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Internet predators after 'easy targets'
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Keith in Colorado | 6:30 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
I agree. I also found it odd and judgemental that he suggests that if a person
requests to be a Scoutmaster, that, that's the last person he'd call
to the position. So, if I love scouting, I'm automatically a
"predetor" and should be on a "watch list". That's
nuts! I was a Cubmaster for four years when my two sons were in the program and
I completed Woodbadge. I was also a Scoutmaster on two occasions. I loved
it!
Lastly, if Knutson is right, it appears that a "healthy" relationship with our children is the key. For the most part, I agree with that premise. On the other hand, there are children, that no matter what we do, they have a mind of their own and often rebel. I'm 64 now and have five children. So I've been there.
So, what's the answer? Besides a good relationship with our children and doing all we can as parents to be there for them, we can and must exercise our faith and ask the Lord to protect our children. He will do so, if we do our part.
Lastly, if Knutson is right, it appears that a "healthy" relationship with our children is the key. For the most part, I agree with that premise. On the other hand, there are children, that no matter what we do, they have a mind of their own and often rebel. I'm 64 now and have five children. So I've been there.
So, what's the answer? Besides a good relationship with our children and doing all we can as parents to be there for them, we can and must exercise our faith and ask the Lord to protect our children. He will do so, if we do our part.
Utah's record | 7:22 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
The D News previously reported about Attorney General Shurtleff's internet
task force's many awards and how they lead the nation in per capita arrests
of predators. No question about it -- these cops work hard to protect our
families. We have to do more to support our police in this area. That's
an old-fashioned idea, but still true. But we have to do our part. FHE and
watching the registered sex offender lists are just part of it. A kid with
internet-connected computers in the bedroom is an invitation to trouble. Kids
need to be taught to challenge those who try to get them to do things they know
to be wrong, even church leaders. Remember Bishop Dave Gomez (a Department of
Corrections high-ranking official) who abused the boys in his congregation? Its
not just Catholic priests. Not by a long shot. Kids need to know that there
are plenty of smooth Mormon predators, the Val Southwicks of the internet world.
Comments continue below
Craig Coleman | 9:18 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
I do not understand why anyone is being critical of Charles' Knutson's
efforts to educate parents on the danger of sexual predators on the internet.
If you read the entire article you will see that he is advocating that parents
form strong relationships with their children. Because he is speaking to an LDS
audience it is only natural that he would encourage them to use family home
evening and family prayer as a means to strengthen relationships with children.
How is this wrong? I also agree with him that church leaders should be
suspicious of adults who volunteer for scouting positions. In a perfect world
we would be happy to have people step up and ask to be put in those positions.
But it is not a perfect world and, unfortunately, there are adults whose
intentions are less than honorable. In my opinion it is better to err on the
side of protecting children from predators than it is to err on the side of
protecting some adult who might get their feelings hurt.
Anonymous | 9:26 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
The scoutmaster thing is just rediculous! There's nothing wrong with a
person who would enjoy being involved in scouts. I think many times you can get
a feel for what a person is really like before putting them into a position like
that.
Also.. I grew up in a good home with loving parents, but they simply didn't know much about computers. I would chat with friends and I would recieve messages from random men (i'm a man). I knew not to talk to those people and avoided the curiosity.
I think the best parents are the ones who are willing to talk about anything with their children. If a kid feels confident they can talk with their parents about ANYTHING, the child probably will talk to them.
Also.. I grew up in a good home with loving parents, but they simply didn't know much about computers. I would chat with friends and I would recieve messages from random men (i'm a man). I knew not to talk to those people and avoided the curiosity.
I think the best parents are the ones who are willing to talk about anything with their children. If a kid feels confident they can talk with their parents about ANYTHING, the child probably will talk to them.
Justin | 9:36 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
LDS Teachings? As opposed to any other religions teachings. I had a good chuckle
reading this article.
Only in Utah...
Only in Utah...
To Go beyond FHE @ 12:39 | 9:53 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
Excellent advice--even better that the article--which I too, felt was filled
with stereotypes and inaccuracies.
The reason I became a victim of a sex abuser when I was much younger was because I was such an easy target. Children need to be taught correct principles and to think for themselves, not just to obey.
Also, I think we need to make ourselves and other responsible adults MORE approachable to children not shrouded in fear of their authority or how we will respond if there is an actual problem.
The reason I became a victim of a sex abuser when I was much younger was because I was such an easy target. Children need to be taught correct principles and to think for themselves, not just to obey.
Also, I think we need to make ourselves and other responsible adults MORE approachable to children not shrouded in fear of their authority or how we will respond if there is an actual problem.
Addicted to tyranny | 9:54 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
And those who work for the State who want to keep the citizenry dependent upon
the State go after the weakest in our society too, pushing food stamps,
"free" education, police protection, anything to get these easy
targets to become addicted to state services.
good advice | 10:13 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
delivered in an inaccurate manner. Clearly this man is out of touch with the
way most families use the computer and interact online. The best thing you can
do is keep all computers in the room where you spend the most time. No
computers in the bedroom - ever.
Dumb parents | 10:21 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
What kind of parent lets their kid have a computer with internet access in
his/her bedroom? I can't imagine how much time is being wasted with kids
isolating themselves in their rooms playing World of Warcraft and chatting
online with whoever.
Why not get off your butt, go outside and do something productive and worthwhile?
I can't imagine a parent that actually loves their child saying, "Here Jimmy, take this computer into your room and spend however much time you need on the internet......and when you're done I'll make you a pb&j for being such a good boy"
Why not get off your butt, go outside and do something productive and worthwhile?
I can't imagine a parent that actually loves their child saying, "Here Jimmy, take this computer into your room and spend however much time you need on the internet......and when you're done I'll make you a pb&j for being such a good boy"
Chad | 10:40 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
Justin, of course the article mentions LDS teachings. First off, the first line
of the article acknowledges that it is centered on mormonism as the person they
are interviewing is in charge of that sort of thing for the LDS church. If the
person being interviewed had been a baptist, it would have referred to baptist
teachings. Hello.
Second, the DesNews is an LDS-held paper. They are always slanted toward the LDS viewpoint and make a stronger effort to address themes important to LDS readers. You are free to read the trib if you don't like that. That is what makes this country great. The DesNews can choose what to report and you can choose to read something else. Freedom of speech rocks!
Second, the DesNews is an LDS-held paper. They are always slanted toward the LDS viewpoint and make a stronger effort to address themes important to LDS readers. You are free to read the trib if you don't like that. That is what makes this country great. The DesNews can choose what to report and you can choose to read something else. Freedom of speech rocks!
Keith in Colorado | 11:27 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
Craig,
So you're saying along with Knutson, that you're automatically guilty, until proven otherwise. I understand the need to be constantly aware of what's going on out there and within our wards, but to suggest that because a person (especially in the Church) wants to "volunteer" for a scouting position he must be a pedifile, is paranoid! If that's the standard, because bishops have been perpetrators, we also have to assume all new bishops are suspect.
Some of you Utah mormons are so self-righteous and judgemental, it's unbelievable!
So you're saying along with Knutson, that you're automatically guilty, until proven otherwise. I understand the need to be constantly aware of what's going on out there and within our wards, but to suggest that because a person (especially in the Church) wants to "volunteer" for a scouting position he must be a pedifile, is paranoid! If that's the standard, because bishops have been perpetrators, we also have to assume all new bishops are suspect.
Some of you Utah mormons are so self-righteous and judgemental, it's unbelievable!
Anonymous | 11:30 a.m. Aug. 22, 2008
It was a good article, but it needs to go a bit further and mention cell phones.
Some are attached to the internet, and sometimes children give their number to
predators so they can "chat" without having to be in that room where
everybody can see the computer.
Kids can get texts while they are in their room, the bathroom, "outside doing something productive", on vacation, wherever. Do NOT let your kids get phones with internet access, and check their texts regularly to make sure you know who they are texting and what it's about. Tell your kids you are doing this, and they are far less likely to give their number to people they don't know or text inappropriately.
Kids can get texts while they are in their room, the bathroom, "outside doing something productive", on vacation, wherever. Do NOT let your kids get phones with internet access, and check their texts regularly to make sure you know who they are texting and what it's about. Tell your kids you are doing this, and they are far less likely to give their number to people they don't know or text inappropriately.
Henry Drummond | 12:01 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
I have to agree with most of what is said here. Parents would panic if
strangers were coming into their home when they are not there and communicating
with their children. That happens every day on the Internet and parents are
simply oblivious to it. You're not being overbearing if you are
supervising what you're children are doing on the computer. The social
networking sites take the attitude that they are not responsible for the
security of your child's personal information or for who has access to
them.
Craig Coleman | 12:43 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
I assume you have identified yourself from Colorado in order to make sure
everyone knows you're not one of those despicable Utah Mormons you so
evidently loathe. I guess it is easy to throw out insults when you can remain
hidden behind a cloak of anonymity. Of course, I would be just as suspicious
of a man who volunteered to be the bishop as I would of one who volunteered to
be the scoutmaster. Evidently there are some who see this as paranoid but I see
it as being cautious. There are far too many children who have been exploited
and abused by predator adults. Men who are experienced in scouting and/or have
earned trust will be asked to participate--there is no need to volunteer. When
it comes to protecting children I couldn't care less about the feelings of
adults.
Scoutmasters? | 12:48 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
All in all, a good article. This is a serious problem and parents DO need to be
aware, monitor their kids, etc. Unfortunately, all kids will not be obedient to
their parents' attempts to protect them. They'll use the net at the
library, at a friend's house, and so on. But we have to do EVERYTHING we
possibly can to protect our kids--and letting them get hooked on computers is
not a good idea.
As to the scoutmaster thing, it is terribly unfortunate, but, along with the wonderful men who love scouting and helping our young men, there are a handful of men who DO seek out oppoutunities to molest young boys and men.
We had a terrible case years ago in our stake and many young men were damaged. The scoutmaster went to prison. The Bishop later said that he should have realized that when someone comes to a Bishop seeking a calling that red flags should go off--one way or another. Loving scouting and hoping to be called is NOT the same thing as actively seeking out a calling that should come through inspiration (not desperation or by self-seeking people).
As to the scoutmaster thing, it is terribly unfortunate, but, along with the wonderful men who love scouting and helping our young men, there are a handful of men who DO seek out oppoutunities to molest young boys and men.
We had a terrible case years ago in our stake and many young men were damaged. The scoutmaster went to prison. The Bishop later said that he should have realized that when someone comes to a Bishop seeking a calling that red flags should go off--one way or another. Loving scouting and hoping to be called is NOT the same thing as actively seeking out a calling that should come through inspiration (not desperation or by self-seeking people).
David | 1:46 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
Who would ever want to be a scoutmaster nowadays with all the aspersions and
insinuations cast in articles and reactions like those here on those who give so
much of their time and resources to the excellent scouting organizations in our
communities?
Keith in Colordo | 2:48 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
Craig,
I don't stereotype all mormons in Utah, as being self-righteous and judgemental. It's just very obvious that in Utah, there's a lot of "over kill" on many issues, which I believe is cultural and a lot of the time is motivated by these attitudes. My apologies though, for coming on so strongly.
I believe Scoutmasters?, 12:48 p.m., has given a good response that helps me lighten up on the subject a little.
By the way Craig, I'm a former Bishop who served in Utah. I'm 64, have five wonderful children and nine grandchildren. And, four of my children and their families live in Utah. Perhaps my rigidity is due to my age (my children have accused me of that). Again, my apologies - and thanks Scoutmasters?
I don't stereotype all mormons in Utah, as being self-righteous and judgemental. It's just very obvious that in Utah, there's a lot of "over kill" on many issues, which I believe is cultural and a lot of the time is motivated by these attitudes. My apologies though, for coming on so strongly.
I believe Scoutmasters?, 12:48 p.m., has given a good response that helps me lighten up on the subject a little.
By the way Craig, I'm a former Bishop who served in Utah. I'm 64, have five wonderful children and nine grandchildren. And, four of my children and their families live in Utah. Perhaps my rigidity is due to my age (my children have accused me of that). Again, my apologies - and thanks Scoutmasters?
Chuck | 2:55 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
My kids have learned that the best defense in real life (versus online life) is
a "super-friendly greeting." I am a firm believer that a confident
person is a difficult target. Kudos to law enforcement for trying to educate
parents that coddling is not protection. Information and strong positive family
relationships really are the key to safety, both online and live.
As parents, we need to teach our kids to report unsolicited personal emails or other online contacts. We should keep the computers out of the bedrooms and in open places in our homes. Trust is a two-way street. We teach our kids that we trust them, and that they need to trust us on this one. We're on the same team -- parents and kids against predators.
As parents, we need to teach our kids to report unsolicited personal emails or other online contacts. We should keep the computers out of the bedrooms and in open places in our homes. Trust is a two-way street. We teach our kids that we trust them, and that they need to trust us on this one. We're on the same team -- parents and kids against predators.
RL | 3:54 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
I don't agree. I do agree that a child is far more vulnerable when they
don't have a genuine, and close relationship with their parents. This is
key. You can teach them all you want, but it comes down to not only knowing
what they are doing when, but the why... really knowing your child, which comes
from earning your child's trust. This is done by lovingly setting limits.
Dictating every move your child makes only makes them more vulnerable. Teaching
them how to handle things when you aren't around, by example and actions,
not lecturing or overpowering, is what works. LDS values DO foster this.
It's just that most parents find it difficult to pull this off. Just
surviving, these days, is tough on it's own. I'm also bothered by the
assumption here that it's only the online preditors, or registered
offenders to guard against. Far more common is the family member or family
friend that is the sexual preditor. Your "gut" or the Spirit, is your
best defense there. But the safeguards are the same.
Charles Knutson | 4:58 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
I wasn't asked for comment before the story ran, and I didn't review
it for accuracy (didn't know it was happening, actually). Most of the
report was very accurate (and much appreciated). The "Scoutmaster"
comment was unfortunately not accurately reported.
I never said the word "Scoutmaster" in my Education Week class. The point I made was that in today's society, if there's a man in the ward who has an unusually strong desire to work in the church with young children, and pressed for the opportunity to hold a calling in the cub scouts or the primary, if I were the bishop, my first reaction would be to be suspicious, and then try to be very sensitive to the Spirit in making a calling decision.
Oh, and the reason I was focusing on LDS principles in this presentation? Two words: Education Week.
Check out the Internet Safety Podcast online (which I host) where we deal with all of these issues in greater detail, and it's a non-denominational audience (unlike Education Week, which is an LDS audience).
I hope this reduces some of the confusion and misunderstanding.
Charles Knutson
I never said the word "Scoutmaster" in my Education Week class. The point I made was that in today's society, if there's a man in the ward who has an unusually strong desire to work in the church with young children, and pressed for the opportunity to hold a calling in the cub scouts or the primary, if I were the bishop, my first reaction would be to be suspicious, and then try to be very sensitive to the Spirit in making a calling decision.
Oh, and the reason I was focusing on LDS principles in this presentation? Two words: Education Week.
Check out the Internet Safety Podcast online (which I host) where we deal with all of these issues in greater detail, and it's a non-denominational audience (unlike Education Week, which is an LDS audience).
I hope this reduces some of the confusion and misunderstanding.
Charles Knutson
Charles Knutson | 5:19 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
A couple other clarifications:
Sexual predators do, in fact, seek out opportunities to be near children, and this includes youth leaders, teachers, school crossing guards, etc. Not all youth leaders, teachers and school crossing guards are sexual predators (obviously).
The comments that suggest that I believe that *any* guy who wants to be the scoutmaster *must* be a predator is a bad leap of logic.
Of course, in a dangerous world, where sexual predators attempt to gain access to our children, an extra dose of caution is important.
Last thing... The article is a short report of a presentation that went more than an hour, not a complete essay on the topic. If the article didn't say it, it doesn't imply that I don't believe it (or didn't say it in the class).
Everything I taught in the class was centered around healthy parental relationship with your kids. Some commentors correctly identified this as critical, but several asserted incorrectly that I either didn't believe it or didn't say it. I do believe it and I did say it.
Sexual predators do, in fact, seek out opportunities to be near children, and this includes youth leaders, teachers, school crossing guards, etc. Not all youth leaders, teachers and school crossing guards are sexual predators (obviously).
The comments that suggest that I believe that *any* guy who wants to be the scoutmaster *must* be a predator is a bad leap of logic.
Of course, in a dangerous world, where sexual predators attempt to gain access to our children, an extra dose of caution is important.
Last thing... The article is a short report of a presentation that went more than an hour, not a complete essay on the topic. If the article didn't say it, it doesn't imply that I don't believe it (or didn't say it in the class).
Everything I taught in the class was centered around healthy parental relationship with your kids. Some commentors correctly identified this as critical, but several asserted incorrectly that I either didn't believe it or didn't say it. I do believe it and I did say it.
Ryan Larsen | 8:17 p.m. Aug. 22, 2008
It is also important to watch out for "adult" children, 18 and over.
They are particularly at risk because predators can get away with legally
soliciting them and can be far more aggressive in their grooming, such as
offering to take them on trips or offering to rent out a room at a very cheap
rate or for free. I think its a good idea for parents to let their kids stay at
home rent-free for a few years.
A VERY GRATEFUL MOM | 10:39 a.m. Aug. 23, 2008
Thank you so much for this article! I appreciate the CONSTANT reminders that
come in every way shape or form of the dangers and tactics of on-line predators!
I am more than willing to admit that I do not understand nor will I ever
comprehend the many devious ways in which predators work. As a citizen,
neighbor, friend, wife and mother I want to know anything and everything I can
to protect those I love!
PS: A QUESTION For those of you who are so focused on making this an issue about religion--What are you doing to protect your families and communities??
PS: A QUESTION For those of you who are so focused on making this an issue about religion--What are you doing to protect your families and communities??
Mother of 4 | 12:32 a.m. Aug. 24, 2008
I have four children...age 15 to 23. This was a good article (by the way Mr.
Knutson, thanks for the clarification, especially about the misquoted comment
about Scoutmasters). The best defense is always a good offense! Building strong
relationships with our children and being aware of the events in their life on a
daily basis is the best offense we can create. It will help to ward off their
insecurity and curiousity that might draw them to respond to predators. However,
I believe it is important to remember that although as LDS we are cautioned to
not be "of the world", we do live "in the world". This is a
world of technology. In our fast pace world, we can lose touch with family and
friends without the convenient use of technology. Also, if our children are
going to succeed in the future business world, there is a great chance they will
have to be efficent in the use of technology. The internet is a wonderful thing
when used properly. Instead of avoiding it, find the sites that can be uplifting
and positive.
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His description of "easy targets" is inaccurate. It's those whose parents seem over-bearing, who are always watching them and whose parents don't inform them of the seriousness of online predators that fall victim. They are taught to be trusting and to respect adults and authority figures.
They aren't taught to question authority and to ask questions. This is the type of children that sexual predators seek out. It's the child that he describes as being a "difficult target" that's the easiest for a predator to prey on.
Parents must learn to protect their children from predators and this guy is doing a grave injustice telling them that so long as they have dinner with their kids, hold family home evenings and monitor their computer that they will be safe.
He ignores the real symptom that predators prey on and that isn't feeling alone as much as it is feeling alienated from your parents and peers and that happens even with members who hold Family Home Evenings. I suggest Knutson stop giving bad advice to parents. Real relationships is key!