Howard S., I ama little surprised at your efforts to spin a lie. The truth is
that the WCC has in the past expressed interest in BYU joining their conference.
The reason is that BYU has explored the option of Independence more than once
over the past several years. The truth is that the MWC did everything in it's
power to sabotage BYU's plans to go indy because they did not want to lose their
biggest revenue producer. The PAC never wanted BYU and that's ok. As a BYU fan
even I am willing to admit that the PAC is not a good fit for BYU; mostly
because the Presidents of PAC Universities do not want BYU in the conference.The Big 12 was about to extend an invite to BYU years ago, but we all know
that the Governor of Texas(Baylor Alum) pressured them into inviting Baylor
instead of BYU. BYU has been preparing to go Independent for about 10 years, so
don't act like they did this on a whim. Utah going to the PAC was part of that
decision, but not all of it. Get your facts strait.
I've said it over and over again, BYU is going to do great in the WCC/PCC. I
can't remember which conference it is. Oh well, whatever conference, BYU will
@Veritas Aequitas"Eventually, with the 2010 realignment opening
up new avenues for expansion, the WCC decided to revisit expansion
plans."***************V.A. - You make it all sound so
rational and reasoned.The truth is that BYU approached the WCC
begging for a spot for non-football sports so the could pursue the path of
independence for football.And of course football independence was
drive by the urgent necessity of avoiding any perception that the Cougars were
being left behind by Utah in the realignment of 2010.Bottom line is
that BYU makes themselves such a nuisance that no conference wants them, not the
PAC 10, not the BIG 12, not the MWC, not even the WAC.Enter the WCC
"deciding" to revisiting expansion plans.
Howard S. | 5:09 p.m. Utah and BYU are both headed out of the MWC,
and are taking different paths. Both have improved their situations, and both
are going to benefit from their new affiliations.I'm going to guess
that after going 1-9 against BYU in the last ten matchups, Utah is looking
forward to moving out of the shadow of BYU basketball.Best of luck
to Utah.If they bring in the right coach, or Boylen decides to learn
how to win, I would like to see both local schools do well.But, not
is not really the time to claim any meaningful "athletic prowess" by
Utah over the BYU.It just does not exist.===Regarding Harmon's poll, really, someone behind bullet-proof glass does not
know Jimmer.ESPN had rolling down the LH side of the screen last
night... "The Jimmer Show"...I'm sure if you polled people
in a sports-bar, your results might have been different.Just
curious, is there an editor at the DesNews Sportsdesk that reads these story
concepts? How does half of this "news" even get printed?
Howard S. | 5:09 p.m. Taylorsville, UT Anyone can get in the
WCC. The PAC 12 is a bit more selective. ===Utah could not get
a WCC invite.During the massive upheaval of conference affiliations
in the 1990s, the WCC remained very stable. It has not had a school join or
leave for nearly 30 years (the last change of membership was in 1980, when
Seattle University left the conference). Before the 2010 realignment that
eventually led to BYU joining the conference, only the Ivy League and Pac-10 had
remained unchanged for a longer period.Although the conference has
had public universities as members in the past, and one of its founding members
was a public school, the current membership is seen as hostile to admitting any
public institutions.Eventually, with the 2010 realignment opening up
new avenues for expansion, the WCC decided to revisit expansion plans. The
conference decided that it would only seek out private schools, but would not
limit its search to faith-based institutions.Since you seem happy to
base your Universities "athletic prowess" solely on
"invites", and refuse to factor in "competition", or
reality, using uninformed generalizations, in "your mind only" -- nice
MiP"Think Wally Szczerbiak. I hadn't heard of his until he was
dismantling the #2 seed Utes in round two of 1999."**************Right MiP - it's kind of like the dozens of nameless players who have
dismantled the Cougars since their last tournament success in... let's see...
oh, right... in 1981.
@Veritas Aequitas"BYU claimed the 2009-10 Deseret First Duel
championship, symbolic of athletic supremacy between the pair of in-state
rivals."****************Whoa... Hold the presses...Does the BIG 12 know that BYU has claimed the prestigious DFD
(advertising campaign) championship?When they find out they will
certainly, and immediately, extend an invitation for BYU to join their
conference.The invitation will assuredly be accompanied by a sincere
apology that they were so shortsighted as to not have extend the invitation
sooner.And of course, when the PAC 12 finds out they will
immediately withdraw their invitation to Utah.... either that... or
no one will either notice or care...
Dick may be a good sports writter, but he's not going to be working for Gallup
anytime soon. The sampling data was frought with mistakes and he had
an "n" of 4?His point is taken though: even those admitted
"fans" didn't know who Jimmer was, which means he's not as ubiquitous
outside of Utah as some might think. Sure a few med school interviewees in
Syracuse and a few RockChalkers have heard of him----but that doesn't mean he's
beloved by everyone in the Midwest and East coast. No reason to testify. Still
plenty of folks who have no idea who Aaron Rogers is, too.But who
cares? It doesn't affect Jimmer's game. He'll still probably win POY. And even
more glory can come in the tourney. Think Wally Szczerbiak. I hadn't heard of
his until he was dismantling the #2 seed Utes in round two of 1999.
I agree with Howard. Why would "HE" care? Of course he hides his head
in the sand about any statistical data that isn't BCS invite 1-0.Here, bro, I'll help ya out."BYU claimed the 2009-10 Deseret
First Duel championship, symbolic of athletic supremacy between the pair of
in-state rivals. In 2009-2010, the Cougars won 45 1/2 - 15 1/2, the largest
margin of victory to date in the rivalry series' point total. Points are awarded
to the winner of the 12 sports in which the two schools compete
head-to-head."This years score is 28-16 BYU. Utah earned 10
points for football.It compares the "athletic prowess"
(Larry Scott likes that term) of both Universities whole athletic program
Hedgehog: I have an idea about some things and I may have "no" idea
about other things, but I do not have "know" idea about anything.
To Howard S: You are correct. The PAC presidents wouldn't let Peter in, if by
chance he wanted in, which I guarantee he wouldn't. Nor will he let but very
few of them into the place where he is. Think about it - it is pretty profound.
BYU wouldn't fit in the PAC 12 - wouldn't feel comfortable, neither does the
PAC 12 feel comfortable about BYU being there. So I think both sides are happy.
Why aren't you?
Hey, we know who Hedgie and bigutefan are and we're not impressed. Same old
thing, dad after day.
@Cougars1Oh, well if you PROMISE that the athletes care about the
DFD, then you must be right.I stand corrected.
Can't wait for the Cougars to be on ESPN and BYUtv.
4 people in Texas haven't heard of Jimmer. That's very statistically telling. If
you watch ESPN once a week, you know who Jimmer is, the Utes, Aggies, Aztecs,
and Rebels definitely know who he is.
Howard S., that reaction would be what one would expect from a fan of the team
getting their butts handed to them. I promise the athletes from the respective
schools care about the outcome. Try not to let your OCD show so much.
"It is very difficult to get into the WCC. You must have faith"Tommutwoshoes,What? I'm guessing you just made that up to
make you feel better. Most national sports fans have know idea what the WCC
stand for - you know that right?
@Cougars1The Deseret Duel??? The Deseret Dual????Really... You must work for Deseret First because NO ONE, Ute or Cougar, cares
one whit about the outcome of the Deseret Duel.Oh, except Deseret
Yes Howard, and how have the yewts done since then. The last time they were in
the tournament they got a 5 seed and got blasted by a 12 seed. Utah is trending
down. Boylen has set the program back so far, it may take years to rebound. As a Utah fan you SHOULD be happy with the PAC invite. FYI, BYU fans are
very happy with the move to go indy in football and to the WCC with other
sports. I know it can be hard for yewt fans to wrap their tiny little brains
around that, but it is the way it is, and the fact is for the past several years
BYU has competed with Utah in football and owned them in basketball as well as
most of the olympic sports.This may be the first year one of the
schools has lost the football game but still manages to dominate in the Deseret
First Duel.Good luck in the PAC, honestly; and I hope some day you
are able to get over your bitterness toward BYU. Then again, why bother; it
actually makes these boards entertaining to read.
It is very difficult to get into the WCC. You must have faith. The Utes would
never be invited. Only a weak conference like the PAC10 wanted U after they were
rejected by the Texas crowd. Now the PAC12 will be so watered down the Rose Bowl
might have to dump them for folks that really matter like TCU. Trash talk is so
easy to do. So let's just wait a few years and recheck where we both are.
Maybe we'll both agree that neither is a power in sports and isn't likely to be
any time soon. Things do change.UCLA and PAC8 used to be the
dominant power in basketball. (Big East and Acc now)USC used to be
dominant in football. (SEC now)PAC8/10/12 is bigger but not better. Power
is steadily shifting East and South. We both better get used to it or do
something about it like Boise State and TCU.
@Cougars1 "When it come tournament time the WCC does just as
well as the PAC10.2."Okay, lets talk tournament performance.
Utah was in the Sweet Sixteen in 2005.BYU was in the Sweet Sixteen
in 1981. That's 29 years years ago for those who are counting.I
expect a 30 year Sweet Sixteen shutout for the Jimmer lead BYU Cougars.
Howard S. "Anyone can get in the WCC. The PAC 12 is a bit more
selective." Uh, did you forget that Colorado was invited in at the same
time as the Ew of Ew? Not all that selective. When it come tournament time the
WCC does just as well as the PAC10.2. The bottom team in the WCC
beat Utah this year too. Maybe the PAC needs to rethink their selection process.
@Big Hapa When Jimmer boy is playing in Europe, the BYU faithful
will quickly realize that the WCC is a low rent district compared to the
exclusive gated-community of the PAC 12.Anyone can get in the WCC.
The PAC 12 is a bit more selective.
Yes the boo birds from the hill are alive and well. It is a slow, very slow BB
news day, month, year up at the U so what do bored eutes do ? They come on a BYU
blog site and expose there weak minded analysis of basketball.Get
used to the boredom eutes, the basement of the pac 12 will be a lonely place.
I was at a medical school interview in Syracuse and only 1 or 2 out of the 10
there hadn't heard of Jimmer. As soon as I said I went to BYU that's all they
wanted to talk about. I sat by the wife of Syracuse's womens basketball
coach on the plane ride home and she said she and her husband love to watch
Jimmer highlights. College basketball fans know Jimmer. Your random hotel
worker, or Hedgehog's acquaintances in MI might not, but sports fans know him
and love him.
Dick's "Golden Questions" of Jimmer:* Have you ever heard
of Jimmer Fredette?* Would you like to know more?Spreading of gospel of Jimmer, one question at a time...
I'll pay homage to the Jimmer if/when the y makes it to the elite 8.
@bigutefanI happen to be in Las Vegas this very moment. Last night I
was at the batting cages on Rancho and Alexander just off of Craig watching my
young cousin take some BP. I was wearing a BYU hat. Two of the coaches from his
team, non LDS guys, came up and asked me about Jimmer, said they saw him all the
time on sportscenter and wanted to know if I thought he was as good as the
highlights they see several times per week. I assured them he is. One of the kids that was also at the cages, not on my cousins team, also saw
my hat and yelled out "Jimmer Jredette!" as we were standing there.
Now I suppose he might have been an LDS kid as there are alot of them in Las
Vegas but obviously he is known, and respected, by fans out side of Provo.
@hedgehog, I live in the Midwest, and I teach at a basketball-mad university.
Plenty of people know who Jimmer Fredette is. Plenty.I think the
best point Dick makes is that if you asked random people the same questions
about POY candidates from previous years, you would get the same result. Dick
is just geeking out about Jimmermania, and he he found out that Joe pedestrian
was a bit of a buzz kill.
Hedgehog, you are wrong. I live in Kansas and work on a military base with
people from all over the country. I can tell you that any man who watches ESPN
and follows college basketball in my squadron can tell you exactly who Jimmer is
and who he plays for.All Harmon has done is establish that Jimmer
isn't as widely known as, say, President Obama among those who don't follow
since when has TCU done anything in Bball?who cares if Dallas doesn't know
who Jimmer is? They will after today when he drops multiple 3's on them.And also nobody outside of Hedgie's mom's basement knows who he is
Who cares how much people know about him, he's our homeboy? This has been a fun
season, with lots of highlights - enjoy the ride! Jimmer most likely will make
the NBA as a role player, Rose gets the most from above average players, and we
get to sit back and enjoy. I love the spirit of the team and the university. I
love the effort, and the icing on the cake would be a deep run into the tourney.
Too much fun!
TeamJimmer_com has compiled a fun selection of Jimmer highlights for fans who
still don't know who Jimmer is.
Sorry, Dick Harmon, you dropped the ball on this article. Asking four random
people in Dallas about Jimmer doesn't constitute a news article. I agreed with
the blogger who said you might have asked them at the same time who the VP of
the United States was, and they wouldn't have been able to answer correctly.
Instead, ask four people standing in line for the BYU/TCU game today if they
have heard of Jimmer. Then you'll have your news article! The "man on the
street" knows little except keeping his head above water in horrible
financial times! Yes, also ask anyone who follows ESPN sports, and
they will easily be able to answer. Jimmer is really a national hero among many
sports fans, young and old, now. He is a great BB player, doing really well, and
more importantly, it has not gone to his head. Watch TrueBlue on
BYUTV Wednesday nights. They have shown some fun insights on BYU's coach and
AggiesYou're a funny guy.Jimmer is averaging 4.3 assists
per game, which is MUCH better than the Aggies assists leader, Brockeith Pane at
3.3 assists per game.BYU and Utah State both average 15 assists per
game.So where's your statistical proof that Utah State is a much
better "team" than BYU?
bigutefanThe ute whining and envy about Jimmer is hilarious. All hat and
no cattle certainly applies to the tun. With all of the practice, the utes
should be more gracious losers.
I am a student living in Nova Scotia. I was working on a project the other day
when a Canadian classmate of mine came over to me and said, "How about that
If Jimmer were black and played for ___________ (fill in the blank) he would get
more national coverage. The national sports media has their own agenda related
to many things that have nothing to do with sports.
Aggie84You're just jealous.The Aggies could have used a
go-to star like Jimmer in Moscow. Most great teams have a star --
Magic, Bird, Jordan, Kobe, the list goes on and on...
Whatever... A random survey of people who probably couldn't tell you
the name of the U.S. Vice-President either.Most college basketball
fans know who Jimmer is and that's really all that matters.One thing
is certain, all of the fans in soldout Daniel-Meyer Coliseum are looking forward
to watching the Jimmer Show today.
It's amazing that Jimmer is worth all the dead space in the newspaper. Yes, he
is a good player but not one that will get the recognition of the other players
around the country.I'd much rather watch a team playing ball than watching
one player take over and hog the ball.Go Aggies!
Hmm . . . asking 4 random people in Dallas. . . smart? Yeah right! Ask people
who know who and what they are talking about. I suggest ESPN, Sports
Illustrated, and NBA players. Or I guess you can just ask hedgehog because he
seems to know SO much about basketball! Get a life Dick! Texas is a
football state and if you haven't noticed, TCU stinks at basketball. They don't
care about Jimmer. They ended their football season with a perfect record and a
#2 ranking. If you are going to ask someone who Jimmer is, ask someone who knows
something about basketball. My students (even the ones who cheer for the team up
north), call out, "Look at me! I am making a Jimmer shot!We
love you Jimmer and Jackson! Keep up the good work!
They may not know about Jimmer in Dallas, but when I was waiting for a plane in
Milwaukee two college aged guys came up to me and gushed about Jimmer (I was
wearing a byu sweatshirt). I don't know where they were from, but definitely not
from the MWC territory.Should be fun once BYU has played against
SDSU on CBS and then once the tourney begins.
The whining seems to be coming from the team up North. Of course they do have a
lot to whine about this year. I don't expect the Cougs to win the NC but no
matter how far they go the fans will support them.. unlike the yewties who have
trouble getting anyone to show up for a game.
Don't feed the jealous, juvenile trolls!
Sounds like "bigutefan" must live next to trevon willis. I think
Trevon has learned his lesson though.
Yeah, no one follows college basketball any more. Go to a Ute game against
anyone but BYU and the place is empty. Go to a Cougar game against anyone and
you have to pay big bucks for a scalped ticket. Am I surprised that 4 people in
Dallas haven't heard about Jimmer. No. Am I surprised by all the national
stories about Jimmer. Absolutely. I hope we continue to win. I hope we win at
least 2 games in the NCAA big dance. I hope the Utes keep Boylen over.
If you don't think Jimmer is going to win go see the ESPN poll from yesterday.
47% of the vote. The next highest was Sullinger with 19%. Jimmer won
every state but Ohio, North Carolina and Connecticut. I know fans
aren't the voters for the John Wooden player of the year award but I'm pretty
sure they reflect the opinion of the majority of people watching college
basketball right now. Jimmer is the best player!And yes
there will always be people like Michelle Peralta or those 4 Texans who don't
know and don't care.
I read the comments posted so far and it was hard to tell who was whinig.
Yes dick, you are correct. jimer is not know to the average sportsfan outside of
the bubble.In the Midwest, no one knows about the MWC, therefore no
one knows or cares what a jimer is.BYU will need to get to the elite
8 before jimer gets on the radar screen.
you really think people in tcu country follow basketball???? They don't even
know it exists. Espn is on everywhere. They obviously aren't bball fans. Dumb
He is not going to win POY award, nobody knows who he is and he is just average
at other aspects of the game besides shooting. He is not going to get calls at
the Thomas and Mack for the MWC tourney and he is not going to get calls in the
NCAA tourney. Prediction....Yners will lose in the 2nd round of the MWC tourney,
and if not the 1st round of the NCAA tourney, for sure the 2nd round. Dave
Rose's teams peak to early in the season. I don't know how you coach a team when
to peak, but year end and out, his teams are great in January, and in survival
mode in February, and barely crawling in March. Its been a pretty consistent
pattern. Yner fans should be worried, March 10th is coming, the day Boylen is
fired and a REAL coach is hired at Utah. Until then, Utah is stuck with the
worst coach in college basketball who has destroyed Utah basketball. Enjoy the
ride Yners, it is about to end in 7 games, and Jimmer will be lucky to be a 2nd
round pick in the NBA playing in Europe