Mormons & Media: Revisiting 'Mormonism's moment?'

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  • The Vanka Provo, UT
    Feb. 18, 2011 6:12 p.m.


    OH, my bad. Calling their "creeds" an abomination is so much better!

    Saying such a thing would be like saying God has an intense aversion, loathing and detestation of your Articles of faith and your sacred Temple ceremonies.

    It would be like saying God greatly dislikes and abhors your Book of Mormon, D&C, and Pearl of Great Price because they are vile, shameful, and detestable.

    Are you seriously going to try to make Joseph Smith's horrible statements sound good?


    I thought LDS believed in truth and honesty.

    By the way, I am not "anti-Mormon". I am married to a very active Mormon. I attend Church regularly and count several Mormons among my good friends. Just because I believe Mormons to be wrong and deluded does not mean I am "anti-Mormon." It just means I think they are wrong and deluded.

  • Vanka Provo, UT
    Feb. 18, 2011 9:29 a.m.

    Deucy and DSB,

    I did not write a single "loathing and hateful" thing about a person who is a member of the LDS Church. I certainly never mentioned any "low-down hypocritical Mormons", much less said I found such critters in Provo.

    Where did you two get all all that nonsense from?

    But while we are on the topic, it is noteworthy that DSB condemns those who judge the Church by "a few bad apples". Jesus said "Ye shall know them by their fruits... A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit."

    How, then, can the "good tree" of Mormonism bring forth any corrupt fruit at all?

    And most importantly, do you both deny that Talmage's book is considered like secondary scripture to Mormons? It is studied carefully by LDS missionaries. It is not from the correct sources and is filled with falsehoods.

    "Learn about Mormonism from Mormons", you say, but you also say "Learn about all other religions from Mormons".

    So tell me, do your comments illustrate the "good apples" or the "bad apples" of Mormondom?

    If you think this a waste of time, adieu to you.

  • DTanner Memphis, TN
    Feb. 18, 2011 12:42 a.m.


    As do most anti-mormons I have known, you misquote Mormon beliefs to make your point.

    Your quote: "Around 50,000 Mormon missionaries circle the globe telling people about how all other religions are "an abomination" in the sight of God"

    The correct quote is that their "CREEDS" were an abomination. Their creeds describe the "Trinity", a belief held by most churches,but NOT found in the Bible. This three-in-one concept of God is instead a result of Greek Philosophy affecting the 4th century theologians thinking.

    John 8:17-18

    17-It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. 18-I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me.

  • sharrona layton, Ut
    Feb. 17, 2011 9:42 p.m.

    Tommy2Shoes,As a Mormon covert from an Evangelical church, I'll vote for an Evangelical in a heart beat. Find one that meets my needs and can win my party's nomination. I'll vote for him or her. Why can't you do the same if the position were reversed?
    Because as a Christian converted from Mormonism, I would not vote for a Romney. He would be an effective tool for the Mormon missionaries and the LDS church toward Christians unaware of Mormon doctrines.

  • Tommy2Shoes Lehi, UT
    Feb. 17, 2011 6:00 p.m.

    I will vote for the person that I believe will best lead this wonderful country. Lately we have been given poor choices from the major parties. Let's all stay involved and help our respective parties nominate people of great intellect and great love for our country and it's constitution. As a Mormon covert from an Evangelical church, I'll vote for an Evangelical in a heart beat. Find one that meets my needs and can win my party's nomination. I'll vote for him or her. Why can't you do the same if the position were reversed?

  • Bill in Nebraska Maryville, MO
    Feb. 17, 2011 4:40 p.m.

    To All: What is bad is that no one is going to win in this debate. Those who are against the Church and its membership are not going to convince those of us that it is wrong. Probably won't put any doubt in our minds either. So in reality we are all wasting our time trying to voice a viewpoint that no one is going to listen to or even take underadvisement.

    So these comment boards are nothing but waste of time for critics and non-critics alike

  • DSB Cedar Hills, UT
    Feb. 16, 2011 1:10 p.m.

    Duecy friend - you find what you're looking for. If low-down hypocritical Mormons was the focus of your searching, you would find them in California just as Vanka finds them in Provo. I think my neighbors in Utah County are the salt of the earth, and would give Vanka the shirt off their backs if she needed it, as well as a few bucks and a ride to wherever she wanted to go, despite her loathing and hateful attitude. But there's always a few bad apples, and if someone judges an entire group based on the bad apples, I think it says more about that person than the group.

  • The Deuce Livermore, CA
    Feb. 16, 2011 12:44 p.m.

    The focus of my question has seemed to digress to a rant about the LDS religion. While these comments can be made of almost any group as you will find those that say one thing and then act another way. In my life experiences with many people from many different religious backgrounds, I have never felt the same venom that seems to be found in many of your remarks here. I have never had the experience of having a Mormon tell me falsehoods about other religions. Maybe its the type of Mormons I know versus who Vanka from Provo knows. Is this a Utah thing as my experience doesn't support this same feeling.

  • ? Fort Knox, KY
    Feb. 16, 2011 11:07 a.m.

    You're right, Vanka.

  • Vanka Provo, UT
    Feb. 16, 2011 9:46 a.m.


    I hear Mormons claiming to be Christian all the time. They say exactly what you have said to try and prove they are Christians.

    Let me remind you what Jesus said about that:


    "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? [We are Christians!]"

    "And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

    Just saying you are Christians does not make it so.

  • Vanka Provo, UT
    Feb. 16, 2011 9:43 a.m.


    Your "profound" rules would be nice... IF Mormons followed them.

    How many Mormons learn about Catholicism from a Catholic? Very few. Instead, Mormons learn about Catholicism from Talmage's horrible "anti-" book: "The Great Apostasy".

    How many Mormons learn about Protestant religions by speaking with a qualified representative of those religions? Very few. Instead, Mormons learn about other religions from those who have defected from those religions and joined the Mormon Church. These people badmouth their former religions - religions they FAILED at - in LDS meetings almost every week.

    Around 50,000 Mormon missionaries circle the globe telling people about how all other religions are "an abomination" in the sight of God; how all other preachers and professors of all other religions are "all corrupt" "teaching for doctrines the commandments of men".

    So why the hypocrisy? Why do Mormons say "If you want to know about Mormonism, ask a Mormon", but then Mormons run around telling everyone falsehoods about all other religions?

  • ? Fort Knox, KY
    Feb. 16, 2011 6:14 a.m.

    Another thought is Mormons, who are Christians, wanting to be exalted isnt much different from other Christians who want to be with God. In order to be with God, we must become even as His is. God is an exalted, immortal being. For behold, this is my work and my glory to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man. Moses 1:39. Resurrection brings immortality. Exaltation is eternal life. Both come to us by way of the atonement of Jesus Christ.

    Mormons and other Christians have much more in common than many may realize. The language or terminology used to define similar beliefs and practices might be different, but there is more that should bring us together than drive us apart.

    There is much in the world already trying to drive people apart which then tears families and the country apart, isn't it better to work together to do those things that will strengthen individuals and families that will then strengthen our country?

  • ? Fort Knox, KY
    Feb. 16, 2011 5:43 a.m.

    Part 2 of 2:

    Others worry about the LDS belief that we are all children of God, this to include Lucifer. Isaiah asks Lucifer how he fell who was son of the morning. Isaiah 14:12. If there is any parent who knows the heartache and what it is like to have a wayward son rebel against him, it is God the Father, then for Him to see another Son suffer for the sake of all His other children whom He loves. He loves all His children.

    LDS believe 1 John 5:7. For there are three that bear record in Heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three become One. For some, this means that these three are one and the same. While for others when three become one, it usually refers to one in thought, purpose, or they are united. It is what the Savior prayed for while in Gethsemane. That the apostles and all those who believe in Him, would be one, even as He and the Father are one. John 17.

  • ? Fort Knox, KY
    Feb. 16, 2011 5:39 a.m.

    Part 1 of 2:

    LDS believe in Jesus Christ in much the same way others do. John 1:1. LDS also believe that Jesus Christ is the Word and that from the beginning He was God and that He was with God the Father.

    Lorenzo Snows statement in thought isnt much different than what is quoted with John 1:14. As man is now God once was. Means Jesus Christ, though He was God, came to earth and took upon him a mortal body. Man on earth has a mortal body. After the Savior was crucified, He was resurrected and received an immortal body. Because He was resurrected and received an immortal body, everyone else will also be resurrected and receive an immortal body. Hence, man may become as He is.

  • Give Me A Break Pullman, WA
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:44 p.m.

    Thank you for this, and for all of your comments. I cherish the opportunity I have had to become a member of the LDS faith. It has enlightened and enlivened my life. I am saddened that it does not appeal to all.

    But having just completed another in-depth personal reading and pondering of the Holy Bible from page 1 through page 1448 of the Cambridge KJV edition, the 1075 pages of the Anglican KJV, and the nearly 1600 pages of the LDS KJV Bible, (not their Book of Mormon - but the 400 year old KJV Bible) each Bible being identical except for glosses and footnotes, I am persuaded more and more toward the LDS belief system. Few others get it. Doesn't anyone other that Mormons believe in the whole Bible anymore? A Mormon President would be a great blessing to America. They understand things that others just see as mysteries, like the purpose of life. Why not a President who knows he is accountable to God for every idle word, for every act. It would be refreshing.

  • washcomom Beaverton, OR
    Feb. 15, 2011 6:37 p.m.

    I once met a wise Catholic priest who said, "Do you want to know about the Catholic religion? Ask a Catholic. Do you want to know about Judaism? Ask a Jew. Do you want to know about the Mormons? Ask a Mormon."

    How profound and simple can you get?

  • open minded Lehi, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 5:11 p.m.

    You think it is hard for a Mormon to be president, imagine being Muslim.
    I have so many neighbors who hate Muslims and think Islam is all about terrorism. This is due to a lack of knowledge on my neighbors part. People trust the news and friends to get their information on events and religions- too many of them don't research beyond that. This has led to gross misunderstandings about the LDS faith nationally. It has also led to gross misunderstandings about Islam. Since Mormons don't like being misrepresented why would they participate in doing it to others?

  • The Deuce Livermore, CA
    Feb. 15, 2011 5:04 p.m.

    To: sharrona | 10:33 a.m. Feb. 15, 2011
    Layton, Ut
    You have clearly presented the difference in doctrine between the LDS Church and Judeo/Christianity. To which, I am in total agreement. My original comment had to do with those individuals who said they can't vote for a Mormon because they are not Chirstian. By the simplest of definitions, a belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ qualifies one as a Christian. As you have pointed out very well, the difference is in the doctrinal concepts. So my original question is, if the LDS Faith is Christian-based by definition, why would one have a problem with a Mormon candidate based only on this fact alone? We as a country have had many presidents with different beliefs of Christianity.

  • JLFuller Boise, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 2:50 p.m.

    I have been a member all my life and didn't really start to understand the church until I was in my 40's. It seems we can be surrounded by some things from our earliest childhood and still be oblivious to them. My wife's cousins served their missions in the south in the 1960's and they say people actually thought Mormons had horns. We can't laugh AT people for their misunderstanding but we can laugh at their goofy notions.

  • Convert Cedar City, UT
    Feb. 15, 2011 1:38 p.m.

    The LDS Church does reflect a spectrum of beliefs and personalities. Here in Utah, we are dominated by consevative politics. But beyond the "Center of Zion", there is much more diversity.

    Harry Reid is an outstanding example of a faithful member, as are many others who do not share the Utah conservatism.

    As the LDS church has grown, it has broadened its acceptance of those out in the world. We now proselite in Africa. We now welcome small families, single adults, even those that struggle with homosexuality. Our divorce rate is similar to other churches. That isn't a source of pride, but rather acknowledgement that we are similar to others.

    Our doctrine still remains somewhat mysterious to those that have not studied it. Yes, we are polytheistic (according to the accepted definition). But we are also Christian, believing that we are members of Christ's church and His disciples.

  • JanSan Pocatello, ID
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:39 p.m.

    To me the basic summation of being a Christian is someone who belives in Christ as the Savior and redeemer of the world. This is something that as LDS people of faith we believe in. How and who Christ is what he looks like,etc.. is not so much a composit of the word Christian as it is a basis for a religious belief. I am LDS and I AM A CHRISTIAN! I may not belief the same as you but I believe in Christ.. Sence it is HIS name I think that believe in Him is what is important. Personally, I don't care what you think, it is between me and HIM and He knows, I love Him.

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:06 p.m.

    To "sharrona | 10:33 a.m. " the problem is that you define what a Christian is differently than how "The Deuce" does.

    To clarify things, please tell us how you define what a Christian is.

    My favorite definition of what a Christian is came from a catholic nun who said that "Christians are people that believe in all the Saints and Virgins."

    The Merriam-Webster dictionary defines a Christian as "one who professes belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ".

    You seem to have a different idea. Please share with us what you believe a Christian is.

  • sharrona layton, Ut
    Feb. 15, 2011 10:33 a.m.

    The Deuce, "You have yet to prove the point that the LDS Faith is not Christian. I can find no issue with your statements, based upon my limited study of the LDS Church.
    Joseph Fielding Smith:and these three constitute three distinct personages and three Gods. This is a form of polytheism or social trinitarism.
    Judeo/Christianity is monotheism. For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are One(*eis, 1520) (1 John 5:7 KJV and the JST). Eis is the cardinal number one in Greek.

    I have a clue,I left the Mormon church when I became a Christian and Layton is LDS and some of my family are very active in the church.

  • The Deuce Livermore, CA
    Feb. 15, 2011 9:56 a.m.

    To: sharrona | 12:13 a.m. Feb. 15, 2011
    Layton, Ut
    You have yet to prove the point that the LDS Faith is not Christian. I can find no issue with your statements, based upon my limited study of the LDS Church. However, you have only defined differences in concepts of belief and have not proved whether or not they are Christians. My original statement had to do with why or why not would someone vote for a Mormon for President. If the basis for your vote is whether or not th LDS Faith is Christian, then that is an easy answer. If you are basing your vote on the differences in religious doctrine, then that is another issue. Voters need to focus on what the individual will bring to the office rather than what color of tie he/she is wearing.

  • sharrona layton, Ut
    Feb. 15, 2011 12:13 a.m.

    The Deuce,"they believe in Jesus Christ. I have yet to find anyone who can prove me wrong in this case. If you have not taken time to study their beliefs then you have no basis for an opinion. Comments?,a couple.
    Christians believe ,In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (John 1:1)or Jesus is God.
    Mormon Doctrine, The devil is a spirit son of God who was born in the morning of pre-existence or Jesus is the spirit-brother of Lucifer. Christians believe God is the uncreated creator of all else,(aseity).
    Mormons believe, As man is God once was as God is man can be. Lorenzo Snow
    The Word became flesh...(John 1:14)or God becomes man not man becomes God.

    Mormons want to be God(exaltation), Christians want to be with God.

  • The Deuce Livermore, CA
    Feb. 14, 2011 9:18 p.m.

    While not of the LDS faith, I fail to understand the uninformed opinions of the LDS faith by those who appear to lack a brain. I for one would vote for a Mormon candidate if I felt they represented my needs and feelings as a voter. I fail to understand what difference this makes. For the uninformed, the LDS faith is a Christian-based faith. Their difference is in their concept of the trinity. However you cut it, they believe in Jesus Christ. I have yet to find anyone who can prove me wrong in this case. If you have not taken time to study their beliefs then you have no basis for an opinion. Comments?

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    Feb. 14, 2011 8:33 p.m.

    The mention of Proposition 8 in the article was sure to bring on the haters. The wording used to speak of Proposition 8 shows the clear bias of the "Washington Post" in favor of a replacement of man/woman marriage with genderless marriage.

    I would also criticize them for their un-critical quoting of David Kirkham. There are many Mormon historians and political scientists who would give a more nuanced set of statements, saying that while on the whole the constitution was part of God's plan, and its net result was positive, calling it an inspired document is going to far and that we clearly recognize that as it was first written it was flawed.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    Feb. 14, 2011 8:23 p.m.

    Hirschfield is the first person I have seen give an answer to why people will vote for a Mormon governor or a Mormon senator long before they will for a Mormon president.

    I do not agree with all his assesments. I think there is also a perception, right or wrong, that the preisdent has far more power or influence than a governor or a senator and thus we care much more about what he thinks and who will influence him, but the recognition that how people decide the prisident is not based just on policy is important.

  • dbobsnodgrass Manchester, NH
    Feb. 14, 2011 8:11 p.m.

    A sadness overwhelms, as I read the many passionate, ill-informed, angry comments, in the original Post article. Unfortunately, "angry" appears to work the best, so nothing gets accomplished.

    I have never met an angry Mormon.

    Mormons, et al., & Media; something about the message and the messenger comes to my mind.

  • juni4ling Somewhere in Colorado, CO
    Feb. 14, 2011 7:22 p.m.

    Well, we have Beck on one side of the political spectrum... And then on the other complete opposite side of the spectrum we have Reid.

    We just about got somebody for everybody.

    If you believe that the US Constitution was inspired by God, you got Beck.

    If you believe that the US Constitution isn't worth the paper it was written on, then you got Reid.

    Somebody for everybody, I guess... Hey, what can I say, we are a missionary church...