Comments about ‘Rights group teaching in S.L.’

We need to have a straight alliance. Groups like this don't encourage equality they encourage segregation.

Wake up, McCoy. A destructive democratic agenda does not equal progress, even in a conservative state like Utah. Too bad we aren't more conservative, freedom loving, that would be true progress.

I think it's important to have each side represented. It's obviously far from that on Utah's Capitol Hill.
I encourage them to meet. I encourage them get involved in the "creative politics" in this State. God knows 90% of us don't.

AS I read the story, this group's purpose is not to help the citizens of the state understand human rights, but rather, how to help the vocal minority push through their agenda.

"McCoy, one of three openly gay state lawmakers. "There is important work to be done working to elect fair-minded people."

I think he meant to say, "to elect people with an agenda to promote a deviant lifestyle and to change laws to promote immorality".

I don't think anyone should be elected who has an agenda that includes anything other than serving the constituents who voted them into office.

And they wonder why they cant win any races in Utah. The gay and lesbian agenda is not what the vast majority of utah citizens want in their community. I hope people see this as the Democrats trying to push their "morals" on us. Please dont vote for the democrats and say no to their agenda to hurt the family as we know it.

i wonder when divorce will be banned? what hurting more the institituion of marriage, gays and lesbians trying to get equal rights to married or opposite sex couples filing for divorce and remarrying?

We liberals are definitely trying to push our morals onto the rest of society. That's what any political constituency does: since politics is the arena in which we decide how we should collectively act, it is inherently a moral undertaking. No apology is necessary, and no honest apology is possible.

More than that though, we are trying to change people's hearts and minds, to help them see that "as you have done it unto the least of these my brethren, you have done it unto me." Change the culture, and the politics will take care of itself.

Most importantly, we are committed to persuasion by conversation. Unlike the non-liberal left, which exists in tiny pockets in certain university departments but almost nowhere else in the US, mainstream American liberals will not shout down or attempt to muzzle the ideas of their opponents, even as we vigorously challenge and refute them. You may be my adversary, but you are not my personal enemy. We respect people, but not their bad ideas.

I have to laugh, again we have a blind liberal saying gays don't have the same rights as straights. Can a straight man marry another man? NO! Straight men have no more rights than gay men.

I also find their denigration of anyone with morals quite insulting. Just because we don't support special rights for gays, we are not fair-minded. That's the best way to win an argument you can't win on logic, try diminish your opponent's position.

"The training runs all day at the Salt Lake County Government Center, 2001 S. State!?!"

Since when does the Salt Lake County Government Center open its doors to groups pushing a political position? Do the Republicans have training meetings at the Government Center? How much is this group paying to use these facilities?

And which of our elected officials is in the tank for this group?

Yes, all people are equally represented in Utah, yes exactly.

Some of you need to have a family member tell you that they have always been gay since the first memories of childhood.

Then turn your hate on them.

This is not the year 1600. Try to treat people with honor and respect. We all came from God, right?

lost in DC,

As the law currently stands (except in California and Massachusetts), Bob can marry Sue, but Ellen cannot marry Sue. Therefore, Bob has a right that Ellen does not. It's also true that Ellen can marry George while Bob cannot, and that therefore Ellen has a (different) right that Bob does not. But those are separate acts of discrimination. They do not cancel and make everything fair; they add, and make the situation doubly unfair.

I know it is weird to view it that way, and I sympathize, for it has taken me, a middle-aged liberal, a lifetime to realize it, but as odd as it seems, it is actually true.

Suppose, in some very unlikely scenario, heterosexual marriage was prohibited, while homosexual marriage was permitted. Would anyone still be saying that everyone had equal rights? Imagine being unable to marry the person you loved merely because you were of a different sex from them. And imagine the frustration you would experience as you saw same-sex couples free to marry merely because they shared the same gender.

response to lost in DC continued...

Or, even more oddly, imagine a society in which everyone could marry whom they please as long as the spouse did not share the same first initial. In a trivial sense, the law is fair to everyone, since it does not single out any class of people and it applies equally to everyone. But it is patently unfair in any profound sense, for it means that Joe cannot marry Janet while Tom can. Change "first initial" to "gender" and you have the current situation.

These are (deliberately) weird and ridiculous examples, but they are used to show the logic of the situation.