Comments about ‘Readers' forum: Ice Age is upon us’

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Published: Wednesday, June 1 2011 12:00 a.m. MDT

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Roland Kayser
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Google the effects of warming on the jet stream before making such a comment.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

Back home in maryland my mom returned from vacation to find the house at 90 degrees (so much for that leaving the AC off plan). You see, Frederick, MD hit 102 today and that's a city that has the same average temperatures yearround (roughly) as Salt Lake City but you're not going to see me say that proves global warming. The reason is there's anomalies everywhere and if we're talking about global warming, you have to look at the globe.

DougS
Oakley, UT

Phoey! The big argument is whether any of our weather is caused by MAN. What little science implies that it is...is countered by Nature itself. Most CO2 is a result of natural causes, most polution is a result of natural causes, therefore, unless "Mother Nature" can be swayed by legislative means, the weather will continue to frustrate those who wish to control the globe.

RanchHand
Huntsville, UT

Climate and weather.

Climate changes doesn't mean that you still won't have local weather conditions.

ECR
Burke, VA

Kirk - look a little beyond your North Salt Lake neighborhood and you might find a different story. A friend of mine from Logan reported snow on Memorial Day while I was sweltering through 95 degrees with a humidity factor making it feel like 103. This tornado season has been one of the most deadly in recent history and one of the most deadly in all history. The hundreds that have been killed by these horrific, violent storms might have a different take on the changing weather than your simplistic viewpoint.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

Real, unbiased,financially detached science is now debunking the global warming hoax. Satellite imagines show ocean levels are stable,not raising as James Hansen NASA "scientist" predicted in the 80's. Global mean temperatures have been dropping steadily since 1999, not increasing as some predicted. This in face of increasing CO2 emissions from China and India. Rasmussen polls show most Americans no longer believe in man made global warming. We have just had the coldest winter and spring in N. America since 1917 documented by real, honest meteorologists. None of the dire environmental predictions made in the 80's and 90's have come true. They could not have been more wrong! And still some still hope for a massive cap and trade transfer of wealth, which is really this silly scam was about!

KM
Cedar Hills, UT

Presidents involved in CCX makes me question the relevance of global warming. If there is something to be gained by these evil groups and people by selling carbon credits then, in my opinion, its probably a scam.

Blue
Salt Lake City, UT

DougS and Mountanman,

The scientific evidence is abundant that global warming is real and man-made.

"Most CO2 is a result of natural causes..."

That is incorrect. Scientists can study the nuclei of the carbon atoms in atmospheric CO2 and trace the source of the carbon. Earth's rapidly climbing levels of atmospheric CO2 comes from the combustion of fossil fuels. That's an established scientific fact.

"Real, unbiased,financially detached science is now debunking the global warming hoax."

That's wildly untrue. The real and unbiased science establishing the reality of anthropogenic global warming is massive and growing. Google "global warming evidence" and see what happens.

If you're going to argue against that, please cite your sources and the professional science journals that publish that research. Op-ed pieces from Exxon-funded "think tanks" don't count.

"Rasmussen polls show most Americans no longer believe in man made global warming."

The laws of physics could care less.

"None of the dire environmental predictions made in the 80's and 90's have come true"

What a whopper! Cite your sources for that claim. The reality is that the warming is _faster_ than predicted.

Ok
Salt Lake City, Utah

I kind of like the cold weather we have been having. But then, I own stock in the gas company. The cold weather works for me, thanks Mother Nature.

Screwdriver
Casa Grande, AZ

G-L-O-B-A-L does not mean YOU right there.

It wasn't funny the first thousand times and it's still not funny. People laugh when you say it allright, it's just that they aren't laughing with you like you think.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

Re Blue. Thanks but I am obliged to stand by the findings of my own open minded study of this issue. I invite you to site one example of any dire prediction happening caused by man made global warming! Oceans are not rising, snow still falls everywhere it always has, deserts are not getting larger and the earth has been cooling since 1999. These facts are indisputable regardless of an ever shrinking number of people who want it to be otherwise!

procuradorfiscal
Tooele, UT

Re: "How many of these sophomoric, ignorant comments will the Deseret News print?"

As many as climate "scientists" pass their way, is my guess.

At least until these "scientists" run out of excuses as to why their global warming theories are unable to predict anything, and can't be otherwise validated.

But by then, of course, these "scientists" will have moved on to some new imminent catastrophe that can only be addressed by the immediate destruction of capitalism and an unthinking, head-first dive into redistributive socialism.

That's their scam. Has been for years. Proponents of these tired, discredited socialist scams, whatever else they may be, are best categorized by the phrase, "one-trick pony."

Blue
Salt Lake City, UT

Mountanman, you're pursuing your own "open minded study"? Please explain.

"I invite you to site one example of any dire prediction happening caused by man made global warming!"

This took about a minute to find: Amber J. Soja et al., Climate-induced boreal forest change: Predictions versus current observations, Global and Planetary Change (2006).

Quoting from the research conclusions:

"Scientific evidence of the transformation of landscapes due to changes in climate is mounting throughout the circumboreal zone in Alaska, Canada and Russia. In this investigation, we reviewed previous predictions of climate-induced landscape-scale change in an effort to determine whether the currently warmer conditions have resulted in the predicted effects. We found that the predicted keystone indicators of initial change demonstrate that alterations in ecosystems are currently underway. Given the increases in temperature in boreal regions over the last decades, these modifications of the landscape are in agreement with modeled predictions. In some instances the warming and/or the effect of warming is more rapid than predicted, suggesting potential non-linear rapid change, as opposed to a slow linear progression of change."

There's much, much more science along these lines. Please look beyond rightwing blogs.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

@Doug
"Most CO2 is a result of natural causes"

That is true but natural causes are rather balanced leading to very slow rates of change in CO2. If you look up the Mauna Loa CO2 dataset you'll see a consistently steady increase in CO2 that's now up to about 380ppm from I think 310ppm half a decade ago. You have to go back several hundred thousand years for the last time it even got to 300ppm but in half a century it went from 310 to 380 in a way that is a clear human signature.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

" Global mean temperatures have been dropping steadily since 1999, not increasing as some predicted."

1999 is the coolest year in the 1999-2010 range. I think you meant to say 1998 and it shows a statistical flaw in your statement. You're cherrypicking. Every year from 2001-2010 is warmer than all years from 1991-2000 except for 1998 which is statistically tied for first with 2007 or 2010 depending on dataset (noaa or nasa). 1998 had a very very strong el nino and el nino years tend to be warmer. You're basically saying that the earth is cooling even though the 2nd to 11th warmest years are this past decade and you used a clear outlier year as the base point. Here's what you should be doing, use a 3yr average or a 5 yr average to smooth the data. Then you'd see that we're still warming because well... again, when you have 10 of the 11 warmest years on record the past 10 years... that means we're warming. 2008 was a la nina (those tend to be cooler) and a solar minimum, yet it was still something like 10th warmest.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

Re Blue.. What you have provided is uncollaborated and unverified, not even good gossip. One person's olympic leap of science and subjective opinion of a very small area of the world (a part of Russia). One could also use the same arguement about record snow and cold in the US this winter and extrapolate that across the entire world to prove there is no global warming! Your example is too small, too subjective (no real numbers, no real data). Back to your left wing blogs I guess!

KM
Cedar Hills, UT

btw the climate has been changing for eons. Why o why do you think that man can stop the climate "change" in its tracks? Its the audacity of arrogance!

chilly
Salt Lake City, UT

"Most CO2 is a result of natural causes..."

Blue: "That is incorrect. Scientists can study the nuclei of the carbon atoms in atmospheric CO2 and trace the source of the carbon. Earth's rapidly climbing levels of atmospheric CO2 comes from the combustion of fossil fuels. That's an established scientific fact."

Of the 750 gigatons of CO2 "produced" annually, 30 gigatons are man-made. I'll let you do the percentage calculation on that Blue. On second thought better ask....

By volume, CO2 represents around 5% of all greenhouse gases. Water vapor, over 99% of which is natural, makes up almost all of the remaining 95% of GH gases.

Murray Dad
Murray, UT

KM, Mountainman, procuradorfiscal et. al.,
If you are referring to the cherry - picking data offered by Steve Goddard re:Global Mean Sea Level (Jason 1 and Jason2 satellite altimeter data) using 2010 as data, without the seasonal signal or reverse barometer; this has been widely panned as classic selective skewing.
There is again a disconnect between extreme weather events and climatic trends.
The reference noted by Blue is a comprehensive overview, I offer the work of Rubel, F., and M. Kottek, 2010: Observed and projected climate shifts 1901-2100 depicted by world maps of the Köppen-Geiger climate classification.

Stalwart Sentinel
San Jose, CA

It's true, there is an Ice Age upon us. Over the years, I have noted an overall cooling trend in conservatives' ability to research and intelligently discuss any topical issue. It seems the permafrost that has blanketed Texas and the southern US for so long has leap frogged into Utah. Conservative conspiracy theories have chilled their ability to reason and analyze the information at hand. Where's my coat....

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