Utah..Medical school and technologies start-ups.BYU..Honor code and
preparing students to live life with integrity.
Nobody is a fan of academic stats. Its all about football!
So, there!Juvenile one-upsmanship over who's university is
educationally better is bunk.It's like comparing apples to oranges.
Each offers difference educational advantages.Enough already with
those juvenile comparisons!Let's just stick to comparing sports,
where it's apples to apples. Where winning gives the winner's fans something to
Gee, not much discussion when nice things are said about both schools. That's
interesting? Anyway, this just points out that we have a lot to be proud of
from both of these institutions. Way to go!
As a Ute fan I find a lot to admire about BYU both academically and
athletically. When we face each other, I cheer only for Utah, but when BYU goes
against anyone else I'm happy to see them win. When both schools have good
athletic records it lifts up both programs. Academically, they do a fine job
teaching undergrads and preparing kids for life, as does the U. I admire the
honor code at BYU, but BYU fans have got to realize as a public institution the
U cannot enforce an honor code. The two schools have different mission
academically and philisophically.TJ,I take offense at
your insinuation that the U doesn't teach integrity. Integrity is a basic value
of society and the lack of it shouldn't be tolerated at any institution of
higher learning. That is no different at the U. The holier than thou tone of
your comment reflects a part of what causes some of the bitterness in this
rivalry and I know is frowned upon by LDS Church authorities. Remember, which
football team had Elder Joseph B. Wirthlin's initials stenciled on their helmets
the year he died?
What do I like best about the u? How about 75% of the time we know they will
lose to the Y.
I'm also a Ute fan, but have a great deal of respect for BYU as an intitution.
There may be some small things I would like to see change at BYU, but overall I
think they really do strive to meet their goal of educating and uplifting the
students. They work to keep the school as a positive representation of the
Church, rather than a school that is loosely associated with the religion (like
you see with some other religious schools).
Utah has a great medical graduate program and has a really good undergraduate
program.BYU has a slightly better undergraduate program and a better
alumni network.Mormon Ute,I think TJ was referring more to the
requirements of the honor code and taking religion classes. I don't think he
was saying that the U is unethical or immoral, but teaching morality through
religion isn't a focus at the U like it is at the Y.
@mikee99He is refering to all sports, not just football. I
personally have no idea if the real percentage across all sports is 75% in BYU's
favor but it wouldn't surprise me if it is.
@Mikee99I'm not sure how Cali Coug got to 75% either, but:BYU has won 3 of the last 5 = 60%BYU has won 27 of the last 40 =
68%I don't think this will be a high scoring affair on Saturday.
Both defenses look solid, and neither offense is playing to their potential yet.
I think the home field will give the advantage to BYU. My prediction: BYU 20,
Great article. We need more of this kind of journalism. Let us find the good
in one another--there is plenty to be found. As for an earlier
comment that BYU has a holier than thou attitude. I disagree. This article was
praising the BYU Honor Code. That does not mean that other schools are not
honorable or teach integrity. It only means that BYU chooses to ensure a
certain level of honor and integrity with its student. That is a good thing and
does not speak negatively about any other school.Thank you for this
@Mikee99,Utah fans always cite the record of BYU-Utah games since
1896, which is a little like tracking BYU's Ultimate Frisbee team against Utah
since 1990. Football was not an officially sanctioned sport at BYU until 1922. A
(not-official) team from BYA (the Academy) played Utah multiple times from 1896
to 1903 and lost badly repeatedly. When the Academy was dissolved and
re-established as a separate BY High School and BYU in 1903, football was not in
the system. It was started in 1922.BYU's record against the U is bad
enough from 1922 to 1972 (when Lavell took over) without including the
superfluous 1896-1903 record.Cougars could say "For the last 5
years, BYU's won 3 times" or "In the last 40 years, BYU's won 26
times." In the overall record, however, Utah OWNED BYU from 1922 to 1971
(38-5). 1972 to 1992 it reversed (BYU 19-2). Since McBride became coach in 1990,
it's been pretty even (11-10 for Utah). That includes runs of three wins for BYU
(1990-92) and Utah (1993-95) and four for Utah (2002-2005).
I think the EPA designation of clean energy campus is quiet misleading and
deceptive since the U buys several million dollars per year of Renewable Energy
Credits REC's to off set the carbon emissions. REC's do nothing to clean up the
actual campus but rather is a voluntary cap & trade, smoke and mirrors
trick.The other comparisons I have to take at face value.
Cali Coug,Wow, you are living in the 70's and 80's aren't you?LOL
CougFaninTX,Great example of how you can twist the numbers to say
what you want. Add another year and make it the last 6 and you get 50%. Back
off to the last 24 and it is still 50%. Funny how that works, huh?
If you want access to the best graduate schools, and to jobs at the top
companies in the country, BYU is clearly winning the race. BYU's more selective
undergraduate programs and broad, national recognition and alumni base puts them
in a different league than Utah. The number of BYU graduates attending top rated
graduate schools is significantly ahead of Utah. And starting salaries for BYU
grads are significantly higher than for Utah grads for almost all programs where
they compete head-to-head. This is reflective of BYU's strong national
reputation, across-the-board, better companies that recruit at the Y, and the
rapidly growing and now significantly stronger alumni base for BYU across the
country. As for engineering program strength, Utah certainly is respectable.
Look at starting salaries out of the same programs, however, and you will find
that BYU grads generally do significantly better - a strong vote by the
marketplace.Because of their focus on gathering research dollars,
Utah leads BYU in academic research, particularly in the sciences. But don't
confuse research or dollars with whos students are better regarded. Succesfull
applications to top graduate programs are a much better measure.
Uteology,I was referring to TJ's comment not the article itself. I
agree the article is positive toward both schools, but TJ's comment gives the
clear impression BYU teaches integrity while that is missing at the U. If
that's not what TJ meant, I's love to see a clarification.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's nice. IT'S WAR!!!
I need to apologize to everyone. I made a disparaging comment about
the University of Utah. I was intending to throw light on the EPA designation,
and the not that the University of Utah was being dishonest. Actually Utah is
being very proactive in campus energy conservation.
Clearly both schools are good. Each has their different focus. Each could make
the point they are better than the other using criteria that benefits them
most.Lets just agree that a degree from either is a great
accomplishment. I always chuckle when someone tries to tell me a bachelors
degree from Harvard has any more value than the same degree from Boise State.
All the Harvard degree gets you is a higher starting salary.Go Utes!
my favorite thing about BYU is that they lost to Utah State last year in
football.my favorite thing about Utah is that they admit to being
afraid of playing the Aggies in basketball, very big of them.
First I attended both school!I am a Utah fan (as my posting name
indicates)What are three things I appreciate about the Y?1) Protecting my moral standards such as not allowing me to see Rodin's
"The Kiss" at the Rodin exhibition held at the Y.2) The
haven the Y affords for female students to find, in four years, a husband of
the same faith.3) A place where one is not exposed to tatoos
(unless the person already had some - or he/she is an athlete), body piercing
(male only - the school is "not going there" regarding female
students) 4) Forgot the rule only allows for three...
The title should be changed to "Things CARMAN should take note of."
The fact that a great article like this can, for the most part, allow us as fans
take a different perspective about why our hostilities towards one another
should not extend off of the football field is awesome. Fans like Carman who
strive to take from the integrity of the article shouldn't be allowed to be a
@ Mormon Ute,The Utes may have had Elder Wirthlin's initials
stenciled on their helmets the year he died, but who had a LIVING PROPHET come
to their stadium in 2000 to rename it the LaVell Edwards Stadium? That's
right....BYU!!! GO COUGARS!!!
...That means BYU students comprise 14 percent of the U's graduate
programs...So, what it means...for smart cougars who realize they
need a real education, they go up to the hill to get it.I am glad to
hear that since I was a Utah graduate.
@Kateybug: In 2009, President Thomas S. Monson was honored during half-time at
the University of Utah for his support of the school and the football program.
Yes, we do know how it feels to have a living prophet in our stadium and he just
happens to be a Utah fan. Go Utes!!
@Moderate, to each his or her own. I care more about academic stats than sports
stats (these are schools, after all), and I'm grateful to have both of these
fine institutions in my state. I'm a BYU alum, but I have a tremendous amount
of respect for the research and innovation coming out of the U.
Mormon Ute, Regarding TJ's Comments, I believe that is some smack
talk going on there! Considering that this is "rivalry" week; with
that in mind, the insinuations are what they are. Those who chose to differ from
my observations, I'll respect those differences. I have a great
appreciation for both institutions and their service to the world community.
Certainly they are different in their roles, mission, and operations, but the
individuals who choose these two universities are similar in their passions for
success. I speak in general and not specific individuals.I would
think that those who chose to have the honor code as their message of success
would do well to take note that there is a difference between verbally citing
the code and living the code. Judging by the disparaging posts from a few
supporters of "Honor", it would be wise for these individuals to put
their passions toward the latter as it applies to civility and pride. Smack talk
I think Cali Coug calculates based on quarters, i.e. 75% because BYU beat Utah
for three of four quarters last year. (I guess BYU beats Texas 75% of the time,
Cool stats, but Utah is still gonna win Saturday.
Biggest difference between the schools is who does the most judging and
discriminating versus who doesn't.
I am one of those 14% of U grad students who are BYU alum (I didn't get in to
BYU's Master of Accounting program so I went with the next best option in the
state). As a result I like and respect both schools. I think it is ridiculous
that fans and other people from both Universities try to disparage the academics
of the other university. Both are excellent schools in their own ways and one
excelling academically will not hurt the other one, and likely will help. As a
side note, I have not converted my allegiance as far as sports go, and I never
will, so I will be wearing blue at LES this Saturday and cheering on my Cougars.
@Calu Coug:Last 9: Utah 6BYU 4---> Utah 60%Last 18:Utah 11BYU 7--> Utah 61%Quite
consistent, don't you think?
I'm glad so many Utah fans are so much better than BYU fans because they don't
have a holier-than-thou attitude. And they're definitely not judging when they
call people judgmental either. Thanks for you self-proclaimed humility.
One of the biggest differences is that one is a stste school and one is a church
school. One is easier to be accepted and one is harder to get into and requires
a better GPA in high school. For those LDS who don't like the fact that their
tithing goes to support BYU there are those LDS whose taxes go to support the U
whether they want them too or not. So why quibble about things that you can't
change or influence? Go to the school of your choice (yes, even Utah State,
Weber State, UVU, SUU, Dixie, Snow, etc.) and just be happy. One team will win
and one will lose. And if you watch the game or not won't make any difference
in the outcome, just how you feel. Our state certainly benefits from having
both the U and the Y.
But in all seriousness, both schools have much to be proud of. They are
different institutions with different focuses and each does well at what they
In just the recent history of when Lavell Edwards became the head coach at BYU
has the U-Y game become a rivalry and that is because the Y suddenly won most of
the games, typically by large scores. Now it's about even with a few years the
U haing been a much better team. Prior to that, which U fans like to quote in
their "life time Utah-BYU stats," Utah was a rival with Utah State.
Now, funny thing, the Utes won't even play them. So I dub the U-Y thing as a
"recent rivalry" and maybe that will fade too, as they are no longer
in the same conference. I can't help but wonder if all the conference
realignment energy develops, where exactly will USU land? I know U partisans
like to disparage BYU but I think USU is the school that's truly the most
vulnerable in the near future.
@SoCalUtahFan.6 + (plus) 4 = 10; Not "9" (simple math,
even for a Utah Man).Good Job, however, on try #2. You are correct!
11 + 7 does equal 18.Math Score: 1 for 2 = 50%Unfortunately, past records will not determine who wins this year. Therefore,
good luck to both schools this weekend and may the best team win. It will
be fun to watch!
@toosmartforyouToo scared to face USU? We have you scheduled for the
next four years... or did you completely switch sports from football to
basketball (in which case yeah... we're wusses with that, we'd probably feel
more pathetic about that if we actually realized we had a basketball team).
I think it's funny how magically sports is brought up in an article that is all
about academics. Really? I like sports as well but in my short 22 years of life
I have come to realize that there is more to life than sports. How old are you
some of you people that haven't come to that conclusion? Anyway, both schools
are great and they have so much to offer and the great thing is that what they
have to offer is so different from each other. I think it's fantastic! I am a
current BYU student and am so grateful for the blessing to attend such a
wonderful university but if I were to attend the U I wouldn't feel any less
One major difference the article forgot to mention:At BYU, there is
no place to have a smoke, but the U campus allows smoking.
I am getting a kick out of the comments. By far my favorite part of any BYU
article. The back and forth banter is great. This is why I love this rivalry!
We can take an article about how good the actual schools are and make it a
battle and I wouldn't want to see it any other way!GO COUGARS!
...so what you're sayinig is that BYU doesn't teach their students well enough,
so they have to come to Utah to finish off their education ???...haha, just kidding, but I'm sure a lot of insecure cougars are upset!