Comments about ‘Editorial: Immigration is about us’

Thank you for a reasoned and civil commentary. I wish that all those you describe as being courageous for sharing their views were as civil and thoughtful.

This is the best summary of the immigration issue I think I have read to date. It is laudable and desirable for Utah to set the standard for the rest of the country. My hope is that whatever emerges in the way of the proposed legislation that it may be completed in the spirit of mutual respect and understanding. I believe it can and this outline provides a good foundation for what will come.

How is allowing half a million immigrants from Mexico to enter the country illegally every year "compassionate" to people in other countries around the world who also want to come here? So the DN is advocating that those who cheat and cut in front of everyone else standing in line, should be allowed to benefit from their cheating (amnesty) while all others still have to stand in line with even less chance of arriving? I fail to see the "charity" and equity in your position.

Equating entering the coutry illegally to going 5 MPH above the speed limit is absurd -- everyone on the ground can see that uncontrolled illegals are wreaking havoc on our society (taking precious few jobs from legitimate citizens, driving down wages, straining social services and so forth) while we could care less about drivers going slightly faster than they should on the road (many speed limits are set ridiculously anyway). Get real.

Excellent, refreshing commentary.

Two years ago, Elder Marlin K. Jensen pleaded with Utahns and with members of the LDS Church to avoid knee-jerk, paranoid, misinformed reactions to the immigration problem, and to show greater deliberation, thoughtfulness, and compassion in crafting legislation.

Since he gave that counsel on behalf of the Church I have seen very few voices following it. The proposed laws have focused only on enforcement of the broken system currently in place, and the public discourse (including these message boards) have been filled with bile, hatred, and heartlessness--not to mention misinformation and paranoia.

It is indeed wonderful to read this editorial. I hope many readers take it to heart. Thank you, DN, for being a voice of reason on this issue.

First of all, this is certainly head and shoulders above most of the editorials I've read here in the past. However you may feel about the debate it must be noted that the treatment of this topic by the paper has been quite good and I hope continues in the future.

I speak Spanish fluently and have lived on both sides of the border legally as did my father. While I'll concede that there isn't any one approach that will fix everything, most of the problem starts with employers who want the inexpensive but hardworking labor the people from Mexico provide. It has always amazed me that the same politicians who are so anxious to me this a political issue defeat the very laws that would control well over 90% of the illegal traffic. Once we move this from being a political wedge issue to being a bipartisan issue we can get most of this under control without amnesty and without crippling industries who depend on the labor pool from Mexico.

Watch Dog, please explain why so many want those who violated federal and state privacy laws commended and given whistleblowers status. What they did is far more egregious than crossing a border in order to obtain emplopyment. The fact is that entering the country undocumented is a civil violation and a misdemeanor, not a felony like so many want us to believe. Deal with it.

This was one of the best editorials written in a very long time. I will think about what you said for quite a while. Thank you.

Excellent editorial and well grounded.

For those who continue to say, "it's about enforcing the law" a couple of observations.

First, who would disagree with that statement? For that reason it has almost zero value and adds nothing to actually accomplishing that result. I could say that about every law particularly those against violent crime. In yet, short of a dictatorship with a police state we have no hope of completely eliminating violent crime in the near future. All we can do is try to keep good people good by making the penalties fit the crime and making it more likely than not, or at least a high risk that someone who commits a crime. Again, I would ask what are the right policies and how much will they cost?

All of us can also help to create the kind of society we want to live in, with good, hard working, and honest people who obey the law.

Second, we make the laws. It isn't enough just to say "enforce the law." We also must consider what changes to the immigration law will help improve our nation and make it a better place to live.

To finish my unfinished sentence: That someone who commits a crime has a substantial risk of being caught.

Again, to the resource issue. It is popular even among local officials to blame the federal government for a lack of enforcement. Hence the message bills like AZ and those that will soon be submitted in Utah's next legislative session. And the message bills in Congress like "Anchor Baby." While these may feel good, and get politicians through convention, they will do little to solve the core problems of illegal immigration, and they will also do little or nothing to reduce the number of undocumented residents. We should be concentrating on real solutions, not gimmicky feel good "re-elect me" politics. Much like health care reform, we nibble around the edges, but never address the real problems.

The fact is, we don't need new bills empowering local law enforcement to help ICE agents enforce immigration laws. We already have a federal program, that no one seems to discuss. It's called "secure communities" or 287-G. Under this program, local law enforcement can share biometric information with ICE agents. No counties in AZ have utilized it and only Washington and Weber counties in Utah. Why not? Because of the costs in resources and training?

Great editorial with a lot of thought and perspective.

The thoughts were well Presented!!

Define felon, since those that work here are committing multiple ones? Is it so easy to excuse criminal actions? What criminal action should we ignore next?

Our immigration laws are excellent, if enforced. And that is the problem, isn't it? One side wants the laws enforced, the other side wants preferential treatment and amnesty. Neither will budge.

We have to decide if we are a country of laws, or not. Amnesty (1986) caused this problem, it is not a solution, but rather a means to delay enforcement, creating the next wave of illegal immigration.

Mark H. Willes
Deseret Media Companies

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Thank you for putting in words my sentiments exactly.


You might want to be careful,
Many here have already started calling you part of the evil "Liberal Media".

And still many others have said the "Liberals are taking over everything - the Deseret News, KSL, and even the LDS leadership".

You comments are right on, and you have my support.

Thanks.

When our lack of vigilance and care allows the illegal immigrant and his offspring to control our elections in favor a "south of the border" mentality and agenda will we say "Oh, no!" in surprise? Suddenly realizing the fruits of our own foolishness? What we are witnessing is a seemingly benign invasion almost without precedent in North America, short of the colonizing invasions that brought many of our ancestors to this Land during colonial times. And just barely short of the seemingly benign invasion in modern times of the Jewish people in their return to the Holy Land. World changing. We need to have "world changing" awareness and concern. And action.

Well said, Mr. Willes.

One correction: You wrote: "Except for Native Americans, we are all here because of immigration."

Actually, the Native Americans are immigrants, too. They immigrated from other parts of North and South America and ultimately from the Middle East. We are all immigrants.

US Government Guide: Criminal Law
The body of law that pertains to crimes against public authority–the federal or state governments, for example–is known as criminal law.
US Government Guide: Civil Law
In a civil action, one private party takes legal action against another private party to seek relief in a court of law for an alleged wrong.

The section of the US Code that governs unauthorized entry into the country makes the act a crime because you can spend up to 6 months in jail (a misdemeanor) or 2 years (a felony) for repeat offenders. It also allows individuals to bring suit for damages. Having a civil penalty available does not change the fact that it is still a crime and, if convicted, are criminals.

Legal aliens can be deported for overstaying their visa more than the 180 day grace period and will not be allowed back for 3 years. Legal alien speeders will not be deported and will have no effect on their ability to get a visa. They are not equivalent and it is dishonest to say they are.

Social Evolution, Progression, Logic, whatever you want to call it... logic tells us that those who change and adapt survive - those who won't, don't.

Civil, truthful, and well-thought out dialog on this issue is appreciated by the majority in this state. Thank you Deseret News for helping us all be wiser about the immigration issue; I cringed when I heard Carl Wimmer on KSL insist that 80% of the crime in this state is committed by illegals. Proven not so. Throwing around such "facts" is proof this state's leaders need to realize that the majority of people in this state are centrist, middle of the road conservatives. We want the truth, we want to be compassionate, and expect our leaders to be honest, compassionate problem-solvers. Let us all look for these qualities in the people we vote for, whether they have a D or R by their names in November.

The Statue of Liberty stand as a testament to legal immigration, how well it can work and defines the argument. Should the Government decide who comes here, or should individuals and organizations?

We also found out the past few weeks just how much Americans have been lied to concerning the illegal immigration. We found out that social services cannot check social security numbers of people here illegally.

Once state by state message bills and "anchor baby" gimmicks either fail or fail to produce results, which they certainly will, what might be some of the real solutions to the immigration problem?

One solution is expanded legal immigration. We need to expand the number of legal immigrants who have advanced education or other training in jobs that are in high demand. We also need to have a uniform nation-wide guest worker program for less skilled labor. Some will say that this will take jobs away from existing U.S. citizens. Experts can debate that issue, but I'd like to ask a question. Did the 100 million increase in the U.S. legal population added during my lifetime take jobs away from the 200 million U.S. citizens at the time I was born?

Of-course not! The economy has expanded dramatically in those 52 years. The economy is not static. It expands and contracts, but over time has expanded. There is no basis in fact to suggest that undocumented workers, skilled or unskilled take away jobs from citizens. But jobs in China might. So why not make them documented with a guest worker program?