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Utah basketball: Utes now hope to compete to win vs. Cal

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  • B C Park City, UT
    Jan. 15, 2012 7:36 p.m.

    "Utes now hope to compete to win vs. Cal"

    If losing by 36, only scoring 45, and only dishing out 6 assists is Utah's idea of competing, the Utes better hope a little harder.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Jan. 15, 2012 1:52 p.m.

    MHL

    "but if Utah brings up past basketball history (which by the way is much shorter than 27 years) you Y fans start talking about ancient history."

    MUCH SHORTER?

    Utah fans have absolutely NO PROBLEM bringing up 1944 like it was yesterday, even though that was so ancient the NCAA champion wasn't even recognized as the national champion.

    Doing the math, 1944 was FORTY years before 1984!

    Utah fans have this weird time-space continuum where nothing before 2004 counts in football, but nothing after 2004 counts in basketball.

  • agb Layton, UT
    Jan. 15, 2012 9:54 a.m.

    raisedaute | 11:35 a.m. Jan. 14, 2012
    Cottonwood Heights, UT
    You've got to luv it. All you hypocritical Y fans who on one hand will always bring up 1984 which is now 28 years past but if Utah brings up past basketball history (which by the way is much shorter than 27 years) you Y fans start talking about ancient history. TYPICAL
    ---
    Actually you've got it backwards. U fans get on Y fans for bringing up the 1984 and 1996 football seasons because they are in the past, but U fans will be the first to bring up the Cougars 1996 basketball seasons.

  • MLH SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 6:49 p.m.

    @mussinaround

    There is no way someone has that much time to figure that one out. What and the heck are you trying to say. As long as the Utes are having a hard time you all will be obsessed to let everyone know. All I can say is way to keep it under 200.

  • Eddie Syracuse, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 6:25 p.m.

    Here come the uties again with "my conference is better than your conference". Have you noticed once it turns to who is the best team, they will immediately turn to "their conference"? It is almost like they are calling on their fellow conference chumps to come to their aid. So, so, so little brother like.

    As far as some "pac 12 newspaper" saying that the u will bring their storied program to them, that is laughable. So when are you going to bring it? Is this the "storied" program u are talking about? LOL. I think the only reason they said that was so that when they beat you down, they can then say, "Look at us, we beat a storied program".

    What a joke. Even the pac 12 is living in the past, trying to convince themselves that the whole conference is what it used to be.

  • Marked it Down Park City, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 5:24 p.m.

    sportfanforlife

    "when anyone in your conference gets as many championships as ANYBODY in the pac 12 then you can run your mouth"

    San Francisco - back to back NCAA AND National Championships 1955 and 1956
    Utah, along with ASU, Col, Wash, Ore, and OSU all have ZERO national championships

    Feel free to run your mouth all you want to Eddie.

  • deductive reasoning Arlington, VA
    Jan. 14, 2012 3:44 p.m.

    "hmm how quickly you cougar fans forget. st marys (your supposed best in the weak wcc) only beats san diego (the worst in the wcc) by THREE points on the road what does that say abiut your terrible conference?"

    Before spouting desperate, erroneous spin, you should check the facts:

    Sagarin/Pomeroy

    #13/#15 Saint Mary's beat #264/#260 San Diego ON THE ROAD, by SIX, 78-72

    #46/#50 Stanford beat #291/#312 Utah AT HOME, by THREE, 68-65

    Just one of the reasons Saint Mary's is a Top 15 team and Stanford isn't even in the Top 40.

    Top of the WCC > Top of the PAC 12

    It's not even close.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 12:28 p.m.

    @eddie when anyone in your conference gets as many championships as ANYBODY in the pac 12 then you can run your mouth.. until then just stop makin yourself look foolish just like every other y fan

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 12:27 p.m.

    @phoenix "when the worst team in the state of Utah only loses by three points on the road to the best team in the PAC 12, what does that tell you about the strength of the PAC 12?"

    hmm how quickly you cougar fans forget. st marys (your supposed best in the weak wcc) only beats san diego (the worst in the wcc) by THREE points on the road what does that say abiut your terrible conference? and i guarantee utah is better than san diego they are awful.

    @eddie "U are not in a better conference, and u are a terrible bball team. This year and for the foreseeable future. U do not have a storied program (except for a couple of years under sweater man, which does not make a "storied" program), and you have turned yourself into One Sport University to get into the conference of chumps."
    really they're not in a better conference but they are ranked higher than yours?? isnt that the same argument you delusinonal y fans used in football for your top 25 ranking? hahahaha wo hypocritical y fans much? get a clue eddie.

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    Jan. 14, 2012 12:24 p.m.

    Sportsfanforlife Hilarious... Try the real source of the National Championship for 1944... HELMS...It says undefeated ARMY as 1944 National Champions...Neither the NIT Champs, St John's or the NCAA champs Utah by default via Arkansas, were awarded the actual recognized National Championship. Thus you and your farytale. Utah only played and won 3 authentic games in regular season. Everything else were pickups. Utah got in the NCAA tournament because they were ousted early in the first round of the NIT and were only allowed in the NCAA because they needed a replacement team to avoid cancelling. It was because of a car accident that killed an assistant Arkansas coach and seriously injured two of it's five players. It reaslly takes a lot of imagination to impose and elevate a fluke of chance as being something more than what it actually was. That being a great Human Interest story. Nope Army was the 1944 National Champions bar none.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 12:03 p.m.

    Eddie: "How long has it been since you enjoyed a good season?"

    A couple years? Winning conference in 2009 wasn't too bad, even though 2006-2008 were. I like how some act like it has and will always be the way this season has been. I guess you gotta get your money's worth if you're gonna kick a guy while he's down.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 12:00 p.m.

    @raisedaute wow someone else with and ounce of wisdom on how hypocritical these delusional y fans are. its hilarious that just cause THEY say utah doesnt have a national championship thats its true lol. but if you actually just type in goodle "1944 ncaa national basketball champs" and UTAH is the ONLY team that comes up anywhere. haha but i guess if they say it enough then utah wasnt nat champs even tho facts say they were lol. typical y fans.

  • raisedaute Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 11:35 a.m.

    You've got to luv it. All you hypocritical Y fans who on one hand will always bring up 1984 which is now 28 years past but if Utah brings up past basketball history (which by the way is much shorter than 27 years) you Y fans start talking about ancient history. TYPICAL

  • casual observer Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 11:28 a.m.

    Being a 23.5 point underdog is big hill to climb. Give it a go.

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    Jan. 14, 2012 11:26 a.m.

    @FYI...you are absolutely right. Recent success or failure does not define a storied program. Nor in Utah's as well as BYU's case has it ever produced a National Title for either Basketball program. An thanks btw... for opening up the door. I'm taking your advice and deferring to football articles...BYU actually has a Football National Championship and a Heisman...You can actually read about them. Now I suppose... we're going back to Fantasy Island where we are going to hear about Utah's 1944 fairytale...and how Army didn't win a National Championship that year. Wouldn't be surprised if Pebbles starts throwing rocks again...he loves a good Fary tale. But seriously...maybe Utah should again start arranging a few side pickup games just to sort of even out that W-L column. Bet you could get some good odds out at Wendover like the Utes must have had in 44 over the Wendover Army Air Corps Bombers. So what if they only have a H.S. team out there!!!

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 11:13 a.m.

    FYI

    Utah does have a rich tradition in basketball, but "storied programs" sometimes fade and never return to their glory days.

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 14, 2012 11:08 a.m.

    then, in 2008... NBC Sports listed Utah #12 in their top 25 "Greatest Basketball Programs of all Time,"...

    now, in 2012, Utes now hope to compete to win...

  • FYI Taylorsville, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 10:59 a.m.

    @ Eddie
    "U do not have a storied program (except for a couple of years under sweater man, which does not make a "storied" program)"

    I guess that is why in 2008 when NBC Sports listed their top 25 "Greatest Basketball Programs of all Time," they ranked Utah #12.

    ESPN/Sagarin Ranks Utah #19 in All-time Rankings. Utah makes the top 40 list in all decades since 1940 except the 80's and 2000's (obviously).

    It also must be why the Seattle Times in 2010 said "Utah would bring a storied basketball program to the Pac.

    At the end of the 2010-2011 season Utah was 11th winningest program in NCAA history, had made 27 NCAA tournament appearances with a winning percentage of .538, had 5 conference tournament championships, 29 regular season titles, and finished 21 seasons ranked in the top 25.

    Recent success or failure does not define a storied program. For more information on this claim and the definition of a storied program, see comments on football articles.

  • Rock Of The Marne Phoenix, AZ
    Jan. 14, 2012 10:54 a.m.

    Lil Eddie, if wishes were fishes then your dream of Ute demise might happen; too bad for you little brother Utah obsessed Y fans they are not. Enjoy your glory days in B-ball as even with Jimmer your team only made it to the sweet sixteen. In fact BYU still owns the record in futility of most NCAA Tourney appearances without ever getting to a final four ( and only once to the round of eight). So please save me your boasting until your team actually does something of note.

  • Eddie Syracuse, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 10:43 a.m.

    @ goRed

    We may have gone 1-25, but we did not stay low for long like u have. We bounced back and have beat u on a regular basis and will for the foreseeable future. Like I have said in the past, u have traded everything u have to enter a "BCS" conference and are now officially one sport university. u are nowhere close to competing in anything else. u will have a hard time recruiting real talent to compete and will fade into oblivion.

    u can spin it anyway you want, but the last year proved it and the following years will prove me right. Keep deflecting back many years ago to the 1-25 season, but remember....we bounced back. How long has it been since you enjoyed a good season? And how many years will it be before you are "competing" again?

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    Jan. 14, 2012 10:41 a.m.

    Oh... and about that H.S. recruit that was going to set the world on fire by helping Duke win National Championships...He ended riding the pine and transferring to another program out West...where he didn't do much as far as winning his new teammates a National title either. So... @GoRed...care to take a stab at where he wound up at???

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 14, 2012 10:38 a.m.

    Unlike Utah losing to Adams State, BYU didn't lose to any DII teams in 1997

    BYU 1997
    CS Fullerton
    Washington
    Pacific
    Weber State
    Utah State
    Boise State
    Houston
    Georgia
    Penn State
    San Diego State
    Wyoming
    Utah
    TCU
    SMU
    Rice
    Tulsa
    UTEP
    New Mexico
    Utah
    Wyoming
    TCU
    SMU
    Tulsa
    Rice
    New Mexico
    UTEP

    Utah 2012
    Adams State
    SD Christian
    Boise State
    Montana State
    Harvard
    Massachusetts
    UNC Ashville
    Fresno State
    CS Fullerton
    Brigham Young
    Idaho State
    Portland
    Weber State
    Colorado
    Washington State
    Washington
    Stanford
    California
    Arizona
    Arizona State
    UCLA
    USC
    Oregon
    Oregon State
    Arizona State
    Arizona
    Colorado
    California
    Stanford
    Oregon State
    Oregon

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 14, 2012 10:38 a.m.

    GoRed

    "Meanwhile, we will never have to worry about going 1-25 like your team did."

    BYU was back to 20+ winning seasons within three years of 1997, unlike Utah, which has been spinning its wheels since Majerus left.

    BYU
    1997 1-25
    1998 9-21
    1999 12-16
    2000 22-11
    2001 24-9
    2002 18-12
    2003 23-9
    2004 21-9
    2005 9-21
    2006 20-9
    2007 25-9
    2008 27-8
    2009 25-8
    2010 30-6
    2011 32-5
    2012 14-4

    Utah
    2006 14-15
    2007 11-19
    2008 18-15
    2009 24-10
    2010 14-17
    2011 13-18
    2012 4-12

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    Jan. 14, 2012 10:33 a.m.

    @GoRed 9:52 a.m. Jan 14 2012

    ...hmmm...let's try this twist... shall we???

    When Steve Cleveland took over due to the firing of BYU's winningest men's basketball coach, Roger Reed, the BYU basketball program was sent into one of College Basketball's most devestating tailspins... that totally and quickly left the program in a shambles... all because some sports hack at the Provo Daily Herald made a mountain out of a molehill over Reids off the cuff comment to a highly sought after California H.S. recruit that he was going to disappoint millions of BYU fans if he selected DUKE over BYU. BYU didn't just lose a mediocre coach that couldn't put together a winning season. It lost an icon...the winningest coach in it's history. Several major transfers occurred...the results of which eventually brought BYU's program to it's lowest point ever... in which a 1-25 season resulted. In D-1, not only did BYU not have the time to start over from scratch they had to scramble to even put a team together.
    That being said...BYU has made huge strides. It took us a while to get back to our glory days. Enough Said!!!

  • GoRed WEST VALLEY CITY, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 9:52 a.m.

    @sammyg, cougfanintx, phoenix

    When Coach K took over, Boylen had left the program in shambles. And competing in D-1 you don't have time to start from scratch the way Utah has had to do. That being said, the Utes have made huge strides. After the first few games, it didn't look like Utah would even win the 4 games that they have thus far. Utah continues to improve. It will take us a while to get back to our glory days of the 90'S, but that day will come.

    Meanwhile, we will never have to worry about going 1-25 like your team did.

  • SSmith Washington, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 9:42 a.m.

    Focusing on the past is irrelevant unless you're witting a history book.

    If I were a coach I would not tell my team: "Hey, we were good 10 years ago so that means we are good now"

    Nor would I say, "Hey, we have some good recruits coming in next year, so don't worry."

    I would focus on here and now. Teaching fundamentals, coaching to the strengths of what I have. I believe there is more talent on the U team than has been brought out. My point: I get frustrated with a coach who has not brought a team together yet and who sends the message that as long as you try hard we are all good.

    He should expect more and not be satisfied with what he is getting. Because he, I (I'm a Ute fan) believe we should not be satisfied with Coach K. Why go through three more years of the two previous mistakes.

    Clean house starting with Hill and Coach K. Do it right, now and completely.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 9:35 a.m.

    Ute basketball... A PAC 10.2 Coat Tail Story

    And the Ute fan said, "Yeah, we stink ... but we are part of this great conference and it's ranked higher that the WCC"

    Deflection, denial, and demise.

  • Riddles in the Dark Olympus Cove, Utah
    Jan. 14, 2012 9:32 a.m.

    This isn't the first time Utah has been in a prolonged slump and BYU has clearly been the dominant team. From 1982 to 1990, Utah was only slightly better than they've been since 2006. The main reason for the wider gap between the two programs this time -- BYU is much better.

    1982-1990
    Team, Overall, Conference
    BYU 167-107(61%), 95-49(66%), 4 20-win, 1 losing, 3 conference championships
    Utah 143-131(52%), 74-70(51%), 1 20-win, 4 losing, 2 conference championships

    2006-2012
    Team, Overall, Conference
    BYU 173-49(78%), 81-19(81%), 7 20-win, 0 losing, *4 conference championships
    Utah 99-106(48%), 45-55(45%), 1 20-win, 5 losing, *1 conference championship

    *not counting 2012

    Utah will probably improve to being a decent team in two or three years, but unless Krysto turns out to be the second coming of Majerus, I don't see Utah surpassing BYU as long as Dave Rose is at BYU.

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    Jan. 14, 2012 9:06 a.m.

    @motorbike: 9:46 p.m. 13 January

    "When the worst team in Utah loses to the worst team in the Pac-12 by only 3 points what does that say about the strength of the Pac 12?"

    ...love your sense of humor. You will need it to survive not only Utah's bb season this year but also the entire Pac's. Your "do you know where the WCC is rated..." response to phoenix was a classic. So dude... here... let me really help you. Try reading Yahoo's Mike Huguenin's article "All About the Pac 12: Avert your eyes; This is ugly.

  • Eddie Syracuse, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 7:11 a.m.

    Poor little bro's on the hill, when things get bad for their team they will still make that infamous statement about the PAC 12, "Well our conference is better than your conference".

    U are not in a better conference, and u are a terrible bball team. This year and for the foreseeable future. U do not have a storied program (except for a couple of years under sweater man, which does not make a "storied" program), and you have turned yourself into One Sport University to get into the conference of chumps.

    Good luck OSU and enjoy your hibernation.

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    Jan. 14, 2012 6:49 a.m.

    re: StGtoSLC
    Fair enough. I don't see Utes being eternally inferior. I was only trying to use motorbike's quote to make a point. motorbike comments like the Utes will be back in contention next year and the WCC is a junior college league. There's not much difference between the PAC and WCC. I believe the WCC is better at the top end, and the PAC is probably better with the middle of the conference teams.

    Rebuilding a program from where Utah has fallen to takes time, and I do wish U well.

  • Mike Johnson Stafford, VA
    Jan. 14, 2012 5:26 a.m.

    I for one like that Utah on occasions shows signs of coming out of its biggest slump in its history. For the record, the Pac-12 is 9th and the WCC is 10th on Sagarin's rankings.

    Sagarin rankings for the Pac-12 and WCC:

    23California
    46Stanford
    58Arizona
    81Oregon State
    85Oregon
    86Washington
    87Colorado
    95UCLA
    128Washington State
    165Southern California
    203Arizona State
    291Utah

    13Saint Mary's-Cal.
    22Gonzaga
    26BYU
    162Loyola Marymount
    179San Francisco
    235Santa Clara
    239Pepperdine
    258Portland
    264San Diego

    Pac-12 and WCC are currently 7-7 against each other.

  • Razzle2 Bluffdale, UT
    Jan. 14, 2012 12:27 a.m.

    Three close games in a row. I can't wait for next week's home games too.

    I think they try too hard though. They play well until they have to make the play, then they choke.

  • phoenix Gilbert, AZ
    Jan. 14, 2012 12:01 a.m.

    motorbike

    let me help you with a little perspective

    the top teams in a conference, define the conference, on a national level

    nobody cares about the bottom dwellers

    Sagarin/Pomeroy Rankings

    #12/#14 Saint Mary's
    #21/#24 Gonzaga
    #24/#21 California
    #27/#19 BYU
    #46/#49 Stanford
    #58/#46 Arizona

    #292/#312 Utah

    Utah playing Stanford close, DROPPED the Cardinal out of the Top 40, leaving California as the only PAC 12 team ranked in the Top 40. That's how bad Utah is.

    Where your conference is rated is far less important than where U are rated, at least for teams that don't have to live on reflected light.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 13, 2012 10:49 p.m.

    CFIT, I really have no beef with BYU basketball, and especially have a lot of respect for Dave Rose, and most of your posts are pretty fair and in good taste, so I have no problem with you. But it gets under my skin a little bit when fans claim this vast superiority in talent. On a national level, if someone heard almost any of those players you named, the resounding response would be... "Who?"

    I think the reason Coug fans feel happy about this is because it's consistent with the teams they've had recently, and there's no shame in that, you've had a good program as of late. But I would say the reason they're successful is because of how they're used and because of a well-coached team. I would give Utah the same opportunity to put together some teams in their new system before proclaiming them as eternally inferior.

    And some of the other talented upcoming players Utah has are Aaron Dotson (LSU transfer), Justin Seymour (6'3" SG from Georgia) and Dallin Bachynski (SUU transfer recently returned from mission).

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    Jan. 13, 2012 10:27 p.m.

    re: motorbike
    "Do you know where the WCC is rated?
    Let me help you, it's below the Pac 12 ... and it always will be."

    What is the WCC record against PAC12 teams this year? Hint: WCC is leading.
    Take out Portland, and WCC has almost double the number of wins against PAC12 teams as loses.

    I admit, the PAC12 does not have any team as bad as Portland. But, I also believe the PAC12 does not have a single team that is better than St Marys, Zags or Cougs.

    Let me tweak your quote a little.
    Do you know where the Utes are rated?
    Let me help you, it's below the Cougs ... and it always will be.

    Cougs have 9 talented Freshmen plus a pipeline that includes Haws (2X), Collinsworth (2X), Emery, Chatman, Harward, Nielsen, and a shot at Jabari Parker (yes, it's a long shot, but we're still among the schools he's considering).

    Utes don't have much this year and has a pipeline that includes Loveridge. I don't see the other talented players you are referring to. Sure, they may be more talented than what you have, but they are not Carlino, Harrison, Austin, Haws, Emery type talent.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 13, 2012 10:08 p.m.

    phoenix, very convenient that you didn't list the actual best team in the PAC-12, because they're ahead of BYU.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 13, 2012 9:46 p.m.

    phoenix -

    "when the worst team in the state of Utah only loses by three points on the road to the best team in the PAC 12, what does that tell you about the strength of the PAC 12?"
    _____________

    Do you know where the WCC is rated?
    Let me help you, it's below the Pac 12 ... and it always will be.

  • phoenix Gilbert, AZ
    Jan. 13, 2012 9:35 p.m.

    motorbike

    #27 BYU
    #95 WSU
    #127 USU
    #239 SUU
    #262 UVU
    #292 Utah

    It's nice that the Utes are trying hard, but

    when the worst team in the state of Utah only loses by three points on the road to the best team in the PAC 12, what does that tell you about the strength of the PAC 12?

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 13, 2012 9:22 p.m.

    SSmith -

    Imagine when they "try hard" and add some talented players!
    The future is brighter and coming faster than Cougs like yourself had planned on.
    Enjoy taking those jabs while you can.

  • SSmith Washington, UT
    Jan. 13, 2012 8:40 p.m.

    Except their coach is satisfied with losing--as long as they try hard.