Sign critical of LDS destroyed by fire

Homeowner blames a 'small-minded individual' for blaze


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  • Re: TicketHolder
    Dec. 10, 2008 7:04 p.m.

    RE:TicketHolder | 8:40 p.m. Nov. 13, 2008
    How is this even newsworthy?

    This maybe doesn't seem like the most newsworthy event, however, when the rights of the people are in danger (especially on something so fundamental and critical to our country and freedom) I would call that newsworthy.

    ps. Maybe they forgot to put their hammer away. Maybe they were just making a point. Maybe they were trying to frame their opponent, etc... You are jumping to conclusions.

  • Info man
    Nov. 15, 2008 2:48 a.m.

    The separation between church and state was intended to keep governmental infiltration and control out of churches. It was never intended by our founders to keep God and his commandments out of the government. Our laws are based on Judeo-Christian values. The Ten commandments have been part of and influenced our nations values since it's beginning. Our belief in a Supreme Creator and our trust in His guidance is so valuable to our nation that we printed it on our own money.
    We live in a day that our constitution hangs as a thread. We cannot allow secular progressives to continue to change our country to their idea of what America should be. Judges who legislate from the bench are overriding the rights of the moral majority. We need to stand together to protect the ideals and values of a country that was founded by men who were guided by a supreme being, who were divinely inspired to Declare our Independence and write our Constitution. If we do not fight and defend our freedoms we will loose them. We may be taken over from within.
    Don't buy into the big lie that takes God out of our great democracy.

  • Norie
    Nov. 15, 2008 12:27 a.m.

    i dont know why everyone's targettng the LDS church I'm pretty sure 53% of the californian population IS NOT LDS. It was clearly a widely and deeply felt issue. IT seems to me the LDS church was encouraging its members to exercise their democratic right to stand up and educate their peers on important issues. Its far too easy to pick on the LDS church. Vandalism of anyone is not acceptable regardless of which viewpoint you agree with

  • mom of five
    Nov. 14, 2008 10:08 p.m.

    I am saddened to know that my children are watching our voting process in America. If the majority votes win and the out come is not the way you wanted, you have the right to throw temper tantrums, vandalize property, tattle tale to the media, and basically whine ,complain, and cry until you get your way.I also want to add name calling. I have to explain to my children that adults do not always act like adults,sometimes they act like three year olds. Grow up and except that the majority ruled.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:35 p.m.

    IF we are going to discuss this.... try to keep race out of it.

    Gay's are not a race.
    it's a group of people with common feelings.

    weather i agree with it or not. does not make me a racist or not.

  • Linda
    Nov. 14, 2008 8:42 p.m.

    Iman AND vegas jeff: having different views from other people is fine but it is not fine when these differences turn into any type of hate crime. Believing in God does not make anyone a SIMPLE minded or an uneducated person.FYI

  • To Anonymous 2:25
    Nov. 14, 2008 5:45 p.m.

    You can worship whatever God you want and if you believe he is agreeable to same-sex marriage, more power to you. That doesn't mean I can't vote the way I see fit. That has nothing to do with how you worship.

  • You can't make me agree
    Nov. 14, 2008 5:31 p.m.

    Dear Jeremy,

    Please remember that many Christians and most Mormons don't believe people are born gay. We all are born with tendencies that are shaped by our choices and environments. While I have TREMENDOUS sympathy for gay people, I do not condone their actions, just as I don't condone the actions of liars, thieves, adulterers, abusers, etc. I know that sounds harsh but like I said, many of us think this behavior is a sin. I myself am not perfect so I would never cast a stone at another. Just understand that we will never accept this behavor as normal; that's why we can't be for same-sex marriage. I will never accept abortion, euthanasia, or same-sex marriage. I don't hate people because of their beliefs but I will not be forced to accept them either.

  • L. R. Clayton
    Nov. 14, 2008 4:31 p.m.

    It is always the extreme actions of the few that make the news. I believe that in reality the vast majority of people on both sides of this argument have been calm, civil, non-violent and respectful, it's just that you don't hear about those people in the news.

    LDS members have every right to campaign for what they believe in and those who disagree have every right to voice their opinions as well.

    I was alarmed to see that a different story on desnews had to have it's comments closed because there were threats being made in the comments.

    I hope that people on both sides will come to understand that everybody is entitled to voice their opinion without being subjected to threats, violence or property damage.

  • Equal? Des News? What up, G?
    Nov. 14, 2008 4:16 p.m.

    So, there were too many crimes against Yes on 8 signs to even make the news, I guess.

    But, one guy gets his sign burned and gets his OWN story.


  • Freedom of speech is sacred
    Nov. 14, 2008 3:42 p.m.

    Freedom of speech is sacred. Let's respect it, defend it, and exercise extreme care and thoughtfulness in how we personally use it.

  • Howard Stucki
    Nov. 14, 2008 3:06 p.m.

    To say that churches can't be involved in the political process is absurd. They as an entity
    and as individual members are as viable in the
    political process as anyone or any other entity
    or organization. And as far as a legislating
    morality; our whole legal system and laws are
    all based on morality. Is it moral or immoral to
    steal from someone? Is it moral or immoral to
    kill someone? Get the point. All our laws are
    based on morality.

  • re: Anonymous 2:25pm
    Nov. 14, 2008 3:04 p.m.

    We will, but we also will expect you to follow the 12th article of faith (can't pick and choose - all or none)

    12 We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

    Most interpret that the laws of this country always denied gay marriage, squeeky wheels allowed the courts to trample on this interpretation. And how does this country work - it allows the people to vote on clarifications and after proposition 8 passed it is now more clearly defined that in California it is against the law.

    At no point has someone stated that you can't worship your God how you choose. But being married isn't how people worship their God. It is how they religiously commit to someone on this earth. Not to their God. If someone stayed single all their life because they didn't find the right partner they are no less capable of worshipping their God than someone who is married.

  • John Pack Lambert
    Nov. 14, 2008 2:54 p.m.

    To the 10:23 commentator,
    I felt the statement about the sticker on the door was given to indicate that the signs were probably posted by a resident of the house. Placing signs in front of someone else's house is not an unheard of action.

  • when i find my self
    Nov. 14, 2008 2:37 p.m.

    in times of trouble...well you know the rest!

  • Contention
    Nov. 14, 2008 2:28 p.m.

    the LDS church was forced clear out of the country by bigots and yet we were allowed to grow and thrive. if we don't learn the lessons of history and maybe more to the point the lessons we teach in church on sunday, what kind of a world are we creating. God gave us agency for a reason and when we seek to take agency from one person we risk our own. I personnally don't care how you define marriage but when we create systemic obstructions to equal protection under the law for all our citizens we have to ask what happens when we are the persecuted. the love christ asks of us is simple and pure and offers no option for bigotry.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 14, 2008 2:25 p.m.

    Allow me the right to follow your 11th article of faith:
    We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.

    My God allows for gay marriage. Why won't you allow me to practice my beliefs?

  • Emma
    Nov. 14, 2008 2:23 p.m.

    After reading many of these comments, I am not surprised that the FBI reports a 6% increase in violent acts against homosexuals and a decline in all other hate related crimes.

  • Brian
    Nov. 14, 2008 2:17 p.m.

    Here's what is great. WHen Bergstrom wants his signs up, it is free speech. When the church shares its view on marriage, it is hate-speech.

    Pick a side.

  • Alex
    Nov. 14, 2008 1:53 p.m.

    Let us not hyperventilate over this violation. One day we might look back to these as the good ole days when all they did to us is deface some of our property and burn signs. This sign burning isn't worth getting exercised about. Move along.

  • religion vs. society
    Nov. 14, 2008 1:50 p.m.

    The problem with people using religion as the basis for opinion on this subject is that those not of said religion can't or don't follow the same thought patterns and won't see or accept your point of view. I myself am against gay marriage on the level of it being bad for society as a whole. If you disagree with me than just look at what has been going on lately in Sweden or any of the other Northern European countries that have legalized gay marriage and really all other forms of partnerships, aka. plural wives, husbands, multiples of both, etc. Do some research on them and see if the results of those policies are what you want here. Unfortunatley, I don't think anyone of the anti-prop 8 persuasion will be willing to accept the evidence as it is presented. One of the great (sarcastic) things of human nature is that we tend only to accept evidence that supports our point of view and throw out all other evidence as false.

  • Re; Inside info
    Nov. 14, 2008 1:32 p.m.

    You know this how?

  • Inside Info
    Nov. 14, 2008 1:11 p.m.

    Could be attacked for sharing this, but the owner of the signs did the damage.

  • Thorne
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:55 p.m.

    Yes, churches should stay out of politics, except when governments take on inherently religious issues such as marriage..

  • IMAN
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:38 p.m.

    RE: Linda

    It is "Just that simple" for you as you view this issue through your dogma. Other view the issue differently. What I find simple is how YOU view things.

  • Scott @9:58
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:38 p.m.

    Scott- thank you! Very good post, I think the LDS faith is just th prominent face involved in the argument in this area, thus the easiest target.

    I remmeber hearing the other morning of a Book of Mormon being burned at a temple, where was Mr' Free Speech in this case? Why was that not condemned by the gay advocates as a violation of their beloved "free speech for all policy?"
    Because they agreed with it- talk about hypocrisy!

  • hbg41
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:37 p.m.

    Does anyone know if this should be classified as a hate crime?

  • understanding
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:22 p.m.

    The separation of church and state clause in our constitution was put in place to prevent the government from controlling the church like it had in England (The Church of England). It was not put in place to prevent religious thoughts, symbols or morals from becoming part of the laws voted on by the people for the people.

    Our country's first laws were based on the 10 commandments and our fore fathers were very religious God fearing people. If our fore fathers were allowed to influence the government under these same premises why can't people today do the same?

    I like the statistics above from Scott-I did some brief fact finding and see them to be sound approximations.

    Also if religion is not supposed to be a part of all this conversation then why are we discussing the question on whether Gays can marry? Marriage is a religious institution that over time added elements of a civil contract. This civil contract provides rights/responsibilities to the individuals. Check in on the religious aspects of a Catholic or Mormon marriage and you'll see that they recognize the civil license and the religious ceremony as separate entities. Other religions may be similar.

  • NigelUK
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:12 p.m.

    "There is beauty all around when there's love at home."
    Attack the structure not the individual. A little more love, a little more tolerance, please.

  • Michael
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:05 p.m.

    Why do gay people demand that religious people should stay out of politics? In a way, the philosophy held by many gays is its own secular religion. But we don't insist that they stay out of politics.

    Many of their political beliefs derive from their sexual preference, some of mine derive from a belief in God. Why should I confine mine to a pulpit while they are free to voice theirs in the public sphere?

  • wayne
    Nov. 14, 2008 11:49 a.m.

    does anyone think the owner of the sign started it on fire? would be a great way to get some press time.

  • re: Linda
    Nov. 14, 2008 11:40 a.m.

    "I find it so sad that some would blame the Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints for what the people voted on. Marriage between a man and a woman is ordained by God. It is just that simple. Clearly all this anger and hatefulness is not the way to go about a disagreement with a law and comes from a source that is not of God. "

    Some people don't believe in your God. Some people don't believe in any God. This is their society as well as yours.

    If you lived in the middle east you might understand the problems of having a "God-based" government. But then of course, you have the "true" religion and they don't.

  • re: v
    Nov. 14, 2008 11:17 a.m.

    "Why is this a religious issue. I'm not religious at all but I can still figure out that gay marriage is wrong for society."

    Why is this a black/white issue. I'm not black at all but I can still figure out that inter-racial marriage is wrong for society.

  • re: This is why
    Nov. 14, 2008 11:13 a.m.

    "How dare you protest at a place of worship!!"

    As an LDS person who voted against prop 8, my ward building has not been a place of worship for about 4 months. It has been prop 8 headquarters.

    Our first three testimonies at our lsat fast and testimony meeting were all about prop 8. Couldn't tell you how many more, as I had to leave.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 14, 2008 10:31 a.m.

    "I do not agree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it." - Voltaire

  • bam0612
    Nov. 14, 2008 10:30 a.m.

    gus and matthew... thank you. you are the example i want to show my children. you are grown adults and are able to agree to disagree without name calling and violence. i appreciate your example.

    if we all believe in "a" god, and that god loves everyone, gay or straight, then why are we -both sides- so mean to each other? please, let's set a better example for our children.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 14, 2008 10:23 a.m.

    This is unprofessional biased Journalism. You mentioned twice the beer cans everywhere---which had absolutely no relevance...as well as the got satan sticker. How was any of that relevant to the story---in which someone set fire to something which could easily have spread to a house and killed people. Maybe the person who wrote the article was the one who set the sign on fire.

  • deseretnews.com moderator
    Nov. 14, 2008 10:18 a.m.

    In addition to our stated rules, any comments containing threats or references to violence of any kind will not be posted. If the trend continues, all comments will be barred from this story.

  • Free Speech for 1 side?
    Nov. 14, 2008 10:16 a.m.

    "obviously done by a small-minded individual with no concept of freedom of speech."

    I love that quote. Is this not the exact same thing the Church and it's members exercised in supporting Prop8. Free Speech.

  • Fall of Rome
    Nov. 14, 2008 10:00 a.m.

    @CougarKeith -I don't know where you got the idea that Rome or Greece practiced same-gender marriage. Also, homosexuality did not bring about the fall of Rome.

    Here is what is accepted as the reasons for the fall of the Roman Republic:

    Internal turmoil provoked in 133 BC by economic stagnation in the city of Rome, slave revolts without and dissension in the military precipitated a period of unrelenting political upheaval known as the Roman Revolution, the Late Roman Republic, or the Fall of the Republic. In essence, the republic system of government underwent a painful and violent transition from irresponsible oligarchy to a more accountable autocratic form of government. It is possible to discern a pattern in the devolution of legal, constitutional authority in the Republic and to identify FOUR steps to the collapse of Republican authority.


  • Bob
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:59 a.m.

    It is not worth your freedom to damage someones property. If you are a young person, wake up to what is right and wrong and learn how someones property is sacred. How much blood has been spilled for this individuals free speech? It is sacred and to be protected. If you are an adult, you missed something somewhere in your life. Think long and hard and get some help. I hope you will be held accountable for this and it will be a benefit to you. If you are not held accountable by the law I pray that you will repent and ask forgivness of this person you wronged.

  • Scott
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:58 a.m.

    It's ironic the sign holder talks of "small minded people with no concept of free speach". Not quick to take a side, I wanted some info on what effect mormon's had on the vote. My research indicates that: Mormons make up less than 2% of the population of California. There are approximately 800,000 LDS out of a total population of approximately 34 million. Mormon voters were less than 5% of the yes vote. If one estimates that 250,000 LDS are registered voters (the rest being children), then LDS voters made up 4.6% of the Yes vote and 2.4% of the total Proposition 8 vote. In fact, if Mormon's didn't vote at all the vote would have still passed.

    The rest of the 97.6% of the people that voted yes were Catholic, Jewish, Buddhist, Black, Hispanic, Athiests, and anyone who exercised their right to VOTE however they so choose. The gays lost, yet they can't accept it and are quick to single out the mormons.

    This coming from a beer drinking non-mormon who is tired of the gay/lesbian lobby being intolerant of other's beliefs--when what they are asking is for others to be tolerant of theirs.

  • This is why
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:49 a.m.

    people who don't have stong feelings, now do. You lost get over it. How dare you protest at a place of worship!! Have you no shame?! The church didn't violate the "seperation of church and state". The LDS church is not trying to become a part of the government. There is nothing illegal with any organization letting it's member know where the head stands. Imagine if the IRA took a stand on this issue, would you call them out? Maybe you should try to imagine the LDS church as a straight organization and you might get it. This is what is wrong with our justice system, how much does a sign cost? Especially a handmade sign? $2 maybe $5. The court costs for the lawsuit will be like $800, maybe more. I sure hope my tax $$ is wasted on a frivolous lawsuit. It was probably dumb high school kids that wanted to burn something and saw the sign and had an oportunity to do it. Who didn't do stupid things like that in high school? Grow up this is a non-story, how about we make them a new sign instead of have it go to court?

  • vegas jeff
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:42 a.m.

    linda,ordained by god? i worry about folks like you ,just cannot think for yourself .the bible, book of mormon ,koran ,all writtin by man to control man and it has worked on you.educate yourself

  • Separation Church & State
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:40 a.m.

    The statement from the article,"we have a secular government and in order for it to continue to protect our constitutional rights churches must not take an active role in politics," is simplistic and ridiculous! Separation of Church and State does not mean that a church can't weigh in on political issues of moral importance, especially if the law can have future ramifications on judicial interpretations of laws that can affect the churches members and their freedom of religion. That would be inexcusable of them not to act. That is what is expected of the churches leaders. What if there was a proposition that you believed was unfair toward the gay population and a church spoke out against that proposition. Would that be acceptable? Wouldn't it hold extra weight coming from a church on a moral issue? Sorry, but you have to allow churches to weigh in on political topics otherwise religious people don't have anyone advocating for them. There are a lot of not-for-profit organizations that give their opinions on issues in the community. Why should churches be any different if the law applies directly to them and could have legal ramifications in the future.

  • Giveaway?
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:38 a.m.

    Does the fact that beer bottles were strewn about the yard reveal anything? What LDS goes around swigging beer, littering yards, and burning signs? Someone please save us from the assininity of it all.

  • wamba
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:32 a.m.

    I'm betting it was a young person who did this. One of those teenagers that walks the neighborhood at night with their friends and feels personally insulted because someone said something against their church, and doesn't know how to respond like a mature adult. They probably had no idea their actions would do a million times more damage to the church than a silly yard sign.

    Whoever burned the sign needs to come forward, admit to it, apologize, and accept the consequences.

  • Rich
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:09 a.m.

    As a proponent of Proposition 8, I am also a huge supporter of free speech. A person should be allowed to place opinion signs on his or her property, and he should have the right to wear badges or T shirts that say, "Gays are deviant," "Giving in to homosexual urges is a sin," "You aren't born gay, you choose your sexual preference," and "Gay marriage jeopardizes society." Should teachers be allowed to teach such things? Should newspapers be allowed to write such things? Don't forget that the gay coalition did not want Dr. Laura to have free speech because she did not think gay sex was healthful or normal. They forced her off TV. I think I'll start a mini-boycott of my own. From now on I won't buy or watch anything produced by anybody who is pushing the gay agenda. Elton John, Ellen, Rosie and the rest of you, goodbye.

  • pepperoma
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:05 a.m.

    I find it interesting that there are many, many stories about GLBT protests and boycotts and letters and everything. If I look really hard, I find the occasional story about "Somebody's anti-LDS or anti-Prop 8 sign got stolen or vandalized."

    For the most part, the retaliation against the retaliation has been minimal to non-existent. I'm very glad for that.

    I disagree with homosexuality/SSM. I also disagree with people who feel the need to vandalize anything or persecute anyone who does not agree with them. I rather firmly believe people do not have to agree in order to get along.

    Just my 2 cents' worth.

  • Hate Crime
    Nov. 14, 2008 9:04 a.m.

    Call the ACLU

  • I think we can all agree...
    Nov. 14, 2008 8:59 a.m.

    I think we can all agree that this sort of behavior should be condemned and discouraged. It doesn't seem likely at this point that we will ever know who did it, and I don't think it does any good to throw around unfounded accusations. To anyone, from either side, even considering doing something like this: DON'T. This will only provoke an escalated response, and we don't want a repeat of Haun's Mill.

  • Jake
    Nov. 14, 2008 8:38 a.m.

    "[W]e simply want the church to keep their ideas of morality on the pulpit and not in legislation."

    In other words, "We don't want the Church to practice what it preaches. That's just not fair."

  • stupid
    Nov. 14, 2008 8:30 a.m.

    I am sick of this, gays are attacking the church and it is not a hate crime, however if something negative is said against gays then look out!

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 14, 2008 8:28 a.m.

    When property damage is inflicted on LDS churches, the LDS faithful bigots cry out "Look how horrible and intolerant the gay community is!"

    But when an LDS bigot burns these signs, they say "Don't blame the entire church for the behavior of one or two people!"

    Hypocrisy, thy name is Mormon!

  • Small Mindedness
    Nov. 14, 2008 8:19 a.m.

    So the guy who owned the house said the fire was "obviously done by a small-minded individual with no concept of freedom of speech." Obviously HE is the small minded one for posting such a childish sign like that in the first place.

  • Silly
    Nov. 14, 2008 8:02 a.m.

    A cheap cardstock sign goes up in smoke and it makes the news. Was there really nothing more important to cover?

    Hungry children? Elderly people in need? Lost employment? Something?

    (Incidentally, some kids rang my doorbell and ran away a few nights ago. It wasn't covered in your paper. Why not?)

  • funny
    Nov. 14, 2008 7:42 a.m.

    at a time when america is about to hit poverty and war can brake out. we are worried about some funny sign in some ones yard that got burn because a couple of teenagers just wanted to have some fun. waste of time.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 14, 2008 2:20 a.m.

    I'll bet he did it himself to get attention

  • Adam
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:47 a.m.

    One single sign critical of the LDS church is burned and it generates more news articles than all the articles ever written about the tens of thousands of 'Yes on Prop 8' signs that were vandalized before the election. Hmmm...

  • Government and Rights
    Nov. 14, 2008 12:33 a.m.

    Shame on those who burned and tore up the signs. But the question remains: Who gives rights? God. God gives rights. "All men are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights. . ." Government protects these. Ours is a representative government and has constitutional protections of the right of free speech. If those who are affected cannot speak, how are they to be represented? All individuals and organizations are affected by laws and judicial decisions. Governments are influenced by private individuals and public and private organizations all the time. Why, then, do those opponents of prop. 8 wish to silence, through intimidation, and lawsuits, the voice of opposition? Is this not a free land? Are we not all invited to come to the table to discuss the issues? If a group, religious or not, represented by their government is denied access to the political process, as the opponents of 8 would like, then we do not have a free country and the rights of all people are at risk. Religiosity of a participant in the political process has nothing to do with the issue. All groups should speak, and should be protected in their right to do so.

  • CougarKeith
    Nov. 13, 2008 11:22 p.m.

    I feel bad for the poster of the sign, and I feel worse for the burner of the sign. This is the kind of stuff that happened just before the fall of Sodom and Gomorah. Greece and Rome began the practice of Homosexual marriages and they soon fell. Here we are in America, the greatest nation in the history of the world, and what are we on the brink of? This is so sad, but the mainstream says, The Gay Community has rights! Sure they have rights, but the thing is this, they don't have the right to impose their will on the majority! Those who do not repent, and who are not prepared will suffer, even some of the righteous will suffer, but the good news is those who choose the right need not fear, those who have their food storage, need not fear, those with strong families need not fear, and those who "fear God" need not fear. Remember always who is in charge, and that all is in the hands of god. Always count your blessings, always know that God is in supreme control, and have faith. Always have faith and you will not fail.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 13, 2008 11:09 p.m.

    Way to be objective in your reporting, Deseret. Could you describe that sinful abode in any more graphic detail? That sounds almost as terrifying as any given street one could walk down in Salt Lake.

  • anon.
    Nov. 13, 2008 11:06 p.m.

    As a LDS member i say bring it on. How can we as members of the LDS church expect that standing up for what is right will be easy when it was never easy for our Savior who DIED FOR WHAT HE STOOD UP FOR. Get ready for the end of the world, and the opposition we WILL face. This issue and ones similar are what we can call a weeding out process; it will determine those who really believe what they say they do. All of this is predicted in the BIBLE, read the story of sodom gomora.

  • Where did they come from?
    Nov. 13, 2008 10:50 p.m.

    There are a lot of possiblities who the culprit(s) are, but these signs sounded like the types used to protest. You have to ask yourself how would someone get a hold of such signs? Would they make them just to burn? No, because burning them would destroy the words, so your point of LDS people having hate would be missed. Besides, these kind of crimes are usually not premeditated, they are impromptu. My guess is that protestors were looking for a way to get rid of the signs they had used the day before.

  • support of another comment
    Nov. 13, 2008 10:33 p.m.

    To"Another Comment" Thank you for your comments!

    I am proud to be an LDS and a faithful support of my Leaders. As a naturalized citizen of this great nation, I am proud of that too! It is heart broken to watch the Church been attacked but we will prevail.

  • To Danielle
    Nov. 13, 2008 9:57 p.m.

    It sounds like, in your opinion, Christians and Catholics are different than Mormons. And I thought Mormons claimed to be Christen... not by their actions in California and not by your own statement as a Mormon. Your church cannot have it both ways.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 13, 2008 9:33 p.m.

    These antis should have to to pay for the firemans time let alone shame they tries to put on LDS. This is sad.

  • v
    Nov. 13, 2008 9:00 p.m.

    Why is this a religious issue. I'm not religious at all but I can still figure out that gay marriage is wrong for society.

  • TicketHolder
    Nov. 13, 2008 8:40 p.m.

    How is this even newsworthy? We have a crushing economy, wars on 2 fronts, a newly elected president and the Des News is printing a story about a home made sign that was lit a blaze. The fire crew that was passing by didn't see anybody close to the scene. It's not like this thing could flame on for hours like a forest fire. Its duration would be seconds at best. Ironically the hammer was left in the front yard and nobody answered the door?? It doesn't take Sherlock Holmes, not even Larry Holmes, to tell you that the perpetrator lives at the house, didn't answer the door, and is trying to frame his LDS neighbors. Please print something news worthy. I am begging you. PLEASE

  • Chris
    Nov. 13, 2008 8:36 p.m.

    Why isn't all the anti-LDS stuff being called hate crimes? Like the death threats on the internet against Mormons, etc. If half of this protesting was being done to the gay community, or another "squeaky-wheel" group, the jails couldn't hold all the people the police would be bringing in!

  • Two wrongs do not make a right.
    Nov. 13, 2008 8:26 p.m.

    I am actually more disappointed in those who burned those signs, I would compare it to bombing abortion clinics. I am totally against gay marriage and find the behavior of the gay population very hateful and selfish. But I also find retaliation just as bad, what does that accomplish, but showing weakness to a weak group. Whoever did this needs to grow up.

  • Tuck
    Nov. 13, 2008 7:43 p.m.

    The beer bottles were remains from a party from the weekend that didn't get cleaned up. Think it's a hoax all you want; Feel free to talk to the people dropping off their kids at the school nearby that witnessed it.

  • 8th and C Street
    Nov. 13, 2008 7:37 p.m.

    Hoax. Antis trying to make us look bad. Shameful. Beer in the vicinity should tell you lds are not involved. Antis and non-members have no standards. You made yourselves look bad with this one.

  • Fox
    Nov. 13, 2008 7:17 p.m.

    Again this was not a staged event, and what does the fact that there are beer bottles or funny stickers on their door have to do with this hate crime.
    I find it shameful for the deseret new to try to assassinate the character of the people that live there, who are friends of mine and very good people.
    Sad to think that one of the people that live in that house is ex-military as well, poor guy put his live on the line for our right to the freedom of speech just to have someone burn it in his front yard.
    This was a Shameful act and even more shameful for the commenters who have called it a hoax and went about their day with their blinders firmly attached.

  • Linda
    Nov. 13, 2008 7:03 p.m.

    News Flash
    This specific disagreement has ended up in a hateful and angry manner. and that was the only thing I was referring to.Disagreement should be only that a disagreement, but when you factor in anger and hate you see the the awful lengths people will go to. I think you took my comment(on one incident) way out of context, and have assumed my outlook on the world is pitiful.

  • John Pack Lambert
    Nov. 13, 2008 6:59 p.m.

    The pest comment is from the 6:07 commentator.
    Why have there not been articles about all the vandalism and detruction of Yes on 8 and Yes on 102 and similar signs?
    I guess it is because the newspaper would turn into a sign vandalism register if that was the case. This sign burning is news because destruction of the antis signs are so rare.
    However, it is not even clear who put up the sign that burned , let alone who burned it.

  • Mom in MO
    Nov. 13, 2008 6:28 p.m.

    Bullies. They are grown up bullies. If you cross them, they will beat you up. So you'd better just agree with them now, and give up your lunch money, and save yourself a beating. Don't ever try to be yourself with your own opinions, because they will call you names and give you a hard time, the tolerant, loving bullies.

  • It Happens
    Nov. 13, 2008 6:07 p.m.

    My 80 year old mother's "Yes to Prop 102" sign in Arizona was ripped and thrown all over her yard 4 times before the election. She just kept taping it back together and putting it back in her yard.

  • Justin
    Nov. 13, 2008 6:05 p.m.

    A staged events to make LDS look bad. The beers should be a clue. Not only stupid but just plain tasteless. LDS memebers would never be involved in this action. Get over yourselves antis.

  • Another comment
    Nov. 13, 2008 5:31 p.m.

    Hope the Salt Lake police remember to add trespassing to the charges if they ever find these people. Also, what about malicious mischief, or intent to incite a riot or something. There should be plenty of good stuff to charge them with. Don't forget to watch the protesters too, if they set foot on private property - get em!

    By the way, I voted yes on 8, but couldn't afford to donate. However, two wrongs will never make a right. I urge all who believe in the yes vote to simmer down and let the out-of-control element in the protests shoot themselves in the foot.

    I am proud of my membership in the Church. It means a lot to me. I also became a citizen two presidential campaigns ago, and exercised my right to vote every time an election was held, and have been called to jury duty FOUR times in that time. I should not have to feel frightened because of the vote I cast, or simply because I am a member of any Church.

  • Just a comment
    Nov. 13, 2008 5:23 p.m.

    If it was an LDS person or persons who did this, shame on them. If it was not an LDS person, shame on them. If it was someone on the No on 8 side, shame on them.

    The pro 8 signs in California have pretty much vanished from sight now, and the no on 8 signs live on. Wonder where all the yes on 8 stolen and defaced signs ended up, besides the ones I constantly saw crumpled up in gutters? One trio of teenagers was caught in the act with 53 stolen yes signs in their car on one night.

    Oh, by the way, if the person(s) go on the lawn to burn signs, steal them, or deface them - an additional charge of trespassing on private property is applicable.

  • Matthew
    Nov. 13, 2008 4:57 p.m.

    News flash!
    Disagreement does not equal hate. I've had disagreements with my wife but I've never stopped loving her and I've certainly never hated her.

    How sad it must be to see the world through a lens where anyone that disagrees with you is interpreted as hateful. What a confused and pitiable world view that is.

  • Linda
    Nov. 13, 2008 4:55 p.m.

    I find it so sad that some would blame the Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints for what the people voted on. Marriage between a man and a woman is ordained by God. It is just that simple. Clearly all this anger and hatefulness is not the way to go about a disagreement with a law and comes from a source that is not of God.

  • Not Hoax
    Nov. 13, 2008 4:50 p.m.


    Knowing the tenants there, I can assure you it was not their handiwork.

  • hoax
    Nov. 13, 2008 4:38 p.m.

    I bet they burned it themselves just to get press coverage. It worked.

  • Chachi
    Nov. 13, 2008 4:32 p.m.

    Everyone should agree that it's wrong to torch people's signs on their own property, regardless of what the signs say.
    But then again, a lot of things that should be obvious apparently aren't--like the irony in gay rights people accusing Mormons of hatred and bigotry as they threaten our tax-exempt status and shut down our temples. Or the difference between 19th-century Mormons polygamists wanting to be left alone and gays wanting official governmental endorsement of their unions. Or the blatant bias in how the major news networks are reporting this.
    How many of the protestors really try to understand the Mormon viewpoint? How many of them have gone to the LDS Newsroom website and read the interview with Elders Oaks and Wickman?

  • The Church should be ashamed
    Nov. 13, 2008 3:46 p.m.

    Hate is toxic. You think the LDS Church would have learned that by now. The Prop. 8 battle is going to haunt the Church for years to come.

  • MPetrie
    Nov. 13, 2008 2:56 p.m.

    The signs should not have been burned and whoever did it, LDS or not, should be ashamed. The people who made the signs have the right to make their voices heard as well. There have been stupid actions performed by only a few on each side of the issue and, unfortunately, it's smearing the images of both sides. But I agree. The public wanted it put to a vote.... they got it. Gay marriage is banned in California. Move on.

  • joe
    Nov. 13, 2008 2:14 p.m.

    who cares, its just a burned sign. And if LDS people were the cause they need to wise up. Acts like this just give anti-pop 8 people more publicity then they deserve.

  • Gus
    Nov. 13, 2008 2:06 p.m.

    Who cares who started what????
    I'm sick and tired of this soap opera. Every person has the right to express their ideas and preferences period! Stop attacking others for their beliefs and whatever or whoever they voted for... let's move on with life now.

  • Danielle
    Nov. 13, 2008 1:45 p.m.

    Thank you hmmm. You make a really good point. By the way it was not the mormon church that started all of this. It was the catholic church and christians alike.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 13, 2008 1:40 p.m.

    America,land of the free? hmmm only for some people is the way it tends to be, if you follow all the rules and do as you are told

  • Jeremy
    Nov. 13, 2008 1:39 p.m.

    Because taste in sports team, soft drinks, and spreadable sandwich condiments is completely analogous to who you're born attracted to.

    Do you people ever think before you post?

  • John Pack Lambert
    Nov. 13, 2008 1:31 p.m.

    There is very little that is clear in this article.
    Whoever burned the signs clearly committed an act that should not be tolerated.
    I wish church members had more patence, more love for their enemies, and lived up to Jesus' admonition to pray for them that despitefully use us more.
    Of corse, there is no evidence that the person who started the fire was a member of the church.

  • hmmm
    Nov. 13, 2008 1:20 p.m.

    Anyone who likes the LA Lakers watch out because Bull fans are going to come picket in front of your home until you change your mind.

    Anyone who prefers Coke as opposed to Pepsi watch out because Pepsi lovers are going to hunt you down and bug you because they think pepsi is better.

    Anyone who likes grape jelly not peach be prepared to have a ton of peach lovers throwing peaches at you and call you names because apparently no on can have differences in believes in the country.

    People donated money to support prop 8. Lots of different people from all walks of life. It was voted on. It passed....

  • Jason
    Nov. 13, 2008 1:10 p.m.

    Sorry to say that there is no proof for anyone to claim a Mormon did this. I understand why ONE would do this...but I also understand why someone against the LDS Church would too.

    Also, be careful using the word bigot.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 13, 2008 1:09 p.m.

    As a beer drinker, I'd like a copy of that sign.

  • What?!?!
    Nov. 13, 2008 12:56 p.m.

    You're right. This totally justifies all the hate and bigotry thrown at the LDS Church.

  • What?
    Nov. 13, 2008 12:20 p.m.

    You mean this can go two ways? And naturally this is probably national news that proves Mormons are bigoted homophobes and violent too!

    Couldn't possibly be someone who is just tired of the bigoted anti church hateful rantings of the gay community..now way.