Comments about ‘Bullies do long-term damage to themselves, as well as victims’

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Published: Wednesday, Jan. 4 2012 12:55 a.m. MST

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md
Cache, UT

Excellent article Lois.

A voice of Reason
Salt Lake City, UT

In respect, my opinion-

Bullying is often defined or examined without scope, context, and without great scholarly care. It is not as simple as 'words or acts of hatred'. Human beings fight. It doesn't take a historian to know this. But people do fight at every age. When two or more persons gather to ridicule or cause harm to someone, this to me is bullying. Whether that's bullying a gender, race, religion, adult, child, etc.

If we examine the ultimate cause, the very first point of concern, we see that the moral principles and values within us are the first concern. we either allow ourselves to be drawn to what's right or wrong. We as beings all form our desires this way and have control over which principles we adhere to. Children aren't really different here, but they are less developed. It is parents responsibility to teach their children right from wrong and to teach them in a way that will help them motivate themselves to continually do right.

Many attribute bullying to social grouping, saying 'this is because we as beings are horrible when we group together'. But this is absolutely without evidence and reason.

Continued...

A voice of Reason
Salt Lake City, UT

The idea that grouping together causes our downfall neglects the first principle of moral desires within every human being. Also, if even one group does good work, then it is not the grouping, but an individuals choices- ultimately their desire to do right.

Examining groups is only looking at how many are willing. While important, too many people are ignoring is what causes those numbers; the individual and how strongly they desire to do right- if even by being against the grain.

Everyone knows right from wrong and which one hatred belongs to. We already know why bullying happens. It's because at core, a child either desires to do right or wrong- and in their early growth it is our responsibility to reinforce what they already know by teaching them.

People always want a 'cause and solution', to remove bullying, remove hunger, remove hatred, remove evil, etc.

You can't stop something from existing.

The solution is continually teaching- to persuade as many to do good continually- and adults need this persuasion as much as children do. How do we persuade?

Nothing has ever persuaded me to do good unto and for others more than the Book of Mormon.

My2Cents
Taylorsville, UT

The only reason there is long term damage to victims and the bully is that the bully is allowed to be a bully because the peers are forbidden to stop them.

The victims continue to live a life of insecurity and fear and the bully is allowed to continue peer terrorism.

From experience, the only cure for a bully is another peer who will challenge a bully. As a bully is confronted by a peer and they meet their own fear and learns its not a good thing and he stops and becomes the good citizen. The best cure for a bully is a set of boxing gloves, or fists, a referee, and his own blood. Violence can be a good thing, its how we learn discipline and respect and defending your rights.

Chuck E. Racer
Lehi, UT

The headline makes it look like its "U.S. schools" fault. It's not. If it is getting worse, it is a reflection of society. DON'T pass more laws regarding it. That would only make it worse!

krissy
Sterling, VA

This is an excellent article and one parents need to be more aware of. Another place that people tend to be in the dark about it the bullying that is taking place amoung the youth of the LDS church in Utah. Sunday School, Young Women's, and activities can become a very frightening experience for too many. I felt it as a youth. Girl's camp was a week-long nightmare that I still remember to this day. It was so bad I asked that I could attend a different school district so that I did not have to tormented and made fun of during the week as well. I also saw this as a youth leader amoung the boys and girls. It happens all the time. Please speak up when you see it.

Random
Redlands, CA

Don't believe for a moment that it stops once kids make it through school. Bullying happens at the workplace, in the neighborhood and defininitely at church. No solutions, just observations, unfortunately.

Cora Smith
BOUNTIFUL, UT

Nothing has ever persuaded me to do good unto and for others more than common sense,and common decency toward my fellow human beings. Thank's to my parents.

A voice of Reason
Salt Lake City, UT

I feel I should make something known on here. One summer when I was a child, I moved to a new area. I made friends with someone and we used to bully a kid who lived nearby. I was mean. Intentionally mean. I made fun of him in whatever way I could because 'making fun of' was fun. I very literally was a bully.

I did and instantly felt horrible afterwards. I felt bad for him. I came back to his house later and apologized. I asked if he wanted to hang out with me. His is mother welcomed me in and wanted us to be friends. To this day, he is still my best friend. His entirely family are friends of mine.

So along with my opinions about free agency, choice, desire to do right, moral values, and so on- I have experienced change myself and know others who have. No school charter or policy changed me. No adult reprimand changed me. I changed what I desired most and a loving mother forgave and used wisdom.

You won't find this parental inspiration in schools. Things like Family Home Evening can't be replaced by what the world offers.

news.john2
Orem, UT

Though I agree that we need to teach, encourage, persuade (or whatever similar word you would like to use) children to be good and kind; the fact is there are plenty of children with parents who will not, because they themselves are prone to bad behavior. So how do we protect the victims in the meantime? Why do we let "children" do things that if done as adults would be considered criminal? I wish I had answers. One possible step in the right direction in taking back the schools from bullies, is to make schools accountable. The standard unspoken policy on bullies at school is for the school to "document nothing, deny everything"; have some "bully education" and then move on. If schools had to be accountable for following up on accusations of bullying, then documenting the findings, then intervening on behalf of the victim if necessary; all the time knowing that they will be audited and held accountable, then maybe we might see a difference on how schools treat victims as opposed to the bullies. Yes there are a few random people and programs that are helping here and there, but currently bullies have preference in the system.

washcomom
Beaverton, OR

It's become acceptable to be a bully, as per the different shows on TV that 'tweens and teens watch: "Jersey Shore", "The Hills", and most reality shows.

They aren't a good use of time, nor are they beneficial to the psyche of anyone.

Monitor what is watched, and teach your children NOT to bully. But they also need to have some sort of fall-back plan if it happens to them. Make your home safe, so they can feel they can talk to you about it. Be their advocate. And don't take this lightly. This is very harmful, in the long run.

Schwa
South Jordan, UT

It gets better.

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

'MURRAY In third grade, kids started taunting Tate Harris about his sexuality...' - Article

'You are normal

Homosexuality is not a mental disorder. All of the major medical organizations, including The American Psychiatric Association, The American Psychological Association, and the American Academy of Pediatrics agree that homosexuality is not an illness or disorder, but a form of sexual expression.'

Source: Gay, Lesbian, and Bisexual Teens: Information for Teens and Parents

- America Acadamy of Pediactrics
Published online: 11/2008

*'Teens - gay or straight - more likely to attempt suicide in conservative towns' - By LINDSEY TANNER - Medical Writer - AP - 04/18/11

*Gay teen suicide linked to conservative climates By Rosemary Winters SL Tribune 04/18/11

'LGB youths were five times more likely than their straight peers to have attempted suicide. One in five gay teens said they had attempted suicide. (sic)
Mark Hatzenbuehler, a Columbia University psychologist and researcher, analyzed a survey of nearly 32,000 11th-graders in Oregon.'

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

'In high school, when he joined a school choir, typed notes began to appear on his windshield and the outside of his locker. "You should drop out," said one. "You should kill yourself," said another.' - Article

*'Poll: Young people say online meanness pervasive' - By Stacy A. Anderson - AP - Published by DSNews - 09/27/11

*'Arkansas school board member to resign over anti-gay post' - CNN - 10/28/10

'McCance wrote on his personal Facebook page that he wanted gay people to commit suicide...'

*'Advocates see rise in gay suicide' - By Gina Barker, Deseret News - 08/06/10

*'13-year-old Seth Walsh commits suicide after anti-gay bullying' - By Marci Stone - Salt Lake City Headlines Examiner - 09/29/10

*'Raymond Chase Commits Suicide, Fifth Gay Youth To Take Life In Three Weeks' - Huffington Post - 10/01/10

*'Utahns think about suicide more than other Americans, study shows' - By Dennis Romboy, Deseret News - 10/21/11

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

'It is parents responsibility to teach their children right from wrong and to teach them in a way that will help them motivate themselves to continually do right.' - A voice of Reason | 7:02 a.m. Jan. 4, 2012

This is an excellent point.

My concern, is that it is too vauge.

Many condemn LGBT persons for being 'wrong' or 'immoral' or not HAVING 'good' values.

My examples?

*'Excommunicated From His Church, Gay Mormon Commits Suicide' - By Eric Ethington - Published by Affirmation - 09/24/11

*'Gay man says 'reversal' therapy did not change him' - By Lisa Leff - Associated Press - Published by DSNews - 01/20/10

'A gay man testified Wednesday in a federal same-sex marriage trial that the "reversal therapy" he underwent as a teenager to change his sexual orientation drove him to the brink of suicide.'

*'Psychologists nix gay-to-straight therapy' - AP - 08/05/09

'The American Psychological Association declared Wednesday...(sic) No solid evidence exists that such change (to orientation) is likely, says the report, and some research suggests that efforts to produce change could be harmful, inducing depression and suicidal tendencies.'

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

Think bullying stops when you are a child?

*'Homosexuality Is a Sin: Rick Perry Tells Bisexual Teen Why He Opposes Gays in the Military' - By Buck Sexton - The Blaze - 12/19/2011

'..I dont agree that openly gays should serve in the militaryDont ask dont tell was working I hate the sin but i love the sinner.

*'Republican Debate Audience Boos Gay Soldier Stephen Hill After DADT Repeal Question' - By Jason Linkins - Huffington Post - 09/23/11

*'GOP state legislator: Homosexuality worse than terrorism' - By David Ferguson - Talking Points Memo - 09/10/11

*'Gays greatest threat to America, Buttars says' - By Aaron Falk - DSnews - 02/19/09

*Survey links gay suicides to religious message - BY KRISTEN MOULTON SL TRIBUNE 02/17/11

Think again.

There is a clear and evident connection between persecution due to religious teachings...

and gay suicide.

To believe that we can pray about personal insults from the time a person is a teen...

to when they die, is not realistic.

We need to DO something. We need to take action.

As, Momrons have felt the sting of persecution...

Missouri executive order 44, October 27, 1838.

We, as Americans, cannot ALLOW it to others.

raybies
Layton, UT

Victims of bullying are not generally part of a group, instead they have something in their behavior, circumstances or status that renders them unable to fight back--making an easy target. I it's naive to suggest that simply allowing whole peer groups to fight back in order to stop bullying will solve anything. Often the victims don't fit into or feel a part of any groups. Isolated they make easy targets.

It really requires intelligent adult observation both in the schools and by parents to identify who might be vulnerable.

JoLynne
LOGAN, UT

I was sad to read that children sometimes hide the problem from their parents, for fear their mom or dad will only make it worse. This article gives good advice on handling a bad situation--I agree that it's best to work with the child and have him play as big a role as possible in stopping the bullying. I'm glad to say that in my family's case, all we had to do was visit the principal. He took it seriously and listened while my child explained what was going on... and then he acted.

Butch70
Spokane, WA

I say stand up to these bullies and they will back off.

BobP
Port Alice, B.C.

This may not make it past the censors.

My youngest son was the victim of bullying in the church. In particular early morning seminary in Canada. They would take his coat and gloves and then shove him outside the chapel into minus 25 weather. It became a nearly daily occurance for a while.

The primary abusers were the sons of the Stake President and two Bishops (along with their hangers on). When I found out by accident, I arrived early to pick him up, I got some details and went to the fathers who gave me the "boys will be boys" routine. They also said thier sons were tired of my boys "smart mouth".

We had a meeting with my son, me, my wife the fathers of the and the boys. My wife verbally tore them all to shreds, apolgies were offered. My advice is, to never back down.

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