Comments about ‘Mormon church reiterates support for Utah immigration bills, including HB116’

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Published: Wednesday, April 20 2011 11:03 a.m. MDT

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Brian the engineer
Columbus, OH

I agree with the three points made by the LDS Church.

Unlike many on this thread, I choose not to extrapolate the meanings of those three points in order to find details with which I disagree.

MormonDem
Provo, UT

Kateybug:

I'm sorry to hear about the trouble you went through. But the fact is, immigration reform such as that supported by the Church would help in situations like yours, because more immigrants would have a legitimate way to work, drive, and have insurance. There's simply no way to deport all the undocumented workers that we've been welcoming into our country on the down-low in order to keep our cheap produce, etc. Sensible immigration reform like that which the Church has supported will make horror stories like yours less common, not more common.

Kearns_Dad
Kearns, UT

Don't we as American receive "amnesty" when we elect to pay a fine to stay out of jail for breaking the law? Shouldn't we accept our punishment and go to jail for speeding, jaywalking, etc. When I receive a ticket, I pay a fine to the city (to stay out of jail) AND pay more money to take a class to keep points off my driving record. If I'm honest in obeying, honoring and sustaining the law, I should not pay the fine, go to jail for a few days to think about my actions and allow points to be added to my driving record.

As an American citizen and Utah native, I support the church position & I support HB116.

GWB
West Jordan, UT

Wow, I can't wait to hear the results of the next Temple Recommend appointments for those on this board who post that they oppose this move by the Church.

You either sustain and uphold the Prophet and the General Authorities or you don't.

If you disagree wtih them on this issue, you are morally obligated to tell your Stake President that you can't sustain the authroity of the Prophet.

Anything less would be hypocrisy, and God will be able to look into your heart and know that you are being deceitful.

So, do you support your church leaders or don't you?

charlie91342
Sylmar, CA

I don't understand you all that disagree with the church's stance. This is coming directly from the Prophet and the Quorem. You should not disagree - you should obey.

Once you start disagreeing with the leadership and prophesy, it is a slippery slope. Don't let satan side-track you - to disagree is to follow the wrong path.

Trust the church - it will not steer you wrong. When you let personal feelings interfere, you lose sight of the goal.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

As a progressive, it amuses me that the staunch conservatives who are most likely to rail against progressives in the faith for things like opposing to prop 8, are now the ones who find themselves disagreeing with a church position. Welcome to cafeteria-land, it's nice to have you here.

Alfred
SLC, Utah

"The commandment to 'love thy neighbor.'"

We love them... and we love them even more if they obey our laws and stay in their own country until invited to come in.

"The importance of keeping families intact."

Families can be kept intact if illegals with kids will take them with them when they are asked to leave, and stay out until they are invited back.

"The federal government's obligation to secure its borders."

Calls for securing the border is a red herring. The borders will never be secured. Foreigners can always find a way to break in. For example, fully forty percent of illegal immigrants here today come on visas but overstay. They forget to to home. A fence a mill high cannot stop that method of illegal entry.

Casca
Orleans, IN

If you want an upper hand to stop these innocuous Political Correctness of our immigration laws, forced on us by the Lib-Democrats and their (seeking more votes) or Elite Republicans (cheap labor) our only real alternative is the TEA PARTY. Its overall platform is less government interference, fair taxes, and national security. Their leaders will halt the unresponsiveness of both parties to our 14 Trillion deficits and not allow the credit ceiling to rise without assurances that government expenditure will be cut, including fraud and waste in entitlements. That a double layer fence will separate America from drug cartels and the far reaching economic immigrants pouring into America. There will be no Immigration reforms, which include amnesties of any kind; currently that means the Dream Act, Sanctuary States, chain migration, that are stealth amnesties. We need to look after our own people, living in poverty, not the rest of the world. Speak-up, join the TEA PARTY and make this a central issue in coming elections.

Mr. Bean
SLC, Utah

@MormonDem: "I'm glad that so many members of the Church who find themselves at odds with the Church on this issue are so generously offering to counsel the Brethren as to the proper interpretation of the 12th Article of Faith..."

The 12th article of Faith is not that complex and difficult to fathom. If a person crosses the US border without authorization, government immigration laws have been broken. And the law breaker must correct the situation before getting back in the good graces of the Church. That means leaving... or if necessary, being tossed out. Staying does not correct the situation. How can that be so difficult?

MormonDem
Provo, UT

Sorry Casca. Real Mormons don't drink tea.

FarnsworthPMacGillicuddy
Layton, UT

@GWB:
Your assumption and false piety about temple recommend interviews is sadly erroneous. I vehemently disagree with the "Statement" based on political principle, you "choose" to assume that means myself and others like me, don't support the General Authorities of the Church. You are so wrong, it's part of the mythology that so infects "Utah Mormons" who wear their (false) "testimonies" on their sleeves to get their Church career tickets punched. Most unfortunate indeed. You could have shown more compassion for those who disagree, but you made false assumptions and now bear false witness by your actions. Try not to judge others so harshly friend, I/we might have to interview YOU for a temple recommend some day, you might not like the results either.Mexico is a corrupt and failed state. Yes, we desperately need immigration reform, but we need the illegals here NOW, to assimilate into our culture, to take advantage of the FREE ESL classes at every school district in the country. Most do not, and will not, that's who I have a problem with. Your assumptions are way off base and smack of the very thing the Statement is preaching against.

idahonian
Burley, ID

What happened to the common consent doctrine? (D&C 26:2) I don't recall voting on this.

EgbertThrockmorton
Layton, UT

We have our agency to agree or disagree politically with our religious leaders. That's a far cry from not "supporting" them ecclesiastically.To suggest, infer, insinuate, otherwise, is truly reprehensible even here in Utah. It's typical cultural behavior from people who do not have a strong testimony of the Restored Gospel. Mexico is a corrupt failed country. It would be NICE, if the illegals here now, would at least try to take advantage of the free ESL classes our taxpayer dollars support, which are available at every single school district in this country. So, if these people choose willingly to self-estrange themselves (that means segregate), from society, they are willingly depriving me of the opportunity to show compassion for their plight. I can't force myself upon them, that's taking away their agency, but don't expect me to lay out more tax dollars to support people who are unwilling to be a part of this country, when most of those opportunities to better themselves are indeed FREE, by Federal Law. The "Statement" is nothing more than political expediency, to stave off Mexican government intervention down there. The truth never needs a defense.

SLars
Provo, UT

Paying a fine and staying out of jail is not amnesty for citizens. Amnesty would be not having to pay the fine and stay out of jail.

Rewarding lawbreakers that come here illegally for jobs is amnesty if you allow them to stay and work. You teach nothing by rewarding illegal behavior. I think this sets the wrong example, and teaches a generation that breaking laws is OK.

It's hypocritical to stop enforcement of immigration laws, while allowing other laws to be enforced that break up families. Lots of mixed signals here that send the wrong message.

HB116 has no quotas for need. If a person is here illegally, they get a free ride. The permits are good for two years, but can renewed indefinitely. There is no funding for a police force, administration, or workers for the new immigration department. The state does not believe this will ever be law. The legislatures own lawyers told them it was unconstitutional. It will only help the business leaders retain workers and maybe add a few new ones with the May deadline. And the Church supports this?

Viva la Migra
American Fork, UT

@GWB
"If you disagree WITH them on this issue, you are morally obligated to tell your Stake President that you can't sustain the AUTHORITY of the Prophet."

Is this in the same spirit that an illegal alien is morally obligated to tell the Stake President that he is not being honest in his dealing with others if they are committing identity fraud and I-9 perjury or openly defying a court order to leave the country?

And come to think of it, unless I slept through a recent conference talk, I have yet to hear a Prophet or General Authority officially proclaim that members of the church are now obligated to overlook immigration laws and disregard long-taught doctrines to be honest and obey the laws of the land. The few statements I've seen quoted from certain leaders have been made in a political setting, not in General Conference or a letter from the leaders read at the pulpit.

I think it's safe to root against the Prophets' favorite sports team or disagree with a General Authority's political opinion outside of a church setting.

Janet
Ontario, OR

I didn't understand the Church's position on the ERA, but I wasn't (am not) a prophet, seer, or revelator. Now I see the reasons for that position. I was puzzled when the Proclamation on the Family came out (seemed pretty obvious), but now I see why it was important. I was concerned about the church's involvement in passing Prop 8, but President Monson didn't ask my opinion on that, so I didn't voice any dissent. I applaud the Church's stance on immigration, but even if I didn't, I'd support it. I believe that we have a living prophet, and I sustain him. Over the years, people have left the church over blacks not having the priesthood, over blacks receiving the priesthood, over the ERA, over Prop 8, and now (I'm guessing) over the Utah Compact. It's a trial of our faith to sustain our leaders when we see things differently than they do, but "We see through a glass darkly." When the Savior returns, we will live in a theocracy, where all people are equal and have all things in common. That's how it is.

JBrady
Murray, Ut

People make bad choices all the time, and families are broken up when laws are enforced and people are sent to jail. Does the LDS church plan to stop all laws from being enforced?

Families are deported, I think we all know that.

I am not going to throw my fellow citizens under the bus so people who broke the law coming here can take their jobs. You are not teaching responsibility, honesty, and doing things the right way by rewarding illegal immigration.

nottyou
Riverton, UT

Editor: Seriously? You can't accept a comment that is based on one of the Articles of Faith of the Church? Look at some of the comments you've accepted and please reconsider. That's a double standard if there ever was one.

JBrady
Murray, Ut

This seems to be a changing stand by the Church. Going back and reading old articles and posts on the official Church blog, show they said they never supported any particular bills. Now they say they did?

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

"I didn't understand the Church's position on the ERA, but I wasn't (am not) a prophet, seer, or revelator. Now I see the reasons for that position. I was puzzled when the Proclamation on the Family came out (seemed pretty obvious), but now I see why it was important. I was concerned about the church's involvement in passing Prop 8, but President Monson didn't ask my opinion on that, so I didn't voice any dissent. I applaud the Church's stance on immigration, but even if I didn't, I'd support it. I believe that we have a living prophet, and I sustain him. "

And this is why a Mormon will have a hard time becoming president.

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