Comments about ‘Official text of Utah Compact declaration on immigration reform’

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Published: Friday, Nov. 12 2010 11:00 a.m. MST

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jray
patterson, la

hello why are my comments not being allowed to post? Is there a pro illegal immigration sentament on this website? pres. benson taught against socialism and communism so you must not be a member cause this is something they would do.

fromSTL
Saint Louis, MO

what is this supposed to mean?
"criminal activities, not civil violations of federal code"
I thought the debate was primarily about violations of Federal statute, i.e. criminal violations ... like being here without a visa.

jrey
Salt Lake, Utah

jray...What?!!! "Why do i feel our church leadership is falling astray and giving into the world and its false presepts."
Where is your testimony of the church and our leaders?

FYI..not all immigrants come from Mexico. Do your Geneology buddy..

maximum
Phoenix, AZ

It seems Utah is making the same mistake as others by lumping both legal immigrants and illegal aliens into one group and calling all of them "immigrants." Humane inclusion of [legal] immigrants already exists. I've never heard a case where families of [legal] immigrants were separated.

Families separated because the parents are deported while their children who were born in the US stay behind have nobody to blame but themselves. If a father or mother is put in prison for a crime they committed, does that make the state inhumane because they are separated from their children?

At least dependent children of deported aliens can (and should) remain with their parents. In fact, this should be mandatory unless the parents can make other arrangements for them.

People try to make law enforcement the bad guys in these situations. But the *real* bad guys are the parents who knowingly break the law and, thus, bring pain and anguish upon their families.

JenniferZ
Highland, UT

And how are we to treat those immigrants who are not integrated into our society? Yes, we do have a very open and kind society, but the hispanics' refusal to integrate, as other immigrants have done, is a huge stumbling block to acceptance and progress. I see so many children of these immigrants going down an awefull path because the parents don't know what's going on, and it breaks my heart, and puts a drain on our country. My children's education suffers, and I have to pay fees for them to attend school, and the school district cries that the population growth is creating a strain that we must pay for, yet no one asks immigrants for legal status. If anyone can break our laws and take our money through services, why do I have to follow the rules, why should I pay taxes? This is very frustrating for me when I daily see the troubles caused by illegal aliens.

Bobo
Magna, UT

It is insanity to propose any solution to the presence of illegals until the government proves it will enforce the borders and prevent others from coming here illegally. The self-serving document proposed here is nothing more that nice-sounding phrases meant to hide the ugly truth about immigration: it is built on exploitation: it attacks the wages in this nation; and it serves the interests of those who really don't have the best interests of the nation as a whole at heart. The same forces that helped to create the mess are those listed as sponsors of this document. The analogy of the fox guarding the henhouse comes to mind.

Deraj
Douglas, Isle of Man, British Isles

It's a little disturbing to read these comments that stink of a distint prevalence of rascism remaining in the U.S.

I realise that there has been huge improvements in achieving equality since the times of the Civil Rights movement, but it is shocking to someone, (maybe it's because I was naive about rascist attitudes in the U.S), who comes from a part of the world where when rascism does exist, at least it does not show it's face so plainly in the broad daylight!

In many of the comments, I read about Mexicans and Hispanics. Hold on... I thought the topic was about immigrants? So.. when Mexicans and Hispanics enter teh U.S they all live off the welfare state and the hard-working U.S nationals are paying with their money for the laziness and lack of respect for law that Mexicans and Hispanics have?

It is always easy to see the cause of your problems as someone elses' fault. Look at your own attitudes. If you want integration, then take responsibility to integrate with them. Wayneincalif, Europe has many cultures, but what makes you think that any of those cultures are any better?

proud2b4family
Spring Grove, IL

I know of a family that needs reuniting. The parents left a dependent child in their home country to be taken care of by an ailing grandmother. They came here illegally. Can we reunite them with their family?

Jonathan Ickes
Logan, Utah

I am intensely offended that people would assume that any and all immigration is bad. There is certainly a difference between legal and illegal immigration, and only the latter is what is in need of attention. I agree that illegal immigration is essentially scamming the system and is an illegitimate way of gaining status. However, the issue needs to be explicitly addressed as purely an ILLEGAL immigrant issue. Do not slander and generalize the terms, otherwise one might convince the general public that all immigration is bad, therefore terrorizing those people who obtained United States citizenship legally and legitimately who do not deserve that kind of attention. The media groups who generalize and do not realize their impact on society are enemies of society, and should be scolded for manipulating the good people of this country into thinking something completely different than what the real issue is.

ProudMexicanMormon
SLC, Ut

I am sad to see the hate and misunderstanding that is in this state.I am a mexican mormon that has lived in utah for 13 years and I have seen the change in this state.Go to Mexico,go SEE WHY people move,go see if you could live in such circumstances,go see if YOU wouldnt do anything for your kids not to starve.You do not understand what it is like until you have lived it.I have lived it.But I am so glad my parents brought me here because I now am getting my bachelors,I am becoming a better person.And you know what?I have paid my way for all this.So many of you need to analyse yourselfs because you do not understand the meaning of "love one another"

logicalfallacy
Mesa, AZ

ProudMexicanMormon - I am sad to see you have fallen into the same fallacious arguments of why illegal immigration should be ignored. Here is what you are saying: Every country in the world that has hardships should allow its citizens to invade another country illegally, committing a crime in the process, lying and stealing (fraudulent docs) to get in. Screw the process or line, I'm taking cuts since my selfish needs are larger than my neighbor who is waiting in line. If I leach off the taxpayers and deplete their hard-earned taxes to support me, so be it. I'm trying to understand what your definition of "love one another" is?

The reason this country has become so great is because it has been allowed to enforce its sovereignty and uphold its values and laws. Congratulations on becoming "a better person" with education. If you or your parents did it illegally, then you are a disgrace and a cheat. Don't try to call bad things good. We've been warned of that in the bible.

sirils
manti, Utah

When did utah become such a hot bed of bigotry and hate? We use to be better than that. I support the church's position not only because I follow a living prophet of God, but also because in my heart I feel it is consistent with True Christianity - which by the way, is very much bigger than any one country's supposed national interests.

snowbird
Ogden, UT

i have to agree with most of the others on this..our articles of faith #12 says we believe in obaying the laws of the land,,but our church has trouble with this article some times like with poligamy and hireing illegal mexicans.we have lots of people in our state looking for jobs.those jobs taken by illegals could be done by legal utah tax payers..the sad thing about it is most of the people hiring the illegals are our niegbers we set by in church on sunday morning..nobody forced these people to come here,they should do like our for fathers did 250 years ago and fight for and free there own country do away with there corrupt goverment and they would be happy at home..i know yhe lds church would be more than happy to help them do that

Greg Howard
Provo, UT

The LDS Church signed on to the Utah Compact which in part says:

"LAW ENFORCEMENT: We respect the rule of law and support law enforcement's professional judgment and discretion. Local law enforcement resources should focus on criminal activities, not civil violations of federal code."

I guess the Church should amend their 12th article of faith to say, "We believe in...obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law......except for the Federal Civil code."

Jeff H.
Fullerton, CA

In one of the earlier comments someone remarked that Utah had spent over $189 million in the education of undocumented children. Also in a previous comment someone claimed that 500,000 undocumented people came to Utah from 2003 to 2006. Assume that of the 500,000 50% work. Assume that they earn $6/hour and work 40 hours a week and 48 weeks per year. Assume also that the citizens of Utah would have to pay 15% more for the goods and services that these undocumented workers produce. All of the assumptions are reasonable. This new higher cost would be over $300 million dollars per year. When you talk of the costs of illegal immigration shouldn't the overal lower cost of services and products get counted too?

We claim to be a nation of immigrants. We wear this like a badge of honor. Yet can anyone name an immigrant group that was welcomed and honored in our country when they first came here? Isn't it time this changed?

Serenity
Manti, UT

This "Utah Compact" casts such a dark shadow. Whatever happened to the pride of being an American citizen? To the immigrants coming here and working and living productive lives for five years under the "alien" status before having the privilege to take a citizenship test and receiving the coveted citizenship to the United States of America?

What about the 12th Article of Faith which states: We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

Perhaps the Church feels a responsibility to its illegal members to protect and help them. But doesn't that compromise the basic fundamental beliefs of the Church? Is this an easy way out without hurting the feelings of the ones who broke the laws of the land?

I realize that the Church is put into a tough situation, and perhaps the decision made is wise. Only time will tell, but right now, I just can't see it.

Somehow, I feel betrayed by this skirting around the issue of illegal immigration. Our country is for Americans who are legal citizens and our boarders should not be violated so very badly.

mb1107
Centreville, VA

Notice that the Utah Compact' text does not actually use the word "illegal."

This leads me to a few conclusions
1) Isn't this confusing? When most people read this, as I can see in the comments, they are thinking it's referring to illegals..
2) This is a huge omission. You can't draft an entire document about immigration and not talk about Legal v. Illegal Status. There is a huge difference.
3) @jray and others, I think you should not assume the church is supporting "illegal" immigration, considering it's not even in the text.

Mpope
Sanford, Co

I saw nothing in "The Compact" that did anything other than skirt the issues. Of course we should be humane, but breaking the law is breaking the law. We are a Nation of laws. That cannot ever be forgotten.

BeththeOkie
Edmond, OK

If we change citizenship definition to include only those who are born here with at least one parent who is a legal citizen,we would end the motive for illegals to come here to give birth. Illegal aliens' children who are born here are entitled to every benefit of citizenship, as the law stands now.
We must acknowlege that illegal aliens are outside the law. But if employers are sufficiently punished for employing illegals, (like losing their business licenses) and landlords are also severely punished for renting to illegals, soon the illegal aliens would find their home countries more attractive and return to them. We must motivate them to go home instead of motivating them to stay here. Readers might also be interested to check out the Kiva site which offers very low cost micro loans to businesses all over the world. Hope at home coupled with willingness to work hard and righteous living is the surefire way to prosperity as a nation and for individuals.

cfly
Fort Wainwright, AK

I don't know why people get so bent over backwards about simple things. This legislation has nothing to do with ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS. They are never mentioned in this compact. Only Immigrants are subject of the compact. And after reading this compact I thought to myself, well this is obvious and I see why the Presiding Bishop agreed to attend the signing. What is embarrassing is the thought that perhaps this was written with the intent of misleading people into thinking the Church is anyway supporting, encouraging or ignoring illegal immigration. It is just ignorant to not welcome legal immigrants. What is ignorant is that lawmakers are wasting time and money drafting pointless legislation about something that is not an issue, Legal immigration is not and never has been as issue, Illegal immigration is. Stupid politicians.

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