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LDS black leaders call for spirit of unity
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Brilliant | 1:00 a.m. June 9, 2008
This is a refreshing story. Too often minority leaders in America focus on
something that pulls us apart. It is so wonderful to hear of leaders who speak
of matters that bring us together. The world is better when we work together
rather than separate ourselves. I wish more of these leaders could be more
prominent to offset the outlandish hypocrisy of bigots like Jesse Jackson and Al
Sharpton.
Bookaholic | 1:06 a.m. June 9, 2008
Wow, a lot of truly inspired people contributed to this article, some real
spiritual giants. Very uplifting. They really focus one's attention on the
essence of the gospel of Christ. Makes me want to be a better person and
parent.
I pray the gospel will continue to spread to all corners of the earth. I've always pictured the Lord at the head of a long table with many empty chairs and him weeping with joy when an empty chair was filled. He wants all of us of every color, hue and ethnicity to be with him. If people are open-minded enough to investigate and pray with real intent, they will receive a testimony of Christ and his Church as these fine people have done.
I remember when the announcement was made. Like so many others, I wept with joy. It is really incredibly rewarding to see great spirits like those highlighted stepping forward to lead us to Christ. They have my deepest regard and respect.
Thank you for a wonderful article.
I pray the gospel will continue to spread to all corners of the earth. I've always pictured the Lord at the head of a long table with many empty chairs and him weeping with joy when an empty chair was filled. He wants all of us of every color, hue and ethnicity to be with him. If people are open-minded enough to investigate and pray with real intent, they will receive a testimony of Christ and his Church as these fine people have done.
I remember when the announcement was made. Like so many others, I wept with joy. It is really incredibly rewarding to see great spirits like those highlighted stepping forward to lead us to Christ. They have my deepest regard and respect.
Thank you for a wonderful article.
Comments continue below
Don't insult more by explaining | 1:26 a.m. June 9, 2008
Brilliant (1:00 a.m.),
"This is a refreshing story. Too often minority leaders in America focus on something that pulls us apart. It is so wonderful to hear of leaders who speak of matters that bring us together."
That's the problem and nothing has really changed because of your attitude. If blacks lick our boots and forgive us for every past injustice we applaud them for doing so because it benefits us but when they do the opposite and condemn us for our current racism we feign outrage.
"I wish more of these leaders could be more prominent to offset the outlandish hypocrisy of bigots like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton."
That's what this really comes down to isn't it? If they are good "boys" and do what "blacks" should do and lick your boots you praise them but if they challenge you current racism you accuse them of being bigots.
The one thing the Church needs to do on this for any real healing to take place is to say that the priesthood ban was not inspired of God and that it was the result of racism on the part of members and leaders of the Church.
"This is a refreshing story. Too often minority leaders in America focus on something that pulls us apart. It is so wonderful to hear of leaders who speak of matters that bring us together."
That's the problem and nothing has really changed because of your attitude. If blacks lick our boots and forgive us for every past injustice we applaud them for doing so because it benefits us but when they do the opposite and condemn us for our current racism we feign outrage.
"I wish more of these leaders could be more prominent to offset the outlandish hypocrisy of bigots like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton."
That's what this really comes down to isn't it? If they are good "boys" and do what "blacks" should do and lick your boots you praise them but if they challenge you current racism you accuse them of being bigots.
The one thing the Church needs to do on this for any real healing to take place is to say that the priesthood ban was not inspired of God and that it was the result of racism on the part of members and leaders of the Church.
Tom | 1:50 a.m. June 9, 2008
Wonderful article.
Wonderful day | 3:37 a.m. June 9, 2008
Last Sunday, I was able to attend a baptismal service of an African American
man. After his baptism, during the bearing of his testimony, he told of his
conversion story. Another African American bother talked about his conversion as
one of the speakers. There were few dry eyes in the congregation! We are so
blessed to live during these times! Welcome to all our black brothers and
sisters! You will be such a great blessing to all of us!
Brother Chuck Schroeder | 5:43 a.m. June 9, 2008
After being a LDS member for the past 50 years - it seems as if every year,
someone has to bring up "the race-card" in Church.
"Though they may not fully understand the reasons for the LDS Church's one-time ban on priesthood for black males, three black leaders of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints called for a spirit of unity amid the growing diversity within the church on Sunday"
We need to LEARN FROM HISTORY, (not dwell in it), so that we don't do that same wrong all over again from History, and a lesson was found in it.
I had a "flashback" after reading this story - when a BLACK called for a spirit of unity amid the growing diversity within the church - it almost reminded me of what Rodney King had said as well, with his "can't we all just get along" after the riots in CA. GET OVER IT WILL YA?. No matter how it's said, it's still "playing the race-card."
"Though they may not fully understand the reasons for the LDS Church's one-time ban on priesthood for black males, three black leaders of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints called for a spirit of unity amid the growing diversity within the church on Sunday"
We need to LEARN FROM HISTORY, (not dwell in it), so that we don't do that same wrong all over again from History, and a lesson was found in it.
I had a "flashback" after reading this story - when a BLACK called for a spirit of unity amid the growing diversity within the church - it almost reminded me of what Rodney King had said as well, with his "can't we all just get along" after the riots in CA. GET OVER IT WILL YA?. No matter how it's said, it's still "playing the race-card."
Lance | 6:12 a.m. June 9, 2008
Back in the days of the twelve tribes of Israel, the only tribe who was allowed
the priesthood was the Levites. It didn't mean that the other tribes were
bad or couldn't be members, nor did it mean that the other tribes would
never be priests. We know that later on, members of other tribes would hold the
Melchizedek Priesthood. So who knows why the Lord only wanted the priesthood to
be with one tribe at one time? As long as all of his children are eventually
entitled to the same blessings, who cares?
Carole Knowles | 6:33 a.m. June 9, 2008
It must have been a wonderful meeting. I wish I had been there.
We spend too much energy affirming who we are rather than seeking a testimony of the divinity of our Savior Jesus Christ, and earnestly trying to become like Him. When we know Christ, we know ourselves. No one, black nor white, will stand in this church without a firm testimony of its truthfulness, .
What a difference between that meeting and what happened on the streets of Salt Lake in the Gay Pride Parade. One seeking God's glory. The other, their own pride.
We spend too much energy affirming who we are rather than seeking a testimony of the divinity of our Savior Jesus Christ, and earnestly trying to become like Him. When we know Christ, we know ourselves. No one, black nor white, will stand in this church without a firm testimony of its truthfulness, .
What a difference between that meeting and what happened on the streets of Salt Lake in the Gay Pride Parade. One seeking God's glory. The other, their own pride.
Anonymous | 6:40 a.m. June 9, 2008
how is it that leaders like jesse jackson is bigotted but no-one points out that
ezra taft benson actually ran with george wallace, in his fight for the white
house. black people accept the priesthood and the story that went with that but
that doesn't mean they have to forget their history. jews don't
forget their history, why is it bigotry for blacks not to forget theirs?
heleninoz | 6:51 a.m. June 9, 2008
Just some excerpts from Wikipedia.
Elijah Abel (July 25, 1810 � December 25, 1884) was the first black elder and seventy in the Latter Day Saint movement, and one of the few black members in the early history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to receive the priesthood.
Abel was born in Maryland as a slave. He was baptized into the Church of Christ in September 1832.
Abel was ordained an elder on March 3, 1836 in Kirtland, by Joseph Smith, Jr. In December 1836, he was ordained a seventy. In 1839, Abel was made a member of the Nauvoo Seventies Quorum. He worked as a mortician. He was a carpenter by profession and assisted in the construction of temples in Kirtland, Nauvoo, and Salt Lake City.
In 1843, Abel served a mission in New York.
In 1847, he accompanied Brigham Young to Utah Territory. In 1884 he served a final mission in Canada, during which he became ill. He died upon his return home.
Abel's son Enoch and Enoch's son Elijah � were ordained to the priesthood: Enoch was ordained an elder on November 27, 1900; and Elijah was ordained an elder on September 29, 1935.
Elijah Abel (July 25, 1810 � December 25, 1884) was the first black elder and seventy in the Latter Day Saint movement, and one of the few black members in the early history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to receive the priesthood.
Abel was born in Maryland as a slave. He was baptized into the Church of Christ in September 1832.
Abel was ordained an elder on March 3, 1836 in Kirtland, by Joseph Smith, Jr. In December 1836, he was ordained a seventy. In 1839, Abel was made a member of the Nauvoo Seventies Quorum. He worked as a mortician. He was a carpenter by profession and assisted in the construction of temples in Kirtland, Nauvoo, and Salt Lake City.
In 1843, Abel served a mission in New York.
In 1847, he accompanied Brigham Young to Utah Territory. In 1884 he served a final mission in Canada, during which he became ill. He died upon his return home.
Abel's son Enoch and Enoch's son Elijah � were ordained to the priesthood: Enoch was ordained an elder on November 27, 1900; and Elijah was ordained an elder on September 29, 1935.
Most Awesome | 6:51 a.m. June 9, 2008
I was blessed to sing in the choir. It was one of the most special, spirtual
and AWESOME experience to be there and feel the spirit, and hear the words the
Lord wanted us to hear.
apart=divided | 6:53 a.m. June 9, 2008
What would expect from a culture that spends all its time setting itself apart?
Happy | 7:00 a.m. June 9, 2008
As me, my wife and 2 children are the only Latter-Day Saints who are white (and
one other Sister) in our congregation, I am happy to know that what was quoted
in this article is true. I know my family is considered by my Brothers and
Sisters as "thier People" in the Branch and I know that I will
eternally love and cherish "my people" that I worship with too. We are
all Latter-Day Saints, who by God's design have different color of skin and
different habits and culture. To that I say I am happy too!
Swish, Swish | 7:03 a.m. June 9, 2008
I hear someting being swept under the rug...
Distance Traveled! | 7:07 a.m. June 9, 2008
My wife was talking with her Father a couple of months ago. He is a Democrat
(one of the 5 in Utah) and is 80 years old. He finished 6th grade before he
started working for the Railroad. He weighed in on all of the issues that
Hillary and Barack were representing and talked of the coming election. He is
old-fashioned and very set in his ways. I was so happy to hear from my wife
that he talked for 30 minutes about a woman and a African-American who are
candidates for the Pres of the US and never once refered to their gender or
race! He saw two candidates. These are the steps that we need to take as a
country and as a culture that are neccessary for us to see all Saints as just
that: Saints!
John | 7:10 a.m. June 9, 2008
Fantastic article! I'm glad they held this meeting.
Leigh Little | 7:18 a.m. June 9, 2008
I would like to ask something I have wondered about. What does the church say
about interracial marriage? Is it possible to have such a marriage in the
temple?
Anonymous | 7:20 a.m. June 9, 2008
Wish this had been broadcast.
Camille | 7:29 a.m. June 9, 2008
Great Article. My husband and son went to the Tabernacle to see the program. My
young son came home and joyously announced that he met Big T (Thural
Bailey)while he was there. And that Big T shook his hand and talked with him. He
was thrilled! My husband and son also enjoyed the talks that were presented and
my son learned alot. It was an uplifting experience for both of them. And I
would like to thank Big T. for being such a positive influence for young people.
And being a great example for others who are not members of the Church of Jesus
Christ of Latter Day Saints. (LDS Church) and for those, like yourself, who are.
Wonderful Example | 7:41 a.m. June 9, 2008
I'm a Utah boy who married and then moved to Atlanta, living in the Atlanta
Ward. Fred Parker was the Bishop of that ward while we were there, what a
wonderful example of hard work and endurance he was to the ward. We had such an
amazing relationship in that ward and Bishop Parker was one of the reasons for
it. Especially convincing was the way he helped people realize they
weren't 'stuck' in any situation, that we could work our way out
of any bad spot, economic or social. What a wonderful message that was, to
offer hope to those who might feel none. Thank you, Bishop Parker, for your
testimony, strength, and example!
Aaron | 7:50 a.m. June 9, 2008
> "A small group of protesters gathered outside the grounds of Temple
Square Sunday evening to advocate for the issuance of a formal apology and open
recognition from the church for having prohibited black men from entering the
priesthood."
Having been there with MRM I have to say: it's obvious that the church admits they prohibited blacks from entering the Mormon priesthood. What we specifically want (and what I wish the reported had undershood) is recognition that the prohibition and the not-valiant-in-premorality explanation behind it were taught far more than a mere policy or as mere folklore. Consider the 1949(or 51?) LDS First Presidency statement:
"It is not a matter of the declaration of a policy but of direct commandment from the Lord, on which is founded the doctrine of the Church from the days of its organization..." They go on to say, "The position of the Church regarding the Negro may be understood when another doctrine of the church is kept in mind, namely, that the conduct of spirits in the pre-mortal existence has some determining effect upon the conditions and circumstances under which these spirits take on mortality..."
A lack of apology indicates a lack of integrity.
Having been there with MRM I have to say: it's obvious that the church admits they prohibited blacks from entering the Mormon priesthood. What we specifically want (and what I wish the reported had undershood) is recognition that the prohibition and the not-valiant-in-premorality explanation behind it were taught far more than a mere policy or as mere folklore. Consider the 1949(or 51?) LDS First Presidency statement:
"It is not a matter of the declaration of a policy but of direct commandment from the Lord, on which is founded the doctrine of the Church from the days of its organization..." They go on to say, "The position of the Church regarding the Negro may be understood when another doctrine of the church is kept in mind, namely, that the conduct of spirits in the pre-mortal existence has some determining effect upon the conditions and circumstances under which these spirits take on mortality..."
A lack of apology indicates a lack of integrity.
Aaron | 7:53 a.m. June 9, 2008
I meant "reporter", not "reported"
LDS in Texas | 8:07 a.m. June 9, 2008
I wished I could have attended the commemoration.
re: Don't insult more | 8:33 a.m. June 9, 2008
Where do you get your bellicosity? It sounds like Brilliant was commending
people who hope to unify rather than divide. You fabricated the subservience out
of thin air. What I want is for all people to live peacefully together. I hope
that doesn't make me a person who wants Blacks to lick my boots. Grow up
already!
Reality | 8:34 a.m. June 9, 2008
I wasn't aware that there were any black leaders in the LDS Church.
wrz | 8:39 a.m. June 9, 2008
"I cannot understand why, especially in view of the wonderful, faithful
black members of the church clear back to the the beginning..."
Check the old Testament. The Israelites were the "chosen" people. If there were chosen folks, then there were unchosen. Further, only the tribe of Levi were priests officiating in priesthood functions (i.e., held the priesthood).
For that matter, check the New Testament. Christ sent the gospel FIRST the Jew and THEN the Gentile.
Women don't, to this day, hold the priesthood... In many churches.
Go figure.
Check the old Testament. The Israelites were the "chosen" people. If there were chosen folks, then there were unchosen. Further, only the tribe of Levi were priests officiating in priesthood functions (i.e., held the priesthood).
For that matter, check the New Testament. Christ sent the gospel FIRST the Jew and THEN the Gentile.
Women don't, to this day, hold the priesthood... In many churches.
Go figure.
UTmouser1 | 8:50 a.m. June 9, 2008
Has it never occured to anyone that up until 1978 there were people still living
who were part and parcel of the Civil War and already members? Just as the House
of Israel wandered in the wilderness until all of those who had favor with the
Egyptian King had passed away, perhaps this ban had less to do with those of
Afican descent than it had to do with men who held the priesthood already. I do
not know the reason but am glad that today I can share the gospel with members
of all races. Regardless of my color or ethnic background, first and foremost, I
am a Child of God who enjoys the company of ALL my eternal family members.
Des. News Reader | 9:09 a.m. June 9, 2008
Re: Leigh Little: Of course you can have an inter-racial temple marriage! The
temple is for all worthy members! Good question.
Robo | 9:14 a.m. June 9, 2008
God doesn't provide instruction that the people as a whole are not ready to
receive (Moses and the children of Israel for example). The whole country was
racist and slavery was prominent when the church was established. Racism
continued generally in the US on through into the 1960s and 1970s. Blacks
holding the priesthood just wouldn't have worked because of this. The
various reasons given for that stance were for that time. When the people of
the church were ready, the policy was changed. Revelation is always timely and
for that particular time. Our most recent living prophet, President Hinckley
made it very clear that there was no room for racism in the church. That
teaching supercedes ANY previous teachings on the subject. It seems to me that
black members of the church understand that. Was it radcist for Jesus to preach
only to the House of Israel, first unto the Jews and then unto the Gentiles?
Everything in its order in the wisdom of God.
The reason | 9:19 a.m. June 9, 2008
I believe the reason why blacks were not allowed to bear the Priesthood until
1978 was because of a prevailing racist culture up preceding it.
It's the same reason why Moses did not give the "higher" law to the Israelites instead of the 10 commandments was because the people were not ready for it yet.
God is not going to force doctrine down the throats of his people if not enough are ready to accept it. Had Brigham Young authorized blacks to receive the Priesthood it would have been a huge disaster. Unfortunately, most people at the time saw blacks as inferior.
God doesn't choose super-heroes to join his church. He chooses 'the least among us' and molds us into super-men.
It's the same reason why Moses did not give the "higher" law to the Israelites instead of the 10 commandments was because the people were not ready for it yet.
God is not going to force doctrine down the throats of his people if not enough are ready to accept it. Had Brigham Young authorized blacks to receive the Priesthood it would have been a huge disaster. Unfortunately, most people at the time saw blacks as inferior.
God doesn't choose super-heroes to join his church. He chooses 'the least among us' and molds us into super-men.
kraig | 9:20 a.m. June 9, 2008
Leigh, yes you can have such a marriage in the Temple, I have two black friends
who married white girls in the Temple. I am truly amazed at the strength and
faith of our Black brothers. Thank you for your examples.As for Aaron I am sorry
you feel that way, I have not met any Black LDS people that have your same view,
and I have met dozens.
Duh | 9:20 a.m. June 9, 2008
>the conduct of spirits in the pre-mortal existence has some determining
effect upon the conditions and circumstances under which these spirits take on
mortality.
That should go without saying if one believes that God provides us with experiences in this life that are the experiences we need. We each come into this life prepared for different things and needing different things. That state is a result of the choices we made in our pre-mortal existence. That does not, and has never been implied by the Church to mean, that a person born into one situation has more or less value than one born into a different situation. It merely means that God puts us in the circumstances that are tailored for our individual needs and abilities. Reading more into it is nothing less than a juvenile attempt to manufacture victimhood.
That should go without saying if one believes that God provides us with experiences in this life that are the experiences we need. We each come into this life prepared for different things and needing different things. That state is a result of the choices we made in our pre-mortal existence. That does not, and has never been implied by the Church to mean, that a person born into one situation has more or less value than one born into a different situation. It merely means that God puts us in the circumstances that are tailored for our individual needs and abilities. Reading more into it is nothing less than a juvenile attempt to manufacture victimhood.
God is Great! | 9:22 a.m. June 9, 2008
To Leigh Little: Of course there are interracial marriages in the temple, I
personally know of several; including a marriage taking place in July of a
Nigerian and a white girl from Utah. Just look at Thurl Bailey. Wow! God is
great!
To Aaron | 9:23 a.m. June 9, 2008
Your quote is interesting and, what you may not have considered, is that it
applies to all of us. I have a retarded son. That doctrine covers him, too. It
doesn't mean, at least to me, that he is being punished, any more than
starving children in third world countries are being punished for some problem
in the spirit world. It may mean that, since each of us accepted where we were
to be sent and the conditions thereof, that the place we came is somehow for our
eternal good, no matter how terrible the conditions are while we are here. And
conditions all over the world, throughout recorded history, have been terribly
hard for most of us. I believe that those of us who were willing to forego
certain privileges here may well have been the stronger spirits and may even
have chosen to come into situations that may well try those around us far more
than us.
As I said in my first post, this was difficult for me, but one of my dear black friends (non-LDS) whose daughter was healed by the missionaries, told me she was quite comfortable with it! Surprised the heck out of me.
As I said in my first post, this was difficult for me, but one of my dear black friends (non-LDS) whose daughter was healed by the missionaries, told me she was quite comfortable with it! Surprised the heck out of me.
Aaron | 9:32 a.m. June 9, 2008
wrz, God's love for the Jews was based on unconditional love, not a racist
"you [insert skin color or ethnic group] were more valiant in the
pre-existence" doctrine. Grace by its nature isn't obligatory. Justice
is.
CA | 9:36 a.m. June 9, 2008
Aaron....Where can I find the whole quote you posted? I like to have sources and
the whole conext of things posted online because things can be interpeted many
ways when you don't.
Leigh Little....A man and a woman of any race/races can be sealed in the temple.
Leigh Little....A man and a woman of any race/races can be sealed in the temple.
Ronald | 10:08 a.m. June 9, 2008
I hope there will be a black church president soon we need some color and life
in the church.
this is absurd | 10:12 a.m. June 9, 2008
a brief perusal of the B of M will give you volumes of racist connotations that
may NEVER go away.
Phil | 10:12 a.m. June 9, 2008
Priesthood has nothing to do with skin color. It is a matter of lineage and
covenants. God made certain promises to the ancient fathers that He swore to
fulfill. In the time of Moses, the priesthood was taken from everyone except the
descendants of one family--because Israel broke the covenant. Yet among their
descendants were many righteous Israelites who had no access to priesthood. The
lineage of Ham didn't have priesthood not because of who they were but
because one of their ancestors broke the covenant.
Dave Thomas | 10:23 a.m. June 9, 2008
In the beginning, the Church once ordained black men to the priesthood. Then the
Church declared black men ineligible. Many decades later, the Church decided it
was okay again for them to hold the priesthood.
The fact that black people originally held the priesthood suggests there wasn't any eternal or divine reason for revoking that policy -- unless you assume Joseph Smith was wrong to authorize the black ordinations.
Look, I'm sincerely happy that black and other Church members can find ways to make peace with this part of the Church's legacy. But it doesn't change the obvious facts: The policy of withholding the priesthood was obviously a result of racism and bigotry among the Church's leadership (no doubt reflecting the attitudes of the general membership). The mental gymnastics you have to perform to avoid this conclusion are stunning.
The Church is made of people, and people (including leaders) often make stupid and terrible mistakes. Until LDS people (and I'm one of them) accept and own this particular mistake, we'll never put it behind us.
The fact that black people originally held the priesthood suggests there wasn't any eternal or divine reason for revoking that policy -- unless you assume Joseph Smith was wrong to authorize the black ordinations.
Look, I'm sincerely happy that black and other Church members can find ways to make peace with this part of the Church's legacy. But it doesn't change the obvious facts: The policy of withholding the priesthood was obviously a result of racism and bigotry among the Church's leadership (no doubt reflecting the attitudes of the general membership). The mental gymnastics you have to perform to avoid this conclusion are stunning.
The Church is made of people, and people (including leaders) often make stupid and terrible mistakes. Until LDS people (and I'm one of them) accept and own this particular mistake, we'll never put it behind us.
Aaron | 10:35 a.m. June 9, 2008
CA, google a phrase of the quote and you'll find the larger context
quickly. Or you can go to the web site of Mormonism Research Ministry.
To Dave Thomas | 10:40 a.m. June 9, 2008
I'm afraid you're a little misinformed. Joseph Smith gave SOME black
people the priesthood, but not all or even most of them. Between his death and
the 1978 revelation, there were other people of ALL skin colors that recieved
the priesthood while many others did not. Heavenly Father has His reasons for
setting things up the way He did. Just because we don't understand what
they may be does not mean that they weren't very real and very important at
the time. Please go and read D&C 58:3.
Anonymous | 10:53 a.m. June 9, 2008
Why do Black church leaders have to call for unity? After 30 years -- more than
a generation -- since the 1978 declaration why isn't there already unity?
RE: Dave Thomas | 11:02 a.m. June 9, 2008
How can it be right for someone to apologize for the actions of others when we
can in no way know the reasons for those actions? Our context and life
experience is very different from theirs. We can only guess what actual
revelations were given to Joseph Smith and Brigham Young. We can only imagine
what it was like to live in that time, and we can't begin to suppose that
we know the full intentions of God. An apology would be placing blame on someone
or something that we only have pieces of knowledge.
We do know, however, what the church does for the lives of its members and the service it provides in the world now, in our time. We can only move forward. Negativity and blame casting only divide and push us backwards. I'm personaly thrilled at the growing diversity in our church from all cultures. Welcome to all. The gospel brings joy and blessings to everyone willing to live it.
We do know, however, what the church does for the lives of its members and the service it provides in the world now, in our time. We can only move forward. Negativity and blame casting only divide and push us backwards. I'm personaly thrilled at the growing diversity in our church from all cultures. Welcome to all. The gospel brings joy and blessings to everyone willing to live it.
DNeal | 11:17 a.m. June 9, 2008
As Laman and Lemuel complained..."These are hard things.." This is a
hard thing to fully understand, but I'm still trying to grasp the fullness
of the atonement. I honestly believe some things just have to be taken on
faith. Since I sustained President Kimball, I know that The Lord works through
His Prophets. If their is consternation within the church, then I cry out loud
that we all repent and move forward. It really is that simple...we are all
children of a kind and loving Heavenly Father. Simple as that. I can wait for
a fuller explanation to all the what's and why's till I get to the
other side. Go read what Faith is again....it helps me when I am looking for
more meaning. It will all come.
Dave Thomas | 11:22 a.m. June 9, 2008
It has nothing to do with apologies or blame.
I feel it's a cop-out to say that we can only guess why things proceeded as they did, or that God moves in mysterious ways. It's the same as blaming our mistakes of Satan's influence. It absolves us of responsibility and makes it impossible to learn from our own mistakes.
God lets people make choices, and that means people make mistakes. When you recognize that people chose their actions, then you can use reason to figure out WHY they acted as they did, instead of just blaming everything on God's will or Satan's influence. Then you can figure out how to make better choices moving forward.
I don't see that as negativity. I seems like an honest way of working toward improvement.
I feel it's a cop-out to say that we can only guess why things proceeded as they did, or that God moves in mysterious ways. It's the same as blaming our mistakes of Satan's influence. It absolves us of responsibility and makes it impossible to learn from our own mistakes.
God lets people make choices, and that means people make mistakes. When you recognize that people chose their actions, then you can use reason to figure out WHY they acted as they did, instead of just blaming everything on God's will or Satan's influence. Then you can figure out how to make better choices moving forward.
I don't see that as negativity. I seems like an honest way of working toward improvement.
Jason | 11:24 a.m. June 9, 2008
Great article.
It is great to see the kingdom of God Rolling forth and filling the earth.
It seems that some of the greatest growth in the church right now is in Africa, while it is slowing in most other parts of the world.
The first shall be last and the last shall be first.
Truly there is a time to every season.
It is great to see the kingdom of God Rolling forth and filling the earth.
It seems that some of the greatest growth in the church right now is in Africa, while it is slowing in most other parts of the world.
The first shall be last and the last shall be first.
Truly there is a time to every season.
John Lambert | 11:43 a.m. June 9, 2008
To the poster at 7:18:
Not only is it possible to have an inter-racial marriage in the temple, but they do occur. I personally know at least four inter-racial couples that were married in the temple, and there are others I know who I think were married in the temple.
I know a white man who was in a district presidency whose wife is black. The one black man on our high council has a white wife. If you go through the Mormon Times from a few weeks ago you will see articles on Marcus Martins and his white wife married in the temple, Brother McClain and his white wife who have been sealed in the temple and his is now a temple sealer, and President Stevenson and his Samoan wife sealed in the temple.
Actually I just remembered my roommate from Puerto Rico, who claimed African descent and who would have not been allowed to recieve the priesthood before 1978, married a white woman in the temple. Then there was my friend bruce, a black man from Curacao, who married a blonde girl from Bountiful.
Not only is it possible to have an inter-racial marriage in the temple, but they do occur. I personally know at least four inter-racial couples that were married in the temple, and there are others I know who I think were married in the temple.
I know a white man who was in a district presidency whose wife is black. The one black man on our high council has a white wife. If you go through the Mormon Times from a few weeks ago you will see articles on Marcus Martins and his white wife married in the temple, Brother McClain and his white wife who have been sealed in the temple and his is now a temple sealer, and President Stevenson and his Samoan wife sealed in the temple.
Actually I just remembered my roommate from Puerto Rico, who claimed African descent and who would have not been allowed to recieve the priesthood before 1978, married a white woman in the temple. Then there was my friend bruce, a black man from Curacao, who married a blonde girl from Bountiful.
VA Teacher | 12:09 p.m. June 9, 2008
To Reality:
"I wasn't aware that there were any black leaders in the LDS Church"
It's obvious you haven't been to the South.
"I wasn't aware that there were any black leaders in the LDS Church"
It's obvious you haven't been to the South.
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Alex Boye sings at the Tabernacle during the commemoration of the 30th anniversary of the announcement extending the LDS priesthood to "all worthy males."
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I cannot understand why, especially in view of the wonderful, faithful black members of the church clear back to the the beginning, anyone would object--I personally have NEVER met anyone in the church who wasn't pleased, and I've lived all over the country.
To my brothers and sisters, whoever you are, wherever you are, and from whatever background you are, may we love and serve each other.