How more wrong can you be? A church is absolutely entitled to give advice on
issues, but not candidates. The church has every right to tell its members to
vote according to its teachings. This does not violate anything, including
separation of church and state. Let's drop this issue once and for all!
The church did not place anything on the ballot. The people of California made
that choice. The LDS church did not give any money to any cause...it's members
did this out of their own purses. Let me get this right...when a church with a
moral compass encourages it's members to vote according to that moral
compass...its wrong...yet a presidential candidate who gets the backing from a
particular race...its okay? This is democracy, baby! The people have
spoken...red, black,white, LDS, Catholic, Atheist, Gay...each had their vote.
The Gay community may not be a religion, but they are a voice in
democracy...they just weren't the majority vote in this instance. There will
always be other elections.
Frankly I think most people are missing the obvious flaw in this official
statement and I can't believe that the LDS Church's legal department let this
statement get out the door.The LDS Church DOES NOT have a right to
participate in politics. Its members do but the church as an organization does
not. What the Church as an organization has done in the political arena is in
blatant violation with its requirement as a 501C(3) entity.I have
nothing against LDS members exercising their right to vote. I encourage it. Just
so long as the only encouragement from the Church organization is "hey remember
that your right to vote is very important so everyone go vote." The minute the
Church as an organization is instrumental in the placement of anything on the
ballot anywhere or issues official statements or letters to its membership
telling them how to vote they are out of line and I hope the IRS reminds them of
that fact with a tax bill dating back to their first activity on this matter.
LDS, don't feel you're being singled out because the LANGE temple was "attacked"
last week. Other churches are being picketed as well, and I suspect there's an
agenda being followed to "attack" us all over time. Evangelicals over the
weekend, and surely the Catholic cathedral will get its turn.In the
meantime, why not rejoice when they persecute you and say all manner of vile
things about you? Do you not remember the Sermon on the Mount?
I saw the protestors in Salt Lake City, or should we call it the "March of the
Hypocrites 2008?"A bunch of hate-filled bigots crying out against
hatred and bigotry.There were more than a dozen groups in that
coalition against gay marriage, yet, only the LDS Church was singled out in
protest. Even the CatholicOver 70 percent of African-American
voters supported a ban on gay marriage, but those protestors would never dream
of going into an African-American neighborhood like Compton or South Central and
chant "Shame on you."I don't support bans on gay marriage, but I
can't support the lopsided, blinded by hate viewpoints of people who can't
accept the fact that they were out-voted in a democratic process.Oh,
and by the way Cliff, obviously you've never been to the south, where Baptists
shun their gay children far more often than the LDS. Another display of
ignorance from a group that claims they hate ignorant people.
that 2 other states passed the same law? California is not the only one. As an
American it is my right to vote the way my heart tells me. As an LDS member it
is my choice whether or not to follow the Prophet. Many people in this election,
LDS or not, made their choice. I chose to follow my church leader and make my
decision, not because they told me to but because I believe the Bible to be
the word of God. For centuries the law of marriage has been clearly defined
and who are we to try to override our God?
Marriage, and the rights appertaining thereto, are a matter of state law. In
some states, it is possible to be married as a matter of sharing the same
domicile for a specified period of time; common law marriage. This is a legal
status recognized by the state and enacted by state legislatures. Whether a
Judge, Justice of the Peace, or Priest, the authority to marry comes from the
state and they are, generally, required by law to state this in the ceremony.
Because the law permits such a union, an LDS Bishop could now be required to
marry a gay couple. He would be hard pressed to refuse such a request given
that his authority to marry is governed by the state in which he resides and not
the dictates of his doctrine. Were he to refuse, the gay couple would simply
sue for redress and require the state to force the Bishop to comply with the
law. So much for the concept of separation between Church and State. In this
regard, religious organizations have consistently and constantly fought to keep
state laws from infringing on their belief systems.
Well, I am neither gay nor part of the LDS church, but here I thought that
separation of church and state applied to state elections. Funny how that
works, when one church with an excessive amount of tax exempt money gets to use
its funds to push its ideas of moral righteousness on a group of people. Yes,
everyone has their right to free speech, but I am pretty sure that right was
guaranteed to American citizens, not to religious institutions. In fact,
constitutionally, I'm pretty sure that religious institutions are only
guaranteed the right to exist without being persecuted by the state in return
for keeping their nose out of the state's affairs. But most of you are right,
"the gays" should just accept their social inequality that resulted from this
"fair" election and not worry about the fact that a church whose beliefs they
don't follow is running their lives. That is what living in America is all
For xscribe: Let's just say for argument sake that there is a God. Do you really
want he/she/it to handle the situation? The are a few accounts in the Bible
where God handled things him/her-self and the result was not pretty. Are you
sure you want this?
Protesters: AAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!LDS Church: Are
you done yet?Protesters: AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!LDS Church: *looks at watch* Still waiting. This could take a while.
Let's get back to our plans for the Christmas show...
I think Hinckley would have handled this a lot better than President Monson. He
was much more media savvy. Its possible to get views across without getting
peoples backs up.
The gays make me sick. The Church has a right to speak on decisions as directed
by God through our Prophet. No other institution, religious or otherwise has
this authority. Get over it all you gays, the word has been spoken and the
Church has taken action. It was the right thing to do and one day you will thank
the Church for this action.
shouldn't feel bad about getting singled out by the gays and lesbians. Let them
scream it out. The church is morally right to pursue such an issue and it's
never ever about politics.Keep up the good work LDS and other
churches who also donated money to Prop 8. They can scream all they want and I
will keep winking at them as they walk by me with their idiotic signs and
All you Gays, enough with Hate and Intolernce already!You lost. The
majority chose otherwise. NO matter how you sum up the democratic process, you
lost.Constitution gave you the right of free speech to convince
others and the majority disagreed.That how this republic works
constitutionally.Any church has the righ to interject themselves in
any state and in any moral debate they see fit.
You gays, enough with the hate and intolerance already.I mean,
really, it is like you have no sense at all.
How did the LDS church specifically persecute the gays?
As a Californian Mormon, I didn't know we had so much clout in California.
Mormons make up less than 2% of the population of California. There are
approximately 800,000 LDS out of a total population of approximately 34 million
and we got Prop 8 passed all by ourselves. What an accomplishment to do it all
And if prop 8 had failed, the same protesters would be out in force, rallying
around the same temples and telling the world how awful the LDS people are.
...to the American sense of fair play? That's democracy, folks. Both sides
stated their arguments and a vote was held. Sure, LDS members donated money and
time towards their agenda. The gay activists have been throwing time and money
at their agenda, too. Both sides made their case and the people of California
cast their vote. NOBODY HERE IN UTAH CAST A VOTE FOR THIS PROPOSITION! We may
have shown our support, but it was ultimately up to the citizens of California
ALONE. Well, they made their decision. If the Proposition would have failed,
the LDS church would not be picketing and protesting and yelling "Shame On You!"
We would respect the choice of the people of California. If we can serve as a
whipping boy for all that pent up frustration, confusion, and personal turmoil,
however, we have big shoulders and we can let 'em vent for a bit. It still
won't change the fact that the majority of Californians do not want to see
deviancy re-classified as marriage.
You who have commented on this article crack me up. If you would read the last
paragraph of the statement you would see that the church has no problems with a
civil and respectful discussion. It is the verbal attacks on both sides of the
issue they are decrying. They are asking others to grow up and respect the
opinions of all, not just their opinion.
The statement used the term "mutual respect and civility" with regard to each
other. Maybe if religion would stay out of it and let their god take care of
it, instead of saying they're doing "his work," there would be some mutual
respect. He/she/it didn't need help creating the world. I think he/she/it is
capable of dealing with this issue without the need of religious groups and
others outlawing same-sex marriage.
How should one read this? "Don't just pick on us?"The LDS Church
has been singled out because it has taken the lead on Prop 8, and is especially
harsh in its treatment of homosexual members and especially apologetic in its
defense.No other church proscribes so viscerally to member families
dealing with a gay son or daughter, an approach so imbued with rejection. Show me a modern Catholic family that is as destroyed by this as most
active LDS families are?The LDS Church has been front and center and
undivided on this issue. Other churches are happily keeping their collective
I hope we can follow the teachings of Jesus and respond to hate with love.
wow! church can mobilize its zombies to affect other people but complain when
they push back??? They need to learn that non mormons resent them foe butting
their heads into their lives. If you need examples: Utah liquor laws, Prop
Ironic that the LDS would feel persecuted as they actively and effectively
persecuted gays and lesbians in California. Once again religion shows just how
un-American it actually is -- Utah! brilliant. I will join the boycott.
It is disturbing that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is
singling out supporters of Equal Marriage Rights for speaking up as part of
their democratic right in a free country.While those who disagree
with Equal Marriage Rights, such as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day
Saints, have the right to make their feelings known, it is wrong for it to
target advocates of Equal Marriage Rights for being part of the democratic