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Comments about ‘N.Y. Times praise unlikely to change Utah immigration debate’

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Published: Monday, Dec. 6 2010 11:16 p.m. MST

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RRB
SLC, UT

@ Gormax, we have one person in this country working here illegally that makes to little money to pay taxes. We also have a person that is a citizen, that is drawing unemployment, because a person here illegally is working in his job?

Do you see anything wrong here?

@ CWEB, your talking about a family indecent, not all Hispanics. I have Hispanics in my family that do not act that way.

Gormax
Cedar Hills, UT

@RRB, read wiki's economic impact of illegal immigrants on the US. Overall, illegal immigration actually adds to wealth of American citizens. Just because a politician wants you to believe it's an issue in order to garner your vote, doesn't mean it's true.

If you remove the illegal immigrant who is working on a low wage then several things happen: Cost of wage will increase to find a citizen to do the job and this will be passed on to the consumer which means we can buy less with our dollar. This means that someone else will lose their job because you can't afford to buy their product any more. Impact: less jobs.

Otherwise, the business cannot afford to continue employing workers in the US and so closes or moves and eliminates many other citizen's jobs (Hersey's recent move to Mexico costs 1500 jobs). Impact: more lost jobs.

So, which way would you like to lose your job? In order to boost our economy we need to employ people, any people. This will create people with income (even small) which will create more jobs.

There are alternatives, let's think of them.

Ronald Mortensen
Washington, D.C.

Christine | 1:16 p.m. asks: When will Sandstrom and his band start protecting and defending the rights, freedoms and opportunities of millions of Innocent American children.

The fact is that Representative Sandstrom and others are indeed working to protect literally millions of innocent American children who are the victims of illegal alien, job-related identity theft.

According to reports by the New York Times and ACLU, 75% of all Illegal aliens routinely use fraudulently obtained Social Security numbers which is a felony. Many of these numbers belong to innocent American children including an estimated 50,000 Utah kids and over one million Arizona children. This is identity theft, another felony.

Illegal aliens destroy American childrens good names, saddle them with arrest records, devastate their credit histories and even corrupt their medical records with life threatening consequences.

Representative Sandstrom and his band are trying to stop illegal aliens from committing serious felonies and destroying the futures of innocent American children while those who oppose his efforts are supporting criminals who are taking the rights, freedoms and opportunities away from millions of innocent American children.

Christy
Beaverton, OR

I wonder what the native Americans thought about the influx of the white man on their land way back when.

I wonder what people thought about the influx of Irish immigrants way back when.

I wonder what people thought of the influx of Chinese immigrants way back when.

I wonder what the people thought about setting free the slaves way back when.

I wonder what people thought of a mixed race couple marrying way back when.

I wonder what people thought of the idea of a black man being POTUS way back when.

van
Saratoga Springs, UT

I would rather get advice on what to do with illegal immigrants from the Mormon Church and Catholic Church and the good people that signed the Utah Compact than..

Rep Sandstrom and the talk show radio pipe band. Laura Ingraham..Sean Hannity, brother Beck. Brother Romney..and and brother Hatch.

Oh..sorry Sen Hatch wanted to help illegals kids before he wanted to not help him. Didn't he have a little to do with the dream act?

Take Hypocrits and the talk radio crowd out of it and we will have sensible reform.

DN Subscriber
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Consider the untruths, half truths, and deliberately leaked information which aids our enemies that has appeared in the New York Times.

Now, why should we grant any credibility to such an organization? They had a great reputation 20+ years ago, but in the last 20 years or so, they have proven that they are little more than stenographers for the radical left, especially the anti-American types.

Therefore, if the N.Y. Times favors anything, it is probably something to be rejected out of hand by any freedom loving American, and especially Utahns.

Sorry, Compact supporters, your proposal is still unacceptable, regardless of some no longer credible newspaper's support.

JLFuller
Boise, ID

There is room in our country for more people and I think just about anyone will do. But we have to be smart about it. Process is important and allowing just anyone in without regard to who they are or their intentions seems counter productive if not dangerous to me. All of us came form some where else. In the case of Hispanics especially, they represent what we want. By and large they are family oriented, passionate about our country and want to belong. They are good people - our kind of people. The kind America was built by. We are better off with them. We need younger people to help fill in our aging ranks. Someone has to pay our social security recipients checks. I vote for Hispanics. Now we just have to find a way to make the ones here illegally legal. I think we are better off with them. The bad ones we can deal with.

  • 8:42 a.m. Dec. 8, 2010
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Phill
Provo, UT

THis is a wonderful piece of article, and it is indeed praiseworthy to see that the NYT addressed the Utah Compact Act. It goes to show how Utah should lead the way in EXAMPLE ! and not be a follower of deteriorating, inhumane laws such as the Arizona style law. Utah is showing itself as a compassionate leader, just as the residents of this state portray to be in person and belief, and should reflect those same beliefs in action, and now nationally. CWEB. I couldn't agree more.
I'm grateful for reasonable people on this world, on this country, and on this state of Utah.

  • 9:06 a.m. Dec. 8, 2010
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RRB
SLC, UT

@Gormax, studies show any gain by illegal immigration is voided by costs to state and local government. 100,000 children in Utah's schools cost us $600 million per year.

You don't create business by importing millions of unemployed people, you add to the welfare rolls.

Once again, how do we gain by spending billions each month on unemployment, so America will tolerate having millions of people taking our non agriculture jobs?

The compact is nothing more than a preamble to amnesty. Like the Dream act, that allows any adult from 16-35 to sign up for college and trade school to get citizenship, it's not being honest. It's about deceit and back door maneuvers that will only inflame America when discovered.

Gormax
Cedar Hills, UT

@RBB, The studies you mention, do they include every aspect of the situation, or are they only focused on trying to make you feel like it's a problem? I gave you a report to look at which covers the much of the issue.

I agree that you don't create business by importing unemployed people. However, we imported them when we had work for them in droves. We didn't have the lower-level workforce to cover all the home building that was going on five years ago, for instance, and most of them were illegal immigrants.

If you read my earlier posts, you would see that if one person loses a job, inevitably another will as well. Unemployment is meant to stave off this waterfall effect, but I agree that it can't go on forever.

It's interesting that you mention agriculture jobs as being one area you are OK with immigrants taking. When you dive deep into the economics you might find that our own government's subsidization of agriculture has a huge effect on why so many people don't have jobs in their own countries and so come here looking for work.

Reggie
Centerville, UT

The church preaches compassion, yet conveniently forgets the 12th AofF about obeying, honoring and sustaining the law. The bleeding heart doesn't consider law - only what they see as fairness and equity. We have laws on the road for a reason. We have immigration laws for a reason. Please use logic before compassion. Your argument has no validity without logic.

SLars
Provo, UT

Gormax, you are your own worse enemy, from your link.

The Center for Immigration Studies reported in 2004: "Households headed by illegal aliens imposed more than $26.3 billion in costs on the federal government in 2002 and paid only $16 billion in taxes, creating a net fiscal deficit of almost $10.4 billion, or $2,700 per illegal household."

Let's not forget it's illegal. Or does making more money approve illegal activity? Should we all start doing things illegally, as long as it makes more money and adds to the economy?

SLars
Provo, UT

The LDS church did not sign it, they stated that people should come here legally, and countries have the right to enforce immigration laws.

The Dream acts cost are $20 billion, that's $4 billion more than the entire illegal population brings in according to the CIS.

Most people here illegally hire out as sub contractors, temp workers, or never make enough money to pay taxes. So even the CIS might be off.

suzyk#1
Mount Pleasant, UT

it seems to me that all they are puffed up about is the NYT opinion or which I think is of no importance. The thing that would be important is the opinion of the citizens of Utah not some pumped up newspaper. It just comes down to this: if you are here illegally - you are a law breaker and deserve and should expect nothing more. We do not owe you a living - we know you want the freedom that comes with living in the United States of America but you have to do it: THE RIGHT WAY.And if you choose to stay here illegally do not expect everything to go your way...it doesn't happen that easy. Get your citizenship and then you can live here free of fear of being sent back because that is where you should be until you are a true citizen. You are breaking the law and people who break the law face consequences, you are not an exception to the rule. It's just that simple.

Beachleydad
Orem, UT

Those who trash the Church because of their stance on immigration are ignorant of what the Church does FOR illegal immigrants in Utah. Open your eyes and minds instead of just reacting emotionally to what you've been told.

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