I'm afraid Boylen is gone, but bring on Dave Rose. That would be more than a
fair exchange for Judkins.
Just checked the latest conference RPI's from RealTime RPI dated 2-16-2011:PAC 10 # 7WCC #14After losing Jimmer and Emery at the
end of this year BYU's RPI next year is not going to do much to raise the WCC's
RPI. Sorry. As far as TV deals go look for the WCC to close a deal with FOX so
that they can piggy back their games with PAC 12 games.If Chris Hill
attends the Utah State vs St. Mary's basketball game this weekend he is there
for only one reason, to check out two head coaches as possible replacements for
Boylen, Randy Bennett of St. Mary's and Stew Morrill of Utah State.
DutchmanIt really doesn't matter how "available" your
product is if the product you're offering isn't something fans are interested in
"buying".Such is the state of Utah basketball and the Utah
football could collapse into that same void if the Utes become perennial PAC 12
bottom half of the conference dwellers.
I guarantee you if Boylen goes there will be more guys quitting or leaving than
if he stays. That is not the way to improve the program.I do agree
that a change needs to be made. I suggest cleaning house with the assistants
and bringing in more experienced and positive coaches.If Chris Hill
wants to make the right decision he needs to get all his facts. That includes
talking to the people that it would effect the most-- the players. If he knew
his boys better he would know how to better approach the situation.
It's sad to see my beloved Ute basketball team playing with such sparse crowds
watching the games. Nice guy or not ... Boylen is history.
As much as I don't cheer for the Utes, I'm impressed with Boylen staying classy
and positive.What else do you want him to do or say? The leader is
going down with the ship and I guess he should be commended for that.
Veritas Aequitas,A little nit picky are we? Sorry, PAC 10 rather
than PAC 12. The official change is getting close and I am not the first to
make the mistake. Even national media guys are doing it.Want info
on the latest TV developments? Google Jon Wilner (college sports) and he has
the latest update on the PAC 12 (yes, 12) TV deal. Good read. His comments
about ESPN and PAC 12 basketball can also apply to ESPN and the WCC.
Which is more likely to happen next year, BYU raising the RPI of the WCC, or
Utah lowering the RPI of the PAC 12?Actually, it's a trick question,
because both are near guarantees.
Dutchman | 8:25 a.m. Feb. 17, 2011 Murray, UT Cali Coug,"Perhaps you can enlighten me. I follow this subject pretty
closely.""The fact is the latest conference RPI has the
PAC 12 at number 7 and the WCC at number 13 right between the Horizon and Ivy
Leagues. That RPI was released on February 6th."===How
does the PAC 12 have an RPI this year?This comment makes your
Cali Coug,"The latest news on the PAC 12 TV contract does not
look promising"Perhaps you can enlighten me. I follow this
subject pretty closely and I haven't seen anything lately. I know the
championship game for 2011 was awarded to FOX for about 24-25 million for the
one game, more than expected. And FOX is interested in getting back into
college football big time and will be bidding on the PAC 12 deal. This is the
regular FOX channels not the cable network."The WCC is better
than the PAC this year"This comment makes your comment about
the TV contract suspect. The fact is the latest conference RPI has the PAC 12
at number 7 and the WCC at number 13 right between the Horizon and Ivy Leagues.
That RPI was released on February 6th.
This is the tough pac 12 that utah is going to. wow impessive!Men's
Basketball - Conference RPIs (2010-2011)Join Discussion now in Men's
Basketball Message BoardOnly games against Division I opponents are
counted. Rankings update every 5 mins. Last updated - Wed Feb 16
09:30:04 PST 2011 View Conf. Power Ratings View Real Time
Conf. RPIsvip RankConferenceAvg. RPIAvg. SOSSOS RankTeams1 Big East
0.5900 0.58101162 Big Ten 0.5833 0.57472113 Big 12 0.5788
0.55793124 Mountain West 0.5679 0.5561495 Atlantic Coast 0.5597
0.54887126 Southeastern 0.5594 0.55585127 Pacific-10 0.5506
0.55236108 Conference USA 0.5386 0.52619129 Atlantic 10 0.5312
0.531881410 Colonial Athletic 0.5254 0.5212101211 Horizon League
0.5175 0.5141121012 Missouri Valley 0.5170 0.5141111013 Western
Athletic 0.5049 0.5005149
Now way Boylen stays. His offense is the most un-creative i've ever seen. Our
bigs are so under-developed. Not a chance he hangs around. I don't want to
stomach one more year of mediocre offense. I know all the guys are new but my
pickup games have more creative offense then this and it's a D1 program.
I have no problem with the WCC. It's decent enough. I have no problem with the
PAC-12. It traditionally has had excellent teams at the top---particularly in
the postseason. Certainly Rose is happy at the Y and will be lead
them into their new WCC era.The question is whether Boylen should
stay and lead the Utes into the PAC-12. Most of the above posts are
either: 1) Y fans talking abut how great their team is and how WCC takes Utah to
the woodshed (forgetting of course---or more like not knowing---that Utah beat
Pepperdine, and is is 11-5 vs WCC teams the previous 10 seasons--the so-called
lean years---including beating Gonzaga two years ago, but I digress) OR they are
posts from my own side talking about how few tourney games BYU has won over the
past two decades (which is true but could/probably dramatically change this
season).Arguments FOR keeping Boylen:---Good work ethic---Class work---Passion/teachingArguments AGAINST:---Lack of wins---Player turnover---Empty seatsMy
opinion is even if the Utes finish with 13 wins---Boylen will be gone.New conference, new coach.
Just watching the Wyoming game. It must be a red out. Oh wait, those are empty
If Boylen stays on I think attendance will increase. BYU fans love to drop by
the HC and root for the other team when no matter who that other team is we know
they will beat Utah. What's not to like about that. I would pay good money for
Bullwinkles next stop...Wassamatta U. So long poetry lovers!
Dutchman.Do you even know what your argument is. It takes so many
twists and turns, I think you argue just to argue.===Uteology...You really want to talk being exposed? Dropping from #5 out of the AP rankings, or having a basketball team that only
the coach believes in?You kids have fun up at the Alumni House
tonight. Be careful driving home. The roads are slick.
Qwest PerfectedJust how much "playing experience" have the
Utes had in the NCAA tournament lately?In the last 6 years, BYU has
played 5 games in the tournament. Utah has played 1 game.Doing some
quick math, I'd say BYU has FIVE times more experience in the NCAA tournament
during the Rose era than the Utes have had -- and MUCH MORE still to come this
season.While BYU fans are sitting around their televisions watching
the brackets on Selection Sunday, Coach Boylen and the Utes will be busy
cleaning out their lockers.Hill hired Giac and Boylen. So much for
Hill's great track record for hiring coaches.
Uteology"Now the nation can see BYU get exposed in HD."Like Utah was against TCU 7-47.or Like BYU was
against SDSU 71-58.Utah fans have a weird definition of being
exposed, especially this year.
re So Cal Ute,I see you took offense to some objective dialogue asking
will Utah return to the glory days. Let us make something very clear here.
Utah has yet to hit the bottom. That day will come either next year or the year
after. At that point, they can rebuild, but the ceiling is much, much lower
than you actually think. I think records against similar opponents will help
you find the direction of each program. Finally AFA swept the Utes and this is
not one of those good Falcon teams.
Solomon the Wise"but the most important factor for BYU joining the
WCC is exposure through ESPN and BYUtv broadcasts of BYU sports, including BYU
basketball. Something even membership in the PAC 12 can't deliver."-------------It seems the only program that can't play on
the national stage due to lack of exposure is BYU. For us it was never an
issue.Now the nation can see BYU get exposed in HD.
DutchmanI've seen lots of Utah fans in the Huntsman Center lately
coming disguised as empty red chairs.Chair seats or not, the entire
Huntsman Center seating area would fit below the concourse at the Marriott
Center.Besides, having benches in the Marriott Center for the
student section allows a couple hundred extra students to crowd into that area.
The students stand pretty much the whole game anyway, so having chairs would be
a waste of space.Bottom line is if you have a good team and a good
program like BYU has had lately, fans around the nation will find you, just like
they have Jimmer this season.If you have a lousy program like Utah
has had lately, it doesn't matter what arena you play in or which conference
you're in, nobody will bother watching you either in person or on television.The Utes will be lucky to have 5,000 fans in the stands tonight against
Wyoming. Do you really think a 10-15 Utah would be attracting anymore attention
playing a 9-15 Arizona State or Oregon State in the PAC 12?
A partial list of possible replacements:Rick Majerus - The Marriot hotel
awaits(wishful thinking)Donny Daniels - GonzagaTommy Conner -
WestminsterBen Jacobsen - Northern IowaAlex Jensen - St. Louis
(possible Assistant)Brad Stevens - Butler (wishful thinking)Dave
Rose - BYU (wishful thinking)Mark Few - Gonzaga(wishful thinking)Gregg Marshall Wichita StateJim Larranaga - George MasonShaka
Smart - VCUTommy Amaker -- HarvardCuonzo Martin - Missouri St.Randy Bennet - St. Mary's
Dutchman;The latest news on the PAC 12 TV contract does not look
promising...The conference was hoping for a Big Ten type of deal...it all went
bye-bye when Texas told the PAC-10 no thank you and the Conference went to it's
Plan B. The WCC is better than the PAC this year and will be better than the
PAC next year.The u should retain Boylen, just because the u has
lost 10 of the last 14 games against the Y is no reason to dump your coach.
Boylen will be successful. Given time he will have a winning team in the
PAC...the u may not be able to compete against the WCC but you don't need
to...you're in the PAC.
I saw the BYU basketball team walking on the beach. At sunrise, they looked
behind and only saw one set of footprints. (Trust me, they were not coach
It's crazy to hear byu fans talk about their NCAA tournament experience - like
solomon.... not so wise. Just exactly how many NCAA tournament games have your
coogs won in the last 5 years??? let me help you it's 1 game. So please save
your advice for someone else.It is time for Boylen to go. He has
some decent talent on this team but has no clue how to coach them to victory. I
think his assistants aren't very good either.Hill has a pretty good
track record for hiring coaches - don't forget Majerus, Meyer and Whitt. The
last two baskeball coaches have struggled, but I'm sure we will find the right
fit to get the program back on track.I'm glad that you're happy with
the WCC - they typically get 1 team in the tourney by the way so good luck with
that.It's true the MWC is higher rated this year than the PAC, but
that isn't typical. The Utes will get it figured out and be fine. Thanks for
the concern though coog fans but you can go back to your jimmer worship and
leave us alone.
Jim Boylen's problem is scouting and getting talent to come play for him. He was
one of the many coaches who saw game film of Jimmer Fredette and said, "too
slow." When you are out scouting and someone in your camp brings you Jimmer
Fredette and you flat out pass on him that quickly. You deserve to be judged
just as quickly and passed on as well. "Too slow." Atleast Brent tried
to help you Jim. Good luck next year.
Solomon the Wise,"that has 2/3's the capacity of the Marriott
Center"Because the Huntsman Center is 100% chair seats."
BYU joining the WCC is exposure through ESPN and BYUtv broadcasts"Both the WCC and PAC 12 are in negotiations for new TV deals. The WCC
commissioner said in an interview the other day that there is no guarantee the
WCC will stay with ESPN. In fact, he said that the best way for the WCC to get
exposure is to piggy back TV games on to PAC 12 games so that viewers will know
that a WCC game follows a PAC 12 game. The WCC is waiting to see what TV deal
is struck by the PAC 12 so that they can possibly get on the same network and do
those piggy back games with the PAC 12. No offense, but to state that arena
size and number of fans in the arena is of no importance is a bit naïve.
The college basketball TV landscape is so fractured now that players and coaches
know it is important to perform before large crowds. It is not enough to just
say, We are on TV.
I have met Coach Rose and spoken to him on several occasions. He is a class guy
and is a great fit for BYU. Additionally, Stew Morrill is a great fit for Utah
State. All talk about either of them moving to Utah is dumb.Boylen
has done some good things with the program. Unfortunately, winning the right
amount of games was not one of them. Utah will go to round three at finding a
replacement for "Big Rick".Go Utes!
I wish everyone (even the Dnews) would stop suggesting Stew as a coach for Utah.
Have you seen his staff hold up those stupid signs telling the players which
plays they are running?As for all you delusional cougar fans, even if they
get a top seed in the NCAA tournament they will not win more than two games.
Good Luck with that!As for Boylen, everybody but Boylen knows he will be
gone next year! Hopefully, Hill will find a coach that loves a challange to take
a program back to the top.
DutchmanThe PAC 12 does have some nice arenas, including that
40-year old arena on the hill that has 2/3's the capacity of the Marriott
Center, but the most important factor for BYU joining the WCC is exposure
through ESPN and BYUtv broadcasts of BYU sports, including BYU basketball.
Something even membership in the PAC 12 can't deliver.Just this week
I watched two Big East teams play in an arena that only held about 6,000
fans.If size of arena was really that important, Syracuse would
dominate Duke every year in both exposure and national prominence.btw, Oregon spent $250 million on one of the ugliest floors ever built. I'd
take any of the courts in the WCC over that monstrosity anyday.Winning the PAC 12 championship might be more prestigious than winning the WCC
championship, but success in the NCAA tournament is the only thing that really
matters, and Dave Rose can be just as successful entering the tournament from
the WCC as he could from the PAC 12.A good run in the Big Dance this
year could establish BYU's seeding credentials for years to come.
@truth machineSo I won't admit it, big deal.There's a lot of things
I won't admit.
@dutchmanRose will not be leaving BYU and he certainly won't be
going to utah. It no longer even needs to be discussed.
SoCalUteRecent history (since Rose became BYU's head coach)BYU has won 80% of its gamesUtah has won 50% of its gamesBYU
has played in 5 straight NCAA tournamentsUtah has only played in oneBYU has 3 MWC championshipsUtah has 1You make not like
the trend, but reality is the BYU and Utah basketball programs have been headed
in opposite directions for the past 6 years and there's no evidence that that
trend won't continue for the foreseeable future.See BYU/Utah
football 1964 - before and after - for an example what can happen when two
programs suddenly change directions.
Solomon the Wise,"Rose would never say it in public, but I'm
sure he would relish stuffing your "Kids at the back of the bus" words
down your throat."Rose is too classy of a person to ever do
anything like that. Tell me where Rose has been put in charge of this bus and
how he was consulted on the WCC deal."half of BYU's games in
the WCC next year will be played in an arena larger, by far, than any arena in
the PAC 12"I assume you are speaking of the games BYU will play
at home in the 42 year old Marriott Center with half bleacher seats. Tell me
what arenas there are in the WCC other than BYUs larger than a few thousand
seats. All the PAC 12 arenas seat from 10-15,000. Cal renovated Haas Pavilion,
USC built Galen Pavilion in downtown L.A. about 5 years ago and Oregon just
opened Mathew Knight arena in Eugene which cost about $250 million. There is no
comparing the WCC with the PAC 12 in any category.
Only 2 teams in MWC history have ever made the sweet-16 (Utah 2005 and UNLV
2007).The Pac-10 had their worst year in a long time last year, but
they still had a team that made the sweet-16.
I love how people say that the MWC is better than the Pac-10 in basketball.Really? How many times has a MWC team actually made it to the sweet 16?Last year the Pac-10 was horrible, but they still had a much better year than
the MWC as they had a team get passed the first weekend in the NCAA tournament.
@ Bottom Line The bottom line is that your comments are that of a true loser.
You Y'ners always try to make the the Utes look worse in the past since you
can't usually be better in the present. Now you have an opportunity to bash the
Utes Basketball team, but instead you take the loser route. Why didn't you
comment on the losing seasons that the cewgs had which were pointed out by
Brad?After all it is 'History', your favorite subject.
DutchmanRose would never say it in public, but I'm sure he would
relish stuffing your "Kids at the back of the bus" words down your
throat.Being the first coach in decades not in a "power"
conference to win the NCAA tournament is just the type of challenge Dave Rose
would enjoy.btw, half of BYU's games in the WCC next year will be
played in an arena larger, by far, than any arena in the PAC 12; and Rose will
still get to play on the west coast in sites that make those in the PAC 12 pale
I agree that the PAC-12 would be a step down. They have what, 1 ranked team?
The MWC has 2 ranked and one or two usually getting votes. Give him at least
one year in that conference as well as giving him a chance to gel a whole new
team (unless they all leave to some other frontier again).
"His arena is less than half-empty." I don't think this means what
you think it means Brad.
gonefishnAre you finished with your rant?Traditions
start and end, grow and diminish.Bottom line: It's all
just wishful thinking on your part. You have no proof that Utah will ever be
even half as good as the Utes were in the late 90's; nothing the Utes have done
since 1998 even comes close.BYU is a Top 10 team with the leading
POY candidate. Dave Rose has won 20 games or more in every one of his six season
as BYU's head coach and he's lead the Cougars to five straight NCAA tournaments.
Nobody knows if it will happen, but BYU has the potential to make a deep run in
this year's tournament.Going forward:BYU has a solid
group of players returning next year and a great coach with a proven track
record.Utah has a few good players and a coach who is still
searching for an offense. There's no guarantee that if Utah replaces Boylen,
that the new coach will even be as good as Boylen.Your hyperbole
aside, stating your opinions as immutable facts doesn't make them so.
Although Utah may have wanted to wait another year before deciding on Boylen's
fate, Rose's own success at BYU and the move to the WCC has moved the time table
up to this year. None of you can state with any certainty how happy Rose is
about laboring in the WCC. Kids at the back of the bus always have smiles on
their faces. But, Bronco and Holmoe are now driving this bus and Rose could be
very unhappy over the situation. I am just saying. Plenty of coaches and
employees who are otherwise happy with their work leave their employers for
other oportunities because they are slighted or clash with a co-worker. For
Utah's part money will not be an issue. There are plenty of boosters with
enough money that given the chance to get Rose or Morrill will fork it over.
Some will do it with glee. A move to the PAC 12 by either Rose or Morrill means
playing in west coast cities at nice venues large enough for 12-14,000 fans and
coaching in a prestigious athletic conference.
I'm not a Utah fan, but a UNLV fan....so obviously I don't really care too much.
That said, you have to consider a few things with this guy. Giacoletti did not
leave him much to work with....it takes a while to rebound when the programs hit
lows like Utah has lately. Majerus had this team playing well, but lets face it,
its not because he was loading the roster full of ultra-athletic, 5-star
recruits...and after having the fortune to identify talent and develop guys like
Doleac, Miller, Van Horn, Jensen, etc... and etc...Majerus didn't leave the
cupboard full for Giac either. If I were a Ute, I'd more upset
about Boylen churning thru players, than anything else. He's ran too many
off.....that said, I'd take 2 or 3 guys off the Ute's current roster over guys
playing regular minutes at my school (UNLV)....that hasn't been the case at Utah
for years. IMO, he has something special in a few of these players, and you
don't need 85 player in basketball to be good...I'd give him one more year.
What is better than watching the yewts have a .400 record while in the MWC?Watching them have a .333 record while in the Pac 12, with most of the
wins(and some losses) coming against D-II colleges before conference play
The only worry BYU fans might have about the rumblings on the hill, is that the
Utes might actually replace Boylen and mess with a good situation for the BYU
and Utah State. Right now, the Cougars and Aggies have absolutely no
competition from the Utes for the best basketball players in the state of
Utah.That could change if the Utes had a coach as good as Rose or
One more thought, then Im done... (thankfully for some of you Im sure)Suggesting Dave Rose would ever consider a job at utah is laughable. TrueBlue
has a very good list of reasons. I would just like to add one thing.Whoever takes over that program will AUTOMATICALLY be in the "hot
seat" from day one. I dont care who you are, you dont take over a program
like that with any sense of job security. Why would Dave Rose want that? To
prove he's awesome? No. He's already brought BYU back so he doesnt have to prove
anything to anyone. And contrary to what some ute fans think, some coaches
actually LIKE coaching at BYU, believe it or not.
A few questions for all the Yewt fans:1. When do you start to
question the amount of money Hill pays to coaches? Do you think he's getting
his money's worth? even if its Eccles and Huntsman's money?2. Do
any of you really believe Rose will leave BYU? Do you think Rose cannot
determine for himself a great situation from a potential situation?3. How long do you think it will take to get the program going? It seems to
me that one can try to make the current players winners and start recruiting
better. Or you could go the JUCO route. Does anyone believe it can be done in
1-2 years? Are not most of the current best players in Utah high school ball
more prone to BYU or out of state than the Yewts? will you be happy if it
takes 3 more years or longer?
Live it up coug fans, revel in it. You may want to put it in context though:1. Next year you will be wollowing in the bottom half of the WCC.2. The
Pac 10 is down but traditionally has been far better in bball than the MTN or
the WCC in every measurable way. Utah will dominate in state recruiting again
with the right choice.3. Is this BYU team that good or is it just Jimmer.
In reality this BYU team, the best BYU bball team in its history is not as good
as say the top 7 or 8 all time Utah teams. Could this BYU team even beat the
2004 Utah team, debatable?Go ahead cougs and enjoy our mess, but do
so knowing heart break is around the corner.go Utes
Even if the Utes were winning games and vying for the conference championship, I
would be in favor of letting Boylen go. He has no offense, he has not taught
his tallest player a single offensive move, he can't even get his team to shoot
free throws. The defense is OK, but the offense reminds me of an action verb
most commonly used to describe the efficacy of a Dirt Devil. It also reminds me
of the offense that BYU used to run under Tony Ingle, which is to post up one
guy, pass the ball around the perimeter until one of four things happens: 1)
turnover, 2) shot clock runs out, 3) a player who makes 20 to 30% from the
three-point line casts up a prayer, or 4) a player decides to go 1 on 4 and
drive into the teeth of the defense.
DutchmanUtah can take it's best shot at Rose, but it won't matter.
The Utes have nothing to offer that Coach Rose doesn't already have.Coach Rose has built a great basketball program at BYU and he has the solid
backing of the administration, boosters, students, and fans. More importantly,
he can be every bit as successful playing in the WCC as he could be in the PAC
12.Why would Coach Rose want to give all of that up to take over a
failing program that would take years to salvage from the mess it has become?
I thought Dr. Hill applied for the AD job in Washington. Maybe he is'nt doing
anything because he is hoping to leave and not have to clean up the mess.Alex Jensen would be a great addition to the program.
At the end of this season a lot of schools are going to make a run at Dave Rose
especially if his team goes deep into the tournament. So, why not Utah? Utah
may be thinking this is the opportunity to go after Rose before he is snatched
up by another school. That would be a reason to fire Boylen at the end of this
season and go after Rose or Morrill. No one really knows how happy Rose is
since his program was escorted to the back of the bus for the sake of football
independence. And Morrill only has what is left of the WAC. Morrill is 59 so
he may want to step out of a deteriorating WAC and move to the PAC 12. I know,
fans will say Rose turned down the Houston job last year to stay at BYU but that
was before he was told to take his program to the WCC apparently without much
consultation. Rose is going to leave BYU at some point and he will have many
suitors this year. Utah has to take a shot at him and some back channeling may
already be taking place.
@hedgehogI definitely wouldnt say Im "worried" about the
coaching change up on the hill. Laugh Out Loud!I would say
"entertained" would be a better description. Oh and by the
way, if utah ends up bringing in Roger Reid, I will NEVER stop laughing.
Roger Reid was mentioned in the poll as a possible replacement for Boylen, I
think all of us SUU fans would be happy if Utah took him away from us:)
"less than half empty." Is that the same as more than half full?Don't like "he's gone" articles appearing as headlines in the
newspaper. Doesn't do any good. Everyone knows the problem. Stories like this
are hard on the family, needlessly. Find some creative subject to write about,
if you are worth what they pay you to second guess coaches and AD's.
The Peter Principle, the eponymous law coined by Dr. Laurence Peter, explains
that "in a hierarchy, every employee tends to rise to his level of
incompetence." Everyonefrom the office intern to the CEO, from the
low-level civil servant to a nation's presidentwill inevitably rise to his or
her level of incompetence, if it hasn't happened already.For Boylen,
it's already happened. Dr. Hill can do Coach Boylen a favor by
helping him return to his level of competence -- as an assistant coach somewhere
I say cut the losses and move along. Now is a good time to start looking and
interviewing new coaching prospects especially during March Madness. Boylen was
supposed to be "The Man" when it came to coaching big men and yet
today Washburn at 6'11" and 7'3" Foster have not been an offensive
threat. I think a new coach will at least draw the curious.Forget Stew
Morrell he has found a home in beautiful Cache County. Alex Jensen is an
assistant to Majeras and has learned the X's and O's from the best, but without
the controversy, plus he has local ties. If nothing else have the new coach try
and lure Jensen from SLU and have him on the bench as an assistant. I
don't like the thought of having Boylen coaching in the PAC 12 and have the
program spin even more out of control.Four years is enough time and a buy out
won't hurt him nor his family. Buy him out and remind him to turn out the
lights. He'll land on his feet and Utah round ball can move on. One can
@ hedgie,There is no way Hill waits until July 1 to fire Boylen. If he
does, he will have another mass player exodus and lose potential recruiting time
and players.You are right, the Cougar fans are so worried about who
Utes next coach will be, we are shaking in out boots - NOT.And since
I know that you watch every Cougar game, since you are obviously so well
informed - you better keep your calendar open for March 24 because they will be
playing in the Sweet Sixteen.
Just some food for thought, but what is the new normal? Is it the current state
of the program or is it the 90's run? It is probably somewhere in between, but
I would lean more that expectations have been way too high and a 500 team with
occasional pops is the reality.
You know your [Utah] program is doing badly when "lowly" Utah State
out-recruits you for in-state recruits. Aggies have had consistent
well-performing years in the college basketball world.Boylen isn't
the worst coach to ever walk the face of the earth. Give him another season. I
remember the years when Steve Cleveland was at the helm at BYU and there were
just as many BYU fans not attending those days as well. To say that BYU fans
are more devoted than Ute fans is just a silly school-ground argument.Good luck Utes, good luck Cougars. I enjoy following both of these teams. Go
Our little furry ground hole dweller is completely delusional if he thinks that
BYU fans are at all worried about the coaching mess up on the hill.Utah fans would give their eye teeth to have a coach like Dave Rose coaching
the Utes, and deep down, even a BYU obsessed hater like hedgehog would have to
agree, although he would never admit that in a public forum.
Here is the bottom line. Looking at Utah's schedule this year, I would expect
this team to be at least 18-10. This would include sweeps by BYU, SDSU, and
UNLV. Those losses should all be less than 10 points. In other words, the game
was decided in the final minutes. A split with NMS. Road losses to UT State,
Michigan, and Butler.That would be a team making progress maybe
stealling a game from the big three. But clearly that is not our team.Go Utes!
I don't get all the talk about Utah going to a superior basketball conference in
the Pac-12. Last I have seen the MWC is much better. Utah and Boylen will do
better in an inferior Pac-12 basketball conference. Keep him!
Hill might be able save 500K by waiting until July 1st to let Boylen go, but,
would there still be a decent coach available by then?Most Coaching
changes will be starting in early April, which means the Utes would be two
months behind the rest of the country if they way until July 1st.Would Hill take the chance of starting his search for a new coach without
first telling Boylen that he was being fired? That's not something Hill would be
able to keep from leaking out.
What's in a name? (My Name) Everything.
Kewgs sound really worried about a coaching change at Utah. Their subconcious is
telling them that their fifteen minutes of fame are just about up.Enjoy your cute little jimer story - come the second week of March it's all
@hedgehogThanks for the info. Makes sense.This is a
crucial time for utah basketball. Another bad season with another bad coach and
recruiting will take another step (or two) back. Chris Hill needs to
put a lot of thought into his next hire. So far his track record for hiring
bball coaches isnt all that impressive.
Like Gary Crowton at BYU, some coaches just are great assistant coaches, but
they just aren't qualified to be head coaches.That seems to be
Boylen's problem. He's fine coaching a particular position, big men I heard in
the NBA, but he doesn't know how to put a system together that incorporates the
skill sets of an entire team.Utah is one of the worst in the country
in assists and turnovers, which is direct result of a sloppy, undisciplined
offense.Boylen will take the money and run back to the Big Ten or
the NBA as an assistant, which is where he should have stayed all along.
Give the guy a chance. He has this program right on the edge of turning it
around. Besides which alum is going to step up to the plate and pay the millions
in a buyout. With the mess of not getting one single dime from the pac 12 for
two years, its not like the u can afford to fire him. Patience is what is needed
with boiling right now.
I admire Jim's passion for the game and his devotion to the program. Yes, he
has only gone 1-7 against BYU while his predecessor went 3-3. His predessor had
a year with the best college player in the country while BYU had a down year.
(That accounted for two of the three victories, the other was an upset at the HC
in 2006).The defense has been better under Boylen. No question
about that. But the offense has not improved at all. There is no
dead-eye shooter. There is no post up threat. The fact that we are in the
300's in assists per game speaks volumes about the offense.
It would be extremely bad PR for Utah, to raise ticket prices for an inferior
product. Putting a new label(PAC 12) on the product, doesn't mean it's worth
more money.Nowadays, announced attendance (paid attendance), is much
greater than actual attendance, which means that a lot of Utah fans who have
tickets aren't even bothering to show up.Raising ticket prices may
be the final straw for some of those fans who may simply stop buying season
tickets until they see a better product being put on the floor.The
question for Hill is, how far can he afford to see attendance drop before he
pulls the plug on Boylen.
Why would Stew want that mess at his age??
Sports junkie,Hill will wait until July 1st to can Boylen. Based on
the contract the Utes could save as much as 500K if they wait.
This article is dicouraging. I was really HOPING Jim Boylen was the future.But in all honesty...I think at this point its very obvious
that Boylen is NOT your guy. Hill should have let him go to moment he realized
that. Heres what I don't understand.. If Chris Hills intentions are
to let Boylen go, why wouldnt he just him go immediately to start the rebuilding
process now? At least the team would have a chance to enter the pac12 on a
positive note with a new coach who has a few games under his belt. Chris Hill is smart. Im wondering if the utes WILL see a new coach next year.
Its all very perplexing.
I lost faith in Boylen after the Arizona loss in the NCAA Tournament 2 years
ago. It wasn't the loss itself that concerned me but rather how we looked
totally unprepared for that Arizona team. Boylen seems to be a great guy and I
would have liked to see him succeed but it just isn't happening. It's time for
Utah to cut it's losses and go in a different direction.
I say that Utah should give him more time. To be fair, he should get another
ten years at least to work on the program. I like the direction he is taking
the team and he deserves some time to see how far he can take them.
The Marriott Center's been "less than half-empty" all year, Rock
Monster, but the TUN's arena has not. I think you meant "less than
half-full" or "more than half-empty." My middle-school English
teacher is beaming with pride right now.
Of course he won't be back.The school won't take a team of this skill set
to the Pac 12 just to be the weekly doormat.I imagine coach Boylen is a
fine man and a nice guy but it's time for he and the school to move on.
Utes should hold off on that ticket price increase if they want to attract a fan
base. Perhaps they should be giving free tickets away to school children for
good reading performance. They need to do something to actually put bodies in
those seats.That used to not be a problem.Consider if
the football team has a few bad years. How soon will the program lose its
current fan base? Think about how many people left early during the TCU game,
and you can see the Utes could be in trouble very quickly if they can't stay
The Rock Monster has spoken . . . er, written!The big problem for
Chris Hill is the economics. The numbers say, "Make the change." For Utah, however, part of their reputation requires them to be able to
hold onto and to support a coach. Giacoletti and Boylen both won conference
championships. To dismiss them both within two years shouts, "Hey!
Anybody who comes here better get a long-term guaranteed contract, because we
will terminate the agreement if you have two successive tough years."So, the problem gets tougher for Hill and the Utes. The reality is that
the Utah fans are fickle and won't support a team that struggles.
Your headline is the most encouraging news I've read all year about the Utah
basketball program. There is hope if we say goodbye to Jim before he totally
destroys the 11th [formerly] best basketball program in the country. My family
will not be going to the Huntsman tonight to watch 3 and 8 Utah play 2 and 9
Wyoming in a boring, pass the ball around, pretend basketball game. I think I
have to mow the lawn or go to the dentist. However, I think we do have one
first in the country this year - Utah has to be the ONLY school where the
women's gymnastics team more than doubles the fans of the men's basketball team.
Unbelievable. Make the change now before we get drilled in the PAC-12.