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Texas sheriff defends raid on YFZ Ranch in one-on-one interview with Deseret News
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What's next? | 6:54 p.m. June 3, 2008
Schleicher County Sheriff David Doran, your county is on the attack. With so
much child abuse in your country, the officials may have to take your children
and everyone else's children into custody just to protect them. Since the
officials do not really know which family (FLDS, Baptist, Catholic, etc) have
child abuse, then they may have to take all children.
There is no reason to investigate any particular family - just take all children everywhere. This will assure that all children are protected from child abuse. Maybe after two months every county resident's children can come home. Just don't anyone leave the state and be sure to meet with children services for counseling and follow any other restriction the judge may have.
Make sure of what your church is teaching because you might have to give up some of your United States freedom of religion.
I guess you will defend a raid on every resident in your county.
There is no reason to investigate any particular family - just take all children everywhere. This will assure that all children are protected from child abuse. Maybe after two months every county resident's children can come home. Just don't anyone leave the state and be sure to meet with children services for counseling and follow any other restriction the judge may have.
Make sure of what your church is teaching because you might have to give up some of your United States freedom of religion.
I guess you will defend a raid on every resident in your county.
Anonymous | 6:53 p.m. June 3, 2008
The sheriff does have the free agency choice to refuse to carry out an
unconstitutional order. He might be subject to jail, but his conscience would be
clear.
There are many villians here, the biggest being Judge Barbara Walther, for whom there is now an impeachment petition being signed at the gopetition website.
There are many villians here, the biggest being Judge Barbara Walther, for whom there is now an impeachment petition being signed at the gopetition website.
Comments continue below
Fred in Va. | 7:18 p.m. June 3, 2008
I keep getting e-mails from a girl in Nigeria that has some problems getting her
money out of the country and into the USA.
It's possible this Sheriff could handle the exchange of cash for her.
Over the years I have known many law enforcement officers. Some very good,some very bad, and some with swelled heads from putting on the uniform.
My nephew, a retired Texas Ranger says he wouldn't touch this with a very long stick.
He is in a bad spot no matter what he does, he won't be right (according to the media) CPS will hang him out to dry and lay everything in his lap saying "well he should have told us it wasn't legal"
Remember this, A police officer can only act after the fact and then only if a law has been broken. To act in advance of a crime can sometimes leave you way out on a limb.
It's possible this Sheriff could handle the exchange of cash for her.
Over the years I have known many law enforcement officers. Some very good,some very bad, and some with swelled heads from putting on the uniform.
My nephew, a retired Texas Ranger says he wouldn't touch this with a very long stick.
He is in a bad spot no matter what he does, he won't be right (according to the media) CPS will hang him out to dry and lay everything in his lap saying "well he should have told us it wasn't legal"
Remember this, A police officer can only act after the fact and then only if a law has been broken. To act in advance of a crime can sometimes leave you way out on a limb.
Stephen | 7:20 p.m. June 3, 2008
The Sheriff says they got a call about abuse, but to whose home did they go to
take out the alleged perpatrator. I guess he had many homes, because they
didn't take any man, but most all the children. Who was abusive, and who
was abused? Two monthes worth of abuse. I'm sure a case will be establihed
to save face, however if there was abuse by "husbands", then they need
to be held accountable.
Thomas | 7:55 p.m. June 3, 2008
That sheriff is a shameless liar.
wyogirl | 7:57 p.m. June 3, 2008
THANK YOU Deseret News for this interview! I was so happy to hear some of the
details of this raid.
This was carried out in a calm manner - if the FLDS would have cooperated in the first place and presented the girls to be interviewed there would not have been the need to take their children. So everyone posting about how horrible it is that all these children were taken by CPS remember - it was the FLDS that caused it and brought it on THEIR OWN CHILDREN to protect their scum-bag men and their perfect Prophet.
What were they doing in the two hours they wouldn't let anyone in? How many girls were successfully taken away or hidden from authorities?
The truth will come out - the Sheriff stated that proof of crimes committed was obvious "in plain sight."
Perhaps CPS committed errors, but it seems like they tried to do this a better way, it must have been extremely frustrating trying to work with the FLDS BUT at least they erred on the side of protecting children - not of the side of protecting child rapists.
I hope some women and children were able to escape
This was carried out in a calm manner - if the FLDS would have cooperated in the first place and presented the girls to be interviewed there would not have been the need to take their children. So everyone posting about how horrible it is that all these children were taken by CPS remember - it was the FLDS that caused it and brought it on THEIR OWN CHILDREN to protect their scum-bag men and their perfect Prophet.
What were they doing in the two hours they wouldn't let anyone in? How many girls were successfully taken away or hidden from authorities?
The truth will come out - the Sheriff stated that proof of crimes committed was obvious "in plain sight."
Perhaps CPS committed errors, but it seems like they tried to do this a better way, it must have been extremely frustrating trying to work with the FLDS BUT at least they erred on the side of protecting children - not of the side of protecting child rapists.
I hope some women and children were able to escape
Stephen | 7:59 p.m. June 3, 2008
One other thing- about this informant- it scares the bejeebeies out of me to
think that maybe we have informants in our churches sent by the government, or
law enforcement. It is now a reality. Thanks alot big brother! This was wrong!!
Monker | 8:15 p.m. June 3, 2008
DORAN:
"..The community during this operation, and there was a time for need, we called for that help the community came out in droves and brought love, volunteerism, monetary donations, shelter. The whole community came out and supported law enforcement and supported the women and children out here."
Such love, "support", and devotion to the FLDS women and children. I suppose Doran thinks Utahns are not as smart as Texas. Unreal.
He's already talking about indirect communication through a Deputy which means he is now out of FLDS confidence as a reward for his "generosity".
Maybe the FLDS have the voting power to tip the election for him. They should shop.
"..The community during this operation, and there was a time for need, we called for that help the community came out in droves and brought love, volunteerism, monetary donations, shelter. The whole community came out and supported law enforcement and supported the women and children out here."
Such love, "support", and devotion to the FLDS women and children. I suppose Doran thinks Utahns are not as smart as Texas. Unreal.
He's already talking about indirect communication through a Deputy which means he is now out of FLDS confidence as a reward for his "generosity".
Maybe the FLDS have the voting power to tip the election for him. They should shop.
Janet | 8:19 p.m. June 3, 2008
There is definitely distrust and he brought it upon his own self. Doran was
considered a friend and we gave him every trust but he turned out to be a
traitor. I forgive him and leave judgement to God. His controvery is not with
Warren Jeffs but with God who sent him here. Good luck, Doran.
Why young children | 8:29 p.m. June 3, 2008
I can understand the need to remove some of the children of say 10 years of age
and older for questioning as well as some of the adults to a neutral setting.
However, why did CPS feel it was necessary to rip children of 12 months of age
and older away from their mothers? As a father of a 2 1/2 year old and an 8
month old I cringed every time I heard about this story. Kids should not be
ripped away from parents where no probable cause of abuse is present. The only
abuse that has been alleged is marriage of underage adults of the age range of
12 and above. No one is claiming that 2 year olds are being forced into
marriage. If they aren't why did CPS need to take the younger children?
Was questioning and an investigation in order? Probably, but it went far beyond
what is constitutionally acceptable. That is where the Supreme Court has issues
and where my disagreement lies. In short, this case turned into religious
bigotry rather then CPS trying to help. And for the record, I am not FLDS, in
fact, I am a former Texas resident.
How many times did Rozita call? | 8:32 p.m. June 3, 2008
Doran admits they got more than those two calls from Rozita/Sarah, and that the
caller had inside information, which suggests that someone in law enforcement
was feeding this to her. I wish the interviewer would have pressed him more on
the details, though, such as when the first call occurred, whether it was before
March 29, as it apparently was by at least a week. And then who gave
Rozita/Sarah the number of that women�s shelter.
betty | 8:40 p.m. June 3, 2008
why does no one but mormons and polygamists comment on this page.
this is an honest and decent man who was doing what he was paid to do, carry out a court order to protect innocent children.,
fdls tried to lie their way out of it, even told the children to lie, were still lying to the court when one said she did not know who lived in the same house as she did. nonsense.
where are the decent people on this webpage.
this is an honest and decent man who was doing what he was paid to do, carry out a court order to protect innocent children.,
fdls tried to lie their way out of it, even told the children to lie, were still lying to the court when one said she did not know who lived in the same house as she did. nonsense.
where are the decent people on this webpage.
This sheriff is an idiot | 8:47 p.m. June 3, 2008
This sheriff should be impeached for him to defend the actions of removing the
children shows what an idiot this man is.
A Mormon, Texas Business Owner | 8:53 p.m. June 3, 2008
Mormon Supporter said, "An economic boycott of Texas and Texans is a
legitimate proposal at this point in Mormon history."
How is that a legitimate proposal??
And who exactly are you referring to? LDS or FLDS? FLDS don't usually refer to themselves as "Mormons".
How would not buying my products help "Mormons"?
Assuming you were effective at carrying out this so called "boycott" of Texas and Texas made goods, how would this help me, an LDS Mormon? And...if it did hurt me, a dreaded Texan, what am I supposed to do about the situation with the FLDS?
Contrary to popular belief, not all of us Texans have pick up trucks with gun racks in the back window so I can pull off my gun and restore order with "them there government folk" down in Eldorado.
How is that a legitimate proposal??
And who exactly are you referring to? LDS or FLDS? FLDS don't usually refer to themselves as "Mormons".
How would not buying my products help "Mormons"?
Assuming you were effective at carrying out this so called "boycott" of Texas and Texas made goods, how would this help me, an LDS Mormon? And...if it did hurt me, a dreaded Texan, what am I supposed to do about the situation with the FLDS?
Contrary to popular belief, not all of us Texans have pick up trucks with gun racks in the back window so I can pull off my gun and restore order with "them there government folk" down in Eldorado.
zxcvbnm | 8:59 p.m. June 3, 2008
I have never heard so much back peddling and double talk in my life. Ahhhh shecks sheriff....so you were in charge but not in charge. The army was just there in case ....tank and all. The caller was on the phone....the nut job in Colorado. The perpetrator was on the phone but you just could not verify him......jeez dude.....go in on an unverified call....don't verify the perpetrator.....and continue talking with the nutball caller. Yhe second warrant identified all the pregnant women as the excuse to remove everyone......yep.....pregnant adults.
Your informant sure was accurate,,, give me a break.
Bozo the clown could have conducted this inversigation better than Doran.
The Tx Supreme court ruled this was a farce. Suck it up big boy and quit trying to "awe shucks" the whole mess.
This reminds me of Boss Hog and his bunch on the dukes of hazard.
Shame on the State for relying on this guy for information and support.....he is worse than Barney.....and no Andy to keep him in check.
Daylight search! | 8:59 p.m. June 3, 2008
Perhaps the sheriff would have had better luck with the search if he'd come
in the morning and spent the day looking. I think doing a search like this at
night is an attempt to instill fear and to intimidate--and it sure isn't an
easy way to find someone who might be hidden or hiding. Depriving people of
sleep is a well-known interrogation technique, done frequently by terrorist and
dictatorial governments--I hate even the hint of it to be found in America.
But, as someone with family in law enforcement, I do respect the fact that they are frequently hung out to dry by judges and CPS in cases like this--and I do know that whenever they go out on call, they are putting their lives at risk.
It still sounds like the confidential informants weren't actually on the ranch--and my guess is that they were activist ex-FLDS--which may or may not be a good thing. And I still think those calls were a hoax.
Thanks for the interview, DN--I think the sheriff's words tell us quite a bit--not all of it good.
But, as someone with family in law enforcement, I do respect the fact that they are frequently hung out to dry by judges and CPS in cases like this--and I do know that whenever they go out on call, they are putting their lives at risk.
It still sounds like the confidential informants weren't actually on the ranch--and my guess is that they were activist ex-FLDS--which may or may not be a good thing. And I still think those calls were a hoax.
Thanks for the interview, DN--I think the sheriff's words tell us quite a bit--not all of it good.
Hugh McBryde | 9:02 p.m. June 3, 2008
I'm sorry, but the business about seeing "teenage or underage pregnant
girls" has already been demonstrated to be a fantastic lie and it
wouldn't be evidence of a crime ANYWAY.
wrz | 9:06 p.m. June 3, 2008
"However, why did CPS feel it was necessary to rip children of 12 months of
age and older away from their mothers?"
The answer is quite simple. Texas and the CPS were going after the FLDS and it's teachings (polygamy and underage marriage, mainly). That's what this is all about. That's why they removed all the children. They determined that such teachings amounted to abuse of boys and girls. They could have removed just the girls over a certain age who would be in danger of underage marriage. But then baby girls would someday be in the same pickle. And baby boys would someday be taught to prey on underage girls.
And they wanted all the kids, boys and girls, to be farmed out permanently to get them away from the FLDS environment and into possibly Baptist homes to get FLDS teachings out of their brains.
What Texas and CPS forgot to remember is that there has to be imminent danger of health and safety of the kids to be removed from their parents and homes. Which was not the case.
The answer is quite simple. Texas and the CPS were going after the FLDS and it's teachings (polygamy and underage marriage, mainly). That's what this is all about. That's why they removed all the children. They determined that such teachings amounted to abuse of boys and girls. They could have removed just the girls over a certain age who would be in danger of underage marriage. But then baby girls would someday be in the same pickle. And baby boys would someday be taught to prey on underage girls.
And they wanted all the kids, boys and girls, to be farmed out permanently to get them away from the FLDS environment and into possibly Baptist homes to get FLDS teachings out of their brains.
What Texas and CPS forgot to remember is that there has to be imminent danger of health and safety of the kids to be removed from their parents and homes. Which was not the case.
To Betty | 9:14 p.m. June 3, 2008
Most of the people on this page are decent. As Americans they are allowed their
own view of the matter without being called "indecent"
I would consider myself a secularly-inclined, Agnostic. I see problems with all religions, particularly as a source of conflict.
Did some of the FLDS tell some lies? yes, Did CPS Baptists tell some lies in court? Yes. Does government tell lies, all governments? Yes. Is the world full of honesty? No.
Everyone has rationalizations and justifications for their actions and attitudes. This is human.
We all broke some law today, all of us, because we are so into controlling each other's lives that our legislators have given us so many existing laws that now have little purpose other than to harass. For example: Vagrancy, and some I can't mention here that invade personal life.
These are what our "decent" people wanted at the time to control someone.
Competition between people and cultures is at the root of all law and war. Competition without regard to the effects on others is the real root of evil. Money is simply how they keep score.
No one can be competitive and be truly decent, so let's be more generous.
I would consider myself a secularly-inclined, Agnostic. I see problems with all religions, particularly as a source of conflict.
Did some of the FLDS tell some lies? yes, Did CPS Baptists tell some lies in court? Yes. Does government tell lies, all governments? Yes. Is the world full of honesty? No.
Everyone has rationalizations and justifications for their actions and attitudes. This is human.
We all broke some law today, all of us, because we are so into controlling each other's lives that our legislators have given us so many existing laws that now have little purpose other than to harass. For example: Vagrancy, and some I can't mention here that invade personal life.
These are what our "decent" people wanted at the time to control someone.
Competition between people and cultures is at the root of all law and war. Competition without regard to the effects on others is the real root of evil. Money is simply how they keep score.
No one can be competitive and be truly decent, so let's be more generous.
Bruce | 9:18 p.m. June 3, 2008
Great entertainment...I only hope he wasn't trying to be serious.
3000 people in that dusty little county and that's the best they can come up with for sheriff?
Shucks, "ya'll".
3000 people in that dusty little county and that's the best they can come up with for sheriff?
Shucks, "ya'll".
The Sheriff Had It Right! | 9:18 p.m. June 3, 2008
The sheriff is a standup man that was trying to protect these children from the
ilk of Warren Jeffs and their perverted teachings.
Quite pathetic to see all of the negative posting from the FLDS vilifying a man that was trying to protect their children when their are plenty of photos out there of the real predator with his tongue down the throat of a 12 year old.
Quite pathetic to see all of the negative posting from the FLDS vilifying a man that was trying to protect their children when their are plenty of photos out there of the real predator with his tongue down the throat of a 12 year old.
zxcvbnm | 9:23 p.m. June 3, 2008
Re Betty
Ok girl......lets get this real clear. This paper is written in Utah....kinda Mormon don't ya think.
I am from central Texas.....Waco area......remember Waco.
Mormons aren't polygamists. I'm Catholic.....
So try again.
I am asambed of the tactics used by CPS and law enforcement in this matter.......and proud of the courts for halting this travesty. But I will pay thru the nose for the bumbling fools that are responsible for this.
Shame on Texas........from a Texan
disgusted | 9:27 p.m. June 3, 2008
Alright it is time to quit bashing the sheriff,if you are so quick to believe
the flds about how bad they have been wronged by everybody in the world--just
give the cps and law enforcment the benefit of the doubt!!It is so easy now days
to only believe the bad about the law WHY??I would be willing to bet that if
any of you needed help you would not be against them then,so back off and look
at this from all angles.Remember this is about the little kids.
Juror | 9:34 p.m. June 3, 2008
Beds in the temple with young girls DNA, underage pregnant child brides,
past and present, pictures of old perverts kissing 12 year old girls in a sexual
way, Uh........the FLDS guilty don't stand a chance before a(mostly
southern "baptist" jury). I predict that Jeffs will soon have new
cellmates as do most that I know down here. This is one time I will look forward
to "jury duty", if I'm lucky enough to be selected.
FLDS.......you have no freinds here, better head back to Utah, were this is
allowed! And yes I'm a Texan with a loud mouth and tell of your filth to
any one who will listen.
LetsBeReal | 9:40 p.m. June 3, 2008
What a liar!
"We're talking about teenage girls, underage girls that were pregnant or had children."
There were two. Both identified themselves as adults, and even after CPS and the Sheriff here abducted innocent adults, CPS has finally had to admit it. The sheriff is still lying about it.
"We were searching for a victim on the property. She has not been located yet."
Sure she has been located. They know exactly where Roza Swinton is.
"We never could get a full confirmation if indeed it was Dale Evans Barlow, we could not get full confirmation of his location."
Why didn't you just contact his probation officer? Why didn't you just call him at his home in Arizona? Oh, you did that. Sorry. That was before you got the search warrant. After you got the search warrant, that's when you became uncertain as to the whereabouts of Dale Barlow.
"We're talking about teenage girls, underage girls that were pregnant or had children."
There were two. Both identified themselves as adults, and even after CPS and the Sheriff here abducted innocent adults, CPS has finally had to admit it. The sheriff is still lying about it.
"We were searching for a victim on the property. She has not been located yet."
Sure she has been located. They know exactly where Roza Swinton is.
"We never could get a full confirmation if indeed it was Dale Evans Barlow, we could not get full confirmation of his location."
Why didn't you just contact his probation officer? Why didn't you just call him at his home in Arizona? Oh, you did that. Sorry. That was before you got the search warrant. After you got the search warrant, that's when you became uncertain as to the whereabouts of Dale Barlow.
Doran -liar and/or stupid | 9:41 p.m. June 3, 2008
1.Cell phone calls can be traced!!! No one has explained why the calls were not
traced!
2. Barlow was on probation - why didn't they call his probation officer with info?
3. Seeing young looking women pregnant is not evidence of sexual abuse. The test will be whether they ever got a search warrant for non-FLDS families when a pregnant teenager wouldn't id the father? I bet out of the thousands of underage births, there is no other case when a judge issued a property search warrant.
4. I wonder is this confidential informant was Elisa Woods - gee, what a coincidence that this raid would coincide with her new book. Or maybe Carolyn with her book coming out in paperback.
2. Barlow was on probation - why didn't they call his probation officer with info?
3. Seeing young looking women pregnant is not evidence of sexual abuse. The test will be whether they ever got a search warrant for non-FLDS families when a pregnant teenager wouldn't id the father? I bet out of the thousands of underage births, there is no other case when a judge issued a property search warrant.
4. I wonder is this confidential informant was Elisa Woods - gee, what a coincidence that this raid would coincide with her new book. Or maybe Carolyn with her book coming out in paperback.
zxcvbnm | 9:48 p.m. June 3, 2008
RE disgusted:
Oh yes the little kids,,,,,,,where have you been.
Texas MHMR witnessed the treatment of those little kids as they were ripped from their mothers arms.
The kids kept from their parents for two months as their mothers were held as children themselves.
I have had my share of Texas justice over the years. My house has been broken into....I was told to build a fence. My farm has been vandalized....I was told they didn't have the men or time to patrol. I have called reporting drug dealers....noone to investigate. I have worked with DPS undercover.........yes undercover and watched them do a cost benifit anaylysis on the drug haul......and let the dealers go. Don't tell me about Texas law enforcement.....if it isn't a traffic ticket forget it.
The law inforcement industry in Texas is just that....an industry. So fill the jails with the poor and profitable but don't call it law enforcement. Tax collectors with gun is the proper description.
LetsBeReal | 9:48 p.m. June 3, 2008
One other thing. Did you notice this bit:
"Child Protective Services conducted interviews all through the night, I mean through the full night and up to the day."
They interviewed children all through the night, and the sheriff here is a bit concerned that they didn't cooperate with the gestapo good enough.
"Even then, because not all of the children that were requested to be brought forward was brought forward to Child Protective Services. They were not satisfied that these people were fully cooperating like they requested they do. So it was requested to do a residential to residential search."
You see it was requested that they search for Dale Barlow, Sarah Barlow, and baby girl Barlow. They didn't have a search warrant or a court order to search for unnamed children in every individual residence on the ranch all through the night. Looks to me this is a flat out admission that they exceeded the authority of the search warrant. I guess though that when you're the gestapo from the police state, you don't need no stinkin' search warrant.
"Child Protective Services conducted interviews all through the night, I mean through the full night and up to the day."
They interviewed children all through the night, and the sheriff here is a bit concerned that they didn't cooperate with the gestapo good enough.
"Even then, because not all of the children that were requested to be brought forward was brought forward to Child Protective Services. They were not satisfied that these people were fully cooperating like they requested they do. So it was requested to do a residential to residential search."
You see it was requested that they search for Dale Barlow, Sarah Barlow, and baby girl Barlow. They didn't have a search warrant or a court order to search for unnamed children in every individual residence on the ranch all through the night. Looks to me this is a flat out admission that they exceeded the authority of the search warrant. I guess though that when you're the gestapo from the police state, you don't need no stinkin' search warrant.
FLDS Thoral breeds | 9:51 p.m. June 3, 2008
Hey folks, don't worry about FLDS, they will eventually breed themselves
extinct, because they don't want to pollute their wonderful FLDS Mormon
blood with the rest of you. They are too pure. The rest of you are all just
filthy gentiles.
toJuror | 9:57 p.m. June 3, 2008
You are such a fine example of a human being. Why not just get out the Texas
necktie and hang them from the oak tree in the square? Too bad you had all of
your slaves freed too. Bigots! And yes I too am a Texan.
zxcvbnm | 9:58 p.m. June 3, 2008
Way to go Juror.......you just proved the point of eveone that has called Texans a bunch of closed minded Baptist bigots.
SLIPPERY-SLOPE | 10:02 p.m. June 3, 2008
=
ANTI-RELIGION SLIPPERY-SLOPE ARGUMENT AND REASONING
... it is going to be very hard to practice their beliefs within the state of Texas," Doran said.
SOURCE: BILL HANNA, Sheriff predicts criminal charges against polygamist sect members, STAR TELEGRAM, Posted on Tue, Jun. 03, 2008.
Does this fit into definition of "FALLACIES OF [ANTI] RELIGION, FALLACIES OF [ANTI] MORALISM [based anti-polygamy beleives]" AND "FALLACY OF
[ANTI] AESTHETICISM [based anti-polygamy beleives]?"
DISCLAIMER: Continuation of my literary work/efforts...fact/fiction...
quasi-fact/quasi-fiction...draft...outline...etc.
Authorship/Moral Rights: LSAT STUDENT OF FALLACIES, Debater or
FALLACY HUNTER
SIGNED: RECKIPS
==
ANTI-RELIGION SLIPPERY-SLOPE ARGUMENT AND REASONING
... it is going to be very hard to practice their beliefs within the state of Texas," Doran said.
SOURCE: BILL HANNA, Sheriff predicts criminal charges against polygamist sect members, STAR TELEGRAM, Posted on Tue, Jun. 03, 2008.
Does this fit into definition of "FALLACIES OF [ANTI] RELIGION, FALLACIES OF [ANTI] MORALISM [based anti-polygamy beleives]" AND "FALLACY OF
[ANTI] AESTHETICISM [based anti-polygamy beleives]?"
DISCLAIMER: Continuation of my literary work/efforts...fact/fiction...
quasi-fact/quasi-fiction...draft...outline...etc.
Authorship/Moral Rights: LSAT STUDENT OF FALLACIES, Debater or
FALLACY HUNTER
SIGNED: RECKIPS
==
Re: Juror | 10:08 p.m. June 3, 2008
Hey Deseret News, I thought you had a standard for abusive language. The
vitriol from this foul mouthed poster is disgusting. We've heard nothing
about the bed in the temple after the initial report, or its use if there ever
was one..Warren Jeffs is in prison in Arizona, so that has nothing to do with
Texas..Then to openly brag about the FLDS not standing a chance before a mostly
baptist southern jury is not only a disgusting display of bigotry, but also
perhaps a good reason to move the judicial proceedings away from the region. And
bad breath.
Lastly, it's spelled friends.
Lastly, it's spelled friends.
Juror | 10:16 p.m. June 3, 2008
Sorry,...when I see an apple I simply call it.....well,......an apple. If you
pour sugar and milk on it, I will simply state that it is a
apple,......uh,.....with sugar and milk poured upon it.
zxcvbnm | 10:17 p.m. June 3, 2008
Between the words of Harvey Hildebrand...the words of Voss and the words of the Sheriff, Texas looks like a bunch of hillbillies.
Even the Governor gave CPS a pat on the back early in this mess and has said nothing since.
Everyone screams about the picture of a convicted felon with a toungue down a girls throat and with the next breath wishes the big boys in prison would fill his other orifice with something else.
Seems that everyone supporting this state full of self righteous zelots needs to take the foot out of their mouth. It only looks worse each time you speak.
Juror | 10:52 p.m. June 3, 2008
Now the FLDS are going to teach us how to spell. And if you think this post
was abusive, it must have hit the "spot", (tattle tale).......but you
ain't seen nothing yet as to the likes of a Texas prosecutor. I don't
think he will want to "play nice", or as you say "be
sweet"!!!!!
Re:Juror | 11:16 p.m. June 3, 2008
I'm not FLDS. I'm not a mormon, I'm an Iowan The only spot you
hit is the one that makes me want to vomit. In my experience the bigger the
mouth, the smaller the intellect. You appearently are having trouble following
the facts in this case.
I heard the same empty boast..don't mess with texas before the Texas supreme court reminded you hilbillies that you cant flush the constitution down the toilet.
I heard the same empty boast..don't mess with texas before the Texas supreme court reminded you hilbillies that you cant flush the constitution down the toilet.
re: juror | 11:17 p.m. June 3, 2008
that's hillbilly to you.
John Lambert | 11:34 p.m. June 3, 2008
There was no outcry, only a false call that could be traced out of state, and
claimed treatment in a hospital that could have been proven to be entirely a
false story. Also, it was provable the alleged abuser was not in Texas. There
was no reason to go in.
Joyce | 11:43 p.m. June 3, 2008
I am amazed at the ones that can not comprehend what they read.
Most of the above posts were answered in the article the paper wrote.
Then others are totally off the issue.
Most of the above posts were answered in the article the paper wrote.
Then others are totally off the issue.
John Lambert | 11:42 p.m. June 3, 2008
To Betty:
Either you just ignore what people say or you do not read the page much. People who are agnostic Jews who grew up in New York City have commented on this page. Beyond that, it is hard to say what religion many of the people who comment are, although some people seem to waste no time in figuring it out, they do it in two seconds flat from one word in a persons post. Halal.
Either you just ignore what people say or you do not read the page much. People who are agnostic Jews who grew up in New York City have commented on this page. Beyond that, it is hard to say what religion many of the people who comment are, although some people seem to waste no time in figuring it out, they do it in two seconds flat from one word in a persons post. Halal.
John Lambert | 11:50 p.m. June 3, 2008
To to Juror:
There are many Mormons in Iowa. Your statement of being an Iowan is irrelevant to any of the discussion.
There are many Mormons in Iowa. Your statement of being an Iowan is irrelevant to any of the discussion.
Interloper | 12:02 a.m. June 4, 2008
Sheriff Duran has done a fine job of explaining why the search and removal of
the children from the YFZ Ranch occurred the way it did. I believe this article
will be one to look back on a year or two from now after FLDS perpetrators have
been charged, convicted and are serving their time. By then, public opinion,
except among FLDS members and any remaining apologists, will be largely
laudatory toward Texas officials.
Most important:
� Both Sarah Barlow and Dan Barlow may exist, under those names or others. The oft-stated claim that only Rozita Swinton is implicated in phone calls to shelters is false.
� The search was legal by all of the rules that apply, i.e., in good faith, in plain view and probable cause for issuing warrants.
� The FLDS' refusal to cooperate led to the removal of the children from the ranch. (BTW, it wasn't until weeks later that some children were separated from their mothers.)
� Very useful evidence was gathered as a result of the search of YFZ Ranch.
Good work has been done.
Most important:
� Both Sarah Barlow and Dan Barlow may exist, under those names or others. The oft-stated claim that only Rozita Swinton is implicated in phone calls to shelters is false.
� The search was legal by all of the rules that apply, i.e., in good faith, in plain view and probable cause for issuing warrants.
� The FLDS' refusal to cooperate led to the removal of the children from the ranch. (BTW, it wasn't until weeks later that some children were separated from their mothers.)
� Very useful evidence was gathered as a result of the search of YFZ Ranch.
Good work has been done.
Mormons vs. FLDS | 12:05 a.m. June 4, 2008
Both LDS and FLDS believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet and that the Book of
Mormon contains the word of God. The LDS Church is also called the Mormon
Church and its adherents are known as the Mormons. Good journalists refrain
from using the term Mormons to describe any members of breakaway sects, such as
the FLDS or Community of Christ. Those who persist in using the term Mormons to
describe members of breakaway sects typically do so for one of two reasons: 1)
to cast aspersions on LDS by associating them with LDS apostates and to confuse
the public on the differences between LDS and non-LDS, and 2) to bring
credibility to breakaway sects by giving them the appearance of societal
respectability that has been earned over the past 100-plus years by the LDS
church. Incorrect use of the term Mormon is, hence, an improper use of
propaganda and an indication of religious bigotry. The Mormons identify with
the FLDS in some ways because many of their ancestors were persecuted for their
beliefs, but the LDS do not practice polygamy, do not support the breaking of
constitutional and correct laws and seek the conviction of child molesters.
Harvardman | 12:27 a.m. June 4, 2008
Texas really dropped the ball on this one, that darn Constitution got in the
way. I think that the FLDS are off base in their practices however, that does
not give the Texas officials the right to go on a witch hunt. Hooray for the
Texas Supreme Court for standing up for the Constitutional rights of these US
citizens. If anyone questions that racism, sexism, and religious bigotry exists
in this country I would point them to the Sltrib and Desnews blogs because this
stuff is crazy. I know that many non-Mormons in Utah are frustrated being in the
minority, but come on are Mormons really that bad? If they are why are you
living in Utah? When I moved to Boston I did so knowing that there are a lot of
Catholics here. I don't expect that the Catholics are going to change their
way of life because I move to town. If the Catholics here were oppressing me I
would leave the state. It is not worth being unhappy over. You only get one life
to live.
Careful observer | 2:25 a.m. June 4, 2008
Why did the orign of the cell phone in CO not surface until days after the calls
were made? Could it be that it took that long to get the information on where
the calls came from in the first place. The two calls that started the whole
thing were made to an answering machine hot line at CPS. Those numbers are
available worldwide from internet phone directories like dex online. I happen to
know how long it takes to have a routine search of phone records done. Life
threatening type are real quick bit this type can take days.
The sheriff did repeat someting in the earlier reports, "They kept moving the children form building to building." Is that a clear sign of cooperation with the search warrant.
Couldn't locate Sarah? Give us a break. Ever try to get anything out of a teenager who doesn't want to talk to anyone? Especially if it's someone they don't know asking them very personal questions. Even more problematic is if they're trained not to trust?
The sheriff did repeat someting in the earlier reports, "They kept moving the children form building to building." Is that a clear sign of cooperation with the search warrant.
Couldn't locate Sarah? Give us a break. Ever try to get anything out of a teenager who doesn't want to talk to anyone? Especially if it's someone they don't know asking them very personal questions. Even more problematic is if they're trained not to trust?
To Interloper | 5:25 a.m. June 4, 2008
Enjoy reading your posts. Excellent comments.
Interesting | 6:11 a.m. June 4, 2008
Love it how certain comments are not posted here. Especially ones who support
the views of the Interloper and some of the others who are not supporters of the
FLDS propaganda machine. Let's see if this one makes it.
Momotaro | 6:25 a.m. June 4, 2008
All of the schemers will be running for cover.
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Schleicher County Sheriff David Doran's relationship with FLDS has been severely strained in the aftermath of the raid on the YFZ Ranch.
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May I propose that anyone who was offended by the biases, presumptions, assumptions and actions of Texas state officials boycott the State of Texas. Don't go to Texas. Don't buy goods and services from businesses in Texas.
An economic boycott of Texas and Texans is a legitimate proposal at this point in Mormon history.