Deseret News | Who was the MWC kidding?

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Dick Harmon: Who was the MWC kidding?

Reality | 12:51 a.m. March 22, 2009

Amen Brother

jimbo | 2:17 a.m. March 22, 2009

I think it is really much more simple.

Utah and BYU played horrible. A&M and Arizona played great.

I will stand by that both are great and worthy to be there teams.

Utah Man | 3:30 a.m. March 22, 2009

Great observations. Both Utah and BYU got ran over in their games. Benches weren't deep and once they took out a key player the battle was all uphill. The Conference IS better than it ever has been, and if they continue on this course, they'll all be very competitive in future tourneys. Look at the ACC and Big East...each and every game is a war within the conference, with the end result being teams that are extremely ready for the tourney because their season was like a tourney...no given wins against cellar dwelling confernce opponents.

Comments continue below

Bandwagon journalists?? | 5:34 a.m. March 22, 2009

So suddenly the whole MWC is crap because they played 2 lousy games? This is the job of the East coast folks, not a local writer- that is to jump to ridiculous conclusions on very limited information.

Utah probably had too high of a seed but last I checked one of the teams they beat is in the sweet 16. A team they absolutely trounced gave a 1 seed all they could handle yesterday. They played lousy in their tourney appearance and lost to a team that shouldn't have even been in the tourney. Does that discount everything they have done?? Of course not. It seems as if 2 other 5 seeds lost their 1st round game too (as did a #4 seed).

BYU came out flat (a disturbing late season trend)against a team shooting out of their heads and could never make up the difference. Does that mean they didn't belong and their season was a waste? Does it mean the whole MWC was terrible? Ridiculous conclusions.

I would expect this reactionary tripe from sportsboards or even a certain blonde columnist from a competing newspaper but it is very dissapointing to see from Mr Harmon.

Heartless | 5:54 a.m. March 22, 2009

BYU's and Utah's performances were both heartless. This should end any talk of the MWC being on par with the ACC, which you do hear from time to time.

Bob2 | 6:33 a.m. March 22, 2009

The Utes early season losses should have really told us more than they seemed to. We didn't really make the gigantic strides that many have claimed. We were simply a bunch of seniors who had played a lot together over the last few years and should be expected to pound out 21 or 22 wins. We played a tough schedule (smart move) but we won some we should have lost and lost a few we should have won. I can't tell if the program is on the rise, or simply blipped out of sub-mediocrity for a season. I think real progress would look more like our football program, where fans can't wait to see what certain underclassmen will do this season and our depth is our strength.

The tourney decides it | 7:03 a.m. March 22, 2009

No controversy. The MWC got schooled. It's obvious. Undeniable.
I just wish NCAA football was the same. Controversy abounds after the football season. Let a tourney decide football too!

real world | 7:17 a.m. March 22, 2009

No, Harmon finally got it right. After listening to people talk about the mwc all year and how awesome they are, I was wondering how and when they joined the powerhouse conferences. Head to head in football and basketball (the only 2 sports people care about), top to bottom they would get crushed against the "big boys". I'm not saying there wouldn't be an upset or two (see the Utah sugar bowl win), but top to bottom it would be pretty ugly. So please for the sake of the rest of us, quit comparing yourselves to the ACC, Big East, SEC... you're not there yet.

sophomoric | 7:24 a.m. March 22, 2009

The author has reached sophomoric conclusions. Must have had writer's block. Facts are true, but they do not reach the conclusion. It is the old A plus B must equal C, when in reality A plus B is only A plus B.

The Utes and the Y have played great ball in recent years. USU the same. All 3 ran into buzz saws. Odds are that that can happen, and it did.

Sophomoric column, reaching for controversy. Sad that he is still employed. Very sophomoric.

Now if the author had diagnosed one of the games, etc., and pointed out problems in recruiting, etc., then the column has merit. To just run around yelling "The sky has fallen, the sky has fallen" is so..............well, sophomoric.

Eric | 7:32 a.m. March 22, 2009

You're so right, the NCAA tourney isn't about match-ups or anything. Along with BYU and Utah being fakes, Wake Forest, West Virginia, Cal and FSU are all fakes too. Pretty said to say almost 1/4 of the top seeds (8 or higher) were fakes.

Keep Climbing the Mountain | 7:42 a.m. March 22, 2009

Wake Forest's coach said that BYU's team could compete in the ACC. I believe him.

HOWEVER, that would be the starting 5, maybe six. The problem is depth. MWC teams need more depth to compete for an entire year.

This is something that MWC football teams have faced over the years as well - but they've become deeper on the depth chart over the past two decades and once in a while a MWC team will rise to the top. Utah in 2004 and 2008 in point.

As MWC schools get deeper their success will improve. And one day.... that magical team will happen.

MWC | 7:53 a.m. March 22, 2009

MWC could be more competitive if we had better "officials" in the league. Our officiating has got to be the most one sided when playing in the State of Utah.........I believe you call it MWC greed from COMM. Thompson!!!

Tribefan | 8:39 a.m. March 22, 2009

Harmon in addition to being a BYU shill, is a sunshine patriot.

true blue | 8:41 a.m. March 22, 2009

The league is actually 3-5 in post season play. wyoming lost in the first round of the CBI.

Truthful Article | 8:42 a.m. March 22, 2009

Only the truth hurts fans, and tis article is reality. Wake up, look in the mirror, we don't exist in a fantasy world. Spot on Harmon!

rfrmac | 8:45 a.m. March 22, 2009

It was an easy shot to take and you took it. Was the MWC the only conference that got shut out? No! Did conferences with 7 teams in the dance now have 1 - Yes? - In Utah's case the article would have been more well served if there was a discussion of Utah's continual high number of turn overs. If there is one thing that coach Boylen needs to work on with his team it is to cut down turnovers! Utah needs a true point guard that is consistent. This we did not have this year. Wait, Dick does BYU. Well, I will let a true BYU fan fill in the blanks. How about Dick and article on how the term BCS has now gotten into basketball. The MWC is classified now as a mid major in both sports. How did that happen? That would have been a nice article.

You went for the easy one - you've taken it - now move on.

one view | 9:10 a.m. March 22, 2009

Sure, it's easy to look at the outcomes of the BYU and Utah games and to talk about the disaster. I only watched the last few minutes of the Utah game so I can't make assertions about the Utes, but I did watch the entire BYU game.
Look, no question BYU came out flat offensively and Cummard was pressing -- missing easy layups at the start. But A&M was shooting beyond belief. Some of their shots were open looks, but some were "just turn around and flip it toward the basket" and it would go in. No fault of the BYU defense, and if A&M had merely made half of it's first ten shots, BYU would have survived the onslaught and the game would have been much closer at the end.
So, the fact is, A&M made these shots and won the game easily, but to disredit BYU and Utah and the entire conference because some team played it's best and luckiest of the year is absurd.

bergstro | 9:45 a.m. March 22, 2009

I'm just glad that we haven't had any dork-fans from either side arguing about which team was better in their disappointing loss. That's probably the most unsatisfying result for most fans: you can't trash talk about 13 point losses to lower ranked teams. It should be a quiet off season on that front.

ks | 9:58 a.m. March 22, 2009

Is rediculous to try and find or make up bright spots for the MWC, let alone Utah and BYU. It is very clear they are lacking, very very poor basketball, not much talent really. Utah's only chance to improve lies clearly on Boylen, can he recruit? This program needs talent preiod, and have to say American boys. If Boylen cant bring in talent, waist no more time with him. BYU?? what else can you say? Only good in MWC?

James | 9:59 a.m. March 22, 2009

Isn't the record 3 wins and 4 losses?

TED | 10:03 a.m. March 22, 2009

How did the MWC become a mid-major? When ESPN said so! ESPN and the BCS are one and the same. When the MWC oppted for the Mountain Channel over kissing up to ESPN,they cut their own throats.

Another thought. Self confidence seem to be lacking in the players? I thought so.

BlueBoy | 10:32 a.m. March 22, 2009

Funny how the football season's success by Utah and the other MWC teams spilled over into the MWC's basketball season. No, the MWC teams didn't have great records against top opponents in basketball like they did in football, so it really was just carryover that made the talking heads think the MWC deserved 3-4 teams in the NCAAs.

Well, the proof was in the pudding, wasn't it? Don't expect the MWC basketball to follow the MWC football successes in years to come.

Hopefully, the MWC football successes weren't a flash in the pan, or the MWC can forget about getting any shot at being a BCS conference.

And for posters thinking the MWC is a lesser conference because talking heads say so, remember that the MWC is a fledgling conference that has yet to prove itself. The talking heads are on target so far.

SoCalUteFan | 10:37 a.m. March 22, 2009

For Utah to be seated #5, they really disappointment me and played heartless.

Oh well, I can still watch my Sugar Bowl rerun....

Go Utes!

Hype by the MW | 11:10 a.m. March 22, 2009

This is a lousy league and it is show a lousy tv network. I am a former fan.

Congrats Dick! | 12:31 p.m. March 22, 2009

You set out to write an article that was sure to stir up some comments and it did. Exactly what you are paid to do. No problem.

As for the MWC being weak in basketball, that will continue to be the case until the top schools are able to attract other conference top schools into coming to play here. We are allowed to play away as much as we want it seems, but no one wants to play at our places. Can't really blame them. Most of them would lose playing in The Pit, The Marriott Center, Huntsman Center, etc.

It will all work out eventually. This conference will eventually become a major player but it will take some more time. After all, it's only been 10 years since we started this one.

Basketball Fan | 12:47 p.m. March 22, 2009

This MWC league finds out every year how slow and small they are when they get to the NCAA's or NIT's
BYU hasnt' won a first round game in the last 7 invites under 3 different coaches, so it's not coaching it's talent!!! Utah on the other hand has had a little better success than BYU, but not much. They lose at home to a team that they shouldn't have even brought into the Special Events Center.
Get use to it MWC, you will never be in the Big's

Harmon spot on MWC=rubbish | 1:04 p.m. March 22, 2009

MWC is rubbish at best. The notion that BYU or Utah can compete with athleticism is laughable, provocation or truth? Complete truth just look at how they fared against athleticism . . . USU same thing, although closer and probably a tougher opponent, they faltered. Again lack of athleticism kills.

MWC is NOTHING COMPARED TO THE POWER CONFERENCES. Fact is SDSU would have represented better than BYU because although they are not as fundamental they are certainly more athletic which seems to be worth more in the tourney.

MWC quit talking until you have at least went .500 in the NCAA's.

Mike | 1:06 p.m. March 22, 2009

Lets not forget the UTES lost to SW Baptist, Idaho ST. and got trounced by Oklahoma. Granted they beat Gonzaga and LSU. It was a wierd season. They were good, NOT great.

Tourney Results
NCAA
BYU - 1st rd loss. Blown OUT!
UTAH - 1st rd loss. Out played!

NIT
New Mexico - 2nd rd loss
UNLV - 1st rd loss. Beat soundly!
SDSU - Still in 3rd rd...

CBI
Wyoming - 1st rd loss. Beat by northeasten at home.

= MWC B-Ball is not that good.

MWC Football is a legit power conf. - Between UTAH, BYU, and TCU the MWC has produced a top 10 caliber team each year in the last 6 years. In BasketBall the MWC is good but hasn't produced the top 10 caliber team since the Majerus (WAC) days. Granted UNLV and UTAH did make sweet 16 runs.

Well said... | 1:15 p.m. March 22, 2009

Now get rid of thompson and the Mtn. We need a fresh start!

to Mike | 1:32 p.m. March 22, 2009

"Tourney Results
NCAA
BYU - 1st rd loss. Blown OUT!
UTAH - 1st rd loss. Out played!"

You can't hide your anti-BYU bias even in an article about the conference BOTH Utah and BYU belong to. Both teams lost by 13. Utah lost to a lower seed!

To me that is more of a sound spanking than BYU's loss by the same margin. Sorry, but that's the truth. Or can't you handle the truth?

Are you really a Ute fan or just a Y hater, like all your "Ute fan" brothers? Stay on topic and stop wasting everyone's time.

Johnny Moser | 4:12 p.m. March 22, 2009

Grateful for Utah's one and out. Heard enough smack on Friday for a lifetime from redheaded stepchild brother up north. Can't talk smack this week unless he reruns his sugar bowl win.

Question: Does BYU have the record for number of appearences with one and out showings in NCAA tourney history? Just wondering, at least I could claim that we are the worst of the best, would go along with my being a Minnisota Vikings fan.

UNLV | 4:15 p.m. March 22, 2009

Here's the problem with the MWC. First, The lack of speed at the guard line on a National Level. Second, The teams that live in the High elevations have the advantage over teams closer to sea level during league play. Thus you see BYU, always in the NCAA tournament due to their homecourt advantage in the MWC. But because they have slow defenders and slow foot speed at the guard line they are always one and done. College basketball is built around great gaurd play most of the time. That is why when UNLV gets in the tournament we are successful because we have had good quick defenders and shooters (which the exception of this year) Utah tried to build their team around Neville and he is not a go-to guy against physical teams and again the Utes guard play was based on slow players.

USU | 4:16 p.m. March 22, 2009

So by your deductions, then the WAC would be better then the MWC, right up there with the Big East. They displayed a much better showing in the tournament.

Reality, it comes down to desire and coaching. Some teams come in believing they belong and wanting to prove that to the world. Ala USU, Cleveland St, Western Kentucky. Others come in feeling they belong and don't have to prove it. Their seed is proof enough and their opponent will roll over, like Utah, Wake, Illinois. Others like BYU come in thinking they have been slighted and never prepare mentally. The coaching has to get players to focus. It certainly wasn't there with BYU. If BYU would have been more on the bubble, worried about making the tourny and happy with any seed. They would have come out far better motivated to play. Great example in the MWC tourney, UNLV gets beat by SDSU and suddenly according to BYUs announcer, BYU should be able to walk to the Championship. So, what happens, they are not ready to play SDSU. Facts is, great teams come ready to play every game, it has nothing to do with better conferences.

Sophomoric? | 5:58 p.m. March 22, 2009

To the Harmon basher (and by the way, I'm not a Harmon fan)....

If you bash a writer but use the word sophomoric FIVE times, it doesn't give you much clout when bashing his writing.

In your own words...very SOPHOMORIC

WHO WAS UTAH KIDDING | 7:24 p.m. March 22, 2009

WHO WAS THE STATE OF UTAH KIDDING?

That should have been the title of the article.

SDS and UNM would have done better. UNLV probably won at least one.

Vegas Visitor | 10:14 p.m. March 22, 2009

Both the MWC and the WAC are basketball weak, weak, weak. And UNLV couldn't beat a 16th seed. It will be good to get back to football.

Seattleview | 10:34 p.m. March 22, 2009

Does this mean you are going to give up being the #1 contributor to the BYU hype machine? That would be great. Unbiased reporting would be a welcome relief.

Make BYU earn your praise by winning against quality teams and then you can praise them. Until then, just keep it realistic.

The Champ | 10:43 p.m. March 22, 2009

A few years back the Mountain west was lousy at football but in basketball they could compete with the "big 6" quite well.(back in the Rick Majerus glory days UNLV and New Mexico also had solid programs) Now the Conference has shifted and is a great football conference who cant play basketball. I think its a fair trade football is more intertaining anyway.

RE: to Mike | 1:32 p.m. | 12:24 a.m. March 23, 2009

Stay on topic? The article is about the MWC and so was my comment. I like BYU but I guess your insecurities as a HOMER Y took it the other way. Both losses were bad as I stated, and I also praised BYU'S football team. By the way Arizona is still playing in the sweet 16 and A&M got bounced.

Tough, but true | 8:38 a.m. March 23, 2009

Can't argue too much with Harmon, even though I typically love to do so. Both teams played poor games. Said this last Monday, and still stand by it. Arizona was the toughest of the 3 teams drawn by locals. Having 3 pros on your roster is how you win tourney games. They were inconsistent during the season, but with that kind of potential they can show up any beat anyone on a given day. They will give Louisville a run for their money. More than A&M showed anyways.

I think the biggest issue is the lack of athleticism that both teams showed. At least in football, TCU and Utah have been able to recruit similar athletes to Pac-10 teams, but nobody seems to do it in basketball. UNLV and SDSU have some athletes, but not many "basketball" players, and you need both to win.

Hope to see Boylen get some speed into the program. Having the big guy is nice, but speed and athleticism are the new waive. Unless you have a guy like Thabeet, the slow big guys just don't work well in todays game. Look at the NBA, same trend.

Tarheel Ute | 8:45 a.m. March 23, 2009

I dont know what games Sophomoric watched but Mr. Harmon got it about right. BYU and Utah were stunned from the get-go. They ran up against defenses, that while they may have seen lesser versions (WYO, TCU, UNLV) they were unable to compete no less exploit. Both lost their ball-sense and composure, never to regain.

Im not sure that the MWC 1st team could beat any of the top half of the NCAA bracket.

I not bashing the MWC; The MWC has the cards stacked against them, starting with recruiting. The best athletes dont wont to play in a conference were national exposure is non-existent. In basketball, smaller teams, make recruiting the best talent critical.

For the most talented, college is a means to an achievable end, the NFL or NBA. The best are attracted by national exposure the TV contracts of the BSC conferences. Some great but mostly good talent remains - Utah and BYU.

For us older guys, I suspect Mr. Harmon is only slightly older than me, he called it like he saw it. And in this case I agree, however sophomoric.

Frowny | 10:20 a.m. March 23, 2009

BYU looked like they ate poison tainted steaks. The MWC MVP played more like the conference clown. The MWC doesn't deserve respect when they play so poorly when it counts the most. Anyone that disagrees with this article just doesn't get it. The MWC will be fortunate to get two teams in next year.

The Game's Over | 10:35 a.m. March 23, 2009

Even though BYU and Utah made a run late in the second half, their opponents quickly scquelched any bid for a come-back. The most disappointing thing to me was having to listen to the BYU announcer....Wrubell. His coaching from the broadcast booth was embarrasing! He was making Coach Rose look like a fool. Besides that, he doesn't have a very good knowledge of the game....basketball or football.

MWC not the only choke . . . | 10:55 a.m. March 23, 2009

I think the MWC was too hyped, but perhaps the bigger issue was they looked unprepared. What can you expect from local writers and coaches, who is going to say that the local teams or conference only deserves one bid. It think the MWC did deserve their two bids, maybe even three, but would have liked to have seen them play better. I would conversely liked to have seen a conference like the Big Ten which is obviously weak this year receive the same treatment as the SEC which only sent two?? this year. This might have let a team like SDSU or UAB or Creighton get in. I think the biggest disappointment conferencewise this tournament has got to be the Big Ten which sent 7 but only has two left.

Oh well life goes on... | 11:17 a.m. March 23, 2009

The deeper Arizona goes the better the seeding looks. They are playing pretty hot right now. A little dissapointed that Utah couldn't handle the pressure. They had to many turnovers even without full court pressure throughout the year. The Cat coaches were licking there chops, and we couldn't adapt. Oh well. We still have the Lady Utes in Hoops and Gymnastics.

richstakeonit | 12:28 p.m. March 24, 2009

Both of these very talented teams reacted like deer caught in the headlights. Perhaps our league is not as physical as we think, so it intimidates our teams when they run into that style of play. Both Marquette and Arizona seemed to be "on target" from the tip-off. Is that coaching or is it exper-ience, or both? Both Utah and BYU have played some phenomenal games during the season, so it is not a question of talent, it is a case of mental prepared-ness, I feel. Is it possible our coaches need to brush up on preparing their team for these bigger, more physical venues? I sensed BYU's players being tentative, afraid of making a mistake on the big stage, with the world watching. This hesitancy took them out of their rhythm, which affected their entire performance.

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