Comments about ‘Local clergy weigh in on LDS 'cult' claims, Christianity’

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Published: Monday, Oct. 10 2011 11:28 p.m. MDT

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Just Thinking Outloud..
Merrimack, NH

I view the LDS as Christian, but they are not Catholic or Protestant. In my opinion their unique teachings do not diminish the great message of Christ. They do not take anything from my strongly held faith.

But I do consider them legitimate Christians. Their reason for a restoration was to move away from the changes brought about as Christianity evolved over the centuries. I have to be honest that there have been many, many changes since Christ walked the earth. Historical changes to Christianity are documented, and undisputed by most non-LDS theologians. To find out for yourself, study from the most excellent sources you can find. Start with the creeds to which the modern religions adhere. The Nicene Creed, written about 325AD, or The Athanasian Creed (5-9th century) is a place to start. Don't just read what someone says about them- actually read them. It is my belief that the reformers had good reason to challenge the theological leaders of that day.

Protestant reformers were not viewed as historical, authentic Christians either. The leaders of Catholicism viewed them as heretic's. In spite of that, the followers of the reformers knew they worshiped and loved Christ.

Informed Voter
South Jordan, UT

Thank you, Reverend Crowder.

A voice of Reason
Salt Lake City, UT

I'm not criticizing Reverend Myke Crowder, but simply remarking that "impolite" is a very nice way of putting it. Someone saying that I and millions of others don't have the right to the 1st amendments protections is far more than impolite, it's borderline on a lot of things that I doubt I need to mention here.

My biggest concern is that so many evangelicals agree with some outrageous lies I've had the misfortune of learning about. An evangelical apologized in the tabernacle, saying that they've 'sinned against us, and made conspiracy theories against us', etc. This is my primary concern... with how many people I've either known, met, or seen that follow those ideas and cling to them... how many would be willing to listen to Jeffres's 1st amendment comment and would be inclined to agree with him?

I don't care what people believe, but the second they start needlessly attacking others beliefs they have gone down the wrong road. I hate thinking about where that road ends and how many people have made it all the way down. I can say one thing though, that road is definitively not the straight and narrow, not of Christ at all.

coleman51
Orem, UT

I honestly don't know how anyone would not believe that Christ plays a deeply meaningful and central role in the doctrine of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. I was a former Methodist and converted to the Church when I was 19 years old. The reason I converted was because of my reading of the Book of Mormon. One cannot come away from reading that book without a deeper understanding of the role of Jesus Christ and his atonement. The Book of Mormon is the most convincing book in this world on understanding and coming to know the Savior. Those who deny that Latter-Day Saints are not Christian are basing it on a very arcane or diluted understanding of the Savior or else they simply don't want to know the truth.

lexidog
MILLINGTON, TN

It really doesn't matter what others think of the LDS. They believe how they believe and it's no one elses business. It was a thoughtless comment on the Texas pastors' part and it has no bearing on who should be president. Because it occurred where Mr. Perry was speaking created a situation that he apologized for and that should be the end of it (IMHO).

Iron Rod
Salt Lake City, UT

Unsaid feelings

If 75 percent of the 1000 evangelic pastors responded to the survey that Mormons were not Christians, I think we can accurately judge what they are teaching their flocks.

Rather than ignore attacks on our faith perhaps we ought to do what other minorities do, form groups to actively challenge these misconeptions.

People say things about Mormons that they would never say about blacks, hispanics, Cathoics or Jews, Why because they are challenged if they do.

Perhaps we ought to form some thing like the Anti Defamation League which is used quite effectively by the Jewish Faith or the NAACP which is used by the Blacks to conter these misconceptions.

Twin Lights
Louisville, KY

I think I could accept someone saying we are outside of historical Christianity. I prefer the term traditional to historical because of differences that exist between modern Christianity and the primitive church.

Our differences with other, modern Christian denominations are, in part, key to our religious claims. But to say we are not Christians is another thing entirely. It pains me to see the religion I love portrayed as anything less than the powerful advocate for the Savior which I have experienced it to be.

We fall victim (please don't read more into that word) to the No True Scotsman argument. In this, the speaker defines a group to exclude all not in full agreement with their point of view. Essentially, they draw the definitional circle tightly around themselves.

This is NOT an argument we can cede to our critics. To do so means we give up part of our ability to forcefully advocate for the Savior and his doctrines. In order to do his work, we must be undeniably understood to stand on his side.

Untraditional? Sure. Non-historical? Depends on what you know of history. But non-Christian? NO. Not now, not ever.

David King
Layton, UT

I've seen maybe four or five articles now published by the Deseret News rehashing one statement made by one person during the Values Voters Summit, but never did I see the winner of the Summit's straw poll even mentioned. It was Ron Paul, by the way.

Why do we as people and the media let one outspoken pastor define the entire political conversation for the nation? We could be talking about jobs, the economy, the wars overseas, budget deficits, securing our borders, immigration reform, health care, the value of our currency, or any number of things more important than this. I urge the Deseret News and all media to ignore the sideshows and report on the most important issues in the selection of a president.

alwaysthinking
Farmington, UT

Praise God for people like "Just Thinking Outloud" from Merrimack, NH!!! I didn't know such people existed. You have absolutely hit the nail on the head.

The DN article about the local pastor was encouraging. As a former member of the Baptist church, if those pastors being surveyed about "are Mormons Christians?"are anything like the pastors at my old church, it would be hard for them to make an informed decision because the ideas they passed on to our congregation about who Mormons are and what they believe were far from the truth. They did not know enough about the doctrines of Christ which we as Latter Day Saints hold sacred to be able to judge us - not that others should be judging us anyway-. As in most cases in this world, ignorance is the root of much evil and misunderstanding.

raybies
Layton, UT

I loved the line in this response about how we're choosing a chief executive officer of the country, not chief pastor. It is a wise thing to seperate religious authority from secular, and imo, it's dangerous to think otherwise. Many religious leaders have terrible governance skills... just look to the middle-east for evidence of that.

Elcapitan
Ivins, UT

I appreciate that large group of born again clergy voting us Mormons out of their circle. I hate to think of us in such diminished, uninformed terms as they opeate on.

GuitarGuy
Layton, UT

The first mistake Evangelicals make in this situation is assuming they own the rights to define "Christianity".

The second mistake they make is to define a Christian is someone who "subscribes to classical Christian creeds and doctrines", when NOT A SINGLE Protestant or Catholic denomination is in perfect agreement on all doctrines.

That is why they split in the first place and great divides exist today: They had differences of opinion. Even one parish differs from another based on the beliefs and style of its preacher. They have ignored the charge from Paul in Ephesians 4:13 to come to a "unity of the faith". A fact which could lead one to question THEIR Christianity, I think, hmm? ;)

Esquire
Springville, UT

Why do conservatives keep pulling religion into politics, any way? Even in Utah it is done as a tool to suppress the other political party (I guess I have answered my own question, right?. So, Mormons, you don't like it when done on the national level, so why do you engage in it here in Utah?

Midwest Mom
Soldiers Grove, WI

Jeffress is enjoying his 15 minutes of fame.

LiberalEastCoastMember
Parkesburg, PA

Iron Rod wrote, "Rather than ignore attacks on our faith perhaps we ought to do what other minorities do, form groups to actively challenge these misconceptions."

Already done. They're called Wards and Stakes.

Rifleman
Salt Lake City, Utah

The Jews thought Jesus was the leader of a cult. They thought that killing Him would destroy His Church. It didn't. In his day the enemies of Joseph Smith thought they could destroy the LDS Church by killing him. They didn't. Today members of the LDS Church are found all around the earth, and their numbers are growing daily.

Why do people worry about Romney's faith when we've banned Jesus from our schools and public meetings?

Leo Femedlers
El Paso, TX

Re: Iron Rod -- "Perhaps we ought to form some thing like the Anti Defamation League which is used quite effectively by the Jewish Faith or the NAACP which is used by the Blacks to conter these misconceptions."

I believe we do. They are called missionaries. Every member. :)

procuradorfiscal
Tooele, UT

Re: "Local clergy weigh in"

It's kind and gracious of these men of God to give an honest assessment of their neighbors' actions and attitudes, but I think Pastor Mitchell's answer hits the nail on the head -- are Mormons Christians? "That is an individual question," Pastor Mitchell said. "I am not God and do not know anyone's heart."

Another way of saying it -- if we're accused of being Christians, would there be enough evidence to convict?

As we know, questions by friends, even enemies, of our status as Christians, are a matter of surpassing indifference to our standing before the Lord. How we handle these questions may be illustrative of our status, however.

These questions provide an opportunity for reflection, to examine whether our actions may have given cause to question our status. But that questioning, whether sincere or disingenuous, should never be used as an excuse for unchristian conduct on our part.

Are Mormons Christians? If our real concern is how the Lord would answer that question, the rest will take care of itself.

theOtter
Lafayette, IN

The saddest thing about all this is the hypocrisy. Ive never encountered someone, who believes the Church of Jesus Christ to be non-Christian, who can give a definition of Christianity that accurately excludes it. Every so-called reason Ive ever heard also applies to other groups that these people *do* recognize as Christian, and often include groups from their own churchs ostensible history!

People need to get a life.

Jazz Cop
San Francisco, CA

It's like you need to apply for chrisitianity now, with all these unknown qualifiers, in that case there must also be a best christian religion, and it is called the church of J.C. that's right, the church of Jazz Cop.

accept jesus in your heart--check
abstinence-check
seven virtues-check
hates the devil-check
$125 check for application fee-enclosed-check

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