@ Rational | 7:18 p.m. Aug. 29, 2011 '85 is equally as irrelevant as
BYU football or basketball or any of the sports programs are not that important
in the long run or the big picture but they are tools for exposure to the
message of the Restored Gospel. I think Vi Sekihema made the point in one of his
article that he has some contacts among the brethren that have expressed the
point that BYU sports may be second only to the full time missionary program in
bring exposure to the church and the message of the restored gospel. Again
sports is only entertainment and it is a tool but it may be more important than
some people want to acknowledge. Jimmer & the BBall teams success and even
Brandon Davies situation has brought a great deal of positive exposure to BYU
and the church. This yrs football team with so many of the games on national TV
will do the same. It is a good time to be a cougar fan. Go cougs.
Uteology, citing Wikipedia? Is that what passes for edgeucasion it texas? "All my X's are in the alph-U-bet. And somewhere in Texas
are the "B's""I'm havin' trouble findin' my X's"Cause I couldn't get into the Y"
Geeze, we are still debating 1984? Let it go, Utes. L-E-T I-T G-O. Of course, in 1985 BYU crushed UW...
Bastiatarian | 3:44 p.m. Aug. 29, 2011 TUCSON, AZ >If
exposure for the church is the reason for the football program, why did Ricks
cancel their program?===Ricks did not want BYU Idaho to
compete with BYU.It's that simple.
Uteology wants me to prove someone else's opinion wrong. Rich. Why don't you
just look to the opinions of the pollsters for 1984, cause BYU was AP and UPI
consensus #1. I think that's good enough. Bryan Gumball and Barry Switzer are
both entitled to their biased opinions. Year in, year out, the national champ
is debatable. and Why? because EVERY year, the NC is based on opinion. which
makes it more of a pageant than a legitimately determined NC. So in '84, the
majority opinion (Bryan Gumball and B Switz excluded) was that BYU was the NC.
You can disagree all you want. But that was the system. BYU played by the rules
within the system and were awarded an NC, part of that as Sports Authority
stated, is due to their previous success. Like it or not, that counts in
NCAAFB. And from the late 70's on, BYU has had pedigree (a few down years not
withstanding) They've had huge wins over perenial powers in every decade since
@ BastiatarianI am not the one who thinks that football is a high
priority. Hearing Bronco talk about his role and the football team's role is
what falsely sets up the program into something that it looks like we both agree
it is not. My point in commenting was that because football is a low priority
and the "exposure" value to the church is not as great as Bronco
dreams about (indeed, the arrogance, among other things, that I regularly see
from the team renders the connection to the Church embarassing rather than
helpful), football will eventually fall by the wayside. I used Ricks as an
example of a situation where the Church's feeling about the value of football
was very obvious. Sure there were many factors that went into the decision to
discontinue, but presumably, were football truly an important tool to create
"exposure," then the program would be continued, no matter the cost.
Football will no longer be "expedient" (assuming it ever was).
>If exposure for the church is the reason for the football program, why did
Ricks cancel their program?There is a prioritization of resources
and a whole mountain of other issues involved in the conversion from a JC to a
4-year university. Exposure for the Church through the football program was
never the highest priority for Ricks (nor is it the highest for BYU; anyone who
thinks so doesn't know anything about the BYU football program or about BYU). At
some time in the future BYU-Idaho may restart a football program, but it's not
expedient at this time.Basically, the connection you make is a non
If 2010 had been a year similar to 2007 wherein there were multiple one-two loss
teams at the tops of the polls then TCU or BSU (barring a loss) would have
probably played for the NC. Let's face it, for a non-BCS team to play for the
NC some things would have to fall just the right way. If Oklahoma, Alabama and
Utah all go undefeated this year Utah will still not play in the NC despite
their BCS conference affiliation. BYU fans recognize a NC is a lofty goal and
will not happen without luck AND earning it on the field. The schedule is much
improved from the 1984 team, but not as strong as SEC etc.
If exposure for the church is the reason for the football program, why did Ricks
cancel their program? I know BYU football is a bigger program, but isn't any
exposure going to lead to more converts? Despite what Bronco feels
is his life calling, BYU football will one day go the same way as Ricks
As a Cougar fan, I would have to agree that TCU, Boise State, and Utah have done
more, recently, to "bust" the BCS than BYU; especially BSU and TCU. I
think BYU has had some ok seasons, but they need to prove they can go undefeated
and play in some important bowl games before I will brag much about any recent
The fact that Utah or TCU or even BS haven't been able to get into a
championship game shows that the BCS system is still just as bad as it ever was,
it isn't fair. The ute fans used to bemoan and criticise the BCS system, now all
of a sudden it is the greatest and the reason they are or should be considered a
great team/program. That doesn't make sense and isn't true. The BCS system is
still bogus and unfair and we need a playoff system. Too much is being made of
the BCS bowls and system. Last yr TCU deserved a chance to prove they were as
good as anyone and worthy of a shot at a NC. Until a playoff system is institued
this stupid bantering will continue and nothing will be proved. The only real
benifit the utes have belonging to the PAC 12 is the money. TCU, BS, Hawaii and
Utah have shown you can get into a BCS game without belonging to a BCS conf. ,
winning is the key, Arizona and Arizona St have proven how benificial belonging
to the PAC conf., it hasn't done them much good.
Uteology | 8:00 p.m. Fort Worth, Texas -----------Cite your source.===As much as you dispise me, you are
now using "cite" instead of "site" See, you can learn. ..............Dr Rosenrosen | 8:06 p.m. Gilbert, AZ
Uteology using selective qualifiers on history to legitimize his team
again. ===Don't ya love it.And quoting Switzer and
Gumbel is classic Uteology. That Two Stooge show was a joke back in 1984. (BTW,
Bo Diddley is a HOF musician, an innovator and also known as "The
Originator" because of his key role in the transition from the blues to
rock & roll.)Gumbel interviewing Switzer is classic Uteology. In
1983, Switzer was civilly prosecuted for illegal insider trading by the U.S.
Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), but defended himself as having
"accidently" overheard the information while lounging on the bleacher
behind some corporate insiders, and was found not guilty. Yet, what he did was
still wrong.The guy has no moral compass. He had a horse in the
race. Oklahoma finished raned #4 coaches and #3 AP. He had to discredit BYU to
get a shot.Your blind bias is getting old.No
credibility.(Tell me again about my season tickets).
Stop hanging on every word and nuance and just play football.
Yesssss, Game Week is Here!
UteologySorry, I did miss at NM, but that still only gives Utah
three regular season opponents with winning records vs. four regular season
opponents with winning records for BYU.Bottom line, both BYU and
Utah deserved to play better competition in their bowls. BYU should have faced
Washington or Nebraska in the Holiday Bowl and Utah should have played Auburn in
the Fiesta Bowl.The reason why BYU was able to win the NC despite
their mediocre schedule, however, was what BYU had done in previous seasons --
1979 to 1983 -- to establish their legitimacy as something much more than a
one-year flash in the pan.
UteologyFirst, I apologize for mis-spelling your handle. No slight
intended. Second, you cite Barry Switzer????If you had
also cited Bo Shembechler (again, sorry for any mis-spelling), you know what you
could call that on the hill?Double blind research.
@TheSportsAuthorityMy bad, I absolutely missed Hawaii and Utah just
like in 2004 you missed @New Mexico 7-5. Indeed BYU won 4 teams
over .500, yet some have ranked their SOS around #80 to #104.Let me
say this again, Utah did not deserve a national title shot in 2004 but we did at
least deserve a chance at Auburn. In 2008 after being the only
undefeated team in the nation, THAT year, we did deserve a shot at the NC title,
16 AP voters agreed--the most under the current rules for ANY non-AQ team. I
also think TCU in 2010 should have played in the title game.@DrSorry just because the source BG doesn't agree with you doesn't mean
he's not credible. If he's wrong prove it.Second, according to Wiki
under Washington Huskies football they also claim the 1984 NC:BYU's
title was notable for being the only time since the inception of the AP poll
that a team was awarded the national title without beating an opponent ranked in
the top 25 at the season's end. The B (QPRS), FN, and NCF polls awarded the
Huskies the national championship.
Uteology"1984 BYU 13-0: @AF (8-4), Tulsa (6-5) and no other
team above .500"For somebody who pretends to be a statistics
expert, you fail miserably.BYU 1984 (13-0)Tulsa 6-5at
Hawaii 7-4at AFA 8-4at Utah 6-5-1FOUR opponents with
winning records, three of them on the road.Finished 1983 #7 in both
polls, Top 12 finishes in 1979, 1980, and 198124-game winning streak,
including road wins against two Top 13 teams -- @Air Force(#13/#15) and
@UCLA(#17/#13).Utah 2004 (12-0)Texas A&M 7-5at Wyo
7-5Pitt 8-4THREE opponents with winning records, only one of
the on the roadFinished 2003 #21 in both polls; Utah's first Top 25
finish since 1994.Losing seasons in 2000 and 2002; lost to Texas
A&M(4-8) and barely beat BYU(4-8) 3-0 in 2003.Utah 2008Finished 2005, 2006 and 2007 unranked
Also, the change from the Bowl Alliances to the BCS did nothing for the mid
major schools and conferences. All it did was realign the structure and banded
the Big 10 and PAC10 to separate farther away from the mid major schools even
more. Utah in 04 was so dominant that the BCS had no choice to include them.
What was impressive is that this is before the BCS championship game when there
were only 4 schools. There is no fact, no truth that BYU is the reason that the
ZelphExists"The BCS was created to have one bonafide champion
without controversy."And it's failed miserably.
From Wikipedia: Because the Bowl Alliance failed to include the Pac-10, Big Ten
(and the Rose Bowl) and so-called "mid-major" conferences, the Bowl
Alliance was reformed just three years after it began. BYU's persistent
performance opened the door for mid-major conferences to participate in
upper-tier bowls as well. In 1996, despite 18 conference championships in 23
years, one of the winningest records in college football and a #5 ranking in the
AP poll, BYU was excluded from a Bowl Alliance bowl and was relegated to the
Cotton Bowl beating Kansas State to finish the season 141. Now the Bowl
Coalition was also at risk of anti-trust because of the monopoly on the bowls.
LaVell Edwards, BYU Coach, testified in Congress at that time about the inherent
unfairness in recruiting for teams who were excluded from bowls simply because
of conference affiliation. With the pressure of potential Congressional action,
the Bowl Alliance reformed into the Bowl Championship Series that not only
included the Big Ten and the Pac-10 conference but also cracked open the door to
allow the possibility of a "mid-major" team's participation.
@bluecoug89.... what are you blabbing about? Im a kitty fan now? Im confused.
Were you born in 89? Poor kid hasn't even seen the big stage.
Yes, the famous Bryan Gumble, the most credible Sportscaster in the world, never
known for bias. Too bad all the pollsters disagreed with him. And Switzer
didn't have a vested interest at that time either? Right, he didn't want his
team to be #1 did he? Those are some weak sources Uteology. Why don't you just
start citing random Ute fans. It's laughable that you would cite a coach who was
vying for the title himself.
Sorry Zelphie. That was suppose to say "welcome to the club". Sorry
for making an error in your initiation to the wonderful world of BYU. How sweet
Dr Rosenrosen | 9:47 p.m. Aug. 28, 2011Gilbert, AZcite your source?
Cite your source that Utah's 08 was more respected than BYU's 84.---------------In late November, NBC invited Oklahoma coach Barry
Switzer on the Today Show to promote its upcoming broadcast of the Orange Bowl,
which the network had dubbed an unofficial national title game. Switzer's team
(9-1-1) was ranked second; its opponent, Washington (11-1), was ranked
fourth."How can you rank BYU No. 1?" Today host Bryant
Gumbel wondered aloud. "Who'd they play -- Bo Diddley Tech?""They play in the worst conference in the country," said the
Oklahoma coach. "BYU beat its schedule, but it didn't beat the
world."Yet no one questioned Utah after we spanked #4 Bama, I
recall Switzer being speechless in the post-game show.
WY was ranked? Doesn't appear so. Ok, so the 04 team still only beat only 1
ranked team (ie a team that was ranekd when they beat them) that Pitt team was
pretty horrible too. I will say that I actually thought that was the Best team
Utah ever put on the field. I thought they should have had a shot at a better
bowl matchup. Sadly, they didn't. It was a very good team though. I was way
more impressed with them than with the '08 team.
Wow! ZelphExists is now BYU's #1 fan. Thanks to the club, bro!
"Legitimate national champions have a Waterford Crystal Football trophy in
their trophy case."TSA:That trophy didn't arrive
for more than two decades after the zenith of the program. Admit it, the wait
wasn't exactly a ringing endorsement of the ongoing relevance of cougie
Dr Rosenrosen | 9:41 p.m. Aug. 28, 2011Utes lucked their way past TCU
because their kicker missed 2 chipshot field goals.----------------2004 Utah 12-0: #25 Pitt (8-4), Texas A&M
(7-5) and @WY (7-5)2008 Utah 13-0: #6 Bama (12-2), #7 TCU (11-2),
#18 OSU (9-4), #25 BYU (10-3), @AF (8-5)1984 BYU 13-0: @AF (8-4),
Tulsa (6-5) and no other team above .500FYI... BYU's best team since
1996 was in 2009 #12 11-2. That team won New Mexico 24-19 because UNM missed
field goals and was spanked @LES by 7-6 FSU 54-28 who the week before barley won
Div-2 team Jacksonville State at home 19-9.
Quit dodging my question! Cite your source that BYU was the reason that the BCS
was created... You are avoiding it because you cant, because there is no source,
and you no you are just making it up in your own head. Cite your source. Still
waiting.... And the fourth team is Oregon State. Thats 4 more ranked wins
than your 84 joke of a title. Go ahead and google top ten least deserving cfb
football titles. You wont have time though cause you'll be be looking
forever for a source that states that the BCS came along because of BYU.Lets see that source...
cite your source? Cite your source that Utah's 08 was more respected than BYU's
84. It's an implication. Like the BCS is going to come right out and say
"we did this to keep schools like BYU out." right. But the timing of
it speaks for itself.
@TheSportsAuthorityWhen did I say winning a NC is equivalent to
winning a BCS game?Its not, that's all in your head. Wannabe BCS busters can only print "Perfection" t-shirts in the
preseason.@ZelphExistsActaully, the 1983 was BYU's best
team ever. They actually beat 2 final ranked teams, which I think is the only
BYU team to do that: BYU 11-1: #13 @AFA 10-2 and #17 @UCLA (7-4-1)
The BCS wan't created because BYU finished 5th that year. BYU fans are really
not this delusional to think differently, right? I've lived all over the
country and the only state that talks about BYU is the state of Utah. Please
cite your source where BYU was the difference that the BCS was created. Still
Still waiting on your source....
Of course Utah fans would want a crystal trophy over a BCS trophy but they also
would want a respected crystal trophy where you had to beat a few top 25 teams
to earn it. BYU backed into that trophy and we all know it! BYU beat 0, ZERO,
nada, nil top 25 teams in 83-84. Utah beat 4 top 25 teams, 2 in the top 10.
Utahs 2008 year is much more respected than 84. Truth hurts!
UtelogyAdmit it; wouldn't you prefer that Utah had actually won a
national championship, instead of trying to pretend a winning BCS bowl is
equivalent to winning a national championship.Legitimate national
champions have a Waterford Crystal Football trophy in their trophy case.Wannabe national champions can only wish that they had such a trophy.
@Utology(2nd try)I'll Admit it, I would prefer your
team to shut it whether they put up or not. We can both agree that the 2008
Utah team that surprised themselves by being undefeated by the end of the
season, then took both BYU and Alabama to the woodshed was much preferable to
the arrogant and ultimately embarrassing end to the Utah 2010 season.
"The BCS was created to have one bonafide champion without controversy. It
was started in 1998" And the BCS has done a great job of having a
bonafide NC without controversy right? Also note the year the BCS came into
play-- '98 one year removed from the 96-97 BYU cotton bowl champ team that ended
up ranked #5 and stirred up all the controversy because the Bowl alliance (front
runner to the BCS) locked BYU out of their elitist bowl party. That got
national attention and led to the BCS. To say that BYU had nothing to do with
it is to live in denial.'
The whole argument that the BCS was created because of BYU is absolutely
asinine! Wow! Seriously? Do you realize how insane you sound when you state such
falsehoods! The BCS was created to have one bonafide champion without
controversy. It was started in 1998. 1984 was a mere afterthought. Now its
ancient history. The delusion down south is so comical. Please, I beg you, back
up your claims with facts. Please find your source that the BCS created because
of BYU. Go! This ought to be good...
Uteology using selective qualifiers on history to legitimize his team again.
nunya | 6:36 p.m. Aug. 28, 2011Sacramento, CaUteology you are more
clueless then I thought....BYU forced rules to be changed in case a non bcs
school was ever ranked in the top 5 again or undefeated...YES, once again it was
BYU that fought for and caused it to change.-----------Cite your source. During the BCS era when was BYU ever ranked in
the BCS top 5 or undefeated at the end of the season? In 2001 Hawaii proved the
BCS was correct that BYU was not a BCS buster when Hawaii rolled all over BYU's
defense with 72 points.Here's my counter argument:"Back in 2004, there was no such thing as a non-AQ team even making it
into a BCS game. That all changed with Utah, the original BCS buster... Consider
Utah made it into the game before the BCS expanded to five games and changed its
rules to guarantee a spot to a non-AQ team that finished in the Top 12 of the
standings."-- ESPN | Ode to Utah, the original BCS buster (by
Competition was originally designed as a method of pushing each other to excel.
I think it is still valuable when thought of in that context. Unfortunately we
tend to think of it as a vicarious way of proving superiority. Sorry, I just
don't buy it.
I'm proud of the fact that BYU won so many conf. championships but to me that
wasn't the most important thing. To me how high the cougs ended up being ranked
was more important. To me how much national attention/respect/ exposure the
cougs got was more important than winning the WAC or the MTN. conf.
championship. Maybe that is why I can't see why so many ute gloat over belonging
to the PAC 12. What your record is or ends up being and what you end up being
ranked is more important to me. It shows how good you are compared to the rest
of the nations top football teams. You can be a member to any of these BCS AQ
conferences and not be one of the top teams in the country. To much is made
about being a member of a BCS conf. . What your winning percentage is and how
high you are ranked means more to me. Money wise a BCS game is important because
they get paid alot more but that's a different issue.BYU will get plenty of
money whether they play in a BCS Bowl game or not.
@Y Grad / Y DadAdmit it, wouldn't you prefer you team put up or shut
oh, ok, the '04 Texas A & M team that Utah beat 1st game eventually attained
a #20 ranking by the end of the season. They were 7-5 with a marquee win in OT
over Texas Tech. So a mediocre A & M team was the marquee win for the U 04
team. Sounds similar to the '84 BYU schedule that U fans are so quick to slam
in order to discredit BYU's '84 run. Hmm no hypocrisy there though. Right?
U 90, research man, research! BYU beat 3rd ranked Pitt in '84. Utah beat a
terrible Michigan team in '08, a lucky win at home over a good ranked TCU, and a
win over a demoralized ranked BYU team. Not exactly the pinnacle of college
schedules. So give it a rest. As for the '04 team, which team did they beat
that was ranked? research man, research.
what you U fans will never acknowledge, that is certainly true is, b4 there was
Boise, before there was TCU, before there was Utah, there was BYU. They were
the orginal cinderella that did it before any of these schools (ok except for
TCU's hayday in the 1940's or 50's). But BYU was the original BCS buster before
it was the BCS, when it was the Bowl alliance in 96-97. as for assistant to the
regional mgr 63's assertion that BYU could never get that type of talent. maybe
not, maybe so. Good thing football is more than just talent alone. it is
talent + coaching/scheme + character,maturity, and discipline. What BYU may
lack in raw talent, they make up for in these other categories which is why they
were are and will remain competitive.
Uteology you are more clueless then I thought....I'm never going to argue the
fact that BYU hasn't made it to the BCS game or that the utes, bsu, hawaii and
tcu did not deserve to be there, they earned it....BYU forced rules to be
changed in case a non bcs school was ever ranked in the top 5 again or
undefeated...YES, once again it was BYU that fought for and caused it to
change...utes and all others did and will forever benefit from what BYU did.
You sure are a smart one.
Let the quest begin. Bronco has a lot to look forward to because we are going
undefeated this year starting with Mississippi.
>In order for Utah to win a NC this year......the rest of the
Pac-12 would have to forfeit most of their games against Utah. There's a very
good chance that Utah will go 2-10 this year.
I bet the writers come up with these stories and especially the headlines to get
trolls to post. I guess no one is hurt in all of this and Deseret News makes
more money as the lemmings run off the cliff together.
Re rational, The game last night didn't come out as planned. Some
bad special teams issues bungled it up. I suppose you'd know all about it. Kind
of like that blocked kick the other blue and white team had lol.
re Rational, Just being rational here. Perfection means flawless. Not saying
that a NC wouldn't have been nice. Just saying, by definition the Utes did in
fact achieve the qUest for perfection. Nobody else in the country did that year.
This fact is supported by the Utes unblemished record that year. By definition
it was perfection.
The reference to a QUEST in the title makes me chuckle.Well played,
Jeff Call. Well played.BYU has been a very good football program
for decades. I hope they do well as an independent.I don't believe
the Big 12 will invite the Cougars. A big obstacle to that partnership is BYU's
refusal to compete on Sunday. Since the Big 12, and most other conferences,
play on Sunday, there are only a few leagues where the Cougars can truly
consider membership.I respect Coach Mendenhall. He is a solid coach
and sounds like an even better man. BYU should hope he coaches for a very long
time.Good luck, Cougars. Except on 17 SEP!
Not being affiliated with a conference, it's clear that BYU will/must measure
football success based solely on two things, their win/loss record and
end-of-year ranking. That being said, program success, measured by exposure for
the school and the church, is ongoing with the new TV deal with ESPN and the
freedom that comes with control of broadcasting and marketing your own brand.It seems Coach Mendenhall, Tom Holmoe, and the players are not shying
away from saying as much. The goal is, as stated, a national championship.
Putting the goal out there will draw criticism (see Bronco's prediction and the
Ute trolls fulfillment of said prediction). I think the the current
BYU coaches, players, and administrators are looking to the future in a way that
the majority of fans haven't grasped. BYU has a great tradition they leverage,
but that is past...just like the WAC and MWC are in the past.The
weeks and years ahead are exciting and full of promise. I'm thrilled Bronco
proclaims he wouldn't have it any other way. Go Cougars, beat Ole
Miss! Good luck Utes (except on Sept. 17th)Football is
". . . donkeys of themselves during warm-ups?"y grad:No, Utah doesn't do the Haka. That would be Daniel Sorenson's
"boys" down in Provo.
"Start in 1960 . . ."Blucoug:There you go
again. Maybe you can also convince BYU to officially abandon knowledge of the
cougies abysmal football record for nearly half a century.Take
heart, they 've done it before. Look up "The Forgotten Years".
When i went to univirtsity of utah in 2008, we did what byu want to do. We went
undefetead. BYU is so arogant and so is that Heaps boy. I is so happy that
they think they can win a nationel championship. it will only make the fall
that much harder when they fall. Utes are going to be the won suprising people
when we win the pac12 this year.
Nunya, BYU did not pave the way for Utah's invitation to BCS bowls. The Utes
accomplished that on their own by beating ranked teams in 2004 and 2008,
something the Cougs didn't do in 84.AltaFan, Thank you. Finally a
BYU fan admits the BCS was created because of 1984
Here is to the beginning of "Quest to be alone".Good luck
Ah, Utology, from your earliest post, please don't go there. You have been
too well spoken on behalf of the loyal opposition in the past to resort to
hyperbole. Future facts are not facts. BYU fans do not know how
good this team is, and you do not yet know how good this team is not. Your last
point is worthy of discussion, because to win an NC for one of the little guys
requires both perfection and all the cards to drop in the right place and right
time. History though it may be, BYU fans know about this. But
to your credit, at least you didn't make the comment about Utah
"quietly"'doing anything. Hopefully coach Whit had the discussion with
his players after the LV bowl that he should have had after the BYU
game. Admit it, wouldn't you prefer your team to announce
embarrassingly high goals to making donkeys of themselves during warm-ups?
It is rather annoying reading to the bitterness from the Ute posters who feel
that two big bowl wins make them the superior program. A national championship
is bigger than any individual bowl win, especially considering the recent BCS
trend of belittling any program that is not in the fold. BYU has
been to the Citrus, Holiday, Liberty, Fiesta, Freedom, Tangerine and other bowls
over the years. What made those bowls great is that the teams who were invited
to bowls were the best programs. Now there are too many bowls, with even BYU's
6-6 team going last year. Only one was of any relevance BECAUSE it was the bowl
that won the Cougars a championship. None of the rest matter because they like
the Utes Sugar and Fiesta bowls weren't important to the rest of college
football. Only one bowl matters, and that is the one where a champion is
crowned over all the sport. No individual bowl is better than a
@ JohnInSLCTry looking at modern day championships and there is no
comparison. Start in 1960 and count how many times the utes won an out right
championship. Hint: all you need is one hand, nothing goes beyond that.
Uncle Rico,You mean Jake Hypes? That's funny that the
title of this article included the word "quest".Here we go
I like Coach Bronco's approach. It will be interesting to see how they do as an
independent. I hope they do well, except on Spet 17th...Still, I'm
surprised to see how many folks out here think BYU would win a NC if they go
undefeated (no small task as it has only happened once in their storied
program). That is not the BCS precedence. If they think they can rise above what
TCU, Boise St. and Utah have done recently, I think they severely overrate their
schedule this year.A few inconsistencies I've noticed in a few of
the posts:1) Do we feed off the AP or the coaches poll, predominately? It
seems if you're going with AP--you can exclude Utah's coaches rank last year. If
you're going off the final coaches, you can say Utah finished "4th" in
2008, instead of #2 in the AP poll---which can award a split NC against the BCS.
Selective bias.2) If BYU has a double-digit win season it's considered a
great year. If Utah does it, it's "horrible"(see also 2010).3)
"Perfection" does not mean winning all of your games. Huh?Consistent inconsistency....nice.
I am so excited because now my friends who are BYU fans in Mexico can watch the
games!!!!! They are going to be so excited! Does Utah's fan base go that far
outside of Utah? I don't think so. It looks like good football has far reaching
effects while mediocre football reaches to, well, one person in Ann Harbor.
I am not even sure why we need to play the games this season. Lets just have
the NC victory parade now in Provo while the weather is still nice.
@JohnInSLC... thank you for writing what I was too lazy to rite. Well said and
oh so true!
Snack and swoop:Your spin is hilarious. By endless references to
1984 and denigrating Utah's conference championships in the 1920's, 30's, 40's,
50's and 60's, you are: (1) reluctantly admitting how truly awful BYU was, and
(2) refusing to realize that 1984 is also ancient history to the majority of
people alive today.On the other hand, if you want to truly compare
recent success, let's stick with the MWC era. In addition to top 5 final AP
rankings (oops, you don't have one, much less two), shall we compare Utah and
BYU's bowl records? How about wins against ranked opponents?Not as
successful as you thought, eh? Yes, the public dreams are
great--until the inevitable first early loss. Then the whole program, and its
fans, look just a tad bit foolish to the rest of the college football world. Is
that the message you are eager to spread? Seems like you'd want to actually beat
some ranked teams regularly and win three-fourths of your bowl games before
talking about your future national championships.
An undefeated season is impressive but not as impressive in a weak conference or
independent. I don't expect BYU or Utah getting a nc in the near future but I do
see my Utes back in a bcs game before the cougars. One loss with the weak
schedule and they are done. 2nd place in the PAC 12 can smell of Roses due to
the first place team playing in bcs championship game. Anyway, I
smell a blue t-shirt coming.
@nunyaSpeaking of handouts what did you do with your BCS share?Here we go again; taking credit for someone else accomplishments.
According to your own fans, see AltaHawkFan's post, BCS was created in part
because of BYU. Now your taking credit for breaking down the BCS by playing in
Vegas? Not only is Bronco dreaming so are some of the fans.@Riverton Cougar You can dream like your coach, but it is highly
unlikely that BYU will play for a NC if they go 10-2, 11-1, and 13-0 over the
next three season. Why?Because history shows us that it
is highly unlikely. TCU has proved how difficult it is: 2008 11-2 #7, 2009 12-1
#6, 13-0 2010 #2 (3 first place votes). The same TCU team that has lead the
nation in defense over the last three years. Sorry but even Bronco knows that
he doesn't have that kind of talent.Claiming that your
"competing for" national championship when your really "competing
for" is the Armed Forces Bowl is just wishful thinking. Now get into the
BIG 12 then you dream about a NC.
What else are they supposed to say now? "Well, we'll be happy with an 8-5
year, so long as we can go to the armed forces bowl." Without a
conference, the only thing lift is a NC. Shouldn't every coach be aiming for
that? Stick with the positive talk, just back it up on the field this
TruthI don't have to explain it to you, you already know.Thanks for the lesson on the 84 team that beat a 6-5 team and was gifted the
"nc". Never heard that one before.Oh and btw, Utah will
most definitely have the chance from here on out to play for a NC. This year
will be difficult at best but it IS possible.Get used to it
JohnInSLCNOBODY cares about leather helmet conference championships
won in conferences hardly any fans have ever heard of.The biggest
difference between Utah's leather helmet era championships and BYU's modern era
championships is BYU actually did something on a national scale during most of
those championship seasons -- representing the WAC/MWC in the bowl designated
for the conference champion and finishing in the Top 25 most years.Not a single one of Utah's 20 pre-WAC conference champions played in a bowl or
finished in the Top 25.Since LaVell became BYU's head coach in 1972,
BYU has won 26 of the last 39 head-to-head meetings, and 3 of the last 5.Utah fans are conflicted. They like to talk about "recent"
success and not living in the past, but the immediately revert to living in the
past when it comes to overall head-to-head in football and a history of success
in basketball.BYU, by the way, now leads the overall series in
basketball, and as far as recent succuss, BYU has dominated overall success
during the Dave Rose era.
I loved your comments, Nunya. Thank you.
Are all Cougar fans super uber sensitive? Wow! Being the 3rd best team in the
state must really sting!
Oh snack, more selective stats from you.Since 1922, when little
brother y decided to join its big brother playing football for real:All time conference championshipsUtah 24BYU 23Head-to-head record:Utah 57-34-4If The y was as consistent
as you claim, you wouldn't be stuck on 1984 when telling everybody how good your
NC UTES 2010 | 12:04 a.m. Nov. 2, 2010 "Well on our way to the
2010 national championship, as I predicted 2 months ago.TCU is good,
but we all know Utah gets up for and almost ALWAYS wins the close games (with
the ocassional blip against BYU as we painfully know).0% chance TCU
leaves Salt Lake with a win.It's happening - MARK IT DOWN - Utah is
the 2010 national champ."Of course "NC UTES 2010"
quickly disappeared into the night never to be heard from again in that
incarnation after Utah's 7-47 humiliation in the biggest game in Utah history.
utahcountyute"There is a difference in being "Never public
about goals" as you state and taking one game at a time until you reach
your goals. Utah has done this twice in the last 10 years."Done
what twice? Finish 6th in the final BCS standings with not even a prayer of
actually winning a national championship?By not stating their goals
publicly, they give themselves the luxury of crowing about whatever they
accomplish after the fact and pretending that was there goal all along.
Of course, BYU fans have never done what a certain Utah fan did last
utahcountyute,One great season every once in a while does not win
championships. Having a great season with a history of greatness will award
teams with the opportunity to play in the big game. BYU didn't win the national
championship in 1984 because of the 1984 season. They won it because of the
1982, 1983, and 1984 seasons. An undefeated BYU will most likely not play in
the NC game this year because of last year. However, with their history, a
great 2011 season (10-2 or better) along with a 11-1 season (or better) in 2012
will likely put an undefeated 2013 BYU team in the NC game for sure. Maybe a NC
game next year if they go undefeated this year and next year.Likewise, Utah wouldn't make the NC game this year, even if undefeated. Next
year is a possibility, but 2013 is more likely still.
It's great to dream. Kind of a downer though, when you are rudely
CougarindyThere is a difference in being "Never public about
goals" as you state and taking one game at a time until you reach your
goals. Utah has done this twice in the last 10 years. I would set
attainable goals at this point Bronco. Ole Miss might be a start.
mgr63....um, does the number indicate your age? Well, at least now I know why
you wrote what you did...your age definitely showed on that post. Lay down
before the nursing home employees catch you.
Hey Uteology....make no mistake about it my friend...but your sorry team along
with tcu, bsu and hawaii benefited from BYU changing the landscape of non bcs
teams getting the invite to play with the big boys. you're no different then
those people that feel entitled to that free government money...you know,
reaping the rewards from someone else's hard work and not even thanking them.
Hope your kids don't grow to have your same entitled attitude. As for your
team...BYU will change the college landscape again and you will again reap the
rewards...hope you learn how to say "thank you" by then. Then again,
that's like asking a free loader to go find a job.
I see the trolls are out in force on yet another BYU article. Didn't they
supposedly "move on" over a year ago? But, here they are, still
obsessing about an independent, non-AQ team, when they're supposedly one of the
"big boys" now. Once a little brother, always a little brother.Oh well.The era of BYU independence begins and the quest is
renewed.Let the weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth by the
kids on the hill begin.
howie, mgr, Uteology, et alKyle never made a big deal out of winning
conference championships, either.Result:Bronco - 2Kyle -
1Kyle never made a big deal out of being a consistent winner.Result - AP Top 25 Finishes:Bronco - 4Kyle - 2Kyle is the very definition of Utah football past, present and future:Lots of one-hit wonders like 1964, 1994, 2004 and 2008, but little
sustained success.Bronco is the very definition of BYU football
consistent excellence over the past half century:17 Top 25 Finishes
(both polls) (5 for Utah)23 conference championships (6 for Utah)15
national individual award winners (0 for Utah)6 national college football
hall of fame inductees (0 for Utah)1 Heisman Trophy winner (0 for Utah)1 National Championship (0 for Utah)
Good luck to Utah and BYU this year. As a fan of both, I would like to see a
knockdown, drag out fight come September 17th that we can all watch live on ESPN
HD! Then I want to see BYU run the table and head to the Fiesta bowl while the
Utes crush whoever comes from the Big 10(12) in the Rose bowl(except for
Nebraska since that is my team). What would be epic is to see the Cougars land
in the Big 12 in 2014 or 2015. Then we could see a Utah vs. BYU National
Championship game. The Holy War BCS National Championship Game, that would make
the SEC, Big East, and ACC cry their eyes out watching the boys from Utah battle
it out for the Beehive boot and the Sears Trophy. Dream good Utah, dream good.
Texas A&M is going to announce they are leaving the Big 12(9) anytime now.
So, if the Big 12 comes calling for the cougars, what do they do? They have made
promises and contracts with the WCC, with ESPN, and BYUtv. So do they stick it
out and chart an unknown, independent course, or do they take a huge opportunity
and play amongst the likes of Texas, Oklahoma, Texas Tech, Baylor, Missouri,
Kansas, Iowa State, and Kansas State. Maybe they could join the Big 12(9) in say
2014 or 1015 just to see how this independence thing works out. It looks like
there may be a lot of tough decisions for Holmoe and Mendenhall in the next few
I love Broncos remarks in this article. He's a great leader.One
thing for sure; Utah could never take such a bold step as independence. There
are only a handful of BCS teams that could.I do hope though that
this year BYU has no losses and Utah has one loss. I wish them both the very
Utah: Never public about goals, been to 2 BCS bowls, 0 national titles.BYU: sets high goals, 23 conference championships, 1 national title, massive
independent ESPN tv deal! Go Cougs!
UteologySome sit around saying it can't be done while others dream
big and go out and try to make those dreams come true. I'd much rather be in
the second group.
@Uteology,In all honesty, I don't think there has ever been a team
in BYU's history that could ever compete with the TCU, Utah, Boise St. squads
that went undefeated in this century. The talent at every position in
unattainable for BYU to recruit. Some of the games that BYU has on it's schedule
in the coming years are just simply not all winnable. They may win a couple if
another QB gets knocked out like the Oklahoma game in 2009, but not consistently
even for an entire season. Look at what a "so-so" FSU team did to BYU
the last two seasons........just destroyed them. So, unless BYU is able to get
solid defensive talent, and some key players at skill positions on offense, then
there really isn't much to discuss in my opinion. Their fans will love them all
the same and entertain us as always. It is only a game. Cheers!
I love you Bronco! It's off to war with Ol Miss!!!
Re: uteologyhahahahahahaha You don't think that BYU's National
Championship changed the college football landscape ? Why do you think the BCS
came about ?
"I would just as soon say it. There will be detractors everywhere that say
it's not possible. I'm not one of them. I think it is possible [national
championship]... what if we were able to accomplish this here? What would that
do to the national landscape?" -- Bronco While he's been
dreaming of a national championship, Utah, TCU, and Boise have been changing the
college football landscape. For details, see 2004-2011 seasons.The
fact is that this BYU team is not as half as good as lest years TCU team. The
same TCU players that were ranked #7, #6, and #2 over the last three years.
That team only got 3 first place votes in final AP rankings while going 13-0.
I love my Cougs too assistant to the regional Mgr63, I love 'em too.
. . . wow, it's late, where have my grammar skills gone? -- I love 'em *too
I love 'em to assistant to the regional mgr63, I love 'em to
BTW, hawk, how'd that Bingham game turn out?
Let's see, Hawk, Florida lost one game the 2008 season and they were the
national champs and the Utes went undefeated the same year and weren't national
champs, and you prefer the Utes' result? I'm pretty sure you are the only
@Dr Rose,The Ute trolls go to other papers that have decent articles
about Utah football. The best articles and posters on BYU is at the D News. I
love my cougs!
Quite inspiring article isn't it. Love Bronco's attitude about all of this. It
may not happen this year or next but if it happened once it very well could
happen again. That's what is great about BYU football.And then you
have another team and several of their fans proud about the fact that they can
actually lose games and still come out a 'winner' in their conference. We found
coat tails and we're hangin' on.Kind of diminishes the very purpose
of being a winner doesn't it?Give me a 'rimshot' on that drum
What'd I tell you about the trolls. Much more obsessed with BYU football than I
think I'll ever be. And that's saying a lot.
re deductive reasoning, Winning a NC with one loss like Flordia did a few short
years ago is not perfection. winning every game, that means having a flawless
win record, is actually perfection. Just a heads up.
I hope that all the players listen to Bronco about a NC. He knows how to win big
time! BYU 'glory" again! AWESOME!
National championship here we come! When they see us beat many teams 56-0 and go
undefeated this year......the BCS will recognize our storied football program,
massive fan base and surely grant us the opportunity to win it all AGAIN. Go
quest? uh oh. there goes that word again.
Since Howard was the one to bring it up, there is only one team in the state
with a National Championship. Go ahead and place as many qualifiers and 'yeah
buts' as you want. It was, is and will always be an NC. Then U fan rebuttal is
'but we've been to 2 BCS games this decade. Here is a fact: History, whether
recent or not so recent is still history. So if U fan bags on Y fan for 'living
in 1984' U fan is still living in the past him/herself . . . just a more
recent past. Truth is You're team isn't any better than 'TDS' (weakest moniker
ever) and you know it. And whether you'll admit it or not, I think you know
you're going to lose this year.
Uncle Rico Be afraid; be VERY afraid. Because it's going to get
really ugly for Utah State in Provo this year. Bronco won't even be inclined to
call off the dogs.
Howard S."National Championship? I say bring it on. Just like
2008 when BYU boldly set its goal as the Quest for Perfection... And Utah
quietly achieved it."Sorry to burst your bubble, but finishing
4th in the Coaches poll, the official BCS final poll, isn't
"perfection".Perfection ends with a national championship;
anything less is, well....less.It's interesting how low
Utah sets it's goals... back into a PAC 12 championship game by finishing 2nd in
the PAC 12 behind USC and then hope to get lucky again like the Utes did in 2008
to make it to a BCS game.That may get you to a BCS game, just as in
2008, but it'll never get you a national championship.Instead of
mocking your big brother for setting his goal on winning another national
championship, you should be taking lessons from him on how to actually win a
national championship -- see 1979 to 1984.
USU was a blind squirrel finding a nut last year. Happens every seventeen years
or so. They'll get destroyed this year. It surprises me that Aggie fan is
every bit as delusional as Ute fan, but with even less reason to be so.
I love the fact that national media are not just speculating whether or not BYU
will get an invite to the Big12, but whether or not they would accept it if they
did. What other non-AQ in the country has a setup wherein that is a reasonable
debate? I am not sure what we should do should said Big12 invite come. I see
pros and cons either way. But I think its awesome that my friends in Big12
country honestly wonder whether BYU would deign to join their mighty BCS
I will always be glad to have a team with these goals. Every team in the country
has that as an ultimate goal.I learned on my mission that there is a
difference between "setting goals and making plans" and "making
plans and setting goals". If you set your goals first and work towards
them you instill the drive to be your best in everything you do. It changes the
way you plan, the way you work, the things you do and the reasons you do them.
If you first see what your plans are, and then set goals based on
what you think you can accomplish you are inherently limiting yourself. Your
entire mindset is different because you are acting on what you are rather than
what you hope to be. Regardless of whether or not you achieve those
goals, you are a better person for setting them and striving for them. But I
also hope we can achieve this particular goal :)Go Cougars!
Everyone needs to fear BYU big time this year.We got Jake Heaps. He is
the best QB in NCAA history to lose to USU.
I love the new misplaced cockiness by overzealous U fans and their Pac 12
delusions of grandeur. It'll make their whupping on 9/17 so much sweeter. keep
building that noose Howard, one comment at a time.
@HowieIn order for Utah to win a NC this year, they would need to beat
BYU. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but that isn't going to happen. Good
luck in your other 11 games though and thanks for keeping up on the Cougs.This team has a ton of potential, but they are young and inexperienced.
If they can execute well, they will have a special season.Kick off
is less than a week away. I can't wait. Go Cougs!
Howard S. | 9:31 p.m. Aug. 27, 2011 Taylorsville, UT National
Championship?I say bring it on.Just like 2008 when BYU
boldly set its goal as the Quest for Perfection...And Utah quietly
achieved it.Could BYU be setting the stage for a Utah NC?I like the precident. Utah and National Championship? when has
that ever shown up in the same sentence? I guess you can always dream about utah
winning one LOL.
National Championship?I say bring it on.Just like 2008
when BYU boldly set its goal as the Quest for Perfection...And Utah
quietly achieved it.Could BYU be setting the stage for a Utah NC?I like the precident.
Get ready. Here come the trolls.