sammyg,The Dnews article over the weekend said Doman is still adding
things and changing plays. No check.One season doesn't make players
veterans, especially when that season was barely a winning one. No check.10-3 is always better than 7-6 and who did we play in that bowl game?
Oh, that's right, a team that was in the National Title picture most of the
season.No depth at QB. Yeah, that's what I said. Name your back
ups behind Nelson and tell me how much experience they have. And if you
consider Nelson a solid backup after last season, I feel sorry for you. No
checkFamiliar faces, but not in familiar places. Virtually the
entire offensive coaching staff has new positions and at least one of them has
never coached before. Proving themselves? That comes in the games, not in
practice. No check.Like I said, plenty of problems in Provo.
Including the fact that the fans, coaches and the Dnews don't want to
acknowledge the problems. I sure hope the coaches are privately seeing them and
working on them.
scenic view,A couple of corrections to your comments:QB's - Jake Heaps is learning a totally new offense. It took him over half
the season last year to get a handle on the old offense. We'll see how he
does.Jordan Wynn's shoulder shows no sign of weakness at this point
and the coaches are very confident that he knows the offense well enough to
thrive. Unless you have an inside source of information not available to the
rest of us, you're just making stuff up.O-line - You've got one top
ten lineman, that doesn't make your whole line top ten.We've got an
All-American and Outland Trophy candidate as well. We may not have deep
experience, but we have deep talent.RB's - We shut down your RB's
last year and you have the same guys coming back. They don't scare me.
Ducky,***Yes Utah leads head to head but of course none of that
occured in any of our lifetimes, for as long as we have been alive BYU has a
huge lead head to head.*** Yes, I know that 6 of the last 10 and 11
of the last 20 isn't in your life time, because you died 20 years ago? In the
last 20 years, Utah has been the better team. (most college kids aren't more
than 20)***BYU is much more of a national brand, has many, many,
many more nationally recognized accomplishments, is much more recognized
nationally, simply put BYU's last 40 years eclipses anything Utah has done in
the last 120 years.***By accomplishments do you mean that the media
voted for you and gave you a prize? If winning a popularity contest gives you
warm fuzzies in your heart, then I'm glad for you. But it doesn't mean that BYU
is better. Aside from the beauty pageant prizes, BYU has NOTHING on Utah.
typo.... Wynns near injury!
momo uteBYU's problems? New offense, no depth at QB, total redo of
offensive coaching staff, last years 7-6 record....Do you need me to go on? New offense... went over these things in early spring with QB...
checkUtes going thru same thing... uh, QB playing catch up and
nursing an injury... Chow nursing a near heart attack from last week's blown
paly and Heaps near injury... hope that works for you7-6 record...
recovered and won it's meager bowl game. Youngsters are now veterans....
check10-3 Utes... lost their bowl game, lost to all formidable
opponents on national tv and almost to a 7-6 team by the skin of their teeth...
other games were squeekers too.... hope that works for youNo depth
at QB... you kidding? What a lame comment and you know it... checkredo of coaching staff...BYU has familiar faces at staff... all
doing ok and will prove themselves quite well... checkChow as a Ute,
he'll last as long as your QB does. If Wynn goes down he takes Chow along with
him on the 'Life Flight'Compared to the Utes... Cougars have ZERO
Mormon UteThere are four huge differences between BYU's offense and
Utah's offense for 2011:Quarterback - both are learning new
offensesBYU has one of the best young quarterbacks in the country,
schooled in the fundamentals since he was a youngster, with a rifle arm, who's
spent the last 6 months learning BYU's offense and developing timing with his
receivers on the field.Utah has a wounded quarterback, whose
shoulder may or may not hold up for an entire season, with limited arm strength,
serious problems with confidence in himself and from his teammates, and
everything he knows about the offense and his receivers he's learned in the film
room or from the side lines.----------------Offensive
LineBYU has one of the Top 10 offensive lines in the country with
great depth.Utah has an average offensive line at best with
virtually no depth.----------------Running BackBYU is loaded with talented and experienced running backs.Utah has
talent, but absolutely no experience; in fact one of Utah's top running backs is
a rugby player who is just learning the game of football.----------------ReceiversBYU is loaded with talented
and experienced receivers.Utah has some talent, but virtually no
Duckhunter,The following is quoted from a Dnews article titled,
"Brandon Doman shows of a new, dynamic offense." "...Elements taken from Sid Luckman and Doug Scovil; formations used by
Bill Walsh, and a strong tinge of LaVell Edwards in the days he hired a daring
and creative Dewey Warren just after the Vietnam War.What we saw
Saturday was a multi-dimensional West Coast offense designed to make a defense
cover the entire field on every play. And not be predictable.New
offensive coordinator Brandon Doman wants to run an offense that will keep
defenses guessing, off-balance and on their collective heels.Every
offense would like to do just that, of course. But that wasn't exactly BYU the
past five seasons.Doman likes what Boise State does and doesn't mind
plagiarizing."Wow, that sure sounds like a new offensive scheme
to me.It's a big jump from QB coach to coordinator and Doman was
hired to change the offense, because of last season's struggles. Who is in
denial??Sure, BYU improved last season, but still lost to the team
you can't stop criticizing and now your players are learning a new offense. Did
I say anything that isn't true?
Duckhunter,Riley Nelson failed miserably last year and can hardly be
considered a capable backup to Jake Heaps. Yes, he played a whole season before
his mission, but where was that? USU? Wow, that's a powerful offense to be in
charge of. If he had stayed at USU, he might still be the starter. LOL Can
you name the active QB's on the roster behind Nelson who have done anything to
prove themselves in D1 play? C'mon, back up your bravado.
@mormon uteYou are almost unhinged over this and that tells me that
you have some serious concern, I'd say you'rr scared to death frankly, that utah
is in for a very mediocre season. It's ok, you're not alone in those fears nor
are you alone in your denial of it. Then there is the small fact
that you keep posting less than truthful stuff.1st of all BYU is not
running a new scheme as you claim. Doman is certainly tayloing the offense to
his philosophy but BYU is still running a west coast pro style offense.utah is completely changing their scheme, to the BYU offense actually, and has
a completely new coordinator doing it. Maybe you didn't notice that Doman has
been on the BYU staff for several years and coached the qb's? Then
of course BYU fans can see a definate improvement and a strong finish last year.
utah "fans" can see a near complete collapse followed by the loss of
half the roster. I know reality is somehow hard to deal with but it
is still reality anyway.
@mormon ute"BYU's problems...no depth at QB"Bwahhahhaahhaaaaa......Please stop humiliating yourself with
comments like that. Just because a BYU poster tells some truth about utah on
here doesn't mean you should go off and post ridiculous stuff to try and get
some "revenge". That was a really ridiculous thing to say considering
BYU has three top 20 prep qb recruits on their current roster, including the #1
overall, plus another qb (Nelson) that has the equivalent of an entire season of
starting between his freshman year at usu and last year at BYU.LOL!
@classlessBYU did field a team for a couple of years in the 1890's
and then did not have one for almost 30 years until they started playing in the
1920's. Since utah played all of those years BYU didn't it stands to reason they
would have more over all wins with that 30 year head start.As to
your other stats, well they are pretty close actually. Yes utah leads head to
head but of course none of that occured in any of our lifetimes, for as long as
we have been alive BYU has a huge lead head to head. You can claim
anything you want to claim, I don't really care, the truth is BYU is much more
of a national brand, has many, many, many more nationally recognized
accomplishments, is much more recognized nationally, simply put BYU's last 40
years eclipses anything utah has done in the last 120 years. utah
has 2 bowl wins that they hang their hats on. Those were nice accomplishments,
I've never denied it, but it hasn't all of a sudden elevated them to national
prominence despite your attempts to convince us they have been.Just
MichiganCoog,So a new offensive scheme at Utah is somehow a bad
thing, but at BYU it's a good thing? I guess the way your offense performed
last year that is true, but your team is going to have just as hard a time
learning then new scheme as our guys and from what the papers are saying Doman
has added a bunch of new stuff since spring so they are still learning. At
least we have some new players coming in who don't have to unlearn the previous
scheme.Crash and burn, huh? What do you call a 7-6 record? Against
stiff competition on the road? You lost to Nevada and Florida State AT HOME.
I'll give you the fact that Air Force, Utah Statem TCU and Utah were hostile
environments and a couple of those were stiff competition, but Utah State???
So, you are counting Utah as stiff competition...? I'll go along with that.
Funny how your team can lose to TCU 31-3, but when the Utes lose to that same
team it is a disgrace. Not sure how you work that out in your mind. I'll take
10-3 over 7-6 any day.
sammyg,BYU's problems? New offense, no depth at QB, total redo of
offensive coaching staff, last years 7-6 record....Do you need me to go on?
Duckhunter,***You see utah has been playing football for about 30
years longer than BYU has***The question could be asked, when did
BYU start? Is it 1862 when the school was first started, 1875 as claimed by the
school, (when the school was purchased), or 1903? Don't most
learning institutions claim their sports history before they became a
"University", like Boise St, UNLV, Oregon St, ect. Therefore, I'm not
sure why BYU doesn't claim that they had a football program in 1896. According
to BYU, the institution started in 1875. BYA fielded a team in 1896. BYU may
have taken a hiatus from fielding a team for ~20 years, but they had a team in
1896 and for a couple of years after. I know that Utah didn't play 30 years
before 1896. So, why are you discounting this?The all time win stat
might not be a fair measure. Yet it proves that Utah does have a longer, better
history. I noticed you couldn't downplay any of my other facts stating that Utah
is the best team. Besides, "best team" really is a matter of opinion.
IMHO, and factually, Utah is historically better.Go Utes!!!
Ufan,***We have have two backups who were given starters' reps all
spring, and both looked horrible.***We only have 1 backup that
looked horrible in Spring. The other changed position. We have a new back up
named Jon Hays. He is looking much better than the other 2 did.
Mormonute,BYU doesn't have many problems to be concerned about this
year, because they weathered those problems last year, against very stiff
competition on the road, in hostile environments. Utah is about to go thru some
major problems, because lack of experience, last year's crash and burn ending,
with replacement players with little to no experience whatsoever replacing those
"crash-and-burn" veterans that looked so good against TCU, Notre Dame,
and Boise State...even BYU (who lost by a bad call, and just plain bad freshman
luck), will not make those same mistakes this year.Utah will, and
you'll see it when they finish no better than 6-6. Granted, if J. Wynn can last
the entire year without a scratch, 7-5 or 8-4 might even be possible. Don't
count on it though, cause he's fragile and will most likely go down to some form
of injury due to his lanky frame...especially during the grind of the PAC10.2
vs. the pushover MWC that he fattened up on the last 2 years...I
guess we'll all see...
@ mormomute"... more concerned about this issue than they are
their own problems..."And what problems are the Cougars
having??? Definitely not QBs, recruiting, or TV coverage.I'm
genuinely concerned like other fans. We don't need scores like 7-47, 3-28, and
3-26. At least if it happens this year it won't likely happen on national tv.
@ altahawks ducky michiganCoog sammyg All I can say about bringing
in a JC QB is one thing Cam Newton Just go back to your cougar
articles and play there.
@mormon uteWell you might have a point if the pac10 network was
currently available nationwide. It isn't. It is available on a few cable
systems, no sattelite systems, and has large holes in its coverage. When it is
actually available nationwide, and before next season, then I will honor my
promise. Until then you keep making up truths and pretending it is other people
that are being dishonest. How pathetic is that.
Duckhunter,We have the quote, you didn't say next season you said
next year. Just looking at my calendar that would be 2012. Your credibility
continues to sink with every comment you make on Ute articles.
It's so funny to see all the BYU fans more concerned about this issue than they
are their own problems and the Dnews is on the same band wagon. While the Dnews
and BYU fans have made such a big deal of Utah having a new offensive scheme
with Coach Chow and how much of a challenge it is for the players to learn, they
turn around and try to put a positive spin on the same situation at BYU. If a
new offensive scheme and inexperienced back up QB's is a problem for Utah (a
team the went 10-3 last season) shouldn't those issues be of even greater
concern for BYU (a team that went 7-6 last season)?
Somehow I knew Duckhunter wouldn't honor his commitment to stay off the Utah
articles.Shall we look at BYU's back up situation? Riley Nelson
certainly didn't pan out as a starter and his previous school was Utah State.
Duckhunter,Actually there were I believe 16 people in the AP that
voted the UTES # 1. Whit was the only one that voted them number 1 in the
BCS/Coaches Poll, because the rules for the vote with the coaches poll/BCS has
to vote the winner of the BCS title game as # 1. Who knows if other coaches
would have voted them # 1 had that rule not been in place. Just like the little
Y 84, the UTES were the only undefeated team in the nation that year. Except in
84, the BCS & the rule for coaches voting had not been set in place, &
the Y won the NCG. I cannot take that away from them, & it is a great
accopmlishment. UTE fans would love to have a title in football. In 2003 Elliot
went down, Alex Smith had played 5 plays in his life, & he did very well I
think. Same with when BJ went down. Ratliff came in, beat the Y his first game,
then crushed 24th ranked Georgia Tech in the bowl game. We wont know how good or
bad a backup will be until they get into a game. Go UTES!
Both Utah and Byu need to make sure they win both their first two games before
they meet up on the 17th. If they both come in 0 and 2, then all this preseason
excitement would be out the window. I think it's time for fans on both sides to
root for each other and stop this silly bantering back and forth as to who's
better until the two meet on the field every year from now on. I would love to
see Utah win out at the Pac every year and then loose only to Byu and I'm sure
the Utes would love that too for Byu and then loose only to Utah. That would be
so awesome for the state of Utah football.
The problem with lack of depth, especially at QB, is the time it takes to get up
to speed. PAC-12 ball is going to be a lot quicker and more intense than what
the backups are used to, and even if they get up to par fast (3-4 weeks), it'll
ruin the season (see Oklahoma and Sam Bradford).
@thleteutah wasn't the "best team in the nation" in 2008
by anyones estimation other than some utah "fans" like yourself. No
one voted them #1 other than whittingham.But of course chow was
being evasive. He basicly made a comment that is meaningless and applies to
everyone while purposely avoiding the real issue of the backups not being any
good. Also the utes aren't putting a premium on protecting wynn because he is so
great, they are putting a premium on protecting him because they litterally
don't have anything else. That doesn't mean he is all that great either just
that he is all they've got.
The better your QB is, the more concerned you are about protecting him. Whitt
calls protecting Wynn "job 1" not only because the backups aren't as
good, but because Wynn is THAT good. Don't you think that Stanford has the same
concern with Luck? Had Brian Johnson gone down, there's little doubt 2008 Utes
would not have been the best team in the nation. Look what happened at OU when
Bradford went down in the first game of 2009, it's just rarely a good thing to
lose your starting QB in college ball. So I think Chow is accurate in
deflecting the question that Utah's worries are not unique.
Oh by the way Troy Hinds just committed to BYU. LOL!
@classless"512 better than 627 (all time wins)"I always like it when you post this little peice of misleading info, which
you've done many, many times. You see utah has been playing football for about
30 years longer than BYU has, utah started in the 1890's whereas BYU didn't
start until the 1920's. But don't let actual facts get in the way of you trying
to make a misleading point.LOL!
Duckhunter,So let it be written, so let it be done. Your comment
and promise is duly noted in the file.
@SwoopI went to a bunch of spring practices and the red & white
game. While none of Utah's backup QB's are as good as Jordan Wynn, none of them
would lose to Utah State by 15 either.2nd-string Utah QB
>>> Riley Nelson
@wileyIf, and when, the pac10 network is actually available
nationwide I will keep my promise. It is not now. It is only available on a few
cable networks and is nowhere close to "nationwide" at this point.
There are massive holes in its footprint. Remember it has to be done before the
next season starts. If I was you I wouldn't bet on that.
"A backup with no experience is still better than a backup named Riley
Nelson."You obviously didn't watch any of Utah's spring
A backup with no experience is still better than a backup named Riley Nelson.
Anyone remember 31-16 Utah State?
So if Wynn flops and the backup quarterbacks struggle, you can always turn to
your experienced running backs!Seriously guys, I don't know how
anyone can feel confident going into this season. I am afraid that Utah's
performance on the field very well could show PAC-10.2 to be accurate.
Kam Ute: that was Brett Elliott who went down in the Texas A&M game, he
left the program the following year. Ratliff came in when Brian Johnson was
injured near the end of the game against New Mexico and then, in his first
start, led Utah to a road win against BYU and then an Emarald Bowl victory over
Georgia Tech. I think this is an example of experience not being an issue. Any
team that has a big separation between the starter and the back up has concerns
about injury. Sometimes the back up picks up the ball and rolls with, sometimes
they don't.I am sure USC, Stanford, Oregon, ASU, UA all have similar
concerns if their starter goes down.
I don't like how Coach Chow is minimizing Utah's backup QB situation. Yes, most
programs don't have experienced backups, but the problem for Utah goes much
deeper. We have an injury-prone junior QB who's never played an entire season
and missed all of spring practice after surgery on his throwing shoulder. We
have have two backups who were given starters' reps all spring, and both looked
horrible. If Wynn goes down, we're in serious trouble at QB.
Ducky, you are dead on and it's hilarious to see several of these Ute fans just
brush this so called 'non-issue' off, all because Coach Chow says it's
normal.We all know that Chow and company about had a heart attack
when Wynn went down last week. Heck, they will probably have "Life Flight'
helicopters on standby for something like this in the future. Wynn goes down,
start the helicopters for Chow and several fans.The Spring Red /
White game revealed the weakness at the position and last week's collision
exposed again the precipitious position the Utes are in. Sure Chow
is right about the backup experience equation but simply excusing the current
situation as something as normal and acceptable does not make it go away for the
Utes. Wynn is 10x the QB over Shreeve and everyone will be having a
cow if something happens to Wynn. Watching every game with the fear of knowing
your one and only good QB is all that you got brings a certain 'cliff hanger'
element to each game.Really puts the pressure on the O line to do
something outstanding everytime. We shall see.I'm not worried about
I guarantee you Utah is concerned about the quarterback position. First of all
Wynn is a concern. Only time will tell but he HAS to perform. And if he goes
down then all bets are off.
Good ol' norm telling half-truths again. He is correct that most college teams
don't have backup QB's with experience. What he's not telling you though is
that nearly all college teams have QB backups with more than 5 min in the
program. Most college team's backup QB at least knows the name of his offensive
linemen and the plays he's supposed to run.Be afraid ute fans. If
wynn goes down, your already pathetic offense will grind to a halt completely.
MichiganCoog,***You are dead on about Wynn's backups...go no further
than that 7-0 nail-biter in the Utes spring game, as evidence to show how ugly
things could get.***You see, that would only be accurate if both of
the backups were actually in the Spring game. Jon Hays just joined Utah for Fall
Camp.***and return less experience than what they ended the season
with is just plain scary...***Didn't Ducky just say that experience
isn't that big of a deal? So, you agreed with him and then now you don't? I
don't get it.***Good thing I cheer for the best team in the State of
Utah (TDS)***Yep, 7-6 is better than 10-3 (last year's record), 512
better than 627 (all time wins), 56% TDS is better than 58% Utah (all time win
%), and 34 better than 54 (head to head). Logic dictates that I cheer for the
best team in the State of Utah, Utah!!! P.S. Thank you for your
interest. I know that I'm sure excited to see them play in PAC12 games this
year. Go Utes!!!
Rock of the Marne, Wiley Old School:A whole post dedicated to a
"mid-maajor troll"?I thought you were BCS Rock.Maybe you can move past the duckhunter?===Many back-up QB's
have replaced a starter and done well. The key is to keep Wynn safe and prepare
the best with the personnel that you have. I'm sure Chow is on top of it. That
is why they pay him the $$$.I'll personally scratch this off my list
of things to worry about.
Good points Duckhunter. You are dead on about Wynn's backups...go no further
than that 7-0 nail-biter in the Utes spring game, as evidence to show how ugly
things could get. As fragile as J. Wynn is, I'd be dang scared if I were a Ute
fan right now...they are 1 hit away from a complete disaster for their inaguraly
PAC10.2 season. Yes, the Utes could actually be pretty good this
year, especially on defense, but offense? Based on how they crashed and burned
at the end of last season, and return less experience than what they ended the
season with is just plain scary...Good thing I cheer for the best
team in the State of Utah (TDS) that has plenty to be excited for the coming
season ahead, and for years to come. Go Cougs!
Duckhunter, how come you aren't honoring your promise to not post on Ute
articles for a full year? The key word is "honor." When does the
Awh Ducky is back with his dower forebodings for the Utes. It's like a black
cloud following the program when he speaks. Thank goodness it is all just the
wishful thinking on his part, a fan of the mid major team in Provo, with nothing
better to do than troll U of U stories. You are legend Ducky with your Debbie
Well chow is correct when he says the backups at most schools don't have much
experience. They are backups after all. So the real issue isn't if they have
experience, the issue is are they any good? If they are good then
they can come in and perform adequately if the starter is injured and if they
have to play for several weeks, or the remainder of the season, they will
improve as they play.So that gets us to the real issue for utah, are
their backups any good? Thus far none of them has shown anything. shreve was
awful in the spring and the fact that the jc transfer appears to already be
ahead of him shows he isn't much good. The jc transfer? Well the school he was
origninally going to was some school in Nebraska none of us has ever heard of
that dropped football.So in short utah fans chow is simply dodging
the question with his claim that not many backups have much experience. Of
course they don't. What you don't hear from him is that the backups at utah are
any good. I'd be worried about that fact.
I'd take a good-great backup QB with no experience any day over a
mediocre-average back up QB. I think that was our biggest problem last year.
Although I like Cain personally he wasn't anything more that a mediocre-average
QB. Wynn got injured and even though Cain had the experience, it
How many complete games does Riley Nelson have?How much
"experience" did he really get during the Bronco Wheel-O'-Quarterbacks
College football is replete with backups coming in unannounced due to injury to
the starter and having a great career in his place. Others can't carry their
team at all, so the team tanks for the rest of that year.Sure, it'd
help to have an experienced backup, but even that's no guarantee.Therefore, inexperienced backups is a non-issue because you don't know until
you open the box of chocolates just what you're going to get.
Ok, go ahead an minimize the issue...I have to laugh about all of this,
especially when all the Ute coaches just about had coronaries when Mr Wynn down
after after someone accidently knock him over after a play. Don't downplay how
important that Mr. Wynn stays healthy. Ya'll have nobody to come in to fill in
without alot of grief and pain it will bring...better yet losses!It
is good to have depth at every position (see the TDS). 3 deep at every
position...nice time to have a solid program without any question marks...go
Brett Ratliffe was a stud qb when he broke his hand on the last play of the game
against Texas A & M. Alex Smith came in and filled in nicely. Most programs
have very little experience at backup and players adapt once given an
Alex Smith was "just" a backup QB who worked out ok, dontcha think?
I agree with Coach Chow. I have always wondered why so many people were making
a big deal of the lack of experience at QB.