Comments about ‘Utah Jazz: Sloan long ago moved on from 1998’

Return to article »

Published: Thursday, June 19 2008 12:01 a.m. MDT

Comments
  • Oldest first
  • Newest first
  • Most recommended
Alex

Cmon guys, I'm a diehard Jazz fan and we can debate the 98 finals or the refs or the pushoff or whatever. But it is pretty common knowledge that Stockton was one of the dirtiest players of all time. Let's get down from the soapbox.

travis

The NBA game will change when/if the fans demand it by not watching or attending games. Tell the commish why you are not watching and follow through. The problem is that it would hurt the local team, and if it isn't done league wide nothing will happen.

no2ndOsama

Let's all take the same degree of emotion and put it into somthing we have control over: Stopping the Osama-Obama/Socialist express!

400ex

I'm moving on. Does it seem to anyone else that with a week before the nba draft the Jazz have had very few work outs with draft prospects? Is there a trade set up, do they already have it worked out to get what they want?

Chad

I seem to also recall another controversial call (or non-call) involving a Jeff Horny 3-pointer in that game, sometime either late 3rd or early 4th. I can't recall the exact situation, if it was another shot clock violation called that should not have been, if they said he toe was on the line for a 3 when it wasn't...something along those lines. Anyone recall? In any case, I believe this was another horrible call and the kind that shouldn't be missed - a non-judgement call. Fouls like the MJ one on B-Russ are calls that I can swallow easier, though it did seem like a push.

Mike W

no2ndOsama, have you forgotten it was George Bush Sr.'s families that had such close ties with the Bin Laden family? Have you forgotten George W. Bush has failed 7 years later to capture the man responsible for the attack that has killed 3000 Americans on American soil? And you're worried about Obama?

I agree the Jazz got hosed in the Eisley call and the Harper call, those are both reviewable and should've been fixed... I've always thought the push off on Russell was ok, no way any ref makes that call in the closing seconds. People need to remember that the Jazz and Karl Malone benefitted from the refs for many years. Malone led the league in FT attempts something like 7 or 8 times, while Jordan led once, and Kobe led once... we've gotten our share of calls too...

GIVE IT UP

The NBA is fixed??? Really.... well it I guess it really benefited the league when San Antonio, the 38th largest media market, won the championship three times. They probably loved setting up that boring, barely-watched Detroit/Spurs series. Everyone is the recipient of bad calls, everyone feels liked they're picked on, every team that loses in the playoffs feels like 'The Man' is keeping them down.

Let's remember, the Jazz had the ball with under a minute to go and a one-point lead. Karl got stripped and we didn't even get a shot off. Then, after Jordan's eventual game-winner, we still had plenty of time to come up with one of our own, but we didn't even get a shot off. Whose fault is that? Some of the calls were bad, but when you have multiple chances to win, whose fault is it really?

No debate. Bavetta Admits Errors

Dick Bevetta came out in the last couple of years and admitted they missed both 24-second calls 'debated' here and elsewhere.

The debate is moot. We have the video evidence and Bavetta admitted it - belatedly.

Team Player

I agree with 400ex, lets just move on... the '98 finals is an ancient and exhausted debate. I think the Jazz have had few workouts because they have a very well stocked roster already. I'm guessing their going to trade away some or all of their 3 picks. If they keep one, I'm hoping they do get Roy Hibbert, but its starting to look like they may need to trade up a little to get him.

Big Time Jazz Fan

Yeah, Russell got pushed a bit to create space, Howard Eisley got robbed, and Ron Harper got away with one. That's not evidence of a conspiracy though. Consider this... 1997, Western Conference Finals Game 6... John Stockton's miracle shot (anyone remember how great that was?? I was watching while working for a caterer, and I burst out of the kitchen and started hugging random guests at the wedding!). Great moment in Jazz lore, but go watch the replay on Youtube sometime. Karl Malone literally bear-hugged Clyde Drexler to keep him from contesting Stockton's shot. It was up to Barkley to rumble out and try to challenge it, but he had no chance.

The bottom line is this: calls go both ways. We got bailed out with a no-call in that game, we lost after a (few) tough no calls in the Finals the next year. Not a conspiracy, just life.

Jazz fault

The Jazz had their chances. If Karl Malones has any clue that Jordan stopped following Hornacek through the key and came back, Malone hits Horney for an easy lay up and the Bulls would have to hit a 3 just to send it to overtime.

Don't forget that AFTER Jordans game winning shot, Stockton had a WIDE OPEN THREE AND HE MISSED when the ball hit the back of the rim and bounced out. There were calls the Jazz got hosed on, but they still could have won that game, if they would have just executed one more time.

Yes the NBA is Fixed

As I recall there is a NBA ref that is admitting to fixing games for all the gambling refs and also because the NBA told him to fix games.

Tuffy Parker

So Bill... If I understand your point, you're saying that because John Stockton was a "dirty" player and somehow received preferential treatment, that now justifies all bad calls/no-calls. Is that right?

I may be confused but it sounds to me like your post might be "biased" toward bashing John Stockton rather than about the quality of NBA officiating.

Bomar

NBA officiating has played a big part in who wins important games, yes there are series that the officiating can't control i.e. the sweep of the Lakers prior to the finals. On the other hand the officials have determined who won. The NBAs mouthpieces continually talked up the desired finals teams which they got and see who is officiating these important games. Stern does not have to make calls or talk to anyone, they just assign those company officials to the games. Trust me Donaghy is not the only one who is dirty. What about those that were convicted of tax evasion for selling their 1st class plane tickets and buying coach tickets and pocketing the difference and some of those were never fired and then there is Joey Crawford. What is he doing blowing the whistle again especially games involving the Spurs. For these reasons and many more I don't think we can take the NBA any more seriously than the WWE.

Obama and Jazz fan in Cache

No2nd Osama,

From a "vicious Mormon Jazz fan" I tell you to shut up with your Obama bashing. Obama will be a much better president than George W. Bush. And contrary to what many Deseret News reading think, you can be a "card holding" Mormon Democrat! I do not have a major problem with Jordan's steal of Malone, even though he did hit Malone's hand, or Jordan's pushoff on Bryon Russell. Referees almost always swallow their whistles in those situations at the end of games, especially in the playoffs, even more so in the Finals. Michael Jordan was never going to be called for a foul in those situations. The referees generally give the benefit of the doubt to the road team, because they are playing so well in a hostile environment, if they are still in the game like the Bulls were, only down one point. My problem is that Bavetta and company waved off Eisley's three and tacked on Harper's late 2-pointer. The Bulls would have been down by six when Jordan stole the ball from Malone and there would have been a game 7. Although no ones knows who would have won game 7 in SLC.

Obama and Jazz fan in Cache

"readers" not reading

Tuffy Parker

The truth of the matter is that NBA officiating is inconsistent at best, biased at worst. The NBA is a business with a focus on making as much money as possible. Stars and large markets drive more revenue. Anyone who claims that these factors don't have some influence on officiating is wearing some serious blinders.

While some big Orwellian type control or conspiracy is highly unlikely, I beg someone to definitively show that there are not multiple standards applied to overall NBA officiating.

In regard to GIVE IT UP's post about San Antonio - they are/were loaded with stars with appeal outside their home market.

Also keep in mind that there are some teams that have enough talent and focus that the quality of officiating has little bearing on the outcome of games. The true championship caliber teams are the ones that can transcend the external factors and win regardless.

Unfortunately, the Jazz have never been at that level. Love or hate MJ, his competitive fire could always elevate him to a higher level in tight situations. Stock had some of that too but didn't have the same athletic ability. Malone couldn't elevate his game leaving us 0-for-2.

Just what i think

To: Jerry, Jerry, Jerry

Whistle blowers always lose. Do you know what would happen to Jerry Sloan if he publicly complained about calls and questioned the integrity of the NBA officials? Jeff Van Gundy did it and look what happened to him! We would get even less calls and even more unfair officiating the next time around. Thats why you can't dwell on it!

To: Give it up

When people say the NBA is fixed they are not claiming that the best team never wins. Its just that in close games in crucial juntures the calls always seem to go the the team with the biggest star and market. If the game isn't close it can't happen. So between two pretty evenly matched teams the officials can make a huge difference. You can try as hard as you want to convince me the Lakers are better than the Jazz this year and you will never do it. Its just that the Jazz and Lakers are pretty evenly matched and so his royal highness Kobe and the Lakers got the calls and the series!

Lot of good it did them cause they ran into Boston who actually plays defense!

Bill

No bias here Tuffy, I have nothing against dirty players. It takes all kinds to make the NBA and world go around. My point is let's be honest. Stockton got away with as many non-calls as anyone. Things have a way of evening themselves out. Kind of like this thread. When I first read it, all I saw was the Jazz got robbed and every call went against them. Now I look back and the last few posters have offered a less one-sided opinion. Not wrong or right, just different.

Beer Drinking Bud

The question I have is would there have been a foul called on Russell if Jordan had missed the shot? None of the players wants to find out there efforts were in vain. It takes all of the sense of accomplishment and pride away from the game if the refs have been slanting the games. But, it's hard to ignore the blatant missed calls and questionable calls that seem to control the flow of the game so often. I laugh when they are asked, "Coach, What do you need to do to win the game?" The bottom line is put the ball thru the hoop more often than your opponents. Score enough points by a big enough margin and the bad calls don't hurt so much. If the starters are on the bench in foul trouble, then the bench has to pick up the slack. Use their talent and hustle!!!

to comment

DeseretNews.com encourages a civil dialogue among its readers. We welcome your thoughtful comments.
About comments