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BYU football: Cougars trying to tackle their scheduling challenges

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  • Cougar_Independence OMAHA, NE
    July 31, 2011 8:31 a.m.

    @mount olympus

    "I love how BYU fans are living in denial and claim that going independent is so much better than joining a BCS conference."

    Question: who will make more revenue from their TV contract this year: BYU or Utah? Answer: BYU. Expected to make $8-10 Million from ESPN. Utah will make $3 mil from the pac12 championship game only.

    BYU > Utah

  • Cougar_Independence OMAHA, NE
    July 31, 2011 8:22 a.m.

    @junkgeek

    "The Pac-12 just announced a nationwide TV deal (for 2012 and beyond) that will put every Pac-12 game on national TV. The Utes won't have any problem getting people to watch their games."

    Yeah, as long as you have cable! Notice Directv nor Dish Network were involved in the PTN deal. If you have satellite, you won't be able to watch Utah. Larry Scott said approximately "40 million homes". Well, that's about 20 million less than BYU TV, but I'm sure ute fans in the state of Utah will see the games, as long as they have comcast.

    Also, this network won't be up until August 2012. That means Utah home games this year are "KJZZ or Bust"!

    Go KJZZ and their 30 viewers!

  • Teddy Bear Las Vegas, NV
    July 30, 2011 11:11 a.m.

    Tomahawk-

    There isn't much difference between ESPN and ESPN2 these days anyway. It's pretty commonplace now that any cable/satelitte package that provides ESPN also provides ESPN2.

  • Cougar_Independence OMAHA, NE
    July 30, 2011 10:11 a.m.

    @isred

    "Byu plays 4 WAC teams and a Big Sky team in Provo this year."

    Amazingly how near-sighted some comments are. BYU had to put an independence schedule together at the last minute for 2011. Holmoe has said without the WAC stepping up and offering to help, BYU wouldn't have been able to do 2011 as an independent. 2012 will be slightly better, with home games against Oregon State and Hawaii, plus road games at Notre Dame Boise State, and Utah.

    2013 BYU has Texas, Boise State, and probably Utah at home.

    As a cougar fan, I'm looking forward to future years, not just looking at 2011.

    One fact: Notre Dame has never visited Rice Eccles, and never will. On the other hand, BYU has welcomed Notre Dame more than once, and has 2 guaranteed home games with Notre Dame in the near future.

    BYU in 2011: 10, maybe 11, games on the ESPN family of networks!

    Go Cougars!

  • Cougar_Independence OMAHA, NE
    July 30, 2011 7:20 a.m.

    Many commenters are referencing that BYU can't get good quality games in October/November.

    Let's remember that BYU plays TCU and Oregon State in October this year. And also the Notre Dame game moving forward is scheduled for October/November time frame. I wouldn't be surprised if Notre Dame is moved permanently to Thanksgiving weekend. Notre Dame doesn't have natural in-state rival who they can play every year on Thanksgiving weekend, like Alabama/Auburn or Ole miss/Mississippi State. BYU could be that new rival, even though we are over 1,000 miles away.

    Also, the Hawaii game this year is in December, and Hawaii will be a great team this year.

    Georgia Tech next year will be an October game.

    The only fact so far is November 2011 is not a good schedule. But, having pieced in a matter of months really didn't give BYU a lot of options. Remember, BYU announced independence only 11 months ago. Seems a lot longer, but it really was that short of time.

    2012 will be better, 2013 will be. Better than that, and 2014 will be great and all years moving forward.

  • Tomahawk Red North Salt Lake, UT
    July 29, 2011 11:42 p.m.

    OK I just figured it out...

    Utah State and UCF are Friday nights. No other competition.

    For the Texas game... ESPN is showing Notre Dame @ Michigan. Tough competition.

    For the Utah game... ESPN is showing Stanford @ Arizona. Tough competition.

    Makes more sense knowing that.

  • Tomahawk Red North Salt Lake, UT
    July 29, 2011 11:34 p.m.

    I gotta tell you, I'm highly surprised how ESPN is scheduling some of BYU's games.

    Both the Utah and Texas game will be shown on ESPN2. Those are definitely ESPN-quality matchups, so why ESPN2?

    Then they decide to show Ole Miss, UTAH STATE (?)and UCF on ESPN?

    I don't get it. That doesn't sound like good judgment.

  • Tomahawk Red North Salt Lake, UT
    July 29, 2011 11:31 p.m.

    "We don't like to do Friday night games because of high school football. But if we have an opportunity to play a great game on a Friday, we'll do it or look seriously into it."

    Clearly.

    They play on a Friday night three times in 2011 alone.

  • riddlemethis Clearfield, UT
    July 29, 2011 2:39 p.m.

    UU702:

    Reading comprehension not my thing? Apparently it's not your thing either. " show me where I said you were slamming BYU. I simply said your argument is contradictory. Larry Scott wanted a 16 team league. He currently has a 12 team league. You lobbing out personal insults doesn't cover up the fact that the utes were plan b.

    Anyway you will be forgetting all about this after the Utes start out 1-2.

  • Where's Stockton ??? Bowling Green, OH
    July 29, 2011 2:12 p.m.

    uu-702
    Primarily Utah was only an after thought contingency on Scotts bucket list. Simultaneous and down the line defaulting declines by the entire group of his BIG 12 hopefuls minus Colorado and Utah's geographical location had more to do with Utah's invite. Once the ball got rolling and Scott's dream conference fell apart Utah's selection was a matter of saving face. Let's not kid ourselves into buying a cop out that Scott is overjoyed with the results of his venture. Let's also keep in mind what happened to the old WAC when Commissioner Benson created his 16 team fiasco. If there was any merit attached to the Utes invitation it was to give Scott an out... to use thier two BCS wins as a rationalization or as a last effort to smooth over rejections by the teams he really wanted... more or less in case plan A didn't work...which is the reality.

    Actually I like having Utah in the PAC. It brings more of the nation to all of the state of Utah College and University teams and greatly improves every team in the state's exposure... I could say more but the pot is stirred enough.

  • UU702 Layton, UT
    July 29, 2011 11:06 a.m.

    @Riddlemethis

    Reading comprehension not your thing huh...that's cool. My original comments are about college football, super conferences, and scheduling. If saying "Utes are safe" and "if byu doesn't get picked up" is interpreted as slamming byu than that's your problem.

    I'll leave the slamming to the coach at Idaho. No respect from IDAHO? ouch!

  • Vegas Las Vegas, NV
    July 29, 2011 10:19 a.m.

    UU702 - You have no idea what you're talking about. The PAC-16 offer was made to the Big12 teams. Utah wasn't invited until after Texas (and the rest of the big12 (minus CO)teams followed) denied the offer. Utah was only invited to be the doormat of the real PAC12 power teams to showcase themselves in a conference championship game.

  • riddlemethis Clearfield, UT
    July 29, 2011 10:09 a.m.

    UU702:

    Maybe you forgot about the rumors that the PAC10 was reluctant to take Kansas or the like? byu fans like to say Utah made it because Texas backed out; that is very much assumption not fact,

    So how do you qualify using rumor folks didn't want Kansas for evidence and accuse BYU fans of assuming Utah only got invited because Texas backed out?

    And as far as getting all twisted up? You're the one commenting on the BYU article and posing the question that I said what I said because "it makes me feel better" And as far as miscontsruing someone else's post: I don't need to feel better about anything. Before YOU get all twisted up maybe you might want to read where I gave kudos and props to Utah for being in the PAC12.

    But maybe I haven't been paying attention like you say. I've only heard of the PAC12 not the PAC 16.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    July 29, 2011 9:46 a.m.

    "The similarities of Arizona, ASU and the Utes are amazing. No NC for football."

    Kenny G.

    The similarities of Minnesota, Army, and the Colleg of Detriot are amazing. All have won long ago NC's.

  • UU702 Layton, UT
    July 29, 2011 9:02 a.m.

    @Riddlmethis

    Uhhhh...you obviously weren't watching when the PAC16 push was made and Utah was very much in the conversation as one of the 6 additions. Maybe you forgot about the rumors that the PAC10 was reluctant to take Kansas or the like? byu fans like to say Utah made it because Texas backed out; that is very much assumption not fact, but if it makes you feel better?

    Secondly, before you get all twisted up you might want to read where I stated "if they were not picked up" scheduling could get very tough (in reference to the article). I think your "Myopic" interpretation of my original post is the problem.

  • GoGetter Sandy, UT
    July 29, 2011 8:22 a.m.

    Independence = WAC with a mask on.

    They should hesitate to schedule the big boys of Utah State, an ESPN affiliate can't afford an upset like that again...

    If Independence if what they wanted, Independence is what they got. It seems like a lot of the small issues of being Independent are now being discovered in Provo. That's why jumping ship and choosing your school's future should require a bit more time and planning.

  • Rueben L Folsom, CA
    July 29, 2011 8:10 a.m.

    my point was simply that for scheduling sake, BYU needs Utah much more than Utah needs BYU. BYU fans wait for months about the next "big" scheduling announcement...and then what do they get, Conference USA's Southern Mississippi?

  • riddlemethis Clearfield, UT
    July 29, 2011 1:27 a.m.

    UU702 | 10:40 p.m. July 28, 2011
    Layton, UT
    Watched Larry Scott predict on the beloved ESPN last night that Super Conferences will happen. Larry makes things happen in case anybody hasn't been watching.
    -----

    Uhh. You obviously weren't watching when Larry Scott tried to create a 16 team conference out of the PAC 10 and failed.

    You are in a quandary pointing the finger of scorn at BYU saying they will be left out of the 16 team conference, when only a year ago Utah was left out of the creation of a 16 team conference! The reason Utah is where they are is because the 5 Big 12 Schools turned Scott down. That's not a jab at Utah. Utah should be proud of themselves for accomplishing enough to be the 12th team. It's a wonderful opportunity and based on the nascent success of the fb program well deserved, but it is myopic and hypocritical to say BYU can't get into a 16 team conference, when the only reason Utah is in the PAC is because of the failed creation of a 16 team conference.

  • Riverton Cougar Riverton, Utah
    July 29, 2011 1:05 a.m.

    "You won a National Championship that was ranked by a Sports Illustrated writer as "The most undeserving NC of all time". I won't even do the research on this one, I'm sure Sammy G, Ducky, Y Grad...will do it for me (since they don't seem to work), but tell me the last time a National Champion played a 6-5 team for their "bowl game" & went without beating a top 25 opponent all year."

    By calling a national championship undeserved, there is the implication that there was a better team (after all, if the best team won the national championship then it wouldn't be undeserved). Please provide irrefutable evidence that BYU was NOT the best team in the nation.

    As for Utah demanding a 2-1 with BYU, I doubt they will ever be so arrogant to do it. BYU would laugh at their faces for suggesting it. Utah State did the 1-2 with BYU because there was a lot of money involved, which they need. BYU is not hurting financially and, despite what Utah fans think, is NOT a worse team than Utah. Imagine if BYU demanded a 2-1 with Arkansas. Similar case.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    July 28, 2011 11:54 p.m.

    Come on GJ:

    Utah State up and coming, they're not good. SDSU was a quality team and one of the best quality wins for the Cougs last year. SDSU won a bowl game and their coach is now leading the maize and blue in Ann Arbor. They have exciting, dynamic talent most years, USU not so much.

    Nevada to Central Florida. I will take Nevada every time. Nevada lost one game last year, their coach invented the Pistol offense and they are truly one of the most interesting teams in the west year in and year out. They have also beat the Cougs in their last two meetings.

    Yes, BYU's home schedule last year wasn't great but it's worse this year, in fact this is the worst home schedule for quality of teams I've seen in a long time. But even with that said independence brings opportunities but let's face it, the 2012 home schedule isn't one of the benefits.

  • truecoug1 Provo, UT
    July 28, 2011 11:30 p.m.

    @Mount Olympus "If they really knew that, then 3 or 4 years ago they would have started scheduling 12 games a year, instead of just the 4 non conf games. It obviously was not planned as they said, otherwise BYU wouldn't be playing half of their games against the WAC."

    So what you're saying is that BYU made the decision to go independent the moment Utah left for the PAC 12 and then in the space of one month, when BYU announced its independence, they had built the most state-of-the-art broadcasting facility in the western United States, developed and released an APP that allows the broadcasting of BYUtv on all mobile devices and signed an 8 year contract with ESPN?

    Yup, there was obviously no forethought at all to the process (roll my eyes). Give me a break

    BTW, not sure what all the hullabaloo is about our scheduling. It gets better and better with each season. Look at the 2013 slate of home games (Texas, BSU, Georiga Tech, Utah). Pretty awesome.

    Go Cougars!

  • UU702 Layton, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:40 p.m.

    Watched Larry Scott predict on the beloved ESPN last night that Super Conferences will happen. Larry makes things happen in case anybody hasn't been watching. Most predictions I have seen show the PAC12, Big10, SEC, and ACC picking off the cream of the Big12 and Big East. The first four are all 12 team two division formats (probably not a coincidence).64 teams most likely in creating 16 additional spots and everybody else second tier. Playoff system solved.

    IMHO it takes one of the aforementioned four conferences to go to 16 and it will be a race for the remaining teams. Anybody left out will struggle for relevance and some may bow out (that would suck). Utes are safe; byu's current scheduling issues and relevance could pale in comparison if they were not picked up. Any number of things could happen over the next 2-4 years including nothing but that is not very likely.

  • Flames6 North Salt Lake, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:36 p.m.

    Might be the only tackle that team makes this year.

  • USUfootballWasIndependent2001&am Salt Lake, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:54 p.m.

    Welcome to the WAC cougars!

  • Mount Olympus Salt Lake, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:52 p.m.

    re: sammyg
    If they really have been planning this for years as they say, then they should have known that they were going to go independent in 2011 years ago, like they said.

    If they really knew that, then 3 or 4 years ago they would have started scheduling 12 games a year, instead of just the 4 non conf games. It obviously was not planned as they said, otherwise BYU wouldn't be playing half of their games against the WAC.

  • yourmomgoestocollege Las Vegas, NV
    July 28, 2011 9:48 p.m.

    Can't you argue that BYU's 2011 schedule is no weaker than the schedules played by the previous BCS busting schools, and upon first look it is probably a little stronger? Boise State played Oregon in 2009 and Oregon St in 2006, and Hawaii played Washington before beating up on the WAC and other weaker non-conference. Utah's 2008 schedule included only Michigan and Oregon State, and the 2004 schedule included Texas A&M and Arizona. TCU played Oregon St last year as the lone significant BCS opponent, and in 2009 played Virginia and Clemson. Texas, Ole Miss and Oregon St are certainly on par with those teams, despite being in down years.

  • One Nil to the Arsenal! Gilbert, AZ
    July 28, 2011 9:45 p.m.

    "Phoenix a miserable rat trap?" Gilbert was ranked in the top 50 places to live in the USA the past 3 years, so not sure where your getting your info brother. But Tucson...........not enough $$ in the world.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    July 28, 2011 8:50 p.m.

    The similarities of Arizona, ASU and the Utes are amazing. No NC for football.

    Being in denial about known fact and history kind of makes BYU hater comments rather silly, ya think?

    I like the Glen Beck book titled "Arguing with Idiots"

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    July 28, 2011 8:27 p.m.

    @Mt Olympus

    Winner winner chicken dinner, ding ding ding...

    "If this independence things was really in the works for years, why didn't they schedule some good teams for 2011? They should have done this years ago."

    Uh, could it be that it was only announced last year? Can't schedule games until the 'cat's out of the bag'. LOL and ROTF!

  • JayDee West Jordan, UT
    July 28, 2011 8:09 p.m.

    @ Mount Olympus

    Are you serious in needing an explanation as to why independence may have been considered years ago but schedules were not made until after the announcement? I'm confident you understand the concept and are not just getting in a dig.

    @ 1984 for life said: "Utah fans care about the quality of the opponent." My response: #1) Montana State; #2) Ute fans giddy that they "don't have to play Oregon and Stanford this year"; #3) Ute fans rejoicing that USC is on probation and "even with a loss" we make it into the PAC 12 Championship game.

    There is no debate that BYU's schedule is seriously lacking at the end of this year, yet it's curious that all I hear from U fans is how glad they are they do not have to play (or get a gimee with a loss) against the champions of the Conference of Champions. So, which is it? Quality opponent or a sigh of relief?

  • 1984 for life Salt Lake City, UT
    July 28, 2011 6:33 p.m.

    @ Duckhunter | 4:41 p.m. July 28, 2011
    Highland, UT

    "With utah being limited to only 3 out of conference games, one of which will be BYU, they can't schedule that many sure wins, or they could but the fans will not like it." You are correct. Utah fans care about the quality of the opponent. BYU fans care about the record at the end of the year regardless of the fact that the wins come playing a WAC schedule.

  • Mount Olympus Salt Lake, UT
    July 28, 2011 6:14 p.m.

    Wow some of these comments are hilarious.
    Saying SDSU is equal to USU?! That is hilarious.

    2011 home schedule would have been a lot better had BYU stayed in the MWC. Air Force, TCU, Boise State, and Utah all playing at LES.

    If this independence things was really in the works for years, why didn't they schedule some good teams for 2011? They should have done this years ago.

  • BlueHusky Mission Viejo, CA
    July 28, 2011 6:06 p.m.

    Utah 2-1? I don't think BYU has ever done 2-1 with PAC10 teams. If UCLA, Cal, Stanford, USC, and Washington all do home and home, why would Utah think BYU would ever give them 2-1? Given the size of LES and the ESPN payoff, Utah would be more likely to go 1-2 than for BYU to go 2-1.

    Personally, I'm looking forward to the spanking the Huskies are going to deliver to the Utes.

  • SLC BYU Fan Salt Lake City, UT
    July 28, 2011 5:32 p.m.

    Utah will not demand a 2 for 1 deal from BYU since gate revenue and viewership dont arrant making such a demand. Utah administration officials including AD Chris Hill also feel somewhat indebted to BYU since they stuck it out with Utah during the last of the WAC era and the more recent MWC time frame when BYU had a golden opportunity to bail and go to the Big-12 in 1993 when that league was formed. Now Utah gets the golden league invitation and due to the mess that the Big-12 has become BYU must face the scheduling nightmare, and likely delayed gratification of a significant conference invitation until perhaps mid-decade.

    As for BYU demanding a 2 for 1 from Utah State, lets put it politely, the checkbook talks, and cash is something the Aggie athletic program is in short supply of. The 2012-2015 home and home deal Utah has with them will likely be the last strait-up such deal Chris Hill makes with the school in Logan. The 2013 game BYU plays up there will also likely be their last since Holmoe had a political bone to throw.

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    July 28, 2011 4:54 p.m.

    No complaints here . . .

    2011 schedule is better than a MWC schedule would have been with four games against AQ teams and one soon to be AQ team.

    2012 schedule will look a lot like 2011, but with home games against Oregon State and Hawaii should provide more appeal for the home games.

    And I get downright giddy thinking about 2013 and beyond with teams like Notre Dame, Texas, Georgia Tech, West Virginia, Boise State in the mix.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    July 28, 2011 4:41 p.m.

    @gonefishn

    I actually gave your comment a recomendation because it was actually good.

    One thing you will notice however is that it is mostly utah fans calling for a 2-1 despite the obvious facts that there is no basis for it. I see no real basis for it going the other way either other than BYU's larger stadium capacity. But that alone is not enough of a reason either.

    In my opinion they either play each other 1-1 and every year or else they should just drop each other. The truth is each team will take turns being more relevent from season to season. In my opinion BYU will have more really good seasons than utah because they will have more ability to schedule themselves some automatic wins. With utah being limited to only 3 out of conference games, one of which will be BYU, they can't schedule that many sure wins, or they could but the fans will not like it. They will want to see some variety of quality teams from around the country and will not want to see two montana st. every year.

  • forreal people Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 28, 2011 4:32 p.m.

    TJ,

    Duh.

    "and maybe an additional one or two on nationally per year."

    Even this year in 2011, there are all ready 3 nationally televised utah games. Without the unrivaled Pac12 TV deal and network that starts in 2012. Obviously if Utah remains ranked and wins, it will turn into more- the only way it remains only three this year is if Utah starts losing.

    By any use of logic, one would have to bet big time on that improving once the landmark TV deal starts in 2010. I would love to take bets from anyone who agrees with your post.

    Logic, comon sense, and reality - great stuff.

  • Mount Olympus Salt Lake, UT
    July 28, 2011 4:22 p.m.

    I love how BYU fans are living in denial and claim that going independent is so much better than joining a BCS conference.

    Really? Why didn't BYU go independent years ago?
    Many claim that BYU going independent was not a knee jerk reaction to Utah going to the Pac-12.

    If this were the case wouldn't BYU have planned it more in advance?
    7 home games, the only BCS opponent is Utah, then 4 bottom of the WAC teams and a big sky team?

    Admit it, this independence thing is not going to work out how most BYU fans think, otherwise it would have been done years ago.

  • Tommy2Shoes Lehi, UT
    July 28, 2011 4:13 p.m.

    Dear Tom,
    Just schedule us some decent teams in Oct/Nov. Army, Navy, Notre Dame. We should have them on a permanent schedule for those months. TCU, Pitt, UConn, WVirg, any ACC team worthy of top 50 ranking. Consider moving the Utah State game to the slot vacated by Utah. This should be easy starting 2013. Set up a few games with Cal and Stanford. Since you coached at Cal, this should be a piece of cake. Play Hawaii on the road every year to play a 13th game. Besides, a trip to Oahu is better than a bowl game and a great recruiting tool. Early December game please.
    Don't schedule Idaho State or any other lower tier opponents. Think bigger. Think winner.
    Sincerely,
    Tommy

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    July 28, 2011 4:03 p.m.

    junkgeek
    Actually, there are several regional networks. I heard it in 1320 AM this morning. The "Mountain West" network will cover CO and UT. Because CO is much bigger, they will likely get the most coverage for now. Not tinkling on your parade, just repeating what I heard. It was also speculated that eventually all of these regional channels could maybe end up as all Western US and possibly even the entire US. It is good for Ute fans either way. It pretty much guarantees all games will be televised locally and maybe an additional one or two on nationally per year.

  • forreal people Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 28, 2011 3:57 p.m.

    Some of you are missing the main point of the article: Home Schedule. To my surprise, BYU has done a great Job with the away scheduling. The 2 for 1's with Texas and ND are great examples.

    There is no doubt that BYU season ticket holders are getting downgraded, at least this season. Even in the distant future they have to play at ND twice before getting them in Provo in 2014. That's a problem - if I were a BYU season ticket holder. Bad game times, weak opponents, ect.

    Like I said before, the overall schedule looks like it will be improving from decent to great in the coming years, and the overall schedule is what maters from a post season perspective.

    It is a good thing BYU has ESPN leverage to schedule games. The bigger named opponents are playing the Y for ESPN as much as any other reason (says Bronco himself).

    Congrats on pulling in some of those big names though. When I first heard about independence I did not think it was going to happen. I was wrong.

  • GJ Greenwood, IN
    July 28, 2011 3:56 p.m.

    junkgeek, The deal was to televise all of the games, but not all of them will be nationally televised. Most of them will only be regionally televised. Also, with a name like yours I wouldn't expect you to like Provo. It's too clean.

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    July 28, 2011 3:56 p.m.

    Correction: Utah has produced only half a dozen or so ranked teams in its entire HISTORY.

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    July 28, 2011 3:54 p.m.

    @One Nil to the Arsenal!

    You can disparage BYU's NC all you want but it will never change the fact that they were the consensus national champions in 1984. It's in the NCAA record book, you can look it up for yourself. Scoreboard!

    Furthermore, since you are quoting national sports publications, BYU was ranked by ESPN recently as the #25 most prestigious college football program in the country. Utah was somewhere in the 40's even after their glorious Sugar Bowl victory. BYU has produced nationally ranked teams on average every other year for the last 35 years running. In spite of their great undefeated seasons in '04 and '08, Utah has produced only half a dozen or so ranked teams in its entire season. The Utes have been fantastic the last 7 years or so, but they are the Johnny Come Lately's of college football.

  • junkgeek Agua Dulce, TX
    July 28, 2011 3:20 p.m.

    "Tucson and Phoenix are miserable rat traps..."

    Have you been to Provo in the last 20 years?

  • junkgeek Agua Dulce, TX
    July 28, 2011 3:19 p.m.

    The Pac-12 just announced a nationwide TV deal (for 2012 and beyond) that will put every Pac-12 game on national TV. The Utes won't have any problem getting people to watch their games.

  • BYU in Tucson Tucson, AZ
    July 28, 2011 3:04 p.m.

    Hey BYU haters, talk about respecting your opponets, Ute fans have no idea the buzz saw your team is going into this year. I hope some of Utah fans travel to a few of your away games this year. Arizona and Arizona St. are you're new rivals and (I'm not proud of this) theese are rude, nasty people. They treated BYU awful in 06, Iowa last year, geez, Go youtube Arizona rude fans. Against Oregon, USC. The fans are also dumb, they WILL think Utah IS BYU, and not a lot of people like BYU. You UTES have been playing with puppy dogs in the mountain west and you're still hung up on BYU. I just hope the Utah players are looking ahead or they're not ready for PAC 10.2. I'll be there Nov 5th vs. U of A Nov 5th watching the Ute amidst the chaos, Whittingham pacing the sidelines looking lost like he did against Notre Dame. Except South Bend is nice, Tucson and Phoenix are miserable rat traps and it hurts to lose here.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    July 28, 2011 3:02 p.m.

    Smurf,

    Also, why can't the BYU/Utah rivalry late in the season be grandfathered? It's been going on a LONG time and is a pretty big deal for both schools. It's not a lot to ask either since I just gave the perfect scenario when the game could be played and no other school in the conference, besides Utah and USC, has such a longstanding, signficant nonconference rivalry that they would have to accommodate. I think Chris Hill and Kyle are soft. A little too worried about upsetting their new conference that with each Pac-12 story I read, they appear more and more like the conference whipping boy.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    July 28, 2011 2:50 p.m.

    Smurf,

    Regardless of why USC is allowed a nonconference game late in the season, one thing's for sure: If USC is not playing a conference opponent one particular weekend in October/November, then at least one other Pac-12 school will either 1) have to be playing a non-conference opponent as well or 2)have a bye. Why not just allow BYU and Utah to play that same weekend while the rest of the Pac-12 plays each other? Problem solved.

  • Wayne Rout El Paso, TX
    July 28, 2011 2:49 p.m.

    It does not seem to me that the "soft" games listed for this year are much different than Wyoming, New Mexico, or UNLV last year. While I probably would not like to see these guys every year, I think it is nice to play them occasionally. New Mexico State has been begging for a game with BYU for a long time. A 2 for 1 home with them would give them one sold out game for the year and a chance to be on TV. As long as there are tougher teams on the schedule, having a few games that are division I but not power houses seems OK to me. Last year Ohio State played Marshall, Ohio University, and Eastern Michigan.

  • FromWA Olympia, WA
    July 28, 2011 2:44 p.m.

    Honestly, with the BCS being what it is, I totally get not scheduling non conference games after September. These conferences look to miss out on $19 million if they only put one team in a BCS bowl. So if you lose an out of conference game in November, you don't go to that BCS bowl, even if the opponent is really good. And playing BYU in November if BYU is anything other than undefeated is no win for any team with BCS aspirations. So while I hate it, and it may seem unfair, I get it. I probably wouldn't allow my teams to play a late non conference game if I were running these conferences, or I'd at least heavily discourage it, quietky.

  • One Nil to the Arsenal! Gilbert, AZ
    July 28, 2011 2:33 p.m.

    "Nationally Prominent Team"....man, that makes me chuckle every time I hear one of you Zoobs say that. I don't know what you think the college football world owes you guys. It's like your walking around with this big chip on your shoulder now b/c your completely left out of the BCS Hype. You won a National Championship that was ranked by a Sports Illustrated writer as "The most undeserving NC of all time". I won't even do the research on this one, I'm sure Sammy G, Ducky, Y Grad...will do it for me (since they don't seem to work), but tell me the last time a National Champion played a 6-5 team for their "bowl game" & went without beating a top 25 opponent all year. Your current situation (worst access to BCS bowl games) is the product of your own success during the Reagan Administration. Ya, you've had some great players come through. You've had some prestigious WAC/MWC Championships. But when your talking about Nationally prominent programs......I'm pretty sure that unless your LDS, nobody in this country is writing in BYU in that blank. Again, not your fault. It's the bubble.

  • Portland Trail Blazers Sandy, UT
    July 28, 2011 2:33 p.m.

    If BYU dumps Utah off their schedule, Utah will have no chance of ever getting on ESPN. Utah needs BYU like a fat kid needs cake. Utah is in the same class as Wazzu & Oregon State in the Pac 10.2; nobody has any interest in them outside of their fan bases. It's proof, not one of them got an ESPN game/deal through the PAC 10.2. Oregon State will probably get theirs through BYU, just like Utah did.

    Once again, BYU is carrying the load for little brother, Utah.

  • Tom in CA Vallejo, CA
    July 28, 2011 2:16 p.m.

    utah wouldn't be on the map without the last 40 years of BYU football. So who needs who?

  • Jared Northern, FL
    July 28, 2011 2:11 p.m.

    RE: isrred

    BYU has a weak home schedule this year (although, being in a major BCS area, I can tell you that a lot of top BCS schools have weak schedules, they just have a few really tough games but most of the other games are powder puff) because they had a short time to fill the schedule. BYU's schedule will be very strong year in and year out after this year.

  • Hawkyo SYRACUSE, UT
    July 28, 2011 2:06 p.m.

    Reuben @ 8:30
    Holmoe, Mendenhall, and BYU have always been respectful of Utah, it's the fans, and a few of the players that have had issues. But it cuts both ways, Respect is earned, and disrespect is often earned as well. Utah fans haven't been the best hosts either. Both side could take a lesson form come of the classier places to play. I hear ND fans are very gracious hosts.

  • Dave S Holladay, UT
    July 28, 2011 1:52 p.m.

    I can't believe teams aren't lining up to the byu especially with that great new TV contract.

  • Veracity Morgan, UT
    July 28, 2011 1:39 p.m.

    Silent Lurker

    BYU fans, how is Utah wanting a two for one with BYU any different that BYU wanting a two for one with Utah State?

    Answer: Beside being classier, BYU is the better team than Utah or Utah State.

  • gonefishn Salt Lake City, UT
    July 28, 2011 1:32 p.m.

    Wether it is Utah or BYU, they better insist on as many 1 for 1's as they can get and not be too heavy handed / arrogant with the insistance of recieving their own 2 for 1's. This is competitive athletics and the worm turns ie Utes in the 80's or BYUs Crowton era.

  • Papa Smurf UTE Herriman, UT
    July 28, 2011 1:16 p.m.

    Giantfan,

    Larry Scott came out and said that the specific game between Notre Dame and USC is grand fathered in, and since they are the cream of the crop in the Pac 12, they got to keep that game. Go look up the interview with Scott back when they made this announcement.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    July 28, 2011 1:07 p.m.

    @silent lurker

    "BYU fans, how is Utah wanting a two for one with BYU any different that BYU wanting a two for one with Utah State?"

    Good grief.

    Let's do the math for you.

    BYU - 65000 seat stadium. Sell out or close for every game.
    USU - 27000 seat stadium. Even it it sells out it is less than half the size.
    UU- 44000 seat stadium. Once again even if it sells out, much less revenue.

    BYU - 40 years as a nationally prominent team.
    USU- no years as a nationally relevent anything.
    UU - 7 years as a decent team, 2 years as a very good team.

    BYU - Concensus National Champion
    USU - Uh.....no
    UU- Uh.....no. But they did finish #4 a couple of times.

    BYU - Huge national fanbase....worldwide fanbase even. Lotsa viewers.
    USU - Uh.....has a few fans in Logan and a sprinkling around the state.
    UU - Uh....has a bunch in SLC but they are tenuous. Next to none anywhere else.

    I could go on but there is really no neeed.

    LOL!

  • Who am I sir? Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 28, 2011 12:57 p.m.

    How great is independence? Ask the BYU softball team. When the WAC(!) said they no longer needed the Y because they now had The University of Texas - (arlington!)the softball team joined the football team in the dream of independence. More sports to follow?

  • ClarkHippo Tooele, UT
    July 28, 2011 12:13 p.m.

    As a Cougar fan, I'm willing to watch BYU play a few games against Idaho, Fresno State or even against Ball State or Eastern Illinois if at the same time we can still schedule games against teams like Notre Dame, Texas, TCU and Ole' Miss. If you think about it, it's really not much different than the MWC schedule. For every BYU/Utah game or BYU/TCU game, there were games against UNLV, New Mexico and Wyoming.

    Obviously, BYU football is going to have to endure some growing pains as it moves from the MWC to Independence and a good part of that includes scheduling. It may take a couple of years, but I have faith the Y will eventually get into a good groove.

    As for the BYU/Utah game, here's a nightmare scenario for you Ute fans.

    Let's say Chris Hill decides BYU is now officially beneath the U's dignity and they drop the game from their schedule. Then, the last scheduled game occurs and the Cougars have another John Beck style, last second win.

    Now what?

    As long as the BYU/Utah game stays competitive like it has for the last 20 years, it's staying.

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    July 28, 2011 11:07 a.m.

    silent lurker.
    USU will use this as a revenue generating "money game". They can generate more income in one trip to Provo's 67000 seat stadium than they can with 3 or 4 games in Logan and their 27000 seat stadium. And all they have to do is take a Bus ride which cuts down on traveling expense.
    Also; BYU needs home games in the near future because of the neutral games and the 2 for 1 deals they are getting to play some very good teams.

    Win Win situation.

  • isrred Logan, UT
    July 28, 2011 11:04 a.m.

    Byu plays 4 WAC teams and a Big Sky team in Provo this year. If this is the kind of home schedule independence produces, I would invite byu season ticket holders to save some cash and just drive to Logan for USU games.

  • Red Headed Stranger Billy Bobs, TX
    July 28, 2011 10:57 a.m.

    Silent Lurker

    If you understand abstract concepts like "math" and "time" it shouldn't be hard to understand the difference.

    Some arrogant conferences won't allow their schools to schedule games outside of their conference after the month of September. BYU probably would have no trouble finding BCS teams to play in September. But because of the self-imposed rules of the self-annointed conferences post September slots are harder to fill. In order to play teams that would really give BYU a boost if we win, (like Notre Dame and Texas) the school has had to give up some two for one. That means if we wish to have six home games, BYU needs some schools to give it two for ones. Utah State thankfully helped out BYU.

    Why give a Utah a two for one at a prime time (September) for BYU to play in a smaller, hostile stadium? If BYU is going to give a two for one, it should be worth the risk like Ohio State or another name BCS school. See? math and time.

  • RojoRules SOUTH SALT LAKE, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:56 a.m.

    @ Rueben

    The Utes have had some extremely good seasons. They are a team that has National buzz even with the lackluster MWC media coverage. But they are in no position to be asking for a 2 for 1 from BYU. BYU has had stellar seasons year in and year out, except last year. And people on here suggesting that the rivalry should take a break. WHAT???? Those games have been the most exciting, intense, last second, nail biters that I've ever seen. I would be so sad to see this rivalry fall apart. Even though the Utes will have numerous high quality games year in and year out, I NEVER want this rivalry to even take ONE year off. It would be a travesty.

    If Utah goes into the PAC 12 and wins it a couple of times and goes to National Championship, maybe they would be in the position to ask for a 2 for 1.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:41 a.m.

    Re: 9er4life

    How foolish it would be for either program to want to discontinue the rivalry. The fact that it still generates a lot of interest and revenue for both programs makes it a no-brainer. For either side to claim it no longer necessary because "we've moved on" is 100% arrogance.

  • 9er4life Provo, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:26 a.m.

    From a Ute fan,I don't mind if there's a sabbatical between the two teams. Both schools are definitely going in different directions. The Utes need to establish themselves in the PAC 12 and establish rivalries within the conference. Rivalries create a different atmosphere when those teams head to RES. The Y have their own agenda by going the indy route and to promote their religion. So the two schools are quite different in what they deem important. A 10 year hiatus would be nice.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:20 a.m.

    Re: Silent Lurker

    It should be an easy answer. It's no secret that USU is not at the same level financially, facility-wise and revenue generating as BYU or Utah. The fact that so many now think that Utah has now broken through some glass ceiling without proving anything in the Pac-12 is dumbfounding. BYU will make more money in tv, bowl and gate at least the next 3 years than Utah. Fact.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:14 a.m.

    Smurf

    USC has this little non-confernce rivalry going with a school called Notre Dame-maybe you've heard of them-that happens late in the season (last year it was played in late November, this year late October). Now before you go off on how "BYU is no Notre Dame" let's be real. The BYU/Utah rivaly game is just as important to both schools as USC/Notre Dame is for them.

  • GACougar Atlanta, GA
    July 28, 2011 10:10 a.m.

    Good points, giantfan. I don't think that Utah State is complaining too much about the pay they will receive from coming to LES. If the truth were known, BYU probably had to insist on playing at Utah State every third year or else Utah State would have wanted all of the games at LES. Money talks.

  • Silent Lurker Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:02 a.m.

    BYU fans, how is Utah wanting a two for one with BYU any different that BYU wanting a two for one with Utah State?

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    July 28, 2011 10:00 a.m.

    Re: SU Wildcat

    So, in your mind, Utah is so big time now that them asking for a 2 for 1 from BYU is the same as BYU asking it from USU? That is exactly undeserved arrogance. Utah has proven nothing in the PAC-12 and here we have all these people raising them to some stature that you usually have to earn in college sports.

    And apparently some fans think that scheduling football games should be like charity. BYU cannot afford to play USU home-and-home over the long run. To play the "red" programs, they'll have to play them on the road quite a bit. That takes up their road schedule quickly. Playing every other year in Logan makes it harder to accomodate those "red" teams. BYU doesn't make enough gate playing at Romney to make it worthwhile to go every other year. And besides, Utah State loves playing at LES because of the gate they get. Instead of having to travel to College Station or Norman Oklahoma or Auburn Alabama to get those big paydays to keep their athletic department afloat, they only have to travel 100 miles south on I-15.

  • Papa Smurf UTE Herriman, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:59 a.m.

    I personally dont think they should have made Utah St a 2-1, and Chris Hill nor Holmoe should ever ask for a 2-1 in the rivalry. However, if the other major conferences do what the Pac and others have done, where after Sept, there are no out of conference games. Then scheduling for the Y, and having decent games in Oct and Nov is going to get tough. No one wants to see Idaho, Idaho St, UNM, New Mexico St, Utah St, San Jose St, etc as all of their home games in Oct and Nov, actually, ever for that matter. The Y will have ESPN's help, but if that conference rule is in place, it wont matter what ESPN does, Utah, Texas, Nebraska, Penn St, Ohio St, etc will not be able to come to LES late in the season, and if the Y loses 1 game early and has cupcakes the rest of the way, fans may lose interest.

  • Striker Omaha, NE
    July 28, 2011 9:50 a.m.

    Fun article to read. So glad BYU is not playing Idaho or Idaho State next year. I hope BYU stays away from lower division schools. That's just such a waste. Schedule teams like Florida International for those green games. The schedule for next year looks great. That will be a fun year too.

  • GACougar Atlanta, GA
    July 28, 2011 9:48 a.m.

    Reuben said, "Utah has 9 guaranteed games every year against quality opponents with their conference affiliation. . ."

    Really? I cannot believe you said that. Regardless, I do not believe that even you believe it.

    Colorado? Washington State? Oregon State? Arizona?

    Undeserved arrogance? Couldn't have said it better myself.

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:48 a.m.

    BYU and Utah Players, Coaches and Administrators have a great deal of respect for each other with very few, if any, exceptions. The only lack of respect is from a few pretend fans on both sides whose dislike for the other team out-weighs their loyalty or like for the team they pretend to be a fan of.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    July 28, 2011 9:42 a.m.

    Very few PAC teams are worth a two for one: USC, Oregon (for the time being).

    Washington State is worthy of a two for one...in our favor.

    Until they prove otherwise, Utah is in the middle, one and one or no deal. And before Utah proves themselves in the PAC, BYU may just as easily prove themselves "all interesting" and the team folks are trying to get on their schedule, even for a two for one.

  • Starfarer Mesa, AZ
    July 28, 2011 9:39 a.m.

    Why does everyone think that seasons coming will be like this one for scheduling?

    Let's look at the facts. Teams already have scheduled games 2-3 seasons out. they are locked into those games. This means that BYU will have a hard time for these first two years. Then it will be a lot easier.

    Think like a AD. There are weeks in any schedule that can be moved given a two year lead time. If one can be moved to schedule a nationally televised game and a neutral location for big bucks, why would you turn that down? It's all about money, and ESPN doles it out to teams who draw.

    I think that playing utah every few years fits the program just fine. I could care less if they played every year.

  • giantfan Farmington, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:37 a.m.

    Rueben,

    Apparently Utah needs BYU to get on ESPN. Without the BYU game this year, Utah would be relegated to the obscurity of Versus and KJZZ all season long!

    And the day that Utah offers BYU 2 for 1 and BYU actually considers it is the day that the Board of Trustees discontinues athletics!

  • SU Wildcat St. George, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:28 a.m.

    To CougFaninTX:

    Undeserved Arrogance on the part of Utah??? Really?

    If that is the case, why did BYU force Utah State into basically a 2-for-1 deal instead of a home and home, guarantee money notwithstanding. Now that typifies Undeserved Arrogance.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:16 a.m.

    @lil' reuben

    "Holmoe, Mendenhall and BYU would be wise to be respectful to their rivals to the North"

    What makes you think they aren't respectful? Of course you know they are what you really mean is you think they should grovel. Earth to reuben....utah is not the equivalent of BYU in national prestige nor accomplishment in football. utah is nothing more than a cling on who must attach itself to other more prestigious and accomplished programs simply to survive.

    Sure having a yearly game with utah helps scheduling but with the scheduling restrictions the pac10 has dictated to the hapless and powerless utah program it requires them to schedule in the fairly easy to fill September slots and really doesn't do much at all. BYU has no problem finding quality September opponents.

    Return to your fantasy land where utah is in a position to demand a 2-1 despite it's lack of national prestige or interest, its small stadium, its lack of respect from tv exec's, etc. In the meantime the fact chris hill isn't so stupid as to take your advice is readily apparent considering he has made absolutely no attempt to do so.

    LOL!

  • GJ Greenwood, IN
    July 28, 2011 9:09 a.m.

    "if Utah wasn't playing in Provo, it would be the worst lineup of home games since the pre-LaVell era."

    Last year BYU played a home schedule of Washington, Nevada, SDSU, Wyoming, UNLV, and New Mexico. This year it's Utah, UCF, USU, SJS, Idaho State, Idaho, and NMSU.

    Utah = Washington (BCS team)
    UCF = Nevada (quality mid-major team)
    USU = SDSU (up and coming mid-major team)
    Idaho = Wyoming (over matched mid-major team)
    SJS = UNLV (perpetually underachieving mid-major team)
    NMSU = UNM (hopelessly bad mid-major team)
    Idaho State = bonus exhibition game

    Aside from the bonus exhibition game, I don't see much difference from last year. Are you even old enough to remember the "pre-LaVell" era?

  • UU32 Bountiful, UT
    July 28, 2011 9:09 a.m.

    That is very unlike Bronco to 1) use the word "red" in any sentence ever to the media and 2) say, ". . . red is, proceed with a lot of caution. Stop and look both ways and make sure you're ready to go."

    I know, I know, he put Utah in the yellow category below the top-25 caliber along with Utah State (ouch). Just saying . . . a bit un-Bronko-like.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    July 28, 2011 8:49 a.m.

    CougFaninTX:

    Do I sense a new buzz phrase in the making? "Undeserved arrogance," I like it!

    Your reply is spot on. We need games. Do we need THAT game? No. Do we need it at the price of being dictated to? Heck no! Insisting on a two for one, either way, is the surest way to insure that the rivalry gets a break.

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    July 28, 2011 8:42 a.m.

    Rueben L
    "If I were Chris Hill, I would think long and hard about only offering Holmoe 2 in Rice-Eccles for 1 in LaVell Edwards. If BYU says no, they lose out a lot more than Utah does and have one more game they need to try to fill."

    From a scheduling perspective, you're right, BYU needs this game more than Utah. But from a "what's best for the fans", this game is equally important for both. Utah will never find another opponent who creates the rivalry interest like this one. Neither Utah, nor BYU football would be the same without this game. To suggest a 2 for 1 instead of a home and home typifies the undeserved arrogance of some Utah fans.

  • Rueben L Folsom, CA
    July 28, 2011 8:30 a.m.

    A couple things are clear after reading this. Holmoe, Mendenhall and BYU would be wise to be respectful to their rivals to the North, because they need them for scheduling a heck of a lot more than Utah needs BYU. Looking at BYU's home schedule next year, if Utah wasn't playing in Provo, it would be the worst lineup of home games since the pre-LaVell era. The Utah and possibly Central Florida games are the only home games that hold any interest as far as quality opponents. Utah has 9 guaranteed games every year against quality opponents with their conference affiliation, and share equally in the PAC-12 money from the contracts with ESPN, FOX and the PAC 12 network, regardless of how many times they appear on TV. If I were Chris Hill, I would think long and hard about only offering Holmoe 2 in Rice-Eccles for 1 in LaVell Edwards. If BYU says no, they lose out a lot more than Utah does and have one more game they need to try to fill.

  • BP Salt Lake City, UT
    July 28, 2011 7:36 a.m.

    Given recent experiences with the mountain, I'm guessing that not as many fans will be complaining about night games.

  • IndeMak South Jordan, UT
    July 28, 2011 7:03 a.m.

    Scheduling must be difficult. For every Nebraska, there has to be two San Jose States. The smaller schools are lining up but the bigger schools don't need BYU because they already have conference affiliations. Good thing ESPN is on their side because individually, most of the games simply would not happen.

  • Coyoteghost Saint George, UT
    July 28, 2011 6:06 a.m.

    I appreciaate the added informatio regarding the legal aspects:

    "I've never spent so much time with lawyers in my life as since we went independent."

    Provides an insight into the complexities of scheduling that I had not considered befoe. What a pain in the rear end to have to deal with lawyers so much.