Yes it would help incumbents, but it would also help the 3rd or 4th place
contenders as well. I don't like the idea of radicals deciding. (yeah I said
to Uncle Charles | 7:18 p.m. Jan. 10, 2012 Again -- I'm the
"fringe" because I'm mainstream, and not out on the far right fringes?
What a sad commentary about the state of the Republican party these days.As to giving out my precinct number? Not a chance. You know as well as
I do the warnings against giving out too much personal information on the
internet. I'm not falling into that trap.
Furry, the problem you have is you think unless people think like you they are
on the fringe, far right, extremists. The reality is that maybe in your
neighborhood you are the fringe. You can't convince your neighbors that your
positions are correct and you should be the delegate. Deal with it.We have varied points of view in our precinct but we are adults in our
discussions. We do exactly as I said above and it works great. We had people who
were pro-Bennett last go round, some for Lee, Bridgewater and anyone else who
ran. Everyone stated their case and we voted. It took 2-3 votes for each one and
we were done.No one castigated anyone else. No one left feeling they
weren't heard.From everyone I've talked to, my caucus is the norm.
Again, give us your precinct number and I'll come to yours this March 15 to see
exactly how it all goes down. I'd love to witness first hand the silliness that
you describe.Somehow I don't think it went down like you say. Again,
you need to consider that YOU are the fringe, extremist in your neighborhood.
To Uncle Charles | 12:33 p.m. Jan. 10, 2012 And I'd love to go to a
caucus meeting like yours. My guess is that they are few and far between (and,
most likely, that way because everyone is in agreement and nobody has a
differing opinion -- rubber stamp, anyone?).
I don't live in Utah, but I can't help wondering: Since all a member of Congress
can really offer is his/her vote, is there any evidence that Sen. Lee has voted
unlike Mr. Bennett would have? Or that some unknown (R) would change the course
of the nation by voting radically different from Hatch? True, no one gets his
seat guaranteed for life, but describing Bennett or Hatch as anything but
conservatives is kidding yourself.
And since change happened across the nation in the last election how can anyone
say it's only a problem in Utah? Conservatives are fed up with big government
Repubs being in office. Bennett was one of those and so is Hatch.To
try to circumvent the convention is all that Leavitt and his cronies in the
Establishment of this state want. They lost power last time and they don't like
it. They will lose power this time because Hatch will lose at the convention as
well which will negate all of his millions from outside the state.If
someone wants to run in the General Election, go for it. No problem, no issue.
But to try to get yourself on the Primary because voters ousted you at
convention is just a pure power grab.Again, the Establishment is
running scared. Conservatives are awake, involved and making changes. The date of the caucus is March 15. Schedule it. Be there. Make a difference.
Convince your neighbors that you are worthy to be a delegate. If you can't, it's
not the process it's your policies and you got outvoted. I was voted delegate
without even going to the meeting.
Harry is spot on! No one had any issue with the caucus system until Bennett got
the boot. I went to Bennett's room after the voting round that he didn't make it
and he was crying, telling everyone that it was HIS SEAT! It's not his seat nor
is it Hatch's.I find it interesting that people like Furry think
that their experience (and I highly doubt it happened the way she said it did)
is normal and widespread.I challenge anyone who said they have an
experience like Furry to post their precinct number on here so we can all come
out and see these meetings. I'd love to attend a meeting where shouting, yelling
and castigating happens.Our meetings are calm, controlled and
mature. 12-20 people show up and those who are running for delegate get up and
give a 2 min speech. Questions are then allowed and then we vote. We are done
within 45 minutes and on our way.The problem that Furry, Bennett,
Leavitt are having is that conservatives didn't stay home. They came out and
voted and made changes. It happened across the nation as well.
Caucus system demonstrates the truth of Yeats's poem: "The worst are full
of passionate intensity."
Furry1993, if indeed you are mainstream (and the mainstream is the majority),
then the problem is that not enough mainstream people care enough to show up at
the caucus. Everyone can go but so few do that those willing to organize and get
people out to the caucus will have the say. It may not seem fair but it is, in
fact, a great way to measure how much people really care.
No, Harry, the incumbents aren't why people want an alternative to the caucus
system. The caucus system favors those on the fringes of the political
spectrum, and reasonable people don't matter. I know that from personal
experience -- the people at the caucus I attended made it VERY clear that I
wasn't welcome. Why? Because I'm a mainstream, center-right Republican and not
a far right proponent. I was talked over, ignored, and (by inference from the
actions of the attendees) invited to leave. The people of Utah deserve better
Yep, just protect the status quo. We can't ever look at making our system
better. We are so afraid of change that we want the chains of the past to weigh
us down forever.