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Utah Jazz swat Shaq, dash past Phoenix
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magnus | 6:05 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
Whoa there Jimmy Z, slow down there. You're jumping form A to K and
skipping the rest of the steps in there. I do think Sloan is a great coach and
I do not believe the Jazz need to go in a different direction, as far as I am
concerned Sloan has Tenure and he should be done being the coach of the Utah
Jazz when he decides he doesn't want to be the coach any more, and not
before then.
However, that does not mean that I am blind to his faults. Usually I am ok with the way he develops young talent because the guys ahead of them can get the job done and if they survive the Sloan tough love years they come out excellent, well rounded players. I think that the young guys can give us everything Collins gives us right now and more. Sloans ideal of putting experience and trust over talent and potential, which I usually think is a good thing, is hurting the Jazz right now and will hurt them more down the road because the guy with the experience and trust is simply one of the worst players in the league.
However, that does not mean that I am blind to his faults. Usually I am ok with the way he develops young talent because the guys ahead of them can get the job done and if they survive the Sloan tough love years they come out excellent, well rounded players. I think that the young guys can give us everything Collins gives us right now and more. Sloans ideal of putting experience and trust over talent and potential, which I usually think is a good thing, is hurting the Jazz right now and will hurt them more down the road because the guy with the experience and trust is simply one of the worst players in the league.
Jazzsmack | 6:22 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
RE: MAGNUS
Yo not being over critical.
But you are finally coming to realization the rest of us have already come to.
Sloan does not give his young players the game time experience they need, and hence many of them never really develop and end up being traded off, not protected, or they leave as free agents.
Notice the ones young that got extrensive playing time in the first couple of years are still around like deron, brewer, AK, collins,
The only way you can develop is by get getting playing time.
It's either that or you must be already great like stockton and willing to wait your turn.
Yo not being over critical.
But you are finally coming to realization the rest of us have already come to.
Sloan does not give his young players the game time experience they need, and hence many of them never really develop and end up being traded off, not protected, or they leave as free agents.
Notice the ones young that got extrensive playing time in the first couple of years are still around like deron, brewer, AK, collins,
The only way you can develop is by get getting playing time.
It's either that or you must be already great like stockton and willing to wait your turn.
Comments continue below
Jimmy's Undies | 6:27 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
Jimmy thinks that CJ will have 3 or 4 bad games now!
Dan Tanna | 8:18 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
Koufos is the future of this team!
KDB | 8:41 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
Miles is the best Player on this team!
Miller Metric | 9:01 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
According to the Trib this is how the Jazz evaluate players.
"The Jazz use a formula devised by owner Larry Miller to evaluate NBA players' value.
How the Metric is determined: Add points, rebounds, steals, blocks and assists. Subtract fouls, turnovers and shots taken. Divide by minutes played.
Against Phoenix:
Boozer .629
Knight .619
Kirilenko .545
Miles .320
Korver .261
Harpring .250
Brewer .200
Millsap .185
Price .037
Collins -.364
Koufos -.600 "
Assuming the Trib is accurate, this approach is so fouled up it is laughable other than real decisions may actually be based on it.
Just a few ideas. 1. there are such things as smart fouls. 2. every shot taken = minus one point. This approach creates a very distorted understanding the contribution of each player and thier relative contribution to the team. It penalizes good shooters and inflates poor shooters.
If Sloan is really using this formula that explains a lot of really questionable decisions.
The Jazz need to get out of the "rule of thumb" dark ages and evaluate using a decent statistical approach that captures reality. The Jazz will never be champions with this evaluation approach.
"The Jazz use a formula devised by owner Larry Miller to evaluate NBA players' value.
How the Metric is determined: Add points, rebounds, steals, blocks and assists. Subtract fouls, turnovers and shots taken. Divide by minutes played.
Against Phoenix:
Boozer .629
Knight .619
Kirilenko .545
Miles .320
Korver .261
Harpring .250
Brewer .200
Millsap .185
Price .037
Collins -.364
Koufos -.600 "
Assuming the Trib is accurate, this approach is so fouled up it is laughable other than real decisions may actually be based on it.
Just a few ideas. 1. there are such things as smart fouls. 2. every shot taken = minus one point. This approach creates a very distorted understanding the contribution of each player and thier relative contribution to the team. It penalizes good shooters and inflates poor shooters.
If Sloan is really using this formula that explains a lot of really questionable decisions.
The Jazz need to get out of the "rule of thumb" dark ages and evaluate using a decent statistical approach that captures reality. The Jazz will never be champions with this evaluation approach.
More on the MM | 9:15 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
If the Jazz are really using the Miller Metric they are rewarding the wrong
players with money and playing time and penalizing the wrong players with less
time and money.
With this evaluation system, rebounds, steals, blocks, assists, fouls, turnovers and shots taken are all each worth 1 point. Nothing could be further from the truth.
This evaluation system will cause the Jazz to be a lot less efficient on both offense and defense than they could be if they were properly evaluated. Besides it does little to capture defensive efficency which is better captured by how many points the other team scores.
I have a hard time believing the Jazz are so mismanaged. I am not sure where the Trib got it's info.
With this evaluation system, rebounds, steals, blocks, assists, fouls, turnovers and shots taken are all each worth 1 point. Nothing could be further from the truth.
This evaluation system will cause the Jazz to be a lot less efficient on both offense and defense than they could be if they were properly evaluated. Besides it does little to capture defensive efficency which is better captured by how many points the other team scores.
I have a hard time believing the Jazz are so mismanaged. I am not sure where the Trib got it's info.
Anonymous | 9:40 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
I can't believe that Sap at the end of the list, are you kidding me, the
other thing the block that Kofos take against Amare wasn't a foul, it was a
clean block, so that would screw the gut stats up.
I'm really happy with the way Kofos is playing, and he is the future for the Jazz, now we have a good three blocker (AK, Sap and kofos)
For people who bashing Sloan, I agree he does mistakes sometimes, but other teams envy him for the system he runs in Jazz, some of the players are in the team won't shine the same way if they don't play for the Jazz, because everybody shares the ball and look at Bravin Knight.
I'm really happy with the way Kofos is playing, and he is the future for the Jazz, now we have a good three blocker (AK, Sap and kofos)
For people who bashing Sloan, I agree he does mistakes sometimes, but other teams envy him for the system he runs in Jazz, some of the players are in the team won't shine the same way if they don't play for the Jazz, because everybody shares the ball and look at Bravin Knight.
Neg comments must be SOC | 10:21 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
I am not sure what is going on in regards to the negative and in some cases
absolutely dumb azz comments on this board. Someone mentioned the RSL fans were
kind of in a backlash mode. I dunno........ be greatful there are a couple of
pro sports franchizes around SLC. Being bitter over who gets all the attention
in the paper, on the news, on the radio......... come on. Soccer is lucky to
even have a foothold in the U.S.. If they keep on keepin' on Soccer may
one day have a product they can sell to the masses here in the states. Nascar,
pro wrestling, and even MMA probably draw more than MLS.
The Utah Jazz own the Utah market and rightfully so. An excellent product and model franchize have been our good fortune for 20+ years. I find it quite exciting to see the Jazz going thru the injuries and still being in games. The playoffs are months away and this team will grow and gel when it really matters.
The Utah Jazz own the Utah market and rightfully so. An excellent product and model franchize have been our good fortune for 20+ years. I find it quite exciting to see the Jazz going thru the injuries and still being in games. The playoffs are months away and this team will grow and gel when it really matters.
D-Will forever | 10:27 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
the Jazz are easily in the top 5 five teams in the NBA the just need to get a
few road wins. They have a very good PG and an perfect forward in Booz they just
need to play there A game and they will be beatable. I am looking forward to one
heck of a season and a long playoff run that will hopfull end up in the finals.
Go Jazz
Seattle???? | 11:34 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
The Jazz just might go to Seattle, who knows. However, their heart would be left
in SLC because SLC is where they got "heart". Not a good suggestion.
Why even bring it up. Why I have been hearing that Utah's economy is not
all that bad. Hope the dip in the car business does not hurt LHM and the Jazz.
His Japaneese car sales might be what keeps feeding the hopper. We need the Jazz
in SLC. GO JAZZ!!!
Jimmy Z | 11:52 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
Jimmy Z says : Jerry when you have a player that
is hot leave him on the court and let him play ball.
I remember when Horny used to get hot and would
score 15 in quarter and then he be at the end
of the bench. Forget about the rotation, when you
you have a guy shooting the lights out. Brevin Knight,was delightful to watch against Phoenix
he showed that he is very very smart player and
can hit the 15 wide open jumper on the double team.
AK,Millsap, and Booze played fantastic. CJ I have
to admit played very well except for a few defensive
lapses when the former GS star number 22 burned him
for a few backdoor layins.But, overall the Jazz had
a good effort.
is hot leave him on the court and let him play ball.
I remember when Horny used to get hot and would
score 15 in quarter and then he be at the end
of the bench. Forget about the rotation, when you
you have a guy shooting the lights out. Brevin Knight,was delightful to watch against Phoenix
he showed that he is very very smart player and
can hit the 15 wide open jumper on the double team.
AK,Millsap, and Booze played fantastic. CJ I have
to admit played very well except for a few defensive
lapses when the former GS star number 22 burned him
for a few backdoor layins.But, overall the Jazz had
a good effort.
WP48 | 11:53 p.m. Nov. 18, 2008
I ran the short version of wp 48 for Collins, Koufos, Price and CJ for games
played so far. CJ and Koufos are making a big positive contribution (CJ barely
ahead), Price is making a slightly positive contribution and Collins is making a
negative contribution so far.
In fairness to Collins, he has been hurt and the short version may not pick up on the total effect he has on the team. Collins may make the other players better because he understands the system. As Sloan said "Price is still learning to play PG". As long as we win I am okay with Price learning. He is needed right now anyway and may be needed again in the future.
The key point is that CJ and Koufos based on total games played are at least average NBA players in spite of a lack of experience.
We need Koufos down the stretch and in the playoffs against the big tall teams. I hope he is developed as fast as possible.
SAP is playing about 50% better than CJ and Koufos based on wp48 scores to this point.
In fairness to Collins, he has been hurt and the short version may not pick up on the total effect he has on the team. Collins may make the other players better because he understands the system. As Sloan said "Price is still learning to play PG". As long as we win I am okay with Price learning. He is needed right now anyway and may be needed again in the future.
The key point is that CJ and Koufos based on total games played are at least average NBA players in spite of a lack of experience.
We need Koufos down the stretch and in the playoffs against the big tall teams. I hope he is developed as fast as possible.
SAP is playing about 50% better than CJ and Koufos based on wp48 scores to this point.
re: Seattle Jazzed | 12:01 a.m. Nov. 19, 2008
Most "Utahans"? First of all, learn to spell. Secondly, everybody
cares. We love the Jazz, so why don't you just move yourself to Seattle.
Nobody will care. The Jazz have been here 30 years, and will be here for the
rest of our lifetimes. GO JAZZ!
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something here with your comments. Thank YOU this
is the type of problem Jerry has had for years.
Thanks for posting your comments. Very well said.
Jimmy Z has said for years find a new guy at the
helm