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Teachers struggle with district cuts
140 comments | Read story
No surprises missed the point | 11:31 p.m. July 5, 2009
The point is that it is the young teachers who are bearing the brunt of district
budget cuts. These are the teachers least financially able to afford cuts. It
is young people that need to be recruited into the teaching workforce in order
to improve education. The teachers at the top of the payscale should suffer the
same reduction in pay. They are part of the system also.
More teachers whining | 11:53 p.m. July 5, 2009
Just another example of teachers using the media to tell the public how
"little they are being paid". They knew the salary when they started
pursuing the career. Everybody is facing financial shortfalls. Somewhere in all
that education some teachers failed to learn economics apply to them too. Maybe
they should learn to quit complaining at least they have a job!
Comments continue below
Ed Secretary | 12:02 a.m. July 6, 2009
When teachers, etc. complain about their salaries, they forget to divide by 9
and not 12 months. The salary is spread out so a pay check is received every
month. My daughter just graduated from a University and she can't even get
a job and she's qualified in several areas.
mlh1973 | 12:17 a.m. July 6, 2009
I too get sick of the griping and whining. I get sick of the griping and
whining of those that think all teachers do is gripe and whine. Every year,
teachers have to do battle with the state legislature, the district
administration, and others who would have them work for nothing. This year is
no different. Unfortunately, many of you that are commenting think that
teachers should just be quiet, count their blessings, and go about business as
usual. If they were to do this, then they would be taken advantage of over and
over again. You are correct that this is like every other profession and
industry out there. The times are tough, and everyone has to fight for what
they need and want. Teachers are no different. What is drastically unfortunate
is that the Jordan School District and others are choosing to have those that
make the least, shoulder the burden for ALL. As new and talented teachers look
at education as a career, these decisions will persuade many to think twice, and
likely to go another way. Sad...because my kids are just entering the
educational system, and I want them to have the very best.
Tired of Union control | 1:02 a.m. July 6, 2009
Steps and lanes is garbage. The teachers union screws over the younger teachers.
There are so many old fossils that need to be dismissed from the system. Why
would they leave, however, when they get rewarded for time served. How education
ever got away with a salary system that doesn't reward performance is
beyond me. Oh wait, the powerful unions are to blame. If teachers were paid for
performance, you can bet many young teachers would be making more than the older
ones. There's enough money to be more equitable. Start paying based on
performance. I don't understand why those who pay the salaries, the
taxpayers, don't demand it.
Teacher | 1:04 a.m. July 6, 2009
To Ed Secretary - You may think that teachers only work nine months; however, if
you were to add in all of the extra unpaid hours that they work, and then add in
2 or 3 weeks of PAID vacation time (which teachers do NOT have, but SHOULD have
if they were treated like other professionals), you would find your totals
coming in fairly close to 12 months of work.
Ray | 1:25 a.m. July 6, 2009
$34,500 isn't so bad when you compare it with some who do not have a job.
Teaching seems to be a way to dodge the economic bullet. When I started my
school district put me on the 4th step as a reward for my time in the military
and my salary that years was $6300. My good friend started at $15,000 as an
accountant. My family had to scrape but we made it. I shed no tears for this
teacher's situation. At least he has a job and his wife can help--that is
the way life is today.
Teacher 2 | 1:27 a.m. July 6, 2009
Thank you to Amy K. Stewart for writing an article that actually gives the
teachers' side of what is going on in Jordan School District. Jordan
District has been very careful how they have phrased the terms of their offer to
the teachers for the 2009-10 school year...I should say they have been careful
to the point of misleading to any teachers who may be uninformed about what is
going on.
bemused | 1:31 a.m. July 6, 2009
The Jordan board could fund the shortfall by increasing class sizes, but that
means more layoffs - i.e. young teachers.
The legislature could have funded the shortfall by choosing to do fewer road projects and put more funding in education. That would have served the young teachers.
The Jordan board didn't make this problem, but they have to figure it out.
Chances are that a young MBA can find more lucrative work than teaching high school. It just looks like this guy wanted to make a difference but won't afford to. That's too bad.
Utah will get what it's willing to pay for.
The legislature could have funded the shortfall by choosing to do fewer road projects and put more funding in education. That would have served the young teachers.
The Jordan board didn't make this problem, but they have to figure it out.
Chances are that a young MBA can find more lucrative work than teaching high school. It just looks like this guy wanted to make a difference but won't afford to. That's too bad.
Utah will get what it's willing to pay for.
Anonymous | 2:29 a.m. July 6, 2009
The United States does not put a high priority on teachers. It pays medeocre
salaries and attracts mediocre candidates to the profession. The United States
ranks 24th in the world in achievement in math, reading and writing. Finland,
however, who ranks number one in achievement goes after its best and brightest
students as teachers. They put a high emphasis on education. Many of these
countries who rank significantly higher than the United States are able to
educate their students at about one fourth the cost of the United States. There
needs to be a major overhaul with teachers beginning with their university
training. Teachers are not preparing students for the 21st century by teaching
problem solving, critical thinking, and collaboration and leadership skills.
Many high school graduates are not ready for the university or the world of work
when they leave high school. Administrators are often unprepared to mentor
beginning teachers to help them grow professionally. I taught in the Provo
School District in the seventies. There were no music, art, or physical
education teachers for elementary students. The classroom teacher was required
to teach everything, even though most were not equipped to do so. I was never
evaluated.
Anonymous | 4:13 a.m. July 6, 2009
I wish I had a job that paid $35k. I appreciate what teachers do but quit
whining. At least your jobs aren't being eliminated.
Timj | 4:31 a.m. July 6, 2009
Leaving the teaching profession was one of the best decisions I've ever
made. Three years after leaving the profession, and I'll be making 2.5 to
3 times as much money--at an easier job.
A lot of amazing people remain teachers even though they could succeed elsewhere. Putting penalties on young teachers, like Jordan School District is currently doing, will drive some quality teachers to reconsider their career path.
The LDS prophets have told us that employers will pay us what they believe we're worth. Doesn't say much about society's respect for teachers, does it. Tough job (you try disciplining 35 14-year-olds all day long, day after day). Crappy pay (especially starting out). No respect from students, parents, administrators, or society.
If you're thinking about getting out, it may be the best career choice you ever make.
A lot of amazing people remain teachers even though they could succeed elsewhere. Putting penalties on young teachers, like Jordan School District is currently doing, will drive some quality teachers to reconsider their career path.
The LDS prophets have told us that employers will pay us what they believe we're worth. Doesn't say much about society's respect for teachers, does it. Tough job (you try disciplining 35 14-year-olds all day long, day after day). Crappy pay (especially starting out). No respect from students, parents, administrators, or society.
If you're thinking about getting out, it may be the best career choice you ever make.
Anonymous | 5:22 a.m. July 6, 2009
The United States does not put its emphasis on education, thus they do not
attract the best and brightest to become educators. Some countries value
teachers and only those with top credentials are given the opportunity to be
educators. Our country is now about 24th in achievement compared with other
industrialized countries around the globe. Often high school seniors are
unprepared to enter the university or the world of work. It has been proven
that the delivery system of educating a student an education is about four times
more expensive per pupil in the United States than other countries. Tjere needs
to be a major overhaul of education from the ground up. It is no longer enough
for teachers to teach facts and figures. Students can get that from the
internet. They need to learn critical thinking, problem solving, values,
leadership, how to be team players, etc. Administrators need to be mentors and
provide opportunities for teachers to be observed and be given opportunities for
continued growth. Our students can't even compete for some of the
scientific, mathematical, and medical opportunities in the top tier
universities. Asian, and other foreign students fill those ranks.
Utahns are cheapstakes | 5:37 a.m. July 6, 2009
It is pretty ridiculous that the average starting teacher in Utah still
qualifies for food stamps. Paying some taxes IS patriotic! You get what you
pay for -- pay less and the best will leave.
Teacher | 5:47 a.m. July 6, 2009
The problem is teachers have to get their raises from the legislature. That
wouldn't happen if they weren't vocal about it. Sad but true.
I predicted this would happen in our district. The old teachers run the negotiations in each district because they are in charge of the "association". They negotiated a pathetic settlement this year. Freezing steps and lanes is the worst thing you could do to a young teacher. The story gets that point right on the money. A young teacher that completes a degree at his own cost will now receive no compensation for that degree. Young teachers stick out those first few years because they know if they can make it to about year 7 then they will be making decent money.
I would guess that every young, male teacher trying to support a family is seriously reconsidering the idea of staying in education right now.
The uninformed posters say they are sick of the whining. Well, keep saying that if you wish but be prepared for no men in education and no professional teachers.
It will soon be an hourly job.
I just saw a job posting for an hourly elementary teacher.
I predicted this would happen in our district. The old teachers run the negotiations in each district because they are in charge of the "association". They negotiated a pathetic settlement this year. Freezing steps and lanes is the worst thing you could do to a young teacher. The story gets that point right on the money. A young teacher that completes a degree at his own cost will now receive no compensation for that degree. Young teachers stick out those first few years because they know if they can make it to about year 7 then they will be making decent money.
I would guess that every young, male teacher trying to support a family is seriously reconsidering the idea of staying in education right now.
The uninformed posters say they are sick of the whining. Well, keep saying that if you wish but be prepared for no men in education and no professional teachers.
It will soon be an hourly job.
I just saw a job posting for an hourly elementary teacher.
I love my job. | 6:09 a.m. July 6, 2009
I am a teacher. I get every holiday off, summers with my kids, not a great
salary, but more than most with a bachelors degree. I am grateful.
mtymouse | 6:14 a.m. July 6, 2009
I know some teachers are very dedicated and spend many hours before and after
school improving their classrooms or giving extra help to struggling students,
but they earn in nine months what I earn in twelve months, so I find it hard to
sympathize too much. However, I do think it is unfair that teachers are always
the ones called on to sacrifice whenever education has to make financial cuts.
I have always thought the administrators of education, both on the school and
district levels, are way overpaid for what they do. Let them sacrifice a bit
too, which would show their support for their teachers (after all, weren't
they all teachers before their current higher status positions?!).
Re: No Surprises | 6:34 a.m. July 6, 2009
FYI - I left the military after four enlisted years and returned to college to
be a teacher. After three years of paying to go to school, rather than being
paid to work, I was offered less to teach than I made three years before in the
military. In the military I got 30 days of paid leave a year, as a teacher I
got June and July to continue my education.
I left Utah to teach in another state that paid better, but returned two years later because Utah is my home. After just one year of teaching in Utah I left the classroom because I could not support my family as a teacher in Utah.
Education faces economic pressures just like every other industry. The sad part is that many teachers have options, maybe not this year, but soon. The point of the article is that a young teacher with an MBA can leave teaching and receive a much higher salary in the business world. Unfortunately many fine teachers do leave the classroom or leave the state, just so they can support their family. I wish we could afford to keep the best teachers in the classroom.
I left Utah to teach in another state that paid better, but returned two years later because Utah is my home. After just one year of teaching in Utah I left the classroom because I could not support my family as a teacher in Utah.
Education faces economic pressures just like every other industry. The sad part is that many teachers have options, maybe not this year, but soon. The point of the article is that a young teacher with an MBA can leave teaching and receive a much higher salary in the business world. Unfortunately many fine teachers do leave the classroom or leave the state, just so they can support their family. I wish we could afford to keep the best teachers in the classroom.
Utah Education is Under Funded | 6:35 a.m. July 6, 2009
The bottom line is Utah public education is under-funded. You can say what you
want about teachers and teachers Unions in Utah but the bottom line is that a
Teacher cannot make a living wage in Utah anymore. It is crazy that we expect
these people to help us educate our future Doctors, Lawyers and Stake Presidents
but fail to pay them even close to a living wage. Nearby states are doing cool
things with their children like Apple Laptop initiatives (WYO) and paying nearly
twice as much to the teachers. We will soon be creating our own self fulfilling
prophesy about public education. Only in the USA do we educate every child. This
is a great tradition that needs to continue. It is the only social program we
should be funding. I am not a teacher. I can't afford to be.
Grand Pap Always Said | 6:36 a.m. July 6, 2009
"You get what you pay for".
Let's see how many qualified teachers we can drive out of the profession this year.
Let's see how many qualified teachers we can drive out of the profession this year.
Bob the bonehead | 6:52 a.m. July 6, 2009
I've worked 21 years in education and I am concerned about the value our
society puts into education. For example, My son graduated from SUU last year
in business and hried on at a energy company in SLC for 65,000 a year with
better benefits than educators have. I have worked 21 years and earned a masters
degree and I won't ever reach 65,000 as a teacher. Like I tell my
children, stay away from education until until our society truly values it. We
are often compared to asian counties when scores are compared but we never want
to talk about how teaching is seen in those countries compared to America.
Anonymous | 7:17 a.m. July 6, 2009
No wonder Utah is 50th in education!
I guess we really don't care about the KIDS.
I think all the sport players out there should give part of their salaries to teachers (across the nation) So we can improve our quality teachers and our KIDS will get a great education and not be run over by other nations.
Everyone is struggling in the Finance department, thanks to the current President. It is only going to get worse, and if we don't have quality teachers (because they all left the field for higher paying jobs) our KIDS are not going to learn about our Great Founding Fathers and others who fought for FREEDOM so we could be FREE! God Bless the USA!
I guess we really don't care about the KIDS.
I think all the sport players out there should give part of their salaries to teachers (across the nation) So we can improve our quality teachers and our KIDS will get a great education and not be run over by other nations.
Everyone is struggling in the Finance department, thanks to the current President. It is only going to get worse, and if we don't have quality teachers (because they all left the field for higher paying jobs) our KIDS are not going to learn about our Great Founding Fathers and others who fought for FREEDOM so we could be FREE! God Bless the USA!
Feel fortunate | 7:40 a.m. July 6, 2009
I went to school in Europe. There were 5 levels of high schools. If students
were late bloomers, they could move to a higher level of high school, because
only after graduating from the highest level of high school could a student go
to college. Doubling a class was a frequent occurrence. Special Ed students
had they own school. No money was spent on games and cheer leading(join a
club), and busing (use a bike or the public transportation system). Only 2
students in my class were 17 when they graduated. The final exams were state
exams and lasted 2 weeks. Graduation was contingent upon passing the exams, and
I knew many kids who had to repeat those exams the next year. Teachers were
state employees and were paid reasonably. All teachers had degrees in the
fields that they taught. Those were the good old days, but after school I had a
solid foundation in calculus, physics, chemistry and 3 foreign languages.
College was a piece of cake for me. All my three kids graduated from high
school with at least the first semester of calculus behind them. I helped them
pick their classes.
What needs to be done | 7:44 a.m. July 6, 2009
The problem with teacher salaries is that it attracts too many people into the
field who really aren't that good at educating youth.
Not enough teachers have the wisdom to reject stupid educatonal ideas. It would seem that not teaching phonix would be an idea an educator would reject. Phonix requires students to learn the letters and about 35 sounds associated with the letters, from there students get a good foundation on reading. But no, modern educators said, we will use the -look say- method instead. Which requires students to learn every word in the english language they hope to use.
The same goes for math education. Before the recent change in the Utah math core. There were increasing numbers of schools in Utah who did not teach times tables or how to do arithmetic by hand. Which is bad enough on its own, but later these students have a very hard time in Algebra.
We are paying teachers too little and attracting to many of the dumbest college graduates to go into education. Especially in math, we need to raise teacher pay, and at the same time, we still need to raise standards which are still too low.
Not enough teachers have the wisdom to reject stupid educatonal ideas. It would seem that not teaching phonix would be an idea an educator would reject. Phonix requires students to learn the letters and about 35 sounds associated with the letters, from there students get a good foundation on reading. But no, modern educators said, we will use the -look say- method instead. Which requires students to learn every word in the english language they hope to use.
The same goes for math education. Before the recent change in the Utah math core. There were increasing numbers of schools in Utah who did not teach times tables or how to do arithmetic by hand. Which is bad enough on its own, but later these students have a very hard time in Algebra.
We are paying teachers too little and attracting to many of the dumbest college graduates to go into education. Especially in math, we need to raise teacher pay, and at the same time, we still need to raise standards which are still too low.
He wants a pay raise? | 8:10 a.m. July 6, 2009
He's getting a degree from the University of Phoenix. Why should the
school district pay him for a worthless degree?
RE: TEACHER | 8:34 a.m. July 6, 2009
The fact is teachers get paid for 9 month's. I don't care how much
over time they put in. I work 12 months and put in about 60 hours per week and
only get paid for 40 hours per week. We just took an across the board 3% pay
cut to eliminate having to lay off more people. Stop whining, the job is what it
is, many don't have jobs. Several teachers live around me and make $50,000
plus and I don't see them putting in all that much overtime, if any. If
your worked in the real world you would understand long hours and low pay.
Canadian Teacher Friend | 8:43 a.m. July 6, 2009
Enjoy visiting Utah often. However... it is mind boggling how much teachers in
Utah pay out of their own pocket for classroom supplies and to help students who
also lack supplies.
Have family and friends that are teachers here.
Sure we too have had budget cuts but Utah's cuts are more like slices off an already too low teacher's wage.
Those of you that say you wish you had that wage...then go to school and be a teacher. Over crowded rooms, little to no teacher assistants, and a work week that far exceeds the actual hours paid for. . Parents often say to me after volunteering and leaving exhausted..."I don't know what you get paid but it is not enough." Children today have lots of emotional baggage brought to school and media/electronic frazzled brains. Your teachers ARE dedicated and yet so undervalued.
Bless your Utah teachers. May the STATE WAKE up. Pay them at least the norm of your country. Be grateful for your teachers. You that are so quick to judge...YOU try it and see if you can do it!
Have family and friends that are teachers here.
Sure we too have had budget cuts but Utah's cuts are more like slices off an already too low teacher's wage.
Those of you that say you wish you had that wage...then go to school and be a teacher. Over crowded rooms, little to no teacher assistants, and a work week that far exceeds the actual hours paid for. . Parents often say to me after volunteering and leaving exhausted..."I don't know what you get paid but it is not enough." Children today have lots of emotional baggage brought to school and media/electronic frazzled brains. Your teachers ARE dedicated and yet so undervalued.
Bless your Utah teachers. May the STATE WAKE up. Pay them at least the norm of your country. Be grateful for your teachers. You that are so quick to judge...YOU try it and see if you can do it!
The Truth | 8:47 a.m. July 6, 2009
Teachers salaries are not bad when you consider the benefits and actual days
worked. Unlike ALL the other employees of the State, teachers will get their
step pay raise this year. Yet they still complain. How would they like to have
no raise like the rest of the state employees?
Re: Timj | 9:01 a.m. July 6, 2009
What do you do now that pays you up to 3 times more than your teachers salary?
pardon | 9:02 a.m. July 6, 2009
The question isn't how are the teachers taking it. The question is how
will it impact the kids.
Remember? The kids is why we educate... for the future!!!!
Remember? The kids is why we educate... for the future!!!!
He loves what he does | 9:11 a.m. July 6, 2009
my husband is one of two male teachers at his elementary school, and he is a
good teacher. Students cry when they don't get his class. Parents bombard
the Principal with requests to get their children in his class.
Probably the same type of people who tell teachers not to complain are the ones who want my husband to teach their kid.
My husband spends hundreds of dollars of his own money every year, like many other teachers do, to improve his classroom. He spends hundreds of extra hours at school, like many teachers do, to accomplish what can't be done during the school day.
His salary was cut by 700 dollars this year. Not a big deal to many, but to this family of seven, it means a lot.
He is looking for an early morning job to supplement our income. I hope the extra work doesn't affect his teaching performance.
Yes, he knew that teachers earned little when he started this career he adores, but aren't you parents glad he stuck with it?
Probably the same type of people who tell teachers not to complain are the ones who want my husband to teach their kid.
My husband spends hundreds of dollars of his own money every year, like many other teachers do, to improve his classroom. He spends hundreds of extra hours at school, like many teachers do, to accomplish what can't be done during the school day.
His salary was cut by 700 dollars this year. Not a big deal to many, but to this family of seven, it means a lot.
He is looking for an early morning job to supplement our income. I hope the extra work doesn't affect his teaching performance.
Yes, he knew that teachers earned little when he started this career he adores, but aren't you parents glad he stuck with it?
My Brother & I | 9:14 a.m. July 6, 2009
My brother and I went to college together. We both graduated with teaching
degrees five years ago. After one year, we both decided that we desperately
needed to go to graduate school if we wanted to support a family. I have a
Masters in Education and am a National Board Certified Teacher (one of only
about 185 in Utah). My brother got an MBA from the same University. His
starting salary in the business world was more than twice what I make in
teaching. Two years later, he's making three times what I make. We both
absolutely love our jobs. Who made the better choice? I went further in my
education than he did. It will never pay off. The reason teaching does not
often attract the best and brightest minds is purely financial, folks.
Anonymous | 9:14 a.m. July 6, 2009
I know plenty of people that went into education because they have 3 months of
during the summer. Oh yeah, and don't forget two weeks off at Christmas, a
week of during spring break and every other holiday you could ever imagine.
Part of my decision process in finding a major and a future career was salary. If you wanted to be wealthy then you should not have majored in education.
Part of my decision process in finding a major and a future career was salary. If you wanted to be wealthy then you should not have majored in education.
Union members reap what they sow | 9:24 a.m. July 6, 2009
The big story here is how new teachers get the shaft from the pay schedules set
up by the teachers union. Rather than try to attract new young talent into the
teaching career, the union is more concerned with protecting the interests of
the older teachers who make up a large majority of the teachers union. And what
do the older teachers want? Higher pay for more experience despite any evidence
that more experience beyond 5 years makes a teacher any better.
I hope the younger teachers are paying attention to this. The teachers union is a cartel, shielding its members from real competition which in this case, includes newer teachers, many of whom are also dues-paying members of the union.
Just remember, you reap what you sow. It's time for Utah to do away with these archaic pay contracts and start paying the best teachers the most, regardless of whether they've been teaching for 5 years or 20.
I hope the younger teachers are paying attention to this. The teachers union is a cartel, shielding its members from real competition which in this case, includes newer teachers, many of whom are also dues-paying members of the union.
Just remember, you reap what you sow. It's time for Utah to do away with these archaic pay contracts and start paying the best teachers the most, regardless of whether they've been teaching for 5 years or 20.
Hypocrisy | 9:25 a.m. July 6, 2009
I think it is funny how everyone complains about how much teachers make and
about our education system because when property tax increases are brought up
everyone fights tooth and nail to fight the increases. Where is the money
supposed to come from if people don't want in increase in property tax?
Also illegals being educated are taking costing the state millions of dollars
($6200 per student)that could actually go to pay teachers a higher salary.
Re: The Truth | 9:27 a.m. July 6, 2009
Your truth is a lie. Step pay raises are decided district by district, not by
the state. My district cut salaries and benefits this year by 8%. 2.5% was
taken directly from teacher steps. Another 2.5% was taken from teacher benefits.
3% was taken by removing options for teachers to make more money, like
professional development classes, etc.
from Jordan School District | 9:32 a.m. July 6, 2009
Why were no district board members given the opportunity to explain the current
situation. Jordan School District prides itself on its commitment to students,
and has done everything to ensure that student programs and services are not
affected because of budget shortfalls. When Ms. Stewart would like to finish the
story, we would be happy to comment to help paint a clearer picture of what is
taking place with the upcoming 2009-10 budget.
Anonymous | 9:42 a.m. July 6, 2009
Everyone here seems to think that if we keep underpaying the teachers that the
good ones will leave. They've been saying that since I was a little kid
(20 years ago) and there are still a ton of great teachers around. A bunch of
my family teach in the Nebo School District and there are 15+ teachers applying
for every job opening. These are good teachers that want to work in Utah, even
though the pay isn't what they would like. BYU pumps out hundreds of
education degreed individuals every year.
Public Ed=Free Day Care | 9:44 a.m. July 6, 2009
Teachers are overpaid considering the high level of competition for their jobs.
There are probably thousands of people with teaching degrees in this state that
are not teaching. Yes, most are worth more than what we are paying them but the
market has always borne much lower salaries than what we are now giving out.
I say cut teacher pay even further. Most people just use the public school system to dump off the kids so they can go work. Because my kids have to deal with that sort of apathy anyway, I educate my kids at home on most subjects after the school teacher has introduced them. As long as my kids get something in school, the teacher is a little better than a babysitter, but that is what I use her for.
I say cut teacher pay even further. Most people just use the public school system to dump off the kids so they can go work. Because my kids have to deal with that sort of apathy anyway, I educate my kids at home on most subjects after the school teacher has introduced them. As long as my kids get something in school, the teacher is a little better than a babysitter, but that is what I use her for.
I teach | 9:45 a.m. July 6, 2009
First off all teachers are not complaining, we understand the economic situation
around the world and have accepted what needs to be done. You don't see
teachers holding up signs and protesting. Second if you think every new teacher
is a good teacher I've got news for you. I have worked with new student
teachers that could not make it through a class period, didn't know how to
do a lesson plan and most of all couldn't control the kids for five
minutes. Before you get rid of all the "Older teachers" you better
think twice, some of the new teachers coming in can't even last through the
student teaching period let alone 30 years. And lastly the real gripe teachers
have is not having to take a pay cut, its when school administrators don't
even suggest taking a pay cut.Pricipals, vice pricipasl the superintendant and
his entire staff. We all have to sacrifice but they don't?. Teachers are
furious they make double what teachers make yeet won't sacrifice a penny.
The real waste in education is at the top. I'm amazed an article is never
writen about this situation.
RE:He loves what he does | 9:48 a.m. July 6, 2009
Don't have a family of SEVEN if the main bread winner is a teacher. It a
pretty simple concept. Im sure with at least 5 kids your family is not paying
much in taxes if any but it will cost around $30,000 per year to educate your
children in the public school system and people are wondering where our tax
money goes?
No sympathy here | 9:49 a.m. July 6, 2009
I have no sympathy for the guy in the story. I'm in a similar situation -
married, one kid and another on the way making about the same salary and yet
we're able to put money into savings each month. Moreover, my benefits are
less than his (no retirement and I pay for my wife's and son's health
plan out of pocket), my wife doesn't work, and we live in a small duplex
rather than rent a whole house, so what's the story here?
How many other Utahns are doing the same thing without calling up reporters to have a big news article written about their "struggles"? And let's not forget that teachers have about the best job security in the world, and yet while unemployment is hitting new heights, they have the chutzpah to complain about no pay raises??
So here's the world's smallest violin playing for Mr. Merrell. That's all you'll get from me.
And P.S. I have to work 12 months a year. I don't have summers off to find another job.
How many other Utahns are doing the same thing without calling up reporters to have a big news article written about their "struggles"? And let's not forget that teachers have about the best job security in the world, and yet while unemployment is hitting new heights, they have the chutzpah to complain about no pay raises??
So here's the world's smallest violin playing for Mr. Merrell. That's all you'll get from me.
And P.S. I have to work 12 months a year. I don't have summers off to find another job.
Anonymous 2 | 9:53 a.m. July 6, 2009
Teachers who think 9 months of teaching = 12 months of everyone elses work are
in the dark. They forget about all the holidays they get off. I work on
Presidents day. I work on Human Rights Day. I don't get 10 days off for
Christmas, or a fall break, or a spring break, or 2 months off in the summer.
My family members that are teachers vacation, vacation, and vacation! They golf
in the middle of the day!!! I haven't had a "middle of the day"
in 3 years. And don't give me the, "we spend so much time outside of
the classroom" speach. You think salaried employees do 40 hours and then
quit? No! They are salaried because they are working 50, 60, 70 hours a week.
I work 24-48 hours straight soemtimes, and I know no teachers are doing that. I
get 2 weeks vacation a year, and that's it!!! I get paid great and I love
what I do!
Outside influences dumbing us | 9:53 a.m. July 6, 2009
There is a polarizing talk show host in Utah who is always railing on teacher
pay and teacher unions. He says we don't need people of high quality in the
subject to teach the subject because these kids are only at high school level
and the teachers are college graduates.
In spite of his popularity among some, I wish he weren't on the air, he is a dumbing down influence on Utah.
Utah definately needs to attract high quality people into the teaching profession. People who know their subject backwards and forward. It hard to do when the pay is so low.
If a person doesn't have a good foundation in High school, 4 years of university aren't going to make up for that. There are high school graduates who barely know their math, then they go on to get a degree in education and become our elementary school teachers, who are supposed to teach math.
Add to this the fact that the schools of education are promoting destructive methods of teaching, where arithmetic is gutted, but other things such as hollow geometry, (little thinking required) (group activities as opposed to individual thinking)
ran out space
In spite of his popularity among some, I wish he weren't on the air, he is a dumbing down influence on Utah.
Utah definately needs to attract high quality people into the teaching profession. People who know their subject backwards and forward. It hard to do when the pay is so low.
If a person doesn't have a good foundation in High school, 4 years of university aren't going to make up for that. There are high school graduates who barely know their math, then they go on to get a degree in education and become our elementary school teachers, who are supposed to teach math.
Add to this the fact that the schools of education are promoting destructive methods of teaching, where arithmetic is gutted, but other things such as hollow geometry, (little thinking required) (group activities as opposed to individual thinking)
ran out space
Anonymous | 9:53 a.m. July 6, 2009
I have a great respect for teachers but they really need to understand that the
benefits are really big. (I agree that they are under paid, but benefits can
add about $8,000 to current base). Those of us who are self-employed really
understand what a benefit it is to have good health insurance and even a
retirement plan that someone else helps contribute to. Please instead of being
so upset that you didn't get a raise and even had to take a little cut, be
grateful that you have any income at all there are alot that would give anything
just to have a steady salary.
Anonymous 3 | 9:55 a.m. July 6, 2009
Also, teachers get paid low salaries because there are 15+ people that will do
their job for them for the low salary and probably do just as good of job. An
education degree is easy to obtain and a lot of local graduates want to stay and
teach in Utah because it is their home. I know that teaching isn't easy,
and kids would drive me nuts so that is why I chose not to be a teacher.
hey now i understand | 9:56 a.m. July 6, 2009
and this should be taken in all seriousness , is not meant as a cut but some
have even had to rob graves to supplement their families...these people deserve
better as they spend the most time with everyone's children. Now the
illegals are putting a huge strain on the system also but we're not suppose
to talk about that and let em just walk around here.
Define harmless | 9:57 a.m. July 6, 2009
Earlier this year someone in state government said education would be
"held harmless" in the budget this year. Oh yeah, he's on his
way to China.
Salary | 10:00 a.m. July 6, 2009
Mr. Merrell, makes just under $25 per hour. Works 180 days a year, with all
vacations off and the summer. I am sure that Mr. Merrell has a summer job where
the salary is not included in this article. If he does not, he should get one.
All teachers go into the job knowing what the pay scale is. Most teachers are just luck and glad to have a job right now. As a teacher, I knew what I was going to get paid. The benifits are great, retirement is good, and the vacation and sick days are great. I see teachers making well into the $80,000 in Jordan District. Maybe like everyone else, he needs to put in his time.
All teachers go into the job knowing what the pay scale is. Most teachers are just luck and glad to have a job right now. As a teacher, I knew what I was going to get paid. The benifits are great, retirement is good, and the vacation and sick days are great. I see teachers making well into the $80,000 in Jordan District. Maybe like everyone else, he needs to put in his time.
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Bingham High School teacher Vince Merrell holds his daughter, Brooke, along with wife Meagan at their home.
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Teacher salaries are public record and anyone entering the field should know that they are not going to get rich teaching.
Lots of families depend on both parents working in order to live at the standard which they desire.
Many other workers are taking pay freezes and pay cuts during these hard times, and teachers should not be exempt. However, school district should make serious cuts in other overhead expenses before cutting teacher pay. (Can the district big wigs get along with one or two fewer assistants or secretaries? Would that make a difference for kids in class?)
Before people whine about the hourly pay for teachers, let's point out that compared to many entry level jobs for college grads (or those who can find work) teachers do pretty well.
There are a lot of college grads in the military, both as officers and enlisted. Their jobs are at least as important and a lot more difficult and far more dangerous than teaching. If you think military pay is a lot better, there are recruiters waiting to talk to you.