Comments about ‘Gay marriage and reshaping society’

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Published: Wednesday, April 20 2011 11:31 p.m. MDT

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Happy Valley Heretic
Orem, UT

IDCoug: I don't hate gays but I do hate homosexuality.
I guess I can see your point, I love God, but I Hate Religions.

"It seems to be part of the training that gays go through about how to put people of a different opinion on the defensive."

Although I'm unaware of the training course you mention,
I am aware that religious training does teach how to put people of a different opinion into a lessor class of people, until they see things the way they do.

MPeace
Provo, Utah

No matter how many GAY marriages are made - they will never make a Family. It is Impossible.

It will be just an assortment of people.

In a Man Gay Marriage - Where will be the Mother? Is the Surrogate mother to be the Mother when she will be never around? There will only be a father. - and the child resulting will NEVER know who its Mother ever is. Is this a family? In a Divorced couple Family there is at least Access to the mother or father.

In a Woman Gay Marriage - Where will be the Father? Is the Sperm Donor the father? -If so , where is he? The same situation occurs as in the man gay marriage. There is no Access to the Father.

Therefore in all of these cases NO Family results.

Man/Woman relationships -even teen pregnancies - still have the Father known. -And the Mother. -And make a Family Due to the parents of the pregnant one. If the parents of the pregnant one do not want the responsibility, they choose adoption.

Adoption into a family which has a woman as a mother and a man as a father is best. - Not into a group of people.

firstamendment
Lehi, UT

Gays are free to be gay, but governments have no reason to bind them. When we bind homosexuals, or mainstream and normalize homosexuality, we send a message to children and adults that variant sexual relationships are also ideal, crucial, and good for all. Studies indicate that they are not.

As legislators and activists promote homosexual cultures they increase the numbers of people who believe they were born gay, thus creating homosexuals with attendant ills.
Once subjected to homosexual environments too many abandon spouses and children for variant sexuality, thus destroying crucial heterosexual marriages and families.
Consenting heterosexuals are legally bound because healthy heterosexual relationships are crucial for society and children raised in these Traditional Families do better.

Some activists want to take the right of marriage from all, if they cant have it (like Pearts extremists, keeping the trees equal by hatchet axe and saw).

They seek to control media and discourage all from speaking the truth about gay violence etc. They say:
It would be just plain bad press for gays andall bad news needs to be
suppressed
From Creating Gay Children

JM
Lehi, UT

When my wife became a citizen and promised to defend freedom, I committed to defending against those who would destroy the First Amendment. Gay activists and the ACLU lead the charge to take rights from religious people to be involved politically, donate to opposing causes, vote, and speak freely.
As part of their call to oppress religion, destroy the Utah brand and so on, gay activists seek media outlets, comments, movies and subtly demonize those standing for traditional marriage. They purposely misinform about studies they do trying to prove homosexuality is genetic and gays are better parents (read Creating Gay Children and narth).
These claims are not true. There are many wonderful gays, but militant activists paint the religious as bigots, even posing as religious people, they also have practiced responses such as: Gay propaganda doesnt hurt families. Ive seen it destroy many. Or, animals are homosexual (ever seen strictly lesbian/gay animals?) Animals also eat their young, some humans also. We teach our children not to do this, we also teach them that homosexuality isnt the way to happiness. And research shows that if we dont do this, our children increasingly turn gay.

Springvillepoet
Springville, UT

@ RantBully

You said: "I find it offensive for gays to brand me as a bigot to make their burden easier while taking away my religious agency."

Gay marriage does not take away your religious agency, but denying civil rights to any U.S. citizen is bigotted.

Here are a few questions for you and others:

How many heterosexual couples' marriages have become null and void based upon gay men or women getting married?

How many heterosexual couples have called off thir marriages because gay men and women have been allowed to marry in some states?

How many gay or lesbian couples have filed a law suit against the LDS Church if they are not allowed to in the temple?

How many courts would uphold such a suit if ever filed?

The answer to all of those questions? NONE.

Bebyebe
UUU, UT

Gay marriage will come. The people here who are so offended will fall away. Younger people are less worried about other's private lives. Even utah will have to accept it.

Brother Chuck Schroeder
A Tropical Paradise USA, FL

Tell the TRUTH DN. You know what makes me sick. I'll tell ya'll what makes me sick. It's stuff like this. Like it or not Utah, this is my view. Let's start now with Michael De Groote, Deseret News - title - "Gay marriage and reshaping society." OK PEOPLE, "Wake up America". Why are we "American's living in a Country "without any laws" all around anarchists"?. What's Congress and State law makers doing to cause this?. Even these Anarchists in central Russia were either imprisoned, driven underground or joined the victorious Bolsheviks, the anarchists from Petrograd and Moscow fled to the Ukraine. Who in OUR GOVERNMENT is putting a stranglehold on political freedoms we always known?. Are ya'll tired yet of these person's who rebels against any authority, established order, or ruling power, who believes in, advocates, or promotes anarchism or anarchy, especially one who uses violent means to overthrow the established order of The United States of America?. Do you want to give up YOUR Holy Bible for the Anarchist Cookbook?. How about The Book Of Mormon also, seeing Utah is the Mormon State?. It's time to "WAKE UP AMERICA."

Andy
Cottonwood Heights, UT

The homosexual community loves to rely on some unidentifiable force that will bring gay marriage. But they never look at the facts: the people of America do not support nor to they want their government to sanction gay marriage.

Gay marriage has been outlawed by constitutional amendment in nearly every state. It has never been approved by voters and in nearly every place it has been allowed it has regularly been overturned by voters.

If you don't like the legal consequences of your unnatural union then form a contract with your partner that gives him/her the same benefits you would have if you were in a natural union. There are numerous web pages that address how to do this. Contractually give the right to make end of life decisions, to inherit your estate, to benefit from your life insurance policy etc etc.

There is no discrimination because you are allowed to contractually make these arrangements under the current law.

jans
Pickerington, OH

I disagree with Mulder21 about the four points and how that will become a major problem in our society. The rights of religious persons to conscientiously object MUST BE UPHELD, regardless of where the marriage debate ends. If someone else can provide these services for gay couples, then the ones who decline to provide them should not be penalized. Perhaps you could argue that they do not receive government funding, but they should be able to stick to their beliefs in their professional life as well as their personal life.

1. Graduate students are being kicked out of marriage counseling programs because they are unwilling to personally counsel gay couples on how to sustain their relationships.

 2. A physician in California was penalized for not artificially impregnating a lesbian woman.

 3. In Massachusetts and Washington D.C., Catholic Charities was driven out of the adoption business because it refused to place children with gay couples.

 4. In Illinois, Catholic, evangelical and Lutheran adoption and foster care agencies are being probed for discrimination

KJB1
Eugene, OR

Globetrecker 3:14 P.M.

That's funny, all of my gay friends have said that they were attracted to the same gender ever since they could remember. I had more than one woman "reject" me before I met my wife, but nobody ever tried to recruit me. Should I feel left out?

It's funny, I've read all these posts and for all the talk about the "gay agenda" and "defending marriage", the only real argument the anti-gay marriage people have boils down to some version of this:

1) Because God said so.
2) Homosexuality is gross.

If you want to feel this way, go ahead, but your feelings aren't proper justification for denying people their civil rights. We survived women gaining greater mobility in society, we survived interracial marriage, and we'll survive this. I guarantee you that someday our children will look back at us and wonder what the big deal was.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

donburi
"What I'm clearly saying is that gays said it would not be taught, and now it's about to be taught. "

You wouldn't complain about this if you didn't think schools should ignore the existence of a demographic of people. Somehow I also think that there's a difference between teaching students about Harvey Milk and telling them they should experiment or some other kind of thing like that (I bet what the gay rights advocates said wouldn't be taught would be encouraging kids to become gay which is different than noting gay people exist).

Truthseeker
SLO, CA

"Our family really isn't so different from any other Iowa family," said Zach Wahls. "When I am home, we go to church together, we eat dinner, we go on vacations...."In my 19 years not once have I ever been confronted by an individual who realized independently that I was raised by a gay couple," he said. "And you know why? Because the sexual orientation of my parents has had zero effect on the content of my character."

Wahls emphasized the typical nature of his upbringing, as well as his own success. He is an Eagle Scout and a small business owner. He also scored in the 99th percentile on the ACT and is now an engineering student at U of Iowa.

Sneaky Jimmy
Bay Area, CA

Maybe we should ask the kids in the orphanages in Romania and elswhere that no one bothers to touch if they would object to having "gay" parents. How about the kids in Africa where both parents have died of aids, would they mind being cared for by a same sex couple?

attentive
Salt Lake City, UT

The Family: A Proclamation to the World. That's what I believe. That's what I know.

Linus
Bountiful, UT

According to many of the comments, Jesus Christ was/is a bigot. I won't buy it. I think a loving God and Father-of-all wants us to be happy, and clearly marks for us a straight path to happiness. I am a senior citizen and a retired English teacher. I know the definition of marriage. You can't fool me.

Bubble
SLC, UT

@ Linus: Actually, Christ never said anything about homosexuality...

You would think if it was that big of a deal, He would have said something.....

Of course, there is speculation that He did - in Matthew when He is talking about eunochs......

But that interpretation supports homosexuality....

Kind of makes you wonder, doesn't it?

twelvestringsam
Orem, UT

I agree with this article. There will always be differing opinions. Gays and Lesbians send their message through Internet blogs, comments and discussion boards, and are very vocal. They have a specific agenda.
Those who believe otherwise need to be vocal as well and ensure their voices are heard through the same process.
I believe in marriage between a Man and Woman for reasons stated in this article.

Dan

Go Utes
Salt Lake City, UT

@atl134 3:31

You disagreed with my post by saying: "The idea that you believe that gay people are a threat to the 'protection of families' and the 'sanctity of marriage' is kind of a heavy charge and can easily be considered offensive."

You missed the point of my post entirely. I do not believe that gay people are a threat to anything. I believe that gay MARRIAGE is. Again, you are confusing being with doing. There is nothing wrong with BEING gay. What concerns me (and society) is ACTING on that tendency. We all have passions that society asks us to control. As I noted, I concede that dealing with same-sex attraction is a particularly acute thing to control--but that doesn't make it wrong for society to expect it to be controlled.

Gay MARRIAGE is indeed a threat to families and the sanctity of marriage. Gay PEOPLE are not at all, unless they are out actively trying to fight against marriage and families by pushing for recognition of gay marriage. If you are offended by my defense of marriage, I apologize. But the issue needs to be discussed and I never attacked gay PEOPLE.

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

Dispeling myths:

Gays cannot have children.

*'Lesbian Utah legislator carrying baby for gay couple' - SLtribune - 01/08/10
'...Rep. Christine Johnson, D-Salt Lake, at her home on Friday, is 16 weeks pregnant. Johnson is acting as a surrogate for a gay Salt Lake County couple, her close friends, after they expressed frustration with the difficulty of adopting a child in Utah.'

Not all hetro marriages have children.

Also, Hetro marriage enjoys a:
50% divorce rate
and 40% of all children in America are raised by single parents. CDC.

Note: Marriage does not guarentee stable family.
My example?

John and Kate, plus 8. Now divorced.
Also, a mother and father do not mean marriage.

My example?

Bristol Palin and Levi Johnson.

Teen Mom: MTV.

And last: Marriage does not always mean monogamy, does it?

*'Nevada senator, facing ethics probe, says he'll resign' - NBC News - 04/21/11

'Republican Ensign admitted having an affair with wife of one of his aides'

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

Being gay is a choice.

*Exodus International, study in 1978. Out of 800 people, only 3 were able to 'change' their orientation. That is a 'success' rate of 0.4%

I wouldn't want a 0.4% success rate for...well, anything.

*'Psychologists nix gay-to-straight therapy' - AP - 08/05/09
'The American Psychological Association slams technique that seeks to change sexual orientation.
'No solid evidence exists that such change is likely, says the report, and some research suggests that efforts to produce change could be harmful, inducing depression and suicidal tendencies.'

*'Gay man says 'reversal' therapy did not change him' - By Lisa Leff - Associated Press - Published by DSNews - 01/20/10
'SAN FRANCISCO A gay man testified Wednesday in a federal same-sex marriage trial that the "reversal therapy" he underwent as a teenager to change his sexual orientation drove him to the brink of suicide.'

'A Heaven-Sent Rent Boy' - By FRANK RICH - NYTimes - 05/15/10
'...the married, 61-year-old (Goerge) Rekers (Co-founder of NARTH) was caught by Miami New Times last month in the company of a 20-year-old male escort at Miami International Airport.'

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