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Dick Harmon: Jimmer Fredette's latest frontier — officiating

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  • Dennis Harwich, MA
    Feb. 19, 2011 7:45 a.m.

    All of you are pathetic. Blaming the officials. That's all BYU fans have done for decades. Big babies.

  • badlandscougar great plains, sd
    Feb. 17, 2011 10:31 a.m.

    jimmer and the byu team are student athletes, so is the rest of the mwc's athletic teams. wouldn't it put past the mwc to look the other way. don't lose your integrity commish.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Feb. 16, 2011 2:59 p.m.

    Suggesting Jimmer to sit because he was taking a beating? Why not call some fouls to calm things down?

  • skywalker Palo Alto, CA
    Feb. 16, 2011 2:59 p.m.

    RD10

    "Offensive players create contact..."

    And they've been getting away with it forever.

    That's expected.

    What's not expected is three or four defenders mugging an offensive player everytime he drives the lane with nothing being called.

    Just as in football, where the receiver usually gets the benefit of the doubt when there's contact with the defender, the offensive player in basketball usually gets the benefit of the doubt on any contact that creates a disadvantage for the offensive player, whether that's a wrist slap, push in the back, a hold, or tripping.

  • RD10 Holladay, UT
    Feb. 16, 2011 2:37 p.m.

    Offensive players create contact and get way to many calls. It makes basketball boring.

    Jimmer usually gets those calls. The refs let it go both ways. I didn't notice Jimmer crying about it. But, The fans around me whined the whole game. It got real old.

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Feb. 16, 2011 1:47 p.m.

    dknight68: Welcome to Dream World!!!

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Feb. 16, 2011 12:56 p.m.

    The only ones out of control were this senseless referee and "Smiley" Cupetts! (Who's smiling now?) A big part of Jimmer's game is getting to the foul line which he has practiced and prepared for all his life. Go ahead, refs, and take that part of his game away. You do yourself proud!!!

  • BYU DUDE Provo, UT
    Feb. 16, 2011 11:21 a.m.

    I was mugged on my Mission 5 times. So I am somewhat of an expert.

    Trust me Jimmer is "Getting "Mugged"

  • wwookie Payson, UT
    Feb. 16, 2011 6:53 a.m.

    An earlier quote:
    "It's amazing how much hatred gets spewed by losers.

    Let's say it one more time.

    Three groups of people determine the outcome of games."

    - I guess this guy has never sat courtside. The fans also have a big impact. In general they can change momentum, but those on the front 5 or 6 rows can be heard by the players.

    The success of BYU at home is not just jimmer, but also that loud fan base.

    Anyways, Jimmer isn't a saint and refs make mistakes. I would love to see Jimmer play against the Jazz in the Malone-Stockton-Hornacek era. He would be on the ground with a few broken bones. He hasn't experienced what Harmon thinks is "mugging".

  • alternate Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 16, 2011 4:44 a.m.

    I believe that an official telling a coach to take a player out, for complaining about being fouled, crosses the line. If there was a foul call it, if not, "T" the complainer if excessive. An official that will force a player off the floor because the official won't make calls, is really bad. That individual needs to hang up his striped shirt and move on to chess in the park.

    A foul is a foul. If an official won't call a foul for whatever reason, then he or she needs a new job. Nothing more, nothing less.

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 16, 2011 4:13 a.m.

    Here is the quote from ESPN:

    "After getting fouled on what turned out to be his final basket of the night with 59 seconds to play, Fredette let the officials know how he felt about their handling of the game's very physical affairs. Before Fredette could attempt his free throw to complete the three-point play, umpire Mike Reed advised BYU coach Dave Rose to remove his point guard from the game, in light of his vocal unhappiness and increasing frustration level. With the game no longer in doubt, Fredette left the contest after scoring his final point.

    Whether the official should be engaging in such a dialogue with Rose is something that can be debated, but there can be no argument that Fredette is getting the stuffing knocked out of him on a nightly basis, and this past week in particular, the whistle was swallowed more often than not.

    It appears that Fredette's brilliance and as a scorer and ease in finding different ways to score is leading officials to make him have to work even harder than lesser players to earn the whistle."

    Clearly not just a BYU fan's opinion.

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 16, 2011 3:18 a.m.

    I want the league to publicly apologize to SDSU Coach Steve Fisher and Jimmer for the poor treatment both received this past week.

    If they can publicly, and wrongly, reprimand Fisher, they can make it right publicly as well.

    While they are at it, they can state publicly that they have discussed the problem with the officials and will be watching how future games are called.

  • Cougarista Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 8:42 p.m.

    Craig Thompson needs to step in. Fredette is being triple teamed, obviously fouled and not getting the calls. End of discussion. The other coaches are mad that Jimmer scores and they don't want to blame their own players.

  • El Ingreso St.George, Utah
    Feb. 15, 2011 8:38 p.m.

    So what do all of you ranters propose? Burning down the MWC headquarters? Seriously, you're all sounding like a bunch of drama-hungry maniacs.

  • moodyblue77 Provo, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 6:59 p.m.

    It's amazing how much hatred gets spewed by losers.

    Let's say it one more time.

    Three groups of people determine the outcome of games.

    Team A, Team B, and team ref. If you don't see that, then you do not know the game.

    I respect refs until they turn into opponents. Then they are just meddlers. If they are not calling fouls that are typically fouls, trying to even up the game, or engineer an upset then they are a pox on the game.

    If they are part of the conversation they are not doing the job. If their names get in the paper, they should be suspended.

  • Real Bass Idaho Falls, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 6:31 p.m.

    Any official who asks a coach to taqke a player out of the game should be suspended!

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    Feb. 15, 2011 6:02 p.m.

    "I remember when Araujo punched a guy from UNLV and us byu fans thought it was great and deserved."

    How did the Dn's allow this comment to get threw. I expected better zoobie censorship than this.

  • Mildred in Fillmore Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 5:00 p.m.

    Everybody hates my Cougars and we are being cheated by the refs. Once Jimmer gets to the NBA, he will never be "ruffed up".

  • scenic view Baltimore, MD
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:56 p.m.

    jazzfan

    The reason Jimmer seems "out-of-control" is because he's being hit hard MULTIPLE times every time he drives. That's the problem, and it's getting worse because the refs are swallowing their whistles.

    The turnovers are a direct result of the fouls that aren't being called.

    Jimmer has been remarkably calm about all of the times he's been fouled throughout the season, but it's gotten much worse the last two games and Jimmer has a right to be upset that NOTHING is being called.

  • sports-junkie West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:53 p.m.

    @ scenic view

    How about the "non-backcourt"-travel-double dribble no call?

    I understand it wasnt actually a back court violation within the rules of the game but to miss the blatant double dribble and traveling violation was mind boggling.

    Even as bad as those non-calls were, no one was in danger of getting hurt, unlike the Jimmer no calls.

  • jazzfan Pocatello, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:43 p.m.

    I'm a huge BYU fan and to be honest I have been disappointed in the way Jimmer handles himself on the court lately. No player should ever expect a call. I feel like he has been looking for contact rather than looking to make a play. When he drives uncontrollably inside he is going to get some contact. But it seems like he sees it as a way out. He still makes some amazing plays, but I'd like to see fewer turnovers and more control from him.

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:38 p.m.

    I remember when Araujo punched a guy from UNLV and us byu fans thought it was great and deserved.

  • scenic view Baltimore, MD
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:36 p.m.

    dknight68

    You cite one example when a foul on O'brien wasn't called and a "phantom" foul committed by Clyburn that was called.

    Obouo was also called for tripping a Utah player when replays clearly show that Charles didn't even touch the Utah player.

    That's not what concerns BYU fans. It happens.

    What BYU fans are talking about is over a dozen times in just the Air Force and Utah games when Jimmer drove the lane and was pushed, grabbed, and tripped, often by multiple players, with nothing being called.

    We're not talking mere slaps on the wrist or a slight push in the back, we're talking about getting hit/tripped hard enough to knock Jimmer to the floor, sometimes in mid-air, which is extremely dangerous.

  • Veritas Aequitas Fruit Heights, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:25 p.m.

    A hedgehog is any of the spiny mammals of the subfamily Erinaceinae and the order Erinaceomorpha. There are 17 species of hedgehog in five genera, found through parts of Europe, Asia, Africa, and New Zealand. There are no hedgehogs native to Australia, and no living species native to North America; those in New Zealand are introduced. Hedgehogs have changed little over the last 15 million years. Like many of the first mammals they have adapted to a nocturnal, insectivorous way of life. The name 'hedgehog' came into use around the year 1450, derived from the Middle English 'heyghoge', from 'heyg', 'hegge' = hedge, because it frequents hedgerows, and 'hoge', 'hogge' = hog, from its piglike snout...

    Let's play the name game...

  • Linus Bountiful, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:20 p.m.

    Games have rules. Basketball is only basketball when played by the rules of basketball. It appears that some officials have decided, "Sure, Jimmer can dominate and win by the usual rules of basketball, but can he win if we change the rules?"

    Many years ago we played basketball in the old Wallsburg Ward House in Wallsburg, Utah. The court was small and the walls confining, so we invented "Wallsburg Ball." There was no out-of-bounds and there were no fouls. We had a great time, but finesse, body control and a shooter's touch were no longer required. Pure muscle and brute force were the winning combination. Those who didn't wish to sustain an injury declined to play by our rules.

    It seems the officials of the MWC have discovered "Wallsburg Ball." You can't blame the players or their coaches. You push the envelope to find what game the officials are calling, and then take every liberty offered. But the fans really wanted to see what Jimmer could do in the traditional game of basketball, and we are being denied the chance of a lifetime. Sad! I hope not tragic.

  • Big_Ben Centerville, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:11 p.m.

    I am guessing that if your name is "articuno" you are trying not to be taken seriously...........Im guessing you are a ute fan pulling a Chris B?

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    Feb. 15, 2011 4:04 p.m.

    PerfectCougar,

    hmmm, it looks like you live in payson "utah" therfore you're a ute.

    Utah: The name "Utah" is derived from the name of the Ute tribe and means "people of the mountains".
    Utes were known to eat mountain cougar as a daily diet.

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 15, 2011 3:50 p.m.

    A perferct Cougar is a BYU Cougar. Not true for a WSU Cougar or many other imitations. No one wants to be called a Ute, so no one copies that name.

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 15, 2011 3:47 p.m.

    How hard is it to understand the disappointment and frustration of fans in seeing the teams best player manhandled and the rules not inforced that are designed to protect him?

  • oldschool Farmington, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 3:38 p.m.

    Yes, some of us have been refs, and that's why it's maddening to see no-calls on hard fouls. As a former player, I also hate refs who call phantom fouls, or church refs who call "over the back" even when there is no contact or "reaching in" when a player makes a clean steal. But a ref who allows a player to be knocked off course repeatedly, resulting in a missed shot or a turnover is one who should be forced to quit (or change). I agree with the comment that Jimmer and BYU will improve with poor officiating in the Mountain West. I well remember when Devin Durrant's team met Kentucky. The Cougars couldn't handle getting mugged because in those days in the WAC practically no physical contact was allowed except for rebound positioning. Devin was thrown completely off his game, and so were the rest of the Coogs. One reason our intermountain teams have been doing better against so-called power conferences (a misnomer since the Mountain West is one of the top four conferences) is that the referees allow contact nowadays. Still, it's not as bad as in the NBA.

  • ArticunoBYU Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 3:23 p.m.

    We deserve to get all the calls! A foul is a foul! Why is that so hard to understand? Go away utsie trolls?

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Feb. 15, 2011 3:20 p.m.

    dknight68

    Did you read the article on ESPN? A completely neutral, objective sports reporter from San Francisco who reports primarily on conferences like the MWC, sees it exactly the same way as BYU fans h regarding the hard, physical play on Jimmer not being whistled against Air Force and Utah.

    Please explain how a neutral reporter sees the same thing happening on the court as Dick Harmon and the vast majority of BYU fans, if there's not some truth to it.

  • dknight68 Ogden, ut
    Feb. 15, 2011 2:49 p.m.

    pac man

    No, I watched the game as well and honestly thought Utah was getting the shaft. I am a Utah Man after all. For instance, when O'brien goes down the lane and gets it across both arms, the ball is stolen away and Jimmer gets a call on the other end when Clyburn waves at him, I decided the MWC was going to ride Jimmer to the bank. You are all simply jumping on the Dick Harmon bandwagon, who has never claimed to be an objective sports journalist, When he says "Oh the injustice of it all!!" A look at the box score simply shows it was not as you all have been describing. You really need to get off the persecution complex. Your guys won the game find joy and rejoicing.

  • In Arizona Mesa, AZ
    Feb. 15, 2011 2:44 p.m.

    By the way, what is a "perfect cougar"?

  • Tommy2Shoes Lehi, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 2:32 p.m.

    As long as we win and Jimmer stays healthy the Y will do very well the rest of this year. Jimmer is fun to watch and gets to the foul line enough in most games. I observe many potential fouls not called on both teams. Just be grateful that we are having an amazing run. Next up is TCU on the road. Good luck guys in Texas.

  • bigdaddy Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 1:34 p.m.

    I'm sure Brandon Davies would love to be officiated with the same lack of scrutiny as the guys guarding Jimmer get.

    Seems like Brandon gets whistled for a foul just walking onto the court, breathing wrong or looking at someone cross-eyed. Considering how hard Jimmer has to get hit before a foul is called, Brandon sure gets some pretty easy ticky-tack fouls called on him.

    There is a HUGE disparity there.

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 1:05 p.m.

    Thanks for the comedy most of you. Nearly all of you base your "opinions" on whether or not your a BYU / Jimmer fan. Jimmer does get fouled a lot. He also gets to the line alot. It is obvious to anyone with a any Basketball IQ that teams are playing Jimmer tighter and more physically. Trying to intimidate him won't work because he simply won't be. It would be great to see consistency from the officials across all games with all teams but it does not happen. Referees frequently influence the outcome of games by how they call them. The law of averages usually treats teams equally overall. Jimmer should just continue to play and leave the politics to his coach. He should get most of the calls he deserves.

  • Skippy West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 1:04 p.m.

    Scott- Try taking off your blue tinted glasses and quit looking at basketball as a red and blue game and start seeing it as basketball.

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:40 p.m.

    El Ingreso

    BYU fans are rightly concerned about their star player being seriously injured because the MWC officials have decided to swallow their whistles and not calls obvious fouls.

    Only BYU haters wouldn't be concerned about the muggings taking place on the court.

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:31 p.m.

    dknight68

    If all you've done is look at the boxscore, then you're unqualified to discuss whether the physical play on Jimmer has gone beyond what is acceptable.

  • El Ingreso St.George, Utah
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:27 p.m.

    Only BYU fans complain about referees calls after winning the game. Good gads, it's just a game, get over it.

  • TGR-BLUE West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:23 p.m.

    Is it the officials job to decide whether Jimmer's style is acceptable? Why should an official tell a coach he ought to take a player out of the game? Why don't they call fouls trying to avoid the ticky tack ones? If Jimmer gets an obvious foul call it, it's part of the game. Should officials try to make Jimmer just bring the ball down and pass it off, so they won't have a tough call to make? I thought that was their job!

  • Anonymous Infinity American Fork, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:21 p.m.

    Officiating at all levels beginning with the NBA has filtered down to the lower levels, i.e. College and high school. What is happening in the case of Fredette is appalling. Allowing fouls and redefining what a foul is in any game is pure nonsense. Officiating has always been over the years favorable to the home teams however it is rationalized by officials, administrators, or the general public. It's a fact. Whenever there are players of higher profile and talent, the focus is always hightened. Fredette is being abused by teams and the officiating needs to address it. He is being bumped and pushed out of his driving lanes, and hacked almost 1005 of the time with a lot of contact being ignored. All this does will ignite the player concerned, his fellow players, the coaches and the fans. This could lead to further violent play and otherwise fan unrest in general. There are cases when these things get and of control, ending up with players fighting and the violence spilling over to the fans, causing riots and fans coming to the floor.

    I say clean up you act officials and call the game. This is not roboball.

  • dknight68 Ogden, ut
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:16 p.m.

    Do you guys want a little cheese with your whine? Holy Cow, you are all complaining about the game against Utah but a quick look at the box score reveals Utah went to the line 8 times total Jimmer went to the line 8 times, and his team went 24. Perhaps the refs were no calling either way? Total fouls against Utah 20 total fouls against BYU 14. If Jimmer is to fragile to play mens Basketball perhaps he should try the womens league otherwise shut up and play. How do you suppose he will be treated in the NBA? Jimmer is getting double and triple teamed, as should be expected since he has dropped 40 several times this year, but as he avoids the first defender he sometimes initiates the contact with the second, or the third this should not be a offensive call necessarily but it should not be defensive call either. Therefore the ref gives no call, and the Y-ners Yine!!

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:07 p.m.

    Its so cheap. Craig thomson will probably have someplayer from the MWC try to hurt Jimmer.
    We never get calls which is why I always boo really hard at the refs and other teams.

  • Cougs4Life Gilbert, AZ
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:06 p.m.

    Referee's have a tough assignment to balance allowing the play to flow and "over-calling" a game. The issue with Jimmer is that teams aren't trying to steal the ball, or impede his progress to the basket, they just want to press full court and tire him out to impact his offensive game. If they could find a way to make him play more defense and tire him out that way, they would do that to.

    The problem is that Jimmer has the ball so much that it would slow the game down if they called every single foul. The rule of thumb is to make the call if it impacts the outcome of the play. Since defenses are trying to steal the ball, and they rarely do, the refs aren't going to call much of the physical play on the way up the floor.

    I don't know if Jimmer's ego could handle it, but it would be interesting to see what would happen if Emery brought the ball up instead?

  • COUGARNATE Lyman, WY
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:00 p.m.

    I don't know about all this psychological junk of what is going on, all I know is that
    Jimmer is getting mugged about 60% of the time. Why are things being called different then they were earlier in the year. Call a foul when a guy gets fouled, is that such a hard concept? I officiate high school football, and when I see a penalty that affects the play I call it. It should be the same, when Jimmer gets knocked to the floor. It is a foul!!!!!

  • Anne26 West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 11:40 a.m.

    I have to say that the comments on this board are extremely entertaining. I haven't seen this type of idol worship since Obama took the white house.

    THE Jimmer, is simply a college kid who plays great basketball. Nothing more, nothing less.

    Teams will attempt to stop Jimmer. Like it or not, good players draw the defense; it happens all the time in sports.

  • TrueBlue Orem, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 11:27 a.m.

    Stop whining hedgehog.

    We already know that the Utes have been victimized by Jimmer (TWICE), or as most of the nation now calls it,

    J I M M E R E D !

  • sky2k1 Saint George, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 11:06 a.m.

    @in arizona

    you need to call down a little bit there...refs are human and make mistakes... and we as humans like to point out others mistakes. Yes, I've tried reffing, in two sports (not high levels though) and it's not easy, but you have to get off your ego trip. I have friends that ref and I know their egos get into the game. Quit worshiping the striped shirt that you once wore.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    Feb. 15, 2011 11:03 a.m.

    V I C T I M

  • Alpine Blue Alpine, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:57 a.m.

    Very timely article. Thanks for expounding on this phenomena Dick.

    Remember a few muggings of BYU stars of the past to include Kresmir Cosic by both Utah and Arizona State Will never forget Phil Tollstrup charging off the BYU bench to defend Cosic against an ASU football player suited up especially to mug Kresh.

    Danny Ainge was roughed up a few times as well, but usually took care of it himself.

    And who will ever forget the former WAC ref turned commentator with an avowed hatred of BYU.

  • XelaDave Salem, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:49 a.m.

    Write letters to the conf.- fill their inbox- they do not read you here

  • Unbelievable West Jordan, Utah
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:28 a.m.

    I've watched closely to see how the Jimmer is handling all the hype and expectations being placed upon him.

    Although its been a barrell of fun, it's also came at a price. The kid has been thrust into the limelight and treated like a rockstar, thus, the new added stress and pressure are eventually going to follow.

    Jimmer is becomming more and more like Danny Ainge. Yes, I said that and am a true blue Cougar. There's nothing I enjoyed more than watching Ainge slay the opposition, however, with that said, I despised his whining even more. Just like with Jimmer, I can hardly wait for the next game to begin, but if he's going to start copping an attitude, he's going to lose favor with fans, coaches, and sportswritters everywhere and that wont bode well when Cousy and Wooden awards are voted upon.

    Focus up Jimmer and play through the tough no calls. Nobody likes a whiner. The NBA is likely around the corner for you, where whining is both accepted and permissible.

    I don't want to look down the road and see a reflection of Ainge when I think about the Jimmer!

  • Neanderthal SLC, Utah
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:13 a.m.

    @BYUalum 5:50 p.m.:

    "Do officials react to a player's stardom?"

    Yes. Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant rarely get called for charging fouls.

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:09 a.m.

    A foul is a foul. Three guys fouling at the same time is a mugging. Pick your player, as all three committed fouls.

    Miss a slap on the arm, ok, miss three guys hacking at the same time, its a mugging and negligence on the part of the referee.

    I don't like it when the ref's miss a call when the BYU players foul either.

  • Veritas Aequitas Fruit Heights, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:03 a.m.

    cvguy | 9:44 a.m. Feb. 15, 2011
    Lehi, Utah
    "Waaaaa! Waaaaaa!"
    ===
    Classy.

    Players cannot guard Fredette without fouling him. He'd light every team up for 60 points if they had to play straight up "D".

    It does not benefit the MWC for BYU to blow out all their teams just to leave the conference next year.

    Let's see if Harmon's column get Fredette a few more calls as he finishes out his senior season, and moves into the NCAA tourney.

    I think it will be good for ratings to keep Fredette playing in March, so we may see a few more calls made.

  • goitalone w bountiful, ut
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:03 a.m.

    BTW,
    Since when is it the official's purvue to tell a coach when to bench his player. As in life, on the court, unless a player has committed an infraction, the ref has no standing in player removal. If he goes off, eject him. Otherwise, if you fear for a players safety, eject the one mugging him.

    "Coach, your player is getting beaten up physically. I don't have the fortitude to eject the one beating him up, so will you take him out?"

    It is rediculous that officials need to play touchy / feely in calling a game. Call it, and let the chips fall. When you do, both sides get the message and play accordingly. When there is a sliding scale, both sides continually push for favoritism.

  • In Arizona Mesa, AZ
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:55 a.m.

    To PerfectCougar. I think your name indicates your arrogance. You say that the refs should get it right when the guy is getting mugged ... hence, refereeing is a subjective job. Give it a try. Your mugging isn't someone elses mugging!

  • TGR-BLUE West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:52 a.m.

    Why should officials be able to restrict Jimmer from utilizing his unusual talents? Jimmer gets plenty of assists because of excellent defensive play, but fans love to see him make space and get off a three pointer or make an incredible move and get off a driving shot. If defenders are allowed to foul him, he's bound to get frustrated. Is Jimmer just supposed to put up with this kind of unfair treatment? True fans of good basketball enjoy seeing talented players display their talents.

  • Hellooo Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:51 a.m.

    It is really within BYU's control. If the opposing team is going to mug their star, then someone has to step on the mugger and that is not going to be a referee. Two or three hard picks on the opposing team's star and you will see a more straight up defense. Until BYU makes such plays they are not good enough to win the MWC and have little chance for a deep run in the NCAA Tournament. Soft or tough (not talking about Jimmer he is a nail), but the rest of the team needs to stand up, clean and very hard.

  • cvguy Lehi, Utah
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:44 a.m.

    Waaaaa! Waaaaaa! Why does everybody pick on us? We are BYU and we are better than everyone else. We would never lose a game in any sport if it weren't for people cheating to make us lose.

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:37 a.m.

    You have to admire the way Jimmer has handled the non-calls up to the last game against UTAH. I have been frustrated by the non-calls for some time and feel he did a good job of moving past them.

    The last two games have got to be too much though and I think the line has been crossed too far by the defense and the officials.

    I do not know of many people who could take what he has received and not show their disapproval in this treatment.

  • jakartafan Houston, TX
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:34 a.m.

    There is one positive to the physical play that Jimmer has to endure. If he survives, he will be prepared for the NCAA tourney. Remember how physical KSU was on Jimmer last year?

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:32 a.m.

    If any player is mugged and there is not a call, the ref's deserve all the criticism.

    Just because it is a hard job doesn't mean they don't have to get the easy ones right. A guy getting mugged by two, three or four players is an easy call.

  • jakartafan Houston, TX
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:16 a.m.

    It is a disgrace that officials feel they need to penalize a good player -it is not their job to try and help the underdog or make a good player work harder. They need to call the same fouls for all players. A player that handles the ball and drives and shoots a lot should be going to the foul line more. And there should be no quota. If they foul him he should shoot, whether it is his fifth trip to the line or fifteenth. This is now starting to get national notice. The MWC needs to tell the officials to call the game right. Otherwise it only validates the national perception that many have that the MWC is not ready for the big time.

  • IDC Boise, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:15 a.m.

    The silver lining is that as long as Jimmer doesn't get hurt, he and the cougars will be better prepared for the conference and NCAA tournaments.

    Go Cougs. Keep on winning.

  • In Arizona Mesa, AZ
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:11 a.m.

    All of you criticizing the refs, have you ever been a ref? Just by walking out on the court the Refs are automatically the bad guys. This is the case at whatever level. Many of the calls they have to make are purely judgemental and there's absolutely no way they can see it all! So next time you want to criticize a ref, try being one yourself for a few games and you'll never criticize them again!

  • yarrlydarb Ogden, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:05 a.m.

    After the Utes' previous showing on their home court, Coach Rose said, "The best way to guard Jimmer is to foul him. In practice we don't call fouls."

    And there was the answer, Boylen thought, for the next game.

    He surely took that statement to heart.

    Fouling Jimmer became 75% of Boylen's game plan.

    But that didn't work either as even with all the no-calls, Jimmer made 16 free throws, which was enough in it's self to win the game.

    Does Boylen know the meaning of backfire?

    Had Davies and Hartsock had their normal game, the margin would have been double or more than what it was.

  • goitalone w bountiful, ut
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:00 a.m.

    I have officiated at a number of levels and more basketball than I even care to remember. I will be the first to maintain that officials seldom have anything to do with the outcome of a game. For every non call made in the final second, I will show you five missed freethrows ten minutes earlier. Fans always want to blame someone for their teams loss, just not their team.

    That said, I think there is a pathetic precedent set in the NBA and it filters down to every level, that of calling a game based on who is playing or the reputation preceding a game. If an official sees a foul as conditioned by his training, then call it. Don't look first to see who fouled or who was fouled. A carry is a carry whether it's Koby or Joe. Call it. If the physicality of a game escalates to the point where management becomes difficult, advise both teams and be true to your warning, including technicals and ejections. Predetermining how you're going to trat favored individuals is always a bad idea, since everyone is somebody's favorite. Just call it by the book.

  • DixieAggie St.George, Utah
    Feb. 15, 2011 8:47 a.m.

    From the way people are describing it, it sounded like Jimmer was ready to bust a cap, so to speak. Bad behavior, no matter how unfair the refs may be, will get you thrown out of the game.

  • WinSum Rexburg, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 8:23 a.m.

    A mugging is a mugging. Should be called and stop all the justification by refs. Typically intentional fouls call for ejection. Now the player being fouled is asked to leave....? Wow...what a mind-set. What's next? Can't play bb without a tatoo?

  • CG Orem, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 8:03 a.m.

    What's up?

    Bad calls on Tai? You mean that technical he got for swinging his elbows which is a clear violation of the rules?

    Sorry bud, it was an unfortunate call for the Aggies, especially the timing of the call, but it wasn't a bad call.

  • Idaho guy Meridian, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 8:01 a.m.

    hedgehog...

    HAHAHAHAHA... really? Stop Fredette and you beat BYU? You are funny! First, very difficult assignment to stop Fredette, seems no one has really been successful at this. Second of all how well did Abouo, Emery, Davies, Hartsock and Rogers play against your beloved Utes? BYU is the real deal and is a legit team. Enjoy disparaging BYU as that is all you seem to be able to do. BYU is a great team, and Jimmer is AMAZING! Go Cougs!

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 7:37 a.m.

    The refs asked Coach Rose to take Jimmer out of the game? Why would they do that? Answer: Take the pressure off themselves for bad officiating and everyone in the Marriott Center knew it including Utah's coach as per his comments. Refs, just do your job and officiate fairly! Brandon or Noah can't even breathe on a offensive player without getting called for a foul, but anyone defending Jimmer has a different rule book- or none at all!

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    Feb. 15, 2011 7:25 a.m.

    My my my, sounds like a bunch ally cats wailing on a hot tin roof.

    If byu had other options than jimer this would not be an issue. Teams know that if you stop jimer dredent you stop the tds.

    One demensional gimmick team.

    NUFF SAID

  • 3grandslams Iowa City, IA
    Feb. 15, 2011 6:59 a.m.

    I do think the MWC needs to step in and say enough is enough. BYU is giving them a glowing national spotlight for a conference, a nice going away present, they ought to return the favor.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 6:58 a.m.

    Officials know that Fredette is going to be covered tightly and manhandled. They need to be diligent in making sure the defense is honest and not overly physical. If the MWC Conference loses him because of lack officiating and worse, it will hurt more than just the teams burn by a once in a generation player. Think about it.

  • What's up? Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 5:55 a.m.

    You might ask Ty Wesley and USU who got the bad calls when they played BYU. It looks to me that Jim is beginning to "press" a little to get his points and at time is a little out of control.

  • byufootballrocks Herndon, VA
    Feb. 15, 2011 5:42 a.m.

    How about simply "a foul is a foul"?

    How about following the rule book?

    It's like each set of refs has a rule book of his own.

    Did the ref who spoke spoke off the record also admit that maybe there's a little of his ego involved in foul-calling?

    I remember an NBA ref who was consistent. He called it by the book on both ends and didn't care what anyone thought about it - players, coaches, home-town fans. The result was a consistent game and less focus on the referrees.

    But Jimmer been knocked around so much and hacked and slammed with no calls that you wonder if the referees are discussing him and if it's an objective to not respect his talent.

  • Dennis Harwich, MA
    Feb. 15, 2011 5:39 a.m.

    Officials. Get real.

  • bikelehi Lehi, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 5:21 a.m.

    What's funny is to see the players mug Jimmer, then look at the refs and when they realize they weren't called for a foul kind of shrug and get back to it.

  • scott Alpine, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 11:53 p.m.

    Skippy

    "They will be playing teams that are BIGGER, FASTER and way more PHYSICAL than any of the teams you have faced this year."

    More physical than Air Force or Utah were the last two games?

    Bigger and faster than SDSU or Arizona?

    You don't get higher seeds because of luck, Skippy, you earn them, especially when you don't play in one of the "power" conferences.

    NONE of those NCAA tourney teams will be anymore prepared than the MWC teams BYU is playing the second time through the conference and in the MWC tourney.

    Your analysis is extremely flawed.

    Try taking off those crimson-colored glasses first; then try it again.

  • Skippy West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 11:40 p.m.

    re lordandrew1: Your NAME says alot. Utah fans don't need to be told they have a crappy team this year, I think they already know that. And yes, BYU is good this year, mostly because of Jimmer. The thing you need to do is look outside your bubble and be realistic about BYU's chances in the NCAA tournament! They will be playing teams that are BIGGER, FASTER and way more PHYSICAL than any of the teams you have faced this year. They will study film and know who Jimmer is and they will know what to do about him. You might get lucky and have a higher seed to give you a chance of winning more games, but you might not win those. After all, it is called march madness for a reason.
    Good luck in the tourney and try to remember...
    WHAT COMES AROUND, GOES AROUND!

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 10:51 p.m.

    It's interesting when officials call hand checks when no clear advantage is gained by the defender, but then choose to ignore a player getting mugged and tripped, when clearly an advantage is gained by the defender.

  • MAFU Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 10:43 p.m.

    Google/youtube the Jordan rules and Detroit Pistons Bad Boys. That was physical defense.

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 10:17 p.m.

    lordandrew1, your last sentence was uncalled for. No wonder Ute fans criticize BYU fans. We are sometimes arrogant, as they often indicate in their blogs, and your blog reeked of arrogance! If we, as fans, want fair treatment by Ute bloggers, we need to be fair in our blogs. Please, all BYU fans, let's be nice with our comments. Let's not be like a bunch of chickens who peck away at one or two they feel are inferior. Let's not put another team down just to make ourselves feel superior. Think about what the result will be before posting.

  • Chad S Derby, KS
    Feb. 14, 2011 10:16 p.m.

    When is a foul not a foul? When it's Jimmer driving the lane.

  • AZnewser Snowflake, AZ
    Feb. 14, 2011 10:08 p.m.

    Sometimes stars get mugged... see Youtube for a clip of Kobe Bryant getting hacked 7 times on one play without a foul call, pretty funny... I wish the Jimmer would let the coaches and fans fight that battle for him. He looks spoiled when he tries to stare down the refs.

  • DC Alexandria, VA
    Feb. 14, 2011 10:04 p.m.

    Jimmer's getting a lot of attention because throughout the season the other BYU players have ridden his wave. It's now time for the other players to step up and be consistent - force defenders to guard you. This will remove the double ad triple teaming of Jimmer. If Abouo and emery can consistently score and Davies pitches in on the inside, then there won't be so much pressure on Jimmer. If BYU can figure this out, they'll make a deep run in the tournament. If it is still the Jimmer show at the end of the season, look for another second round exit.

  • The Rock Federal Way, WA
    Feb. 14, 2011 9:42 p.m.

    Most of us are held accountable for our actions, but who judges the judges?

    Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

    If nobody else will do it then the media (KSL TV) needs to put together a montage of video clips, all from the same game, showing the Jimmer getting assaulted on the court with no foul being called and others getting a foul call over something very trivial by comparison.

    Put it on YouTube.

    Put the names of the officials in the video.

    Hold them accountable in the court of public opinion.

    Coaches can get an official fired but it takes several coaches in the conference working together. Not likely to get that in the MWC this year.

    I remember talking with Lloyd Eldredge after BYU played George back in the Steve Young era. They played in a driving rain. Every time Georgia asked for a new ball they got a new dry ball. When BYU asked for a new ball, if they got one at all it was worse than the one they were replacing.

    These guys need to be held accountable.

  • pmoaks Kaysville, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 9:27 p.m.

    Been extremely frustrating to watch Jimmer get hammered and then watch Brandon Davies have to sit out the last 10+ min of the first half because of some of the calls that go against him. Worry is about an injury to a great college player...and he's been getting banged up pretty hard the past few weeks. I love it when the refs let them play (thought the SDSU game was well called), especially since BYU is so thin in their big men...but let's be real here!

  • Duh west jordan, ut
    Feb. 14, 2011 9:18 p.m.

    @lordandrew1.....you just had to throw in the Ute comment didn't you. This has nothing to do about them, even Hedgie made a simple comment, making light of the article. Teams are now focusing on Jimmer, they don't want to be embarrased by him, they are going to do what they can get away with to shut him down. This last game was no exception. I agree there were some instances where there was no foul so it was not called yet, there were other times he was hammered by two or three players and no calls made. When it's a foul, call it, that's all that is being asked.

  • lordandrew1 Provo, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 8:30 p.m.

    The thing that I'm so ready for is to have Jimmer play with refs from other conferences during the NCAA tournament--this rugby-like treatment of Fredette wasn't happening in out-of-conference play. Why? Because teams knew he'd get around 15 free throws per game!

    Jimmer won't have to do much complaining during the NCAA Tournament--those outside the mountain time zone give Jimmer the same treatment as any other player.

    When that happens, look for AT LEAST 2 tourney wins from "the team down south" while the "amazing, vastly superior Utes" move from the cellar of the MWC to the cellar of the PAC-12!

  • larri3 Farmington, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 8:19 p.m.

    As a former referee, I view an official's job as having three priorities: No. 1 is to control the game. Things should not get out of hand. No. 2 is to be consistent, to treat both teams equally. No. 3 is to make the right call. Because officials are human, they make mistakes. All officials make mistakes with No. 3. Officials with bad attitudes often make mistakes with No. 1 and No. 2. Underdogs get a lot of calls their way. Home teams get a lot of calls, especially in noisy arenas. In the NBA stars get a lot of calls but not as many as before the Donahy incident. In college some refs are like bad appraisers who think it's their job to keep home prices down, and they don't like star players and will allow them to be roughed up a bit. Usually players who show respect to referees will get a few calls. There's a fine line between complaining too much and not complaining enough. A player who doesn't draw too much attention to himself can discuss calls calmly with most officials and get them to see his point of view.

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 7:58 p.m.

    Ernesto de Bajo

    If you know anything about the spiteful, vindicative nature of Craig Thompson, you would know that he's not above telling officials "not to get too picky about calling fouls because we don't want to turn games into free throw shooting contests," when his real goal is to make it more difficult for Jimmer to get fair treatment.

  • Solomon the Wise Alpine, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 7:47 p.m.

    "Jimmer always has always complained about no calls."

    Nothing could be further from the truth, but you're welcome to your clueless rant.

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 14, 2011 7:25 p.m.

    Please do a follow up on this topic very soon. The issue will still be there after the next game. Maybe you have time to line up an a official and watch the game on tape together. Also look at the game against UTAH and Air Force. Home and away!

  • PerfectCougar Payson, UTAH
    Feb. 14, 2011 7:23 p.m.

    I asked for someone to do some real research on this issue and tell us the truth about these non-calls and the double standard.

    This was a nice first try.

    I want to know if the officials have decided ahead of the game to ignore fouls committed against jimmer that they would call against other players. Simply put - is there a double standard against Jimmer?

    This article does not clearly answer that question. It dances around it.

    Please show a current MWC referee the tapes of the games with the non-calls and stare him the eyes and ask him if they were not fouls and if the tape does not prove that their is a double standard against Jimmer.

    Next question after they admit the double standard is - why does it exist?

  • Ernesto de Bajo Albuquerque, NM
    Feb. 14, 2011 7:21 p.m.

    To the dudes that want to put it on Craig Thompson:

    I am no fan of Thompson but do you seriously believe that he is telling referees to call games in a way that punishes teams that are leaving the conference?

  • RaininTime Orem, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 7:06 p.m.

    The fact that Jimmer knows how to draw contact shouldn't be a liability. That is part of his basketball IQ and skill.

    What I hate is when, say, Brandon Davies, is called for some ticky-tacky foul, then Fredette is bumped or mugged at the other end and no call is made.

    Is officiating a tough job? Yes, but trying to play Basketball when the officials are inconsistent during the game is far more difficult.

    Finally, I don't go to games to watch the officials, I go to watch the players compete on a fair and equal playing field. When I think that field is skewed, either by the superiority of one team over another, of because the officials haven't a clue, then it no longer becomes entertaining, and becomes an exercise in mediocrity; mainly because the players or officials do not meet the level of competition.

  • Come On Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:50 p.m.

    Jimmer always has always complained about no calls. It's happened every single game since the beginning of the season. He looks at the coaches, then the referees, or the other way around every time he doesn't get a call. I think almost every player who drives to the basket gets fouled almost every play. They aren't gonna call every single one, no matter who you are. I'm sure if you ask post guys they think they should get more calls too! They get hacked non stop.

  • royalblue Alpine, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:50 p.m.

    PlanetBYU has an interesting take on the whole Jimmer mugging controversy.

    The MWC really needs to address this before a once-in-a-generation type player suffers a serious injury because the officials are afraid to call a foul.

  • Y4LYFE Lubbock, TX
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:48 p.m.

    Let's just remember the MWC coalition to hinder BYUs progress, soon it'll all be over and then the MWC won't have anyone to hate.

  • skywalker Palo Alto, CA
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:45 p.m.

    That MWC promotional video with players helping helping each other out looks kind of lame when the MWC allows players to be mugged like Jimmer is being mugged lately.

    Physical play is one thing, but this is way over the top!

  • ogmson Mapleton, Utah
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:33 p.m.

    My only thought on this subject is that, in general, Referee's do not like to call fouls on the opposing team when the player with the ball looks like he is 'out of control'.

    That is a problem with The Jimmer. His drives are so athletic and so dance like and sometimes even so unbelievable, that the Ref's sometimes treat it as 'out of control' when it isn't.

    And that is the other side of the problem...Sometimes The Jimmer appears out of control because he was knocked around by the first defender, further knocked around by the second defender and then off balance and out of sorts by the time the 3rd defender bumps him underneath the basket. Thus, the infamous 'no call'.

    He is hard to ref, no doubt, but as a fan, all I ever want from an official is to call it both ways. Stop with calling the stupid ticky tack fouls on Jackson, when Jimmer is getting hammered and there is no call.

  • wazzup Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:30 p.m.

    If ESPN sees it, it's pretty obvious.

  • deseret pete robertson, Wy
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:28 p.m.

    All the officials have to do is try tocall the game according to the rules.If you watch games around the country there is a big difference in officiating. They all (supposedly) are using the same rule book.I know it is a difficult job but when they decide they are going to change how they make calls becaues of one player or it's a big game, or tournament time, then they get into trouble.If they are consistent in how they call a game good players will adjust. But when they change because of a player or circumstance that's when players,coaches and fans get upset.

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:26 p.m.

    Enough is enough.

    The physical play on Jimmer is starting to get down right dirty and bordering on flagrant.

    I know that Craig Thompson is going out of his way to make life difficult for teams leaving his precious conference (see TCU/BSU game site switcheroo), and especially BYU, but it's time he pulled his head out and realized that this could turn into a public relations nightmare for him and the MWC if officials don't start calling the very obvious fouls on Jimmer.

    Craig Thompson and the MWC are responsible for the officiating and have an obligation to ensure the fairness of the officiating, but more importantly, the SAFETY of the student athletes.

    A directive to all MWC officials should be sent immediately to address physical play, not only against Jimmer, but throughout the league.

  • BlueCoug Orem, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 6:15 p.m.

    The reason the NBA protects it's stars is because they're the bread and butter of the league.

    The MWC needs to be smart enough to protect its stars, especially if they're not getting the same calls an average player would get.

    Just because Jimmer is nearly impossible to guard one-on-one, doesn't mean that MWC officials should be swallowing their whistles on physical play just to give opponents a chance.

    It's better to turn the game into a free-throw shooting contest than to risk a player being seriously injured just because he's better than any other player on the court.

  • NevadaCoug Overton, NV
    Feb. 14, 2011 5:58 p.m.

    I understand the idea that games are getting tougher the second time around. But some of the fouls on Jimmer have been borderline flagrant. And there have been some of the so-called "air borne" fouls on Jimmer that haven't been called at all.

    If the officials don't put an end to it soon, it wouldn't surprise me to see Jimmer get hurt. And that's something that no real fan wants to see.

  • TheSportsAuthority Arlington, VA
    Feb. 14, 2011 5:52 p.m.

    ESPN's take on the MWC officiating:

    "there can be no argument that Fredette is getting the stuffing knocked out of him on a nightly basis, and this past week in particular, the whistle was swallowed more often than not.

    It appears that Fredette's brilliance and as a scorer and ease in finding different ways to score is leading officials to make him have to work even harder than lesser players to earn the whistle."

    ------------------

    MWC officials need to stop officiating the physical play against Fredette like it's a rugby match, or a great season for the MWC could turn into a national disgrace.

    As much as Craig Thompson hates BYU, he needs to be smart enough to realize that the eyes of the nation are watching and this could turn really ugly for the MWC in a hurry if it's not promptly and forcefully addressed.

    If Fredette goes down with a serious injury because the MWC fails to address this volatile situation properly, the conference can kiss goodbye all of the good will they've built up over the years.

  • BYUalum South Jordan, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 5:50 p.m.

    "Do officiating crews decide before a game how it will be called? Do officials react to a player's stardom? If a player becomes whiny, do officials tell themselves it's going to be hard for the guy to get a call or two until he knocks it off?

    The answer is yes, to all, according to a veteran college official I (Dick Harmon) spoke with on Monday while researching to understand the dynamics of officiating and their approach to games and star players."

    Having attended and watched all the games that BYU has played, we would agree that the officiating changes with Jimmer in the game. He has been mugged, slapped, knocked down flat, and no call has been made. Talk about unfair....when you see moments later that our players tap another player and draw the foul.

    It is very obvious that the referees are not being totally fair to the physical pushing and shoving to Jimmer. He is an outstanding player and has had to surmount not only the full court rotation press, but also the injustice of poor refereeing.

    We just ask that referees be fair in their calls. Anyone would get frustrated!

    Go Courgars!

  • GW Lindon, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 5:25 p.m.

    There's a well researched study from 2009 that confirmed the home team theory, but to me, that was the least interesting conclusion. Search for
    "Fewer fouls called on home team" and you'll find it.

  • Joe Moe Logan, UT
    Feb. 14, 2011 5:22 p.m.

    Interesting article. I'm not so interested in how it pertains to Jimmer particularly, as I'm not a BYU fan and I've only watched a couple of their games, but the discussion points on college refereeing in general was insightful. Thanks!

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    Feb. 14, 2011 5:05 p.m.

    I thought the latest frontier was being a missionary...even though he isn't?

    Wow, the guys busy.