Comments about ‘BYU football: Cougars invited to join Big East, but have not accepted invitation — yet’

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Published: Tuesday, Nov. 15 2011 7:50 p.m. MST

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giantfan
Farmington, UT

afro14,

You should scroll back a few pages here on the comments and you'll find a comparsion list of what would be the suggested Big East Western Divsion and the current Pac-12 South Division, and how they stack up against each other according to Sagarin. It takes into account wins/losses, strength of schedule (SOS) and margin of victory (MOV) so no matter how bad a respective school's schedule or conference might be, it's all factored in.

Well, I'll do you a favor and copy/paste it here for you. You're welcome.

BE Boise 7
PAC USC 17
BE Houston 27
PAC ASU 28
PAC Utah 34
BE BYU 53
BE SMU 57
PAC UCLA 61
BE Air Force 68
BE Louisville 71
PAC Arizona 80
PAC Colorado 111

Big East - West (listed above) avg: 47.16
Pac-12 South (listed above) avg. 55.17

Thanks Uteanonymous and atl134! Good Work!!

giantfan
Farmington, UT

Thanks, TheSportsAuthority. Beat me to it!

Uteology
Fort Worth, Texas

Congrats to BYU. But Big Least 1.11 is worse than the Big East today.

@TheSportsAuthority

Pointless analysis since the proposed Big East West teams did not play each other this year but the PAC-12 South teams did. So the win/loss records would be different if they did play each other. Hence the rankings would be different.

PAC-12 south is weak, brought down by Colorado. ACC Atlantic average Sagarin ranking is worse at 56.7.

truthserum
LEHI, UT

Does anyone actually think a season in the Big East is tougher than a season in the Pac 12?

giantfan
Farmington, UT

Re: Uteology

Pointless analysis? It's actually a very fair analysis. Sagarin rankings are independent of what conference a team plays in and do not just consider win/loss record. That's why if you browse the rankings, you'll see that some teams with a pretty decent win/loss record will be a lot further down the list than other teams with the exact same record because it takes into account strength of schedule played.

And how can you downplay Sagarin rankings as a fair way to compare a possible Big East Western Divsion to the Pac-12 South but then go ahead and compare the ACC Atlantic Division to the Pac-12 South?

Ultimate Ute Fan
LEHI, UT

This is the most juvenile thread I've ever read. Neighbors bashing neighbors, people taking the insults and jabs personally. So ridiculous.

giantfan
Farmington, UT

Re: truthserum said,

"Does anyone actually think a season in the Big East is tougher than a season in the Pac 12?"

Do you mean Utah's season in the Pac 12? Or say USC's or Washington's season in the Pac-12? Utah was fortunate to not have to play the top-2 teams in the Pac-12 this year. In fact, if we look at the Sagarin rankings of every Pac-12 team Utah has or will have faced this year we see this:

USC 17
Washington 35
Arizona State 28
Cal 41
Oregon State 99
Arizona 80
UCLA 61
Washington State 77
Colorado 111

Avg = 61.00

And then you have a potential Big East West Division:

Boise 7
Houston 27
BYU 53
SMU 57
Air Force 68
Louisville 71

Avg = 47.17

Looks like Utah won the lottery this year but unfortunately could not take advantage of it. Yeah, they might still have an OUTSIDE shot of making it to the Championship Game but that's more a testament of USC being on probation and the rest of the division being soooo bad then anything Utah has done.

Uteology
Fort Worth, Texas

giantfan | 10:03 a.m. Nov. 17, 2011

Um, simple. PAC-12 South and ACC Atlantic teams have played division members so the rankings are accurate. Big East West is a hypothetical division whose win/loss records are skewed since they haven't played each other.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

@giantfan [3:39 p.m]:

"'Actually, the cougars would not have considered this move with Boise State. Period. Because without BSU, the cougars don't get an invite.'...You're always harping about proof. Do you mind citing some proof for the above statement?"

Funny you should ask. Because I already HAD done so on previous articles. So pay attention this time:

If you Google "ESPN Big East courting BYU, coach says", you will find an article by Andrea Adelson [c. 11-07-2011] that states [emphasis mine]:

"Boise State has expressed an interest in joining as a football-only member, BUT ONLY IF there is a West Division in order to help ease travel."

So there you have it. BSU will join ONLY IF there's a West Division.

The article also stated:

"Big East commissioner John Marinatto was given the go-ahead last week to invite teams into the conference. Boise State, Air Force, SMU, Houston, UCF and Navy all have been mentioned as candidates."

No mention of the Y.

At least not until after Boise State pulled a few strings.

Case closed.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

@giantfan [3:02 p.m.]:

"How's that for revisionist history? Utah was able to 'bust open' the BCS in 2004 because of what other programs did between 1996 and 2003. I'm talking about what BYU did in 1996 and 2001, and also what TCU, Tulane and Marshall did during that same timeframe. If the same rules existed in the BCS in 2001 that existed in 2004 that enabled Utah to go to the Fiesta Bowl, then BYU would not have been told it would not be invited to a BCS game while it was still undefeated and before their season was even over."

Haha! You're quite the "revisionist historian" yourself. In 2001, the rules to BCS access for non-AQs were quite clear: One MUST be ranked in the Top-12 to be CONSIDERED; ranked in the Top-6 to be GUARANTEED!

The reason why the Y was eliminated from BCS bowl contention prior to the end of the season was quite simple: There would have been no way for them to finish in the Top-6 for that "guaranteed" slot, and there were BCS teams who were ranked higher who get the at-large.

truthserum
LEHI, UT

@Giant Fan:
Yeah, they were definitely lucky to not have to play Oregon and Stanford. But across the board there is no comparison. I think even Kirk Herbstreit and Lee Corso would agree with that. Either way, I would rather have BYU's future schedule with access to the BCS than Utah's, but it is fun watching them play the Pac 12 teams. I mean, Louisville, AFA, SMU, Houston? This is great news for BYU. Good for them. Hopefully they find a way to beat Boise and get to a BCS game.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

@giantfan [3:02 p.m.]:

cont....

On Dec. 3, 2001, when the cougars were eliminated from BCS contention...

(1) They had 1 game remaining on their schedule. Unranked Hawai'i (8-3).
(2) They were ranked #12 in the BCS standings.
(3) The following teams' seasons were already over: #1 Miami, #3 Nebraska, #4 Colorado, #5 Oregon, #6 Florida, #7 Texas, #8 Illinois, #9 Stanford, #10 Maryland, and #11 Oklahoma.
(4) Including the Nat'l Championship [which was the Rose Bowl that year], there were only 4 BCS bowls.
(5) Automatic bids were given to the BCS conference champions: Miami (NC), Colorado {Fiesta), Oregon (Fiesta), Illinois (Sugar), Maryland (Orange), and LSU (Sugar). This left room for only 2 at-large schools.
(6) With 2 at-large bids, and 6 BCS schools ranked ahead of them whose seasons had already ended, there would have been no way the cougars could have moved up by beating an unranked 8-3 Hawai'i team.
(7) The cougars lost their final game, plus their bowl game. Proving they were not BCS worthy in the first place.

And THAT's a FACT!

WON84
PLANO, TX

I hope Naval Vet / mgr wasn't in possession of any sharp objects when she read the following - "BYU has been invited to join the Big East as a football-only member, but, for now, BYU has not accepted the invitation, according to a Washington, D.C. columnist."

cougar76
Raleigh, NC

Naval lint needs to get a life. You spend way too much time researching ways to put down BYU and its fans.

Jake2010
bountiful, ut

How with no teams of any merit would the MWCCUSA garnish the AQ bid from the Big East? I mean seriously folks! With the proposed realignment all of both current conference cream of the crop would be boarding ship in the Big East... Leaving the MWC and CUSA a much larger WAC of the future. 20 teams without a pinch of fight in any of them. Seriously, it is funny to watch all ya'll talk such insolence. Accept the invite while the invite is on the table. Don't make them wait forever... There is nothing better on the horizon unless something like the SEC is knocking, but, we all know with all the anti-LDS nonsense in the bible belt that would never in a million years happen.

WON84
PLANO, TX

"The article also stated: "Big East commissioner John Marinatto was given the go-ahead last week to invite teams into the conference. Boise State, Air Force, SMU, Houston, UCF and Navy all have been mentioned as candidates."

No mention of the Y.

At least not until after Boise State pulled a few strings.

Case closed."

LOL, there was probably no mention of BYU because the league probably thought there wasn't a chance they'd join when most of the conversation to this point centered around BYU as a lead candidate to join a league currently taking members from the Big East. That's a lot to put together. I know.

NightOwlAmerica
SALEM, OR

What are DuckHunter and the impostor Christy B thinking?
Just what is an invite? It like going out of your way to invite someone over for dinner. Only the person you invite gives you a list of demands and requests before attending. BYU is no different. If you are invited don't lay out a list of demands. No wonder power conferences have ignored them while building their WAC legacy.

Duckhunter
Highland, UT

@naval lint

Well as usual you ignore reported facts in order to push a false premise.

In Jay Drew's article, which broke this story and which I know you read, it stated that Big East officials, as well as officials from existing Big East schools have been visiting BYU FOR MONTHS. Well let's quote it shall we.

" Several Big East leaders and some presidents of current/remaining football-playing Big East schools Louisville, Cincinnati, Rutgers, Connecticut and South Florida have visited BYU within the past few months and were reportedly impressed not only with BYUs football facilities, but its new television broadcasting building, which houses BYUtv, a national network available in more than 60 million homes."

In otherwords you keep quoting an article from November 11th, and we all know Boise only even got permission from its regents about a month ago, to negotiate with the Big East. BYU on the otherhand has been hosting Big East representatives, and representatives from exisitng Big East schools FOR MONTHS.

You really are desperate over this and it is hilarious. It is funny that you will make up obvious and easily discredited falsehoods to try make a false point.

LOL!

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

Counter Intelligence:

"You didnt mention that the Y reportedly did not accept Big East overtures 6 months ago - which predates everything you just said....mind closed"

That's because the Big East did NOT approach the Y 6-months ago. That DeepShadesofBlue story that suggested otherwise was a myth that was debunked by Tom Holmoe HIMSELF!

So again...case closed!

Duckhunter
Highland, UT

@nightowl

According to Webster's an invite is:

1.a. to offer an incentive or inducement: Entice
b. to increase the likelihood of
2.a. to request the presence or participation of
b. to request formally
c. to urge politely

Nowhere in any of those defintions does it say "to accept what is offered with no questions and no negotiations".

So far the BIG EAST has "offer(ed) BYU incentives and inducements" in an effort to "increase the likelihood of", "the presence or participation of" BYU, while "urging politely" that BYU do so. In otherwords they visted BYU for months (LOL at naval lint over that one) to find out what BYU would require to accept an invitation, they have now extended that invitation based on the definitions I posted above, and are now waiting, and willing to wait several months according to reports, for BYU to decide whether or not to accept the "invitation".

Apparently you, and of course the other utah "fans" trolling this article and agonizing over this development, are the only ones that have any issue with this at all. Everyone else is perfectly fine with the "example" BYU has set here.

LOL!

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