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Dick Harmon: Going 10-3 is an accomplishment, says BYU's Lance Reynolds

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  • Riverton Cougar Riverton, Utah
    Jan. 6, 2012 11:45 a.m.

    giantfan,

    You would be right except that you're forgetting one very important detail:

    #2 is better than #1, receiving 0 votes is better than getting 20 votes, 12 votes, or even 45 votes, #49 is better than #32, etc.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    Jan. 6, 2012 8:37 a.m.

    54-10,

    You're right, it does sting. I can't wait for Sept. 15! What we Cougar fans can take solace in, though, is that we at least know that BYU finished the season a better team than Utah. We'll probably finish ranked in the polls after another double digit win season. All you've got is 54-10 (hence the little brother need to have it as your username.)

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    Jan. 6, 2012 8:32 a.m.

    sportsfanforlife,

    Like I've commented to DevilishUte, I used Sagarin's rankings because he ranks all 246 FBS and FCS schools together from top to bottom. I don't know of anyone as or more credible who does. We can go USAToday, AP, Harris poll or BCS Final Rankings, if you'd like:

    USAToday:
    BYU 20 votes (#26)
    Utah 0 votes

    AP:
    BYU 12 votes (#29)
    Utah 0 votes

    Harris:
    BYU 45 votes (#26)
    Utah 0 votes

    BCS Final Rankings:
    BYU #32
    Utah #49

    And, in fact, in the 6 computer polls that make up 1/3 of the BCS Rankings, BYU is ranked higher than Utah in every single one of them (Sagarin, Colley, Anderson-Hester, Billingsley, Massey, Wolfe).

    So, as you can see, I didn't pick and choose a poll to help my point. In fact, every other poll I look at only confirms my point.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    Jan. 6, 2012 8:17 a.m.

    DevilishUte,

    I'm simply refuting your claim that BYU lost to a "superior team", which we know they didn't. I quote Sagarin because he ranks all 246 FBS and FCS schools together and I honestly don't know of anyone else as well respected as he who does. Maybe there is someone else more credible, I don't know. Care to share? Anyway, if Utah was or is superior to BYU, then why are they ranked higher than Utah in every human and computer poll that I've seen?

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    Jan. 6, 2012 8:12 a.m.

    crowntown1,

    I didn't say they weren't. The point is, BYU didn't lose to any of those teams, or any others that hang around the 100+ ranking. At home, no less.

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 5:55 p.m.

    I love how the 54-10 beat down is still stinging. No matter who lost or beat whom, 1 thing is for sure.

    Head to head - 54-10 at LES.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 5:36 p.m.

    i love how byu fans always use the sagarin ranknings cause it always make them look better than they actually are hahahaha if the espn rankings or ap coaches poll was like sagarin then they'd use them as well but notice how they dont... hmmm wonder why

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 5:16 p.m.

    @alpinecoug tsk tsk hahaha me get a life? really? and your on the boards responding to everything? so let me et this straight if you're a utah fan and you comment you need to get a life but if you're a byu fan its ok to comment on utah and byu articles??? hahahahahahahah you fans are so funny i just laught at EVERY single thing yall say cause its like listening to a bunch of 6 yr olds.

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 5, 2012 5:09 p.m.

    giantfan,

    You're missing a critical point in your argument.

    On 9/17 Jordan Wynn was the Utah QB.

    In the CO game he was not.

    Getting beat by 44 is slaughter. Why quote sagarin? We already know who won in the head-to-head matchup. 54-10.

    "Only one of BYU's losses was at home. Utah lost three at home, to #40, #46 and #105."

    Because you were playing a bunch of JV teams at home. No shame in losing to #40, #46 with a backup QB. The CO game was DISAPPOINTING and still is, but I bet losing by 44 hurts quite a bit, too. So does the fact that you've lost 7 of the last 10.

  • crowntown1 Corona, CA
    Jan. 5, 2012 5:06 p.m.

    Umm Colorado is still better than San Jose St., Idaho St., Idaho, Hawaii,etc.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 4:34 p.m.

    DevilishUte,

    There's no reason for Cougar fans to admit we lost to a "superior team" because we didn't. We got beat, slaughtered and embarrassed at home by 44 points to our bitter rival and we have to live with that ridicule for 12 looooooong months. I accept that. But we did not lose to a superior team, no way, no how. On Sept. 17, BYU beat BYU more than Utah beat BYU. That is a fact. And you can't convince me that Utah is and was superior because that same Utah team lost at home to a horrible Colorado team that hadn't won a single road game in four years. As poor as everyone wants to say that BYU's schedule was this year, we don't have one single loss on our schedule as bad as Utah's to Colorado. Not even close. Fact.

    To further support my argument:

    BYU Losses (Sagarin)
    #17 Texas
    #20 TCU
    #37 Utah

    Utah Losses
    #10 USC
    #36 Cal
    #40 Arizona State
    #46 Washington
    #105 Colorado

    Only one of BYU's losses was at home. Utah lost three at home, to #40, #46 and #105.

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 5, 2012 12:29 p.m.

    Alpy Blue,

    I'll stop talking about the beatdown on your own field by 44 points and the scattering on your fans after the 3rd quarter as soon as you Coogies admit to the loss (i.e. that you lost to a superior team by A LOT instead of coming up with excuses and "what-ifs"). You lost and lost by a SUBSTANTIAL margin. I could see the fluke argument if you lost by a missed FG at the end or a late score as time expired, but you lost by 44. That is not a fluke. That is a good ole fashion beatdown.

    The other way I'll stop talking about it is after the 2012 game at which point in time I'll discuss the latest whipping you'll have expereienced.

  • Alpine Blue Alpine, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 10:14 a.m.

    May we please add DevilishUte to the list of need "to get a life" commenters.

    He (and others) keep referring to the Utah beatdown of BYU earlier this season forgetting that these types of beatdowns sometimes happen in rivalries. In 2000 and again in 2003, the University of Oklahoma beat-up on very good Texas teams by scores of 63-14 in 2000 and 65-13 in 2003 and again by 55-17 this year. As recently as 2005 Texas whipped up on OU 45-12.

    In 2008 Alabama beat up on Auburn 36-0 after Auburn had won the Iron Bowl for six straight years. Every rivalry has its ups and downs. Get over it.

    What goes around comes around. And payback will be sweet for Cougar fans.

  • Alpine Blue Alpine, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 9:52 a.m.

    Amen Foolish Child, Amen!!

    Most of the posts on this article are extremely child-like and pathetic.

    Your plea for them to "get a life!" is dead-on correct. Especially for posters such as "sportsfanforlife", "duckhunter", "54-10", and "patriot".

    Get a life or better yet, get a job. And if you have a job and are wasting your employers time and money-time to go to work, rather than spewing hate and venom against your hated rival. This really is pathetic.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 9:01 a.m.

    @ares

    That is twice as good as the pac12's .282

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 5, 2012 8:58 a.m.

    And if it really is a rivalry game the home team is expected to win, not get drubbed by 44.

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 5, 2012 8:56 a.m.

    phantomblade,

    You didn't win on 9/17, did you? I recall a 44 point beatdown. The lil' band o' bros was competing for a NC in the preseason. After that DREAM ended in week 2 and was completely and utterly over by week 3, the shift changed to "we'll beat a bunch of JV teams and then we'll call it an accomplishment."

  • Ares Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 8:44 a.m.

    You Independence folk didn't do so well either.

    .500

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 5, 2012 8:27 a.m.

    "Why is it that you have an overwhelming compulsion to spend all the time you are obviously taking to post on articles that have NOTHING to do with Utah?"

    Becuase it's absolutely hilarious to read posts like the one you did, here.

  • Foolish Child Syracuse, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 11:18 p.m.

    To all of the UTE TROLLS that post on BYU articles:

    You say that Utah is now in a BCS conference and that you were chosen over BYU to join the PAC-12 because your athletic programs are superior to BYU.

    You say that BYU is playing a weak schedule and that BYU's decision to go independent is equivalent to choosing mediocrity and irrelevance nationally.

    If both of these statements are true, then why is it Ute trolls can't resist posting on EVERY article regarding the "irrelevant" Cougars?

    Why is it that you have an overwhelming compulsion to spend all the time you are obviously taking to post on articles that have NOTHING to do with Utah?

    Could it be that you are insecure? Maybe your poor showing in the weak southern division of the PAC-12 exposed the Utes as a mediocre team, and the only way you can feel good about your team and yourselves is to constantly denigrate BYU?

    Whatever the truth is, go find something else constructive to do with your time! Your obsessive interest in our "irrelevant" team is strange and pathetic. Get some therapy! Get a life!

  • hohum Saint George, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 9:45 p.m.

    Bowl results:

    PAC10.2 2 - 5 vrs MWC 0-1, Big 10 1-1, Big 12 0-3, ACC 1-0
    Big 12 6 - 2

    What does that say about the conference of champions.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 4, 2012 8:18 p.m.

    DevilishUte

    There may be more truth to the falling asleep question than either of us care to admit...

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 7:16 p.m.

    @phantomblade "btw, if you knew half as much as you pretend to know about college football, you'd know that Idaho State is in the Big Sky, same conference as Utah's first opponent, Montana State."

    thats not somethin i'd be trying to correct someone about LOL especially after all you y fans talked smack about utah OPENING with a big sky team

  • phantomblade Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 4, 2012 6:51 p.m.

    DevilishUte

    BYU played 4 BCS AQ teams this year and 5 WAC teams; but the real difference between BYU and Utah this year was BYU beat EVERY team they were supposed to, while Utah laid an egg against one of the worst teams in the country.

    Spin it however you want, but there's absolutely no excuse for Utah losing at home to a 10-loss team.

    btw, if you knew half as much as you pretend to know about college football, you'd know that Idaho State is in the Big Sky, same conference as Utah's first opponent, Montana State.

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 4, 2012 4:58 p.m.

    "Did Alabama complain that it was the grind of playing in the SEC week in and week out?"

    Yes, they complain about it all the time. Are you falling asleep at the wheel, kind sir?

    And, yes, there is good football played outside of the major conferences. I never said there wasn't. I said that the grind and talent of a BCS conference schedule makes it much more difficult to win on a weekly basis. A PAC-12 schedule is more difficult than a WAC or MWC schedule.

    Now that I have seen both - PAC-12 and MWC/WAC schedules - I wouldn't change being in the PAC-12. Quality competition each week and intrigue for every game. If that means the Utes drop a game or two along the way, then so be it.

    Recall that the Utes went 8-5 with a QB that shouldn't be playing D-I football and pasted your Cougs. Utah was and is the better team and has won 7 of the last 10 (another piece of evidence that the lil' band o' bros is falling behind).

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 4:35 p.m.

    @ Y Grad / Y Dad | 4:17 p.m. Jan. 4, 2012
    Richland, WA

    "Well that depends on if he comes with no sense of team and an out of control ego."

    Nice shot at Jake Heaps. Funny how you loved him when he was the number 1 QB in the country and he was holding press conferences and promising national championships. Now? Not so much.

    Typical.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 4:29 p.m.

    @duckhunter obviously we're not trying to convince you of anything if you cant even tell what it is hahahahaha.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 4, 2012 4:17 p.m.

    DevilishUte

    Your devilish Utes used to make a habit out of beating those NFL talent laden BCS teams in the bowl games. Did Alabama complain that it was the grind of playing in the SEC week in and week out?

    My point is that there is some dang fine football played outside of the power conferences and some pretty pathetic football in them. Overall, is the SEC better than the WAC? Well, duh. Would I like to have some of them bigger better faster stronger future NFL type players on my team? Well that depends on if he comes with no sense of team and an out of control ego.

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 3:59 p.m.

    @ DevilishUte | 3:44 p.m. Jan. 4, 2012
    Tempe, AZ

    You mean with my 2 dad's team playing every lower division WAC team and the worst team in the Big Sky (Idaho State)?

    Love how my 2 dads can't talk about BYU beating anyone, has to talk about Colorado or Boise State victories.

    Sad really.

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 4, 2012 3:44 p.m.

    Y Grad -

    It's the weekly grind of playing teams with NFL talent. It's not one-off examples like your OK example. In addition to having players that are bigger, stronger, and faster, every team has playmakers. There isn't a week that can be overlooked (Utah saw this all too well against CO) like the WAC or MWC schedules. Trust me, I used to think as you do, but now that I've watched conference games for 2 PAC-12 teams (18 conference games and I watched some that did not involve Utah or ASU), I can see how the rigors of the BCS conference schedule wear on teams.

    By the way, OSU put people in the NFL last year. Paea, for one. As I said before, I'm not going to go through each team and list out the talent. It's there and you know it. Coaching, a team being opportunistic, weather also factor into things but I would argue that the better coaches are in bigger conferences as well.

    I was mainly referring to players that get drafted. If you open up the argument to include undrafted players, even more PAC-12 players make NFL rosters.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 4, 2012 3:17 p.m.

    Sorry.

    The year that BYU beat Oklahoma...

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 4, 2012 3:15 p.m.

    54-10

    Not as much as Colorado still stings U. How much did that failure to show up cost U?

    Devilish Ute

    You make your point in a reasoned fashion, but I still disagree with it. The year that you beat Oklahoma, they were loaded with NFL talent. Shoot, the last time the Y beat the U, U had way more NFL talent. How about Colorado, are they loaded with NFL talent. Hasn't helped them much, present company excepted. Oregon State? How's their NFL talent?

    How about Boise State and whichever Arizona team they kicked around, which team there has the most NFL talent?

    And by the way, does Max Hall qualify as "NFL talent"?

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 2:46 p.m.

    I got at least 6 angst filled and desperate replies from utah "fans" on this page alone. Maybe you guys can take up another page trying to convince me of whatever it is you're trying to convince me of.

    LOL!

  • DevilishUte Tempe, AZ
    Jan. 4, 2012 2:32 p.m.

    My Two Dads,

    The biggest difference is that WSU has NFL-caliber players on the roster. The players are bigger, faster, and stronger in the PAC-12 than they are in the WAC. You cannot dispute that. In fact, I would argue that WSU has more NFL talent on their team, alone, than NMSU, SJSU, Idaho, and Idaho State COMBINED.

    Just a few examples on WSU. Before Jeff Tuel got hurt many were saying that he had NFL-type talent. I've seen him play and he is better than most WAC QBS by a long shot. Even better than Tuel, though, is Marquees Wilson. He is one of the better WRs in the country and will assuredly play on Sundays.

    1,388 yards and 12 TDs

    I could go through the rest of WSU's roster and the other PAC-12 teams and name players that will play in the NFL, but I doubt that will change your mind. You want to live in a fantasy land where beating up on WAC teams is an accomplishment.

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 1:51 p.m.

    @ Y Grad / Y Dad | 1:29 p.m. Jan. 4, 2012
    Richland, WA

    and the 54-10 still stings.

    love it

  • agb Layton, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 1:40 p.m.

    sportsfanforlife:

    You will be posting on BYU articles LONG after the polls come out. So you just proved yourself wrong.

    just the facts

    LOL

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 4, 2012 1:29 p.m.

    MLH

    Puhleeeeze, I grew up around Washington State football, it isn't as different as you think.

    All you over-inflated balloons try to define BYU football by it's most embarrassing loss, but can't figure out the same logic that defines Ute football the same way. Do you readily admit that Utah football is bad because you lost to the worst road team in college football - at home? I know, I know, at least U didn't quit. Hard to quit when U don't even show up.

    But that's just it, isn't it? All the whining and excuse making in the world for struggling back off the floor only to do another face plant to end your season, yet you are fixated on trying to deny any progress at all the Y made over the season.

    Well, we'll see you in September. Until then it's all just hot air and over-inflated egos over under-performing football teams.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 1:11 p.m.

    yeah yeah byu fans i know i know "wait until the polls come out" hahaha funny thing is NOONE will still care about byu

    just the facts

    LOL

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 1:10 p.m.

    just the facts that average teams dont beat really good teams such as clemson. or in byu's case sjsu, nmsu, idaho, id st, oregon st (no i dont count them as a good win for either team, theyre terrible just like byu).

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 12:58 p.m.

    hahah all these cougar fans are trying so hard to convince us that they really matter to the world when in all reality..... THEY DONT jsut like duckhunter

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 12:54 p.m.

    hahahahah i love how duckhunter thinks anything he says is accurate. well once again he's WRONG like always. his team is terrible just like his attempts to try and make them look relevant hahahaha

  • MLH SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 12:35 p.m.

    Y Grad Y Dad

    The reason why we keep the score in front of you (54-10) is that all of you cougs think that BYU is a better football team than Utah's, buddy it's not. You are not better than Texas or TCU. And yes you have 10 wins and yes you will probably be ranked, great job. But don't think that your wins over Idaho and NMSU were better than our wins over Arizona and Washington State. Totally different ball game, totally different athletes, totally different level of play. Two three years ago I would have been mad and jealous of the y being ranked and the Utes not. Doesn't even phase me anymore,we have passed you by and it's just going to get more fun in the future for us.

    Utah and BYU are not playing the same caliber of ball. It's just a blast to sit here at my computer and read the comments guys like you have, that your football team is at the same level or better. Like I said Totally Different, one thing I'm sure of, is that it is something you will never understand until you see it in person.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 4, 2012 12:31 p.m.

    @Duckhunter

    Speaking of embarrassing...

    You remember way back two seasons ago when BYU beat Oklahoma and BYU fans danced the night away in celebrations. BYU was ranked #7 in week three only to be embarrassed by 7-6 FSU @LES 54-28 in week 4?

    Utah in 2010 got spanked @RES by #2 team in the nation by a 7-6 team, go figure!

    What's worse is that 2009 BYU team was your best team since 1996.

  • MLH SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 12:05 p.m.

    @Riverton Cougar

    How long did it take you to figure out all of that stuff. Your SOS was in the 90's, you had a great year. Don't get so worked up. Please make sure you read what Patriot said, he has a very clear understanding of what it is like out there. I think it's great you guys won 10 but it is very clear you have no understanding of the game of college football through the eyes of a cougar fan. Make sure you watch the NFL draft this year you will see more PAC-12 players than WAC players being drafted. It's like that all the way around the PAC-12, you can't believe the quality of football we got to see (ute fans).

    USU
    San Jose State
    Idaho
    Idaho State
    New Mexico State

    WOW!!! Now I'm Impressed

  • lanius Woods Cross, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 11:40 a.m.

    "Sorry to burst your bubble, but no team that loses to a 10-loss team deserves to be ranked ahead of a 10-win team, regardless of SOS."

    Unless, of course, the team that lost the to the 10-loss team beat the 10-win team by 44 points at home.

    (yeah, I know it was a fluke.....what ever helps to justify)

  • crowntown1 Corona, CA
    Jan. 4, 2012 11:33 a.m.

    Duckhunter's comments are fueled by years and years of disappointment.

  • crowntown1 Corona, CA
    Jan. 4, 2012 11:23 a.m.

    Enough Said! YOu can sanction bowls take scholarships away but we still went 10-2 this year and are preseason favorites to win the NC next year. Most schools would be crippled by those kind of penalties. The actions of a few 6 years ago cost today's players. I'm okay with the fact that we are gonna be back and are a better team for it. So thank you Reggie and OJ! Duck hunter your ceiling is our floor.

  • MLH SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 11:19 a.m.

    @Duckhunter

    Way to stay balanced- (actually)Utah played a number of better teams than BYU. Now I'm the balanced one also. You beat one PAC-12 school, one conference USA team, and beat up on the WAC. The Bowl Game was a great win for the y. Give up the balance you're a homer, be proud of it.

  • Th Tooele, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 11:08 a.m.

    I think what this whole argument here is that rankings are garbage and a playoff should be played.

    Duckhunter, what in the world does TCU's 47-7 win over Utah have to do with anything? Who cares, its in the past just like Utahs 54-10 win over the cougars this year.

    Rankings are meaningless. There is not an unbias fan in here that would pick Tulsa over Georgia Tech if they were to play head to head. If Utah was ranked 34th or whatever it was on the aforementioned ranking, and GT 50, then with this logic why would GT have been a 3 point favorite?

    Why? Because rankings are near pointless! The only rankings that matter in the system they play in is the #1, and #2 teams.

    Some people keep stating "fact" or so they say. Maybe their personal facts I guess, but Utah played a more difficult schedule than BYU, lost the key to the season in Wynn and won 8 games. BYU's key didn't fit in Heaps, and had a decent year. Both schools competed in most of their games.

    Good job to both teams.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 10:58 a.m.

    @clowntown

    "In accordance with the findings released today by the NCAA, the University of Southern Californias 2005 Orange Bowl game victory has been vacated. BCS Executive Director Bill Hancock said."

    "Among the penalties were a two-year bowl ban, four years of probation, scholarship losses and removal of several victories. "

    The university recognizes that violations of NCAA rules did occur, especially involving impermissible benefits going to student athletes as well as their friends and families, from unscrupulous sports agents and sports marketers, Dickey said. We take full responsibility for those violations, given that they happened on our watch.

    "The school also will return its copy of Bushs trophy to the Heisman Trust,"

    Enough said. LOL!

  • crowntown1 Corona, CA
    Jan. 4, 2012 9:50 a.m.

    Ole Miss 2-10
    UCF 5-7
    SJSU 5-7
    Idaho 2-10
    Hawaii 6-7
    Oregon St. 3-9
    Idaho St. 2-9
    NMS 4-9

    Enough said

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 9:42 a.m.

    @sportsfanforlife

    "@bluecoug go show me ga techs highest ranking of the year then show me tulsa's then show me tulsa's conference schedule and ga techs then tell me who is mediocre hahahaha"

    You remember way back to last season when utah was ranked #5? They were then exposed in the most humiliating fashion, 47-7, at home and then went on to be humiliated almost weekly for the remainder of the season in similar lopsided losses.

    In otherwords utah being ranked 5th was not just false but laughably false.

    Who cares what Georgia Tech "was" ranked, now that we have the entire season to evaluate them we all know, and the pollsters know, that they were a very average team. A high early season ranking is meaningless, you utah "fans" have told us that so very many times. What matters is where you finish and in this case both BYU and Tulsa finished higher than either utah or Georgia Tech.

    Just the facts.

    LOL!

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 4, 2012 6:45 a.m.

    @BlueCoug:

    Sorry to burst your bubble, but no team that loses to a 10-loss team deserves to be ranked ahead of a 10-win team, regardless of SOS.

    ---------

    Sorry to burst your bubble but read your what you said earlier:

    Sagarin rankings before the bowls

    #29 Tulsa
    #38 Utah
    #44 BYU
    #50 Ga Tech

    Seems to me Utah was ranked ahead when BYU had a SOS 97 but not when SOS 90. Now, if you had a SOS of 43 you might be ranked in the top 20 rather then waiting for Penn State to lose.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 4, 2012 6:33 a.m.

    @SportsFan: "Overall perception around the country will be that unranked Utah couldn't win 10 games despite their weak schedule."

    Sorry to disappoint you but here's the overall perception around the country about Utah's first year in the PAC-12:

    "Still, the initial verdict is fairly positive. While the grind of Pac-12 play is far different than the Mountain West Conference, it's clear that Utah can compete in the Pac-12. They figure to be a long-term fixture in the South Division race." -- ESPN

    @BlueCoug

    I accepted Sagarin rankings, I congratulate you on being ranked 3 spots hire even though you had twice as easy schedule. Remember Dick Harmon said you had a "50-50" chance against TCU, Utah, and Texas so really BYU should have been playing in a BCS game this year.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 4, 2012 6:03 a.m.

    motorbike | 5:30 p.m. Jan. 3, 2012
    Cottonwood Heights, UT

    "Overall perception around the country will be that a top 25 BYU ranking will have come as a result of a weak schedule and a bunch of better teams beating up on each other... What does it mean? A lot to you I guess, but not much to most.

    Sure would be nice to have a playoff system."

    Okay, fair enough. I think at least half of the value of polls is it allows people to say how wrong the polls are. And yet, overall MEASURABLE perception will be that BYU made it in to the top 25. Would I trade that for a more respectable game against my despised, honorable rival? Maybe even another over-time win?

    As hard as it is to say no, Id have to say no. Smack talk aside, you have to admit that while Sept 17 was the low point of our season, it was the high point of yours. As Utah fans have repeatedly reminded BYU fans, where you start doesnt matter, its where you end that counts.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 12:23 a.m.

    motorbike

    Overall perception around the country will be that unranked Utah couldn't win 10 games despite their weak schedule. The PAC 12 gift-wrapped the south division for Utah, and the Utes laid an egg against one of the worst teams in the country when the division title was there for the taking.

    Utah finishes with a losing record playing 5 home and 4 road conference games; which makes winning the PAC 12 South next season even less likely. Utah hasn't had a road win against a PAC 12 team with a winning record since last century.

  • BlueCoug Orem, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:25 p.m.

    Uteology

    "Utah played a twice as difficult schedule (SOS 43 vs 90) yet is only ranked 3 spots lower than BYU."

    It's laughable how Utah fans have no problem whatsoever citing Sagarin's SOS rankings, but refuse to accept his team rankings. Lower ranking is still lower ranking, regardless of how you try to spin it. To understand why BYU is ranked higher, instead of concentrating solely on wins, you should also consider losses.

    BYU lost to
    #17 Texas
    #20 TCU
    #37 Utah

    Utah lost to
    #10 USC
    #36 Cal
    #40 ASU
    #46 Wash
    #105 Col

    Sorry to burst your bubble, but no team that loses to a 10-loss team deserves to be ranked ahead of a 10-win team, regardless of SOS.

    -----------------

    sportsfanforlife

    Your personal bias not-withstanding, Tulsa is a better football team than Ga Tech according Sagarin, the guru of SOS, who, unfortunately for U and despite BYU's SOS, still ranks BYU ahead of Utah, as will the AP and Coaches polls when they're published at the end of the season.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:49 p.m.

    @bluecoug go show me ga techs highest ranking of the year then show me tulsa's then show me tulsa's conference schedule and ga techs then tell me who is mediocre hahahaha

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:45 p.m.

    @bluecoug who is sagarin?? nobody but you y fans care about sagarin. how bout you go tell me who ga tech beat and then who tulsa beat and what conference is tulsa in and what conference is ga tech in? georgia tech is a much better football team than tulsa conference and who they actually beat tell it all. haha actually watch games instead of just guessing who was better if you watched any game besides byu games you would know that

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:03 p.m.

    @BlueCoug

    Utah played a twice as difficult schedule (SOS 43 vs 90) yet is only ranked 3 spots lower than BYU. With a SOS of 90 shouldn't you have accomplished your "Quest" by now?

    BYU will be ranked for the "quantity" of wins not the "quality". Penn State will drop out of the rankings so BYU will most likely be ranked.

    That would mean Utah will have one less win over a final ranked team than BYU has since 1996, BYU is 2-26 vs final ranked teams. Utah will have 5 such wins since 2008.

  • bigutefan Las Vegas, NV
    Jan. 3, 2012 8:00 p.m.

    CBS Sports ranks BYU's strength of schedule as the #111 most difficult out of 120 schools. What that really says is only 9 other teams had easier schedules. It is not difficult to win 10 games when you play 5 games against very weak competition and most of those games at home in Provo. I believe BYU had 7 home games this year. Most teams would beat Idaho, Idaho State, San Jose State, New Mexico State, and Hawaii. On the other hand Utah played 11 BCS opponents. To come out of that schedule with 8 wins is a pretty big accomplishment.

  • agb Layton, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 7:07 p.m.

    Brave Sir Robin:

    Ironically in your attempt to say BYU didn't have any signature wins, you made one of your signature comments: full of errors, straw men and double standards. As has been well documented by previous posters.

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    Jan. 3, 2012 5:54 p.m.

    Brave sir Robin
    Definite revision is needed here as bigsoccer has pointed out... Oregon State lost to BYU as well as did Arizona ...but even I wouldn't consider them... Pitt...UCLA... or Washington State as signature teams...and trying to downplay getting beat by the team considered the fifth worst team in division I...a team that hadn't won a road game since 2007 until they beat Utah at RES sort of muddies any sense of credibility. Your signature wins were BYU and Georgia Tech. BYU's was Tulsa and possibly Ole Miss...only because it's from the SEC the best conference period. A win over Utah State is nice...but not necessarily a signature win. The final rankings will settle this issue so until then it's just plain old difference of opinions.

  • BlueCoug Orem, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 5:34 p.m.

    sportsfanforlife

    "ga tech a mediocre team at best?"

    Sagarin rankings before the bowls

    #29 Tulsa
    #38 Utah
    #44 BYU
    #50 Ga Tech

    How else would you characterize bowl opponents other than BYU played a good bowl opponent and Utah played an average or mediocre opponent.

    And the post game rankings bear that out.

    Sagarin rankings after the bowls

    #34 BYU (jump 10 spots)
    #37 Utah (moved up 1 spot)
    #39 Tulsa (dropped 10 spots, but still well ahead of Ga Tech)
    #53 Ga Tech (dropped 3 spots)

    Sorry that the rankings don't support the crimson-colored view of the kids on the hill, but one game does not a season make.

    Obsessing about 54-10, while totally ignoring 14-17 (at home to one of the worst teams in the country), just shows you're not being honest with yourselves about the overall season.

    If a 10-win season is really so insignificant, why has Utah only managed to do it 6 times in their entire football history?

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 5:30 p.m.

    Y Grad / Y Dad -

    Overall perception around the country will be that a top 25 BYU ranking will have come as a result of a weak schedule and a bunch of better teams beating up on each other.
    To be fair, I'm not saying BYU doesn't deserve the ranking ... but who would really know when they lost to the only decent teams they played - outside of MAYBE Tulsa??
    Most people around the country don't think twice when teams from outside the BCS are in the top 25 ... for good reason.
    To show my unbiased intent, I readily admit that had Utah's 2008 team played a BCS conference schedule they never would have made it to #2 in the country - just my opinion.
    Conversely, I believe the 2004 Ute team might have challenged for the national championship given the chance - again, just my opinion.
    Bottom line, BYU did pretty well against what was put in front of them. Meanwhile a lot of good teams played tough games every week allowing BYU to crawl up the rankings. What does it mean? A lot to you I guess, but not much to most.
    Sure would be nice to have a playoff system.

  • crowntown1 Corona, CA
    Jan. 3, 2012 5:06 p.m.

    It tells me they lost the game. Do i think that ASU, UCLA or Cal were quality bowl elegible teams this year? NO! THe Pac 12 has deals with several bowls so teams like UCLA with a terrible record go to a bowl.

  • Ibleedcrimson Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 4:55 p.m.

    Congrats to BYU for a 10 & 3 season, a few bounces your way and you beat Texas for 11 and 2. Nice bowl win.

    Congrats to Utah for overcoming the loss of their starting QB and clawing their way to a respectable 8 win season under those circumstances. Nice bowl win!

    Congrats to USU, you came up short in the bowl game but the progress the last few years has been impressive, may it continue into the future.

    I think these three teams records will be closer than alot of us may want to beleive next year, let's hope it's double digits for all!

    A Utah fan

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 4:34 p.m.

    patriot | 3:44 p.m. Jan. 3, 2012
    Cedar Hills, UT

    ya think? Their schedule was an embarassment.

    Sad really.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 4:31 p.m.

    Riverton Cougar -

    When are you and some of your similar-thinking friends going to realize that the win/loss record of Utah's individual opponents are not comparable side by side to those of BYU's opponents.
    You might as well say the Idaho Vandals are on the same level as the Indianapolis Colts because each team won 2 games this year.
    So I'm guessing you must also think BYU would have BEAT the Colts this year ... and by a score of about 42-7, right?

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 3, 2012 4:13 p.m.

    patriot | 3:44 p.m. Jan. 3, 2012
    Cedar Hills, UT

    "BYU would not have to try and convince people that 10-3 is a good year had they played decent competition....it goes without saying. Obviously Lance is embarrassed by the "bo-diddly-tech" home schedule BYU had this year."

    We don't have to convince anybody. When the polls come out next week, that will be good enough for me.

    Debating with ankle-biters is just a bad habit many of us can't seem to shake. Just like being ankle-biters is a nasty habit some of you can't seem to overcome.

  • Sandpiper Air Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 4:02 p.m.

    @crowntown1, if ASU and Cal should not have been invited to a bowl game, what does that say for utah that lost to both of those teams?

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 3:44 p.m.

    BYU would not have to try and convince people that 10-3 is a good year had they played decent competition....it goes without saying. Obviously Lance is embarrassed by the "bo-diddly-tech" home schedule BYU had this year.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 3:38 p.m.

    "Winning 10 games is a very hard thing to do. It is a great accomplishment for any football team."

    HA!!! Winning 10 games against Idaho, Idaho St, New Mex St, San Jose St, Utah State ,Hawaii and Tulsa? How hard is that? Just about any mediocre team with that cotton candy schedule is going to win 10 games. Sorry Lance but nobody is buying what you are selling ...with the exception of Dick Harmon. Substitute in USC, Washington, Arizona , Arizona St,and UCLA and let's see if BYU get's to 10 wins this year. If BYU wants to play this silly game of powder-puff scheduling at home and then claim a great year then go ahead but nobody outside of Provo Utah is going to listen.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 3:30 p.m.

    @sportsfanfor life

    I own you.

    LOL!

  • KevoTheLion SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 3:13 p.m.

    @Old Cougar....Save it for the lds.org posts please!

    I can't stand it when people get all preachy on these posts with their high and mighty talk. Sorry people but God doesn't follow football or any other sports. Isn't it odd that when the score is tied in the closing seconds and both teams are down on a knee praying for the victory? Someone has to get the shaft? Religion and sports need separation or its nothing but a bunch of hypocrites preaching unity then trashing each other on posts two seconds later.

  • Riverton Cougar Riverton, Utah
    Jan. 3, 2012 2:54 p.m.

    "Utah's signature wins: Pitt, Oregon State, Arizona, UCLA, Washington State, Georgia Tech"

    Pitt: 6-6
    Oregon State: 3-9
    Arizona: 4-8
    UCLA: 6-8
    Washington State: 4-8
    Georgia Tech: 8-5

    Wow, I'm impressed!

    Some of BYU's wins:

    UCF: 5-7
    Utah State: 7-6
    SJSU: 5-7
    Hawaii: 6-7
    Tulsa: 8-5

    So, each team beat 2 teams with winning seasons; Utah beat BYU and Georgia Tech; BYU beat USU and Tulsa. Also note that at least 2 of Utah's "signature wins" are worst than some of these teams BYU beat.

    Let's look at the loses for BYU:
    Utah: 8-5
    Texas: 8-5
    TCU: 11-2

    And for Utah:
    Colorado: 3-10
    ASU: 6-7
    California: 7-6
    Washington: 7-6
    USC: 10-2

    Newsflash: BYU didn't lose to any 3-10, 6-7, or 7-6 teams. In fact, they beat them. It seems that USC is comparable to TCU. So, Utah's only impressive wins are against 10-3 BYU and 8-5 Georgia Tech, but lost to some pretty bad teams. BYU's impressive wins are against Tulsa and USU, but have no loses against bad teams (unless you consider Utah a bad team).

    Utah fans like to trash BYU, but BYU makes Utah look much better. On the other hand, BYU only beat "nobodies", but unlike Utah, they didn't lose to any "nobodies". What is worst, not beating the "somebodies" or losing to a nobody?

    Keep in mind that BYU's 1984 season of "beating nobodies", as Ute fans would say, was still more impressive than Utah beating Alabama in the Sugar Bowl. The difference was one team was awarded a National Championship, the other wasn't.

  • TheHailstorm South Weber, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 2:12 p.m.

    @ Still Blue after all these years;
    The signature win was not BYU but the Sun Bowl that has been played for 74 years with the prime time schedule, top announcers, national CBS coverage and a lot of heart to come back for the win. Georgia Tech was 29-2 when leading after three quarters. That was some good press there pardner and a SIGNATURE win. Kyle Whittingham is 7-1 in bowl games.
    You can tell the good programs by the assistant coaches that get offers , Kyle replaces them and the Utes keep winning.
    He does not fire the entire staff, go surfing in Mexico for two weeks, and then have his coaches re apply.
    7/8 bowl wins are all signature wins as the press has a great time with Utah in a game.

  • crowntown1 Corona, CA
    Jan. 3, 2012 2:09 p.m.

    Their bowl record is bad because some of the schools that were invited shouldn't even be in a bowl i.e. UCLA,ASU make a case for Cal as well. SC is elegible than it's another W. Stanford lost to a good OK St im OT and Washington as well. Let's not get carried away.

  • Unlucky HEBER CITY, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 1:55 p.m.

    People please grow up. BYU is only going to be average from here on out. They will lose to those they should and beat those they should.

    Utah will win a marque game or two now and again but also stumble against some horrible team just as often. Take away Oregon and USC, Standford will drop some next year and the PAC 12 is worse than the Big East, look at the Bowl Records this year.

    Stop the hate both teams let their fans down or you wouldn't be trying to hype them up so much.

    Get use to years like this more are on the way. Quit thinking you are top ten programs. Both are between 30 and 40 somewhere that's it.

  • Rikitikitavi Cardston, Alberta
    Jan. 3, 2012 1:24 p.m.

    Enough already about the inaugural season for BYU independence. What looms ahead is the second season (2012). Truly a test for the Cougars under the tutelage of H.C.Bronco and O.C. Brandon Doman with a noticeably improved schedule. Coaches will REALLY have to "go big or go home" in 2012. Go Cougars.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 1:18 p.m.

    @duckhunter and to say byu was their signature win HAHAHAHAHA yeah right and to say byu is the only "good" team they beat is a joke. byu is not good haha. you call ga tech "mediocre at best" and byu good? dude you just officially made me look at you like you have no idea whats goin on in the sports world outside of provo ut hahaha. you officially have zero credibility on these boards after those comments. thanks for proving yourself once and for all hahahaha

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 1:15 p.m.

    @duckhunter dude are yuou relly that clueless? ga tech a mediocre team at best? did you even watch them play this season or are you just one of those clueless fans that think everyone byu plays is better than mediocre. fact is ga tech wasnt a mediocre team, far better than tulsa. go look at the win/loss column for both teams then come on the board and look foolish atleast do some research first. go tell me where ga tech was ranked most of the season compared to tulsa. i already have the answer ready so dont try to play mne like a fool.

  • 61Cougar Seattle, Wa
    Jan. 3, 2012 1:05 p.m.

    @Old Cougar

    Sounds like college football in the United Order. I love it!

    I wish you well in your New Year's resolution. Good luck with that.

  • UU32 Bountiful, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 1:03 p.m.

    A 10 win season is nothing to put down. Congratulation to BYU for beating the teams they were supposed to beat which, we as Utah fans know all too well, is not always an easy task.

    I think there is a similar feel to both the BYU and Utah seasons this year. Both ended up the season a little bit worse that we had hoped. Both had QB issues that will continue to linger into next year. Both competed on a larger stage than we had been religated to in years gone by. Both were left with a bit of "What if". Both had pretty darn good years if we are all honest with ourselves.

    Any way you look at it, college football in the state of Utah is great entertainment. Both Utah and BYU have reason to be happy but not content with the season. Both teams have plenty of talent back next year to make a run at their respective goals.

    Here's to a great 2012. Good luck to both the Utes and Cougs.

  • Cougar Alumni Beaver, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:53 a.m.

    My only wish is that the Cougar Nation would be truly honest with themselves and wake up to realize a 10 win season against a cupcake schedule isn't that impressive.

    Bring back the Cougars of old, when they strived to get good solid teams on their schedule.

    Sorry, I just don't see it.

    A 3 game Bowl streak is also unimpressive when you play in the NIP " Nobody Important Bowl"

    Come on Bronco, get Mr. Holmoe on the right path.

  • Old Cougar Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:41 a.m.

    In my church we have just begun a course of study for the year 2012. One of the points presented was a listing of "11 ideals."

    Ideal # 9 states: "I would overcome the tendency to selfishness and jealousy and rejoice in the successes of all the children of my Heavenly Father." (GAS)

    Congratulations to Utah on having completed a successful football season.
    Congratulations to BYU on having completed a successful football season.
    Congratulations to USU on having completed a successful football season.
    Congratulations to Weber State on having completed a successful football season.
    Congratulations to SUU, Dixie State, and Snow College on impressive wins.
    etc, etc, etc.

    This year I will try to remove pettiness from my thinking. I will rejoice in victory; will agonize in defeat, but hopefully never put anyone down for trying/giving up/losing.

    Let's us all think/comment on a higher level and enjoy all successes which so many people have worked so hard to achieve.

  • JustTheTruthMan bountiful, ut
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:36 a.m.

    Even basketball is over for the spinsters on the hill... Maybe we should just fast forward to um, silence? Do I hear silence? do I hear let's simply not talk again until September 15th? I second that notion! Silence until September 15th. Oh, and just the truth of this post is that football isn't over until a week from today after Alabama has crushed the dreams and hopes of the over hyped yet galaxies better than U LSU tigers.

  • Jake2010 bountiful, ut
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:32 a.m.

    Perhaps no signature wins but also to that is added NO signature LOSSES! On the schedule of either basketball or football you do not as of this day see even one loss by the Cougars to a team with a losing record... And, BCS credo is not credit for justifying a loss... A loss is a loss is a loss is a loss.... This said... Beating Hawaii in Hawaii with the rivalry like it is is a bigger than most wins against teams with losing records. But, no where near as humiliating as losing by 3 at home to a 2-10 team going into it that improved to 3-10 with that win. Further, at least the Lady Cougars don't outscore our men on the hardwoods as the Lady Utes did on Saturday in Colorado. Men lose 74-33 Women lose 58-52...... What does this say? It says that totally unrelated it is the Laughingstock Stumble in the Rockies in this new rivalry between Boulder and SLC.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:31 a.m.

    Duckhunter | 9:07 a.m. Jan. 3, 2012
    utah's one and only "signature win" this year came against BYU, the only good team they beat.

    -------------

    And BYU's one and only signature win? Utah State! They proved it by storming the field.

  • Sandpiper Air Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:23 a.m.

    Football is over. Let's talk basketball.

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:08 a.m.

    If you say it and print it enough, you just might start believing it.

    Sad.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 10:54 a.m.

    "It would have been much better if the Cougars had won the 50-50 chance games that turned into their three losses."
    ___________________

    I don't have any problem with Harmon making the above comment, but if you're going to make that comment then make the following one as well. Something like this;
    "... of course it took two miracles at the end of the USU game to steal that victory and another miracle at Ole Miss, meaning the Cougars were likely much closer to being an 8-5 team than they were to being an 11-2, 12-1 or 13-0 team."
    Notice I didn't mention the good fortune they also had against Tulsa (last second victory) and Central Florida (interception with the ball on the Cougar 10 with 3 minutes left that would have tied the game.) But those games could more accurately be put in the "50-50 chance games" then the Utah and TCU games as Harmon tries to imply. Now Texas, that's a better argument.
    Bottom line, most logical thinkers would say BYU was much closer to 6-7 then they were to winning "50-50 chance games that turned into their three losses."

  • bigsoccer Syracuse, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 10:46 a.m.

    Brave Sir Robin | 8:59 a.m. Jan. 3, 2012
    San Diego, CA
    "Utah's signature wins: Pitt, Oregon State, Arizona, UCLA, Washington State, Georgia Tech
    BYU's signature wins: Tulsa, Utah State"

    Really? BYU also beat Oregon State, oh Arizona and UCLA, and Washington Stated are not signature wins, they are very bad football teams

  • Disgruntled Nephi, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 10:39 a.m.

    As weak as TV coverage smack is, it cracks me up that Ute fans use the fact their bowl game was on CBS as evidence it was the "better" bowl game. Just one question for all Ute fans who use this argument: What channel are ALL the BCS games on, including the national championship?

  • TheHailstorm South Weber, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 10:22 a.m.

    @ Still Blue after all these years;
    The signature win was not BYU but the Sun Bowl that has been played for 74 years with the prime time schedule, top announcers, national CBS coverage and a lot of heart to come back for the win. Georgia Tech was 29-2 when leading after three quarters. That was some good press there pardner and a SIGNATURE win. Kyle Whittingham is 7-1 in bowl games.
    You can tell the good programs by the assistant coaches that get offers , Kyle replaces them and the Utes keep winning.
    He does not fire the entire staff, go surfing in Mexico for two weeks, and then have his coaches re apply.
    7/8 bowl wins are all signature wins as the press has a great time with Utah in a game.

  • Ares Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:51 a.m.

    Lance Reynolds doesn't know what he is talking about. BYU players have big mouths. I could tell Bronco has been saying stuff like this all season, even though they play joke teams all season.

  • Still Blue after all these years Kaysville, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:49 a.m.

    As a life long Cougar, I confess to being disappointed this year. We had a ton of starters returning and much optimism as the season began. We knew we had some patsy's on the schedule but given the first year of independence, I did not mind that. But in the big games, I don't think Bronco had the team ready to play. Perhaps against Texas, but not really against Ole Miss, and certainly not Utah and TCU. We can do better, we should do better and I am hopeful we will do better.

    And to the silly Utes that keep coming on here - why? yes, you beat us this year. We admit we did not even show up. But that WAS your signature win and if you keep telling us how bad BYU is, then what does that say about you? It will be interesting to count the votes in the final polls; from unbiased observers.

    Basketball? Oh, that's right, I keep forgetting, the U is a one sport school.

  • TheHailstorm South Weber, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:45 a.m.

    @ Uteology
    I agree
    "it would have been much better if the Cougars had won the 50-50 chance games that turned into their three losses"

    Utah pounding the Y into the turf at RES with a score of 54-10 and was the biggest beat down in 89 years --- and that's a 50/50/ game ?
    ROTFL !!!

    With their tender schedule it would like being proud to have beaten a third grade student in Scrabble.
    @ Duckhunter
    How do you get away by addressing Sir Robin as cowardly ?
    That is what I thought of you after the disappearing you pulled act after the game on Sept. 17th. and @ RES no less.
    Don't call people names and degrade them, this is sports and the columns aren't here to feed your ego.

  • Disgruntled Nephi, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:42 a.m.

    Um, Robin how is it Oregon State at home is a signature win for Utah, but beating them on the road isn't for BYU? Did you forget about that one? Personally, I don't think the win for either team qualifies. Wins against WSU, Arizona and UCLA are signature wins? Way to set the bar high! Combined conference record of the PAC teams Utah beat? 12-24! And I thought Utah was big-time! And Pitt? Really? Beating a team that is in the PAC 12 or any other BCS conference does not automatically qualify as a signature win. Or, maybe it Utah's case I guess it is.

  • Dee J Portland, OR
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:42 a.m.

    @ Brave Sir Robin:

    Did you seriously put a home victory over Oregon State in Utah's signature win column, but leave a road victory over Oregon State off BYU's signature win column?

    Very lame. If you're going to come on to the BYU football comment boards talking smack at all things BYU, you should at least have grenades in your arsenal; you're dropping pop rocks.

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:23 a.m.

    It usually takes at least 3 years to put together a respectable schedule...and all things considered for BYU suddenly going independant and having to fully start from scratch...to even put together a schedule at all let alone as decent one as it did in such a short time is in itself an accomplishment. Of course the ESPN partnership had a lot to do with this accomplishment and will be essential in the ensuing years to come as well. There is no doubt we will continue to see great improvements over this first year's schedule...which btw... already is...coming about. It wasn't the greatest admittedly...but it could have been a lot worse. The good thing is that the next couple of years will see even better schedules...and most... as was the case this first year...will be nationally televised...which for those truly unable to grasp the true significance...is the principle reason for going independant in the first place.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:16 a.m.

    "It would have been much better if the Cougars had won the 50-50 chance games that turned into their three losses." -- Dick Harmon

    How did BYU have a 50-50 chance against TCU? The same TCU team that has owned BYU the last 4 years (0-4). That game was over by halftime.

    Against Utah even if you take away Utah's points scored on TOs we win by 14 points. Utah 7 of last 10.

    Face the fact, BYU got exposed when they played the only good teams on their schedule.

  • Wayne Rout El Paso, TX
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:09 a.m.

    I think this illustrates the problem in the BYU football program. Too many people think "pretty good" is good enough. No one at Alabama, LSU, or other top programs would say that 10-3, while loosing to your only tougher teams, was something to be proud about. Or would they say that fielding a team with a quarterback that can't throw effectively was a mark of success? Most programs work 7 long days a week during the football season, BYU coaches, we are told, work a much shorter week. That is fine, but how do they compensate for less effort...maybe by taking satisfaction in being "pretty good" instead of being great.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:07 a.m.

    @cowardly robin

    "Utah's signature wins: Pitt, Oregon State, Arizona, UCLA, Washington State, Georgia Tech."

    With the exception of Georgia tech, which is at best a mediocre team, all of those other "signature wins" are crappy teams. Every single one of them. So if utah's "signature wins" came against crap teams with losing records then you probably shouldn't be bragging about them.

    utah's one and only "signature win" this year came against BYU, the only good team they beat.

    LOL!

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Jan. 3, 2012 9:03 a.m.

    What was Utah's signature win? We all know who BYU's and Utah's signature losses were...

    Weak schedule, weak schedule, weak schedule. Just watch when the final rankings come out, and then stand in your corner alone and keep repeating: weak schedule.

    And Riley raggers, your assignment is to re-watch the Tulsa game and only listen to what Andre Ware had to say about Riley play by play. If your point of view doesn't change, it will only be because you have a mind like a steel trap: shut tight and mostly air.

    To compare Riley to the top 5 quarterbacks and then say he won't beat top 20 competition is disingenuous. Even with a sub-par game (Andrew Luck has them too) he beat a team that would have ended up in the top 25 if we hadn't beaten them and taken their place.

    Next season DOES get tougher, but not hugely so. One more tough team and all tough teams on the road. 10 wins would be good, 11 would be awesome, 12 would be incredible, and 13 is a way tall order - but doable.

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    Jan. 3, 2012 8:59 a.m.

    @Mountanman (sp?)

    You still don't get it, do you?

    The Colorado Buffaloes go in Utah's loss column. Did you forget? Utah LOST to Colorado. We're talking about signature WINS.

    Utah's signature wins: Pitt, Oregon State, Arizona, UCLA, Washington State, Georgia Tech
    BYU's signature wins: Tulsa, Utah State

    The morale of the story: When you play a bunch of nobodies and beat all of them, you've still beaten nobody.

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Jan. 3, 2012 8:54 a.m.

    @ Sir Robin. The only teams who defeated Tulsa in 2011 were ranked in the top ten, except for BYU. Puts that win in the signature win column doesn't it? What column do the Colorado Buffaloes belong in?

  • thebigsamoan Richmond, VA
    Jan. 3, 2012 8:47 a.m.

    The season's over. Yes, the schedule strength was not exactly the kind that makes for bragging rights but it was still 10 wins and a great accomplishment by the kids that we can all be proud of. Much is made of the so called powerhouse schools and their successes but we often failed to realize that all the best athletes go to those schools year in and year out so there's a huge discrepancy between them and the rest of the schools as far as talent is concern, and that gives them a huge and unfair advantage. Does anyone think that if BYU, or any other school for that matter, would not be successful if they too can get the kind of top notch athletes that schools like Alabama, LSU, Oklahoma, Ohio State, USC, etc., get? I think they would. In fact, the perennial bottom dwellers in those same powerhouse conferences would also have a chance to shine like their top dogs if they too could get the same type of talents. I have no doubt about that.

    Go Cougs! Can we win another NC with so called choir boys? Well, why not? Let's aim to make it happen.

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    Jan. 3, 2012 8:47 a.m.

    @Mountanman (sp?)

    Nobody is disparaging the WAC. They are disparaging BYU.

    You're absolutely right that BSU (a WAC team) beat down Utah in the Vegas Bowl. This was the same Boise State team that beat the #6 team at their place (Virginia Tech). Boise was very good, and the fact that they were in the WAC didn't change that.

    Boise had a signature win in 2010. Again, what was BYU's signature win in 2011? Was it Utah State? Tulsa? Tell me...enquiring minds want to know.

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Jan. 3, 2012 8:40 a.m.

    I don't know why so many Utes deparage the WAC. Wasn't it just last year when a lowly WAC team (BSU) game the Utees and through beat down in their bowl game?

  • RockOn Spanish Fork, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 8:22 a.m.

    Life is "compared to what."

    Compared to what BYU would have had in the Mountain West, independence is preferable. Having Wyoming, New Mexico, UNLV and Colorado ST vs. Idaho, ISU, NMS, and SJS is a coin toss. All mediocre to bad teams.

    Next year the schedule improves and winning 10 will be a much greater accomplishment.

    As to the best players... Riley is a gamer, no question. But, not a polished top flight QB. After watching Luck, Weeden and a bunch of other QBs, it's clear what Riley (and Jake) were missing. Again, glad Riley was around, but we can't expect much from him against top 20 programs.

    I'll be happy with 8 wins and pleased with any win against the better teams.

  • gdog3finally West Jordan, Utah
    Jan. 3, 2012 2:46 a.m.

    BYU is a respectable program. They do a lot right as far as I can see, but winning 10 games with their schedule is not all that impressive. If you drop Idaho, Idaho State, New Mexico State, and San Jose State, what do you have? What is BYU's signature win?