Comments about ‘A faith divided: Opinions on illegal immigration vary among Utah's Mormons’

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Published: Sunday, Jan. 2 2011 11:53 a.m. MST

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wrz
SLC, Utah

@Terrie Bittner

"Ezra Taft Benson said following the prophet only when he agrees with you is not following the prophet and that putting someone else's views first (your political party for instance) makes that person or group your prophet."

Benson said nothing about immigration, illegal or otherwise.

"They don't advocate opening the borders--no one does--only treating those who are here the way Jesus would."

Jesus drove the money changers out of the temple. Why? Because they were not there legally.

"When two commandments conflict, we have to choose the higher law and the twelfth article of faith is not ranked higher than compassion..."

Immigration laws can be administered with compassion, if that's your concern. Those who've broken the law can be deported in a kindly and compassionate manner. It's not rocket science.

wrz
SLC, Utah

@positiverealist

"They are already here and most of their families include US Citizens and Undocumented people in a mix."

Yes, and if they are allowed to stay they will soon have all there relatives here as well. We can't take the entire world no matter how disadvantaged they are. Please view 'Immigration Gumballs' on YouTube for details.

"A mass deportation would take over 25 years..."

Not so. Enforce hiring of illegals laws and they will deport themselves... by the thousands.

"...and separate families..."

They can take their families with them.

"...causing more damage to... our financial system."

We currently have 15 million Americans unemployed. If illegals were to deport, the jobs they leave will swiftly be taken up by our unemployed.

"They should be fined just as we would fine any other Civil infraction."

They should be fined then deported.

"That is why the LDS Church gives them callings..."

They get callings because the LDS Church does not look into citizenship before making a call.

"...there is no legal line they can go get into in their own countries."

Then, how do those who come here legally do it? What line do they get into?

Jaime Lee Bonberger
Houston, TX

shakespeare's fool - "Follow the money."

Having dealt with Church welfare issues in a few situations, the financial drain of assistance to the immigrants is far greater than any imagined increase in the "10%". And fast offerings are typically at a negative cash flow in US stakes, while positive in most Latin American stakes.

If you are getting at a perceived church leniency being driven by "the money", then the church would do better to support legislation to send them all home.

The Perpetual Education Fund seeks to solve both isssues - support a decent education for members who stay in their home countries. This allows them a better standard of living while remaining in their native country to provide strength and leadership to the local units.

Screwdriver
Casa Grande, AZ

So many here in God's country can't see a higher law when it hits them.

Take care of them. They were starving and they came here to work.

Why were they starving? NAFTA. Subsidies to our corn farmers (welfare) that dumped corn on the Mexican market and put over a million farmers out of work. When was the last time you had to send your kids to bed without anything to eat?

They come here out of desperation and all many can say here is go back and starve to death unless we get around to processing you papers in time. Nice.

We'll be judged on our thoughlessness and lack of curoiosity about the suffering of your brothers and sisters don't you think? Or did we really think it's just our home teaching record that counts?

Is it better to send sacks of food to starving people or give them jobs?

If you think you are poorer for having helped the sick and starving I really wonder if there is ANY faith left here.

CARL
South Salt Lake, UT

Church always encourage members to stay home and build up membership in their home country. It has been doing that since President McKay has espoused "every members is a missionary"

john in az
tempe, az

The LDS Church most recent statement is that persons will be accountable for the pain they cause their own family.

Also the LDS Church state "Obey the laws" of the land you are in.

screwdriver, what of all the people entering legally who are separated from their families for years, because the legal process only allows for a few at a time.

rewarding the illegal person is an affront to those who are entering legally and suffering.

Concerned-American
West Valley, Utah

Mormons are commanded to obey the law of the land and as Mormons we should obey.
Let no man break the laws of the land, for he that keepeth the laws of God hath no need to break the laws of the land. (Doctrine and Covenants 58:21)
"We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law." (12th Article of Faith)
observe the commandments of God and to be law-abiding citizens wherever they live. (LDS Church Family Proclamation- signed by the 1st Presidency and the 12 Apostles)
Are these statements the true teachings of the LDS Church?
One cannot change the teachings of the scriptures without changing the scriptures.
The offical doctrine of the LDS Church is to obey the law of the land.

The Caravan Moves On
Enid, OK

What's more important?, obedience to laws or family?

Obedience to laws that are based on morality.

Why?

Because Christ said, in NO uncertain terms, that anyone who would choose family over obedience to righteous laws is not worthy to receive Him. Go look it up yourself, it's there.

So, the question becomes, are our immigration laws ones that are based on morality and wisdom or not?

I say, yes.

Why?

Because they show respect for the greater good/needs of a society rather than a selfish "me, me" mentality, societal needs such as "don't drain our resources by forcing us to take care of you when you enter our country illegally", needs such as "don't split our society by refusing to speak our language".

The intent of our laws is also wise in that it makes it difficult to covet what one's (international) neighbor has. By coveting what your neighbor has you turn up your nose at what you have in your own yard. Blessings you could've received in your land are squandered.

(BTW, this required respect for a society's needs isn't just U.S.-specific only, but is for all countries.)

The Caravan Moves On
Enid, OK

Article quote: "However, the (LDS) church also acknowledged that every nation has the right to enforce its laws and secure its borders, and stated that all persons subject to a nations laws are accountable for their acts in relation to them."

Can any LDS member doubt that while the church feels empathy for the families that will be split over the enforcement of illegal immigration, that the LDS church ultimately says "the law is the law"?

Liberals proclaim "Compassion! Compassion! Compassion!" but completely fail to understand that Christ is also a being of law and justice.

What in the world do you think the Final Judgement will be?, one big "Well, I know you did wrong in that situation, but I'll turn my back and ignore that?"

Puh-lease....

When laws are disregarded and ignored, chaos and it's consequent destruction always result. Always.

A Guy With A Brain
Enid, OK

@ Considering | 12:06 p.m. Jan. 2, 2011

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'Condsidering', your reasoning, as well as your wording, is absolutely brilliant!

Could not agree with you more.

radically_independent
Orem, Utah

I think little of this has to do with directly with the rule of law, as most people I know bend or tweak laws. There are far more serious crimes being committed that impact our lives daily. What I really think the main issues here is about respect, or what is scene as a lack of respect for our laws and out culture by those who are arriving here illegally. And I think those feelings are completely justifiable.

But let us not forget our own history. Like these illegals, many of our forefathers, these people come here to provide a better future for their families. But you say our people came here legally. Well, if they were part of the group who entered Utah in its first years, that isn't exactly true. While they may have come to the United States legally, Utah was not part of the United States - it was part of mexico. And just as these new arrivals justifiably offended those who lived in these lands then, we are equally offended by those who arrive in our land seeming to disrespect our laws and customs.

This is simply a repeat of history.

all4one
Provo, UT

If LDS members decide to reduce their donations, that's their right, but if it's tithing then they just won't be able to go to the Temple. Those that do so will have to stand before the Lord. Also, the comment about abortion is ridiculous. The Church is still strongly opposed to abortion except for certain circumstances.

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