Deseret News | BYU Cougars basketball: Team overcomes all road obstacles

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BYU Cougars basketball: Team overcomes all road obstacles

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To: Madden | 6:24 p.m. Nov. 30, 2008

Keep dreaming. If you dream hard enough, BYU might actually win a Tournament Game.

By the way, guess how many times Utah has won the NIT? I await your answer.

These posts are pathetic!! | 7:27 p.m. Nov. 30, 2008

Here is an unbiased opinion from a Cougar Fan from Pocatello, ID. Utah is a far superior basketball program to BYU, and BYU has been a far superior Football program until recently!! Utah has won a naional championship in 1944 (even though that was way before most of our parents were born), and BYU won a national championship when I was 6 years old (I couldn't even enjoy that national championship because I don't remember a thing about it). So BYU fans need to be realistic. The numbers don't lie, Utah has done far more than BYU in the postseason in basketball. Utah has been to the Final Four more often, and has competed on a national level. Since 2004, Utah has been a major college football program to deal with (as much as I hate to say it). going to 2 BCS bowls in the last 4 years is impressive coug fans. But prior to 2004, Utah was irrelevant, and was unheard of on a national level! Utah Fans need to admit that much!! BYU was dominant in football until 1996 when they won the cotton bowl. Conclusion: BYU better in basketball, Utah: bettter in football for the moment.

Interesting | 7:46 p.m. Nov. 30, 2008

So why will BYU go to Poky to play Idaho State but won't even give SUU a 2-for-1?

UNLV and Utah State are both giving SUU a 2-for-1. Weber State trades off every year.

BYU would draw as well to Cedar City as they do in Pocatello. It would help the program down in Cedar get more exposure while also throwing a bone to BYU's fans in Southern Utah.

But since BYU thinks they're big-time for Utah State, it'll probably never happen (especially since we're 0-11 all-time against the Cougs). But Idaho State and Lamar are no bigger programs than SUU.

This goes for Utah, too. Oh, and by the way, we do have two wins against Utah and New Mexico. :-D

At least BYU can claim they've never lost to us, Utes.

Comments continue below

Hartsock? | 8:52 p.m. Nov. 30, 2008

I haven't seen anything about Noah Hartsock lately. Did he get hurt or something. He is a true freshman and we were happy to see him play . We don't get to see all the games, only the ones on BYUTV and we are wondering about him. Don't see his name in the write ups. Thanks, would like to know.

NCAA Champs | 8:59 p.m. Nov. 30, 2008

This was the year of Utah's Blitz Kidsï¿½Arnie Ferrin, Wat Misaka, Fred Sheffield, Herb Wilkinson, Dick Smuin and Bob Lewis. Average age: 181/2.

While the Whiz Kids of Illinois had stayed home in 1943, the Blitz Kids of Utah didn't even have a home in '44. The Skyline Conference had suspended play and the Army had taken over the Utes' fieldhouse in Salt Lake City, so coach Vadal Peterson was obliged to play mostly service teams in church gyms.

Utah went 18ï¿½3 and was invited to both NIT and NCAA tournaments. Peterson took the NIT offer because it included travel expenses, but the Utes were knocked out in the first round by Kentucky. Meanwhile, when Arkansas was forced to pull out of the NCAAs after a car accident injured several starters, the West Regional berth was offered to Utah. This time the Utes accepted and ended up back in New York for the Final Two. There, the Blitz Kids beat a transfer-laden Dartmouth team (including St. John's star Dick McGuire) 42ï¿½40, on a Wilkinson buzzer-beater in overtime.

Give us 1944, and we'll never complain about BYU's 1984 National Championship.

They both happened.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA | 9:20 p.m. Nov. 30, 2008

I enjoy how Utah fans keep pointing how they are the first to do things. Another first goes out to Southwest Baptist University. I'm sorry, I missed this one. Utah really lost to SBU and the Utes are already talking basketball trash after playing last year in the CBI Tournament???

"Itï¿½s obviously a huge win for our program," said Guiot. "If I'm not mistaken, it's first time SBU has ever defeated a Division-I school. We have seven seniors, and that leadership really showed this afternoon, especially late in the game. The thing I stressed to the team, right after the game, is that we have to handle this victory well. We want to get better every game. We have a group of guys who have bought into our system, and will give anything for the team. When you do that, special things can happen, like what happened this afternoon."

Ute's Special...

SBU plays at the Jane and Ken Meyer Sports and Wellness Center, is home of the Bearcat menï¿½s basketball, womenï¿½s basketball, and volleyball teams. The facility was built in 2004. The Sports Arena holds seating for 2,800 fans. The center houses Intramural Basketball and Volleyball Courts, etc...

National Prestige.

Hartsock | 9:21 p.m. Nov. 30, 2008

Read the pregame write up for the Idaho State game which ran in Saturday's paper. Hartsock sprained his ankle badly against Cal Poly.

Funny | 7:28 a.m. Dec. 1, 2008

Rod Cox you are a funny man. Cummard will never ever play in the NBA.

A Blue Blood | 9:05 a.m. Dec. 1, 2008

BYU won the national NIT tourney in 1951 and in 1966 when it was the premier tournament. They also won the national title in football with Robbie Boscoe. Utah won this years football game or did they? I think BYU gave it to them. I doubt the the Y could have won even against a Southwest Baptist football team with 6 turnovers, mostly unforced, by a usually fantastic quarterback. Since Utah represents the MWC, I do cheer for them when they are playing out of conference, especially in bowl games or in NCAA playoff basketball games. In the conference, I will have to admit that I almost always cheer for their opponents. Utah is lucky to have the two excellent universities. The competion between Utah and BYU is great but often blog writers, favoring each school, become very juvenile in criticizing the other. BYU's recruiting is hampered by their strict standards not imposed by other schools. Honor code violations at BYU are severely punished and Utah can overlook the same things or punish lightly.

I loved the ISU game and cheered for BYU even though I live in Idaho and I am an alum of ISU. Go Cougars!!

1944 & 1951 | 9:07 a.m. Dec. 1, 2008

BYU's 1951 NIT championship is every bit as meaningful as Utah's 1944 NCAA championship, in fact, probably more so.

In 1944, Utah first turned down an invite to the NCAA tournamant, to play in the NIT; the Utes lost their first NIT game; the Utes were then invited a second time to play in the NCAA tournament to replace a team that had to drop out.

1944 NCAA Tournament (8 teams)
Dartmouth 63
Catholic 38
-----Dartmouth 60
-----Ohio State 53
Ohio State 57
Temple 47
----------Dartmouth 40
----------Utah 42*
Iowa State 44
Pepperdine 39
-----Iowa State 31
-----Utah 40
Utah 45
Missouri 35

1944 NIT (8 teams) - Bowling Green, Canisius, DePaul, Kentucky, Muhlenberg, Oklahoma A&M, St. John's, Utah.

They still look sloppy | 9:16 a.m. Dec. 1, 2008

I'm glad they're winning and they look like the best team in the state of Utah. However, I think they still miss Plaisted. Miles hasn't quite learned to fill his shoes.

Jumbo Slice | 9:18 a.m. Dec. 1, 2008

The ISU coach was a baffoon - just like Boylen - suprised he didn't grab the microphone and pop off followed by a loss.

Hey Crimson Club | 9:19 a.m. Dec. 1, 2008

How have the Utes done against Kentucky...hahahahaha

Nobody Cares | 9:22 a.m. Dec. 1, 2008

Nobody cares about Utah - BYU is focused on BYU - we don't care about Utah or its fans. The Utes on the other hand have a knee jerk reaction to everything BYU does. Nice way to live your life. haha.

bob | 12:04 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

I love how the article says that Holt is a hostile stadium. I was at the game and First off there were more BYU fans then Isu fans. I was really disappointed at the byu players and there actions. You were playing a team that is half as good as you and your players were trying to pick fights with ISU players? Classless.

ISU has a problem | 12:46 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

His name is COACH

Holt ? | 1:03 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

In Ogden its known as LOLT Arena.

So they really had a hostile 4,000 in that dome? Ya right...

Come play in a real arena BYU...but plan on losing.

You have a losing record in Ogden.

Tobasco sauce | 1:25 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

Yesterday is gone! Today BYU dominates basketball. No ifs or ands about it. It doesn't matter what happened in the 40's or 50's. Utah won't win again till the fat man sings.

Quest | 2:23 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

Can anyone tell me where to get my "QUEST FOR Perfection" Basketball t-shirt to go with my hallowed football t-shirt?

Wilb Breth | 4:05 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

Utah is trash in Basketball right now! BYU is pretty darnn good! They will be 1st or 2nd in conference and go to the NCAA tourney. They may even get to the 32 this year. Utah will go to the MCI invitational in Taoga, Texas.

cdwj | 7:02 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

I am a Fan from Alaska. I read both BYU and UTAH Blogs. I only see a few BYU fans writing on Utes blogs but I see a TON of Utes fan wrinting on BYU blogs. Why is that? Is is because the Utes feel so inferior they have to constantly compare them selves to what they hope is their big brother.... dreaming that they may some day grow up and be like him?
When you are mature - you compare your performance today to how you did yesterday and work for improvement. Utah we hope you gow up.

fan | 9:03 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

and all this means nothing in the larger sceem of things. I am sickened by fans on both sides that seem to think a score or a game or a BCS invitation gives them a "holier than thou" position on anything (yes Utah fans I'm talking to you as much as anyone) This used to be a great, fun rivalry, not so anymore. The colour of your jersey now gives the other team the right and at times seemingly the obligation to throw profanities and objects. I love sports and rivalries but this is out of hand. This isn't smack anymore, for the most part it's just personal attacks and a demonstration of the worst in sports and competition.

RE-FAN | 11:55 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008

RIGHT ON FAN. IN THE 50-60TH, BOTH SCHOOLS WERE THE BEST INTERTAINMENT FROM SCHOOLS. UTAH STATE WAS IN THERE ALSO, SO WE JUST READ THE PAPERS FOR A STORY, WIN OR LOOSE. IT WAS GREAT IF WE GOT A TICKET TO SEE ANY TWO TO PLAY. NOW IT SEEMS THAT THE HATRED BETWEEN PEOPLE WE ONLY MEET ON A BLOG SIGHT GROWS WORSE EACH YEAR AND THOSE WHO BLOG PROBALLY COULDN'T KICK A BALL, PASS A BALL OR SHOOT A BASKET ANY BETTER THAN MY 92 YEAR OLD GRANDMOTHER. IF YOU HAVE FUN, KEEP IT UP, BUT IT TAKES A PERSON, WHO READS COMIC BOOKS DAILY, TO BE SMART ENOUGH TO BLOG. KEEP IT UP AND SOMEDAY YOU WILL PROBALLY GET SOMETHING CLOSE TO RIGHT. GO GO.

RE: "Everyone" | 9:55 a.m. Dec. 2, 2008

Look, if you kids don't stop this stupid bickering, I am going to turn this car around, or pull over on the side of the road and........., [please listen to yourselves,] ........but he's looking at me, but she's touching me.........!!!!!!

HEY!! this article was about a road basketball game in Idaho early in the season, and you KIDS in the back seat have turned it into some spitting match on who won what when. LOOK!! who cares about who won what way back when, it kinda reminds me of that line from Search for the Holy Grail, when the father of the bride at the wedding said about Sir Lancelot cutting down all the wedding guest, "lets not bicker about who killed who, this is a festive occasion". So again, don't make me stop this car!!!

It really is JUST A GAME!!!! Now you kids slide over to opposite sides of the car and play with your own toys nicely, OR ELSE!!!!!!!

(he's still looking at me.........she's still touching me.........) GIVE ME A BREAK!!

Sagarin rating | 3:35 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

BYU # 55 (SOS 339)

where is UTAH?

Utah #16 (SOS 82)

Hannah J. | 6:55 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

I used to be a Cougarette. We traveled with the football team on every away game. I can tell you with 100% certainty, BYU fans are much more classy than the Ute fans.

The Ute fans always threw food and garbage at us. The Ute fans also used profanity.

The Ute fans are real class acts. NOT!!

Cougs Fan | 7:00 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

Who leads the all time series?

Hannah J. | 7:56 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

To Cougs Fan,

Utah leads the all-time series in both football and basketball. It's not even close.

To Cougs Fan | 8:03 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

In football, the Utes lead the all time series 53-33-4. In basketball, Utah leads by an even larger margin. Just google it.

Crimson Club | 8:07 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

Cougs Fan,

In basketball Utah leads this series as well, but by a much narrower margin: 124-120.

I guess we win in both sports. Ouch for Cougs!!

Crimson Club | 8:20 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

Cougs Fan,

In FOOTBALL Utah leads the football series: 52-33-4.

Ouch again, for the Cougs!

Go Aggies | 10:55 p.m. Dec. 2, 2008

The Spectrum awaits byu on Saturday in Salt Lake since Coach Rose is too afraid of Logan.
Fear the Aggies!

RE: 1944 & 1951 | 9:07 a.m. | 12:49 a.m. Dec. 3, 2008

"BYU's 1951 NIT championship is every bit as meaningful as Utah's 1944 NCAA championship, in fact, probably more so."

No bones about it--BYU's WAS more meaningful. You didn't even need to write the rest of your post--all you could have done was noted that the prestige of these tournaments was reversed during this time period.

In other words: In the '40s and '50s, teams WANTED to get into the NIT and go to New York to play in Madison Square Garden. THAT was their primary goal. The NCAA tourney was where they went when they couldn't make the NIT.

I believe the momentum shifted when UCLA became a national hoops powerhouse in the '60s and '70s, hosted by the NCAA tourney. TV sports also helped turn the tide as the broadcasts helped build the Bruins' mystique.

So in a nutshell--BYU's NIT trophy came in the more acclaimed tournament at that time.

To Reality 5:19 p.m. | 7:22 a.m. Dec. 3, 2008

"Utah accepts around 60% of applicants. BYU accepts almost 80% of people who applied for admission. Not very selective."

In 2008, BYU's admittance rate was 68% and has been dropping every year. In 2007 (could not locate 2008 info on the U), Utah's admittance rate was 86%. As you said, "not very selective".

BYU's 2008 new freshman average ACT and GPA were 28 and 3.8, respectively, and have both been trending up over time. Utah's in 2007 were 24 and 3.5, with the average ACT score the same as it was in 2002. Flat.

Rationalize the high matriculation rate any way you want, but the fact remains when someone is admitted to BYU, they go there. When someone is admitted to the U, well, there are other choices after all.

I don't know where you are getting your facts. I wonder if your other figures are as "reliable". If I had the time or inclination, I am sure I could clear things up in the other areas as well.

I'm glad I can enlighten.

To: To Reality | 7:38 a.m. Dec. 3, 2008

Nice made up facts and figures. Sounds like someone hit your grumpy nerve.

Truth is, Utah has always been more selective than BYU. Our endowment dwarfs BYU's. Our research facilities, Noble Award winning professors, undergradate programs and facilities are head and shoulders above BYU's.

Also, the truth is that in the basketball and football all-time series, the Utes lead BYU in both. You can't even compare the athletics either, we dominate them as well.

Have fun watching us play (in the BCS) on National Television. Maybe that will cheer you up.

Everyone | 7:38 a.m. Dec. 3, 2008

You all should quite bickering and just cheer for the only real basketball program in the state, USU. Go Aggies!

Stanford Grad | 8:26 a.m. Dec. 3, 2008

To Reality,

I graduated from Stanford in 1987. I have lived in Utah ever since. I enjoy watching both the U and BYU's programs when they are doing well.

However, I have to tell you that BYU's endowment and academics are not that impressive. Compare your statistics to Stanford.

Stanford accepts around 5-7% of students who apply. Our endowment is 18 billion dollars (yes, $18,000,000,000). BYU's 280 million endowment is not impressive. Neither is Utah's 610 million endowment.

With that said, I can tell with certainty that, outside of Utah, The U has a better academic reputation than BYU. BYU's issues with academic freedom are well known.

I will be watching both bowl games this year and wish BYU and Utah much luck!!

Stanford Graduate | 9:20 a.m. Dec. 3, 2008

To: To Reality,

I graduated from Stanford in 1987. I have lived in Utah ever since. I really enjoy watching both the U and BYU's programs when they are doing well.

I have to tell you that BYU's academics and endowment are not that impressive. Compare your statistics to Stanford.

Stanford accepts around 5-7% of students who apply. Our endowment is 18 billion dollars (yes, $18,000,000,000). BYU's 280 million endowment is not impressive. Neither is Utah's 610 million endowment.

With that said, I can tell with certainty that, outside of Utah, the U has a better academic reputation than BYU.

Good luck in your bowls BYU and Utah. I will be watching.

To To Reality 7:38am | 5:19 p.m. Dec. 3, 2008

"Nice made up facts and figures".

Just do the internet searches and you'll find it for yourselves at Utah, BYU, and Princeton review websites.

You did not even address my data which, if the sites are accurate, are indeed real. Deal with it and quit trying to change the subject you yourself brought up.

The HS GPA and Test Score info are indisputable if you'll spend 5 minutes looking them up, as is the acceptance/admittance data.

Your earlier comment about law schools also prompted a little search ("top law schools") I encourage you to confirm the information yourself. It shows that:

BYU Law school is ranked #46, Utah at #51. BYU's Law School GPA at #13, Utah at #49. BYU's LSAT scores at #25, Utah at #74. Where Utah finally wins is at Student/Teacher ratio at #8, BYU at #102.

Neither Businessweek nor US News ranks the U Business School, while BYU comes in at #22 and #29, respectively.

No go and make up your own numbers or change the subject, as you wish.

To our Stanford friend, your Law School is at #2, and Bus School at #6 in the same reports. Congrats.

It was all Majerus | 5:25 p.m. Dec. 3, 2008

In the 46 years since the creation of the WAC in 1963 through 2008 in the MWC, Utah Mens BBall has won or shared the league championship 16 times. During that same time period, BYU has won or shared it - yes - 16 times.

The difference is that 10 of Utah's championships were with Majerus. That gives non-Majerus Utah 6 championships in the remaining 31 years. Not very good.

You are all Majerus. Without him, you are UTEP.

WACOUG | 11:39 p.m. Jan. 24, 2009

I can't believe the one Ute here who didn't realize that the standards to get into BYU are much tougher than they are for Utah. 28 on the ACT compared to 24--That is HUGE for the ACT. 3.8 GPA compared to 3.5. The numbers are available all over the place. As far as football...hey, look at it this way. BYU has more 11 win or better seasons since Lavell LEFT than Utah has in HISTORY. No doubt, 04 and 08 were great. Other than that, Utah is very mediocre, with a measley 5 top 25 finsihes in history. BYU has to go back, what, to 1996 for their last 5 top 25 finishes.

Nice commentary on the NIT and NCAA tourneys in the 40's and 50's. Any bball fan knows that the NCAA was the secondary tournament until the mid to late 50's. Utah does have a legit bball Natl. title though, because they won the NIT in 1947. Their '44 NCAA title is about as good as BYU's '66 NIT title (BY then, the NCAA had become the superior tourney).

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