Reader comments
Part 2: 'Health care is a privilege, not a right'

JM | 8:29 p.m. Oct. 18, 2009

Why is it okay to have government-run public education, but not health care? Why do we all pay into the education system, even after we are finished ith school? Because as a society we have decided that an educated society benefits everybody. Doesn't a healthy society benefit everybody, also? How much production is lost because people fall ill with diseases that could have been detected earlier had the person had the "privilege" of insurance in which to take advantage of screenings and checkups? If you're worried aout private insurers going out of business, then how do you explain private schools still existing? If you think the government is awful and worthless at everything, then why do you think they're good enough to educate your children?

Ben | 8:42 p.m. Oct. 18, 2009

Wow, leave it to uninformed people to make claims without doing any research. How much money do people pay insurance companies per year just to visit the hospital? And how much are those insurance companies willing to pay when it's time to pay for the hospital bills? It's time for the system to change, but as long as our insurance sponsered politicians are lying to us, we'll keep reading stories about grossly misinformed people like this. Besides, Canada, France, and the UK are our allies, and they offer cheaper and better health care than the US ever could with our current system. If you don't like the changes being talked about, do your reseach and demand for Utah's senators to stop taking insurance-company handouts and to represent us!

Good Honest People | 8:49 p.m. Oct. 18, 2009

They are not self-righteous. They had every intention of paying the bill even when he contracted a HOSPITAL GROWN virus (MRSA). The Hospital did the right thing and took responsibility.

Comments continue below

Just because they did, doesn't.. | 11:05 p.m. Oct. 18, 2009

mean that others will get the same treatment. Others in fact have not.

Realist | 1:57 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

I've never seen more confused people trying to discuss a subject as healthcare.

No JM, I'm not entirely happy with what the government has done with education and so are others which is why we have private schools & charter schools. And you make a HUGE leap of faith assuming government healthcare will be better at preventative medicine.

No Ben, insurance companies don't "sponsor" politicians, and when you get the entire population's opinion of healthcare in Canada, France & UK they are NOT happy with it.

Quit reading your favorite blog and calling that RESEARCH.

No healthcare system is perfect, but people all over the world want to come to the U.S. to get their healthcare or have a U.S. trained doc.

I would add most of what's bad in U.S medicine is BECAUSE the government is already too much involved in it.

The reality of it all. | 4:50 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

First you can't compare health care and education as government sponsored responsibilities. Even education is not a right, its a privilege that you pay taxes for to have. Except illegals that don't pay taxes yet have their grubby dirty hands in our pockets.

You also cannot compare health care in other countries because they don't have insurance companies to fight with. The only thing you need is citizenship.

In these other countries with socialized medical care, every thing is socialized in their system. The Obama plan is only insurance that will feed the corrupted system we have and nothing will change. Health care costs will keep escalating along with your cost for the government insurance plan.

What this family has done has been my philosophy with personal needs in health. The biggest roadblock is doctors and hospitals won't accept cash paying patients. Why is that? Is it so they can overcharge and defraud insurance? Very few people fail to recognize the extreme costs they put on insurance by not paying for an office visit.

Doctors and hospitals do too much over prescribing and not enough healing and patients become test subjects for drug companies.

MHawkins | 5:16 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

They are very lucky people. Hospitals, as a rule, do not pay for care when you aquire another illness while as a patient. It's a risk you take and acknoledge when you sign in. Their paying for the surgery is a rare gift also. They can't afford to do that with eveyone, and still stay in business.

The people in the story must have a very good income, as paying off a $70,000 bill in two years, is beyond most of our means. As 10% of their income, they must have a good business.

But the business climate can change. Then a $70,000 medical bill can lose you your home. A child's sickness can lose you everything you have worked for in your life. And it becomes a matter of a right to healthcare, and a right to live.

but others in fact have | 6:55 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

other have gotten the same treatment as well.

CC | 7:31 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

There is a fundmamental difference between education and health care in that having a public option won't produce a "healthy society." Health care should really be labeled disease/sickness care because people only seek out medical attention when something is wrong. A public option will not change people's behavior with respect to making healthy choices. If anything, it creates an incentive to be even less-health conscious because the financial consequences for avoiding treatment are eliminated.

Abujehad | 7:46 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

But these people are not self-payed. The hospital paid and then passed the cost on to the rest of us!

Anonymous | 9:03 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

All this article tells us is that the system can work for someone savvy enough and patient enough to figure out how to work it--and then hope the hospital is charitable enough to provide free care. Most people do not have this knowledge or ability.

I would hate to base my health and financial future on the hope a hospital will take pity on me. The current system is expensive, confusing and fatally broken. The system will not fix itself--government must step in.

MikeH | 9:19 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

Yes, in isolated cases other have gotten the same treatment. But for the most part, hospitals could not stay in business if they did. As others have mentioned, its only driven others cost higher. So they were not self sufficient, they did not pay for their own care.

It sounds like the hospital was afraid of a lawsuit, I am sure there is more to this story.

unbelievable | 10:16 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

Self pay? They are not self pay. The hospital paid the bill and then passes on the charges to everyone else. Also, her broken hip might have costs all of us a lot less had she not waited 3 weeks because of no insurance. Instead, we all had to pay for a total replacement. It's amazing this couple thinks they are paying their own way and if everybody would just treat the janitor kindly while they are hospitalized the hospital will provide free care.

Avoidable hip replacement | 10:18 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

It sounds like the hip replacement could have been avoided if the woman would have not put off treatment for her hip pain, which she apparently did because she did not have insurance and hoped it would go away. Another argument for healthcare reform that would allow everyone to seek treatment when they need it and avoid a situation becoming worse/requiring significantly more expensive/drastic treatment.

Dingus | 10:31 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

I have worked in many different hospital settings and have had the opportunity to see charity care granted at many of the major local institutions. I actually used to help process cases where we would adjust 10's of thousands of dollars off regularly, not to avoid law suits, but because the families needed help.

I also am a masters student in Health Care Admin and have studied the other health systems across the globe and ironically one of the few commonalities among all systems is that they are ALL running major deficits. That is seldom if ever reported. True it may not be as high as it is in the U.S. but unlike the U.S. the government doesn't dictate which diagnostic equipment is purchased and where it is placed, such as it is in France. There is no gate-keeper such as in England. The, U.S. system is not perfect but far too often we think the grass is green on the other side, it's not always true.

Comparing schools to health care is ludicrous, maybe we should say since government runs the military they should control restaurants...they both feed people.

Dave | 11:26 a.m. Oct. 19, 2009

I have a right to care for myself - its not a privilege. That right (and everyone elses) has been taken by the medical industry. THEY decide who gets treated, what will get treated, who can receive which drugs, etc.
There is a doctor shortage, but the medical industry tightly controls the supply. Hospitals and drug companies can charge whatever they want with impunity. It isn’t free enterprise. Insurance gets the blame, and though they have some unethical practices, they are just a middleman taking maybe 20% off the top. When claims rise - they pass on the increased costs. Those who can pay — are doing it through the nose. Those who can’t have to beg for crumbs from the medical aristocracy.
OUR government is Of, By, and For "The People". Medicine is a business. OUR government has EVERY RIGHT to decide how medicine is practiced in OUR country.
Many say government shouldn’t intervene. Remember if not for previous government intervention, hospitals could leave you for dead outside the ER if you couldn't pay. What those people are REALLY saying that Big Business has been elevated above "The People". If that’s the case, heaven help us.

RedShirt | 12:08 p.m. Oct. 19, 2009

To "JM | 8:29 p.m." lets look at cases where the government has taken on Health Care, just like it did with Education.

In Massachusetts, where they mandated health insurance, only 26% of the people there think it was successful.

Hmm...seems that the government solution was as bad as the problem.

MegP @avoidable hip replacement | 1:14 p.m. Oct. 19, 2009

My hip was badly damaged and could not be saved; not because I waited, but because it had been shattered. By sheer force of will, I carried on during that 3 weeks before surgery. You know, you do what you have to do. In the end it all did work out; I got a new hip, not just a pin and screws repair job. I am very grateful for how things turned out.

And that is what I have learned - it all works out. Maybe not how I first wanted or think it should (healing up on its own), but it is my tutorial and I get to learn from it. So I have moved on.

Melissa | 1:46 p.m. Oct. 19, 2009

Healthcare is a privilege? That is a JOKE! It is, and should be written down as such, a right! Why doesn't someone have the right to wake up in the morning and walk to the bathroom without pain that causes them to fall down? Why doesn't someone have the right to go to work and sit in a chair without pain? Why doesn't someone deserve to live life to the fullest that they can with the best medical coverage available?

Has anyone actually talked to people in Canada, UK and France? I have! Lots and lots of them. I have friends from all 3 spots and they have friends and their friends have friends....I've asked them bluntly about their healthcare and how they feel about it. I get the same answer over and over. They love it.

My husband and I work. We work 7 days a week because we are self-employed, but we cannot afford insurance of any kind because we both weigh more than 180 pounds. Doesn't matter that we have nothing wrong with us, we just weigh more than their scale. How is that fair?

Larry | 2:02 p.m. Oct. 19, 2009

Let's face it. Conservatives are threatened by the 'S' word (socialism). Making health care available for everyone is not called socialism, it's called RIGHT. If people think that this couple is the rule, guess again. And if being a God-fearing person is all it takes, and being 'nice' is all it takes...give me a break. If everyone who needed charity care got it, the health care industry would go broke. And if you think the private insurance companies care about your health, you're more naive than I thought. Have you ever seen a major insurance company's headquarters (or a pharmaceutical company, for that matter)? Talk about greed. Oh, and one more thing. For those of you who believe the rubbish spewed by the Palins, Becks and Limbaughs of this world: who do you think decides your quality/quantity of care now? If you don't think that being rushed out of the hospital too soon (due to insurance company rules) isn't a major contributor to infections like MRSA, think again. I'm a health care professional, and my opinion is, "we need reform now!"

MegP @Abujehad & Unbelievable | 3:07 p.m. Oct. 19, 2009

We have been self pay since 1992, nearly half of our married life. We have learned you have to be responsible for what you get dished; most of the time there is no one to bail you out. It is how you handle the good and the bad. That is one of the tutorials of this life. And if you do get rescued, be grateful. And look for ways to give back.

We have learned that the buck stops with us and when we don't have the money, we wait, we ration, we look for cheaper ways, we self treat, we pray. And when things go wrong, we have learned the hard way that lawsuits are not the answer.

Unequivocally, we experienced charity in its purest form, in our battle with MRSA. If you knew the whole story, you would know what I mean by Charity.

I am sorry others have not experienced the kind of love and care we have had with IHC. They are incredible people, professionals in everyway. Our experience is an example of the best that is found in the American Healthcare System.

Anonymous | 1:50 a.m. Oct. 20, 2009

IHC, Central Utah Clinic... etc.. To tell you the horror stories that happened with them..

Anonymous | 2:01 a.m. Oct. 20, 2009

The private Health industry is unethical as its practices has failed at providing quality healthcare at a reasonable price.

Is the current health system ethical as it provides only to the rich (Those who can afford it) and the wicked (those who break the law and are in prison)?

What about the millions who obey the law that are without healthcare?

What happens if we ignore the health issue once again like past administrations did?

The Health Industry and Lobbyists have paid elected officials to stagnate the issue with arguments and false propoganda about freedom to the public so they can continue to dominate this monopoly.

Banks lobbyists (for Profit) complained when the idea of Credit Unions (Non Profit) were introduced?

Many people benefited from service and loans from credit unions when they were refused them from banks.

Say Yes to "We the People".

The Healthcare system needs change now to Focus on Care instead of Profit.

Treatments should not be denied because of a corporations quest for profits.

The Healthcare industry should be a nonprofit industry.

A public government healthcare option is needed to control costs and give the people choice.

JR | 6:33 a.m. Oct. 20, 2009

And I have beach front property for sale - the hospital may have not charged them but for sure the rest of us who have insurance paid for it, mmm is that not socialization of medicine? How gullible and stupid do these people think we are?

WOW!! | 7:42 a.m. Oct. 20, 2009

WOW. $750,000.00 in care was written off by IHC. I think the Pettys must know someone.

DJ | 12:09 p.m. Oct. 20, 2009

I found this story to be troubling. there seems to be a complete lack of understanding of who actually paid for the two procedures received. this is not an example of being "responsible for what you get dished." The costs involved were simply shifted to those who actually pay for insurance. Had their charity care been denied it would seem likely they would end up in bankruptcy like so many others. Stories like this are frustrating when our company get's it's health insurance bill and it has gone up 5% to 15% even though none of our employees have done more than go to the doctor for a cold.

Mike in Texas | 7:50 a.m. Oct. 23, 2009

I just wonder, with all those horific medical expenses, did they take a federal income tax deduction for them? If so, they had medical public assistance under color of law, another kind of "public option" and goverment subsidized health care. If so, are they really the rugged individualists that they want us to believe they are.

layton | 12:17 p.m. Nov. 5, 2009

Wow, I love it! I thought Utah was all far right government-haters and I was wrong.

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