Recession has no effect on filings, despite national trend
people gettin' married too young...
Is it a 37% decline in divorces nationally, or 37% of lawyers said they have
seen a decline in divorces? The sentence in the story is as clear as mud.
People gettin'married too young is always the cop-out answer. It's probably the
same people who say Utah drivers are the worst. Statistics show other-wise. Not
only does Utah have one of the best driving rates, it also has one of the few
divorce rates all being equal. Take into consideration Those families who choose
to marry within their belief systems, i.e Catholic, Protestant,Jew, Mormon,
etc.: They tend to keep their promises and have lasting marriages. If you don't
like the legal age for marriage, write your legislature.
I have always felt that the young and over 20 are meant to be married and raise
a family. Their youth allows them to be more involved in raising children and
keeping up with and involving children in their activities. Middle aged and
older people have a harder time sustaining the energy of raising children and
usually end up being grandparent aged adults by the time their children graduate
from high school. Waiting too long and cohabitation also hampers a united and
happy marriage. Committing for life and the vows have no meaning anymore.So I don't think that marrying too young is as much the problem as their
lack of character and self discipline they should have been developing from an
early age. The biggest problems the young face are financial in nature and they
don't know how to manage it and education doesn't teach it. They have been
inundated with the mindset that credit and spending is their primary goals and
purpose. With so much individualism being the focus in schools and society with
their peers they don't know how to merge their lives as a united pair.
I remember stories not that long ago about the declining marriage rates -- I'll
bet that has a LOT to do with the (current) decline in divorces. And, again,
Utah was not having the decline -- so it stands to reason it wouldn't see this
decline, either.And, no, it's not "too young," it's "too
irresponsible." In my lifetime, divorce has gone from being the ultimate failure
you probably could not recover from to an acceptable solution for trivial
disagreements.When my parents got married, the average age was
around 18. Graduate from high school and get married and start your life.
Divorce was unheard of. Today the average marriage age is mid-20's, and the
divorce rate continues to be quoted at nearly 50%. You cannot blame age on it.
If anything, stats would show that the older, the more likely to divorce.The real issue isn't age, it's a sense of responsibility and the feeling
that you will make the marriage work, no matter what comes along. In today's
consumer-driven, victim-hood society, neither of those traits are very popular.
are all these divorces non-Mormon? I doubt it. I suspect that most are LDS
temple marriages. Perhaps the church is too lenient in granting temple
I agree, at least for me, I got married somewhat late at age 28, and I have
always felt this was wasted time that I will never get back. What I did really
wasn't by choice.Wish I could have done things differently.
Marriage too young and too fast IS a contributing factor. Utah is NO different,
really, than the rest of the country. People just tend to do more in secret
because of the church culture.
Yes, I'm sure there are many reasons, but from my experience its mostly because
of bad choices by one or both parties. You just never know, so don't take
anything or granted. It takes constant communication and a solid effort by both
to make it work. Even then there are no guarantees. Sometimes you think it will
work, but there are unforseen problems that arise. Its easy to judge until it
happens to you.
Just a facts about marriage and divorce rates in Utah and the US.Statistically, your odds of divorce increase if you marry before the age of 20
(NSFH study).In Utah, the average age at first marriage is approximately 3
years younger than the national average (Utah average 24 men and age 21 women).
Nationally, the refined divorce rate is projected at 40-50% (depending
upon which study you look at).The Utah divorce rate is just about at that
average, but well below the average of our neighboring western states (e.g.,
Nevada #1 in the country and many other western states in the top 10).In
regard to the LDS divorce rate - it is important to distinguish between a temple
and non-temple marriage. The divorce rate for a temple marriage is between 7
and 15% - meaning that of all temple marriages, about 7 to 15% eventually
divorce and the rest remain married. For non-temple marriages, the divorce rate
is over 50%. I tend to agree with the sentiments expressed in the article
in that the economy in Utah is still healthy.
People... please stay together, ask anyone who has been divorced if the grass is
really greener. I got married at a very young age(which was really stupid) but
so far have been able to work things out. Love comes with time and hard work.
Marriage should be taught. Relationships are hard and nobody teaches this
really. So, people with issues (most of us) don't know how to cope in healthy
ways. Intimate terrorism results when one partner dominates and tends to
control the other. It may take a while for the victim spouse to get the courage
and means to get out. By then, much damage is done. Does young
marriage contribute? - absolutely. Young partners do not yet have the skills
and maturity to work out the problems in good ways. They usually don't even
have the money to pay for skill building therapy, etc. Insurance (if they are
lucky enough to have it) doesn't even pay for couples' counseling. And, there is huge economic strain that comes from a young marriage where
perhaps they don't finish college for financial or other reasons or where the
bad economy causes job loss with few skills or experiences to help them compete
in this job market. Money problems contribute heavily to marriage problems.
Who is there to help? They can't even afford a date and a babysitter - things
that might help them. It's a difficult place to be.
The majority of these divorces are mormons. Hmmmmm.....could it possibly be
that mormons get married to fast and to young? It's kind of ridiculous.
Yes, love can grow even with a rough start in the right circumstances when both
are committed. Divorce often happens to quickly. I finally
divorced after many years. Only after the divorce was I able to be financially
stable and sleep at night. Life was so much better; so much more peaceful.
There are many reasons for divorce and one can't begin to guess at what it is
for everyone. We also must not judge others too harshly as much trouble occurs
behind closed doors. Divorce is ugly, especially for the children,
but marriage can be ugly too. I know much psychological damage (as well as
economic) occurred because of my bad marriage. Staying as long as I did taught
my daughters lessons I'm ashamed of, like "stay with the guy no matter what -
even in terrible emotional abuse" and "continue to work, try to pay the bills
for years while he 'finds himself' (or finds a girlfriend)". The
best lesson I was able to teach them was that a woman can take care of herself,
value herself and them, and that it is possible to get out (finally) - not only
possible, but maybe much better!
It would be nice if this article gave some semblance of actual data about
declining divorces elsewhere. The best it offers is results of a survey of
divorce lawyers. Maybe people just aren't hiring a lawyer. There are really no
facts in this article aside from the 1% increase in Utah. Sloppy.
All of the above comments have ignored the fact that the increasingly divorce
rate is largely caused by the increasing influence that the public gives to
modern media in their lives. The message promoted by modern media is extremely
harmful for marriage. Indeed, this message is that immorality, selfishness, and
greed are acceptable qualities and everyone else, including a spouse, must
simply "deal with it." There was a time when the media promoted the old
fashioned values that made this Country great, such a faithfulness, charity, and
respect for others. It is no wonder that the divorce rate in increasing.
The fact is that a lot of people shouldn't get married at all, and shouldn't be
parents. Regardless of societal/family pressures some people just aren't made
for it. Sometimes, many times, people look for someone to "complete them", solve
their problems, or make them happy, which is an easy way to avoid responsibility
for themselves as individuals. Regardless of people's opinions on the matter,
divorce rates, child abuse rates, spousal abuse rates, infidelity rates are
facts. As for young people getting married, well, most of them have no where
near the experience for marriage, and have their own issues to work through
before bringing those problems into a marriage and imposing them on children.
Marriage age, whether young or old, isn't the problem! SELFISHNESS in one or
both partners is the problem!Since the baby-boomer age group
started, American youth have been taught by their parents to be selfish and
spoiled. Spoiled, selfish parents raise even more spoiled, selfish children.
Hence, the progressively growing divorce or cohabitation rates since the
60's.Religion seems to be the only place where people are
consistently taught to be unselfish and committed to their spouses and children.
So, of course, their marriages and families tend to be stronger. It naturally
happens because of 'cause and effect'.However, everyone has free
agency to follow-or not follow-their religious upbringings. The temptation to
be selfish is a constant temptation for all of us. So, when these kinds of
people go selfish 'piglet' on their spouses and children, we are not surprised.
We are overwhelmingly heartbroken and disappointed in them because we know they
were taught to be better!
Only in Utah could the well documented assertion that the younger people marry,
the higher the divorce rate, get an argument.
Don't stay in if there truly is abuse, but otherwise, be humble, be selfless,
take the long, long view, and work hard at your marriage. The age of marrying
absolutely is NOT the issue. Recession might mean people are acting in more
humility, more awareness of what really matters. Who knows? The article
doesn't give us much to go on.
You must be 80 years old and live in the most uneducated town imaginable. Back
when husbands treated their wives with love and protection, instead of using
them as slaves. And no, I'm not a feminist. I loved my ex with all my body and
soul, but all he wanted was complete domination over me, which actually took
AWAY my agency. Some people are so judemental. It makes me wonder how unhappy
they are in their own marriages, and maybe they're just plain jealous because
they don't have the guts or the faith to leave. Divorce is hard and more
painful than death itself, but even still, is better than an abusive marriage.
For children, a divorce could mean the difference between growing up with false,
evil traditions, or cleansing the family line of wickedness and oppression. GIVE
ME LIBERTY OR GIVE ME DEATH!!!
Well what do you expect when KIDS are getting married in their late teens and
early 20's, they haven't even had the opportunity to grow up and yet they are
strongly encouraged to marry at a young age to avoid "temptations"? My wife and
I were married in our mid 20's after dating for a year, and although our
marriage is very strong 15 years later, we both now admit that even we married
too young and without dating each other longer. A certain Private religious
school should also take some responsibility for the high divorce rate in Utah
and quit encouraging marriage of its students at such a young age... or at least
encourage graduation and some semblance of financial stability before marriage.
I married my wife before finishing my masters degree, our early struggles did
not "strengthen" our relationship, in darn near sunk us! And relying on others
for financial support was humiliating, not "humbling". Don't buy into the "Utah
lie" kiddies, "don't be a fool, graduate from school" (before getting married)!
Oh no not one percent!!! I hate articles like this that cause hype over some
lousy statistics that probably have a margin of error of at least one percent
"The majority of these divorces are mormons. Hmmmmm.....could it possibly be
that mormons get married to fast and to young? It's kind of ridiculous."If the majority of people in the state are Mormon, it stands to reason
that the majority of divorces are Mormon. Also, it should be "too fast and too
young." Perhaps you were let out of high school "to fast and to young."
After reading this article I'm filing for divorce.
Are you serious? A certain private religious school should take responsibility?
Maybe we should get together a class action suit and teach it a lesson! Who
cares about whether any of the divorces actually come from the marriages that
occur at the school? Who cares that it's a ludicrous idea to begin with? After
all, if it happens in Utah, it's probably the mormons' fault!
I know 29-year olds who are still extremely immature and selfish, while I also
know a couple of 19-year-olds with one baby who are deeply in love with their
husbands and who are able to work through problems and are being patient and
faithful despite living in itty-bitty basement apartments and having to pay for
diapers. Just thought I'd throw that out there. It's
actually generally 16 and 17 year olds who become the problem marriages. 18-20
year olds often do too - but surprisingly enough, that trend just doesn't hold
in the Church. The fact that young Mormon marriages buck the trend has shocked
quite a few researchers, but it's a matter of maturity, not age. And there are
enough other influences that you can never blame it on one thing (religion in
the home makes a difference, so does cohabitation before marriage, so does
whether or not the spouses came from broken families themselves ... the list
goes on and on.)
Pile on everybody, it's an article about Utah!!
The divorce statistics are skewed since more couples cohabit in others states
than in Utah.
I think that more than age, the speed of courtship is more of a contributing
factor to divorce. LDS culture does result in people marrying at a younger age.
But the real problem is that it pressures our youth to marry QUICKLY. If you
feel the spirit (is it the spirit or just natural romantic emotions?) or if you
have been immoral the answer is just get married and fast. The key to marriage
is to enjoy the courtship process and really try to see if you and your partner
are a good match. Personalities make a huge difference and mismatches often
don't surface until after the butterfly stage has passed. And way too many LDS
couples don't give themselves the time to get through that. The key to lowering
the LDS divorce rate is to SLOW DOWN, enjoy courtship, and find ways to really
get to know your partner in many different situations and allow your partner to
equally learn about you. Just because you are both from the same culture and
belief system you ARE NOT guaranteed a successful marriage. You must mesh and
compliment each other in other ways as well.
Statistics show that couples who are from different religious background have a
higher risk of divorce. I fully believe the LDS culture of fast courtships does
not serve anyone well. But it is also true that only a mixed Jewish/non-Jewish
marriage has a higher divorce rate than a mixed LDS/non-LDS marriage. So my
guess is that a young couple, who follow the LDS culture of a quick courtship,
AND one is LDS and one non-LDS - are probably starting a marriage with the odds
stacked against them.
I married my wife in the temple when I was very young (19). We were definitely
not ready and I think to an extent we both resent each other. It has been a
constant struggle but for over 20 years we have held it together through some
really tough times (infertility, drugs, unemployment, etc). We have never
allowed divorce to be an option even as we have seen family and friends justify
(sometimes rightfully so, other times not so much) splitting. It devastates
children. I think people give up on each other too soon without giving the
marriage a fighting chance.
To VorSo you have regrets, you struggled financially. Maybe you should of
gotten a job and worked some before getting married or getting your masters.
Don't blame the school. You made your own choice. You didn't have to date, or
even look at women if you wanted to finish your schooling. It sounds like you
just have an issue with "a certain private religious school".... and it's
backings? Life isn't meant to be easy...YOU learned YOUR lesson, let others
learn theirs in their own time frame. Plenty of couples make it happily through
school together and have no regrets. I wouldn't call them "fools!"
I have to say religious background plays a large factor. SO often people marry
thinking that either religion does not matter or that with time there partner
will convert. Marriage should be based on love not expectations of spiritual
conversion.My suggestion be careful who you marry.Like
the saying goes from fiddler on the roof"A fish might love a bird
but where would they live."
People who simply live together and separate are NOT part of this
study....hence....you can't blame marrying too young without a fair comparison
across the board. Many many many people in other states jump in and out of
live-in relationships. I'm fairly confident those numbers are lower here
replaced in part by young marriages. Second....these types of
articles are very difficult and time consuming to write properly. Facts are
readily available but often from entirely different sources and not always
reliable...so then...what is a fact? Anymore, it's difficult to say! I once
spent close to a month writing a fact specific commentary for a major SLC
newspaper. After intense study and a commitment to unbiased facts, one
disgruntled reader responded with this, "Oh well, she obviously created those
facts." Personally, I don't believe this is a pure journalistic
piece - without bias. But then again, those are rare anymore.
If you love one another despite the challenges and can be unselfish to one
another, the couple blossoms. When one becomes a little selfish, problems can
become more apparent. I married in my 20s and my wife was 19 almost 20 and
we're happy with 3 kids, one of which was born with a disability.Love life, don't sweat the small stuff and argue only on those things 'worth'
arguing about. (which shouldn't be too much as I can't think of very many things
that are big enough or worth enough to argue about).
The relative rise in the Utah divorce corresponds with the recent rise in gay
marriage around the nation. As Mormon leaders have predicted, gay marriages are
undermining traditional marriage for Mormons. If the trend toward legalizing gay
marriage continues, we may see skyrocketing divorce rates among Mormons, whose
traditional marriages are crumbling in the fact of the gay-marriage onslaught.
I agree with the article. Utah has not felt the brunt of this depression. Money
matters are a huge factor in marital stability, and when there is a perception
that there's prosperity to be had out there if only one's spouse was
contributing more... well... in a depression that perception is wiped out.
Because of sensible social norms, lower debt, and fiscal wisdom that's much more
ingrained in this culture than those areas harder hit, many materialistic
couples are insulated from the financial realities outside of the state. I agree Divorce is a horrible choice if you want to have any sort of a
retirement/financial future. It's too bad Utahn's can't take that a bit more to
heart and on their own eliminate divorce altogether...
it is a fact that more people in other states will live together instead of get
married. In Utah, more people will marry. Thus when the other young couples who
only live together leave each other it's called a "break-up" whereas the other
is called a "divorce". Let's include anyone who has ever lived with each other
for more than a year and see where the totals are. Then what religion will you
What proof do you have that the divorce rate in Utah is higher because people in
other states live together instead of getting married?To the author
of the article: What proof do you have that divorce rates are not declining?The only accurate way to calculate divorce rates is as a percentage of
marriages. The only way to accurately calculate the marriage rate is per
capita.If there are 100 couples of marrying age, and there are 50
marriages, that is a 50% marriage rate. If the number of couples increases to
200, and there are 100 marriages, that is still a 50% rate. If, however, there
are only 75 marriages, that is a decline in marriages.Same thing
with divorces: 100 married couples, 50 divorce, 50% divorce rate. 200 married
couples, 50 divorce - same number of divorces but a definite decline in
divorces.Let's get some real facts....
Utahs divorce rate bucks the national downward trend because many in the current
generation who DO marry within the LDS culture are children of parents whose
temple marriages failed! Combine that with the most self-absorbed 'me-first'
crowd ever produced, and a pathetic entitlement mentality, and you have a
generation viewing temple marriage as merely an agreed-to religious ceremony
designed to placate parents and conform with cultural expectations.Regarding the temple, Elder George Q. Cannon said 100+ years ago: "How is it
now? There is a complete indifference, it may be said, in relation to it. Young
people go there stupid, with no particular desire only to get married, without
realizing the character of the obligations that they take upon themselves, or
the covenants that they make, and the promises involved in the taking of these
covenants."Simply put, parents and priesthood leaders need to better
educate and prepare these kids regarding the sacred nature of both marriage and
temple covenants. Perhaps in doing so, these young people will be more
selective in whom they marry, and not become a casualty like so many of their
parents were.Tim Rollins Oklahoma City
Once again, I read posts from people on this site see correlation and call it
causality. One is not the other, my friends. Divorce and unhappy
marriages come from people doing something that is wrong for them. Marriage is
hard work and most people aren't up to it when they are young, but some are and
can be successful despite their callowness. Many people will mature and become
ready for marriage, though at different times; some people never will. In other words, some people should wait until they are older to get
married, some are capable of marrying young, and a number probably never should
marry. It's a bell-curve, like most aspects of human behavior, and those who
say the problem is "marrying young" or conversely "being selfish" have correctly
identified the problem in some cases, but not most and certainly not all. Every
person and marriage is unique. I think it was Tolstoy who said that happy
families are all the same, but unhappy families are each unhappy in their own
way. In any case, all theories on marriage are bunk at least 50% of the time if
you only have one theory.
To The Real Problem: BRAVO!! YOU HIT THE NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD!!
There is a world of difference between 'revelation' and raging hormones.
Unfortunately, some of these kids get married only so they can get laid without
punishment. On the other hand, the ones who take time to get to know each other
in a variety of places and situations come through with a clearer sense of unity
and a greater chance for long-term success. As a friend of mine in
Canada once said: The first six months youre together, youre so ga-ga about
seeing someone regularly, you blind yourself to any weaknesses or character
lapses your partner may have. After six months, these qualities begin to
surface. If youre still together after eight months, then you have probably
found a good match for you and should then marry and get on with the rest of
your life.I couldnt have put it any better myself!Tim
Just a couple of thoughts. Utah has been one of the fastest growing states for
the past few years. Yet the number of divorce filings has been roughly the same
year after year. So it seems to me that the divorce rate ie percentage is
falling. As for the age debate. The idea of marriage later in life is a
relatively new concept. For as long as records show most people got married in
their late teens to early twenties and divorces were rare. Now people want to
tell us that the divorces are because of the marriage age. Some marriages fail
because of a horrible spouse. I have seen it and don't disagree with divorce in
those circumstances. Most divorces I have seen however are because of a lack of
commitment! Not because of age or education or lack of money. Those are all
excuses. I really don't care what age people are when they marry. If they are
committed the marriage can and will succeed. Hundreds of years of successful
marriages prove it.
I heard in my sociology class that marrying too young can lead to difficult
marriages, but so does marrying too old. I apologize for not having my class
notes on me so I can give you references, but the "ideal" marriage age is
somewhere between 23 and 28. That way you're old enough to know about life but
young enough not to be set in your ways. Obviously these numbers are general
trends and don't take into account maturity and other life factors. Some people
are more then able to marry at 22, and some people aren't ready until they're
30. Long courtships are good, but only to a point. A year is generally a good
minimum, but 3 years is too long. Studies also show that couple that live
together prior to marriage have a lower satisfaction/higher divorce rate that
those who don't. This article only tells a small piece of a large story.
We need more data and information before being able to really understand what's
going on in Utah.
I used to try and correlate age with marriage, but life experiences have taught
me that it really boils down to the individual. I know plenty of people who
married young and it worked out great. I also know plenty who married young,
and it ended horribly, sometimes within a few years, and sometimes not until 20+
years later.I also know plenty of people that married late that did
great, and plenty that did not.No statistics can account for it,
because each individual approaches marriage differently. And because people
change over time, so do their committments to marriage. It's all about the
couple and their committment, and has very little to do with anything else,
including age, religion, etc.
The message of the Good Book...Keep commandments and you prosper.. temporally
and spiritually.. We need to listen more to Prophets and less to toxic
bloggers.They have the advice that works for a happy life and solid marriages.
It always amuses me when people quote the divorce rate from long ago and equate
that with happy marriages. Just because people didn't divorce as much in the
"good old days" doesn't mean that marriages were happy. Since time
immemorial,there have been those who would treat their spouses horribly. In many
cultures this was even socially acceptable. But in yester-year, you had to grin
and bear it. Now-a-days people don't have to put up with all of the
above. Since they now have options, they get out. It wasn't always so.
So I shouldn't have proposed to the girl I met at the Church hay ride last week?
Maybe I'll re-think that.
Make up your minds.Either Utah has 100% Mormons, so you can blame all the
mental, spiritual, and divorce problems on the Mormons, and temple,
marriages.Or you can re-read the article, and figure out that it does not
identify the divorces as LDS, or any specific group.I'm amazed at the
critics who can analyze all the failed marriages as only caused by young, LDS,
temple marriages, children of parents with failed temple marriages. (Which
article are you reading?)And then continue on with their comments as
factual.Try speculating about tender, personal issues with a less
I married when I was 34 which was later in life, but the wait was worth it. I
couldnt have found a better husband. Yes we have been through alot eg
unemployment, financial reverses, death of loved ones and infertility. Due to
marrying at a later age, we both were very independent in so many ways but I
would not change it for the world. I think divorice happens alot when ppl are to
young and it doesnt matter if you are lds or not; i think alot of it depends on
maturity. I married civilly first because my husband had just become a member
and a year later we were sealed in the temple. But I think alot of it has to do
with commitment to each other and being very giving in the relationship. Just my
2 cents worth.
Getting married young can cause major issues. I'm 32 and was ready for marriage
in many areas. I married a younger girl and her lack of life experience has
caused our marriage some pitfalls that we have worked through gratefully.
Waiting to get more established in life can be a major benefit.
I was married to my EX, and she was LDS. That is besides the point, if you are
not able to really spend time getting to know each other in the first place.
You are not going to have a healthy relationship. I have probably heard many of
the same stories of very young couples getting married at age 18 and 19. Those
are the exception. Many couples who wind up getting married really fast, have a
really fast divorce, because they are not able to get to know each other and
spend quality time together.
"I meant what I said and I said what I meant; an elephant's faithful, 100
percent". I married "Mazie the Lazy-bird" 26 years ago, and stuck it
out because I grew up believing you needed to stay in the marriage
no-matter-what. I've worked full-time, did all the cooking,
cleaning, bills, laundry, etc. all the traditional male and female chores --
because "I'm a full-time Mom, not your housewife".I was hen-pecked
and verbally abused for decades.So, what kind of example did I set?
My College Grad-Returned Missionary-Eagle Scout son has vowed to NEVER get
married after watching how his mother treated his Dad.My 18 year old
daughter never gets any dates because she treats nice young men like dirt.It goes BOTH ways!!!Add me to the list.
Any student of American music has hear:"It's cheaper to keep her." You would
need to normalize this date to the changes in our economy.
Ok, it is reasonable to accept the Utah divorce stats- if the numbers are
reflecting a constant data group reflecting the general population. However, the
U.S. stats exclude California, Georgia, Indiana, Hawaii, Minnesota, and
Louisiana. That's a pretty big chunk of the U.S. population and excluding
numbers from those states calls this comparison into question. Utah may be
steady and that's sad, but let it stand on its own if major U.S. states are left
out of the comparison group.
Isn't interesting when two people get married there are two people, but when
they are about to get divorced there arises some third entity called the
"marriage." Yes, it is because of the "marriage", this mysterious third entity,
that is causing the two original people to call it quits.
I didn't see anywhere in this article where it mentioned that most of those
getting divorced (or any) were LDS. No doubt, there were some, but why some
people who are posting on here claiming a connection with the church just comes
down to that never-ending hate for the church. They can leave it, they can't
leave it alone.The real reason was pointed out in the article - the
economy is better in Utah than elsewhere.
Good comments and discussion all around. I just want to add that I think that
the issue is skewed on couples that cohabitate before marriage divorcing more.
I think some of the reason for this coorelation is that couples that
are ok with living together before marriage tend to be less religious. On the
other hand, many religious people tend to be against living together before
marraige.Religious people have more of a stigma against divorce than
non-religious people do. (In some religions divorce itself is a sin and will
only be granted in Extreme cases).So I believe some of the
"statistics" about those who don't cohabitate before marriage (more religious)
getting divorced at a lower rate may be somewhat (not entirely) attributed to
their stigma against divorce and not completely attributed to the health of the
You learn many things about someone when you live with them that you can learn
no other way. I lived with a girl I considered marrying for the better part of a
year (after dating 1.5 years) and discovered that we would not be good partners
in marriage. I lived with another girl for a year (again after dating 1.5
years), and everything was great, we got engaged, and there have been no
unpleasent surprises after getting married in '07. We knew what to expect.I've had a few (religious) people that went into marriage without
cohabitating first tell me that after their marriage experience they "can see
why it might be a good idea to live together first." In any case,
don't get married just because your hormones are raging. You'll later discover
that that part will take up about 1% of your marriage and majority of time will
spent on other (less fun) issues.
Utah has not been hit as hard as most states by the recession. (Yet.) Ask any sociologist. Unlike suggestions by most of the commenters bringing up
age or religious values in decline, the predominant cause of most divorces
center on money. When you live in a time of financial excess and
you're having financial struggles, divorce looks like a plausible solution to
solving all your financial troubles. Just cut your spouse loose from all your
bank accounts and you'll be free, right? In fact, when jobs are plentiful you
figure your deadweight spouse can simply find a job, and the consequences will
be minimal. Justification for divorce is very high. When you live in
a recession, all those justifications are thrown out. You are forced to consider
the harsh reality that divorce will not help, and you take different measures to
manage your financial struggles. The failing financial world can actually help
couples come together because they share a common sense of being embattled. I think money has more to do with this than anything. Go out to eat
sometime. There are still crowds. Utah is not suffering nearly as bad as other
states. Lucky Utah...
It's not the LDS temple marriages that are causing the majority of the problem.
LDS temple marriages only have a 6% divorce rate (proven by several different
studies, including one by the Barna Research Group), compared to double digits
in the state and the national averages. Any group that can sustain a
94% retainal rate is one to promote, not tear down with false accusations.
"The divorce statistics are skewed since more couples cohabit in others states
than in Utah."Two points:1 - Divorce rate statistics
don't include people who live together, just people who are married.2 - Multiple studies have proven that couples who live together before
marriage are nearly twice as likely to get a divorce than couples who don't, so
by your logic, Utah should have one of the lowest divorce rates in the country.
Very interesting article on Utah,divorce is no longer a world phenomenon has it
used to be 50yrs or so ago,what does it really tell us, the same as it always
did,reseccion?location?adultery,all things, but it all echos the same as it
always did so well done Utah,& good luck the rest!Yours,Lyndon Sullivan @lindano
"In regard to the LDS divorce rate - it is important to distinguish between a
temple and non-temple marriage. The divorce rate for a temple marriage is
between 7 and 15% - meaning that of all temple marriages, about 7 to 15%
eventually divorce and the rest remain married. For non-temple marriages, the
divorce rate is over 50%."I hope you're not a real professor,
because your license would need to be revoked to report such an alarmingly false
statement. Back in 2005, my wife and I attended lectures at BYU, and
one family counsel professor said that the LDS church does NOT release divorce
statistics, and the big reasons why is that, from evidence collected elsewhere,
the LDS church has no better marriage retention amongst its members than
non-mormons. Furthermore, policies have changed dramatically when
it comes to encouraging and admonishing marriage. In the past, there were a
great deal of talks and articles by general authorities to persuade members to
marry, and marry quickly, not delaying due to reasons of school, work, etc. Returned missionaries were instructed to be married within 1 year. All these policies changed because it back fired.
"It's not the LDS temple marriages that are causing the majority of the problem.
LDS temple marriages only have a 6% divorce rate (proven by several different
studies, including one by the Barna Research Group), compared to double digits
in the state and the national averages."Here we go again, false
reporting. You think that if an institution manages to succeed 94%
retention won't be studied by the entire psychological and relationship
experts????Since that's not happening, that means it's pretty
obvious that it's not true, and not even close to being true. A BYU
professor has stated much differently than your quote of some sort of research
group. Denial is the typical form for LDS people, since they never
wanted to acknowledge truth that this church is not as perfect as one might be
led to believe. Utah, number one for fraud in the country. Number
one for teen suicide, and number one for anti-depressants. These are
the voyages of the Starship LDS, and like Dr.Phil counsels often, you can't
change what you don't acknowledge. And few here are acknowledging it, so we know
where that goes.
I married a much older man when I was 23 and he was definitely "set in his
ways." As much as we love eachother, I was the peacemaker who had to go along
with the old grump because he was set in his ways. Because of his commitment to
me and to marriage itself, he gradually met me somewhere in the middle so that
we could find a balance between our two very different personalities and
backgrounds. We've got a great marriage, but it took WORK. We didn't buy into
the "honeymoon phase" and seeing the world through religious rose-colored
glasses mumbo jumbo. Being religious, we actually paid attention to the things
we were taught at a young age, not interpret them so that we could find
justification for our immoral actions (marrying someone you barely know to get
you-know-what and divorce afterwards). Side note: Many many of my
friends lived together with bf/gfs before getting married. None of them are
married now or even together. I'm not talking just 1 or 2 people, this is like
10 or 11 different couples. Living together gives them an out, which is hardly
Met my wife in a BYU class. Dated our junior year. Married our senior year. Got
a job. Have 3 kids now. Finishing a graduate program. Working hard. Very happy
because we're following the principles of the gospel. Mosiah
2:40...Consider the blessed and happy state of those who keep the commandments
of God. For they are blessed in all things, both temporally and spiritually. Good stuff.
This is not the Professor you were addressing, although I do happen to be a
professor (not at BYU).Although the Church may not release
statistics on divorce, these are available through other sources and all of the
studies I have seen have shown that the LDS divorce rate is lower than the
average.It is also not true that the Church ever told RM's to marry
within a year of returning home or that the Church does not now continue to
counsel young people not to postpone marriage for reasons of convenience.Sounds to me like you have more of a bone to pick with the Church and
don't want the facts to get in the way.
Many bishops, mission presidents and seminary/institute teachers have told or
recommended RM's to get married within a year. Its pretty cut and
dry to get married ASAP.You need to take off your religious rose
Individual advice between a leader and a young person is not the same as church
policy. As a leader myself and the father of a girl who is 20 years old (and
not married/engaged), my advice has always been the same - be prepared for when
you find the right person, make sure you take the time to know them well and
pray about it. And keep in mind, there never really is a "perfect" time to get
married. If you wait until you can afford it, you'll always be waiting.I know of no leader who is telling anyone get married ASAP. I do think
it should be a priority for young people, though. I think people living with
their parents at 28, 30, 32 years old are going to have it rough getting along
with someone else and being out on their own.
No one knows for sure what the divorce rate is for LDS marriages. You can look
at Utah stats and deduce that it is not that much different than everywhere else
in the country. I know a busy Utah County divorce attorney who claims that
longer term temple marriages do not divorce at nearly the rate of young LDS
couples - hence the reasonable argument that marrying too young and too fast in
our LDS culture is not always a good thing.But the fact is that
there are thousands of older single divorced members of the Church and that has
created an incredibly interesting sub-culture in the Church. Anyone living in
that culture can testify to that. The single adult dances, activities, internet
sites, etc etc are so unique and interesting. Go to a single adult dance some
day - it can be like stepping on to another planet. I love being LDS and find
great humor in our unique LDS culture. But the single adult LDS culture takes
uniqueness, quarkiness, and LDS humor to a whole new level.
"I know of no leader who is telling anyone get married ASAP."Like
its been said, it backfired, that's why it's not said anymore. And
like its been said, this is a pretty cut and dry knowledge, so much so that it's
actually pretty elementary.