Columnist contrasts Elder Russell M. Nelson and Rev. Robert Jeffress


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  • Al Miller Houston, TX
    Nov. 30, 2011 12:07 p.m.

    Swords sometimes swing two ways. While many of us believe that the good pastor is wrong about Mormons he really isn't wrong about voters, candidates and others discussing ideology and a candidate's fidelity to ideological principles he is identified with. Our key test is whether the ideology respects the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. There are ideologies in the world today that give our sacred founding documents no standing under God and we must always feel free to point that out and demand a reconciation from the candidate.

  • Bill in Nebraska Maryville, MO
    Oct. 17, 2011 9:45 p.m.

    To Freedom Always Rings True: For one what Joseph Smith cited came from the Lord Jesus Christ not by man himself. What Jeffress said came strickly as an opinion of the man and the religion.

    I wonder what you would do if Christ stood before you and cited the same thing to you as this: "This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men." Would you feel the same or would you act as Joseph Smith acted.

  • Freedom Always Rings True OREM, UT
    Oct. 17, 2011 10:36 a.m.

    "Where did they find this guy?" Catholic League president Bill Donohue asks. "When theological differences are demonized by the faithful of any religion never mind by a clergyman it makes a mockery of their own religion. Rev. Jeffress is a poster boy for hatred, not Christianity."

    The same can be said about Joseph Smith then. Let me quote him for you Donohue:

    "I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that ALL their creeds were an ABOMINATION in his sight; that those professors were ALL CORRUPT; that: they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof."

    Referring to another church as a cult makes Jeffress a poster boy for hatred and not Christianity but referring to all religions including Catholics as an abomination, calling their professors (including Donohue) corrupt and saying he has a form of Godliness but denies the power thereof isn't?

    Please explain to me why Jeffress was uncivil and hateful while Joseph Smith wasn't.

  • Resistance Lehi, UT
    Oct. 17, 2011 1:04 a.m.

    This is a RE to the repeated assertion by DN evangelicals that LDS aren't Christian becuase they accept Deification.

    From FAIR article:

    The Christian Doctrine of Deification

    Edward T. Jones

    Irenaeus: "We are not made gods from the first, but first men, then gods Polycarp, himself a disciple of the apostle St. John... this they regard as a point beyond dispute, as one of those fundamentals which no one who calls himself a Christian dreams of denying.

    From early Church Fathers man is a creature who has received a command to become God. Basil: Man received order to become God.
    Crawford Knox "virtually all the early Church Fathers taught deification. French Jesuit Rondet wrote [deification] is found in all the Fathers, was the universal teaching of the Catholic Church and her Fathers. most central theological theme of the patristic tradition fundamental axioms for the early Church Fathers.Joyce the Fathers of the Church from the earliest times with one consent take the apostles words [of II Peter 1.4: participate in the divine nature] in their literal sense. There is no question of any figurative interpretation. They do not hesitate to speak of the deification of men.

  • Munk Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 16, 2011 4:41 p.m.

    Good and honest people, who set good examples but still show they are human are those that withstand the test of time. Those that spout hateful rhetoric will be forgotten.

  • JP71 Ogden, UT
    Oct. 16, 2011 7:40 a.m.

    The far/extreme right is becoming more and more extreme. Extreme right ideology does not match-up with Mormon doctrine. Mormons needed to be weary of slipping into the extreme right and the thinking that this is in line with their beliefs. The LDS Churchs recent statement on immigration is a good example of how the Church believes in a Christ like approach to politics. Mormons be weary of the far right, they are not your friends. They just want your vote.

  • amst plano, tx
    Oct. 15, 2011 11:01 p.m.

    Fools make feasts and wise men eat them. I think that's how the old saying went if not correct me.

  • Bill in Nebraska Maryville, MO
    Oct. 15, 2011 10:45 p.m.

    To those who don't feel that Joseph and Brigham wouldn't recognize the Church today. You are wrong! Not only do the recognize it but they would jump for joy and probably have on the other side of the veil. They relish in the knowledge that all of the prophesy that Joseph Smith said about the Church has come to fruitation in more ways than one.

    As some have said before and I will reinterate, the Caravan moves on. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints will continue to grow at a pace that others just can't understand. Those that leave will be replaced by two or three who will be as steadfast as those who crossed the plains into the Salt Lake Valley. The time will come in many parts of this country will the doors to the chapels will be open twenty-four hours as they enter the waters of baptism.

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Oct. 15, 2011 9:59 p.m.

    The good reverend hit on a small piece of a much larger chord. Mormonism is a cult. So is whatever religion he's selling. It's all cultish. The pot got caught calling the kettle black. but they're both the same in the end. Religion is the ultimate untouchable scam. My hope is that someday we get it out of politics.

  • Transaction7 Commerce, Texas
    Oct. 15, 2011 8:13 p.m.

    Where Jeffress went wrong first was in appearing, in his capacity as Pastor of First Baptist Church of Dallas, to endorse anyone in a primary election. Jesus, as another candidate had put it in 2008, was neither a Republican nor a Democrat and was smart enough never to run for office in Texas. I dont know how well Pastor Jeffers really knows Rick Perry.

    Pastors must be free to speak out on issues. The churches led the fight to abolish slavery and then to pass the very imperfect but long-overdue Civil Rights Act of 1964 to combat the lingering residue of slavery that was contrary to my belief in, among other things, free enterprise.

    The Constitution, which, though not inspired in the sense of scripture and imperfect, I believe to have been a gift from God to this historically exceptionally blessed nation, prohibits religious tests for office and grants full religious liberty to all, including the atheists who I think have made a far bigger leap of faith than any believer in God. Thomas Jeffersons deist theology eliminated miracles and was peculiar even in his day, but he made a good President for the United States.

  • ? SLC, UT
    Oct. 15, 2011 4:55 p.m.

    I appreciate these articles coming forward. It's nice to know that though some may not agree with some of the doctrines and principles in the church, there are at least some who are willing to stick up for us.

  • Abe Sarvis Cedar City, UT
    Oct. 15, 2011 12:49 p.m.

    I've never found evidence that any group is "Christian". It seems to me that it's not something you can achieve by joining, you have to do it on your own.

  • joeyjr Bakersfield, CA
    Oct. 15, 2011 12:27 p.m.

    I think it's interesting that there is a comparison between Mormonism and Muslims in this article. That could be another story that should be studied.

  • ulvegaard Medical Lake, Washington
    Oct. 15, 2011 8:57 a.m.

    I have never seen any good come from being critical of anyone. I have yet to meet anyone that is perfect, but when we go out of our way to condemn them before the masses, we often end up being condemned ourselves. Even striking back when offended does little good. Its always best to press forward and live the best way we can and let our actions testify of our true character.

  • ctrwbc WEST PALM BEACH, FL
    Oct. 15, 2011 5:08 a.m.

    When I first heard about Pastor Robert Jeffress on fox news Father Jonathan Morris a fox new contributor said that voters should consider if Romney Church's doctrine supports the constitution. He also that that the LDS church does not baptize in the name of the Father Son and Holy Spirit.

    I asked a close family friend who is a catholic priest and he said the Holy Ghost is what they used to refer to as the Holy Spirit. What I learned after I did some research is that as I had baptized my 6 children I the words "and of the" in the LDS baptismal prayer represent LDS doctrine that Father and the Son and the Holy Ghost are separate Gods. Also Matthew chapter 14 clarifies the relationship of the Father and the Son. Father Hendrick my friend the catholic priest thought that my church did not believe Jesus Christ is God I told him that Jesus Christ has all Gods Power and is a God. It is because of the Arian Heresy of the 2nd and 3rd Centry which refers to Jesus Christ as being inferior to God. Father Jonathan Morris statement on Fox news is misleading

  • Filo Doughboy Bakersfield, CA
    Oct. 15, 2011 4:54 a.m.

    Joseph, Brigham and the original founders would not recognize modern Mormonism from the one they received, taught and sacrificed to send missionaries out with.

    They spoke plain, owned their uniqueness, didn't care about public opinion or approval and lived what they believed. That was the honesty of my grandparents, too. They would be as shocked as I am to visit the church website and tey to make sense of when everything changed to now trying to be accepted as part of the mainstream.

    They didn't care less about being labeled a cult, a false religion, racist or "adulterous polygamists". Two great-grandpas did their prison time and went right back to their plural families. They lived separately, but their kids knew exactly where their fathers were. Grandma was born in 1899 and answered my questions about racism this way: We are not prejudiced against any soul. But we don't have to explain Heavenly Father's commandments; we just have to obey them. You love everyone and treat them fairly, and you'll be treated in kind.

    Living in all-Mormon Idaho, they saw no persecution. But their example of strength served me well. Oh, the good ole days.

  • DUPDaze Bakersfield, CA
    Oct. 15, 2011 12:52 a.m.

    My pioneer grandparents would croak at the abject ignorance of the modern LDS postings here. Does anyone know their own history, doctrines, founders' quotes in well-documented journals?

    Thankfully I still have my folk's library: full of original source books and documentation, many now out of print. "We don't teach/believe that any more". Oh really? How nice for you not to have to explain to your friends why no black man could hold the same priesthood as your white brothers, uncles, cousins. Why you couldn't date that gorgeous guy in Speech class, because his skin-color proved something about his "curse" that effected his temple worthiness...

    Do the non-religious columnists, the comedian with four days expertise in Mormonism and the Bible-only rejectors quoted in this article know that any new revelations, given by SLC prophets, will nullify any previous doctrines they wish? It just happens, that only those which cause a PR ruckus get rescinded. I'm 6th generation Mormon, Daughters of the Utah Pioneers, so don't rewrite my history.

    Any knowledgable Mormons here who will tell the world how all 1830 creeds were described by their founding prophets?
    Does "corrupt abomination" ring any bells?

  • roberto Moses Lake, WA
    Oct. 14, 2011 11:30 p.m.

    It gets old getting slugged in the gut by those who don't believe as I (we) do. Just as it is old being called a racist because I disagree with the president.
    then when some of us bark back, some of the haters can't wait to shout foul and point it out.

    In the end it doesn't change a thing. The church is still true, and the president is still wrong on most things.

  • JM Lehi, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 6:11 p.m.

    If what Mormons really believe is found anywhere besides the Bible, it is found in the Book of Mormon, here is what the Book of Mormon tells us about Gods Children:
    12 And whatsoever thing persuadeth men to do good is of me; for good cometh of none save it be of me. I am the same that leadeth men to all good;
    16 For behold, the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil; wherefore, I show unto you the way to judge; for every thing which inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ, is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ; wherefore ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of God.

  • JM Lehi, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 6:09 p.m.

    I believe Evangelicals are generally Christians. I try to love everyone.

    Sadly, some people are trained to post anti-Mormon propaganda on the DN and elsewhere, trying to justify. Sometimes they pretend to be offensive LDS etc.

    There are also many anti-Mormon websites claiming to teach us what Mitt Romney and all Mormons "really believe." Several of these quote Orson Pratt on Babylon (editing and leaving out his reference to John). Ive oft discussed the semi-quotes posted by DN anti-Mormons(creeds brought tortures etc)but not the Pratt quote.

    Saying Mitt and Mormons believe something because someone LDS (including O.Pratt, BY etc) said it is as unfair as saying present day Mormons all believe Gentiles are unclean because their early Prophet, Peter believed it (before his vision); that all Protestants "really believe" Catholicism is an "abomination" and "blasphemy," "works" centered, etc because Luther said it; that all Protestants hate Jews and LDS because they raped and sought extermination, etc.

    Many opinions are given, and LDS Presidents have clarified that the Abominable Church is not Catholics and Protestants. The BofM definition is those torturing, attacking, etc the Saints. It could be some Catholics, Atheists, Mormons, gaysetc.

  • PacNW-Hoosier Portland, OR
    Oct. 14, 2011 5:51 p.m.

    In my opinion we're making much ado about little/nothing. Need we revisit Elder McConkie's classic Mormon Doctrine? The original publication spoke of the Catholic Church in very derogatory terms. Since revised, the original opinions are still widely known. His final work, the six volume Messiah series, was equally as divisive in its treatment of those who hold to a triune God. And Elder Holland has politely derided, but derided nonetheless, this same Holy Trinity concept in General Conference within the last few years.
    While I strongly disagree with his opinion, I, for one, find it refreshing to listen to a pastor not afraid identify those whom he believes are misleading/misrepresenting the Savior's message. Too, I salute Elders McConkie, Holland, and others who are willing to take a stand, no matter the feelings of the PC crowd.

  • That Makes Sense Orem, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 5:38 p.m.

    I don't believe any candidate should have to go on record as saying whether or not they think Romney is a christian or if Mormons are members of a cult. I think Romney should come out and ask that people stop asking his running mates this question as a matter of principle. Personally, I don't think an "I like Mormons" test is much better than Jeffress' "Is he an Evangelical Christian?" test for political office.

    Mr. Jeffress' bigotry certainly warrants the current outcry, but the solution is not to force other public figures to weigh in on whether or not they think Mormons are Christians. I would hope that a Cain, Paul, Gingrich, etc. have strong feelings that their religious practices, or non-religious practices, are "right" and have a strong commitment to making sure my feeling "right" about my religion is equally protected. A person with no conviction of anything is far less desirable in my opinion.

    My Evangelical, Catholic, etc. friends are great friends because they believe they are "right" not in spite of it. My anti-Mormon friends who don't believe in anything other than I am "wrong" are harder to get along with.

  • ama Mililani, HI
    Oct. 14, 2011 3:30 p.m.

    None of the GOP candidates actually straightway gave a Definite clear answer as to whether he/she thinks Mormons/Romney are Christians. They all evaded a direct answer. Therefore, they all think that Romney at least is not a Christian. SADLY. I can now remember one of the previous Conferences Subject that says something like, Beware of the person behind the Smiling Face! No matter how often you do good and forgive, you are not one of them.
    Joseph Smith at age 14, ONE YOUNG Boy, being harassed and said all manner of evils against him for saying that he had seen God and Jesus Christ. Who started the FIRE of HATRED right then, a Preacher! Now, over 14 milliom members worldwide, the Fire of Hatred continues to linger. But, you know what, mostly when these BAD Preachers and their BLind Followers, need to ROB a member of the church to stop him/her from being a Shiny Star in Public. We, as members of the Church, MUST continue to Counter these Recycled False accusations intended to deceive those seeking for the truth,and to rob our members of their personal and public accomplishments. Thank you Ruth.

  • ksampow Farr West, Utah
    Oct. 14, 2011 2:06 p.m.

    @als Atheist:
    The "hypocrisy " to which you refer is not so:
    The big difference is when the attack is used outside of religious discussions in a political forum as reason to reject any candidate of different belief than yours. Most LDS (Mormons) would not withhold their votes from a candidate - let alone attack him publicly - because he is an evangelical, in spite of doctrinal differences. In fact, Mormons have frequently supported evangelicals - but many evangelicals are unwilling to extend the same courtesy to LDS candidates.

  • FDRfan safety dictates, ID
    Oct. 14, 2011 1:33 p.m.

    Sarah Nichole,
    "He seems like a decent man who is only trying to do what he feels is right for this country. Fair enough. I don't have to agree with somebody's politics to like them as an individual."

    Sure sounds fair to me. I don't know Senator Reid or Mitt Romney, but then I don't know anybody. I sure would like to see Mitt Romney as President and Senator Reid as MAJORITY leader - and Matheson as Speaker of the House. Then, if we could all be open minded and, like the Channel 5 weatherman used to say, see it my way, I could retire from posting comments.

  • wrz Washugal, Wa
    Oct. 14, 2011 12:54 p.m.


    "Cain now leads GOP pack..."

    Cain nay lead the pack but one of his 999's won't fly... the one about 9 percent sales tax. If the federal government gets into the business of taxing sales it will not stop at 9 percent. It may start there but will continue to climb. It's happened to most if not all federal taxing from FICA to income tax. I hope the American voter figures this out before election day.

    The only way to support a federal sales tax is to do away with and replace the federal income tax.

  • JFFR Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 12:02 p.m.

    Most of my Mormon friends on facebook haven't been very Christian-like when talking about whether or not we're Christian...

  • Sarah Nichole West Jordan, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 11:29 a.m.


    While I don't agree with a single one of Brother Reid's political views, and while I feel that some of his political manuevering may have been less than completely honest (I could say the same for some of Brother Romney's antics in the last election), I've never met him. I've never heard him explain his reasoning behind those decisions. I don't have anything negative to say about him or his character or his membership in the church. He's a son of our Father in Heaven, and my brother, and we'd probably get along very well if we were ever to meet - so long as we kept politics out of the discussion. ;)

    He seems like a decent man who is only trying to do what he feels is right for this country. Fair enough. I don't have to agree with somebody's politics to like them as an individual.

  • CA Granny PETALUMA, CA
    Oct. 14, 2011 11:26 a.m.

    There are always going to be people with attitudes like Mr. Jeffress expressed, but even negative publicity can turn to the Lord's advantage by prompting real seekers of truth to find out answers for themselves. Several years ago, my daughter crossed paths with someone like Rev. Jeffress, who was almost rabid in his criticism of Mormons but of other churches as well. He advised brides in his congregation not to go to a well known LDS seamstress in the area for alterations to their wedding dress and warned one bride that if she did, God would curse her and and she and her husband would never be able to have children. The bride declined to follow his warning and told him so as they stood before him on their wedding day. He then refused to perform the ceremony. She and her groom invited their guests to follow them to another location where a justice of the peace performed the ceremony. Curiosity prompted them to seek out the missionaries, and they liked what they heard and are now LDS.

  • FDRfan safety dictates, ID
    Oct. 14, 2011 10:21 a.m.

    Which is easier - getting Jeffress to say something nice about the Mormons or Utah Republicans to say something nice about Brother Reid?

  • casual observer Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 10:14 a.m.

    als Atheist | 6:22 p.m. Oct. 13, 2011
    Provo, UT
    Freedom of expression also carries the responsibility for your comments. Many people of other religions abhor bigotry and gratuitous insults. The criticism of Jeffress doesn't imply a desire to censor him, only hold him accountable.

  • Owl Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 10:07 a.m.

    Jeffress' comments are a reflection of Perry and his philosophy. They have no civility, tolerance or respect for those who do not share their personal philosophy. It completely negates any claim Perry has to national leadership. Thank you Rev. Jeffress and Mr. Perry for coming out of the closet.

  • mammalou Somewhere in the USA, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 9:41 a.m.

    While my son was is navy bootcamp he was the only LDS member in his "ship". My favorite story he told me was of going to bed. He said "Mom, no one understood what I was doing when I knelt to say my evening prayers, but they respected that it was important to me and gave me reverance and privacy during that minute. I, in return, did not understand their worshipping ways, but knew of the importance it had to them and in return granted them the respect it deserved." Many of his group asked questions, and even teased about how many mothers did he have, but they respectfully understood that in the end, everyone had the same desire, to pray and serve our loving Lord. I suspect many were of the same belongs as Jeffress, let's not judge all by his words. We all need to remember to be tolerant of one another.

  • J-TX Allen, TX
    Oct. 14, 2011 9:26 a.m.

    Just a note: Instead of sitting on the DN boards, commenting on the re-hash of the article, you should follow the link to the actual article and post your comments there....

  • The Rock Federal Way, WA
    Oct. 14, 2011 8:20 a.m.

    @ David King

    It is very important to respond to these outrageous attacks on the church.
    George W. Bush did not respond to the ridiculous charges that he lied about WMD in Iraq. (I doubt that you can name a single elected official at the national level who did not believe that Iraq had WMD before 911.)

    Because GWB did not respond it was assumed that he could not respond so today a majority believe the lie.

    A vigorous defense is what is required. We should do this in a kind and gentle manner. We should act like Christians as we defend our Christianity.
    If we do not defend ourselves against these ridiculous charges most will assume that we cannot defend ourselves against them.

    I have provided such a vigorous defense many times. Usually the offenders come to understand that there is substantial evidence supporting the LDS position and they stop the attacks. Those who continue to attack marginalize themselves and nobody listens to them any more.

    John Wayne said it best; "Stupid should hurt."

  • AllBlack Sydney, NSW
    Oct. 14, 2011 8:15 a.m.

    You left out CNN's Cooper Anderson showing 'mormon.org' on his show, repeating twice the full name of the church ie The Church of Jesus Christ of Latte-Day Saint and telling the pastor that they -mormons- hold Jesus as their saviour and redeemer and that Jesus is the only way to return to our heavenly father, something which seemed to put the pastor of guard a bit....then the pastor went on to declare major religions like Budism and Hinduism to also be 'cults'..

    Seems we don't need to worry to much about this pastor as he is only creating free publicity for the church and directing traffic to mormon.org

  • bandersen Saint George, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 8:08 a.m.

    It's nice to see that some people who have been 'sleeping' for years about both major political parties are beginning to take a little time to think. Political parties are the tip of the iceberg of what is wrong, and why independent minded persons will study the constitution to find answers that have very little to do with either one of these parties. The Democratic parties' abortion blank is an offense to God and anyone who reveres life, and the Republican's warlike view of defense shows the hypocrisy of our 'Christian' nation.

  • Macfarren Dallas, TX
    Oct. 14, 2011 8:05 a.m.

    'Much of what you see in the Catholic Church today doesn't come from God's word. It comes from that cult-like pagan religion. Isn't that the genius of Satan?'"

    That's pretty funny Jeffress. And exactly where does the Baptist Church come from, uh, historically speaking? Wouldn't it be the Catholics? Or didn't you read about the Reformation?

  • JWB Kaysville, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 7:58 a.m.

    Growing up, I lived in a town that was a Christian-cooperative town with a good number and variety of Christian faiths, even the "big" tent evangelicals passing through town. Unfortunately, almost all of those churches participated as Pastor Jeffress did last week and the publicity went to everyone. Our not finished chapel was burned down by an arsonist and no one ever followed up on the person that burned the chapel, even though the type and make of vehicle in the parking lot that the ward organist identified as she was leaving the chapel before the fire was started. Christianity is a broad term to include many beliefs, spiritual, philosophical, activist, and educational, etc. We are blessed in the United States to have freedoms in many forms. We sometimes don't appreciate that fact as we go about our daily lives. God's commandments from the scriptures are important to live, especially that we must love one another as He loves us. Turn the other cheek is also important as we go through this life dealing with people. We also have a government that has a creed and constitution to provide for the common defense, including executive, legislative and judicial.

  • camotim Council Bluffs, IA
    Oct. 14, 2011 7:53 a.m.

    this man strikes me as the proverbial Baptist preacher who bought a second-hand car and found out he didnt have the vocabulary to drive it

  • coleman51 Orem, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 7:41 a.m.

    I couldn't agree more with this article. Well done.

  • Rifleman Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 14, 2011 6:18 a.m.

    Re: als Atheist | 6:22 p.m. Oct. 13, 2011
    "LDS are big proponents of "religious freedom"... except for Reverend Jeffres' religious freedom to declare what his religious beliefs are about Mormons"

    Can you cite any specific examples of LDS members trying to deny Jeffress "religious freedom"? Are you are suggesting the LDS shouldn't have the right to disagree with his opinion?

    What SPECIFIC example(s) of LDS hypocrisy regarding Jeffress can you point out?

  • raybies Layton, UT
    Oct. 14, 2011 6:17 a.m.

    Traditional Christianity has benefited greatly from Mormon Envy. Mormons likewise benefit from Traditional Christianity's criticisms. If we're lucky we'll get there together and someday both bow to the Supreme Being as brothers and sisters in Christ, and look back at these skirmishes as ways in which God provided us with opportunities to look inward and improve ourselves.

    I am grateful for this moment and the chance I have to share my LDS belief that Christ is the father of my soul, the Redeemer of the world, and the only way and means by which I may be saved in the Kingdom of God. I love Jesus Christ for his infinite atonement, and hope that I may someday stand with others of faith in his glory.

    I hope those of other faiths will look to the LDS as well for the many good qualities we have been able to polish in the deserts and reaching out to share that God is not dead, nor sleeping, but actively working in the Spirit with us today--that the Family is one of God's most core creations for the happiness of man, and that we are of divine origin--children to the Almighty.

  • Cinefan MIAMI, FL
    Oct. 14, 2011 5:39 a.m.

    One thing I have thought about over the past several years is the idea that we have to be politically correct.

    If one were to read the scriptures, the five standard works, he would never find any instance in which the Lord (his prophets or apostles) was speaking or behaving in a politically correct manner.

    Why do we feel it is necessary to do so today?

    I'm certain someone will reply that it is the "Christian thing to do." If that were the case, was it not the Christian thing to do back in the day, including during the Restoration when the Brethren spoke so boldly, as shown in a post above?

    Seeing how we walk on eggs these days, I can't help but think that we "have feared man more than God" (D&C 3:7). Will all this political correctness come at a price?

  • LDSareChristians Anchorage, AK
    Oct. 14, 2011 12:00 a.m.


    A Jun 2011 poll shows 18% Republicans and 27 % Democrats would not vote for a Mormon for President. Seem there are about 9% points more Democrats that "hate" Mormons than Republicans. Seems the Republican party is the lessor of the two evils than. The Republicans are more supportive of having a Mormon president.

  • Osgrath Provo, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:12 p.m.

    Why do we have to elevate any party above another. All of them, including independent and splinter parties, have both honorable people and scoundrels. I will never vote party line, I will always vote for whom I perceive as the best choice based on character, ideas and competence.

    Political ideology requires people to disregard political pragmatism for whatever a committee decides. That might not always be best for the country.

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 9:32 p.m.


    Don't think for a minute that I am defending the Republican party. It's just the lesser of two evils.

  • SUNNY ALL DAY Saint George, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 8:59 p.m.

    The bedrock philosophy of the modern Republican Party is that a powerful corporate elite can buy their way into the government of The United States of America and force that government to do its bidding.

    The glory will be given to the Republican's forever and ever.

    It's too much like that bad plan that didn't work.

    Strawmen, anyone?

  • StandAlone South Jordan, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 8:49 p.m.

    "Democrats are the new big tent party. All I'm saying is think about it. Because unlike the other party, we don't hate you for what you believe."

    I'm sorry, but I completely disagree. The entire democratic platform is anti-God, anti-traditional family, anti-military, pro-abortion...
    It's anti-everything that I stand for. I don't need to think about it.

  • JohnJacobJingleHeimerSchmidt Beverly Hills, CA
    Oct. 13, 2011 8:45 p.m.

    I would hope my fellow LDS take this opportunity to make sure they are also ones not doing offending to people of other faiths in our communities.

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 8:35 p.m.


    "I have to ask, why does the LDS faith support the Republican party, when it strikes me as obvious the Republican party is trying to support ANYONE besides a Mormon candidate?"

    I can only speak for myself here, but I'd be willing to bet many others in the church share my sentiments.

    I believe what George Washington said about parties was true. Any party is usually bad. Aside from the obvious social issues (gay marriage, abortion, etc.) there is really one huge reason why I cannot support the Democratic party.

    One of the primary beliefs of the church is that the human mind cannot and should not be forced. Everyone must make up their own mind and be responsible for their own life. This is a gift/responsibility given to us from God.

    The bedrock philosophy of the modern Democratic party is that a powerful government can take care of people and their problems...and the ends justify the means. So liberty must be sacrificed for security so that 'not one of them shall be lost, and the glory be the Democrat's forever.' It is too much like another bad plan that didn't work.

  • Robbie512 PROVO, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 8:33 p.m.

    Concerning the discussion between Riles and David King... I agree with David King. If you want to show that people like Pastor Jeffress are wrong, dont do it by pointing to their mistakes, do it by living a good life yourself. Teach by example.

  • Iron Rod Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 8:01 p.m.

    Let's suppose that Governor Perry becomes the candidate for the Republican party for President.

    He has refused to condem Pastor Jeffress comments.

    Will the voters of Utah get in line to vote for him even though he refused to condem the Pastors comments?

    His refusal to condem the Pastors comments speaks volumes for this candidates view point on the LDS faith.

    If we support him after this it is misplaced loyalty in my opinion.

  • There You Go Again Saint George, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 7:56 p.m.



    Stick with people who want your vote, want your money, and then want you gone, especially if you are a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

    The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints allows abortion under very limited specific circumstances.

    I support and sustain the Prophet.

  • mightymite DRAPER, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 7:47 p.m.

    Re: CougarBlue

    "Quotes from this article: "Last year," the website notes, "Rev. Jeffress said the Roman Catholic Church was the outgrowth of a 'corruption' called the 'Babylonian mystery.' He continued, 'Much of what you see in the Catholic Church today doesn't come from God's word. It comes from that cult-like pagan religion. Isn't that the genius of Satan?'"

    Has not the mormon church said much of the same in the past. What is different about this. The mormon church can be as closed minded and bigoted as this pastor has been. Sad on all sides sitting at the table looking for spirituality.

  • grandpaJ LAYTON, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 7:05 p.m.

    I could be a Democrat if they didn't have the abortion plank. Abortion is the worst crime against humanity and the fact that the party hides behind the lie that they are supporting "choice" I will never vote Democrat. Abortion is about power over another human being and has nothing whatsoever to do about choice. So thank you but no thank you. Also, support of the unions must be minimized. Unions are killing our economy

  • CougarBlue Heber City, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 6:55 p.m.

    Quotes from this article: "Last year," the website notes, "Rev. Jeffress said the Roman Catholic Church was the outgrowth of a 'corruption' called the 'Babylonian mystery.' He continued, 'Much of what you see in the Catholic Church today doesn't come from God's word. It comes from that cult-like pagan religion. Isn't that the genius of Satan?'"

    "Where did they find this guy?" Catholic League president Bill Donohue asks. "When theological differences are demonized by the faithful of any religion never mind by a clergyman it makes a mockery of their own religion. Rev. Jeffress is a poster boy for hatred, not Christianity."

    I find it singularly amusing that the "so-called" reverend Jefferies would call the beliefs of the Catholic church corrupted and yet he himself holds to that standard of the trinity, which was developed at the council of Nice.

    Reverend you may now remove your foot from your mouth.

  • als Atheist Provo, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 6:22 p.m.

    LDS are big proponents of "religious freedom"... except for Reverend Jeffres' religious freedom to declare what his religious beliefs are about Mormons.

    Mormons have the religious freedom to call Jeffress' religion part of the "Great Apostasy"' and one of the daughters of the "Whore of all the Earth", but Mormons refuse to respect Jeffres' freedom to call Mormonism a cult.

    How does that hypocrisy work?

  • Hawkyo SYRACUSE, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 5:16 p.m.

    Noodle, I've had liberal friends whose only gripe against me in the world, WAS my religion. We had interesting relationships, to be sure, so don't pretend that libersl will just love LDS people because in many cases they don't.

  • brokenclay Scottsdale, AZ
    Oct. 13, 2011 5:13 p.m.

    "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' . . . . And any person who shall be so wicked as to receive a holy ordinance of the gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them." (Orson Pratt, The Seer, p. 255)

    "Behold there are save two churches only; the one is the church of the Lamb of God, and the other is the church of the devil." (1 Nephi 14:10)

    "Every spirit that confesses that Joseph Smith is a Prophet . . . is of God, and every spirit that does not is of anti-Christ." (Brigham Young, History of the Church, vol.7, p. 287)

    "[F]or they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: 'they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.'" (Pearl of Great Price, Joseph Smith, 2:18-19)

  • Fender Bender Saint George, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 4:32 p.m.

    RE: Cats

    I think it is a good thing to have political principals. One of the political principals I value is freedom of religion. I worry about how freedom of religion is diminished or threatened when one religious faction such as the "Christian right" is allowed such an enormous amount of political power.

    The Christion right has demonstrated both its ability and tendency to consign other minority religions to second-class status. This is evident in the GOP's reluctancy to unequivically disavow Pastor Jeffres' statements about the LDS church, and in the high number of Republicans who will not vote for a Mormon candidate due simply to theological differences. It is evident in the protests against the "9/11 mosque".

    I am not asking Mormons to stop being Republicans. I simply said that it was time for us LDS members to "re-evaluate our political allegiances". I've voted for Republicans in the past, and I'm sure I'll vote for some Republicans in the future. But I will not support any candidate or party that abandons the principals I value, such as equality, compassion, and freedom of religion.

  • Hawkyo SYRACUSE, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 4:32 p.m.

    Pagan, your comment/question from 1:24 pm is probably the most intelligent thing I've ever read from you. THe church officially supports no party. This is why especially in Utah you have so many LDS members who are democrats. It happens that nost member of the church align themselves and their political views with conservativism because they feel it more closely resembles what they think is right. (no pun intended) Some feel the democrats are more closely resembling what they think is right. It's all about perspective. Plus, if you think about it, would Democratic hero, JFK even be considered a liberal in today's society? He was rather conservative by today's standards.

  • Clinker Murray, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 4:29 p.m.

    The response of kind and thoughtful persons of other religions brought tears to my eyes. My hope is that I myself and my Mormon brothers and sisters will humbly "turn the other cheek" when insulted and strive to live our religion. Striking back defensively will not further our cause. Let's follow the example of Elder Nelson and other humble, yet faithful, general authorities of the Church.

  • BobP Port Alice, B.C.
    Oct. 13, 2011 4:23 p.m.

    Perry is toast, burnt toast. Now for Obama and his buddy Wright.

  • Hawkyo SYRACUSE, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 4:20 p.m.

    I said it when this story first broke. "Let him rave on that men shall know him mad." from the Ten Commandments. It looks like I was right. Go figure. Thanks to the open-minded non LDS. Also, let us not forget that not ALL Baptists are filled with such hate. This guy is the exception, not the rule. (I hope)

  • h3tec Ogden, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 4:09 p.m.

    I am LDS and I just don't know why a defense needs to be presented. We know what we believe, and I personally don't give a hoot if nobody else believes as I do, I know who my Savior is and it is Jesus the Christ..

  • Noodlekaboodle Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 3:23 p.m.

    Come on all ya'll mormon republicans. Look at this situation with both eyes open. The party you support hates your religion, and thinks that because of your "non christian" status you don't deserve to be on the same level as them. Come join the Democrats, we don't mind if you disagree with us about abortion and gay marriage. Notice how often Harry Reids gets criticized by the dems for being LDS, oh wait, he doesn't. Ya thats right, us dems will vote in a mormon as our leader in the senate and not blink an eye, even though Harry is LDS. All i'm saying is the Democrats are the new big tent party. All i'm saying is think about it. Because unlike the other party, we don't hate you for what you believe.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Oct. 13, 2011 3:22 p.m.


    I don't know what church you go to, but I've never heard criticism of other churches. In a small Idaho town, it was LDS youth who voluntarily built a Baptist church as a service project. Many LDS members helped rebuild churches after Katrina and other disasters.

    You seem bitter toward the LDS church, but please don't pull a Jeffress.

  • Cats Somewhere in Time, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 3:17 p.m.

    Dear Fender Bender: I always think it is so interesting when posters ask Mormons to stop being Republicans because Evangelicals don't like us. Is the point that we should all join a party we don't agree with and adopt principles we don't agree with because a small faction in the Republican Party doesn't like us? Evangelicals don't control the Republican Party and we don't have to agree with them on everything in order to have common values and goals with regard to our country.

    Just because a lot of Evangelicals are ignorant and misguided about Mormons doesn't mean we should abandon our political principles. We should, instead, work to educate these people about where they are wrong and then work together for common goals.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 2:47 p.m.

    David King | 11:06 a.m. Oct. 13, 2011
    Layton, UT

    Elder Packer's counsel was: "If you have been offended, forgive, forget it, and leave it alone."


    And Christ himself said; "turn the other cheek".

    So -- Are we going to be true Christians,
    or are we going to continue to whine and play the martyr?

  • floridadan Palm Bay, Fl
    Oct. 13, 2011 2:46 p.m.

    I wonder how rich this pastor has gotten from tithing his members have made and if he would be a pastor if he was not paid?

  • Tad Walch
    Oct. 13, 2011 2:45 p.m.

    @David King
    "The majority of these articles focus not on clearly defining our beliefs, but on one statement by one pastor." AND "Can't we ask if we are letting this bother us too much?"

    As the editor of many the items you listed, I welcome you asking these questions. First, I believe our coverage has not been about focusing on the statement but about capturing the reaction. The reaction has come from the front pages of national newspapers and a remarkably broad array of sources. Second, we continue to have conversations about the number of articles we are posting on this issue: Is this too much? Each day, I have felt we have rounded up stories, opinions and items from around the country that provided fresh perspective. Third, I don't think this is about a statement bothering some Mormons as much as it is about how others feel about the statement, and about interest among many to hear what others are saying. Thanks for reading and asking pertinent questions.

  • David King Layton, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 1:36 p.m.

    I appreciate your reply. I will try to give my personal answer (my opinion) to some of your questions.

    "I wonder how many of those articles were produced by the Deseret News rather than just linked to other sources"
    To be clear, a lot of them were not produced by the Deseret News, but I think linking them still shows an inclination to keep the discussion going.

    "I'm not sure why, if you belong to the church, you would be against this kind of publicity and public examination that will, in the end, put the church in a more favorable light as we respond with dignity to bigotry."
    Some of the responses I have seen have not been so dignified. I've heard and read many statements referring to how "stupid", "ignorant", or "crazy" Robert Jeffress is. If this were the New York Times or CNN or some other newspaper my comments may be very different. But as this is a Mormon-owned paper, and a lot of us reading are Mormons, I think I can direct my comments to fellow members. How many of us will vote for a Muslim? an atheist? These are important

  • Wally West SLC, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 1:34 p.m.

    @ Oh, please! | 12:52 p.m. Oct. 13, 2011

    What about Obama's predecessor & his Blues Brothers like quest?

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 1:24 p.m.

    Fender Bender | 12:24 p.m. Oct. 13, 2011,

    Well said!

    With Rick Perry, Chris Christie and now Herrimen Cain...

    *NBC/WSJ poll: Cain now leads GOP pack By Mark Murray NBC news 10/13/11

    leading the polls. It's almost as if the Republican party is hoping for ANYONE besides Mitt Romney.

    I have to ask, why does the LDS faith support the Republican party, when it strikes me as obvious the Republican party is trying to support ANYONE besides a Mormon canidate?

    I do not mean this as an attack on the Mormon faith, just it's ability to function in national politics with such obvious pre-concieved bias.


  • LivinLarge Bountiful, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 1:23 p.m.

    I now find myself on the other side of the debate, I don't think I could ever vote for a Southern Baptist, certainly not if they are as bigoted as Jeffress!

  • Riles Midway, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 1:14 p.m.

    @David King

    I wonder how many of those articles were produced by the Deseret News rather than just linked to other sources. Regardless, I don't think, in reading many of the articles that the focus is solely on Pastor Jeffress' one-liner, but rather on the larger debate that was reignited by his comments. Questions like, What constitutes a Christian?, Is it appropriate to evaluate candidates on the basis of religion?, What is proper and improper discourse between faith groups?, etc. are all vital areas of interest for many in this country, not just Mormons, and have application to relations with just about any other faith or affinity group. Instead of just condemning the particular quote, many of the articles go on to examine these questions that need to get aired out in the public sphere, not in backslapping, private meetings between friends, where it's "okay" to be a little bigoted. I'm not sure why, if you belong to the church, you would be against this kind of publicity and public examination that will, in the end, put the church in a more favorable light as we respond with dignity to bigotry. Just my 2 cents.

  • Disco Vega MoTown, CA
    Oct. 13, 2011 1:14 p.m.

    Bigotry has no place in America...all it does is bring our great nation down. Shame on Rev. Jeffress for not understanding the larger Christian picture of what America is all about. -- Nice article, I hope it makes its way to Dallas.

  • tom jr. north ogden, uT
    Oct. 13, 2011 1:11 p.m.

    I think its time for us Mormons to do away with the phrase the honest in heart which is found in our sermons and prayers. It is a holdover from the 19th century and implies that any who differ with us or show no interest in our message are, therefore, the dishonest in heart.

    We need to be careful also of phraseology that implies salvational guarantees. The blessings promised in temple ordinances and covenants are always conditional, and this should be reflected in our wedding announcements and obituaries. Evangelicals are, in their own minds, the only people on the planet guaranteed salvation. Mormon devotees of Christs word have a hope of salvation, knowing that a final judgement still awaits, where undoubtedly humility will reign as we answer for deeds done in the body.

    We need to dial back any certitude we may harbor regarding salvation and exaltation. Hope and humility should characterize our thoughts, sermons, prayers, and interactions with those around us.

  • Oh, please! Saint George, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 12:52 p.m.

    @InsideView ..."If Perry belongs to Jeffress' congregation and has the same mind set, can you imagine him as President and trying to represent this great Nation?"

    Good question! We are seeing that right now with our current president and his mentor, Rev. Wright.

  • donn layton, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 12:49 p.m.

    RE: Counter Intelligence I am not LDS; yet even I know that Smith is revered as a leader, not God or the Messiah himself.
    You are probably not aware that JS said,I have more to boast of than any man ever had. I am the only man that has been able to keep the whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, Nor Jesus[Messiah] ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. (DHC, v. 6 408,409)

    ute alumni,I have followed Bill Donohue for years. He is always civil and thought. He is a good ambassador for the Catholic church.
    Mr. Donohue was defending the Catholic Church. The official Catholic view of Mormonism is a non-Christian religion. Check Catholic Answers. The Athanasian Creed is clear as well.

  • David King Layton, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 12:46 p.m.

    I understand one or two articles on the subject, to call out bigoted statements, but there has been near a dozen articles in this newspaper on the subject:

    -Rick Perry backer decries Mitt Romney, Mormons
    -Bachmann, Cain evade Mormon questions as race evolves
    -Evangelical leader says LDS Church is not a cult
    -Local clergy weigh in on LDS 'cult' claims, Christianity
    -Romney, Fischer obscurely address 'big, anti-Mormon elephant' at Values Voter Summit
    -Anti-Mormonism: 'Prejudice' of age
    -Why worry about Mormons?
    -LDS public affairs chief blogs on Mormon Christianity
    -Editorial: Cult of intolerance
    -Columnist contrasts Elder Russell M. Nelson and Rev. Robert Jeffress

    The majority of these articles focus not on clearly defining our beliefs, but on one statement by one pastor. This article, especially, does not explain what we believe or try to encourage religious tolerance, but says, in essence "Elder Nelson is so much nicer the Robert Jeffress. We Mormons are so much better, look how many people say so"

    I don't think that's helpful or constructive.

    This is a Mormon-owned paper with a Mormon-majority audience. Can't we ask if we are letting this bother us too much?

  • Fender Bender Saint George, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 12:24 p.m.

    Over the past 50 years, LDS members have leaned heavily towards the Republican party and supported the same ideological, social and political platforms as the Christian right. Now we have reached the point where the Christian right is trying to relegate Mormons to second-class status.

    Ironically, "liberals" and atheists are defending Mormon candidates against Reverend Jeffress' remarks, or at least demanding that if any candidate's religion is criticized, all candidate's religious beliefs should be subject to the same scrutiny.

    The Republican party has become so intermingled with the Christian right that is seems to have embraced the notion that a candidate's religion is more important than his/her competency, record and platform. And despite the supposedly heavy influence of Christianity in the GOP, the audiences at the Republican debates have applauded the idea of letting a man die because he didn't have health coverage, and cheered Rick Perry's record as the governor who oversaw the most executions.

    The Republican party will use Mormons, but won't grant us equal status. Republicans will emphatically claim they revere the Constitution and the Bible, but they will meticulously avoid referencing either.

    Time for us LDS members to re-evaluate our political allegiances.

  • InsideView Draper, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 12:17 p.m.

    If Perry belongs to Jeffress' congregation and has the same mind set, can you imagine him as President and trying to represent this great Nation?

  • Riles Midway, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 11:49 a.m.

    @David King,

    This isn't about Mormons being offended and wanting to get back at the offender. This is about latent bigotry that is used as a tool, not to prevent us from worshiping or believing whatever and however we will, but to color others perceptions of Mormons who are aspiring to high secular positions; as if to say, "don't let the facade of competence, kindness, intelligence, etc fool you, this guy's a Mormon and we all know that the Mormon cult is trying to take over the world and feed us lime jello with carrot shavings". Mormon is being used as a code word for different, cultish, anti-Christian, secretive, polygamous, and evil.

    It's time that closet bigots were put under a microscope and called out. Would you also suggest leaving racial bigotry alone? I don't think that was the context of Elder Packer's talk at all.

  • Mark B Eureka, CA
    Oct. 13, 2011 11:46 a.m.

    Our country has two major political parties. One of them, it seems, is shot through with priestcraft - the deliberate misleading of people on matters of religion for personal gain. Jeffress' goals are no more about Jesus than Sarah Palin's are about "freedom".

  • Screwdriver Casa Grande, AZ
    Oct. 13, 2011 11:17 a.m.

    There are plenty of members of the LDS church that criticize other religions. Fortunatly the leaders have been smarter than that for some time. We can take that as a lesson.

    Now what if an openly Gay person ran for president?

    He/she's a community organizer!

  • David King Layton, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 11:14 a.m.

    that belief? No. We believe the Church of Jesus Christ to be a restoration of Christ's church, and we believe it sincerely. Do we have a right to be offended when someone else has a sincerely held belief that is not inclusive of our faith? I don't think we do have that right, nor does it help us to be offended. No matter how hateful or ignorant the comment may seem, all we can do is try to follow the commandments, love God, and try to treat others with kindness. We should recognize that some may take offense at some of our doctrinal statements. Please note I'm not saying they should, only that they may perceive certain distinctive doctrines in a way that offends them. The important thing is to engage in more heartfelt conversation with those willing to engage us, and the others sometimes just have to be ignored.

  • David King Layton, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 11:06 a.m.

    Elder Boyd K. Packer told a great story in the April Conference of this year. A man lost his wife due to an infection carried by their doctor. He became obsessed with it and the anger and resentment filled his soul continually. He received the wise counsel to "leave it alone" from his Stake President. Elder Packer's counsel was: "If you have been offended, forgive, forget it, and leave it alone."

    After nearly a dozen articles about one statement by one pastor, it is time for the Deseret News and we members of the LDS church to leave it alone. Nothing can be gained by rehashing this day after day. Certainly we want to be understood and allowed to declare our beliefs, but there is no need to go beyond that. If we want to be considered Christians, let us act like Christians, instead of gloating in comparisons about how Christian our leaders are compared to leaders of other faiths.

    If we are honest with ourselves, we would realize that it would be possible for others to take offense at our belief that God described all other creeds as an "abomination in his sight." Should we apologize for

  • klove Roy, Utah
    Oct. 13, 2011 11:03 a.m.

    Having served a mission in Indiana years ago, I know how hard it was to talk to people because their ministers "warned them of us."

    This is such a great side of the internet and communication in the 21st century. No blow hard, even with his 10000 member flock, can keep the restoration from being at least considered. With information freely available, its very difficult to not at least catch glimpses of it through the curtain guys like Jeffress put up.

  • Funkmeister Orem, Utah
    Oct. 13, 2011 11:03 a.m.

    Re GoGetter
    "Well, I think Romney handled it will. I think, if anything, Jeffress made his endorsed candidate look worse. Nice job, dude. Maybe in 4 years you will think twice when you talk to anybody."

    ...and may I add: "(if you still have anybody who wants to listen to you)"

  • The Rock Federal Way, WA
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:59 a.m.

    Christ was frequently sharp and pointed in His comments to the Pharisees and Scribes in His day. These were people who should have known better.

    Christ was always kind and gentle with those who were sincere seekers of truth, even if they were wrong.

    I have had many people tell me that "Mormons are NOT Christians." I have always wondered why they thought they could convert me by starting off with insults of the most offensive kind. Would you buy a care from a salesman who took one look at you and told you how ugly you are? I don't reward people that abuse me.

    What would Jesus do? Jesus would take the honest seeker of truth, show them where they were wrong in a kind and gentle manner. There would be no insults. No attacks. No offense.

    If Evangelical Christians want to convert Mormons they would be well advised to show a little love and compassion; build relationships of trust and then work on showing the LDS people a better way, if their way is better.

    Let your light so shine. May the brightest light win.

  • DeltaFoxtrot West Valley, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:52 a.m.

    The one gripe I have with modern Christianity... it's "Love thy neighbor." not "Judge thy neighbor."

    Intolerance is the #1 problem facing the world today.

    On a shrinking planet where we are increasingly connected to our fellow man can't we learn to get along?

  • GoGetter Sandy, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:33 a.m.

    Well, I think Romney handled it will. I think, if anything, Jeffress made his endorsed candidate look worse. Nice job, dude. Maybe in 4 years you will think twice when you talk to anybody.

  • Friend West Valley City, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:23 a.m.

    The last sentence sums it up nicely. Rev. Jeffress makes a mockery of his own religion. Rev. Jeffress is a poster boy for hatred, not Christianity.

  • ute alumni Tengoku, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:22 a.m.

    I have followed Bill Donohue for years. He is always civil and thought. He is a good ambassador for the Catholic church.

  • KM Cedar Hills, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:21 a.m.

    Oh no! Somebody is going to let the secret out about the LDS Church. That being the leaders of the church are some of the sharpest and most spiritually intelligent people in the world. Listen to the doctrines that they promote and see and feel Christ in every word.

    Oct. 13, 2011 10:15 a.m.

    Thank you for this article, I found it interesting that others had come out of the woodwork to condone this action.

  • ute alumni Tengoku, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:13 a.m.

    jefferess may want to consult with rev. wright.

  • Cats Somewhere in Time, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:11 a.m.

    This is so wonderful to see others stick up for us. What Jeffress did was despicable. Perry used him as a surrogate and now is paying the price. We really appreciate the support from others.

  • leonard Oakley, ID
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:05 a.m.

    After this story, I have a lot more faith in my fellow Christians of all faiths

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    Oct. 13, 2011 10:02 a.m.

    "One columnist even went so far as to compare the Christian influence of Rev. Jeffress with Elder Russell M. Nelson of the LDS Church's Quorum of the Twelve Apostles and found Rev. Jeffress to be lacking."

    Not really a fair comparison. Most people are lacking compared to Elder Nelson.