Deseret News | What C.S. Lewis thought about Mormons

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What C.S. Lewis thought about Mormons

ramper | 5:29 a.m. June 5, 2009

C. S. Lewis, Mark Twain, Arthur Conan Doyle, and Zane Grey all seemed to find a way to dig on the church. Can anyone think of big name novelists that gave us a break?

Anonymous | 6:59 a.m. June 5, 2009

The Mormon-C.S.Lewis obsession is ridiculous. It assumes that no one else in the world ono a large scale shares values similar to the LDS culture, and because there are some shared values with Lewis, LDS folks claim a special connection. The reality is that the wider world, outside LDS culture, does in fact share values. LDS folks are not as unique as they like to think. This is not to denigrate the LDS culture, just to point out the strengths of the rest of humanity. For example, my closest friend is Jewish, and is more of a "Christian" than most of my fellow Utah Mormons.

Ryan | 7:28 a.m. June 5, 2009

"The Screwtape Letters" was one of the few non-scriptural books approved for us by my mission President. An excellent read.

Comments continue below

MiP | 7:32 a.m. June 5, 2009

C.S. Lewis is overrated.

There I said it.

Re: Anonymous | 7:35 a.m. June 5, 2009

Hey Anonymous,

Your thoughts are deep, you really understand the LDS culture. So nice of you to anonymously put us all in our places and show us what the world is really like. Because, you know for sure that NONE of us has ever left Utah or met anyone not of our faith.

Your the best man! Write a book and get a following and by all means, keep the hate mail coming, nothing shows Christians how wrong they are like posting it on a public forum anonymously.

Thanks for the shots of reality man! I guess when I read books about CS Lewis I shouldn't try to draw similarities... You are SO right on this one!! Good thing for us you have nothing better to do than read these articles and post your negative anonymous thoughts.

JLFuller | 7:36 a.m. June 5, 2009

It goes with the territory.

to ramper | 7:41 a.m. June 5, 2009

Tolstoy liked us. I recall reading about it in 'A Marvelous Work and a Wonder' by Legrand Richards,

AZ Newser | 7:54 a.m. June 5, 2009

I love CS Lewis. He probably didn't like Mormons as evidenced in "The Magician's Nephew" when he mocks the neighbors who don't drink coffee and wear funny underclothing. Clearly though, he had an enlightened mind.

Stephen | 8:58 a.m. June 5, 2009

saw Jesus standing on the right hand of God ,Acts 7.
CS Lewis "I allow,indeed I insist, that Christ cannot be "the right hand of God" except in a metaphorical sense. I allow and insist that the External Word,the Second Person of the Trinity,can never be,nor have been,confined to any place at all: it is rather Him that all places exist.
CS Lewis MIRACLES,353

fly_on_the_wall | 9:14 a.m. June 5, 2009

I don't if its just my narrow view but it seems to me that the recent Prophets have quoted CS Lewis quite often. Which makes me wonder why the Bishop of our ward cringes when someone references Star Wars or Lord of the Rings in sacrament meeting.

Don't lose it now | 9:14 a.m. June 5, 2009

Well, old RAMPER, some of us just plainly don't like some of you Mormons. Some of you guys and gods out there have a perfect way of driving others FAR, FAR, AWAY with your sassy, grumpy, pompous, holier than thou attitudes. Otherwise though try and be happy and have a spiffy spectacular day with goodness all around you. Put a "genuine" smile on your faces.

I like CS Lewis. He had away with words.

Creation | 9:22 a.m. June 5, 2009

Joseph Smith taught matter is eternal,and has not been,nor can be created. CS Lewis on Creation"I take it to mean'to cause to be, without pre-existing material,to cause both the form and matter of someting pre-conceived in the causer's thought which after creation,is other than the cause." Hooper ,The collected letters..870

John Z | 9:25 a.m. June 5, 2009

Although not a novelist, Karl Marx refers to Mormons and the Book of Mormon in a couple of his letters. Not in a negative way, but just as an object of certain points he was trying to make. Intersting.

Lewis on the devil | 9:34 a.m. June 5, 2009

"How like a god'is a man, until he makes the fatal false step of claiming divinity and goes plumb down to devil-hood."
CS Lewis REFLECTION on the PSALMS,12.

Naruto | 9:52 a.m. June 5, 2009

Lets not foget that C.S. Lewis and Tolkien were close friends and would meet every week to share ideas for there books. While Lewis' books are definitely an allegory Tolkien refused to admit that his were.

Jud | 9:59 a.m. June 5, 2009

Ernest Hemingway once said that if he had it to do over again, he'd be a Mormon. Quoted in A. E. Hotchner's biography of Hemingway.

Mormon Scholar | 10:06 a.m. June 5, 2009

Robert Millet in his writings "So far as I can tell,however,Lewis did not believe that men and women are punishd for what Adam and Eve did or that we individually "sinned in Adam'as the church fathers declared. selected writings of Robert Millet,2000. 476
CS Lewis "The man who can dismiss "sinned in Adam" as an'idiom"and identify virtue with herd instinct is no use to me,despite his very great learning."
Hooper,The collected letters...,450

ZT | 10:13 a.m. June 5, 2009

Ramper: Ever heard of Dickens? He followed a group of emigrants to "expose" them as crazies. He came away impressed, calling them "the flower of England."

Belgie | 10:41 a.m. June 5, 2009

To "Don't lose it now" - Who you calling "sassy, grumpy, pompous, holier than thou"? LOL!! Maybe you should take a look in the mirror.

observing | 11:19 a.m. June 5, 2009

It is possible to find good in many things, but it is also possible to become lost in something that appears good and, at its root, is not. C.S. Lewis wrote a lot of good books. He was not a prophet. A lot of LDS people need to remember what the "most perfect book" is.

hbeckett | 11:28 a.m. June 5, 2009

I take some of C.S. Lewis material and look for the good that it brings to me. There are many ways to look at our lives and what we do to improve them. The Savior Jesus Christ taught in parables using stories to promote thought and ways to look on the inner man that we could become better than we are. I would like to think that C.S. Lewis accomplished what he intended to do with his stories.

RE: creation | 11:38 a.m. June 5, 2009

In a response to polytheism,CS Lewis said"In polytheism the gods are usually the product of a universe already in existence", sounds like he is talking about Mormonism.
The Grand Miracle...pg 105

Anonymous | 1:47 p.m. June 5, 2009

Lewis believed we all individually "sinned in Adam"? What a shame. He still has a lot of great thoughts, though. Best to keep an open mind.

ramper | 3:54 p.m. June 5, 2009

Tolstoy, Dickens, and Hemingway giving favorable comments about Mormons? Now we have some heavyweights. Book them!

RE : Anonymous | 3:59 p.m. June 5, 2009

The Bible and the Joseph Smith translation both teach "sinned in Adam" Romans 5:12-24 KJV/JST
On the chapter 5 commentary/summary of JST: "Christ died for us,by whom we are reconciled to God-As sin and death came by Adam,so righteous and life by Jesus Christ."

T | 4:05 p.m. June 5, 2009

C.S. Lewis has many writings, many attempt an appeal to a general christian audience, with out trying to convince the reader of a particular sect. Of the writings, parts agree and others parts disagree with LDS theology. My fascination with Lewis comes not so much from WHAT he said, but HOW he said it. C.S. Lewis had a way of looking at human nature through a Christian lens that clarified topics and enlightened the mind with simple, yet beautiful words. Not all that he writes agrees with what I believe, but on the things in which we do agree, nobody say it quite like he does.

To 3:59 p.m. | 4:14 p.m. June 5, 2009

If you take that JST passage to mean the same thing as claiming that we have all "sinned in Adam," I think you ignore the LDS view of the issue. Mormon doctrine says that through the sin of Adam, the human race became fallen, meaning that we are mortal and that we have a natural tendency to sin. But Mormon doctrine rejects the idea that we are individually held responsible for Adam's transgression--only that because of the Fall, we have a disposition to commit sins, and once we do, we're guilty of them until we repent.

njpray | 4:49 p.m. June 5, 2009

I always knew "Mormons" were interesting to those who follow our every move. If anon....posts long enough, maybe he'll join with us. Ok, so it will be a cold day in hades......at least maybe this will gives him a smile.

Truth | 5:16 p.m. June 5, 2009

In the matter of Christs incarnation; CS Lewis "The Christian is not claiming that simply "God was incarnate in Jesus. They are claiming that the one true God is He whom the Jews worshipped as Jehweh,{YHWH-Jehovah}and that it is He who has descended."
CS Lewis MIRACLES,312

Florida fan of C.S. Lewis | 6:10 p.m. June 5, 2009

D&C 109:7 reads "seek ye out of the best books words of wisdom."

I have read a few books by C.S. Lewis and have felt an appreciation for his capacity for logic. Though I do not agree with all of his statements and thoughts, I find that he is able to put thoughts into words that I have difficulty forming myself.

I don't have to agree with all of his theology to enjoy his writings. Especially in my reading of "Mere Christianity" I found greater understanding of my fellow Christian friends' beliefs, which gave place to some nice conversations.

Burppie | 6:20 p.m. June 5, 2009

Lets all mind our P's and Q's on here.

RE: 4:14 ,sinned in Adam | 6:28 p.m. June 5, 2009

The Bible,The Church fathers,CS Lewis and Joseph Smith (JST) clearly teach,"Orignal sin,"we inherit sin like we inherit other things from our parents(DNA),but If you want to beleive Mormon doctrine,that is what Mormons do, I am sure you are sincere but sincerly wrong.

Re:Truth | 6:36 p.m. June 5, 2009

The LDS teachings are explicit that Jesus Christ was the Jehovah (or Jehweh)of the Old Testament. C.S. Lewis doesn't disagree with this point.

C.S. Lewis believed and wrote many things that disagree with what the LDS apostles, prophets and scriptures teach. This is to be expected when the two parties have differing views of Christianity as a whole.

Yet there are a great number of things that the two DO agree on. Lewis is popular with the LDS membership because of these similarities. He was exceptionally gifted as a writer and beautifully, simply, and eloquently expounded on many common beliefs.

Contrary to what they are often accused of, the LDS church openly accepts truths from where ever they may stem from. So if some of these truths are elegantly expressed by C.S. Lewis the LDS church embraces them.

Anglicans | 6:38 p.m. June 5, 2009

FTW! Did Lewis even know what mormonism was?

Original Sin? | 7:06 p.m. June 5, 2009

Any and all who want to claim that Joseph Smith taught original sin based off of a few lines in his translation of the bible ought to think again.

In doing a translation of the bible he naturally started at the beginning with Genesis. Much of what he wrote here has been placed in The Pearl of Great Price under the title of the book of Moses. In chapter 6 it explicitly says that Christ atoned for the "original guilt" of Adam and thus his children and childrens children would not be condemned for his actions.

As this translation was one of the very first of Smith's writings on the bible we can see that very early in his ministry he taught explicitly against what standard Christianity accepts as the concept of original sin.

He also wrote "We believe that man will be punished for thier own sins and NOT for Adam's transgression."

His writings (even the JST of the bible) are consistant with all this

more Truth | 8:06 p.m. June 5, 2009

The LDS cleraly teach Jesus is Jehovah(YHWH).
In the Apostles Bible(septuagint)Theos(God)translates,with few exception,the Hebrew words Elohim and Jehovah,the former his power and preeminence,the latter His unoriginated,immutable,eternal and self-sustained existence. The God of Israel is Jehovah God.
simply put Christians beleive Elohim is Jehovah.

Snake eyes | 8:49 p.m. June 5, 2009

To- Ramper, Belgie and Burpie,

You 3 need a head shrink. Practice what you preach folks. Maybe reading a little Lewis might help.

RE: Original sin | 8:56 p.m. June 5, 2009

What caused the fall of Adam? "The moment you have a self at all,there is the possibility of puting yourself first--wanting to be the centre--wanting to be God,in fact. That was the sin of Satan: and that was the sin he taught the human race.
CS Lewis The case for Christianity.

The metaphysical necessity of the fall.,more on that later

Anonymous | 9:06 p.m. June 5, 2009

You people are embrarrassing. Please stop if you don't know what you are talking about.

Jo Anne | 9:50 p.m. June 5, 2009

What a SILLY group of people...LOL LOL!

Truth is.... | 10:26 p.m. June 5, 2009

Yes the terms "Elohim" and "Jehovah" in the Old Testament are often interpreted by Christians as being the same being - Christ. This is due to the fact that the second to the seventh centuries abounded in theological disputes over the nature of God and Christ. Hardly any church leader agreed with one another on who/what Christ actually was. Comprimises were made that eventually led in process of time to the standard acceptance of the trinity - based more on philosophical rhetoric than anything.

When the books of Moses were originally written (generally accepted to have been done by Moses himself over 4000 years ago but scholars date the oldest known surviving manuscripts to a couple hundred years before Christ) the Hebrews believed Elohim and Jehovah to be completely separate beings. In fact, they acknowledged the existance of a variety of "lesser" such as Ashterah (the wife of God)and even an evil brother of Jehovah (similar to the role Satan plays in Christian ideology) that was actually worshiped in the Old Testament named Baal

The Apostles bible renders a translation that was never intended by the original author

An Observer | 11:00 p.m. June 5, 2009

IT's so funny!

The anti-mormons think they are so clever, always thinking they have found a point on which to expose mormonism,

it turns out they are always wrong,

with bad understanding,
with bad translations,
incorrect history,
things takebn totally out context,
and so forth.

The fact is C.S. Lewis in his ponderings tripped over the truth many times,

and Mormons are simply open-minded enough to see that,

and with his talent for writing, that make him imminently quotable,

regardless of his person feelings for mormons, which may have been born out ignorance.

RE: Truth is | 12:06 a.m. June 6, 2009

1. "The Apostles Bible renders a translation that was never intended by the original author? The Apostles Bible is a nickname for the Greek Septuagint,translated by 70 Hellenistic Jewish scholars,250 years B.C..The reason it's called the Apostles Bible,because the writers of the N.T. quote from it,including Jesus,the Lord himself must be comfortable with the translation of the Hebrew texts.
2. Hebrews considerd Elohim and Jehovah as separate
persons,not true read Exodus 3:13-15 ..'Elohim(God)said to Moses,"I am who I am" And he said"say this to the people of Israel,"YHWH,(Jehovah)the Elohim (God)of your fathers,.... I suggest you might get a modern translation.
3.Second through the seventh centuries abound with theological error,we have still have that problem today,but early church councils well prior to the seventh century issue were resolved with Christian creeds to end heritcal teachings(aryanism)to name one. The creeds are the basic teachings of all Christian churches;Roman Catholic and protestant churhes.

ramper | 8:57 a.m. June 6, 2009

Re: Snake Eyes

O.K. I'll set up an appointment tomorrow and stop at the library on the way back.

Re: RE: Truth is | 5:43 p.m. June 6, 2009

1&2: Theology of the Hellenistic Judaism in the 3rd century BC was already far removed from that of the tribes of Isreal some 1000 and 2000 years before them. These centuries saw a massive cultural/theological shift from polytheism to monotheism. This can all be checked in any number of texts written by religious historians and scholars. When the Spetuagint was written the society was monotheistic and therefore any god mentioned in their sacred writings had to be one and the same. However, if we accept that Exodus was written several centuries before this it would be placed into a culture that viewed El and YHWH as separate gods. So I will repeat "The Apostles Bible renders a translation that was never intended by the original author."
3: The creeds which you discuss are the very products of compromise. There were huge disputes over the nature of of God and Christ during the early years of Christianity and these creeds were produced to settle the matter. It was rhetoric and logic that determined their outcome, not inspiration and revelation.

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