Too bad Utah lost Governor Huntsman who was more a realist than an ideologue.
No warming, just hot air.
"Are human activities responsible for the warming climate?Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) scientists believe that it is
very likely (greater than 90 percent chance) that most of the warming we have
experienced since the 1950s is due to the increase in greenhouse gas emissions
from human activities."This is from the EPA's Climate Change site.
I'd put the URL but the comment section won't allow posts with URLs. Just
google EPA and Climate Change. They have plenty of information for everyone to
"As a matter of fact, in the times of the dinasaurs, CO2 was in much greater
concentration in the atmosphere than it is today, it was hotter then too." Yep, and you see dinosaurs everywhere now don't you?
Herbert told a lobbyist who approached him at the meeting that when it comes to
energy issues, "regardless of the debate on the science, I'm a capitalist."That says it all right there. Procrastinate at the cost of humanity all
for the sake of $$$. You're listening? Yeah right.
You say "people" say human impact on the earth is minimal. It would be more
accurate to say, "some people", but don't let the facts get in your way.Governor Huntsman, I miss you! What were you thinking to have Mr.
Herbert as your running mate?
Herbert, a former County Commissioner and Real Estate Agent, is challenging the
majority of scientists published views? That says a lot right
there. Brash AND dumb.
i love the "follow the money" argument because it destroys your own argument.Compare the money made by auto and oil corporations by dismissing global
climate change. Now compare that to money Al Gore makes from a movie or
advisory positions on Hedge Funds.One is vastly different (and
larger) than the other. Try to think before you speak.
For those who say "The science is settled" and "The debate is over", you can
easily tell by these comments that it's not over!! Most of the so-called
scientific "facts" in Gore's "Inconvenient Truth" were disproved in a court of
law in Britain recently. The court made the showing of the film to school
students illegal without appropriate disclaimers. Also, the IPCC removed the
"hockystick" graphic and theory in subsequent reports after Gore had used it in
his movie.I would like to ask all of the alarmist believers who have
written their comments to answer one question. The global temperature during the
medieval was significantly warmer than it is today and people, animals and
plants thrived. How was it so warm with so little CO2?If you want to know
why so many people are pushing the "climate change" scare, follow the money!
That tells it all.Go Mr. Herbert. I already like you as as our next
For those that believe that regardless of whether global warming is real or not,
we should follow the new air standards just to take care of the earth, you may
want to reconsider. Carbon Dioxide was not a pollutant until the global warming
debate and if this theory is not true, it still poses no harm. The problem
arises when considering whether we should spend all of our resources and effort
battling a naturally occuring compound that may not have negative impact on the
environment. Should man made global warming not be real, all these resources
could be spent toward real environmental issues like water quality, air
pollutants (SO2,CO,fugitive dust etc...), rather than chasing a phantom
pollutant that we expel with every breath and that plants actually require.
Before people dismiss the importance of this debate, you should consider whether
you want the US to spend trillions of tax dollars and possibly sacrifice your
way of life based on a theoretical model made by a scinetific commuunity that
only 30 years ago was predicting global cooling.
Here are the global climate data for all you pagans who want to force the rest
of us to join your earth-worshipping heathen religion and sacrifice our freedoms
on the altars of your god of global climate change: Two years
ago, as the sun was supposed to be starting the next solar cycle, nothing
happened. No sunspots for the new cycle appeared, the total solar irradiance
started dropping, and solar wind pressure dropped to lows never before recorded.
As a result of the decrease in solar output the earth's climate started cooling
quite rapidly as evidenced by people freezing to death in the Andean highlands
of Peru and Bolivia, snow for the first time in 80 years in Baghdad and in
places on the Arabian peninsula where local dialects have no word for snow
because of how infrequently it happens. Here in the US, we just had the coldest
and snowiest winter in over 80 years or on record, depending on the location.
Who cares what an un-elected toady of this states establishment thinks?Maybe after Herby is out of office; he can open a think tank to compete w/ Al
Boy, I'm going to really miss Jon Huntsman Jr.
If we ARE causing global warming, then we should take better care of our
earth. If we ARE NOT causing global warming, then we should take
better care of the earth.Who cares? Our plan and debate should
always be on how to be cleaner and more earth-friendly. I first learned this
when I watched the movie when I was a kid of all of those Disney bears singing
the anti-litter song, "You can pick it up, put it in the bag- boomp-boomp,"
doing their "rump-bumping" as they went along.I applaud any move to
greener, renewable resources (solar, wind, etc). We are way behind where we
should be on this. Of course we should recycle and be smart about our waste. The
real waste is the argument of global warming. Of course our emissions are bad
for us- look at the folks in the big cities and industrial areas of China. The
climate will change regardless of our emissions. But if we don't continually
improve our care of our home, our environment, our health, and our children's
health, will pay the price.
Of course we'll have to wait until summer actually gets here...
This Global Warming argument IS ridiculous! Evidence is rampant that the earth
has gone through many periods of climate change. It will always change. True or
not- the fact is that we SHOULD take care of our earth. We drink the water, eat
food from its soil, and breathe the air. It is our home.Who needs a
huge debate and lots of research? Suck on the exhaust pipe of a running car for
a few seconds and then tell me if you think it's healthy. Drink tainted water
or breathe the air downwind of ANY type of refinery or plant with significant
emissions. It stinks- and it dirties the air.Both we and the
politicians need to quit arguing and start just doing the basics of taking care
of this awesome home we call earth. Each of us individually has that same
If Global Warming continues at this rate we won't have a summer in a few years.
I like it when people declare the debate over in the middle of a debate. As a
matter of definition, as long as people are debating, a debate is not over. The
debate regarding the roundness of the world, for example, is over. I have never
heard a single person argue in favor of flatness. No debate. Global Warming?
Lots of debate all the time.
Did anyone say anything about not being better stewards of our environment? You
don't have to be a nut job to care about the environment. I have less of a
"carbon foot print" than probably 90% of the so called environmentalists. I buy
enough wind power to power my home. I live 3 miles from work and have a very
modest size house. My wife does not commute because she is a full time mom. I
do these things because it makes sense to me not because I believe in the man
made climate change fairy tail. It is possible to be a good steward of the
environment AND not subscribe to Al Gore's lie. The man made climate change
myth is all about power and money.
So, we are not to be better stewards of our environment? We should not limit
polution and other behavior which is detrimental? We should not be more
efficient, ignoring new technology, but instead rely on 19th century technology?
Think about it, we can do better (and my fellow LDS members should be first in
line). Argue all you like, but don't make decisions based on what goes on in
your locality or at one snapshot in time.------------CO2 is not a
pollutant, it is a gas that is vital for sustaining life on the earth. And the
current power technology is not 19th century. If you are going to make it a
religious issue then you would be well served by not promoting lies to try an
prove your point.
Why has the term "Global Warming" been changed to "Global Climate Change"? Of
course the climate is changing, doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that
one out. The climate is ALWAYS changing. Now lets quit pretending that man can
control climate change so we can address more important issues. Of course we
won't have a convenient lie to justify more government control.
Do you mean Al Gore could have been wrong? Shocking.
Where did you get the statistic that there is precisely a 50% chance that God
exists and zero chance that global warming exists? I want to see that data!
"They [liberals, to be renamed later] believe in deneying [sic]
men and women the right to bring forth as many children as they want and to
fulfill God's command to multiply and replenish the earth."To
replenish the earth of what? People? This is a serious question. Are not the
6+ billions of people currently residing on the planet not the most in the
history of the 3rd rock? If so, then it's replenished, right? If not, what was
the previous highest census for mother earth?Or is the earth to be
replenished of its massive cities and metropolisis? Mega skyscrapers? Pregnant
teens? Technological wonder and infrastructure? Single parents and latchkey
kids? Internet gambling and pornography websites? Astronomical personal and
national debts? What, exactly, is this commanded replenishment?
"Now the Chinese are roaring past America and gaining economic speed on us
BECAUSE they are becoming more efficient and technologically advanced than
America to combat global warming."No, the Chinese are gaining on us
because they don't care about global warming. They pollute way more than the
U.S. with their advancing but still older technology. Imposing legislation like
cap and trade or the Kyoto treaty will further slow America's progress (which
through innovation has actually helped reduce pollution because most American
consumers are environmentally conscious to begin with) because we're the only
country that would follow it. Have you been to China and other 3rd
world, advancing countries? They are dirty dumps.
You are spot on IMO. A lot of our manufacturing jobs are going overseas,
because there are minimal regulations in China. You get cheap labor plus no
mountain of legal/environmental paperwork. The net effect is, if we are really
hurting the envirornment the more we have China produce our products the more we
are hurting the environment. You mentioned Geneva Steel and they did
produce pollution locally. How that effected the global environment/climate not
one of us really knows. We can all throw out our theories, but at the end of
the day that is all they are. Politicians/environmentalists act
like they have all of the data points needed, but we only have a very small data
sample and it isn't sufficient to support the claims that they are making.
Bottom line. The beauty of global warming for them is they can make all of
these rules/regulations and at the end of the day no one really knows if they
work or not. If things go good they can claim that they do, and if not they can
claim that we need more rules/regulations. Herbert is right for being
What planet are you on? The Chinese are more environmentally efficient than we
are? Hello?Are you talking about the China that is building an
average of one coal-fired power plant PER WEEK in order to keep up with their
economic growth?Are you talking about the China that has such bad
air pollution they had to shut down most of the industry around Beijing last
year in order to have clear skies for the Olympics?Are you talking
about the China that eagerly snapped up the steel-making equipment from the
"filthy" Geneva Steel works in Utah County and shipped it back home to use
there?Are you talking about the China that refused to sign Kyoto ten
years ago and refuses to consider carbon caps today because they don't wish to
hamstring themselves economically?I am continually amazed at the
ability of environmentalists in general and Global Warming Believers in
particular to ignore facts and modify reality in order to maintain their
TO - re: its all good | 5:36 p.m["Is your name Thomas
Malthus?"]why yes it is. how did you know? are you going to
explain to your children that you destroyed their planet?
"Have you ever considered that God is myth? Teaching your children about God is
great but probably less true than global warming."The difference
between teaching God and global warming is that there is a 50% chance that God
exists while there is a 0% chance that man-made global warming exists.
The anti-having children rhetoric earlier has gotten me to thinking that
"Liberal" is the wrong name. These people do not believe in freeom, they
believe in controlling the lives of others. They believe in deneying men and
women the right to bring forth as many children as they want and to fulfill
God's command to multiply and replenish the earth. Yes, we have to be
wise stewards of the earth. However, God also wants us to have children to help
more people experience earth life. On the question of global warming.
The claims that many nations will be flooded seem over blown. Increased heat
will also mean increased evaporation, more rain, decline in deseret areas and
related occurances. The great time in history was the mideval warm
period when the great Cathedrals were built, when Greenland was settled by
sedentary farmers and similar occurances. We are not yet to those temperature
levels. So even if anthropogenic global warming was proven, which it is
not, that does not mean that things are bad.
Just what we need another global warming "skeptic".Wow a Guv from
the "gravity is just a theory" gang. This is the same group who
pushed the most delusional policies on America in human history, that caused
America's spectacular decline that collapsed our economy, eliminating the
middle-class, destroyed the International American Economic System, decimated
our military power and ended America's domination of the world, making sure we
are so weak NOBODY is afraid of us anymore, they are getting some power back!
YEA!Now the Chinese are roaring past America and gaining economic
speed on us BECAUSE they are becoming more efficient and technologically
advanced than America to combat global warming. I guess we will just
wave as they zoom by America. To think these guys are losing to China. That
proves their "ideas" are the greatest failures and delusions in human
history.To think combating global warming will be one of THE drivers
of economic growth-but NOT in Utah.I guess California will get all
the 21st century technology. And Utah will become America's Mississippi of the
21st century-they don't believe in global warming either.
If you don't think it's political, chew on this list of the top recipients of
environmental special-interest cash from 2000-2004:1. John Kerry2. Al Gore3. Paul Wellstone4. Barbara Boxer5. Bill
Bradley6. Mark Udall7. Jay Inslee8. Jeanne Shaheen9.
Jean Carnaham10. Barack ObamaDo I even need to include their
If you discount the opinions of scientists funded by oil companies, then you
must also discount the ones funded by government grants. If they find that
man-made climate change isn't happening their grant money dries up. They have to
keep searching for data to support it and keep people scared or they will be out
of a job. You can't eliminate the findings of one group of scientists based on
their financial motivations without doing the same with the other side. Then
only those scientists with nothing to gain by either result can be believed.
They must be truly objective. In today's scientific world I tend to believe
those who question global warming because they are risking their jobs and
credentials when they question it. They may be blackballed by those who have a
desired outcome and agenda rather than an objective approach.
I don't know if CO2 is bad or not.I just know what is the primary source
of CO2.Its people.Or rather, birth rate.The more people in the
world, the more consumption of energy.So how come poor countries with the
highest birth rate, that will produce a lot of future energy consumers, and
produce a lot of mouths to feed, blame the western world that happens to have
the lowest birth rate?
... have got to be kidding me... people actually believe in
catastrophic global warming... hahahahahahahahahaha(I mean climate
change) It's not even worth debating the "science" is so bad!!
One good idea would be to download the latest NIPCC book titled "Climate Change
Reconsidered". It's a PDF document.On reading this document it is
obvious that there is no real "consensus" on climate change and that we lack
understanding of many important aspects of "climatic systems". Rather than assuming we know everything about a natural phenomenon, we should
first tackle what we do not know.This is the first step on the road to
enlightenment.BTW, I am a doctorate-level applied-scientist/engineer
andthe NIPCC book was a comfortable read for me. Unfortunately, this may
not be the case for many people that do not have a science background. I suppose this is one of the main problems with this whole "climate change"
(formerly "global warming") issue. i.e. Science has been thrusted
upon the average person that may not have been well prepared to digest this
science due to their background not being science-based.If this was
done by accident or by design, I do not know.But, I would not be surprised
if this was done by design in an attempt to falsely sway the people.
As a scientist myself, I have proven we may run out of C02 unless mankind steps
in to save the planet. Photosynthesis is the reason! Plants adsorb C02 out of
the atmosphere and in the presence of H0H and sunlight synthesize carbon into
two 6 carbon chain sugar molecules and releases 02 back into the atmosphere. For
every ton of sucrose and fructose plants produce, they will adsorb 6 tons of C02
out of the atmosphere. I entered this data into my computer model and learned we
need approx. 9.376 billion tons of C02 each year to sustain life on the planet!
Futher, my research shows that we could run low on C02 within 15 years unless
mankind steps in to save the planet! Do it for Mother Earth! Do it for our
C02 and Methane reflect sunlight down on the earth? Baloney! What experiments of
physics are you referring too? The sun's rays come from space toward the earth
and CO2 and Methane would have little if any effect on reflecting, and even if
they did, why wouldn't they reflect the sun's rays away from the earth, just
like clouds and water vapor do! Your science is junk! Stay off those wacko
websites, they are filling your head with junk!
Yes, but what will the effect be, and is it worth impoverishing ourselves in an
effort to avert a "crisis" that is actually quite manageable?We
already have a good idea of how the earth will react to excess CO2 emissions;
it's called the past 200 years.Since the early 1800's the
atmospheric concentration of CO2 has increased from roughly 280 parts per
million to about 390 parts per million today, or about 30 percent.Yet the actual measured temperature increase is only about 1.8 degrees
fahrenheit during that same time period, less than a degree increase per
century. Clearly, increasing atmospheric CO2 concentration does not produce a
proportional increase temperature.Yet we are asked to believe that
another 40% increase of CO2 will suddenly create a runaway greenhouse effect
that will threaten all life on earth, even though it didn't in the past.More importantly, the climate models of 20 years ago which were used to
create the global warming scare in the first place did not even come close to
predicting the actual temperatures today. So why should we believe them now?
If we grant for the sake of discussion that the most dire predictions of
man-caused global warming and ensuing disaster are correct, we are left with the
evidence that the proposed solutions, most notably cap-and-trade, will make such
a small impact as to avert none of the predicted calamities.
Look, it is a fact that CO2, Methane and other gases reflect the suns radiation
back down to the earth. We know this from experiments in physics. We know this
also from astronomy. Venus is hotter than it should be relative to its distance
from the sun alone. The reason, green house gases. Likewise Mars is colder than
it should be relative to its distance fromt the sun. Again the reason, it is
devoid of greenhouse gases. Its not just conjecture. There has always been a
carbon cycle on the earth which has operated under a balance with carbon
fixation by plants and carbon release by decomposers, volcanoes, oceans etc.
However, for many millions of years large carbon sources have been locked up in
the ground in the form of fossilized plants. The worlds ecosystems, and our own
agricultural systems, have evolved to be adapted to these conditions. It took
millions of years to remove this carbon source. Now we are releasing CO2 at a
pace of millions of metric tons per year. It will in fact have an effect. The
unknown is how these systems will react to warmer temperatures. It is foolish to
ignore the possible consequences.
Actually, you're the one in denial. But I've noticed that's not uncommon for
environmentalists; they seem incapable of accepting anything less than news of
human-caused catastrophes.Based on data from the EPA and the Utah
Division of Air Quality -- you know, the scientists who actually measure the
pollution and determine compliance -- there are four incontrovertible facts
about Utah's air quality:1. The air quality along the Wasatch Front
is better today than at any time during the past 50 years;2. Aside
from a few weeks in the winter and a few weeks in the summer, the air quality in
Utah is rated "good" by the EPA;3. Trends from the monitoring data
indicate that the levels of all six toxic pollutants have been steadily
declining for the past 20 years;4. And prior to new stricter air
standards adopted in 2006 and 2007 all of Utah's urban areas -- including Logan
-- were in compliance with EPA standards.Incidentally, the data from
global temperature monitoring are not "cooperating" with the panic-mongers,
either: Over the past 20 years the average global temperature has remained
roughly the same.
To Grimble, Stop claiming turning lights off at earth hour was a
political act. It was not clearly stated as such. If the CHurch wanted to
support action on global warming, they would make an actual statement about
it. It is interesting that the liberals are much faster than the
conservatives to try to force the Church into being a supporter of their plans,
despite all the claims to the contrary. The Church has no position on
global warming. I think people on both sides need to tone down the rhetoric.
Although you are not spiling the hate as much as some, your blanket assults on
the character of the residents of Utah are uncalled for, and you need to accept
that by attacking Herbert you are standing on the side of dogmatism and against
To the 1:37 commentator, I do have to agree that the comment you were
responding to was uncalled for. However, there are multiple issues in your
response. 1- There is no evidence that the person who you responded to
lives in Utah. That is an assumption on your part. 2- Considering that
he was responding to the accusation that "people in under-educated regions of
the world believe it is okay to over-procreate", he is not the one who
introduced calls for fewer people. His statements needs to be understood as a
response to the claim that the world is over populated. If the world has
TOO MANY PEOPLE, and IF you believe this is a major problem, than it the notion
that drastic measures to reduce the population are called for follows, and this
respondents statements made sense in that context. They were a response to
claims the world was over populated, and do not seem to in anyway reflect the
actual views of the person who made them. Again, your accusations are
without base and caused by a failure to consider the actions of other people in
To the 9:32 commentator, True, the person may have used bad exaples,
but their point is still valid. Prior to Copernicus it was accepted scientific
fact that the sun revolved around the earth.
@Grimble at 1:37 said:"Well, please can you give us the date of the
Church press release confirming their belief in global warming or climate
change?"The Church turned off the lights to the Salt Lake Temple on
March 28, 2009, from 8:30-9:30pm, in observance of Earth Hour. Scott Trotter,
spokesman for the Church, discussed the Church's participation in a Trib article
that appeared on March 26th.The meaning of the Church's
participation is pretty unambiguous. The goal of Earth Hour, from organizer's
official website, was "to reach the target of 1 billion votes by the time world
leaders meet in Copenhagen for the Global Climate Change Conference in December
2009. This meeting will determine official government policies to take action
against global warming, which will replace the Kyoto Protocol."But
of course, not amount of evidence seems enough to convince Utahns. They'll
insist a custodian accidentally leaning on the light switch...
To knowwhat@ 1:31:The 700 signers of Sen. Inhofe's minority report
were not climate scientists--they included virtually any scientific field. So,
as a portion of ALL scientists in the U.S., which the Census Bureau states is
3.5 million, 700 is a pretty tiny number. Furthermore, a number of scientists
listed on it later protested that they had not consented to putting their names
on it.The U of I survey, on the other hand, identified the
specialties of the responders. The ONLY field in which doubters outnumbered
believers was, surprise surprise, petroleum geologists. 90% of ALL scientists,
and 97% of CLIMATE scientists believe in global warming. In other words, the
more someone knows about climate science, the more likely they are to believe in
climate change.There's lots of good scientific information right in
our own back yard. Steven Peck and Richard Gill are both BYU climate science
experts who have been working very hard to try to educate their fellow Mormons
about the reality of global climate change. But Utahns are so blinded by their
gleeful, childish Gore-hate, it's a difficult job.
I'm glad to see Lt. Governor Herbert speak some common sense. However, the
debate about MMGW should be over. There is insurmountable evidence that it is
one of the biggest, politicized HOAXES of all time.
Is your name Thomas Malthus?
Have you ever considered that God is myth? Teaching your children about God is
great but probably less true than global warming.
AaronDon't take me wrong, global warming has been going on for
thousands of years. I believe there is no corrolation between global warming and
carbon emmissions. I loose about two out of three posts to these sites on the
DN. Don't know why. The papers ran a story a few days ago citing a south america
glacier that is continuing to grow.
Re: Goforit, 4:32pm: If youre talking about Prof. Pope at BYU, then, yes, Ill
go ahead and respond. His work did not stick with standard scientific and
statistical practices, and he refused to make his data available for peer
review. So his supposed proof is in reality only wild guesses and means
Some in favor of global warming solutions state that even if it turns out that
mankind is not responsible for global warming, we will still have cleaner water
and air or well still leave the world a better place for our children, etc.
But this is nonsense. These supposed solutions will likely leave the world a
much WORSE place, because they will be so destructive to our economy, our
property rights, and our freedom. The wealthiest countries are the
healthiest. But when you destroy much of that wealth in an attempt to appease
the theoretical boogeyman of global warming, then the nation is much poorer and
less able to pursue matters that have significant PROVEN health benefits. And
the destruction of freedom is not worth it, either. Its like throwing a man in
prison, but making sure his cell has ventilation we could congratulate
ourselves: Sure, hes in shackles, but at least he has fresh air.
I may have been in the last class in Utah schools where a teacher dared teach
that we should study the facts and think for ourselves, instead of merely
parroting the media.... That was in the early 60s. I have looked at my childrens
school books the past 20 years and become aghast at the massive propaganda
campaign that has been going on, teaching children the opposite of what God
tells us. Most of the comments here in favor of the global warming myth simply
reflect the conditioning they have received over many years in the public
schools. I have tried to teach my children to not believe everything they hear
until they measure it against common sense and God's word. I would suggest that
all of us do that, but it might be difficult for all of you who have been taught
from your youth to NOT think for yourself, but merely engage in knee-jerk
reactions to any stimuli that opposes your conditioning. Otherwise, the
global-warming-caused-by-humans myth would have been scoffed out of existence
years ago, when if first left the lips of Spotted Al.
If the earth is warming, why is that a bad thing? Personally I would think a
warmer earth would provide many benefits to mankind (longer growing seasons,
more usable land, etc.) Besides, what's the optimal temperature for
our Earth anyway? We know it was colder in the Ice Age a mear 10K years ago.
Who decides what the optimal temperature is? Another question, if we decide
what the optimal temperature should be, how in the world can we keep the earth
at a steady temperature, that sounds like quite the task.
Herbert asked. "Help me understand the science."Subscribe to Climate
Progress. Read the daily blogs of Dr. Joseph Romm, Ph.D. in physics from MIT. In
2008, Romm was elected a Fellow of the American Association for the Advancement
of Science.Please become educated on this issue. The future of our
children depends on the decisions we make now.
Herbert is just jealous of Gore's Nobel Prize and wants to get one himself!
Wow, good for Herbert. In my book he just moved up another notch or two. In the article, Nick Bridge suggests that Herbert see dealing with
climate change as taking a risk management approach, and he gives the analogy of
a car with a 30% chance of brake failure speeding toward a cliff. But the
problem with a risk management approach on global warming is that it is
one-sided. It looks at the potential risk of doing nothing, thereby pushing us
to take action, but it DOESNT look at the risk of TAKING that action. The
proposed solutions to the supposed global-warming problem have GREAT risk they
will have certain massive brake failure, because they will be so destructive to
our economy and our freedom, and all based on a theory that has many holes in
it. Sorry, but I dont want to get in that car. Herbert is right,
and my hat is off to him. Hopefully he will have the guts to actually pull
Utah out of the foolish Western Climate Initiative. The debate is far from
are not any of you going to demean or disparage the BYU professor who is a
leading authority on these matters? And what about BYU funding part of a large
The Gov's comments about global warming suggest -- not to put it too gently --
that he should not be permitted to serve as the leader of our state. Global
warming is now beyond scientific dispute; man's culpability for this looming
catastrophe is also now well beyond dispute. Where has Mr. Herbert been that he
doesn't understand these immutable facts?
About 35 years ago, those so-called scientists told us, "Global Cooling",
"Ice-age is coming!" I did some research for the titles of those books. They are
looks very scary as same as right now "Global Warming" books. Is this movement
another hypo to "stimulus the US economy"? What a shame.
I have "experts" and Al Gore supporting the facts on this!!!!!After
you take a pair of 2's, put them through an intense simulated "ice age", then
put them through an intense simulated "global warming", then add in their
"carbon print" you miraculously come up with a pair of 2.5's, making the
"theory" a "fact" that indeed, without any doubt, because the debate and the
science are "over", 2+2=5.Al Gore said so, and so does his long line
of sheep following him. Plus I read it on the internet through google - so it
must be TRUE
What Utah's air is clean? You're in denial man, have you seen the inversion
lately? Have you actually looked at the science? A recent desnews article stated
that Logan had some of the worst air quality in the country. I agree lets bring
in nuclear waste and increase carbon emissions, great idea, burn baby burn.
Finally a governor who will refute the Enviro Nazis. This has sure been an
awfully hot summer. LOL!
Jfs, Nasa only came up with the conclusion that some ice caps would increase,
after the observations didn't match their hypothesis. 2nd do you know when the
glaciers on Mt. Cook peaked? It was about 7500 years ago. We are barely
scratching the surface when it comes to understanding how the climate works.
I still don't get it: Why those people change the wording to "Global Climate
Change" from "Global Warning"? I am 100% sure climate has changed and is
changing and will change, this does not need any science! The question remaining
to our ordinary people still is: how people change the climate? is it good or
bad? 100 million years ago, without people, climate was changing? why? how big
the human factor is? I still don't get it! I got my applied physics degree 20
re-re-knowwhat | 2:30 p.m["Still no proof provided from the extremist
claim"]now that's calling the kettle black... are the
extremeists the ones for saving the planet or against it? pls elaborate...
don't believe in global warming? don't think we're ruining the planet with our
wasteful ways?thats fine - its all good. We won't be around when it
all falls apart anyway. you, on the other hand, with your dozens of kids, will
have ruined your childrens future. and I'm sure you'll say God had a hand in
it...so its all good...
Plate techtonics are much more violent then man could ever dream of being. They
do more damage to the earth than we could ever possibly do. 99% of all species
were extinct before the humans started ruining everything. The Earth is
extremely resilient. Species have always changed and adapted to their
cicumstances, hence natural selection. For those who think we're killing the
earth, learn a little about science and how the earth works then come discuss.
The sad reality is that global warming is real and Herbert will be our governor.
You can still be a good steward of the earth and not buy in to the Global
Warming power grab. Fear is a politicians favorite tool to control the masses
and both parties are masters at using it. It is refreshing that Herbert is
willing to recognize there is disagreement on GW. Just my opinion.
Still no proof provided from the extremist claim, I gave you the places you
could look up the data, but I can planly see you would rather read it on some
blog or hear it from your Fuhrer(Gore), than study it for yourself. If you would
like me to provide that exact pages and scientist's please let me know.
Otherwise go back to your propaganda and name calling distractions.
NASA says, "In addition to increasing the amount of melting, global warming
would also be expected to increase the amount of precipitation in the polar
regions.... Global warming could therefore be expected initially to increase
both melting and snowfall. Depending on which increase dominates, the early
result could be either an overall decay or an overall growth of the ice sheets."
Sounds to me like the science is settled. They also said they need more
observations to see if climate models are correct. Sounds like the
models are theories to me.
"what's your point? the issue isn't "average global temperatures" or climate
change in Utah."Really? I thought that WAS the issue, that
increased human-caused CO2 emissions would lead to a significant increase in
temperature.If the actual data show NO significant increase in
temperature over the past 20 years despite a steady increase in CO2 emissions
during the same time period that kinda blows the whole Global Warming theory
right out of the water, doesn't it?Whether or not the polar caps are
melting is irrelevant. If the earth's temperature isn't increasing yet the caps
are still melting then it might be due to something entirely different.That Red Herring, plus your gratuitous anti-Mormon slur only confirms what I
posted earlier: In the Great Debate over Global Warming, the sceptics have all
the facts. The Believers have only insults and invective.
do some of you REALLY not believe we are killing this planet? are you stuck in
the 1800s?how can you possibly look around and NOT think we are
ruining the planet?wow - I'm at a loss for words. No wonder you all
voted for Bush...
. . . there was near-unanimous (much greater than 97%) scientific consensus that
Ptolemy's astronomic theories were correct, and that the universe was mounted on
and rotated within a series of nested crystal spheres.That consensus
did not render Ptolemy's theories correct.Teaching point:Whenever a "scientist" tries to convince you with a consensus view, it means
two things -- (1) He has insufficient facts to make his case,
and (2) He's selling something.
I have also never been convinced that society has caused a global change of our
climate. I am very pleased that we have a leader in our state that feels the
same way. I think it is a very arrogant stance to take to think that us little
ol humans are powerful enough to cause such a global change. It is even more of
an arrogant stance to think we are intelligent enough to stop or change this
alleged new global event. The only real answer to the "Gullible Warming" scare
is that some people have found a way to make huge amounts of money and have
power and control over others. That's really the only reason to come up with
such an allegation. Give em heck, Herbert, don't give in!
NASA studies indicate that the ice pack in the Antartic has increased by 100,000
square miles per decade for that last four decades. Do your own research
["I'm sorry but the caps are not melting faster. You better do some research
and you will find that Antarctica has some areas melting but the majority of the
continent is colder and has more ice that ever before. NASA website will help
you with this. Also Artic ice has increased by about 30 percent since 2005.
National snow and ice data center.Stop drinking the koolaid and do the
research"]wow - I don't know what planet you're from, but here
on earth, the poles are melting faster than ever before. I suggest you actually
read some literature and scientific studies rather than just listen to your
crazy govenor wanna-be...and it's not the kool-aid - it's the idiots
that think everything is ok. wow - the ignorance on this site - must be a Utah
"Herbert told a lobbyist who approached him at the meeting that when it comes to
energy issues, "regardless of the debate on the science, I'm a capitalist.""I think that says it all right there....
"So what do we do to solve the over-population of humans problem? Can we send
you to the gas chamber first?"Thanks for that. I can't say I'm
surprised to read a fascist allusion / implicit death threat coming out of Utah,
the closest thing to Afghanistan the USA has to offer! Look at how great
anti-secularism and regression are!As for overpopulation, I don't
know.. I'd say birthcontrol would be a good start?
Well, please can you give us the date of the Church press release confirming
their belief in global warming or climate change? Especially as caused by human
activity? No? hmm... The Church has always taught the members to
be wise stewards of our resources. There's nothing wrong with saving energy,
reducing water use, recycling, cleaning up the environment, etc. The Church
just built a new Church History Library, which is in the process of receiving
LEED certification. Doesn't mean that draconian measures to force all people
everywhere to conserve and reduce emissions, destroying the economy in the
process is a good idea.
While reading these comments I've noticed that Global Warming Sceptics tend to
cite real research and real figures, while the Global Warming Believers resort
to anti-Mormon sneers and ad hominem attacks on Governor Herbert. For
example:Sceptic: "Average global temperatures have remained
constant or declined slightly each year since 2001. The peak occurred more than
a decade ago (1998)."Believer: "leave it to mormons to live in a
fantasy world. right - no global warming - we should just continue down the path
we've been going. and a con man in the 1800s had conversations with God, and
your leaders are prophets."It's pretty obvious to me which side of
the debate is confident and sure of the facts, and which side is uncertain and
Grimble, I guess you need to define what a climate scientist is. Because the 700
scientist that are disenting in the Senate Minortiy Report are surely more than
that 3 percent.
Wow, what scientific proof or observations do they have to reach their
conclusions? According to geological studies, when ever the earth was really
warm the deserts of the earth disappeared. So how will the Southwest desert get
drier and bigger, when physical geology shows a different observation? Why are
some glaciers advancing and some are retreating? Why has antarctica's ice sheet
been growing for the past 30 years? Why has the earth been cooling since 2001?
May's global temperature in 2009 was .09 degrees Celcius, which was the same as
1979. Why have the oceans cooled for the past 5 years? When was the last
continental record high broken? It was 1974 in Antarctica. Why are all of the
computer models wrong with respect to our current global temps? The answers to
all of my questions are out there, you just have to look int he right places to
Also, all of you who refuse to believe the science on climate change better send
your angry letters to Church headquarters, since the GA's recently met with Al
Gore on the issue and shortly thereafter turned off the external lights of the
Salt Lake Temple in support of Earth Hour, which was a world-wide effort to
raise awareness of the reality of climate change.
How sad that we have to have this discussion over and over and over again on the
DN boards.Listen, folks, you are welcome to believe what you want,
but the FACT is a study conducted by the U. of Illinois found that 97% of
climate scientists think that global warming is a reality. Look it up. The
people that don't believe in global warming are the people like the Oregon
Institute for Science and Medicine, who released a petition of global-warming
doubters that contained the signatures of such respected scientists as Ginger
Spice (of the Spice Girls) and several of the fictional doctors from M*A*S*H.Herbert is right, there ARE two sides to this debate: the 97% side and
the 3% side.Those of you who continue to doubt the science on this
are making your beds with the people who think dinosaurs wore saddles and that
the Earth is flat.I don't blame Huntsman for leaving. It would be
frustrating trying to lead a state full of so many proudly ignorant people.
Let me get this straight, now you're saying that if the weather isn't exactly
right on average that that's proof that we have climate change? So no matter
which way it goes, you're right... unless it's the perfect, average
temperature.You remind of the African village in "The Gods musts be
crazy" who had a coke bottle dropped in their village. Pretty big stretch on
which to form definitive conclusions.
RE - nate@11:39am.I'm sorry but the caps are not melting faster. You
better do some research and you will find that Antarctica has some areas melting
but the majority of the continent is colder and has more ice that ever before.
NASA website will help you with this. Also Artic ice has increased by about 30
percent since 2005. National snow and ice data center.Stop drinking the
koolaid and do the research.
lol - figures fantasy land would be run by a fantasy-boy Herbert. you all
deserve each other
So what do we do to solve the over-population of humans problem? Can we send
you to the gas chamber first?
["Average global temperatures have remained constant or declined slightly
each year since 2001. The peak occurred more than a decade ago (1998)."]what's your point? the issue isn't "average global temperatures" or
climate change in Utah. The issue is climate change at the polls. If you
haven't figured that out yet, and Utah thinks like you do, no wonder we're in a
heap of trouble.you people are amazing. yeah - right - there's no
problem. the caps are melting faster than ever in history, but it's all
good....crazy people... but I'm sure your right - Utah will be the
last place to see climate change, since you're run by the "only true church" -
I'm sure God will look out for you extra specially well...
It is funny how polar ice caps can be melting in one region and growing larger
in another, but the melting is of greater concern because it steers the more
popular political agenda.Wind power better not be the solution to all our
country's needs because those things are hideous and take up lots of land
(a.k.a. disturb the environment) and kill thousands of birds annually. Could
you imagine seeing those hideous wind turbines everywhere that there is
potential for a slight breeze. I agree that wind is one energy alternative, but
lets not go to excess.REMEMBER WHEN THE THEORY OF EVOLUTION WAS
TAUGHT AS A THEORY INSTEAD OF THE GOSPEL TRUTH OF MODERN SOCIETY. REMEMBER WHEN
THE BIG BANG THEORY WAS TAUGHT AS A THEORY. The way things are spoken of these
things today you'd think that their is no reason to ever prove these theories as
fact, because the general concensus says they are fact. The same goes for
global warming I mean climate change because it is not getting any warmer.
I said Utah County. Cuts in air pollution in US cities over recent decades have
added an average of five months of life to their inhabitants, BBC News reported
today. It said that a study had matched air pollution in 51 cities with the life
expectancy of their inhabitants between 1980 and 2000. It found that people in
cities with the biggest shift from polluted to clean air had an average 10
months longer lifespan. Dr C Arden Pope III from the Department of Economics,
Brigham Young University in Provo, Utah, and colleagues from Harvard carried out
this research. The work was funded by a number of grants from research agencies
including the Association of Schools of Public Health, the Harvard Environmental
Protection Agency, Particulate Matter Center, the National Institute of
Environmental Health Sciences and funds from the Mary Lou Fulton Professorship,
Brigham Young University. The study was published in the (peer-reviewed) medical
journal, New England Journal of Medicine.
Whenever a group declares "the debate is over!", they are just acknowledging
that they have reached the shallow depth of their argument and cannot keep going
with the discussion. The fact is, no one knows what will happen with natural
environment in the future. Should humankind be wise stewards of the
environment? yes! Polution is bad and we should be looking for efficiencies in
our productiona and use of energy.Should panic fueled by power
grabbing policy makers make us give up freedoms of commerce, socialize the world
economy, and otherwise take away opportunity from future generations? No.As long as there is continuing thought and progression of knowledge, the
debate over anything is never over.
when you pepole make light of what man can do to the earth ask the japanese in
the citys that we used the atomic bombs on. Bush changed the name of global
warming to climate change. The polution levels in salt lake are the worst in my
life, and are getting worse. This is caused by automobiles and trucks and pepole
are having more breathing problems. The climate is different look at this moth
how wet it is, and its still spring by the way.
It looks like Herbert is one of those who think global warming is a political
question. Everything good is republican and everything bad is democrat. Just
what Utah needs, another politician who decides all issues based on political
The earth is overpopulated with humans. There are several reasons for this, but
the biggest one is that people in under-educated regions of the world believe it
is okay to over-procreate.Because of this over-abundance of PEOPLE,
the decisions we make absolutely affect the well-being of our planet. Like it
or not, we have taken on a role of stewardship. Regardless of the scientific
basis on which climate change is based, the underlying truth is that we are
mismanaging the place in which we all live. Efficient use of resources and the
promotion of healthy lifestyles is something that would benefit everyone.
Average global temperatures have remained constant or declined slightly each
year since 2001. The peak occurred more than a decade ago (1998).Which computer model predicted that?No wonder scientists are now
quietly distancing themselves from global warming theory.
Huntsman's biggest mistake during his stay as Gov. was made before the election
when this clown got the #2 spot.
Good for Herbert. There's plenty of room for scientific debate as demonstrated
by the many reputable, well-known climate scientists like Richard Lindzen who
disagree with the popular view.The uncertainties in climate
forecasting are a log bigger than the bandwagon wants to admit.
RE SallyCan I help you pack?
Yes, Sally, please move! And I'm sure since you are so purely protecting our
fragile earth from destruction, that when you move you won't drive a CO2 causing
automobile or fly an Airplane, so you'll likely be walking to your new
destination. Make sure to wear comfortable shoes that are produced solely from
all natural materials only (do they make such a thing?)I'm sure your
new home won't use evil electricity or CO2 causing natural gas. Its comforting
to know that some people like you are protecting the Earth from destruction
while others like me aren't. There is such a stark difference between the two
leave it to mormons to live in a fantasy world. right - no global warming - we
should just continue down the path we've been going. and a con man in the 1800s
had conversations with God, and your leaders are prophets.no one
bothers listening to your opinion on this simply because you already live in a
fantasy world. your new governor simply is proving the point...
Mr Herbert I thought you were going to keep the politics of one of our most
popular Governors (Huntsman) the same! You're already dividing us- climate
change is real, Utah had respect because of what Huntsman did for the image and
economics of this state. Why don't you learn from him!Jon Huntsman I
miss you- please come back and keep Utah progressing- seems most Utahan's would
rather go back to the horse & buggy days- we need a Governor that will educate
himself on the science before he makes such statements!
once again the people of Utah live in a fantasy world, especially Baline Nay.Baline - It is comforting to know that you have so much more scientific
expertise than the leading experts in the world. Yes - you're quite right - man
can have NO effect on the earth - we are but a speck on the environment. And
magical seer stones will allow you to talk to god and there really is a special
celestial kingdom for mormons....Well, all the "no global waarming"
pundits do have one thing right. Man cannot possibly kill the planet. No - the
planet will be here for millions of years. All man will do is make it
uninhabitable for our species, thereby creating the extinction of the human
race. Probably just as well.That's ok - it won't be me - I'll be
gone in the 50 yrs it takes you to ruin the planet, and I have no children. But
all you mormons, pumping out kids right and left - your kids will bear the
consequences of your actions.great politicians you all have there in
Utah. Gotta love the fantasy world you have created. Good luck with that.
From many of the comments, you can see what lemmings the liberals are - if one
of their idols say it, i.e. Obama, Gore, a movie star, then the debate IS over
about anything. Since when does being a politician, a star or having more money
give someone additional gray matter. The lemmings sure think so. That's why
they jump on the band wagons of "global warming", "love the terrorists",
"socialist healthcare", "only government can solve the problems", etc. etc. etc.
They never learn from history. Now, because the lemmings have become so
numerous (like a rat infestation), we have a socialist president, a liberal
agenda which can only decrease our standard of living, and a focus on making
sure terrorists and criminals live better and more comfortable than the majority
of the world's population. Not only are all the lemmings running over the cliff
together, they are pulling everyone right along with them. They are the modern
day hippies and anti-americans that caused so much flack over getting out of
Vietnam that getting their way caused the slaughter of MILLIONS of our fellow
human beings. UTOPIAS don't work. The "smart" liberals never learn.
Is this guy serious?When has man's impact on earth EVER been
minimal? Just look at any major city today compared to 100 years
ago then tell me man's impact is minimal on the environment including the
What makes me laugh the most about those who are convinced that Global Warming -
oops, I mean the new PC "Climate Change" is real follow obediently behind their
pied piper Al Gore. Yes Al Gore, the man who has more Faux Pas under his belt
that George W. Bush. The man who claims to have invented the internet and many
other wonderful things. How people can take this man serious on any issue is
astounding to me. One more thing, greenhouse gasses and small particles
are two different things. Many times we confuse poor air quality with greenhouse
gasses. Yes they contribute, but poor air quality is usually associated with
small particles that damage lungs. Part of the debate needs to include this
Unlike particulates, sulfur oxides, and ozone, carbon dioxide is not a hazardous
air pollutant. It is an inert gas that is essential for life itself; without
CO2 there would be no plants.The levels of every one of EPA's toxic
air pollutants along the Wasatch Front have decreased even as the overall CO2
emissions have increased. The two are not necessarily connected.And
your contention that Utahns die at a much higher rate than the rest of the US is
false: Utah has the lowest death rate from lung cancer and other respiratory
diseases in the US, largely because Utahns smoke less than anyone else in the
Gary Herbert has guts to tell the gullible governors in the group (Montana's
Gov. Schweitzer being a better informed exception) that he does not buy the
alarmist hysteria over global warming. This is far from a settled
fact, despite what some advocates insist. (Misled by Al Gore and others).It appears that most of those criticizing Lt. Gov. Herbert in comments
above are from outside Utah. Probably from Kalifornia. Ignore them and their
foolish ways, and let us Utahns live in freedom.Herbert is right to
demand PROOF before we squander billions of dollars we don't have on unnecessary
climate change stuff, or even worse, get snookered into some "cap and trade"
scheme.I look forward to voting for Gov. Herbert's re-election again
99% of real scientists? Get a grip with reality, dude or dudette. Global
warming/change hysteria is all about politics and money. Please check your
Herbert will be a much better governor for our state, and has the stones to not
give into the political pressure the left has put with this "climate change" and
the impact human's have on it. How naive are you people, you buy into this
global warming crap just like you bought into BHO making a positive impact on
our society and history will show how wrong you are on both counts.
buy the guy a thermometer?Maybe he should spend the summer in St
George, when it's a hundred and plenty for weeks at a time...
How sad... we actually HAD a governor that thought for himself... and wasn't
afraid to question things... and now we are stuck with this fool... who just
walks around like a bobble head with no real thoughts... he just does what he is
supposed to do. It's a scary thing when the governor of our state is stuck in
the bubble with the rest of you idiots! I need to move.
I can tell you unequivocally that CO2 is NOT a pollutant. The so-called
"scientists" who cannot understand that are on a bandwagon leading to the
destruction of America, and the world. CO2 is an important part of life. The
earth isn't going to come to an end because of it. True, the earth will come to
an end, but not because of CO2. There are thousands of scientists who know and
understand this. There are a few scientists who are afraid to stand up for what
they know is right for fear of losing their funding, and their grants, and their
jobs. Believe me, Herbert is courageous for his small voice questioning what
has been happening about this nonsense.
Anyone who was awake during those basic science and geography classes back in
grade school knows that the earth has always gone through climate cycles They
know that the planet was warmer a thousand years ago than it is today. They know
about Lake Bonneville which coverer much of Utah and Nevada. They know much of
North America was covered with 4,000 feet of ice just a few thousand years ago.
They know that the oceans were once 500 feet lower than they are to day and that
man's CO2 did not cause sea level to rise to where it has been for the past
several thousand years. Anyone who has been outdoors long enough to be remotely
aware of the incredible power of the Sun (which also goes through cycles) to
heat and illuminate the earth is far more powerful even than Al Gore. To presume
that man is so powerful he can affect climate in spite of solar and earth
climate cycles is the epitome of arrogance and ignorance. I applaud Lt. Governor
Gary Herbert for staying awake in those science classes through which the
radical environmentalists and Governor Huntsman slept.
Ok, now please don't confuse liberals with actual facts and logic... let me
try! Of course "a man convinced against his will is of the same opinion
still".1. There are limited resources in this world.2. We
need to decide what's the best use of those resources - otherwise known as
cost/benefit analysis.3. If the world spent 50% of world GDP on efforts
to combat greenhouse gasses, we would reduce total greenhouse gas emissions by
about 1-3%, depending on whose models you use. This might result in a
temperature reduction of about .01 to .1 degree, again depending on whose models
you use. That amount of reduction is not enough to actually make any
difference.4. Meanwhile, efforts to feed the hungry, clean up other forms
of pollution, pay for medical care, help third world countries develop so that
they pollute less, would all go begging.5. Those who promote climate
change tend to ignore facts that don't fit their preconceptions - Arctic ice is
thicker than they thought, Antarctic ice is growing, solar activity actually
DOES affect variations in global temperatures (who'da thunk!).
For asthma and lung disease sufferers its 37 to 1 SLC to TucsonHeart
disease is 22 to 1Older and children is 37 to 1And active outdoors
is 27 to ZEROSo those of you who wish to post facts and quote a web
site should actually go to the web site.
The global warming argument is, like, the same as the argument about whether the
earth is round or flat. Hello! Everyone knows that if the earth was round and we
sailed to the otherside we would be upside down! Im so glad Herbert is our gov.
Such impressive logic he has!
Pima County, AZ (Tucson) had ZERO unhealthy days while Salt Lake County, UT had
NINE unhealthy days. Facts can be confusing when you lie. From the EPA Compare
Air web site using the general population. There is a Glacier in Alsaka,
Portage Glacier that has treated many miles from the visitors center that was
built at its base in the 60's. I think as much as 10 miles or more. I don't
know if humans are causing this but don't lie.
Global warming or climate change as they call it now, is nothing more than a
money making operation for people like Al Gore and his cronies. Go look up all
the Boards Al gore is on and Hedge Funds he is involved with and you will really
see whats going on. He is promoting "climate change" on behalf of several
companies so they can line their pockets from all this nonsense and he is making
tens of millions for his efforts. As they say "follow the money"
in other news, some idiots still think the world is flat, that the sun revolves
around the earth, that sneezing is really demons trying to escape your body, and
that the earth is really only 6,000 years old!I'm curious as to
where the new Gov. got his degree in some sort of earth Science? Perhaps he has
a degree in Climatology? Or at least Meteorology? What? Oh wait; he's a
former President of the Utah Association of Realtors? Ha, that's it! He's our
man on understanding climate change! But the whole global warming
thing is just made up garbage from a bunch of tree hugging hippies. Yea, I'm
sticking with that one.
Science is not determined by polls. Or comment boards. The plural of anecdote is
The best part of this story is that Herbert asks the group to help him
understand the science, but then, when an actual scientist gives a presentation
on how climate change works, Herbert steps out of the room. Classic! Herbert
is obviously a guy who doesn't want to be confused by the facts.
Re @grover: After working in the insurance industry for many years, I also have
the same portfolio of insurance coverage as you with one exception: earthquake
coverage. Geologists (not to be confused with Climatologists) tell us that Utah
has had a major quake every 500 years. It has now been nearly 550 years since
the last big (6 or over)one. My hopefully informed decision is to buy coverage
against what could be a catastrophe. You on the other hand, blithely go without
and if the event occurs will expect the government to come in and rescue you.
Who will be the "socialist" then Pub?
"The debate on global warming is over." That reminds me of the statement in the
late 1800's that "all science has been discovered". I am old enough to remember
that when I was in college it was concluded that the earth was doomed because of
global cooling and that the world was running out of food. All of this was
wrong and proclaimed as fact by "scientist" as fact then. Our present
"scientist" are just as wrong today.Over the years I did enough research
in my graduate and post-graduate education to learn one thing. Many of my peers
were very smart but had no common sense and therefore came to wrong conclusions
and that many of them had an agenda when they did their research. They either
wanted to prove their pet theory, want to fit in with the group/department, or
they had a book or theoretical model to pitch. Needless to say I became a real
skeptic of a lot of research but then again that has helped me in applying what
I learned to my real world job.
I live in Washington State.A friend of mine had the courage to question
global warming in public. It made the national press.The kind, tolerant
people who believe in global warming were calling this man around the clock (and
they had a two week old baby).The Global Warming orthodoxy cannot
tolerate a heretic. The only thing they can do when somebody has the courage to
ask hard questions is name calling and harassment.1. CO2 is a
naturally occouring gas.2. CO2 is essential to life.3. Climate
patterns do not track with CO2 for the long haul.4. As temperatures
increase CO2 is released from the ocean indicating that increased CO2 levels are
an effect, not a cause of higher temperatures.5. Water vapor is the most
significant green house gas. Note how much warmer it is when there is cloud
cover.6. It was much warmer 1000 years ago than it is today during the
mideval warming period. That was a very prosperous period of European
history.Those with the courage to question global warming are
reiducled and harassed.Think for yourself. How could a minor change
in CO2 levels destroy a planet?
Mainstream Utahans have a common sense that is more discerning when it comes to
propaganda from the left. People like yourself are more concerned with labeling
dissenters as "flat earthers" or worse akin to "holocaust deniers". You don't
want to debate the science of Global Warming, in fact you refuse to. You look
at anyone who disagrees with a contempt and disdain calling us "uneducated" and
"refusing to acknowledge evidence". I believe your attitude is arrogant and
prideful. Just listen to the words of our future Governor as he
asks for proof, not saying he has the conclusive answers but acknowledging that
there are respectable scientists on both sides of the argument. Thanks again to
Mr. Herbert, and may more people like him stand up to the prideful and arrogant
people like you.
Even if most all of the world's esteemed scientists were wrong, and you
non-believers found science to fit your preconceived notions of how things
should be, and then you convinced the world that there was some secret
conspiracy headed by Al Gore, dont you still like to breathe clean air? Are not
the annual inversions, the statistically proved shorter life expectancy for Utah
County residents (thanks to the former Geneva Steel mill), and all the other bad
things that come out of living in an inversion enough to make you want to do
something to improve the air quality / environment, or is it more important to
make or save a buck at the expense of the general populations welfare?
It is about time a Gov spoke up on 'global warming'. Just because Al Gore said
the debate is over, it is not. There are many who disagree with Al, it is
another way for government to control our lives and collect more taxes. To 'how
embarrassing', those who have bought the line of Gore and others just have their
head in the sand.
thank you obama for taking huntsman away. now we can have a real governor with a
real backbone again, not some flimsy moderate intent on making their fan base
happy at the rest of the public's expense...
(2Ti 3:7) Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the
truth.The whole GW debate is SO difficult to sort out due to the
fact that there are agendas evident on all sides. It seems impossible to glean
the truth.Also...So many tie pollution up with their perceptions of
GW...These are seperarate but related issues.The repeated remarks
implying that doing something about GW even if it is not real won't hurt
anything, is a silly statement in that whatever we do will require resources and
decision making that will drastically affect how we live. It is akin to me
taking my personal resources (Such as the house payment) and spending it all on
food storage in case of a food shortage. After all what could it hurt? I am with Gary Herbert in that I am unwilling to pull the trigger on
policy and resource allocation for an idea that is still so hotly debated.
adamant proponents of Man-made Global Warming and their solutions sound like
those described by C.S. Lewis who employ fire extinguishers during times of
Actually, scientists in the Middle Ages--or natural philosophers, as they were
known--always knew the world was round. It was the uneducated and superstitious
who believed the earth was flat. Perhaps those who question climate change, and
humans' role in bringing it about, ought to take a page from history and become
educated themselves--that is, read the science for yourselves, not conservative
bloggers and talking heads, before you decide. The truth is pretty persuasive
if you expose yourself to it.
"Fact number one is that Utah is polluted to the point of having some of the
worst air quality in the US. Watch out China, Utah is not content with having
the worst air in America, we want the worst air in the world!"Really? That's not according to what the actual scientists at the Utah
Division of Air Quality and the EPA say. Go to the Division of Air Quality's
website where they write that"Despite these challenges, Utah's air
continues to improve. As noted in the last two previous reports - 2006 and 2007
- in the early 1980s, Utah struggled to meet the health standards for four of
the six criteria pollutants identified by the EPA. By 2006, all Utah counties
attained current federal air quality standards."And then there's the
EPA, who on their "Air Compare" website, list Salt Lake City as having
significantly less air pollution days than Los Angeles and Tuscon, AZ.Fact is, Utah's air is cleaner today than any time in the past 50 years, and
it's getting cleaner.Sorry to confuse you with facts, but I have
noticed lately environmentalists are having a hard time accepting reality.
The climate always changes and always will. I am not sure that man has a lot to
do with it. The question isn't if global warming exists, the question is
does human behavior have much impact? I doubt it.
Oh thank Heaven, for Gary Herbert. Finally, we will get a governor who refuses
to bow down to the "Green-Weenies". (Unlike Huntsman)I applaud our new
governor. He knows what we all have known for too long: There isn't any such
thing as "Man-Made" Global Warming; this is just a fraud invented by the
Rational people everywhere recognize that there is an enormous amount of peer
pressure to agree with warming advocates and that the "overwhelming number of
scientists who agree" with them is the the same argument our children make to us
by saying, "all the kids in the neighborhood have x-boxes."Just
saying the words doesn't make you right. Neither does scoffing at the
I'm sure we all agree that we don't want to breathe pollution, and that we
should be doing what we can to reduce pollution as technology develops. Global
Warming/Climate Change is a new enough issue that we don't know enough about it
to know whether we should even be concerned or not. The thing we do know for
sure is that our seat-of-the-pants "solutions" will costs a lot of money, and
won't change things significantly on a global basis. We must also remember our
government (us) has been using other people's money for a long time. Maybe we
can spend more of our children's money? Maybe our grandchildren's?
You don't set public policy (that will cost us unknown trillions of dollars and
opportunity costs that can't be quantified) based on a theory that MANY
scientists don't even agree with. That would be really stupid.Good
for Gary Herbert.
Most scientist used to believed that the earth was flat, most scientist used to
believe in Dawins theory. Scientist have been wrong on many important issues
throughout history and they are wrong on the issue of global warming as well. If
you put ice into a glass of water, when it melts, does the water level rise or
does it stay the same. Are you smater than a first grader, Al Gore isn't.
"...I'm even happier to get a Governor who reflects the values of mainstream
Utah!"Ahh... "Mainstream Utah Values."What are they?Disdain for education, reason and expert opinion.Willful,
stubborn refusal to pay attention to, or even acknowledge, objective
evidence.Labeling anyone who's opinion you disagree with as
"socialist!"Taking AM radio know-nothing (but proud of it!)blowhards
more seriously than decades of careful research conducted by eminent
scientists.Yep - those are all good ol' "Utah values."
"I am not a scientist - I am a pragmatist. I believe in what I can see, touch
and feel." Good. Then go and Google "UAH global temperature anomaly"
and you'll see that according to satellite measurements the earth's surface
temperature has remained virtually unchanged over the past 20 years, aside from
a spike in 1998.The average surface temperature of the earth today
is almost identical to what it was 20 years go. Despite the fluctuations there
has been no net global warming since then.
Herbert is a realtor and having just completed a new home purchase I can say
with conviction that realators are not scientists! Don't confuse the man with
facts. Fact number one is that Utah is polluted to the point of having some of
the worst air quality in the US. Watch out China, Utah is not content with
having the worst air in America, we want the worst air in the world!
When you aren't sure of something you buy an insurance policy if the cost isn't
prohibitive. Also, how many potential risks out there do you have insurance
for? Personally I have life, health, home and auto insurance. I didn't buy Y2K
insurance when all computers were going to stop working according to the
mainstream press, and I'm not buying the phoney Global Warming insurance which
will just be another step toward total Governmental control by the Socialists.
Wake up and do some research and realize this whole effort is a
Grover, I think Herbert actually was quoted as saying this, "But again I'm going
to be very slow to make radical changes. I'm going to listen, and I'm going to
learn." Beware that liberal fanatical religion does affect your
Thank you for speaking truth in the midst of a horrible effort by the socialist
extremist environmentalists to silence any decent. You earned my vote and my
support by your unapologetic and honest approach. Yahoo, I'm glad for Gov
Huntsman and his new opportunity in China, but I'm even happier to get a
Governor who reflects the values of mainstream Utah!
Yes, there are climate change deniers just as there are those who deny smoking
causes cancer. But does anyone really contend that we are too ignorant to make
policy decisions!? Lt. Governor Herbert confuses lack of unanimity with lack of
consensus. If we wait for 100% agreement we wait forever (to the advantage of
those who profit from the status quo). Are we really debating causation or is
this about who will profit and who will pay?
The science is not conclusive about human caused global warming AND we're not
yet as warm as we were during the time of Lief Erickson. Remember
from history? He's the guy who grew wine grapes in Greenland while the other
Vikings sailed small wooden ships from the Atlantic to the Pacific through clear
water. That's right folks, the polar ice was probably completely melted in the
time of Lucky Leif.Why then, one might ask, do we still have polar
bears? Where did they live while there was no pack ice? The answer of course,
as already noted, is that nature finds a way.When I was in college
the big "crisis" was chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs). They were supposed to deplete
the ozone layer that protects us from deadly solar radiation. So we gave up
certain refrigerants and aerosol propellants. THEN Mt. Pinatubo erupted in the
Phillipines and in a single week put more CFCs into the atmosphere than humans
had in a century. The scientific consensus was wrong. Humans are like dust on
the planet.How arrogant we are to believe that the planet even
notices us on geological time scales.
Anyone who has ever been to the Wasatch Front should agree on global pollution
or global warming, whatever you want to call it. I personally believe that
global warming has been over hyped but lets clean the earth up! How anyone
living in Utah or SL counties dares take a breath is beyond me. Sorry but it is
no FAIRY TALE that Utah is becoming a polluted state, plus our right wing
friends want to bring in nuclear waste from other states and countries to
contribute to our ever growing waste dump of a state. The reason people want to
come to Utah is for the natural beauty, I doubt that will be the case when we
are know for nuclear waste dumps and the only state with more pollution than LA.
Wise up Utah!
No one cares what a former Utah county politician thinks about global
warming...er I mean "climate change" (to use GOP code). People do care however
what the governor of our State thinks. Most decisions that face adults are not
of the black and white variety but requiring weighing the pros and cons and
making an informed decision. Herbert owes it to Utahns to study the issue and
hear from the best minds on both sides of the issue. As one of the "not totally
convinced" attendees put it, "when I am not sure of something, I buy an
insurance policy just in case."
Thank goodness someone has the guts to raise a voice against the political winds
trying to force man-made global warming policies down our throats. Being a
mechanical engineer, I've studied the greenhouse gas issue. As I've considered
the Second Law of Thermodynamics and heat transfer mechanisms in this debate,
they are in disagreement with the theory of have man-made global warming due to
carbon dioxide or other so-called Green House gasses. Let there be a scientific
debate on the issue!!! As it stands, politicians have nothing to lose if they
support the erroneous theory because if it turns out to be false, they can
simply blame the scientists.Yea to Governor Herbert!
Key points that 700 international scientists argree and say about global
warming.1) The Earth is currently well within natural climate variability.
2) Almost all climate fear is generated by unproven computer model
predictions. 3) An abundance of peer-reviewed studies continue to debunk
rising CO2 fears and, 4) "Consensus" has been manufactured for political,
not scientific purposes.Taken from the U.S Senate Minority report,
last update March 16, 2009
Consenus not!I am a skepticGlobal warming has become a new religion. -
Nobel Prize Winner forPhysics, Ivar Giaever.Warming fears are the
worst scientific scandal in the historyWhen people come toknow what the
truth is, they will feel deceived by science and scientists. - UN IPCCJapanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental
physicalchemist.Anyone who claims that the debate is over and the
conclusions are firm has afundamentally unscientific approach to one of
the most momentous issues of our time.- Solar physicist Dr. Pal Brekke,
senior advisor to the Norwegian Space Centre in Oslo.Brekke has published
more than 40 peer-reviewed scientific articles on the sun and solarinteraction with the Earth.Many [scientists] are now searching
for a way to back out quietly (from promotingwarming fears), without
having their professional careers ruined. - Atmosphericphysicist James A.
Peden, formerly of the Space Research and Coordination Center inPittsburgh.
At least he's asking the question.To the naysayers, this is a
version of Pascal's wager. If we take precautions and it's not true then we've
done no harm and have reduced our dependence on foreign oil. We've also saved
ourselves lots of money.If it is true well they're your children,
which you claim to care so much about. They will have a much harder life than
you have.The earth will survive, we may not.$4 gas is
coming in any case. Have you watched the prices lately?
Co2 levels have increased, that is correct, but the reality is that the air in
the US is actually cleaner. Harmful emissions like SO2 (causes acid rain)and
NOX (causes smog & ozone)that actually have an impact on public health are the
lowest they have been in 40 years. Check EPA website for facts on SO2, NOX etc.
Pretty cool stuff.
Thank you Gary! There a few who are willing to stand up for what is right!Climate change is nothing more than an avenue to 1) create global and
domestic taxes, 2) Give more power to the UN, and 3) push us needlessly to
political and social globalism.Even if there were climate change, do
you think our politicians have power to control it? If you think the answer is
for government to mandate we all drive electric cars and tax large wide screen
TVs, there is not much hope for you!
Herbert is right to question the evidence concerning global warming. Quite often
the "evidence" to support global warming is skewed to retain research grants...
which have been sizable and abundant in recent years.
Utahns are making being willfully ignorant into a virtue.
It looks like we are going to have an adult in charge of the state again.Have you ever noticed that elitest liberals are "open-minded" unless you
disagree with them.The fact is that there is no proof that man-made
global warming exists. Even the proponents admit that. So liberals keep up the
name-calling all you want it isn't going to change my mind.
Yeehaw! Looks like Utah gets to revert to the stone age again. Unfortunately,
whether you believe in global warming/climate change or not, this type of
thinking is not helpful. It doesn't take a scientist to visibly observe how
much junk we're spewing into the atmosphere, our water bodies and landfills.
Regardless of whether you're convinced, Herbert, take a stand that the status
quo is simply not good enough! If we're going do double in size over the next
few decades, we can't keep acting in the current manner. Twice the population
equals more than double the problems. Our water resources are already stretched
almost to the limit. Our air quality is horrible. New clean water isn't going
to appear out of thin air. The air we breathe isn't going to miraculously shed
itself of all the particulates we're pumping into it. If you're going to ride
the growth train, then you've simply got to learn to do more with less,
regardless of whether you buy the climate change argument (and I do, having
spent the time to study it and earn a related professional degree).
there is no excuse for Lt. Gov. Herbert to not have studied up on this issue.
It is his duty to seek out the scientific understanding of the issue. He has
staff. He can be briefed. He can sit down with the Governor's staff. He can
call upon the state's scientists. He can type in climate change on a Google
search. But for him to come to the Governor's Association Meetings as a blank
page and say "I don't know anything about this and I'm inclined to think its
baloney because a bunch of my rural friends (ranchers, farmers, etc.) feel
threatened by it" is inexcusable. He will have a very hard time being
re=elected in 2010 if he presents himself this way. Note to Herbert, get smart
on big issues like this, and get smart fast. 80% of the folks voting for you
are along the Wasatch Front. You won't win by just getting votes from Kane
From the state with some of the worst air quality in the country, it is no
surprise that another politician refuses to take responsibility for our actions
and values money more than human beings.Your children will
appreciate the selfishness and Utah's inability to lead when it comes to caring
for the planet.
Courage to be stupid.
We just barely got done weeding the White House of one shrub, looks like were
about to get another in the Utah Capitol. I can't believe Huntsman would have
chosen someone as his lieutenant governor who is this ignorant (of the issues,
but ignorant as well). This will be like the dark ages that we just barely got
over with when Obama took over.The only hope is we can get another decent person
to run against Herbert in the next election.
Hooray for Gary. His courage is commendable.
99% of the scientists huh?I would say it might be closer to %50Just
like with everything, for every one scientist that is sure of global warming you
will find one who is against it.
AMEN! How so many have fallen prey to this fairy tail is beyond me! Way to go,
Herbert, like the rest of the naysayers, see what is their immediate vicinity
and deny the big picture. Kind of like those who thought the sun orbited the
earth. Guys like this will continue Utah's slide into obscurity. Even if
clilmate change is not a reality, what's wrong with being good stewards of the
environment, and not pillaging the planet? Sees like a truly "conservative"
principle, if you ask me. "Guts" does not equal brains.
Typical Utahns think their govern has all the knowledge to make the decisions
for them. Look outside of your small world and research and get your own
opinion instead of one mans based on his political agenda
I was about to turn on my furnace this morning (16June2009,Tue), but my 4th
grader urged me not to as it will help with global warming if I didn't.Seems those youngsters are getting a mighty fine education.
I was watching a science show on the tv and the take away for me was that
through out all of history, the worlds climate has always changed, from cold to
hot, from hot to cold.As a matter of fact, in the times of the
dinasaurs, CO2 was in much greater concentration in the atmosphere than it is
today, it was hotter then too.People panicing reminds me of the
chicken in the barn yard, telling all the other anamials that the sky is
falling.Truth be told, in times past, its been hotter than now, its
been colder than now, there has been more carbon dioxide than now, and at other
times there has been less carbon dioxide than now. And guess what? Life has
thrived through it all.
They don't call it global warming anymore. It's called climate change.
re shecky | 11:12 p.m. June 15, 2009 It takes a man of real courage with
little or no scientific background to disagree with about 99% of actual
scientists who do this every day for a living.____________________________If 99% of scientists disagree with.... ACTUAL REALITY ....who are you going to go with? This
has been the coolest summer I can ever remember.When I was in
elementary school in the 1960's we were told 1) that scientists had
determined we were headed for another ice age.2) that the world had
a 20 year supply of oil left.Seems to me the 99% of scientists out
there have a thing or two yet to learn.That is the take of this
"uneducated" so called hick.
"Climate Change" is a Gold Rush for scientists who wish to live off the public
dime. There is no evidence that the emission of "Greenhouse Gases" could cause
the climate to become warmer. In fact the opposite is true.In 1880
Krakatoa exploded in Indonesia and emitted more CO2 than man has produced in all
of his existance to that time and for hundreds of years to come. The Result? The
following year there was a very cloudy,cold summer CAUSED BY THE DENSE CLOUD
COVER! So the reality is that climate change by man is utter stupidity and will
be used to curtail our freedom, increase umemployment, increase government size,
and help the Obama destruction team further cripple America. Please help stop
these idiots. What they think and do can't stop Global Warming, but it can ruin
the future of you and your family!
Global Warming, Evolution, and Abortion are all topics where it's easy to turn
off the brain, start up the ideology and quit thinking.
If we get much more "global warming", we may have to use our furnaces all summer
long. In all my life I don't remember a summer as cool as this.
Herbert, were you channelling Energy Solutions, Buttars and Ruzicka while you
embarrassed the state of Utah in front of real governors?The sign of
things to come, is the obvious dumbing-down of Utah after four years of a
Utah is a major exporter of power to California. Schwarzenegger signed the
Global Warming Solutions Act of 2006 that required the state to no longer
purchase coal-fired power from Utah. The IPP3 plant in Delta was postponed
indefinitely because southern California refused to buy into the project, and
instead, purchased wind power development near Milford, Utah. All the wind
developed there (two phases of about 400 MW) is going to southern California,
though there are three more phases of the project that are still not committed
yet -- perhaps Utah might buy some of its own wind in the future.The
bottom line is that there are economic and political forces well beyond
Herbert's control that drive Utah's energy market -- from cap and trade to
export markets that won't buy Utah's coal-fired electricity. The practical
reality is that cleaner energy addresses climate change, keeps Utah exporting
for economic development (wind will bring millions of California dollars in
development to the town of Milford and Beaver County), cleans Utah's air (think
the smog in National parks to the Wasatch Front), and prevents mercury and other
pollutants in our fisheries and waterways (good for hunting/fishing).
The best thing Huntsman did was to agree to go to China, so we could have a
governor who is not auditioning for national office. Herbert will not become
another governor moonbeam, like Huntsman was trying to do. It's time for someone
to stand up to the pet political projects of Al Gore.
Congratulations, Gary Herbert! Huntsman's departure cannot come soon enough.
Looking forward to the new direction for the state under your direction.
Math is not always science (and science is not always empirical). A lot of math
these days, especially when it comes to the environment and the economy, is
based on mathematical models. Such models give the illusion of objective science
to any idea the model builder wants to encode in mathematical language. There
are so many untested assumptions underlying mathematical "models" as to render
most of them useless.
NOT POLITICALLY CORRECT but refreshing to hear a man like our future Governor
with conviction and courage speak up against the crowd who blindly follow junk
What you might not know is that there are pictures from the 1950's of even
smaller glaciers, yet no catastrophic flooding. Go figure.
Consensus is NOT scientific fact. Also, there are literally tens of thousands
of scientists who are NOT convinced by the man-made global warming theory.
Also, those who assume it is just "science" do not understand how political
correctness and personal self-interested agendas can affect even "science." When it comes to "true" science the debate should NEVER be over. Only
those who are afraid to debate say the debate is over. When the models that
predict global-warming disaster are applied to historic fact, they don't
accurately predict what has actually happened. They have clearly been proved to
be invalid.We should NEVER be so quick to accept "science" when
there are personal and political agendas involved.
Nearly every newspaper in America believes that climate change is man-made. Who
are we to disagree with the experts?
Just do a little research and you will soon find MANY that disagree with the
politically-charged GW debate. Some stories include loss of funding, chair
positions, tenure, blackballing if you even DARE to speak out against GW.GW is a farce. I just can't wait till UT science core catches up so I
can stop teaching kids two versions of environmental science: the GW/Al
Gore/liberal/politicized/govt. controls your life version and the truth.
I would have to say that Obama is the best thing that has happened to Utah in
quite a while. Finally a governor who can look at something with common sense
and who reflects Utah's values. I am thrilled Prince John will be establishing
his kingdom in a socialist society where he'll feel quite at home.
Any Utah citizen who does not believe in global climate change obviously has not
been in Utah in the month of June. We have almost gotten more rain then we are
expected to get for the entire summer in less then a month. Maybe this is not
directly caused by global warming but still seems a little odd to me, maybe next
year it wont rain at all
If global warming has been occuring for the past several years,the sea levels
should be rising already. New York City should already be under water as the
"scientists" predicted. Is this happening?
The entire WORLD is in agreement on climate change, even GWB acknowledged its
existence. Now we have an ignorant political hack making Utah look like a
redneck backwater of ignorance. Just what we deserve; Utah is the
center of the universe when it comes to conspiracy nuts, misinformation, Ponzi
schemes, and right-wing fear mongers.Gov. Herbert, you need to back
up your statements with facts before you open your ignorant yap.
What a bleeding nitwit."Help me understand the science." ???God save us from these ignorant morons.Every scientific academy
and society in every developed nation is in agreement. The evidence is
mountainous. The models work forwards and backwards. The best and brightest
minds are all saying the same thing. When, WHEN will idiots like this stop with
this "I'm not convinced" game? We don't have time to coddle these fools.
Perhaps it finally time to have a educational tune-up for the readers and
speakers who throw out opinions without the slightest notion of the meaning of
the words that they use.But I am sure that the same people who
discount science will argue that their interpretation of the words are also
acurate, as they seem to not care about history, arithmatic, or any medium of
acurate communication of thought, much less the integration of facts, thought,
and wisodom.For 40 years now we have a radical right wing, ignoring all of
the efforts of the educational and scientific feilds to make it possible for the
USA to have aided in the winning of WWII, that allowed us to then go forward, as
an educated country, leading in all aspects of society.Today we
cannot even field a competitve Math team internationally.Sciece is
not an omnipotent entity like some people want to believe in. It is science, it
is in therory, if you have educated your society to be open minded, constanly
checking it's own self. We then need not waste time in arguing, we merely look
at truth. It is what it is, no denieing it.
It takes a man of real courage with little or no scientific background to
disagree with about 99% of actual scientists who do this every day for a living.
Hopefully the next Governor of Utah will just allow the federal government and
the scientists to protect our global environment as there are larger climatic
and economic issues at stake. The huge consensus of world scientific opinion
has determined the urgent need to begin addressing climate change by whatever
means necessary to our next generation's survival. How long did it take people
to accept the earth was not the center of the universe and actually circled the
sun, that the world was round not flat, that evolution from apes was a
scientific fact, and that now humans contribute to global warming. When the
small minority of people willing to risk our future survival based on conspiracy
theories, it becomes the very narrow undemocratic and rigid, narrow road that
autocratic, dictatorships have also taken.
What a gutsy move on Herbert's part! This is awesome. Herbert is going to be
awesome. He has a way of speaking his mind but at the same time bringing all
sides to the table for good healthy discussion. I am really excited to see what
he does as our governor.
The debate IS over among the "politically correct" elite who think their opinion
is the only one that matters. The debate is NOT over at the grassroots level,
nor even among the scientific community. There are many excellent scientists
who have no pre-determined political agenda, but who remain sceptical of the
climate change findings that have been reported thus far.
I am not a scientist - I am a pragmatist. I believe in what I can see, touch
and feel. Go to Google and search images of "shrinking glaciers". That is
something that can be seen and measured. Melted ice means more water in the
oceans. More water in the oceans means higher sea levels. Higher sea levels
means massive destruction and flooding. Go and learn, explore, decide for
yourselves and quit letting politicians tell you what is "truth" and "fact".
Here's some science that is not politically inspired: In geological time, the
amount of CO2 in our presently is almost at an all-time low. Millions of years
ago when the earth had the greatest amount of plant cover it also had the most
CO2 in the atmosphere. Why, because plants grow better in a CO2 enriched
environment. The more CO2, the more food production for our hungry planet. We
will also have much more oxygen since a product of photosynthesis is oxygen.
We'll all be healthier with more CO2. If you still remain unconvinced that CO2
is the enemy and you actually believe the global warming hypothesis and think we
should sequester CO2, then grow more trees. Tons and tons of carbon is locked
up in trees on our planet. CO2 is not the enemy, it is vitally important for
the survival of life on our planet. It's a good thing that the amount of CO2 in
the atmosphere is increasing.
No the worst that could happen is trillions of dollars of wasted resources that
could have been used to cure cancer or AIDS, provide healthcare for the
uninsured, end hunger in our lifetime, etc.
Getting pretty sick of the left vs. right rhetoric. How is this a political
issue? Can we stop listening to spin from the left and right and just use our
own minds for a while? Yes, there is enough science to support climate change,
and yes, there is enough science to suggest some serious consequences--so, duh,
we stop looking for a conspiracies and do something about it. If the vast
majority of scientists in the world are wrong, what's the worst that could
happen? Cleaner air & water?
When someone declares the debate over, you can be assured they are speaking
dogma, not science.
A governor who thinks like the vast majority of his constituents!!!I
hope these meetings were not taxpayer funded. I'd feel a lot better
about western states governors assembling to discuss bigfoot and UFOs because at
least congress isn't trying to pass crippling legislation (cap n' trade) to stop
Hooey is rigtht! It's just another way the left can push their agenda on the
regular folks! Fight back on this nonsense, America! Chicago has had the
coldest June on record! It snows in places this year that have not ever
received snow begore. The intermountain west has seen one of its coldest and
wettest springs on record.Besides a true trend in warming must be
considered over thousands of years, not just a decade or two. Need I say more!
It's good to see that Herbert has an open mind, willing to analyze and evaluate
the science rather than jumping on the political climate change bandwagon.
An ultra conservative shills for mining, film at 11.
Hooray for Herbert! He understand science doesn't operate by consensus - only
politics does. Anthropogenic global warming is a theory based on highly
speculative climate models. They're nothing more than mega-million dollar
computer games.Just what is it that possesses so many gullible
people to believe these models that predict that a modest increase in the
concentrations of a trace gas in our atmosphere (CO2) can overwhelm the sun, the
oceans and the clouds that create weather on our planet? And why is it most of
those who believe have a "D" behind their name? How convenient that regulating
CO2 would give liberals control over energy policy and the lives of every
American. Nature constantly seeks equilibrium - that's why we have
weather - and human carbon dioxide emissions are nothing but a blip on nature's
radar. The Lt. Gov. is not only right to question the "consensus," he's right
that humans have a minimal impact on our climate.
Why did Huntsman have to leave and stick us with a man who is more interested in
looking for the few scientists to confirm his own point of view, rather than
look at what the vast majority of scientists are saying. This is the typical
know-it-all Republican politician whose credentials far outweighs the real
experts in the field whether it be scientists, health care workers, or school
teachers. If they are not careful, they might even start challenging God's
Gary Herbert is a great man and will be a great governor. We may not
agree with each other re: CO2 cap/trade, taxes, or our effects on climate.We need clean energy, clean air, clean water, clean land and energy
independence. We also need to encourage energy efficiency and technologies such
as ground source heat pumps.We do need more renewable energy. Coal
is reportedly being removed fast enough in Utah that it could last only 15 to 45
years for use in Utah at current rates.We will need more electricity
to offset a reduction in the use of foreign oil, and we can't afford to just
rely on coal.Do we have existing dams that we could add hydro power
to, without putting more land underwater, hurting our rivers and/or wildlife?It has been pointed out that renewable energy will help the state's
economy in places that coal, or gas won't. Renewable energy being added to the
mix will increase the life of the Utah coal economy.Having goals to
rely on renewable energy and energy savings to make up the increased demand on
power is good.
At least he doesn't fall for the belief that the debate is over. There are too
many well informed, well educated men with conscience who believe that the
debate is NOT over. Climate change is all about money, just follow Al Gore's
trail. Congratulations Governor Herbert for your common sense, courage,and
insight not to just follow the heard on this nonsense. What a nice change and a
real breath of fresh air
Finally, a politician that is interested in looking at peer reviewed scientific
studies and facts instead of pseudo science contrived to benefit political
agendas. The debate over "climate change" is indeed NOT over.
This is the dumbest debate since Darwinism. Global Warming is nothing more than
a political scare tactic. NASA has already studied the problem and they've
concluded that the Sun warms the Earth NOT people. That's just common sense! I
remember learning that in grade school about 30 years ago. Al Gore is a moron
and so are all the people who believe his quackery.
The earth gets cooler and warmer. IF you figure that WE are causing most of it,
you have to take into account things most people don't.0. The solar
wind is at a 50 years low, which could cause global cooling.1. The rain
forests are critical. Burning and clearing rain forests are a bigger deal re:
greenhouse gases than cars. Remember the Harrison Ford ad with the tape on his
chest being ripped off?2. You have to take into account that Methane Gas,
(not burned) released in to the air is much worse than burning it. Methane gas
is worse than CO2 re: "greenhouse" gases.3. You have to take into account
that methane released into the atmosphere often comes from several non-man
sources: Wetlands, cows belching, termites, permafrost, etc.Most of
us are willing to agree with cleaner air, water and land, that said, I am not
worried about the CO2. I am worried about the cow belching and termites. :)
So science is now something politicians vote on?
Obviously the Montana Governor has never been to Europe for him to state the
debate is over with in that region of the world.Climate Change as
outlined by the UN and Al Gore has many 'top CLIMATE Scientists' disagreeing.
Their names were put on that findings without their consent. They know that
through the studying of climate records that we are actually much cooler than we
have been just in recent human history. We are coming out of a
period known as "The Little Ice Age". Of course it seems hot to some. But during
the times of Christ for several hundred years, it was significantly hotter than
it is now.Climate is directly tied to the sun, not Co2, in fact Co2
cools the earth. There is a reason why you can only see a couple of man made
objects from space, because despite what our arrogant nature tells us, Human's
have far less impact that we would like to think.
And he is going to be the next Governor? Heaven help us all!!