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Comments about ‘LDS Christianity: Differences that matter’

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Published: Sunday, Nov. 27 2011 11:39 p.m. MST

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OnlytheCross
Bakersfield, CA

I feel your pain, but you cannot always be explicit, staypuffinpc, due to frequent disapproved posts here. That's why this article was refreshing in its openness with altered texts, revisions, new revelations and priesthood, and the true doctrines with which I grew up in the 50's-'80's.

The one subject which was not covered, however, are the reversals on doctrines and practices. That is why many are leary of the Mitt camp. Will there be a new revelation that Pres. Romney will be bound to, which may be anathema to Biblical Christians? That may not give LDS pause, but I guarantee it does to non-LDS. While a papal encyclical might only affect the worship of a Catholic leader, Mormons can have changes with string social implications: Blacks barred from priesthood positions, plural marriage reinstated, new social orders, etc. Anyone who has studied early Mormonism knows the possibities.

These are questions that should be asked of the current prophet. Why Dr. Millet fields these seminars is interesting. If true understanding and clarification is the goal, send the man who hears from God to share His message. If a Mormon wins the nomination, that will be Q&A number 1.

raybies
Layton, UT

Those who promote the claim that LDS are not Christian share an agenda that is decidely unChristian.

Mayfair
City, Ut

I am always puzzled in these types of articles that someone always says Mormons do (or don't) believe in or worship "the Jesus I do" or "the same Jesus as evangelical Christians or Protestant Christians".

Clearly, there is only one Jesus.

What is different is the beliefs about him, or the worship of him. I've yet to read or hear this stated correctly.

ShaunMcC
La Verkin, UT

At the end of an extended doctrinal discussion with a good friend who is a pastor, I understood what defined for evangelicals what a "Christian" was. It was a much narrower definition than I had ever considered. It was (among other things) limited to people who had voluntarily given control of their lives and decisions to Christ and trusting Him completely to guide. I asked him what percentage of his congregation would qualify under his definition. He said "about 15 to 20 percent". He also stated that he wasn't sure if Mormon's were Christians, but "I think you probably are." I have always appreciated his candor and openness. What percent of your local ward do you think are Christians under this definition? The answer may surprise.

FDRfan
safety dictates, ID

I dont need to look beyond my own family to see great diversity in Christian beliefs. I have 2 siblings that believe baptism is not necessary for salvation but is a worthy gesture to make public if one so chooses. Another sibling believes that baptism by immersion is necessary but not the laying on of hands to receive the Holy Ghost. All accept that we must believe that Jesus is our Savior and that we must change from any sinful practices. I believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Surprising to me, is the confidence that we each have in our positions. Scientists now debating the speed of light vs. the speed of a neutrino dont seem to be that confident about the answer. And yet the answer probably wont affect our eternal salvation.

tyndale1
Pullman, WA

I think a good way to understand LDS views of scripture is to consider scripture as writings and communications of individuals who knew their creator, who knew of the coming of the Messiah in the person of Jesus of Nazareth, and who were moved upon by the Holy Ghost to write what they did for the benefit of those who would come after. These writings help us today to better understand He whom we worship, who is Jesus Christ, and to help us come to KNOW Him.

Moses obviously wasn't the first to know of, or to write of, the creation, of the tower of Babel, of the flood, or of the great patriarchs Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, or of the blessings to Judah and Joseph and to their brothers. He did not ever even meet these great individuals. Other prophets both preceded as well as followed Moses in being moved upon by the Holy Ghost to write of their KNOWLEDGE of God. We wish we had all of their writings, all of their speeches, all of their understanding, but we don't. What we do have is marvelous, but no existing book contains even a hundredth part.

tyndale1
Pullman, WA

Saint John noted, that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written if we had all the words and teachings of even the Savior, Jesus Christ, let alone His Prophets. Not all of Pauls significant letters to the saints who lived in the various Churches have been located, but we love what we do have of them. The Dead Sea scrolls give us hope that more of these records may one day be uncovered. So when the LDS talk of having access to ancient inspired records kept by holy men of God who migrated anciently to the Americas, and that those records are now available in our language, and every man and woman can access them, and can read them and can ponder their words, it is worth our personal discovery.

The fact is, the prophets wrote individually what they KNEW of Jesus Christ, but they were not the ones engaged in compiling their writings into the Bible. That was done later by others who loved God, but not by prophets. So if additional histories and inspired teachings of these ancients come to light, we cannot disregard them without investigating them.

Wyclif
OREM, UT

Paul taught that All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, yet we do not even have access today to what Paul had in his day. How did he know all those things about the great High Priest Melchizedek? How about the other records referenced in the Bible compilation that are now lost to us? These include the Books of Enoch, Jasher, Nathan, Shemaiah, Abijah, Iddo and others. Or where are scriptural record that fortold that Christ would be born a Nazerene as Matthew noted? I would love to have all the inspired words of prophets of God, but I do not. But what I do have, I value highly.

Unless every preserved scriptural record is used, our understanding of Deity can be skewed. That is why Mormons use the writings of Book of Mormon prophets to clarify Biblical truths. These are not books that war against each other. These accumulated records of fallen nations and inspired prophets help us better know He whom we worship, which is life eternal. They totally compliment and enforce each other, and bring us to Christ.

donn
layton, UT

Bill in Nebraska : Jesus was not saying he was God?

God said to Moses, I AM WHO I AM(Exodus 3:14 Greek Septuagint).
The Jews understood, Jesus made himself equal to God.

Jesus answered, before Abraham was born,I Am! At this, they picked up stones to stone him,(John 8:58-59 NIV)

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.(John 1:1) The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us..(1:4). God becomes man not man becomes God. See(Mosiah 7:27)

And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.( 1 John 5:20 NIV)

@Bill When the Lord comes again the wicked shall be destroyed, true.
I am the Alpha and the Omega, says the Lord God, who Is(The Being), and who Was, and who is to come, the ALMIGHTY( G. 3841* ). (Rev 1:8)*Used of God only. Jesus has always been God.

(Jesus)ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I(ego) AM(eimi)(John 8:24)

@Charles
the greater outdoors, UT

@onlythecross and donn:

Why have neither of you answered the questions of serenity at the top of this page?

What does it mean to be resurrected?
Was Jesus resurrected? If so, why?

Does Jesus still have His resurrected body? If not, where did it go and why was he resurrected in the first place?

Are you and I going to be resurrected? If so, why do we get to keep our resurrected body forever?

What's the purpose of having a body in the afterlife? Why can't we just exist as spirits forever?

zoar63
Mesa, AZ

How can Christians understand ancient Christianity when the source they use came from manuscripts which can only be dated to the third century A.D.?

JHA0033
BURLESON, TX

My friend Brad and I recently made a documentary about the differences between Biblical Christianity and Mormonism. We thought it would be useful to go and interview Mormons in UT and hear from them about their beliefs instead of relying on experts/theologians opinions.

We hope the documentary reaches both Christians and the LDS with the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

You can view the Documentary "Religion and Redemption" on Youtube for a limited time.

Would love to hear your thoughts!

Central Texan
Buda, TX

Concerning baptism of children at age eight, etc. in case the question has not been answered.

It is never said that children prior to age eight are sinless, just that Christ has said he will cover their sins should they die before the age of accountability.

Often it is difficult to move forward when people are locked into misconceptions. I think that's one of the reasons for the Mormon / Evangelical dialog in the first place.

IDShore
REXBURG, ID

Although not perfect, an in-depth look into members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter - day Saints finds good fruit (Matthew 7:17, 7:20 and Luke 6:43 - 44).

I am LDS. The LDS people I know and I believe that Jesus Christ is the Savior and Redeemer of mankind, the God of the Old and New Testaments, and the Creator of this world and the universe. We also believe that the only way people can be saved is by coming unto and accepting Jesus Christ, and that He was resurrected and will come again in the Second Coming.

We worship Jesus Christ as the Lord God Almighty Who is omnipotent and omniscient and is the Son of God the Father. Mormons are typically a strong force for traditional family values, work hard and are strong patriots. These beliefs and qualities do not equate to a cult.

coltakashi
Richland, WA

It is especially ironic that Evangelicals are so parsimonious in applying the label "Christian", since many of them have a very minimalist set of requirements to claim salvation through Christ, consisting mainly of declaring Jesus to be one's Savior, even without baptism or any change in life patterns. Other Evangelicals regard those who do not reflect a change of heart as having not actually been touched by God's Grace, and criticize it as "cheap grace" which does not save. A Catholic scholar recently visiting BYU was told of one conversation by a BYU professor with an Evangelical minister: "So a saved Christian can commit murder or adultery and still be saved?" "Yes" "What if a saved Christian becomes a Mormon?" "I will have to think about that."

Surely, if the requirements to receive Grace are minimal, any Christian who later joins the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is still a saved Christian. By the same token, the embrace of Christ by Mormons in their worship, Bible study and prayer surely meets those minimal requirements for salvation. After all, Evangelicals do not question your theological understanding before they accept you as saved.

OnlytheCross
Bakersfield, CA

If open dialogue were allowed here, all questions would be answered, Outdoor Charles. But it's like trying to smuggle Bibles into China. The truth will set you free, not an opinion.

No one answered my question back on p.3 about what Jesus told Peter to "feed My sheep". That answer is THE reason why it matters what you believe. I don't care what Millet or Mouw agree on. The Bible is God's Word, and we are mandated to beware of and expose false teachers and teachings: Jude, 2Peter, Galations 1, Romans 10. We can all join hands at food banks, but man isn't saved by bread. Nor does giving bread to the needy get you a key to the Biblical Kingdom of God. D&C 132 is another gospel.

Dr. Millet says he agrees that LDS are not Biblical Christians. He was honest about it and can explain why he disagrees with the doctrine of a Triune God. That doesn't change that Jesus said, "I and the Father are one." Neither can you dismiss your prophet's speech at King Folette's funeral, which changed the essence and characteristics of God.

Seek and you will find Him. I did.

Vanka
Provo, UT

I don't see where anyone answered my questions.

Millet's statement is clearly a misrepresentation of LDS doctrine/belief. LDS doctrines of "salvation" are complex (and in my opinion, internally inconsistent). As such, comparing LDS beliefs about "salvation" with Evangelical Christian beliefs about salvation is misleading. We can only suppose a former Dean of Religious Education understand this fact and, therefore, he must have done it deliberately.

Deliberate misrepresentation? That is not a good thing to do.

paperboy111
Lindon, UT

It's interesting to think how much Mormon Doctrine has changed in just the last 40 years or so. When I was a boy I distinctly recall hearing many church leaders, including many General Authorities, proclaim the Book of Mormon (quoting the Prophet Joseph Smith) was "the most correct of any book on earth" and was widely considered by members as superior to the Bible. Also, it was a widely held belief among the broad membership of the church that our primarily objective on earth was to pursue a path in life that would allow us to become like God, our Heavenly Father. When the LDS Church stopped being a sleepy little group in Utah, these type of beliefs become a bit more controversial.

lds4gaymarriage
Salt Lake City, UT

OnlytheCross
The Bible is God's Word, and we are mandated to beware of and expose false teachers and teachings: Jude, 2Peter, Galations 1, Romans 10.

LDS4
I agree 100%. The biggest false teachings come from the Creeds trying to explain the nature of God and Jesus. These Creeds are filled with pagan/Greek philosophy and attempt to fit the square peg of the Bible into the round hole of Greek philosophy. They are incomprehensible.

One clear example is how Christ is described as being eternally begotten and the Holy Ghost is said to eternally proceed from the Father. Google those terms and look for Christian discussion boards and follow discussions on this. Five people end up expressing eight different opinions. 1 Tim. 1:7 describes such perfectly Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm. I lurked and followed one such conversation where they tried to differentiate between eternally begotten and eternally proceed. It was amazing.

The Creeds describe another Jesus and another Gospel when compared to the plain truths of the Bible.

When creedal Christians doubt whether LDS are Christian, I think of the above and laugh.

The Vanka
Provo, UT

LDS4,

Perhaps you should cease snickering.

You wrote: "The biggest false teachings come from the Creeds trying to explain the nature of God and Jesus. These Creeds are filled with pagan/Greek philosophy and attempt to fit the square peg of the Bible into the round hole of Greek philosophy. They are incomprehensible."

This is a common misrepresentation by LDS apologists. It is not true.

The truth is the Creeds were articulations of beliefs extant at the time, and that had been extant since Jesus walked the earth. The Creeds were articulated in a number of different languages and cultures for hundreds of years, and those languages and cultures embodied certain worldviews that were extant in what we now call "Greek philosophy" and "paganism".

But that is no different than the truth that Joseph Smith's "restoration" and "translation" of the Book of Mormon into King James English means his "gospel" is unavoidably infused with the philosophies and language of his day and the legacy of the King James translators.

In short, we are equally justified to fault Joseph Smith's translations and writings for being "false" and corrupted with 19th century and King James philosophy as we are to fault the Creeds for being "false" and corrupted with "Greek philosophy".

The Greek philosophy corruption myth is a popular one among LDS apologists, but it is not an accurate representation of history, philosophy, reality, or religion.

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