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Dow dives as bailout bombs
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Mike | 3:10 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
What is Nancy Pelosi thinking? Why would she sabotage the passing of the very
legislation she was pleading for by vilifying the legislators she was trying to
convince? This has got to be the most stupid stunt this year in the house. It
is especially disturbing that she would exploit an issue so vital to the
economic health or ruin of the country to sling mud at her colleagues. She is
either very dumb or an extremely mean-spirited person. Either way she has got
to go.
Joseph Atwater | 3:24 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Smart decisions can be made by ungodly Republicans.
WarMungers who spent their money on battlefield toys and boxes for their sons and daughters.
This will mean less money left over to build their monuments to their dead.Less flamboyuant parades and ceremonies for the fallen.This is the Book of Mormon all over again. Judgement Must follow greed,selfishness and arrogance.Democrats likewise flaunt their abortions as "freedom of choice".
One word for the land that was once called "Zion" ......"Maranatha"
Like a warning from the past, thats never heeded.
WarMungers who spent their money on battlefield toys and boxes for their sons and daughters.
This will mean less money left over to build their monuments to their dead.Less flamboyuant parades and ceremonies for the fallen.This is the Book of Mormon all over again. Judgement Must follow greed,selfishness and arrogance.Democrats likewise flaunt their abortions as "freedom of choice".
One word for the land that was once called "Zion" ......"Maranatha"
Like a warning from the past, thats never heeded.
Comments continue below
Mike | 3:50 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
What was Nancy Pelosi thinking? She sabotaged the very legislation she was
pleading for by vilifying the legislators whose vote she was seeking. This has
to be one of the most stupid moves of the year. It is especially alarming that
she would engage in such mudslingging by exploiting such a vital initiative so
critical to the health or ruin of the nation's economy. She is either a
very dumb or a very mean-spirited person. Either way she must go.
No Bailout for the Thieves | 4:55 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Ill-conceived federal policies caused the current crisis. The federal government
chartered Fannie Mae in 1938 and Freddie Mac in 1970; the nub of the problem.
The government implicitly promised these institutions that it would make good on
their debts, so Fannie and Freddie took on huge amounts of excessive risk.
Worse, beginning in 1977 and even more in the 1990s and the early part of this century, Congress pushed mortgage lenders and Fannie/Freddie to expand subprime lending. The industry was happy to oblige, given the implicit promise of federal backing, and subprime lending soared.
This sub-prime lending was a wholesale abandonment of reasonable lending practices in which borrowers with poor credit characteristics got mortgages they were ill-equipped to handle.
Once housing prices declined and economic conditions worsened, defaults and delinquencies soared, leaving the industry holding large amounts of severely depreciated mortgage assets.
Worse, beginning in 1977 and even more in the 1990s and the early part of this century, Congress pushed mortgage lenders and Fannie/Freddie to expand subprime lending. The industry was happy to oblige, given the implicit promise of federal backing, and subprime lending soared.
This sub-prime lending was a wholesale abandonment of reasonable lending practices in which borrowers with poor credit characteristics got mortgages they were ill-equipped to handle.
Once housing prices declined and economic conditions worsened, defaults and delinquencies soared, leaving the industry holding large amounts of severely depreciated mortgage assets.
Freddie & Fannie go Belly Up | 5:00 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
The fact that government bears such a huge responsibility for the current mess
means any response should eliminate the conditions that created this situation
in the first place, not attempt to fix bad government with more government.
Let Fannie and Freddie go belly up, and those financial institutions which acceded to the Democrats ill-advised demands deserved to go bankrupt.
Let Fannie and Freddie go belly up, and those financial institutions which acceded to the Democrats ill-advised demands deserved to go bankrupt.
Anonymous | 5:34 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Many channels are portraying that the failure of Republicans to vote for this is
because of how Pelosi offended the Republicans by talking about Bush negatively.
If Pelosi voted for this bill, she is a complete hypocrite. She said something
to the effect, "Why should we give 700 billion dollars to Bush when the
Bush economics failed." The two angry Republican responders were obviously
for the bill and feel that Nancy's comments were very convincing not to
vote for it! Then the Democrats come on and say it failed because Republicans
were offended! I think she struck a cord in the confidence of Republicans to
give money to the Bush team! Democrats think we can't see the truth by
insulting our intelligence!
We're approximately 28 years over due for a depression! We're 2 standard deviations away from average according to the Kondratieff wave. Approximately every 50 years there's an economic depression.
I'm also extremely against this plan. Just like they bought up AIG, I think they want to buy the financial institutions and have more government control! Let the depression happen! Don't sell by giving away freedom! If not prepared, you'd better declare repentance! Repentance diverts calamities!
We're approximately 28 years over due for a depression! We're 2 standard deviations away from average according to the Kondratieff wave. Approximately every 50 years there's an economic depression.
I'm also extremely against this plan. Just like they bought up AIG, I think they want to buy the financial institutions and have more government control! Let the depression happen! Don't sell by giving away freedom! If not prepared, you'd better declare repentance! Repentance diverts calamities!
so why now?? | 5:34 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
I've heard that the reason those who have voted against it is because they
are listening to their constituents and to public reaction and are voting as
they think the people want. Since when do they do what the people want?? Since
when do they care?? And do they really care, or is just an election year?
Charlotte | 5:58 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Good observation.
Dan | 6:01 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
At least someone involved in the process made a decision. Many thanks to the
House leadership for their strong motivational skills.
Voting NO was wrong | 6:40 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Way to go those who voted NO. We are now suffering because you listened to your
ignorant constituents who know nothing of economics and the relationship between
wall street and main street.
I would rather have a job and have credit extended to me to survive in my business and possibly pay higher taxes than jobless and broke to "send wall street a message".
Ignorant!
I would rather have a job and have credit extended to me to survive in my business and possibly pay higher taxes than jobless and broke to "send wall street a message".
Ignorant!
Lesson learned | 6:43 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Our suffering will show those greedy CEO's what's what. I'm sure
they have now learned their lesson and are having to put a hold on their yacht
purchase.
What a joke to think that by not passing the bill we are doing the right thing.
Now we are all in a hole.
What a joke to think that by not passing the bill we are doing the right thing.
Now we are all in a hole.
charlie | 6:51 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
AMEN!
Ambie | 7:08 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
I hate to say it but I told you so!
Dems fault | 7:19 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Some of you people are bemoaning the "ignorance" of us regular folks
not wanting government to throw a trillion of our dollars down another rat hole.
I say too bad we haven't been that ignorant during the spending orgy the
Democrats have been on for the last forty years.
And how scary is it that an economist for Wells Fargo is quoted in this article saying that "... we lost more today in value than what was being discussed"? Uhhh ... we didn't LOSE anything. My portfolio value may have gone down but since I haven't sold anything I also haven't lost anything. Meanwhile, spending the trillion dollas would have been an actual loss of a trillion dollars. Duh.
And how scary is it that an economist for Wells Fargo is quoted in this article saying that "... we lost more today in value than what was being discussed"? Uhhh ... we didn't LOSE anything. My portfolio value may have gone down but since I haven't sold anything I also haven't lost anything. Meanwhile, spending the trillion dollas would have been an actual loss of a trillion dollars. Duh.
I NO VOTE, YOU HURT MY FEELINGS | 7:21 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Blaming Pelosi makes as much sense. So the Republicans said "she hurt my
feelings and so I'm going to spite her and her partisan speech and vote
no". WAAAA, WAAAAA.
Grasping at straws to excuse the Republicans underhandedness. They blew it because they have already lost everything including the presidency and left the Dems holding this bag. A bag the Repubs deregulated and now don't want to take responsibility to handle the mess.
Grasping at straws to excuse the Republicans underhandedness. They blew it because they have already lost everything including the presidency and left the Dems holding this bag. A bag the Repubs deregulated and now don't want to take responsibility to handle the mess.
Jeff | 7:27 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
It will be interesting to learn what the stocks do now. If they go up by
themselves, then maybe the doomsday predictions are wrong and the bailout
won't be necessary.
Re: Voting NO was wrong | 7:37 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Your right. Our elected representatives should not represent us.
Really?? | 7:44 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
I think its sad that so many people want the government to take care of what is
going on! What happened to responsability?? There are very greedy people in
this world, including our government officials, who caused this situation and
sadly, the honest portion of Americans are suffering as well. I think the best
thing to do is ride it out and if it comes to us as a Nation starting at square
one, so be it. Nice to have a fresh start anyway. Now all we need to do it get
rid of the Demacrats and Republicans in Washington and put people in office that
really care about this Nation and her future. Who knows, maybe if we as a
people start voting for the person running and not the party, we might end up on
top in the end.
I think | 7:56 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
...our predicament is analgous to a drowning person going down for the 3rd time.
Just before the last finger of the victim's outstretched hand goes below
the water surface the House will extend a hand. However, what Congress fails to
realize is that we the people, as we go down for 3rd time, have absolutely no
faith that help will be offered. That is because we have been lied to so often
that we trust no politican.
Zell | 7:58 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
This should show everyone how risky it is to let government control what should
be in the hands of private organizations.As far as Pelosi, it was the Democrats
who started this mess long ago in the New Deal. Oh if we could only have history
taught in our schools maybe we could finally get a government by the people and
for the people.
Not so blind | 8:19 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Can't you see the manipulation of the Thugs on Wall street? Using Money
printed up by The Feds They are raising the "volatile" Market and then
yelling SELL and when it falls, yelling BUY and buying back at the lower prices,
pocketing the profit, and getting others to buy at lower prices which raises the
market so they can yell SELL again. They are still making money while losing it
for Main street. They always have some "happening" to blame it on but
they are fleecing us and still want us to bail them out.
Both Democrats and Republicans are involved in this scam.
Both Democrats and Republicans are involved in this scam.
Win Sum | 8:48 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Can you name one....one.... politician on either side you really trust? Too
many immoral, perverted, greedy, power-hungry people and...who put them there?
Looks like we all share the blame for this mess.
Presidential Politics aside...McCain is the only one who indicates he will have cabinet members from either party....? Best people...? Or, more of the same.....?
Sounds like time to put prayer back in our schools, homes and lives.....
Presidential Politics aside...McCain is the only one who indicates he will have cabinet members from either party....? Best people...? Or, more of the same.....?
Sounds like time to put prayer back in our schools, homes and lives.....
Anonymous | 8:55 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
I think it's all theatrics. Those congressmen who voted against the
bail-out will gallop in at the last minutes, like the calvary, to save the
country. But will it?
The Economist | 8:59 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Let�s party like its 1929. Learn from history! The market
crashed. Government and the Federal Reserve froze like a deer in the headlights.
By 1931 110 banks failed. Businesses could not function without a lending
system. A deflationary spiral insured. Jobs were lost. More businesses failed.
Unemployment reached 25%.
Our world is much more complex now. The ramifications of �let it fail� are catastrophic. Are you kidding me? Is this really the world you want?
Wake up people. We have the tools to fix this problem. The Paulson plan must be passed. This is a matter of not only our economic well being it is also a matter of national security. Stop being masochists. Call your representatives today and let�s get this bill passed for all of our sakes!!
BTW, all this grousing about finding fault is like arguing over who caused the accident while the victims lie on the ground bleeding to death.
Our world is much more complex now. The ramifications of �let it fail� are catastrophic. Are you kidding me? Is this really the world you want?
Wake up people. We have the tools to fix this problem. The Paulson plan must be passed. This is a matter of not only our economic well being it is also a matter of national security. Stop being masochists. Call your representatives today and let�s get this bill passed for all of our sakes!!
BTW, all this grousing about finding fault is like arguing over who caused the accident while the victims lie on the ground bleeding to death.
DOW Dives??? | 9:04 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
The headline screams that the DOW dived because the bailout failed. WRONG!
When the vote was recorded, the DOW was already down 600 points. All day long most of the pundits were predicting that the bill would pass.
Seems to me that most of the loss occurred when the market players were afraid that the bailout would succeed.
When the vote was recorded, the DOW was already down 600 points. All day long most of the pundits were predicting that the bill would pass.
Seems to me that most of the loss occurred when the market players were afraid that the bailout would succeed.
sam | 9:10 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
7 1/2 YEARS OF GEORGE BUSH
TO ALL MY FRIENDS....LIBERAL OR CONSERVATIVE...FYI only.
George Bush has been in office for 7 1/2 years. The first six the economy was fine.
A little over one year ago:
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.
4) the DOW JONES hit a record high--14,000 +
5) American's were buying new cars,taking cruises, vacations overseas,
living large!...
But American's wanted 'CHANGE'! So, in 2006 they voted in a Democratic Congress and
yes--we got 'CHANGE' all right. In the PAST YEAR:
1) Consumer confidence has plummeted;
2) Gasoline is now over $4 a gallon & climbing!;
3) Unemployment is up to 5.5% (a 10% increase);
4) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $12 TRILLION DOLLARS and
prices still dropping;
5) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure.
6) as I write, THE DOW is probing another low~~
$2.5 TRILLION DOLLARS HAS EVAPORATED FROM THEIR STOCKS, BONDS & MUTUAL FUNDS INVESTMENT PORTFOLIOS!
YES, IN 2006 AMERICA VOTED FOR CHANGE...AND WE SURE GOT IT! ....
TO ALL MY FRIENDS....LIBERAL OR CONSERVATIVE...FYI only.
George Bush has been in office for 7 1/2 years. The first six the economy was fine.
A little over one year ago:
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.
4) the DOW JONES hit a record high--14,000 +
5) American's were buying new cars,taking cruises, vacations overseas,
living large!...
But American's wanted 'CHANGE'! So, in 2006 they voted in a Democratic Congress and
yes--we got 'CHANGE' all right. In the PAST YEAR:
1) Consumer confidence has plummeted;
2) Gasoline is now over $4 a gallon & climbing!;
3) Unemployment is up to 5.5% (a 10% increase);
4) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $12 TRILLION DOLLARS and
prices still dropping;
5) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure.
6) as I write, THE DOW is probing another low~~
$2.5 TRILLION DOLLARS HAS EVAPORATED FROM THEIR STOCKS, BONDS & MUTUAL FUNDS INVESTMENT PORTFOLIOS!
YES, IN 2006 AMERICA VOTED FOR CHANGE...AND WE SURE GOT IT! ....
randy | 9:25 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
get this .... $85,000,000,000 (85 billion, the number tossed around for the
AIG bailout - ) spred among 200,000,000 million (those approx 18+ yrs old and
older, 'real' us of a americans would be $425,000 per person ...
deduct 30% for taxes , that would leave each person with $295,000 (a married
couple nearly $600,000)
the 30% taxes off the $425,000 per person would generate $25 billion in tax return to the irs ... immediately
think most americans could get out of debit, pay off mortages , pay college loans or college debit and the list goes on ...
but no, our gov't cant do that ... release american's from this economic bondage .. oh, no ... lets make sure the rich stay rich and everybody else pays for it by bailing out them instead of us
our mess started with lobbyists and policitians and worked its way to us in our bankruptcy and foreclosures ....
lets get the incumbents out and the challengers in and start a new with lobbyists and policitians and work our way to what we had decades ago ...
with the numbers being tossed around .. sounds pretty good and cheap to me
the 30% taxes off the $425,000 per person would generate $25 billion in tax return to the irs ... immediately
think most americans could get out of debit, pay off mortages , pay college loans or college debit and the list goes on ...
but no, our gov't cant do that ... release american's from this economic bondage .. oh, no ... lets make sure the rich stay rich and everybody else pays for it by bailing out them instead of us
our mess started with lobbyists and policitians and worked its way to us in our bankruptcy and foreclosures ....
lets get the incumbents out and the challengers in and start a new with lobbyists and policitians and work our way to what we had decades ago ...
with the numbers being tossed around .. sounds pretty good and cheap to me
Anonymous | 9:37 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
If they pass any bill it better be fair for all not just the irresponsible.
What uninformed people | 9:42 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
frequent these blogs. One comment "let the depression begin". Are
you kidding me? Go talk to those who lived through the depression and have them
tell you about it. Tight credit is the major cause for the Great Depression.
There was great misery during this time period. Forget your 401K for a moment,
we are talking about keeping your job. We have been warned that without
intervention major companies will go under and it won't be a wall street
financial firm where only wall street executives get hurt. We are talking about
me, you and those just struggling to make ends meet. You folks against this
bailout need to understand the ramicifications of doing nothing. Oh, but we
don't want government intervention, that's against free market
principles. Right now it's too late for that. Let's just fiddle
while Rome burns.
Karl Marx | 9:45 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Thank you Utah Congressional delegation for voting "no." Soon
America's economy will collapse and we will have a workers paradise, by the
voice of the people. Elective socialism, it's a one-way trip.
Interesting | 9:54 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
This bailout is George Bush's plan.
And Republicans killed it.
Talk about burning bridges with your party leader.
What's next?
Will The RNC recind GWB's Republican membership?
And Republicans killed it.
Talk about burning bridges with your party leader.
What's next?
Will The RNC recind GWB's Republican membership?
second part | 9:55 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Steve Balmer CFO of Microsoft said today no company is immune from the credit
crises. Microsoft?? the cash cow of public companies?? Perhpas we need to see
a few companies fail to meet payrolls before the public thinks this is serious.
How would you feel if it was payday and the check never arrived? Maybe a few
bankrupcies of non-financial wall street firms is what is needed. Maybe
it'll be the company you work for.
Ridiculous | 10:01 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
To think a true statement would hurt grown mens feelings and they would want to
take their marbles and go home is childish at best. Let the market flounder,
everything will work out for the best in the long run. A good cleansing is what
is needed. Don't fret we will not see a doomsday. This is more scare tatics
by the Bush-Wacker and his administration. Go slow see what the markets and
attitudes are, but be careful what ever you do and make sure you get it RIGHT.
GWB | 10:00 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
To "The Economist", I simply cannot understand. If we cannot argue
over who caused this then we do not know who needs to be punished with the
resulting legislation.
Seriously, it seems that people that oppose this are thinking of themself and only thinking of the here and now. They want someone punished for causing this.
Is it the fat cat bankers, the low life borrowers that bought a too big house, Obama's advisor Raines (who really isn't an advisor to Obama), the McCain advisor Gramm (who called us whiners), anyone.
Most think someone needs to be punished but there is no consensus on whom to punish.
At the same time, Rome is burning.
There will be plenty of time to assign blame, what we need is action like "The Economist suggests.
Seriously, it seems that people that oppose this are thinking of themself and only thinking of the here and now. They want someone punished for causing this.
Is it the fat cat bankers, the low life borrowers that bought a too big house, Obama's advisor Raines (who really isn't an advisor to Obama), the McCain advisor Gramm (who called us whiners), anyone.
Most think someone needs to be punished but there is no consensus on whom to punish.
At the same time, Rome is burning.
There will be plenty of time to assign blame, what we need is action like "The Economist suggests.
Jerry | 10:10 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Regardless of who is to blame for the current crisis, the Republicans will be
blamed and will lose the White House as a result.
Wake up! | 10:10 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Wake up people! The government caused this problem and now we want to give them
a blank check to fix it? We keep electing stupid people that are only vested in
their own interests...not what is best for this country. Here is a news flash
for you, D.C.: We don't trust you! Why should we give you more of our
money with no guarantees? Government incompetence should not be rewarded...throw
'em all out!
Patient Observer | 10:24 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
Soon to play at the Wall Street Theater - A musical farce directed by Henry M.
Paulson, Jr. - "My Poor Taxpayer." Watch them trudge to the edge of
the Septic Mortgage Rescue Tank! Confused, dazed and overcome by fumes, they
lose their cash and fall in, lamenting "With yank from Hank they sank us in
the tank, and then we stank."
But wait, Congress wants to rewrite the script. Probably a good idea.
But wait, Congress wants to rewrite the script. Probably a good idea.
Stop the Blame | 11:11 a.m. Sept. 30, 2008
No one, not Congress, not the White House, not Wall Street, not Main Street, not
Barack Obama, not John McCain, not George Bush; no one was on watch or
understood the complexities of mortgage based securities and the ramifications
of lax regulations. Not only will Wall Street pay for their greed, but as each
day without legislation passes, so will each of us and much of the world.
We knew we should get out and stay out of debt but we didn't. It was too easy to get credit cards and that pretty new house. Americans have short memories, short sight and will learn much from this experience as did our parents.
We knew we should get out and stay out of debt but we didn't. It was too easy to get credit cards and that pretty new house. Americans have short memories, short sight and will learn much from this experience as did our parents.
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Trader Michael Kilkenny, right, sits at a post after the Dow closed Monday down 777 points, the largest point loss in a single day.
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