Reader comments
My view: Keep adult entertainment from kids
154 comments | Read story
Jack Thompson | 4:01 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
I look forward to returning to Utah, possibly this week, to testify for the
passage of this bill. I met with state government officials last month in Salt
Lake, and there is great enthusiasm for this approach, which, if passed into
law, will become a model for other states to tackle the deceptive practices of
the American entertainment industry which mentally molests minors for money.
Jack Thompson
Anonymous | 4:46 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
This is why I turned off my TV and put away my PS2 a long time ago. We have a
lot more family time and family fun. It really does work.. just takes some
getting used to.
Let's get real and find solution | 5:53 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
I agree that this is a serious issue and believe that serious action must be
taken but this idiotic bill doesn't do that. False advertisement? You have
got to be kidding! They aren't advertising a product to minors therefore if
a minor buys it then it isn't false advertisement. There has to be
something false in the advertisement other then "we don't sell to
minors" because that isn't false advertisement of the product and
truth in advertising doesn't apply unless it deals with the product and
plays an important factor in their decision to buy the product. If they
didn't buy it or attempt to buy it then they have no claim under the law
even if their child did buy it.
Saying that they do not sell R rated products or violent video games to minors isn't false advertisement since they aren't advertising under that premise and parents aren't making the DECISION to BUY that PRODUCT based on that specific information. In fact, it would be an incentive for them not to buy and companies who make this promise are advertising that parents not buy the product.
Saying that they do not sell R rated products or violent video games to minors isn't false advertisement since they aren't advertising under that premise and parents aren't making the DECISION to BUY that PRODUCT based on that specific information. In fact, it would be an incentive for them not to buy and companies who make this promise are advertising that parents not buy the product.
Comments continue below
Going too far | 6:12 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
This bill goes too far and too broad in its scope and does not target just games
or entertainment. This is a law that is beyond the scope of Utah's ability
to regulate and is inteneded for other purposes as most of Utahs laws do. Then
holding parents liable is not just either becasue most don't have a clue
about these games, me included. The only way such a law could be enforced is to
ban televisions and veiwing screens (cell phones, computers, etc) from minors.
But not likely, nor are games likely to cause criminal behavior among childdren.
Are we on the brink of another attempt at socialistic government control of our
lives, using children to act out and enforce control? Obviously. With the lack
of proper and wholsome activities for children after school hours and on their
own for many hours they have turned to personal home entertainment by any means.
The problem is, children have nothing else to do but sit in front of a TV or
home computer browsing the internet. And minors even have their own credit cards
from local banks to purchase these materials. This law attacks parents, not the
issue.
self responsibility | 6:17 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Know how does that favorite conservative line go? Games
don�t kill people, people do. Seriously people need to take
responsibility for their own actions and stop blaming video games, movies, the
dog next door��..
Are games different? | 6:24 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
We make drugs illegal because they cause people to behave in ways that
aren't good and do damage to peoples makeup.
Games of violence apparently do the same thing? If so, why are these not restricted in the same way that drugs are?
Why do we treat drugs differently than games?
Games of violence apparently do the same thing? If so, why are these not restricted in the same way that drugs are?
Why do we treat drugs differently than games?
Too much homework made them... | 7:17 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Are games different,
Games don't make people act violently anymore then seeing a movie makes someone act violently. The idea that games are similar to drugs is inherently flawed since any action we do and anything we see creates a response similar to a drug but our desire to drink a lot of coffee or smoke cigarettes doesn't make us go out and kill people because we saw Passion of Christ or Saints and Soldiers and thought "I know how I will get myself some free cigarettes."
There are a lot more things in a kids daily live which has the same effect as drugs but we don't regulate them (i.e., doing homework can cause the same effect as a drug). The problem people have is the false belief that drugs are more harmful then a student who gets OCD about getting straight A's and when they fail a class go on a shooting rampage. Do we ban homework because a student kills a bunch of people because HOMEWORK made them do it?
You people need to realize that people shoot people because they want to and not because homework made them do it.
Games don't make people act violently anymore then seeing a movie makes someone act violently. The idea that games are similar to drugs is inherently flawed since any action we do and anything we see creates a response similar to a drug but our desire to drink a lot of coffee or smoke cigarettes doesn't make us go out and kill people because we saw Passion of Christ or Saints and Soldiers and thought "I know how I will get myself some free cigarettes."
There are a lot more things in a kids daily live which has the same effect as drugs but we don't regulate them (i.e., doing homework can cause the same effect as a drug). The problem people have is the false belief that drugs are more harmful then a student who gets OCD about getting straight A's and when they fail a class go on a shooting rampage. Do we ban homework because a student kills a bunch of people because HOMEWORK made them do it?
You people need to realize that people shoot people because they want to and not because homework made them do it.
Fact checker | 7:32 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Dig, don't just quote press releases. You'll find that "former
practicing attorney" really means "disbarred by order of the
court."
uncannygunman | 7:34 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Interesting, but I don't think it will work as intended. Ever hear of fine
print? The sign at the door will still say "Under 17 Not Admitted,"
but at the bottom of the sign will be a little disclaimer that the theater does
not guarantee full compliance, parents are responsible, etc., etc. False
advertising problem solved.
Also, I don't think the First Amendment is that easily avoided. But it's an interesting theory.
Also, I don't think the First Amendment is that easily avoided. But it's an interesting theory.
Who are the parents? | 7:37 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
I play Gears of War 2, Call of Duty 4, Halo 3 etc. I must be defective because I
have yet to have the desire to go start killing people. Video Games are like
anything else in life, you need self discipline and control. If you see your
kids having issues with the video game it may be time to take it out of the home
and get some help. Parents where are you at? Instead of letting your kids just
play whatever get the rating off the box, it's easier than a DVD because
it's right off the front. We don't need the government to protect us
all the time if you have a standard you choose to live by great, but don't
make a blanket accusation about things you know nothing about. Because some of
us actually are married and have kids and everything. So stop stereotyping us as
black trench coated wierdos just waiting to go on a shooting spree.
Voice of Reason | 7:47 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Actually, Jack Thompson is taking the legally airtight approach with false
advertising here, juvenile "retard" insults on here notwithstanding.
This would be a NEW State law that modifys and improves false advertising laws,
which is regulated by both the FTC and the 50 States, to appropriately include
penalties for non-enforcement of advertised Access to Minors promises. False
advertising has never "only" been about making false statements to get
you to buy; it also encompasses other forms of false advertising, such as
leaving out important label information, making false charitable support claims
for good publicity, etc.
It's about time businesses were held accountable for their promises to prohibit access to minors, which is in fact a form of false advertising since they make the claim to get good publicity, then don't enforce it to make $$$ at the register.
Yes, the first line of defense is parents. But parents need help to do their jobs when they can't be everywhere their kids are - society needs this help. Let's keep this stuff from minors when parents can't be watching.
It's about time businesses were held accountable for their promises to prohibit access to minors, which is in fact a form of false advertising since they make the claim to get good publicity, then don't enforce it to make $$$ at the register.
Yes, the first line of defense is parents. But parents need help to do their jobs when they can't be everywhere their kids are - society needs this help. Let's keep this stuff from minors when parents can't be watching.
Nate Daniels | 8:35 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
FYI, the military does not expose recruits to video games of any kind. At least
not in my 11.5 years with the Marines (including 4 years at the Naval
Academy).
This OpEd is just a bunch of made up stories.
Why is it always the people waving the morality flag that have no problem lying right to your face? (sigh)
This OpEd is just a bunch of made up stories.
Why is it always the people waving the morality flag that have no problem lying right to your face? (sigh)
Anonymous | 8:46 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Games cost about $50. Why does your kid have $50 to spend how they see fit? Why
dont we try putting the responsibility on the parents where it belongs.
Adult? | 8:48 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
What's "adult" about "adult entertainment"? This doggy
doo-doo isn't good for anyone.
A bill may, or may not be a good place to start, but what about typical 'entertainment' on prime-time TV and in the movies. Isn't the hero, or even heroine these days, likely to punch out someone who he / she disapproves of, accompanied by the familiar, unrealistic, snapping sound.
Isn't that Hollywood's message too; that everything can be solved by violence? Often, of course, the bad guy / disapproved guy/ un-pc guy doesn't hit back, making it seem all the more attractive as a method of responding to situations.
Maybe a change in attitude about violence (and porn) from adults, "young adults" and children is the most sure and lasting way to go. It will take a while.
A bill may, or may not be a good place to start, but what about typical 'entertainment' on prime-time TV and in the movies. Isn't the hero, or even heroine these days, likely to punch out someone who he / she disapproves of, accompanied by the familiar, unrealistic, snapping sound.
Isn't that Hollywood's message too; that everything can be solved by violence? Often, of course, the bad guy / disapproved guy/ un-pc guy doesn't hit back, making it seem all the more attractive as a method of responding to situations.
Maybe a change in attitude about violence (and porn) from adults, "young adults" and children is the most sure and lasting way to go. It will take a while.
GP | 8:54 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Mr. Thompson - Please answer two very simple questions:
What is the bill number? Who is the bill's sponsor?
What is the bill number? Who is the bill's sponsor?
You can't | 9:17 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
You can't legislate parental responsibility.
Nihilist | 9:38 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
BOO HOO, the kiddies are being corrupted! Why can't parents step up and
parent their kids? I am TIRED of living my life for peoples' kids. Be a
parent or learn how to use birth control!
Gopherus | 9:43 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"even though reliable age-verification software is used by online alcohol,
tobacco and firearm retailers."
If this is true why is there a law preventing adults from legally importing liquor, wine, and beer into this state via internet purchases and mail delivery?
If this is true why is there a law preventing adults from legally importing liquor, wine, and beer into this state via internet purchases and mail delivery?
E. Zachary Knight | 10:02 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Online game and movie retailers already comply with law and FTC regulation. The
FTC has stated and it is in law that credit card transactions are a valid form
of age verification and proof of parental consent. This is because one of the
signees on a credit card must be over the age of 18.
E. Zachary Knight | 10:03 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
IF this bill that John Bruce is referring to is the one I think, by not defining
"material harmful to minors" you have successfully created an
unenforceable bill. There is no legal precedent that defines "material
harmful to minors" outside of common obscenity laws. Under such obscenity
laws any video game that falls under those measures would already be restricted.
The games that John Bruce refers to are not obscenity. Not unless you consider R
rated movies obscenity.
Truth Seeker | 10:30 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Mr. Thompson, you cite certain reports in this story, could you provide some
more specifics? It would be nice to be able to follow up on these reports with
a link to the report or the official title. If we are going to make change, we
must have a firm foundation of facts. Please fully cite your sources, so that
we can all get a better understanding of these important issues.
sqlrob | 10:36 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
OK Jack, let's try this YET AGAIN. You have NEVER been brave enough to
answer this question the countless times I've posed it to you.
With specificity (it's a legal term. You should know it, even if you've been disbarred for life, which only a handful have), how is this Constitutional, with special emphasis on First, Fifth and Fourteenth amendments. Cite precedents.
With specificity (it's a legal term. You should know it, even if you've been disbarred for life, which only a handful have), how is this Constitutional, with special emphasis on First, Fifth and Fourteenth amendments. Cite precedents.
Hey parents | 10:43 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Keep your kids away from adult entertainment.
Shadow D. Darkman | 10:44 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Question, Jack.
"The FTC has proven Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Target, and others are saying one thing to the American people, to curry the favor of parents, and then doing quite another."
Can you show us the proof, or does it just not exist? If it exists, please post it here. Please note that if you quote the FTC on this, I will be contacting them in order to verify. Contrary to popular belief, Jack, your word is not enough.
"The FTC has proven Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Target, and others are saying one thing to the American people, to curry the favor of parents, and then doing quite another."
Can you show us the proof, or does it just not exist? If it exists, please post it here. Please note that if you quote the FTC on this, I will be contacting them in order to verify. Contrary to popular belief, Jack, your word is not enough.
Peter | 10:47 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
If the Bill refers to all media types, and not just Video Games, which Mr
Thompson has an extremely unhealthy obsession with, then, at least, it is not
being prejudiced.
That said, there is a vast amount of research available on the effect of Media on people, and the balance is actually not as strongly in your favour as you would lead people to believe.
One of the most common Media items in the world is a book called the Bible, and you cannot say that it has no influence on people considering the size of the Christian faith.
Will things like the Bible be censored under this bill? After all, it contains sodomy, rape, murder, incest etc.
Be very careful what you wish for when you start trying to define what is 'for the children' Mr Thompson, you could very well be opening a Pandoras Box. In your blind stampede to 'destroy' things you don't approve of, you could very well end up doing far more damage than good.
That is why the US has always held that the Parents should make the choice of what is suitable for their children, not the Government.
That said, there is a vast amount of research available on the effect of Media on people, and the balance is actually not as strongly in your favour as you would lead people to believe.
One of the most common Media items in the world is a book called the Bible, and you cannot say that it has no influence on people considering the size of the Christian faith.
Will things like the Bible be censored under this bill? After all, it contains sodomy, rape, murder, incest etc.
Be very careful what you wish for when you start trying to define what is 'for the children' Mr Thompson, you could very well be opening a Pandoras Box. In your blind stampede to 'destroy' things you don't approve of, you could very well end up doing far more damage than good.
That is why the US has always held that the Parents should make the choice of what is suitable for their children, not the Government.
Sortableturnip | 10:49 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"Here's the bill in Utah: It doesn't define what content is
"harmful to minors," so we avoid the phony First Amendment arguments
Hollywood loves to make. The bill simply states: If you promise the public you
don't sell adult-rated entertainment to kids, then you had better be
telling the truth, because if a parent catches you selling this stuff to his or
her kids, then you're guilty of fraud under the Truth in Advertising
Law."
Said in an email from Jack Thompson himself.
Said in an email from Jack Thompson himself.
Nightwng2000 | 10:54 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
1) It isn't anyone's Right to dictate (as opposed to offer opinions
which may be willingly followed or ignored) what is or is not appropriate for
other individuals or their children. Even religious beliefs may be deemed
"harful to minors" and the defense of those beliefs could easily be
seen as "phony First Amendment arguments" meant to "mentally
molest" children into following acts of bigotry and hate expressed through
verbal, mental, physical, and/or sexual abuse of children.
Nice how what is acceptable for one individual/Parent may not be for another. So, who is more "morally superior"? The one who thinks their child should be allowed to play GTA I, or the one who thinks lies, deceit, bigotry, hate, and abuse in the name of their "God" is "moral"?
One should always remember that no matter what one discusses, various media products (books, magazines, TV shows/movies, video/computer games, etc), a religion/non-religion, various discussion/debate topics, where someone lives, and a variety of other things, are not always shared in common with everyone else.
Nice how what is acceptable for one individual/Parent may not be for another. So, who is more "morally superior"? The one who thinks their child should be allowed to play GTA I, or the one who thinks lies, deceit, bigotry, hate, and abuse in the name of their "God" is "moral"?
One should always remember that no matter what one discusses, various media products (books, magazines, TV shows/movies, video/computer games, etc), a religion/non-religion, various discussion/debate topics, where someone lives, and a variety of other things, are not always shared in common with everyone else.
Jack Thompson | 10:54 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
You missed the point Peter, so I'll try again. I'm NOT defining what
is harmful to minors. The industry has done that with a Mature rating right
there on the game. If they sell it to kids under 17 when they advertise they
don't, then that is, by definition a fraudulent marketing practice.
Don't blame me for defining what is harmful. The industry has. And we aren't trying to enforce that decision. We are saying stop your deceptive trade practice. Period. We addresss the trade practice, not the material content itself. This is a cool way to go. So cool that the industry is apoplectic about this bill, and that's a very good thing indeed ;). I think people ought to do what they say they do, don't you?
Don't blame me for defining what is harmful. The industry has. And we aren't trying to enforce that decision. We are saying stop your deceptive trade practice. Period. We addresss the trade practice, not the material content itself. This is a cool way to go. So cool that the industry is apoplectic about this bill, and that's a very good thing indeed ;). I think people ought to do what they say they do, don't you?
Serious? | 11:04 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Why should we take you serious Mr. Thompson? Why should I listen to someone who
quite obviously thinks that anyone who disagrees with him is an idiot? You draw
a line and anyone who doesn't toe that line is a threat to you. Go away and
let me parent my kids, I don't need you to tell me what I can and
can't show them.
Sortabletunrip | 11:07 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"After Columbine, the 1999 school massacre authored by two teens who
copycatted the school-shooting scene in the movie "The Basketball
Diaries" and trained on the video game "Doom," "
No proof, just hearsay...
In 2008, the FTC conducted stings on movie theatres and found 35 percent of the time kids under 17 can buy an R-rated movie ticket, no questions asked. Carmike Cinemas, with theaters in Utah, was found by these FTC stings to fail checking IDs a whopping 56 percent of the time.
"In retail stores, the FTC in 2008 found R-rated movies were sold to underage kids at a dizzying pace: Kmart, 47 percent of the time; Blockbuster, 53 percent; Best Buy, 62 percent, Barnes & Noble, 64 percent; Target, 65 percent. At Transworld Entertainment/FYE, with stores throughout Utah, the failure rate is 78 percent!"
Again, need proof...
No proof, just hearsay...
In 2008, the FTC conducted stings on movie theatres and found 35 percent of the time kids under 17 can buy an R-rated movie ticket, no questions asked. Carmike Cinemas, with theaters in Utah, was found by these FTC stings to fail checking IDs a whopping 56 percent of the time.
"In retail stores, the FTC in 2008 found R-rated movies were sold to underage kids at a dizzying pace: Kmart, 47 percent of the time; Blockbuster, 53 percent; Best Buy, 62 percent, Barnes & Noble, 64 percent; Target, 65 percent. At Transworld Entertainment/FYE, with stores throughout Utah, the failure rate is 78 percent!"
Again, need proof...
BearDogg-X | 11:09 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Then it's still unconstitutional as this "bill" would delegate
governmental authority to a non-government group.
And there is no "deceptive trade practice" when you're whining over less than 1% of all video game sales!
Shows how pathetic this "cause" really is.
Jack, practice what you preach: Grow up and get a life.
And there is no "deceptive trade practice" when you're whining over less than 1% of all video game sales!
Shows how pathetic this "cause" really is.
Jack, practice what you preach: Grow up and get a life.
Sortableturnip | 11:11 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"You missed the point Peter, so I'll try again. I'm NOT defining
what is harmful to minors. The industry has done that with a Mature rating right
there on the game. If they sell it to kids under 17 when they advertise they
don't, then that is, by definition a fraudulent marketing
practice."
Again, Jack, the ratings are not a law, they are a guideline for consumers. Video games are considered "free speech"
Again, Jack, the ratings are not a law, they are a guideline for consumers. Video games are considered "free speech"
Anonymous | 11:15 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"Last month an Ohio judge, presiding over the trial of a teen video gamer
for murder, said, "After awhile the same physiological responses occur
playing video games that occur in the ingestion of some drugs.
� an addiction to these games can do the same thing.
� Daniel Petric had no idea, at the time he hatched this
plot, that if he killed his parents, they would be dead forever.""
That judge also said that video games is not a defense and there was evidence of prior calculation and planning. What you quoted is his "OPINION" not his "verdict". BIG difference there, Jack!
That judge also said that video games is not a defense and there was evidence of prior calculation and planning. What you quoted is his "OPINION" not his "verdict". BIG difference there, Jack!
Sortableturnip | 11:17 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
The British Advertising Standard Authority has said it believes 99 percent of
all games in the UK are responsibly advertised.
The authority examined 241 ads examined last year to see whether or not they met guidelines.
�Our survey is encouraging as it suggests that videogames are being advertised responsibly and in line with the Codes,� commented Christopher Graham, director general of the ASA.
The study was in response to Tanya Byron�s UK government report on games ratings in 2008.
�The issue raised by Dr Byron of children�s exposure to violent or inappropriate imagery in videogames is an important one,� said Graham. �The ASA will play its part in protecting children by ensuring video game ads continue to play by the rules.�
The authority examined 241 ads examined last year to see whether or not they met guidelines.
�Our survey is encouraging as it suggests that videogames are being advertised responsibly and in line with the Codes,� commented Christopher Graham, director general of the ASA.
The study was in response to Tanya Byron�s UK government report on games ratings in 2008.
�The issue raised by Dr Byron of children�s exposure to violent or inappropriate imagery in videogames is an important one,� said Graham. �The ASA will play its part in protecting children by ensuring video game ads continue to play by the rules.�
nightwng2000 | 11:18 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
3) The rating system, indeed ANY rating system, is NOT a sales tool. NOR is it
there to decide what is or is not appropriate for someone's child.
The rating systems are a combination of Flashcard letters and descriptive content information which is one of many resources available to individuals and Parents to make their own informed decisions for themselves.
It is easily noted that what falls under one age catagory versus another has changed over time. Look at the MPAA rating system under Wikipedia and you'll see that the MPAA ratings have changed as well. Also, censored words on TV have changed over time as well.
One may as well consider the flashcard ratings arbitrary and use one's own judgement. Which, in fact, is what various businesses do in making their decisions to create a policy regarding rated/unrated material.
An individual's/Parent's actual research using available resources, and there are MANY, far outweighs anything any policy or law will ever amount to.
Andrew
The rating systems are a combination of Flashcard letters and descriptive content information which is one of many resources available to individuals and Parents to make their own informed decisions for themselves.
It is easily noted that what falls under one age catagory versus another has changed over time. Look at the MPAA rating system under Wikipedia and you'll see that the MPAA ratings have changed as well. Also, censored words on TV have changed over time as well.
One may as well consider the flashcard ratings arbitrary and use one's own judgement. Which, in fact, is what various businesses do in making their decisions to create a policy regarding rated/unrated material.
An individual's/Parent's actual research using available resources, and there are MANY, far outweighs anything any policy or law will ever amount to.
Andrew
Peter | 11:24 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
The rating systems are voluntary systems, they are not saying the games are
harmful, they're giving a guideline for purchasers, they're not
stating that only people of the recommended age CAN watch the video, or play the
game, it simply giving the purchaser some idea of what the content of the game
is.
Congress agreed that a voluntary system was the best route to take because parents should be free to decide for themselves what is suitable for their children almost 2 decades ago when the possibility of rating music was discussed.
The rating system was taken on board to prevent government enforcement, not to promote it, you know this already.
You seem to think that a rating system is 'proof of harm', which it is most certainly not, parents should, and do, have the right to choose what is right for their children, and to take that away takes away one of the underpinning rights in this country. I agree that not all media is suitable for children, but an 'M' rating is, in no way, evidence of harm, only evidence of mature content.
Congress agreed that a voluntary system was the best route to take because parents should be free to decide for themselves what is suitable for their children almost 2 decades ago when the possibility of rating music was discussed.
The rating system was taken on board to prevent government enforcement, not to promote it, you know this already.
You seem to think that a rating system is 'proof of harm', which it is most certainly not, parents should, and do, have the right to choose what is right for their children, and to take that away takes away one of the underpinning rights in this country. I agree that not all media is suitable for children, but an 'M' rating is, in no way, evidence of harm, only evidence of mature content.
nightwng2000 | 11:30 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Also, on the subject of not defining what is "harmful to minors", the
"author" trumps himself by actually trying to, through misinformation,
lies, deceit, and phony causal linkage, claim of violent media having caused
various acts, such as a number of crimes, and misinformation and even muddying
the incomplete and even incompetantly performed "research" by various
sources.
Another commenter asked about the comparison of drugs to media effects. The contrast is that drugs have a direct chemical effect on an individual. Individuals are far more complex than even most experts and researchers consider. While an individual taking drugs may have some resistance or will to resist the effects of the drugs, the drug, in fact, affects each individual pretty much in the same way. A drug may not be as effect on one person versus another, but the drug always attempts to affect all individuals the same way.
Media products (books, movies, TV shows, games, and many other things individuals are exposed to) vary widley on each individual and can be strengthended or lessened by personality, interest, prior experience with the thing, other prior experiences, existing mental health, reaction to what one is exposed to, and many other factors.
Andrew
Another commenter asked about the comparison of drugs to media effects. The contrast is that drugs have a direct chemical effect on an individual. Individuals are far more complex than even most experts and researchers consider. While an individual taking drugs may have some resistance or will to resist the effects of the drugs, the drug, in fact, affects each individual pretty much in the same way. A drug may not be as effect on one person versus another, but the drug always attempts to affect all individuals the same way.
Media products (books, movies, TV shows, games, and many other things individuals are exposed to) vary widley on each individual and can be strengthended or lessened by personality, interest, prior experience with the thing, other prior experiences, existing mental health, reaction to what one is exposed to, and many other factors.
Andrew
M Python | 11:31 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
I applaud the efforts of Anonymous @ 4:46 a.m. Though, they are little to
extreme for me.
It all boils down to parents being observant, taking control as well as setting limits and guidelines.
Morality and common sense should not be legislated! Its a slippery slope when people want any organziation to decide what is best for them.
The Spanish Inquisition which noone expects would seem like a walk in the park compared to letting the moral majority in the Utah Legislature have their way.
It all boils down to parents being observant, taking control as well as setting limits and guidelines.
Morality and common sense should not be legislated! Its a slippery slope when people want any organziation to decide what is best for them.
The Spanish Inquisition which noone expects would seem like a walk in the park compared to letting the moral majority in the Utah Legislature have their way.
Nightwng2000 | 11:32 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
That judge also said the "experts" failed to prove squat.
But, apparently, personal opinion trumps the "experts" when it's in favor of the "author's" agenda.
Andrew
But, apparently, personal opinion trumps the "experts" when it's in favor of the "author's" agenda.
Andrew
Kincyr | 11:38 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"Help is on the way for Utah parents to keep violent, pornographic,
adult-rated entertainment from their kids. There's a bill now in the Utah
Legislature to do just that."
and nothing is more violent and pornographic than the Holy Bible. Utah won't accept that.
"You missed the point Peter, so I'll try again. I'm NOT defining what is harmful to minors. The industry has done that with a Mature rating right there on the game. If they sell it to kids under 17 when they advertise they don't, then that is, by definition a fraudulent marketing practice."
17-year-olds are still legally minors, Jack. Your statement is moot.
and nothing is more violent and pornographic than the Holy Bible. Utah won't accept that.
"You missed the point Peter, so I'll try again. I'm NOT defining what is harmful to minors. The industry has done that with a Mature rating right there on the game. If they sell it to kids under 17 when they advertise they don't, then that is, by definition a fraudulent marketing practice."
17-year-olds are still legally minors, Jack. Your statement is moot.
Anonymous | 11:44 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Utah may be passing one of its famous full employment for lawyer laws. It is
false advertising to sell the sizzle and not the steak? Are Washington apples
any better? There's the question of selective prosecution. Utah will charge
video makers and not stores selling sexuality to ten year old tweens?
Isn't the argument that the free markets works best without interference from a incompetent government?
We have a free market that markets thong underwear to tweens, violent videos and "Sex in the City." Even hate is a marketable commodity.
Funny; this Left Coast liberal doesn't see were business has ever put the good of our society over quarterly returns. Seeing this fact daily has yet to tone down conservatives favorite swan song. Business is the apex of American culture because the business of America is business.
Isn't the argument that the free markets works best without interference from a incompetent government?
We have a free market that markets thong underwear to tweens, violent videos and "Sex in the City." Even hate is a marketable commodity.
Funny; this Left Coast liberal doesn't see were business has ever put the good of our society over quarterly returns. Seeing this fact daily has yet to tone down conservatives favorite swan song. Business is the apex of American culture because the business of America is business.
Nightwng2000 | 11:49 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
My number 2 didn't show up, probably because of links.
It was in regards to proposals by the "author" regarding online age verification software.
You'll have to Google the following information to get the articles and info:
idology dot com
Read their blog and their defense.
Internet Safety Task Force, mentioned in the above blog.
Google "online age verification for children brings privacy worries" and look at the first article, which is a NY Times article.
This software, especially the Idology software, is being pushed by the "author".
He complains about "lobbying", yet it appears he is lobbying to have software forced on businesses that, in fact, may prove to be harmful to minors as well.
One would think that the Utah State Attorney General would look into what the "author" is receiving as "compensation" for his lobbying of this software package.
Andrew
It was in regards to proposals by the "author" regarding online age verification software.
You'll have to Google the following information to get the articles and info:
idology dot com
Read their blog and their defense.
Internet Safety Task Force, mentioned in the above blog.
Google "online age verification for children brings privacy worries" and look at the first article, which is a NY Times article.
This software, especially the Idology software, is being pushed by the "author".
He complains about "lobbying", yet it appears he is lobbying to have software forced on businesses that, in fact, may prove to be harmful to minors as well.
One would think that the Utah State Attorney General would look into what the "author" is receiving as "compensation" for his lobbying of this software package.
Andrew
Peter | 11:50 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
I'll also add to the previous statement that, yes, parents should be
present when children buy their media, but, to regulate it through Governmental
legislation is a slippery slope, it starts with Games and Movies, then there
will be an outcry because Books etc are not covered, that will lead to pressure
to start rating books and music (since that WILL be in violation of the
constitution if they don't), which will lead to those being Governmentally
enforced, which leads straight back to the example I set earlier with the Bible.
Adult entertainment? | 11:52 a.m. Feb. 3, 2009
What's either adult or entertaining about raping, murdering, pillaging?
These games appeal only to prurient interests and have no redeeming social value. When will we stand up and call them what they are -- obscene?
Then we can banish them to back alleys and curtained basements, where they belong.
These games appeal only to prurient interests and have no redeeming social value. When will we stand up and call them what they are -- obscene?
Then we can banish them to back alleys and curtained basements, where they belong.
sqlrob | 12:04 p.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"Adult Entertainment?" are you Jack under a different alias again?
Look up prurient. That doesn't include violence. Violence has
*SPECIFICALLY* been excluded from obscenity.
Legal Recourse | 12:06 p.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Legislation is generally necessary when:
1. Parents cannot reasonably create controls for their children, and turn to society to help them.
2. Parents won't create controls for their children.
Clearly there's a problem with some people's kids. And too bad if you're tired of looking out for other people's kids... that's called civilization. Get used to it.
You had freedom, but refused to keep it to yourself. Therefore you're going to lose it.
1. Parents cannot reasonably create controls for their children, and turn to society to help them.
2. Parents won't create controls for their children.
Clearly there's a problem with some people's kids. And too bad if you're tired of looking out for other people's kids... that's called civilization. Get used to it.
You had freedom, but refused to keep it to yourself. Therefore you're going to lose it.
Kincyr | 12:08 p.m. Feb. 3, 2009
"This very day, not a single U.S. Internet retailer, such as BestBuy,
WalMart and Target, verifies the age of any purchaser, even though reliable
age-verification software is used by online alcohol, tobacco and firearm
retailers."
That's because every AVS needs is only a valid credit card number, just like an on-line purchase. Just look at SexKey, for example.
That's because every AVS needs is only a valid credit card number, just like an on-line purchase. Just look at SexKey, for example.
nightwng2000 | 12:14 p.m. Feb. 3, 2009
Anon 11:52am,
As usual, lies, deceit, and misinformation by those who would subvert the US Constitution to create a dictatorship.
I don't find religious beliefs that promote bigotry, hate, lies, deceit, fraud, and corruption to be "moral" and consider them "harmful to minors", but since, according to the US Constitution, we cannot segregate out the "immoral" religions and religious beliefs from the "moral" ones, then we'll just have to pass laws which declare that ALL religions are obscene and "harmful to minors" and then we can banish THEM to the back alleys and curtained basements where such attemtps to "mentally molest" children actually belong.
It's really nice to declare something you don't like, even if you're lying about the content all together or in the context you state, "obscene" and "inappropriate" for others when you already have no interest in it. Of course, if something YOU participate in is considered "obscene" and "inappropriate", will YOU suddenly become the danger and have to give up YOUR Rights?
So, let's eliminate rape, murder, and pillaging from ALL media. That includes educational material, religious material, news related material, and ALL forms of media.
Andrew
As usual, lies, deceit, and misinformation by those who would subvert the US Constitution to create a dictatorship.
I don't find religious beliefs that promote bigotry, hate, lies, deceit, fraud, and corruption to be "moral" and consider them "harmful to minors", but since, according to the US Constitution, we cannot segregate out the "immoral" religions and religious beliefs from the "moral" ones, then we'll just have to pass laws which declare that ALL religions are obscene and "harmful to minors" and then we can banish THEM to the back alleys and curtained basements where such attemtps to "mentally molest" children actually belong.
It's really nice to declare something you don't like, even if you're lying about the content all together or in the context you state, "obscene" and "inappropriate" for others when you already have no interest in it. Of course, if something YOU participate in is considered "obscene" and "inappropriate", will YOU suddenly become the danger and have to give up YOUR Rights?
So, let's eliminate rape, murder, and pillaging from ALL media. That includes educational material, religious material, news related material, and ALL forms of media.
Andrew
Anonymous | 12:32 p.m. Feb. 3, 2009
@Legal Recourse
Benjamin Franklin is, no doubt, revolving at generating speeds in his grave at that comment.
Benjamin Franklin is, no doubt, revolving at generating speeds in his grave at that comment.
ShockLobster | 12:37 p.m. Feb. 3, 2009
The same slanted, irresponsible and poorly written rhetoric as ever out of
Thompson. If only a person could be disbarred from the Internet.
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