'Most influential Christian conservative thinker' Robert P. George joins News board


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  • gchapman
    Sept. 14, 2010 8:20 p.m.

    Regarding gay marriage:
    Marriage between a man and a woman is one of society's oldest and deepest held convictions. To change it now would increase disrespect for marriage.

    On the other hand, if two people want to have a sexual relationship, it is in society's best interest that that relationship be long term and hopefully permanent. But I have a problem with any group, religious or otherwise, asking for a government to recognize them as legitimate. It implies that that group is illegitimate unless a government recognizes them.

    If an intelligent adult wants to make a promise to God regarding a relationship, whether it is to become a priest or to join in a hopefully permanent relationship with another man or woman, it seems to be a dangerous precedent that any other person or entity has the right to interfere between a person and their God.

    A suggested solution is to show respect and compassion to fellow human beings that are in respectful and hopefully permanent relationships.

  • Jean Clelland-Morin
    Sept. 14, 2010 1:08 p.m.

    "What side am I on?" Live and let live. Freedom of expression. All children should have the same starting line regardless of family money or whom the parents are or where they were born (idealistic with all the babies being pumped into the world who are unwanted, unloved, hungry and have no access to education). I'm on the side of the mythical "work ethic". I believe that material reward should come from merit. Most real wealth does not come from hard work in my country. The working class is falling for the Special Interest propaganda and is a slave who supports its slavery. // Jean Clelland-Morin

  • Jean Clelland-Morin
    Sept. 14, 2010 12:55 p.m.

    'Scuse the above errors - I'm not used responding in limited space. / Any family composition
    can be loving and successful if the holier-than-thou and religious fundamentalists would stop the hurtful narratives and discriminatory voting. / I am an ex-Mormon, graduate of BYU, agnostic and a dirty-word, "liberal" (or socialist or left-wing nut or whatever - you can't hurt my feelings with name-calling). My "religion" is the Golden Rule// Jean Clelland-Morin

  • Jean Clelland-Morin
    Sept. 14, 2010 12:31 p.m.

    There was a comment indicating that Robert George didn't get proper media coverage. How many non-Christian's get fair coverage? Why do Communists (yes there are some in the U.S.) get almost no coverage?/ Here's my view of marriage - George can bebate with me if he likes: A liaison-celebration should have NO legal ties. It should be the choice of the participating adults. There should be laws to protect individuals regardless of marital status. Citizens should receive benefits and pay taxes according to individual merit. That piece of paper just serves to let the state manipulate us and the holier-than-thou stick their noses in the bedroom. That bpiece of paper does NOT guarantee a successful relationship or good parenting. As a single mom, I got sick of the family, the church and society in general telling my children and me that we were an inferior family because there was no father? We could have used some moral support and it would have helped if I had not been according to gender - both my parents voted against the Equal Rights Amendment. TBC // Jean Clelland-Morin

  • dumprake
    Sept. 12, 2010 9:22 p.m.

    Why can't a guy like this be quoted in the press, or his conclusions or declarations be trumpeted, instead of the predictable list of mindless leftists who have an agenda, and it's obvious they have an agenda. I could read this guy all day, but I won't read those other goons.

  • LDS Liberal
    Sept. 12, 2010 8:01 p.m.

    Kaye Possa | 8:33 a.m. Sept. 12, 2010
    Great choice! Welcome, Dr. George!


    Agreed, second that!

    [Sutble word of Caution - Utah's a tough crowd.]

  • the truth
    Sept. 12, 2010 6:05 p.m.

    RE: jackhp | 4:11 p.m.

    IF you become a MORE permissive society, then what else will that lead to?

    it is not questin of abandoning, it is a question what else will society permit,

    IF you continue weaken the moral center then what do you have left?

    moral anarchy, as you accept more and more immorality.

    Society crumbles,

    and like ALL past civilizations that became more and more permissive, they ALL fell,

    to either go away completely, or be conquered or replaced by another "empire".

    NO civilization has survived without a moral center,

    you just destroy the will of society to survive, there are just too many who care more about satisfying thier own appetites and desires than they care about others.

  • Vanka
    Sept. 12, 2010 5:49 p.m.


    Strictly speaking, calling legalization of same-sex marriage and abandoning traditional marriage the same thing is not a "non-squitur", it is equivocation. Still fallacious reasoning, but of a different type. Either way, you are correct to point out that someone of Mr. George's caliber should be above such fallacies.

  • Vanka
    Sept. 12, 2010 5:41 p.m.


    Pointing out that George's argument is a non sequitur is not an ad hominem attack.

    Where did you go to school, BYU?

  • RJL
    Sept. 12, 2010 4:56 p.m.

    Legitimate journalists shouldn't write hagiographies.

  • jackhp
    Sept. 12, 2010 4:51 p.m.

    @ Humm?? 4:22

    Fair enough, I stand corrected. I will abide my own advice, even though I'm clearly NOT touting myself as a legitimate news organization.

    Are you willing to call out the reporters and editors of this paper for their use of "Democrat Party"?

    BTW, wasn't it you calling someone a "Bigot" (why capitalize it?) up thread? That seems like a bit of a leap to make based on one simple comment questioning the level of thinking that Christians do on some subjects. Are you guilty of a wee bit of hypocrisy yourself?

  • Humm??
    Sept. 12, 2010 4:22 p.m.

    @jackhp, it's Fox News and right wing. I'd expect more from anyone who was not a left wing nut. But alas it's just perfect that a left wing nut responds with ad hominem

  • jackhp
    Sept. 12, 2010 4:11 p.m.

    "Abandoning traditional marriage also opens the door for acceptance of polyamory, or non-monogamous relationships, as a 'legitimate marital option,' George said."

    Legalizing gay marriage is not the same as "abandoning traditional marriage". Mr. George's argument is a non sequitur. I'd expect more from the "most influential conservative Christian thinker" but I've learned not to expect too much in the way of logic from religious "thinkers".

  • jackhp
    Sept. 12, 2010 4:04 p.m.

    "... George began distancing himself from the Democrat Party ..."

    To Ms. Israelsen-Hartley and any D-News editor who may remain, it's "Democratic Party" not "Democrat Party". I expect such "mistakes" from right-wing-nuts and Faux News - I expect more from anyone considering themselves a legitimate news organization.

  • Xbalanque
    Sept. 12, 2010 3:54 p.m.

    I love this man's scholarship and writings! Reason and faith are COMPLETELY compatible.

  • christoph
    Sept. 12, 2010 3:24 p.m.

    I can deal with conservatives (as long as I ignore their position on birth control---and this because my church teaches me to avoid extremes.)

  • christoph
    Sept. 12, 2010 3:20 p.m.

    One of my favorite conservative Catholics is Pat Buchanan because he smiles, has a sense of humor, and was opposed to the Iraq war from day one. I applaud the D-news for innovation because there are a lot of things churches do not (and should not) have an opinion on: such as health care, immigration, and the most sticky of all: white collar vs. blue collar. The tea party does not like elitist people who have 3 or 4 college degrees and think that that therefore makes them a pharisee or sadducee and that their opinion therefore is better than that of a farmer, carpenter, tent maker, or poet or writer or nurse or kindergarten teacher. I doubt this Princeton professor thinks he is any better than coal miners in West Virginia: but he did leave that culture to go to Harvard to work in white collar jobs; there is nothing wrong with that, but the divide between the educated and non educated in our country is real and God knows it as well as anyone, and loves people in spite of their education.

  • Hutterite
    Sept. 12, 2010 3:15 p.m.

    Truly under represented previously, the white, religious, conservative, freedom means what I say it does crowd will finally have a voice on the board.

  • Jimmy James
    Sept. 12, 2010 1:27 p.m.

    I've only read an article or two by Robert P George, but I liked what I read and think he's a great addition. This is a huge pickup for the Deseret News.

  • skeptic
    Sept. 12, 2010 12:07 p.m.

    LVIS-I hope so; that would be a good thing too. Perhaps it would be best to just take religion out of the equation and seek a common neutral vantage point where we can all see a little more clearly.

  • ShaunMcC
    Sept. 12, 2010 9:46 a.m.

    I am thrilled to have his input here. He is articulate and chooses not to offend. The fact that some choose to be offended is not because they disagree, but because they choose to not listen to and understand a different viewpoint. All civil discussion and debate require allowing for honest disagreement. Understanding those who agree with you is sometimes difficult. Truly understanding those who disagree is critical.

  • BoringGuy
    Sept. 12, 2010 9:29 a.m.

    I have a question for the "Board."

    As you continue to publish a hard copy of the D-News, will it remain the "Deseret News" or will it become "KSL"? Or maybe "Deseret News/KSL"?

    Just curious, "KSL" just seems like a funny name for a newspaper.

  • fair park
    Sept. 12, 2010 9:26 a.m.

    And this is news why? As if anything other than "...influential Christian Conservative" would be touted by the DNews..

  • LVIS
    Sept. 12, 2010 9:26 a.m.

    skeptic--might it also support the social maturing for non-mormon readers? Of course, as you say, change and growth is slow.

  • Kaye Possa
    Sept. 12, 2010 8:33 a.m.

    Great choice! Welcome, Dr. George!

  • skeptic
    Sept. 12, 2010 8:13 a.m.

    Good, the cross pollenation of religious thought may support the social maturing for Mormon readers: although change and growth is slow.

  • heidi ho
    Sept. 12, 2010 7:25 a.m.

    Good move on the part of Deseret News. We all need to stand together in this country to speak out for marriage, family and truth. It's refreshing to work with other faiths in a common cause!

  • silas brill
    Sept. 12, 2010 7:20 a.m.

    "... George explained that sex is a reproductive principle that, unlike digestion or walking, is only fulfilled between a man and a woman becoming one-flesh in 'organic unity.' Such unity is not achieved by two men or two women in a "love-makes-a-family" type arrangement, he argues."

    Yes, reproduction can be achieved with help. Just because homosexuals need outside help for procreation doesn't mean they cannot have a perfectly functioning family. Love can certainly make a family.

    "Abandoning traditional marriage also opens the door for acceptance of polyamory, or non-monogamous relationships, as a 'legitimate marital option,' George said."

    No, same gender marriage doesn't. Besides, no one said anything about abandoning traditional marriage.

    It is comforting to hear a Christian actually say something nice about reason for a change. I've heard sermons and debates where reason is opening rejected for faith. Faith derails reason, however. They are not mutually compatible.

  • BrentBot
    Sept. 12, 2010 6:05 a.m.

    I would like to see Professor George debate Glenn Beck on the issue of traditional marriage. Beck, using strict libertarian logic, avoids condemning homosexual marriage. Professor George is a staunch supporter of traditional marriage.

    I would like to see them debate the work of two prior academics on the subject:

    British social anthropologist Joseph Daniel Unwin argued that any society that has loosened sexual morality outside of man-woman marriage has not survived.

    Harvard sociologist Pitirim Sorokin believed that all political revolutions that brought about societal collapse were preceded by a sexual revolution in which marriage and family were devalued by the culture’s acceptance of homosexuality.