Id risk the 18 pick if we do trade down...on Jeremy Tyler...he is a dark horse
on this draft...a projected top pick before...his moves are questionable...but i
think it made him more grounded...
@ shaybo,There really aren't any big men worth drafting other than
Williams and Kanter. So, trading down doesn't make sense to me.If
the 3rd pick can't get one of those two, then take Jimmer at 3 and some big guy
project at 12.
@whatsinitforme, I would think there's as much chance Irving would stay as
anyone else, even Jimmer has expressed some desire to play in NY. Jimmer is
definitely my first choice at point guard after Irvine though.If you
traded the #3 for 6 and 18 you would still end up with jimmer at #6 and still
have a good chance at a big man at 12 and 18. I like jeremy tyler or Lucas
nogueira at 18, rumors floating that nogueira is 6'9" but I have seen a
video of him standing on his toes holding onto the rim with both hands.
The Jazz will work out the Jimmer tomorrow. I am getting anxious to see what
direction this franchise will go. I think we will shock the NBA next year and be
very good for many years to come if the Jazz draft picks pan out sooner rather
than later.Good luck Jimmer!GO JAZZ!
Would Irving even sing with the Jazz, or stay if he did (ala D-Will)?I'm hopin' Irving goes 1 or 2 so the Jazz can get either Williams or Kanter
(or Jimmer, which depends on how his eval goes on Wednesday).The
Jazz are in a pretty good place with the 3rd and 12th picks. I don't see them
trading the 3rd away to a lower pick, but I would like to see them trade to get
that 12th pick higher if they want Jimmer and use the 3rd on a big.
CaptainL, if the Jazz aren't able to get Williams or Kanter that means Irvine
would be available at the #3 pick. I don't see how we could pass him up if that
@CaptainL, If we can't get Kanter or Williams that means Irvine falls to us and
I think we would have to take him. I think he could be among the elite in a year
or two. He is the only point guard I'd pick over Fredette though. If
they were able to parlay the #3 pick into #6 and #18, I think Jeremy Tyler might
be worth the gamble at 18. And still like Singleton at #12 if they get
Fredette.I still like Kanter at #3 though because it makes AJ or
Milsap expendable and opens up several trade possibilities that could bring the
Jazz a top flight scoring forward if Milsap can't adapt to play the #3.
@Captain Lhe dropped to 6 on draftexpress...he is still a top 2-6
pick...but they pointed out concerns of him being too choosy on workouts...so
Kanter's draft position could change in the next couple of weeks...I'd like for
us to take the Wizards 6 and 18th pick for the third...and probably have them
include Jordan Crawford...we could throw in a player...
I want to see us take a big with the #3 pick and if we can't get Kanter or
Williams or if the FO like him better, I like Jonas V. he's pretty solid and
will grow and develop into a top notch player. His contract is a problem as is
the fact he may take a couple more years to fill out , develop and be able to
contribute in a major way. I know alot of scouts think he's the top Euro player
in the draft and the latest film I've watched make me think he would be OK. Consalation wise, Knight at 3, and BB at 12 would be OK. Maybe Montejunas at
kakashi: Where have you read that Kanter's stock is free falling, I haven't seen
anything to indicate that. He's still top 4 in most everything I've seen.
@ Buggoff (1:16 am),What makes a great PG? What's in their
innerself, NOT how they measure.If measurements were so all-fired
great indicators, players like Nash and Bird wouldn't have excelled.Jimmer has something I haven't seen in a college player in a long time. He'll
do just fine in the NBA as a PG. He already knows what it'll take and won't quit
working at it until he's succeeded.THAT's why I'm so high on Jimmer.
Not just because he can shoot, but WHY he can. He's a "succeeder." The
NBA isn't all that full of them.The great King James proved in the
finals that great natural talent doesn't win games. LeBron is obviously missing
something.Jimmer has the IT factor to be great, the same as
Stockton, Nash, and others that weren't considered "all that" when
they came into the league.What I'd like to see the Jazz do is get
either Williams or Kanter at 3 and trade up somehow (like giving Harris or
Miles) to get a higher than 12th pick to get Jimmer.I don't see
Knight as having as much impact on the game as Jimmer will.
im all for Kanter a few months ago...but...there is something about it that is
risky...i know he is a very talented player...but his stock is free falling
right now...he is being too cautious as some say...but as of right now...i am
praying...we milk this draft for what its worth..im excited to get the draft
started...and see the new Jazz players...hope there would be some draft day
trades...and i hope we could sign battier...just to mentor Hayward...
@CaptainL, I agree with everything you are saying, might I add it's a lot harder
to find a big man that can play, don't see how we could pass on Kanter if he's
there. Jazz already having problems with Tomic's contract buyout don't see how
they would take on another one.
They said John Stockton wasn't quick either.
Derrick Rose wouldn't work out with anyone when he was drafted and look what
happened with him. Refusing to work out with other players means nothing.
one thing NBA teams need is someone who can shoot. Just like a baseball team
getting someone who can hit. If you are a natural shooter or hitter teams pick
up on that. There are lots of athletes who simply can't shoot the ball. They can
play defense and dunk but they can't consistently hit an outside "open'
shot to save their life. Jimmer can.
Even though there may be times Jimmer will be asked to slide over to the 2 spot,
I don't see it happening all the time. One area I think people are
underestimating Jimmer at is his ability to run a team and not think he has to
shoot everytime. To me he is not Price, Price struggles to run the team, Jimmer
is much calmer and under control. I would really like to see evidence that
Knight is better than Jimmer, I know he is younger and that has to count for
something but Jimmer is a better shooter, better passer, has better handles,
scores after contact better, gets to the line more often, more calm &
undercontrol.Listen to the scout, Locke had on yesterday and what he says
Bug: One of the things I like about Kanter is his overall skill level, his
athleticism, his agility etc but I like it for the 4/5 positions, I agree his
combine scores show he can move and would servive at moments if he had to play
the 3, but I think both Paul and Williams are a little more agile/mobile even
though scores don't show much difference.That isn't the point we all need
to focus on, the point is Kanter is very athletic , especially for the 4/5
position and with his skill set and physical presence, it would be a mistake to
pass him over. Like Calapari says, those who pass him over will regret it.
The trib, has an article about Kanter by Calapari, Calapari says he would take
Kanter #1 in this draft, I know he's his coach but he is also Knights coach,
what does that tell everyone, Kanter would be the best pick for the Jazz.
Everyone wants to find fault or reasons not to pick him instead of seeing all
the raasons we should pick him. The same with Jimmer, I don't think Jimmer
will fall to 12 but I sure hope he does, so the Jazz can grab him.
I like Jimmer and hope the Jazz get him. However, he is not a top 3
pick for the following reasons. 1. He is competing with great to
very good PGs in a PG heavy draft. 2. Most teams would go with the
best available big for a top 3 pick. 3. Jimmer is a senior. His D
can improve. His shooting and offense are not going to improve and has to be
adapted to the NBA.4. He is average in speed and agility at PG for
the NBA. 5. The biggest question is about his ability to run an NBA
team as a PG. Is he DWill or is he Price as a floor general? 6. He
is fine as a general guard, as a 6th man or instant offense off of the bench.
However, 90% of the true SGs are much taller with greater reach. He is not a
true SG. You do not spend a top 3 pick on a general guard. 7.
Jimmer is a decent pick at 10 give or take in a weak PG heavy draft.
Kanter is not a SF and will not play there. My point was that he has just as
much skill to do so as Millsap/Williams and Morris. The film on
Kanter is all high school or very early. It is not representative of his skill
level at this point. He is not Koufos. Koufos had a slow
reaction/release where he had to think about shooting before he decided to make
a move. He also played small for his size. He also had a flat shot. Kanter is smooth in transition and shoots with good form. He is high risk in
the sense that there is little game film and he needs a lot of work on defense.
BUT he has the tools to be a great defender. He is decisive on the court. He
reacts quickly. He moves well. He should be a good help defender and also be
able to stay in front of his man. Kanter is an okay pick at 3 so are
Knight and Williams. I will discuss the reasons Jimmer is not a top
3 pick in a minute.
Jesse: I agree that Kanter won't play any 3, I love Kanters potential and skill
set but he's a 4/5. Kashaki: I watched those videos of Kanter several days
ago and they bothered me for a while and then I realized they must not be too
much of a problem with the GM's etc, he's still in the top 5, and his skill set
is what it is, I've watched it and he is much more skilled as a shooter,
ballhandler, has better hands etc than Koufous, I don't see him like KK. I would
love the Jazz to draft Kanter but I'm feeling like Jonas V. may be the player
that they want, if his contract issues can be fixed. KOC and staff spent a lot
of time over in Europe and they must really like someone (or2)over there. I think people are limiting Jimmers potential, if they think Knight has so
much more potential, I think Jimmer can be just as good as Knight and is better
at this point. Especially as a point guard, in the right situation Jimmer could
end up like Nash.
@Kakashi, I disagree with you about Kanter, I think the Nike Hoop Summit said it
all. I can't see the Jazz passing up on him or Williams at the #3, but it is
imperative they pick up someone who can light it up from outside with one of
their picks and I think Fredette is the most sure one to do that in the NBA.
Kanter cannot and will not ever play the 3, not even spot duty. Just because a
guy worked all year to be good at some drills (because he had nothing else to do
while being ineligible) does not mean that that will tranlate to the actual game
of basketball. He is clearly a 4/5. You can't just look at their times and
compare Kanter & Williams. Look at the fluidity of their movements. Williams
may not be a true 3 either, but he has the potential to work on it. Worst case
scenario is he is Tyrus Thomas, but he already has more offensive game. Kanter's
worst case scenario is Kosta Koufos, although his potenial could be higher than
Williams. If we have a choice, I say go for the sure thing. If Williams isn't
there at 3, I still don't know if Kanter is the guy.
@Localblue: Name me one player in this draft that has no weakness. They don't
exist. Jimmer's weakness apparently is that he's white and not from a BCS
Look I love jimmer as much as the next guy, but you guys want to take him at 3?
His ceiling is nowhere near Knights, Williams or Kanter who are all projected to
the jazz by analysts. Jimmer will be available at 12, believe me. If he's not,
then good for him for jumping higher! He is not worth the 3rd pick.
I don't believe he can guard the elite guards on defense and I don't think he
can score on the elite guards, such as Paul, Kobe, Wade, etc etc. He'll be a
great back-up point-guard and a great 6th man, but guys like Williams, Kanter
and Knight have the potential to be All-Star/franchise players, something I
think Jimmer is NOT capable of. I hope I'm wrong, but that is just
the way I see it.
@WhatsInItForMethere are new videos of Enes Kanter on draft
express...and his stock is free falling...the third pick right now..is not a
lock...and as much as i like Kanter's potential...im going to stay away from him
from now...he is very choosy with his workouts...and that seems
questionable...Jonas Valaciunas might go up...Jimmer Fredette might move up to
the 3rd slot...i think as you have pointed out..Kanter's lack of exposure to
decent competition...makes him a huge risk at the 3...i think someone pointed
out that Kanter could be a Koufos...i think that's a possibility...with the new
footage i just saw...i dont think the third pick is a lock...i'd rather draft
jimmer right now...
@PAC manShane Battier for one...Jason Kidd played great defense
against Kobe, Lebron and wade...Ray Allen plays great close D against Kobe
during last year's finals...@AFCougHayward is already
the future SG of the team...we need a SF that can stretch the D..and play honest
King James is 6"8" and 250. Millsap is also. Williams is
6"9" and 248. However, Kanter is 6"11" and 259.
Kanter is just as agile and fast as Williams. If Williams can play SF so can
Kanter. Kanter can shoot from the outside. Vesley is 6'11" and
240. I doubt if he is faster or more agile than Kanter/Williams. Vesley
struggles to guard outside and is not a good shot especially FTs, yet he is the
top SF in the draft. Marieff Morris claims to be an SF 6'9"
241. Kanter has to be as good as him at SF. My point is that Kanter
could play 3 positions. He would have to work on dribbling but he dribbles about
as well as Vesley. He can hit the corner 3 and the top of the key 3. He has a
decent mid range jumper with a quick release.If Millsap can play the
SF (remains to be seen) then Kanter can also play it. Kanter is NOT
an SF but he has enough athleticism to play it if needed.Kanter is
a rare gifted big. He needs work but will be exceptional.
Given a choice among Jimmer, Burks and Thompson I would take Jimmer. He is more
versatile. However, all 3 may be gone by the 12th pick. The boards are moving
around but Jimmer is moving up. The Jazz could get Singlton at 12.
A lot depends on what happens with the Euros and if they drop. I
think it is pretty much a toss up between Knight and Kanter at 3. Unless he is
injured I do not see Irving dropping. Williams is probably gone as MN trades the
pick.How high Jimmer moves depends partly on Kemba's workouts. If he
drops Jimmer will rise. There are also a lot of Vets being shopped
for move up picks. In a lock out year when the Jazz have to pay 5
mill in lux tax, I would not be surprised if the Jazz do not resign AK and also
move Harris just to save money. It is a great year to just rebuild.
Knight becomes the new PG (not ready) and a new SF has to be found. I do not
believe Millsap can play the 3. I think Kanter can play the 3 just as well as
AFCoug: If Burks was a lights out 3 pt shooter that would be good but he's not,
shooting is his problem, he has great handles and is a good athlete but he's not
a good shooter.
I like the idea of trading down with Washington for the #6 and #18. Then
combine the #12 and #18 to move up to #9 or #10. With the #6 take Jimmer and
then at #9/10 take Burks. This would fill the two most gaping holes in the
Jazz's offense and give them a 6'6'' true shooting guard and lights out 3 point
David Locke had an interview with a scout and they call him scout and he was
very interesting, he likes Jimmer, listen , it's on the Jazz site.
Jimmer goes to Kings? Kings move to Anaheim, near me? I'm there.
Jazz Source Who plays defense in the NBA?
@WhatsInItForMeyou cant downplay Kanter's skill set...and he will
definitely produce...and we have a few needs...you can't pass up on a big with
loads of talent...Timberwolves would probably draft him at 2...which in
turn...might get us Irving...Timberwolves' GM is a wildcard everytime he
drafts...so we might see him grab Kanter and leave us with the decision of
taking Irving...I am definitely convinced Williams would go 1...and Brandon
Knight at 4...I know a lot of here isnt impressed with jimmer...its like the
time...everyone was not impressed with Hayward...but i kept preaching that
Hayward just needs confidence...coz you rarely get a guy 6'9" that has a PG
skillset...could run after a fast break block...and with very refined shot
selection even before the draft watching him at butler impressed me enough...and
i think its happening again with jimmer...i do want him in a Jazz uniform next
season...he has the swagger to produce at a high level...im really hoping...the
Jazz gets Kanter and Jimmer...if not jimmer i'll just trust the brass...
Oh my gosh! People have been Jimmered!I like Jimmer and I think he
will have a successful career in the NBA but the talent in the NBA is soooooooo
much higher than college there really is no comparison.Jimmer is a
decent talent in this draft but lets not forget, this draft is hugely devoid of
much talent at all. These guys currently picked in the top 3 would be 9-12 in
other draft years.People have lost all sanity when it comes to
Jimmer and they are making him out to be something he is not.The guy
can shoot for sure.Honestly though, nobody knows what his defense in
the NBA will be because he is playing against weak nba talent (at best) right
now so it is all relative. People need to get a grip. I wish the
best for Jimmer but people have lost all rationale thought on this guy. All his workouts thus far have been against who? Fringe
d-league/college talent.Perspective people.
What Uncle Taft is not telling the media is that Jimmer has been improving his
quickness and vertical by wearing Shape-Ups when he's not on the court. A
source close to me tells me that he even wears them to bed.
One thing is certain: Any contender would salivate over Jimmer.Would Jimmer have fit into last night's game?The Mavs ran a
zone.The Heat couldn't shoot.Jimmer can do anything JJ Barea
can do except speak Spanish.
Best suggestions so far: Williams or Kanter AND Jimmer.Get it done,
Jazz. You owe us one after letting Matthews go.
What I really like about Jimmer is his self motivation and discipline. He is
humble enough to recognize he has some weaknesses and he went out and did
something about it. We see a lot of players that are loaded with natural talent.
But it is a rare thing to see that level of natural talent combined with the
level of commitment to continuously improve that Jimmer brings to the table. And
his will to defy critics and prove them wrong is almost Jordanesque.I used to think that Jimmer was going to be an average coming off the bench in
the NBA. Now I am starting to think he is going to be much more than that.
@ Captain L (10:34am),Guess we'll have to disagree on whether Kanter
or Jimmer would mean more over time to the Jazz.I feel the Jazz have
a much greater need at PG than C/PF. Thus I'd choose Jimmer over Kanter.Remember, the Jazz have a good lottery pick (hopefully) next year when
there should be a much better selection of big men. I doubt any PG next year
will wow the college scene the way Jimmer, Walker, and Knight did.So, considering next year's draft, I'd go with the PG this year and C/PF next
year, if it comes down to that. Ideal would be to get either Kanter or Williams
AND Jimmer this year.And, I agree that Jimmer is a better pick than
Knight or Walker (at any pick).
The Jazz are getting as much WP48 out of AJ/Millsap as they were out of
Boozer/Okur. It is more balanced now as AJ/Millsap are about 15 and 15 where
Boozer was 25 and Okur was 5. The key problems lie in the loss of
Korver, Mathews and Brewer. They have been replaced by Bell. The Jazz were a
.500 team before Korver. They are worse now. Bell can't replace all 3. Brewer could not shoot but he could slash as long as Korver could open things
up. The Jazz lost DWill and he has to be replaced 25+ WP48. Knight
is the best candidate. They will lose AK 18-20 WP48. I do not know who they get
to do that. Hayward should replace Williams. Favors will replace
Boozer in the long run. PG, SF and one more wing who can shoot are
crucial in the long run. Improved D is also necessary. BPA will allow the Jazz to trade for more picks and also the right players in
the long run. The key is to get the right players at each position.
Sloan played a lot of people out of position.
Just trade both picks for young established players that have proven themselves
and go after a free agent or two, because there are a few that are ballers.
Forget this rookie crap, we have too many now.
@ Captain L (10:09am),I'm not biased against Kanter, other than I
have yet to see how he'll be a contributor any time soon. Way too little
experience to suddently blossom in the NBA.Far too many players from
high school or one year of college have failed to produce right away, yet many
that waited until after their Jr or Sr year to go to the NBA have flourished
quickly due to their "basketball maturity."And no, I
wasn't trying to make one player look better than another. If I had, I'd have
not allowed Walker to score so high, as I don't think he's any where near as
good as Jimmer. It just came out the way it did.Like I'd said in
another post, this started out as an exercise for my own information, and I was
surprised when I added things up how much lower Kanter scored than the others.
I think Knight will be a better shooter and defender than Evans. However you
could also get Vesley at 7 in addition to Evans and still have the 12 to add
depth.The Jazz need a couple of great players from the draft. One
this year and one next. Volume is less important than getting the very best PG
and SG/SF that they can. Or a game changing big. It is about
quality. For that reason I do not think they will trade. This is a
multi year rebuilding plan. Don't worry about immediate impact. The Jazz are not
going to contend next year. It is about getting the ideal players
into the key positions. PG and PF have been the key positions followed by a wing
who can shoot.
There is talk of CHA taking Burks or Moti at 9. I doubt if SAC takes Jimmer. SI
also speculates CHA will trade (9 & 19) up with MN to get Williams (2).However, there is also a lot of talk about playoff teams trying to move
up to get Jimmer. How high and how much they will pay remains to be seen. I doubt if the Jazz would trade the 3 for 9 & 19. You use lotto
picks to get stars. The Jazz do not need the 19. SI has the Jazz taking Kemba
and Morris. I think a lot of mocks just plug in garbage on the Jazz to get the
players they want to fall to the teams they want. There were rumors
of a SAC/Utah trade of the 3 pick, Bell and CJ for the 7th pick and Ty Evans or
a 3 way with Evans, Thorton and the 7th for Harris and CJ to POR and 3rd,
Fernandez and Oden to SAC. SAC wants Knight.It sounds like KOC wrote
those rumors. Getting Evans and/or Thorton for moving down 4 spots is a
dream.The Jazz have lots of options.
WhatsInItForMe: I don't necessarily disagree with you but having a chance to
draft a big with a ton of talent and skills doesn't come around very often and
so even though I love Jimmer and what he brings, I'd say we have to take a big
(Kanter) at 3 over Jimmer. Remember, KOC said it's not what they will produce
this year but in 3 yrs. KOC and staff are working real hard and I have
faith they will make the right choice (I say that with a little trepidation). I
didn't think Hayward was even in the conversation last year and yet when I
looked closer at him, I was impressed as to why they chose him.My biggest
concern and where I would have the biggest problem is if the Jazz drafted Knight
at 3, I think Jimmer is better than Knight or Walker and will have a better
career. Not many will agree with that but Jimmer is determined to prove people
wrong and be the best, so far he has done a pretty good job of proving people
wrong. I'm hoping the JazzFOsees his game and potential.
the takeaway from this article...Anyone who knows anything about
basketball would take Jimmer no. 1 in the draft. If he goes 20, that only means
there are 19 teams that don't have anyone in their organization that knows
anything about basketball.However biased and unrealistic this
article is, Jimmer really will be fun to watch at the next level. Hope he can
find some playing time.
Bug, I have had Kanter on the top of my list for the very reasons you listed,
WhatsInItForMe, is definitely underrating Kanter, Kanters biggist assest is his
offense and he rates him a 1, shows his bias, and trying to manipulate his stats
to support his opinion. All of these young rookies will take time to develop and
produce and the situation they end up in team wise will depend on how fast they
progress. My hope is that Favors, AJ & Kanter can be that 3 man rotation,
that would be pretty formidable. Milsaps would have to be traded, unless he
shows he can play the 3 better than I think he can. I would love to see the Jazz
get Jimmer, I think he fills some definite needs the Jazz have. My top
senerio would be for the Jazz to get Kanter and Jimmer, the way Jimmer is
playing at the workouts is making that possibility less likely. I will keep
hoping though. If we do take Kanter, the FO could be planning on moving Milsap
or Big Al and that could bring in other players/or draftpicks.
@ Kakashi,My basis for scoring is just observing what most people
are saying, and having watched enough on each of them, including combine stats
and workout reports.That doesn't nullify my ratings. Just did my
homework as best I could for the time I have.I'd like to see other
commenters' take on THEIR numbers for these five players. I doubt the end result
would be that different for Kanter, the main point of what I got from doing
it.It really started out as an exercise for myself. Then I decided
to go ahead and post it.And yes, I'd feel good about getting both
Kanter (or Williams) and Jimmer, but not at the expense of Jimmer. I believe
he'll contribute more and sooner than Kanter can, considering who the Jazz have
on their team (a key issue).
@ Bugoff,I'm not saying that Kanter won't one day be a top big man
in the NBA, just that he won't contribute all that soon due to his lack of
experience.Maybe he's a quick learner like you believe? Dunno.I believe a 3rd pick should be for someone who can contribute sooner
than later.Thus, I believe Kanter is a good pick for a team that
doesn't need outside shooting as badly as the Jazz do, or help at SF. Therefore,
my desire for Williams (SF) or Jimmer (scoring) at 3.I'd love to see
the Jazz make a trade with someone like Harris or Miles and the 12th pick to get
a pick above 7 to get maybe both Williams (3) and Jimmer (6 or better).I don't think Jimmer will be passed up by Sacramento (or even Charlotte at 9,
like you said).
Jp3 - did you not read the article and just skip directly to the comment boards?
It said Jimmer was tested, and did great on the speed test. That means this was
@WhatsInItForMewhat is your basis from your
scoring?...yourself?...then that nullifies it...since you are biased with
jimmer...im not saying not draft jimmer...im actually in favor of it...but you
should have references...to even make your point count....as far as im
concerned...if we get Kanter and Jimmer that would be great...
If the Jazz have AJ, Favors and Kanter for a front line rotation to go with
Hayward at SG and AK/Millsap or trade/draft at SF and a decent PG and bench they
will be one of the top teams in the league.The Jazz should have all
of the pieces to contend after NEXT years draft.BUT they could trade
Harris or Millsap for a very good player or two. They might move Harris on draft
night for another high pick and have Watson run the team in the lockout year.
That saves salary and gives Kanter/Favors time to develop (keep Millsap).TOR needs an experienced PG and leadership. Harris may be a good fit for
them? They might also get Derozan back for Harris and move Hayward to SF. Or if
they really want to they could have TOR grab Jimmer or Knight/Kemba (if
available)in return for Harris. DET might be a trading partner for
Harris for the 8th pick (Jimmer) and a player.KOC has options. He
has a great plan. This is the first time I have seen Utah actually go after
enough talent to win.
@What I think you are under rating Kanter. He is a consensus top 5 pick for a
lot of reasons. He is just as quick and fast as Williams and bigger. He probably
is better than Williams but there is NO college footage on him. Kanter can also
shoot from the outside. He is going to be better than Memo. Kanter will produce
sooner, shoot better and assist better than you rate him. You can't
teach size and playing him with AJ and Favors in a 3 big rotation would be
killer 2 years from now. That would rival the Laker front line and would be
better than DAL or SA.The Jazz are not taking Jimmer at 3. Unless
something changes CHA is taking Jimmer at 9. They could take Thompson if the
Jazz get lucky. Or the Jazz might trade.
Silas claims that CHA is looking for 3 point shooting to open up the inside. Larry Brown like Sloan did not utilize the 3 and choked off his inside
game. The comments by Silas are pointed AND very clear. That is very DUMB
basketball. I do not care if Brown won a championship and Sloan is HOF. The
approach is still dumb. Silas is looking for 3 point shooting and
Jimmer is a prime candidate. In the list of top 22 Gs in the league
only 2 or 3 are taller than 6'3". Almost all of the 28 PGs are 6'3" or
smaller. The pure SGs 11 are taller. BUT you do not have to be taller than
6'3" to play SG well in this league. Biyombo hurt his lotto
status by missing most of his jump shots inside of 10 feet. PAINFUL was the word
used to describe his workout. FES is better than this guy. The Jazz need to run
from the BB bandwagon. That means Jimmer is jumping him as BB drops.
What counts in an NBA draftee?> Produce sooner than later?> Can score?> Can rebound (bigs)?> Can assist
(guards)?> Can defend their position?So how do Williams,
Kanter, Knight, Walker, and Jimmer stack up here?1 = not so much2 = maybe3 = certainlyProduce soon:Williams=3Kanter=1Knight=2Kemba=3Jimmer=3Score:Williams=2Kanter=1Knight=2Kemba=2Jimmer=3Rebound:Williams=2Kanter=3Knight=1Kemba=1Jimmer=1Assist:Williams=1Kanter=1Knight=3Kemba=3Jimmer=3Defend:Williams=3Kanter=2Knight=3Kemba=3Jimmer=2Results:Williams = 11Kanter = 8Knight = 11Kemba
= 12Jimmer = 12What this tells me is that Kanter should NOT be
picked at 3. He has less to offer overall for such a high draft pick.It also tells me that Jimmer's just as viable at 3 as the others are.Interesting that Kemba comes out tied with Jimmer, yet Knight and Williams are
considered better picks at 3 than them. Sure, there are other factors, but I
think this little exercise does indicate that Kanter isn't a good 3 pick.
"he hasn't even played in the NBA and some of you have him retired and in
the hall of fame.. hes not that good and he is definitely over rated" @gizmo33:You are the only one who mentioned the "hall
of fame". Over rated?? - you have proven your credibility. (utah didn't
have a very good year, did they.)
Well, the Jazz will pass on him, because, as they say, his "novelty"
will wear off...yep...just like the Jazz...misread players they draft...they'll
end up with another loser they'll trade in two years. Jazz...someone up there is listening to too much rap music...As
long as they have the current management...don't expect much.
#3?, Jazz?, Wow, I just might be persuaded to watch NBA this year.
I'm still thinking top 5 for Jimmer. I wonder how well he'll do at the Jazz
workout on Wednesday. That's the real test and also if B. Knight will show.If anything else, this article shows exactly how stupid the Kings
are.Jazz scouts do research on this and they know that Kings are picking
Jimmer at 7.But when Jazz had a workout with Kanter, nobody knows how it
went so nobody can say if Jazz will pick him or not which gives the Jazz great
trading advantage over teams.
localblue: I don't know how good Jimmer will end up being, like many have said,
he may be a role player or he could be an all star, time will tell, but I don't
know where you are coming from with your comments that GM's are talking about
his weaknesses, I have read pretty much everything I can find and I haven't read
anything negative or complaining about Jimmers weaknesses. Jimmer definitely has
weaknesses and that is not what I'm disputing, I'm wondering where your coming
up with comments from GM's AFTER Jimmers workouts that talk about his
weaknesses, I haven't read any. Where are you reading these comments.
If the Jazz get a big with #3 Jimmer is the best choice at #12. I doubt he will
still be there so it may be a moot point but there will be some teams who will
wish they had drafted him instead of whoever they chose. You can't teach heart
and Jimmer has enough for any 2 others in this draft.
A lot of these comments are crazy and drinking the kool-aid. You are commenting
after reading only positive articles on Jimmer. Read them all, not just the
positive ones. A lot of GMs still think he has weaknesses AFTER the combine and
AFTER seeing him in the workouts. We skip over those comments and just go for
the articles written in the hometown Desnews. When you look back at past drafts
the best picks are first those who are not only great basketball players but
also great athletes, Jordan, Wade, Rose, Kobe, etc., all of whom were not first
picks and were passed up for big guys. The next best guys in the drafts are
usually the bigs, guys who are fundamentally sound but also have size. And then
third are those who are hard workers, fundamentally sound and know the game,
i.e, Jimmer. I'm not saying he won't turn out to be the next Stockton or DWill
but with the 3 pick you definitely want to try to get somebody who will be more
than Jimmer. After all, Jordan was a 3 pick.
What does Jimmer have that no one else has in this draft? Just think about it.
Next question, Name five pure shooters in the NBA today. Defense is a different
animal in the NBA. The concept is called team defense or help defense. Notice
what Dallas has been doing. Lets revisit the original question. Jimmer is a pure
shooter, no one else in the Draft is a pure shooter. Jeff
Many ute fans, out of hatred for the Y, speculate that Jimmer is overrated.
But with real proof, we know both Bogut and A Smith were extremely overrated.
Give the kid 3 years in the NBA and then everyone can talk. Stockton was not
a starter his rookie year, barely played. We'll see who was smart and who
We have been doing this draft analysis now for nearly two months and there isn't
alot more to talk about. Every little tid bit of info is gobbled up and enjoyed
but we really don't know much. The Jazz FO (KOC & staff) are very tight
lipped and don't let out anything as to their preferences. The only things we
see are peoples opinions and the so called experts predictions. As the players
perform in their workouts it gives us more info to speculate about but I don't
think we know any more now than we did two months ago. I have always liked
Jimmer but because he's a home town boy and white, I've probably not wanted to
over do my hopes or predictions for him and therefore have kept him down alittle
but as he continues to do better and after watching his compitions videos over
and over, I don't have a problem saying he's as good as Knight or Walker and
probably better. Those who aren't fans will probably goo hoo that he could be as
good but the proof is in the pudding. Watch as see.
I sure hope...we dont end up saying..."i told you so"
i agree with shaybo...but if one stock rises...im sure another one will
drop....Jimmer, Donatas and Singleton if possible...i think Biyombos stock would
fall...if we do get kanter...why not trade up with the 12th pick to get
jimmer?...12th pick +CJ for the 6th pick...
@Realistic: Either on Hoopsworld or nbadraft.net. It said that Morris played so
well that his stock will rise out of the Knicks range.
As a PG Jimmer should be some place between Price and DWill. He
should shoot and run the offense better than Price. He should defend as well or
better than Price who gambles a lot. He should shoot as well or better than
DWill and might run the team as well. As an SG/combo guard it is
harder to peg him. However, he should be someplace between Willie Green of SA to
Felton of Denver to Jet Terry of DAL to Monte Ellis of GS. Given the
number of prolific SGs in the league who are 6'1"-6'3" Jimmer should
have no problems playing SG. The height argument does not prevent
him from playing SG effectively.
No one is annointing Jimmer as the Messiah. No one knows for sure if he will be
a starter, bench player, a star, or bust.However, it does seem
apparent that his draft stock is rising somewhat. He does seem to be performing
better than many critics had suggested. My guess is that Jimmer will struggle
initially, as most rookies do, but will get better with each passing year as he
continues to work on his game.So, let's just enjoy this draft
speculation. We will see on the 23rd where he ends up. But the jury probably
won't be in on Jimmer's NBA success for a few years yet.
You know, I'm sure after D-Rose, D-Will, CP3, Westbrook, Rondo, heck even Devin
Harris break his ankles a few times, our expectations of Jimmer will be a little
more realistic.I hope he does well. He is a great scorer. But lets
see him get to an All-Star game before we annoint him the Messiah.
Suggesting Jimmer is not quick is nonsense. He is every bit as quick/fast as
DWill. The Jazz are not giving up the 3 pick. They might move up a
few spots with the 12 IF forced. They would like to have Jimmer BUT Burks shoots
better than Brewer and Thompson plays D better than Korver. So if they miss
Jimmer they will still get a very good SG/SF. CO ran a strange weave
offense with their wings so Burks did not get good outside shots and his 3 point
% reflects the offense they ran. He is shooting well in the workouts and it is
clear he can shoot better than his college stats. Thompson like
Jimmer was the primary scorer and did not play D. Now in the workouts he is
playing decent D. Jimmer still has to demonstrate he can run an
traditional offense well. He should be able to do it but he is just as unproven
as Knight at running the Jazz offense since BYU did not have a regular offense.
Jimmer is going to do well. Is he the best option for the Jazz? IF they can get him at 12.
he hasnt even played in the NBA and some of you have him retired and in the hall
of fame.. hes not that good and he is definatly over rated
If you say so Dick!!! Sacramento hasn't seen "speed" or "d"
over the years, their program is in shambles!
JImmer does well in the work outs. That is no surprise. If you
want to know how he will do in the NBA look at his game films against Leonard of
SDSU who will be a top 5 or 6 pick and Jacob Pullen of KSU. Jacob is as quick as
anybody in the draft. The game films are a much better indication of
NBA ability than the workouts.
Right jp3 that's why it was so easy to guard Fredette in college, cause he had
no quickness, you should have tried watching him without your Utah Ute eyes,
maybe you would have seen him overcoming the 2 and sometimes 3 defenders that
were always trying to stay up with him.
I can find no evidence that Darius Morris got the better of Jimmer at the Knicks
workout. What are you basing this on? A tweet from Mark Spears? Come on, you
got to do better than that. What references do you have?According
to ESPN's Chad Ford, " Some very good decisions in 2-on-2 by both Jimmer
and (Darius) Morris. They think Jimmer has bball IQ to be a PG in the NBA. Sounds like it was (Klay) Thompson-Jimmer that stood out. Both shot
the lights out Im told. No surprise there.
Can't wait for the workout coming up next week. It will be good to measure up
the three against each other. All of these hopefuls have +\-'s. Walker, is
probably the most polished PG(see stats) Knight needs way more time, and for the
12 pick Burks, he's good but can't shoot, not the right guy for us, we don't
need another project. All of the info coming in on J'ma will make the decision
that much tougher for Jazz. I've said it all along J'ma wont be there at 12.
Shaybo hit it on the head.........unless of course the Jazz want to go big at 3.
The Jazz are good poker players, and will play their cards close to the vest
I watched most of his games this past season--I didn't see quickness then--why
should I believe this propaganda that he's suddenly become a speed demon? The
true point guard on BYU, Jackson Emery, was quicker than Fredette. Fredette is
slow, he displayed it game after game against MWC opponents. He's a great
shooter, of course, but quick he is not.
If the Jazz aren't going to use the #3 pick on a big, I think Shaybo's idea
would be a good one, if Wash. would make that trade, I'm not convinced Knight is
any better than Jimmer, I'd rather the Jazz give Wash. #3 & Bell for the 6th
& 18th then take Jimmer at 6, then, Burk,or Singleton or BB at 12 and Brooks
or Harris at 18. Nogueira isn't showing very well over in Europe from what I've
read, his attitude is questionable. L Nugueira measured out at 6'9 barefoot, not
as tall as thought.None of the incoming guards have Jimmers skill set, I
like Burks handles and athleticism but he can't shoot, (yet), Jimmer has much
more of a complete package. Knight and Walker are both good athletes and have
good skills but not as polished as Jimmer.I have no idea what the Jazz
brass are thinking and how players over in Europe are impressing or not
impressing them , from what I've read no one is shinning over there. If we
can't get Kanter or Williams with #3 then trade and get Jimmer.
All of you should be aware that Darius Morris 6-6 pure point guard beat Jimmer
bad in the workout with the Knicks.. So says the media. The workout on the 15th
should be quite interesting.. For the next eleven days we will hear truth and
talk with the media. Everyone is trying to sell their man. Jazz will make the
Agree with shaybo.. Try to trade down a little and get an extra pick for a
young, athletic wing (Ronnie Brewer-type) and use the 6th or whatever to get
Jimmer. But if not, Jimmer will be the 3rd best player, at least, in this
draft, so take him 3rd.
Taft isn't just an uncle, he is a world renowned speed and conditioning coach
who has trained the best. I think those in the know will take his remarks very
I think the Kings at pick #7 are the first team you have to worry about so
instead of using #3 on him, maybe try to swap the #3 pick and maybe CJ for #6
and #18 with Wizzards who would love to move down to get Kanter, then use the #6
on Fredette and then you still get someone good, possible Brooks or Singleton
#12 and you could go after a player with hugh down the road upside like Lucas
Nogueira with the #18.
As I watch and read about all the workouts, here in the US and over in Europe,
non of the prospects are killing it like Jimmer is. Even those of us who are
Jimmer fans are probably underestimating him. Offensively his is pretty
unstopable and athletically he is showing he can do what it takes to play D.
Jimmer plays the game smart, he uses stop and go, hesitation, change of
direction, crossover or double crossover and he's in control the whole time. I
hope the Jazz find some way of getting Jimmer, he'll be worth it. To me he is
better than Knight and I'd take Jimmer over Knight. Think of Stockton, he wasn't
the most athletic, he was athletic enough though and Jimmer is the same, Stock
played smart, Jimmer can do the same and has the attitude to be great.
@Not so fast."Wow, pass the Kool Aid, readers here want to put
this kid in the hall of fame today!"No, I like to listen to
those who know this kid and I am not talking about the so called experts either.
I like to hear from those who played with and against him, both in college and
the pros, and they all say the same thing that he is the real deal and that he
is a nightmare to defend this type of stuff goes on and on about him. When you
really want to know listen to the real experts, those who play the game!
Nice work outs for Jimmer. Glad to see he's wowing the teams he's playing for.
He's an automatic first rounder, that is awesome enough. The team that takes him
is going to get an individual who had to be guarded by opponents with help from
over half their team, in the NBA he won't have to deal with that as much. He's
is going to have a great career. re: not so fast. His uncle isn't
the source of the article. C'mon, lighten up, no reason not to get excited for
one of the best players ever to have played in Utah. Enjoy life a little.
Jimmer's workout with the Jazz will be BIG! If He wows the Jazz clowns, they
will take him at #3, guaranteed! There is no way they pass on him with all the
hype He has been getting so far. If anyone ever fit what the Jazz stand for and
believe in, it's Jimmer! Hard working, loves Utah, and Gangsta game without the
gangsta look and attitude. If Jimmer impresses in his Jazz workout,
Jazz shocks the NBA world and takes Jimmer number three! Kind of like when they
took a kid out of Gonzaga over 20 years ago. Personally, I would
love to see Jimmer play for the Lakers. I hope they make some moves to get
I don't want Jimmer to go the the Jazz, I want them to remember, THEY PASSED HIM
UP! every time he drops 20+ on them in ESA and the crowd chants YOU GOT
I've appreciated watching Jimmer, but now I'm starting to think that even I
haven't realized some of his greatness because he's been playing in my back yard
so to speak. I'm realizing that the Jazz need to trade their No. 3 pick for a
proven big guy and then trade up to No. 6 or maybe No. 5 to get Jimmer. I won't
be a bit surprised if Jimmer ends up the steal of the draft. I'm not sure
Jimmer has a weakness other than his height, but when I think of some of the
greatest point guards in the past 30 years, he's probably right at average,
which is 6'2" in shoes, and he's a bit heavier and stronger than the
average starting point guard last year (2011 average was 6'2", 185#). If
the Jazz don't get Jimmer, I might finally spring for the NBA package on sat TV.
I agree AZJazzFan... Jimmer is a special talent. You simply cannot find someone
who is as committed to improving and getting better than Jimmer very often. The
Jazz really don't need more size. With Jefferson, Favors, Millsap, future
reception of Tomic, etc... we don't need another big. But we do need a better
backup point guard. Jimmer is proving he can out-compete his competition and he
can definitely out shoot them on a consistent basis. I think Jimmer will be off
the board by 12. Bringing someone who brings star power AND a great skill that
has nowhere to but up to go, why pass him up at 3?
I thought I heard somewhere before from some people that Jimmer could not play
defense. I guess they were wrong. Apparently the NBA thinks so, and if he is
good at D then the Jazz should use their number 3 pick and draft Jimmer.If Jimmer continues to impress with quickness and defense, he may not be
around at 3.
Wow, pass the Kool Aid, readers here want to put this kid in the hall of fame
today!I have nothing against Jimmer but seriously, look at the
sources. His uncle? He has every reason to talk Jimmer up and what a Provo
native saw other people saying or not saying to a player isn't going to hold up
in court. The Maloofs, barely able to keep a team in Sacramento, are not
basketball experts at all, only rich.They are nice stories, but its
grain of salt time.I hope the Jimmer has great success but lets not
claim the kid can walk on water just yet.
The Jazz should take him at 3. If they don't, whoever they take at 3 will not
be as good as Jimmer and the Jazz will regret it for the remainder of Jimmer's
BYU needs to connect with Lee Taft ASAP. If he can design a strength and speed
set of routines for basketball players and maybe other athletes, BYU would
benefit greatly. With the influx of 6'10"-200 lb. players coming in, the
stickman type of kid, the program could certainly use a method for adding
shoulders and upper body muscle mass. Jimmer has shoulders and strength, most
I am telling you if the Jazz get this kid he will be the answer to what this
team really needs. The problem he won't be around at 12. Walker and Knight don't
want any part of this kid why would they? They don't want to show people that he
belongs way higher up in the draft. He should be ahead of them in the draft and
they know it!
It's fairly obvious that all the Player of the Year awards went to the right
guy. Sooner or later, Knight and Walker will have to guard Jimmer. Good luck on