How does one know the unknown, or that that does not exist, or that that will
not be know, or can not be known. The truth is one can't know and doesn't know;
and so opportunists develope elaborate superstitions to fill the void of not
knowing and then work to pull as many others as possible into the circle to fill
the void so as to validate their not knowing and to comfort the inner need for
belonging and individual and group identity recognition to help allay their
fears of the un-known. And thus they pretent to know, and strife to convince
others that they do know untill they are convinced that maybe they really do
know, they just can't prove it. Many become famous, powerful, wealthy,
important, feared and loved doing it. It is the business of power, money and
politics called organized religion that package sale and trade in the open
market the many differet brands of the unknow. The competition is fierce and
deadly. Caveat Emptor.
I think that the importance of both faith and good deeds (works) is scripturally
sound.But there clearly is a difference in how the LDS defined works
versus general Christianity.The active LDS member has a long and
detailed checklist of works. These are generally not considered as helpful
suggestions but as mandatory for a recommend holding member. In
contrast, I think the general Christian idea of works is that one who practices
belief and faith in Christ will be moved by the Spirit to practice good works
here on earth and rarely is a mandatory list provided.The LDS idea
of works is to a large degree dictated by leadership whereas it is much more
personal in the general Christian community.Not saying one is right
or wrong. And there is no question that most LDS take the initiative to do good
works in addition to the required behaviors and ordinances. But works does take
on different meanings to LDS versus other Christians.
Rifleman: James 2:14-26 - Faith Without Works Is Dead. Martin Luther explains,
Man is justified by faith alone, but not by faith that is alone. Genuine faith
will produce good deeds.People quote Ephesians 2:8,9, but forget verse
10,For we are Gods workmanship, created in Chris Jesus to do good works which
God prepared in advance to us do.He saved us(Christians), not because of
righteous things we have done ,but because of His mercy He saved us through the
washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy (Ghost*) Spirit. (Titus 3:5 NIV)
*Ghost is the KJV rendering of the Greek word pneuma, or Spirit, they are
the same word. 1. How will I come to know the
Spirit of the Holy Ghost? Is equivalent to, How will I come to know the
Spirit(pneuma) of the Holy Ghost(pneuma). The advantage of using Spirit is that
it can always be used, whereas Ghost requires the prefix Holy. The author
should use a modern Bible translation.
Aussie Bloke | 7:26 p.m. May 3, 2011 Rifleman | 8:44 p.m. May 3,
2011Thank You for your prospective on LDS.
NoMad:In addition to Rifleman's comment, I live by a principle that
James also teaches: I will show you my faith by my works. My parents always
taught me that there is no safety in passive faith. Latter-day
Saints believe in the Bible and are taught to call upon God continually for a
forgiveness from sin and ACTIVELY seek to apply the atonement of Christ in their
life. There is more to this than simply proclaiming one's faith, there is also
much learning and work required of each disciple in order to serve the Lord.
Re: NoMad | 1:32 p.m. May 3, 2011 James 2:14-26 - Faith Without
Works Is Dead.There is no easy road where we can sit back and expect
the Savior to save us when we do nothing to show our faith.
NoMad, you appeared yesterday on a DN comments board as someone who was
sincerely seeking to understand LDS doctrine. You now seem to be contending with
the doctrine relating to grace, faith and works. You have quoted some very
relevant scripture in defence of your position. May I also recommend the Saviors
concluding admonition in the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew 7:13-29) which in part
He states (V. 21): "Not everyone that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall
enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that DOETH the will of my Father which
is in heaven." You are correct in that salvation comes through the grace of
Jesus Christ in that all mankind will be resurrected (I Corinthians 15:19-22).
However, exaltation in the "kingdom of heaven" requires some work
(doing) on our part. Paul also understood this well in his letter to the Romans
(2:7); "To them who by patient continuance in well DOING seek for glory and
honour and immortality, eternal life." A full reading of the teachings of
Jesus and his apostles affirms the truth of LDS doctrine on this matter. The
Book of Mormon confirms it.
Salvation through the sacrifice of Jesus Christ as the offered Lamb of God is
the only way to Eternal life and Exaltation. LDS believe in progression. the
Bible believes and promotes progression. faith without works is dead. By your
fruits they shall know you. No works, no evidence of Truth.God knows your heart.
No works, no evidence of Christ in your heart. No works, no Glory. LDS believes
in the Bible. Those who reject the Bible are not Christians. I am a Christian. I
have a belief in the Bible...Holy Bible...as a Testament of Christ's Sacrifice,
Works, and Beliefs. Please ask an LDS believer what you need to know re their
Gospel. Don't ask a Roman Catholic what a Baptist believes in....ask an LDS
believer. You will then find the truth....not what some podunk pastor has
twisted around. God Bless you and I in your quest for Truth.
How can you profess faith in God, but not His divine Word? If you claim to
believe in God but not the Bible, then I seriously question the identity of your
god. The New Age movement has their own god, but it is not the Lord Jesus
Christ. The Islamic Muslims claim to believe in Allah (god), but it is not the
Lord Jesus Christ. You see my friend, you have to have faith in the true and
living God. Having faith in God is only good if it's faith in the Lord Jesus
Christ to forgive your sins. James 2:19 tells us that the devils believe in
God. Big deal, many unsaved people believe in God! Have you ever realized that
you were a sinner, bound for an eternal hell without Christ? Did you call upon
the name of Jesus to forgive those sins and save your soul from hell? If not,
please do so now and don't wait another minute. Don't risk spending an eternity
in the lake of fire. You've got nothing to lose, salvation is a free gift from
God...paid for by the precious blood of Jesus.
Re:NoMad | 1:32 p.m. May 3, 2011Salvation is achieved by the grace
of God after all we can do. If we do nothing for ourselves, grace won't save
us. Besides being baptized and receiving all the ordinances for salvation, we
must keep all the commandments of God, live a Christ-like life, repent of all
our sins so the atonement will work for our salvation. Forgiveness of sin only
works through repentance.D & C 19:For behold, I,
God, have suffered these things for all, that they might not suffer if they
would crepent; 17 But if they would not repent they must suffer even
as I; 18 Which suffering caused myself, even God, the greatest of
all, to tremble because of pain, and to bleed at every pore, and to suffer both
body and spiritand would that I might not drink the bitter cup, and shrink Sounds pretty clear and straight forward to me.
Salvation is NOT found in a religion or good works, but in a Person. The Lord
Jesus Christ! John 11:25-Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the
life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live. John
14:6-Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh
unto the Father, but by me. John 6:40-And this is the will of him that sent me,
that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting
life: and I will raise him up at the last day. Mark 1:15-And saying, The time is
fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
Acts 26:18-To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from
the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and
inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me. Romans
10:13-For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Re: NoMad | 11:04 a.m. May 3, 2011 "For by grace are ye saved through
faith"Members of the Church of Jesus Christ believe that faith
without works is dead. It is one thing to tell the Lord we love Him and it is
another to show our love by helping our fellow man.His sheep will
hear His voice when he speaks to them through the mouths of his living prophets.
Mormons believe that one's salvation is based on such good works as baptism,
good deeds, missionary work, and following Mormon teachings. B. McConkie stated
at BYU that a personal relationship with Jesus Christ is "improper and
perilous", Church News, Mar 20, 1982, p.5, Ephesians 2:8-9, For by grace
are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast. Romans 4:5, Salvation comes to those
who do not work for salvation, but believe on Jesus Christ instead! Jesus Christ
came into this world to lay down His sinless life for YOU-to pay for your sins
because you couldn't. Jesus is your only hope for salvation. Only by receiving
Him as your Saviour can you enter the gates of Heaven. There is no other way.
"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh
unto the Father but by me." John 14:6, Neither is there salvation in any
other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we
must be saved. Acts 4:12