Comments about ‘Poll: Great teachers born that way, not taught’

I've got to agree with this one. Although you can improve your teaching ability, some people just have a talent for it. I hated my education core classes at college, but loved the real classes, such as calculus, world history, etc,... I pretty much ignored the stuff I learned in my education classes, not that there was much to even use from them. I remember having to write detailed lessons plans. What a waste of time. Teachers should be made to take classes in the subject areas they are going to teach and have experiences in the classroom. Elementary teachers should be required to have an equal amount of english and math courses. Real courses, not the fluff classes I had to take. One class was on the importance of reading. Duh. We'd great better prepared teachers intellectually and mentally if we required them to take real classes.

My son is studying to be a secondary math teacher. He has many education classes he has to take. What this means is he will have less general ed classes, i.e. history, economics, philosophy etc.

I'm thinking he would get a better education if he could just major in math and during the course of this take a 1 semester course on teaching.

If this were allowed he would get a better math education too.

Why are American schools falling behind? Part of the reason is they have a culture of excessive pride and not listening to parents or paying attention to reality.

For years parents begged to teach their children phonics i.e. learning how to sound out the letters again to help children read. This was a tool used historically, but some education "expert" declared this method wasn't useful so for a period of many years American schools largely abandoned phonics. It took years of low reading test scores and parents begging to get phonics back into the curriculum

Dotto for teaching students to do arithmetic by hand.

Might I suggest that the public and the education community view each other as partners and even friends.

Might I suggest that teachers be treated like the professionals most of them are and that they all ought to be. Why do we pay our teachers so low? Do we need monster houses or would we be better off paying teachers who have talent very well so they don't need to work part time?

The public needs to improve, the mindset of the education community needs to improve, both need to repent.

Americas education is failing because parents make excuses for their children. I taught in a Chinese school that had large numbers of students, some teachers were not qualified to teach, they used outdated books, and it was really hot in the summer. (Same conditions found in Utah). These students excelled because THEY WORKED HARD! They knew if they didn't pass tests THEY would bring shame on their family. It didn't fly with their parents that "they had a bad teacher" or the "teacher didn't teach they way they learn best". Parents didn't send notes excusing their kids from a test or asking an extension for homework because of a family vacation, being sick, etc. It was expected that the students were responsible for their own education. They got what they put into it. It would serve American students and parents well to learn the same lesson.
That said I do think some teachers have more natural ability to teach. American society uses teachers as scapegoat for society's ills while compensating them with low pay, thus qualified and gifted individuals shy away from the profession.
After paying for day care and taxes its not worth it for me to teach.

Michael Jordan had natural talent but it still took a tremendous amount of work and training to be as good as he was. Mozart was the same way. Hard work is a huge part of anyone becoming good at what they do. Why would teachers be different? There might be some people who are socially more prone to be good at talking in front of others but it still takes a lot of work to become really good at it. Great public speakers spend a lot of time practicing their craft, so do actors. Logic would then suggest that the best teachers are the ones who work the hardest at becoming better. I have seen my oldest child have a first year teacher and then my third child have the same teacher six years later- the difference in her quality of teaching was amazing. She has clearly worked hard and learned from her mistakes. Experience and effort are a huge part of teaching- like everything else in life.

"I'm thinking he would get a better education if he could just major in math and during the course of this take a 1 semester course on teaching. If this were allowed he would get a better math education too."

Being a math teacher is *NOT* the same as being a mathematician. Being a teacher is more about the pedagogical skill than the math skill.

This belief that teachers are born, not taught, is one of the reasons why so many unqualified people think they can teach their kids instead of leaving that job to professionals.

There is no doubt in my mind after having experience as a student at all levels, a neighbor and friend of good teachers, and a parent of a fantastic teacher - great teachers come only from talent, training, effort and experience. It takes all four. I wish our society could figure out a way to properly compensate our great teachers, rather than give them reasons to move to other occupations where their talents and skills earn more respect and better financial rewards!

It's becoming more difficult for a natural great teacher to teach. Teachers are more micro-managed than ever. Teaching test strategies with curriculum requiring teachers to be all on the same page is very restrictive. Cooperative philosophies has not always worked well.

re junkgeek | 11:33 a.m. Aug. 27, 2011
Agua Dulce, TX

Being a math teacher is not the same as being a mathematician.
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Agreed, but education classes do little to teach how to teach effectively. That comes from experience. There are plenty of excellent teachers who have never had an education class, i.e. teachers at church, teachers in industry etc. Teachers in the military etc.

We have a lady who lives in our home from China, she is here on a visa to teach Chinese in our schools. She is in an instructor in English in China.

Are you aware that in China, if you want to be a math teacher, you major in math then take one class in teaching methods? If you want to teach history likewise. Given that foreigners are cleaning our clock, perhaps we need to keep an open mind.

Yup, in my own training and classroom experience I'll echo my education courses were a waste of time and I got a masters in physics following graduation because I felt I didn't know physics well enough to teach it yet. After that I taught: some people are naturally gifted but hard work really is what makes a difference, not talent. I've seen terrible teachers become great over the course of years.
America's system is all backwards: not only are parents holding their kids accountable for their performance in school, our teachers are, on average, coming from the bottom 1/3 of college graduates. With some exceptions, but in general you have to either love it to take that sort of pay, or not be good enough to do something more lucrative. In Japan, teachers are INVITED to teach only if they are in the top 10 % of their class. What a difference.

Where I went to school (East Coast) the parents and the school both had high expectations for student performance and 98% of my class went to college, and most of those to very good universities, several Ivy Leaguers. And many with scholarships.

There have been some excellent comments on this post. I especially liked InMyOpinion88 and Worf's comments. This micro-managing of the curriculum is oppressive and useless. Few good teachers even look at the Core Concept booklets they are given. They don't need to.

38 years of teaching have taught me many things: my education classes did not help me teach better, but gave me a background of what had been done historically; some teachers are naturally gifted, but still need to be trained in the best methods; a higher degree does not necessarily mean better teaching will be evident in the classroom, although the pay raise is nice; and finally, regimented control from the powers-that-be is demoralizing and ineffective.

What is most important? You need to know and love your subject and have enthusiasm for it, and most importantly, you need to love/care about your students. Best practices will then enhance your skills to maximize your impact on these young impressionable minds.

Having said that, if a student doesn't want to learn, there is little to be done, even by the best teacher.

A combination of factors make a good, solid teacher, but natural talent must be present for true greatness in any endeavor, not just teaching. A great teacher has a knack for taking challenging, difficult material, considering the students in the class, and, sometimes through trial and error, coming up with the best ways for those students to "get" that material. At times, the highly-touted research-based methods just don't work on some kids. A great teacher will tirelessly try different approaches and, if necessary, buck the system to do his/her best to reach those kids.

Well if you really think so then stop making rules and exectations for teachers to follow. After all, if they weren't born with the ability they would never be able to meet expectations right?

People are just born with the ability to drive a car or fly an airplane as well right? No need for flight school.....

Our schools are not "falling behind" or "failing".

Stop believing the hype. The kids that are putting forth the effort are getting the best education ever available in the USA.

The only thing we are falling behind and failing in is our parenting skills.

Although we are doing a great job of complaining.

I do believe that great teachers are born with a talent that helps them do a better job than others. My education classes didn't do much to make be a great teacher although they did open my eyes to the education system in America.

Sadly, no matter how much training some teachers get, they just don't have the talent to deal with young people. They love their subject matter and usually did well in college but that doesn't make a good teacher. In fact most of my college professors were some of the WORST teachers I ever had. There were a few exceptions to that but just knowing the subject matter is about half of what it takes to be a good teacher.

Unfortunately there is little motivation to become a teacher anymore. We are belittled by the press, legislature, and talk radio. It makes no sense. I am in it to help your children. Wouldn't you think you would want me on your side?

As a teacher and a coach I thought I possessed some natural gifts to communicate what I knew to others plus a love for young people. However, I learned a lot of things through the years how to coach and teach better. Anybody who thinks they know everything and can rely on natural talent won't progress. The analogy in a prior post of Michael Jordan is a good one. Also, actual research shows that teachers reach their peak in years 8-15. And actual research shows that teachers that had educational training did better than teachers who got special exemptions to teach without the formal training. That means having a gift or talent along with enthusiasm is NOT enough. It takes experience and learning a few things. As a veteran teacher I am learning valuable things about using technology that are making me a better teacher plus some things to help ELL students. Again, when you think you know enough, that's a dangerous mindset.

I, too, take exception to the widely parroted misconception of American education. Our schools are NOT failing. Most do a good, and frequently a great, job with what they are given. And Utah does better than most, in spite of the lowest per-pupil funding in the nation. Kudos to them!

The widely published statistics that show American scores lower than those of other nations are trying to match apples with oranges. Most European nations "weed out" low academic performers by age 14 and shunt them off to vocational schools. What rests behind are "crème de la crème," those who have succeeded very well academically. America doesn't do that.

Back to teachers: in sports, some are born with natural talent. Others have a strong desire to do well and a great work ethic. Both can do well. But when you find someone with both those traits in one body, you have a superior athlete. It's the same with teachers. Even those with less natural talent can do very well with desire and the right training.

A student who wants to learn will do well with either one.

Polls???

How about actual research on the subject?

You could do a poll and find out that Lady Gaga is more "talented" than Paul McCartney as a musician. Well, opinions are opinions and everyone can have one, but I bet research would show that teaching probably takes some natural talent, some good training and just plain hard work like being good in any profession would take.

In most countries where students do much better than ours, the average school year is longer. For those that increase the school year by 10 days, that's 190 days in 13 years of public school grades k-12. That's an extra year of study in the years of school. That makes a difference if that extra time is well used.