Comments about ‘My view: Class warfare is Anti-American: Time to preserve American Dream’

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Published: Sunday, Nov. 13 2011 12:00 a.m. MST

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LDS Liberal
Farmington, UT

Mia Love conviently forgets that "the content of their character" is precisely what Occupy WallStreet is fighting against.

Charlatains, Cheats, and Robbers are what is being protested against -
you know, the Law of the Harvest --
not Fred or Bob who worked 12 hour days for 30 years to finally make it big or an honest business providing an honest product.

I call it Character Warfare.

When an 80 year old woman can got to jail for a parking violation,
but a corrput CEO can bilk $Billions from investors and the Government and never even be charged with a crime...I have to wonder if the same rules apply.

Equal and Justice for all?

If the 1% don't see it that way -- the need to prove it.

Salt Lake City, UT

Nice try Mia. You have spilled forward all the right wing wacko talking points. These folks are not asking for equal results they just want a fair chance. Furthermore, your class warfare complaint goes both ways. It is entirely possible that class warfare can be fought from the top down rather than from the bottom up. I am very happy that you and your family have done so well in this country. Why do you begrudge others the same fair shot?

Miami Area, Fl

Every discussion turns into it is wrong to "take from the rich and give to the poor"

Sounds great, and most people would agree.

We have all heard that "it takes money to make money". Anyone disagree with that general premise?

Isn't is just possible that the playing field now so favors those with money that over time, the money has collected at the top?

Is this trend good for the country?
Why do you think it is happening?
Do you think it will continue?
If it continues, what will ultimately happen?

Until you answer these 4 questions for yourself, it is pointless to speculate on what, if anything should be done.

Baron Scarpia
Logan, UT

"The answer to our current economic problems lies in preserving the economic engine that made America what it is today."

This is what the OWS is fighting for.

Today, we have massive oligopolies from banking to energy to medical insurance that lock out competition to keep their control of the market and exploit consumers who are "trapped" by the few players in those industries. In short, the free market and economic innovation has been choked out by the consolidation of these mature industries. Because these profitable oligopolies dominate their industries, there's no need to pursue innovation -- think about it: We're still using the same energy technologies from the 19th and 20th centuries! Imagine if competition drove innovation in energy; we wouldn't be suffering with $3.50 per gallon gasoline!

These same powerful oligopolies live by a philosophy of "profits above all" where business interests lie above citizen/national interests. So job outsourcing, polluting, lobbying to eliminate tax obligations and regulations, etc., are key profit objectives to serve stockholders at the expense of broader citizens.

OWS is not fighting for socialism -- this is a Fox News spin! Rather, they're fighting for citizen freedom from corporate domination and exploitation.

liberal larry
salt lake City, utah

Despite Mia Love's perceptions, the United States ranks lower than most developed European democracies, in economic mobility, We rank very high in the correlation between paternal income, and how much their offsprings earn. By the measures I've found, countries with progressive tax structures, and government legislated health care seem to have MORE opportunity than we do.

Irony Guy
Bountiful, Utah

As an OWS supporter, I protest (!). The writer insists on mischaracterizing us as demanding "equal results." That's not so. What we are demanding is that the Wall Street powers who continually plunder our economy be held accountable for their actions. These pirates repeatedly put the rest of us at huge risk so they can reap huge returns, but they themselves don't actually risk anything!

Salt Lake City, UT

Protesting crony-capitalism and robber-baron behavior on Wall Street does not mean you are a socialist.

It means you've been paying attention.

one old man
Ogden, UT

LDS Lib, you did it again. Kudos.

Roland Kayser
Cottonwood Heights, UT

For many decades the distribution of income held fairly steady with about 2/3 going to labor and 1/3 going to capital. Over the past three decades that has shifted to 55% labor, 45% capital. This means that everyone who works for a living has a much smaller share of the pie to split among themselves, while the tiny minority of people who own everything have far more.

This has not happened because the wealthiest Americans started working harder. It has happened because they used their wealth to influence the government to adopt policies favorable to their interests.

When I talk about economic justice, I'm thinking Eisenhower, not Lenin, Stalin, or Mao.

p.s. Martin Luther King was a socialist.

West Jordan, UT

Excellent commentary. People seem to think they'll get better opportunities by getting more handouts from government. It's simply not true. Better opportunities come when we make it easier for regular people to start a business, borrow money, compete in the marketplace, etc. We do that by limiting government, not by expanding it. Mia Love gets it.

Bountiful, UT

Lofty words by Mia Love, but they don't measure up to our current national challenge. By what mechanism(s) do we restore the American Dream?

It is conservatives who cry "class warfare" at the suggestion that the small group that has done fantastically well the past 10 years be asked to shoulder more of the common burden. Really, isn't this poisoning the well?

In our nation, progress has appeared at acute stress points in our history. Example: labor laws that "punish" employers by mandating higher pay after 40 hours in a week. (Family values Utahns should relate to this example of the majority extracting concessions from the minority. Just sort of makes sense, doesn't it?)

Nobody seriously believes we're on the road to Soviet communism. Let's be real, leave all the tired talking points behind for a moment.

The Des News noted that *Canada* has passed the US in terms of economic freedom, according to two indices, including the conservative Heritage Foundation. How? Their tax structure is similar to the US, except tax rates on higher earners and the wealthy are significantly higher. Wealthy Canadians don't scream "class warfare".

West Jordan, UT

Well spoken, Ms. Love.

Happy Valley, UT

Mia Love's view suffers from the same two-dimensional thinking that plagues most politicized speech today. She sees capitalism and socialism as the only two possibilities. Of course capitalism is right and socialism is wrong. In reality, what she is defending is a system in which people do work hard but are not compensated fairly for their labors. The corporate owners and executives are taking more and more of the wealth while shipping jobs off to Third World countries and hiring fewer Americans.

Meanwhile, technological advances enable the remaining American workers to be more productive (produce more product in a given amount of time). This enables businesses to get by with fewer workers. The problem with this system is that consumers have less disposable income to buy all those glorious corporate products with. Wonder what the source of our accumulating debt really is? It comes from government having to prop up underpaid consumers and struggling corporations.

The solution, of course, isn't Socialism (whatever that means). The solution is to get capitalism to become what it was intended to become--a system in which wealth is balanced because consumers and producers have roughly equal power in the marketplace.


Mia Love doesn't get it.

one old man
Ogden, UT

Casual Bystander -- perhaps if you stop standing casually by and got out to actively start looking and examining and seeking the truth, you would be singing a tune differently. Instead, your casual listening to hate radio has simply left you parroting thoughtless comments.

Don't just stand by. Get out and do. At least seek the truth.

Springville, UT

So, it's OK to have class warfare if conducted by the mega-wealthy and powerful, but if the poor (or even the middle class), and those without power and influence, want to sit at the table, then it's a bad thing? I see....

Saratoga Springs, UT

Thank you, Mia, for having the courage to speak honestly about class warfare in America!

The way to truly help the disadvantaged in this country is by helping them understand the opportunities that we still have to make our own way. Freedom does NOT mean giving power to the government to provide jobs, education, health care, housing and food for whoever demands it. In fact, the more a government tries to redistribute the people's income, the more it takes from everyone's freedom and opportunities. I know many small business owners who would like to grow their businesses and hire more people, but their taxes are too high.

Why should we trust in bigger government to create more "solutions" when this will only encourage more crony capitalism? The temptation to play favorites with the people's money has already proven to irresistible to our politicians.

Pendleton, OR

What makes an 8-10 hour day working in a bank worth more than the same time working in groceries; at any level? What motive could be cited for "earning" more than one needs for expenses and reasonable savings for when unable to continue earning? The answers given will illuminate how individuals think and the degree of self-interest in the responders.

Productivity used to be a major determinant of wage or salary, but recently the process has begun to shift to rewarding questionable ethics. If I can successfully perform some economic task, whether by fair means or foul, I will have "earned" a larger salary. And I can let my ego overcome any bad feeling I might have regarding the means. Implicit in this is the tendency to think short-term because the short-term results drive any boost in income/ego.

That trend is the real problem and is what needs our focus in any attempted change. If government has any role, it is limited to defining the field. The larger role in society is to educate our children, and discuss with our neighbors, that fairness does matter. Let's stamp out "taking advantage" in our dealings.

Orem, UT

So let me get this straight, the OWS crowd does not want to punish all rich people equally. They want to only punish those who have somehow earned their wealth through what they perceive as immoral behavior.

They don't want to take money from the hard working guy who works long hours and builds a successful business and now finds himself in the top 1%. They only want confiscatory taxes imposed on bankers and hedge fund managers. Did I get that right?

Because that is news to me. I have heard nothing of the sort in any of the protest movements, only from comments on this blog. Everything I have heard is how EVERYONE in the 1% (except of course Michael Moore, Barak Obama, and most of the Hollywood crowd) is evil and deserves to have even more taxes heaped upon them.

Salt Lake City, UT

Americans are not demanding we "throw out" the capitalistic system. We are just opposed to the excesses and recklessness which were major contributors to the recession that has left over 9% unemployed. We have not had laissez-faire capitalism since the establishment of Interstate Commerce Commission in 1887. More agencies came later and with oversight and reasonable regulation there was a tremendous growth of the middle class in the 20th Century. But since deregulation began in the 1980's the top 1% have double their wealth, the middle class has been shrinking and has only made modest gains and the percentage in poverty has increased.

There needs to be "shared sacrifice" in bad times, but the super rich are not being asked to share any burden or take any responsibility for their speculative excess.

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