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The new majority

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Tommie | 4:49 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

To "Ignorant Tommie":

Those facts you gave are universal United States statistics. I was only talking about the Western United States, which no one will dispute has high illegal immigrant crime. California, Arizona, New Mexico, Texas, Nevada, Montanna, Wyoming, etc.

ALl of these states have high illegal immigrant crime. You can slant any fact your way if you want to, but the truth remains, illegal immigrants constitute a high amount of crime.

RE: Lost in America | 5:06 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

I know Manuel Velasco quite well. He speaks excellent English becuase he does not live in that bubble you speak of-- his family, neighbors, those he works with, all speak English. He is an example of the answer to your question 'why assimilate?'-- He has had great success here because he has gone about it the right way just like your grandparents. He has embraced the culture and language of Utah while still being loyal to where he came from just like many other immigrants.

Please keep in mind that not all Spanish speaking people have come here illegally or are unwilling to embrace the American culture. That is a blanket statement that is just incorrect, a xenophobic attitude.

More Illegals Please! | 5:12 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

You folks with giant hearts and compassion just think of the few following facts: 1) Most politicians and CEO's don't need social security for retirement, they welcome illegals 2) The billions of dollars spent on subsidizing illegal mexicans could be put into the social security fund 3) If social security is in trouble now, what do you think is going to happen in about 10 years when 30-40 million illegals in the workforce don't pay taxes (social security). Why pay taxes when the government gives subsidies to you and your family for free. So keep welcoming this problem but when you're in your retirement years and social security is obsolete you might wish you could go back in time and change your way of thinking on this subject.

Comments continue below

Confused | 5:47 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

I have 7 neighbors that are all active LDS church members, they all are fed up with illegal immigration and totally against it. Yet, they attend a faith, and give 10%, to a faith that supports illegal immigration. So are my neighbors the hypocrits or is their faith hypocritical? Also, someone please explain to me how a religious faith can support law breaking acts.

TOMMIE | 6:01 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

The LDS church doesn't support Illegal immigration, one of the articles of faith is to abide by the laws of the land.

The church may support immigration, but not when it is illegal.

RE: TOMMIE | 6:22 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

So I guess if the LDS church doesn't support illegal immigration then I must have been dreaming about some of the LDS leaders begging Utah legislators to be compassionate on illegal immigration laws. If they don't support illegal immigration why did they lobby the legislature as well as put an article on the front page of the SL Tribune announcing their "compassionate" position. You either fully support the law or you don't, you can't have it both ways. So I must assume then those particular leaders of the LDS church are hypocritical then and not the LDS church as a whole. I find that believable, yet pretty hard to believe.

John Pack Lambert | 6:28 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

To Fred,
Who are you talking about? The Germans who for 100 years were operating schools in German. Of maybe it is the Amish who have been here 300 years and still speak in German.
History is more complexed than you think.

John Pack Lambert | 6:35 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

To 5:29,
Mexico is not the only source of undocumented immigrants. I have known of undocumented immigrants in Metro Detroit from Albania and the Czech Republic. Many of the Brazilian immigrants in Louisiana are undocumented as are many second wives of Ivorian immigrants in New York City.
There were huge numbers of El Salvadorian and Guatemalan undocumented immigrants until most of them were given legal status under a broad variety of pressures.
I have read about undocumented immigrants in Utah from Venezuela, and if I thought longer on the issue I could think of more such groups. It is not only Mexicans.
On the other hand Mexico is the leading source of documented immigration to the United States.

John Pack Lambert | 6:42 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

To S Waterman,
English has never been the official language of the United States.
Stop your narrow minded attacks on other people.
How are Latinos every going to assimilate when there is so much hate against them?
Actually I have known children of Mexican immigrants who knew absolutely no Spanish. So your theories of non-assimilation are based on false premises.

John Pack Lambert | 6:51 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

To 8:43,
I will ask one courtesy of you. Learn Ute. Well, unless you live north of about Farmington, and then in that case learn Shoshone.
If you live in St. George, learn Paiute, but that is close enough to Ute we can fudge things and pretend they are the same. At least my nephew Tlazotlalia has a legitamate Uto-Aztecan name, which is more than most of you claimers of the land can say for yourselves.
I, here in Michigan, do not know Potawatami, but I also do not go around jeering at people "learn English" so I am not being hypocritical.
One last thing. At least for a while there was a U.S. army billboard a mile from my house with text in Arabic. I wonder how people will react to that?

l | 6:57 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

It is way past time for us to be teaching Spanish in elementary school. Waiting until junior high is putting kids past the prime time to learn a language. It helps in communicating with others, plus learning multiple languages helps you understand your own language better.

For that matter, with the growth that is going on in China, it would be a good idea to try to be ahead of the curve and start teaching Chinese in elementary school as well.

John Pack Lambert | 7:17 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

To Timmie,
"Whites" are not the majority in San Juan County. Native Americans, primarily Navajos, are the majority there.

John Pack Lambert | 7:24 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

To Dutch,
We are not gloating in not having Latinos in our midst. We are just glad that people around here to not start hate faving when they see one.

Rico | 7:26 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

I love it, I can't wait to hear you kissing our Latin butts in a few years, or trying to deny that you were ever that racist against us. The U.S. will have a Latino president within the next 20 years, I guarantee it. I speak Spanish and English, so does my wife and kids, we are citizens, and I'm a college graduate, but I'm so sick of people here treating us like second rate citizens. Just be patient Latinos, our day is coming. Viva La Raza!

Re: rico or whatever | 8:02 p.m. Aug. 14, 2008

I love it how many Hispanics in this country seem to claim the prosperity this country has seen as their own. You've come a bit late to do that. It is a bit like crashing the party and claiming you hosted it. Even better is the fact we can see how a Hispanically-run "party" handled just by looking at Mexico. Interesting that illegals came here because they did not like what they were getting in Mexico and then come here and try to make it Mexico.

california immigrants | 9:02 a.m. Aug. 15, 2008

What we really need is a wall between Utah and California. They're not coming here to assimilate, either. Californians come here and immediately buy the local legislators and start changing the laws so Utah will be more like California. If California is so great, why don't Californians just stay home?
People tend to leave one region to get away from their problems at home; but wherever you go, there you are. They don't escape their problems, they just pack their problems in the trunk with the rest of their junk. We then have to deal with problems we didn't ask for.
My ancestors moved here 150 years ago when it was a desert and made it bloom. The new immigrants have no sense of history or respect for the sacrifices that my ancestors made so they could live in peace and live by their values.

Utahboni

Loren | 12:45 p.m. Aug. 15, 2008

To all you English lovers...Have noticed we use a language borrowed from England? I guess we failed to assimilate with the Utes or other Native Americans? Maybe everyone should be forced to speak Navajo? My suggestion is you all get off your butts and learn whatever language you need to get your job done and enjoy life...Spanish, English, Chinese Arab, whatever...only knowing one language shows a pitiful lack of effort and education and is way to common in America. Berlitz is cheap and easy. Even Pres. Bush can speak Spanish.....come on....grow up....

Rico | 1:55 p.m. Aug. 15, 2008

I'm not Mexican, I'm a Boricua, Puertoriqueno. But my wife is Mexican, we just want to be represented in the Government. We aren't going anywhere.

Anonymous | 3:55 p.m. Aug. 15, 2008

I speak spanish and on the most part have a deep respect and love for latinos. The problem I have with many of them, however, is the lack of respect and sense of entitlement that seems inherent to their culture. As an example, my wife and I had dinner at Applebee's the other night. We were disgusted to see the mess a group of 5 ADULT latinos had made of the table next to us. It looked like they had a food fight. The busboys were completely disgusted and even more so when they found that no tip had been left. The latino culture is one of chaos, disrespect, and bending the rules. If they want to be fully accepted in the american society, those are things they need to change when they come here.

John | 9:37 p.m. Aug. 15, 2008

To all those who think illegal immigrants are a drain on society:

I went to BYU. My wife and I chose to wait to have kids until we were out of school and had worked a few years to save some money. All our neighbors thought we were crazy. If my wife quits her job, they'd say, you can have the baby on Medicare. No worries that you're in school and your wife stays home. You'll all have insurance through Medicare until you get a job.

What a joke. Talk about a drain on taxes. Whatever happened to the LDS people believing in industry and thrift? Self-sufficiency? Sounds like they don't mind the freebies, as long as they are receiving and not giving. How Christlike.

pursuit of profit | 10:48 p.m. Aug. 15, 2008

I love all of you knuckleheads blaming the 'leftists' and 'liberals' for illegal immigration; they're ALL to blame, the republicans as much as anyone. It's about big business; they all love seeing wages depressed and they love exploiting illegal labor. Wake up, simpletons. You're all beating the door down for a McCain-Romney ticket; McCain has fought for illegal immigration forever, and Romney has hired them and had them keeping up his yard, yet claimed he didn't know it. Open your eyes, they play you like a fiddle.

New order | 1:05 p.m. Aug. 16, 2008

And when that time arrives, I can see the United States breaking up into areas of racial religious and cultural differences each speaking their own languages and holding onto their customs. With out a unifying language to hold people together, this is what will happen. We will have nothing over the Middle East and Eastern Europe, We will be just like them. I hope cultural diversity will be pleased at their creation.

Eugene, OR | 5:07 p.m. Aug. 16, 2008

I've been from coast to coast, and I'm starting to think that the most racist people in America live in Utah. Oh, no, white people might not be the majority someday! How white people suffer! Salve our pain, talk radio!

I'm also sure that all of the complainers here are getting ready to quit their jobs so they can pick strawberries and clean hotel rooms for minimum wage...

Golden Rule | 12:10 a.m. Aug. 17, 2008

Eugene,

They will not suffer. Remember the golden rule. ï¿½He that has the gold makes the rulesï¿½ They will just be running things in the background.

Ralphalita | 2:59 p.m. Aug. 17, 2008

What golden rule? I haven't seen any golden rule going on with the street gangs. Funniest thing I have ever heard of. Go preach your golden rule to them who cause chaos. Although, they will pretend to listen but really wont.

The only real problem here | 6:37 p.m. Aug. 17, 2008

is the xenophobic mania that starts to prevail. No, we should not tolerate illegal immigration, but let's be a bit compassionate in understanding why these people are flocking here. They have families that need to be fed and dreams of financial stability just like YOU and ME. They are people too, and a differnet color of skin or a different language still does, always has, and sadly, probably always will cause people to view each other in a suspicious and uncharitable light. Yes, Latino gangs are violent and ugly. So are the gangs formed by any other ethnicity or nationality. They are a problem for both countries and should not be used as examples to stereotype any nationality. It was the Irish and the Jews and the Italians duking, knifing, and gunning it out just a short century ago. Get realistic.

To: Minority Member | 11:21 p.m. Aug. 17, 2008

Although well qualified for a position I was refused an interview because I do not speak spanish. When I filed a discrimination suit against them I was told that knowing how to speak spanish is a special skill. Pretty stinky if you ask me because it's not necessary for them to know how to speak english to get a job.

Also: Try being born in this country, serve in the military, be disabled and low income and see how fast you can get into subsidized or section 8 housing. Those not born here are given top priorty. We were first told it would be a year when we applied - it's going on to two years. I wonder if when I call if we will be told it will be another year. My husband get Social Security Disability it is not welfare. I know senior citizens who get SSI it is not welfare. I recently was able to get medicaid(PCN) but the care the state will cover is almost to the point of being substandard while a person here illegally can get better medical care for FREE

TO: I | 12:00 a.m. Aug. 18, 2008

In Massachusetts, Alaska and Florida spanish is being taught to all english children. For some it starts in kindergarten and other elementary school years. The parents have no say in this as it is a requirement. Gee I had to have my mom's permission to take it when I was in school

Since When | 1:28 a.m. Aug. 18, 2008

Since when did the term Illegal Alien get replaced by Illegal Immigrant?

Lynn | 7:22 a.m. Aug. 18, 2008

Well, try going to a restaurant that has illegals working for them, and have to use sign language to order a meal right here in the USA. Too weird! I do not care to learn Mexican Spanish...which is not the true Spanish language spoken in SPAIN.

Will somone... | 11:59 a.m. Aug. 18, 2008

please close the DANG border?

All better now! | 1:20 p.m. Aug. 18, 2008

The immigration problem in Utah, however, would come to a screaching halt if and only if the LDS prophet or high ranking official would denounce it, say it's wrong, and is not supported by the LDS church. Well, that will never happend since they begged the legislature to be compassionate in making illegal immigration laws last session. So, Utah deal with it because the religion that runs your state says that this illegal act is somehow worthy of compassion. With this clear position by the LDS the faithful will follow no matter how much it is killing our state and country. SAD!!!

Loren | 1:37 p.m. Aug. 18, 2008

True Spanish is not spoken in Spain since the time of Carlos the 5th (Mr. Lisp Guy). The true Spanish is closer to what Peruvians or Mexicans speak. Spain Spanish went nutso after independence....sort of like American English went a little nutso after our independence from ENGLAND...Maybe we should all try to speak English like the English? Maybe bring a torch or we'll have to "bin" all the non-England/ English speakers...Maybe we really speak American? Or more likely we speak an early version of Spanglish which will get fixed over the next 50 years...Language snobs are usually so uneducated! Ever tried to read Middle English? Beowolfe anyone?

Loren | 1:41 p.m. Aug. 18, 2008

Of course, what seems obvious is that whites are scared of losing political control of there dear neighborhoods even though they refuse to have enough kids maintain demographic control (demographics is more certain than death or taxes). Maybe the whites should get a mob together or have the Governor issue an Extermination Letter?!?! That worked for all those guys in Missouri?!?!? Yeah!! Get them!!! Rotten immigrants taking our jobs and scaring us?!

Oh wow! | 7:51 p.m. Aug. 18, 2008

I can't believe how insentive you are! What happened to being merciful? If nothing else please remember that these immigrants you are so willing to hate are human beings. Take a moment and see things from their side.

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