Comments about ‘Don't marginalize religion, Elder Oaks says to Harvard law students’

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Published: Saturday, Feb. 27 2010 12:00 a.m. MST

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To, Jake Sparrow

Only in you own mind. I don't think religion is stupid, I just hate seeing people misled by lies. However, that is your choice to believe in whatever you desire to believe, but it does not mean that the rest of us have to agree with you, or believe in what you believe. None-the-less, Good luck to you anyway.

re: Anti and Seattle Guy

People who believe in religion are not "stupid". Yes, many educated people believe in God/religion. But no matter how many subjective, anecdotal "testimonies" you can come up with they do not provide any evidence that religion is anything other than a potentially positive placebo effect.
Feel free to list whatever "test" you used (it was nothing like doing an addition problem in math) but you have nothing definitive to base your beliefs upon which is why you use the term faith...belief without evidence. No one should, nor normally does, believe his/her teacher, doctor, lawyer, plumber, etc. without evidence. But in this one area you choose to believe in something supernatural without any empirical evidence. It makes no logical sense. But educated people of both the secular and religious persuasion are often not logical, so there you go.

Harvard Law Student

RE: Seattle Guy

Forgive my ignorance about the Mormon church. You appear to be saying that the fact that 1+1=2 proves that your church is true. I'm sorry but I don't follow your logic.

So other churches have SOME truth, you just happen to be the lucky ONE with ALL the truth? (Yawn) Wow, your mother must be so proud of you! How is this different from all the other churches who say the exact same thing?


"People like you only care about, and rely on the teachings of man"

Always one of my favorite believer lines...the irony oh the irony!

ME is real

I believe in ME for certain! Certainly I'm a true fact of ME and a fact to those who know ME. I don't live another persons daydreams nor their silly superstitions because that not ME. For ME it's all about ME and a few people who know ME and I know THEM and they ME.

Jessa Young

I don't think that Elder Oakes is condemning higher education, I think he is pointing to a current bias in higher education against religion. I am not religious, but I do have a degree and I think he is right about that. Its not popular to be religious anymore.

I know many very intelligent people who use religion as a tool to further their purpose in this world, in ways that serve humanity and the rest of the planet and I think that's admirable. There are many non-religious persons who do this also.

My parents are LDS and they are on a non-religious mission in China funded by BYU, teaching English to Chinese medical students. There's a good example of how individuals can lessen the gap between educational institutions and religion.

My hats off to everyone who is working together with others, with different backgrounds and beliefs by focusing on the common ideals that are important to all of us, and necessary for the health and well-being of our earth, and all of the species including humanity, who live upon it.

Seattle Guy

"Anti" above. Anti- Science can NOT disprove that there is a God, or that Christ lived and did what he did. There have ALWAYS been witnesses of everything- from All walks of life. - Even those testimonies DO hold up that there is a god. Even our nation's courts accept "testimonies" and “Witnesses” on court cases-but I guess with religion they don't count.
You must test it by doing it. Which you can't do - because you won't.


Seattle Guy...do you believe in Odin? Why or why not?


Who says all the so called Anti LDS do not believe in God? Perhaps they don't believe in Mormonism, but many of them to believe in God and his only son Jesus Christ. Many of us are devout Christ followers, and believe in one God who rules the universe.

Please get over all the accusations by saying you are the only one who has the truth, and that none of the rest of us have knowledge of anything. Get over your hotheadedness and know all attitude. Finds some peace.


Re: Anonymous
LDS believe that everyone has some truth. But why would God create all these different churches that conflict with each other? and with Biblical teachings? He wouldn't -

To John

I suppose you are saying that all churches are basically wrong including LDS? It sure looks as though this is probably the case.

Just believe in God and leave all the crazy religions alone. Although many churches are good for one thing or another and that is usually socializing, and the welfare needs of the poor.


Re: To John -
I ever said that- you missed the conversation- LDS Claim that only there's is true and others have some truths. Point is - that God has always spoken to prophets and aposlties - why would today be any different? LDS most aren't boastful, but KNOW what they know- testify of it. Others are offended beause they can't get past the idea that god would still call prophets - to know his will. They have been taught that the heavens are closed and god has said all that he's going to stay.

Le Majure

Truth agrees with truth! There is no conflict in truth. If two things contradict each other, one is right and the other is wrong, or one is wrong and the other is right, or they are both wrong. In contradiction they can not both be true.
Therefore; what honest men seek is truth. True Science. True Religion. True Friendship. True Love. True Information. Incorrect theories will vaporize in the light of more truth. Much scientific (as will as religious) thought has already done that.
All knowledge is not created equal! Just because we lable something, "science" or "Religion" or "Law" etc., does not make it True or Valuable. The test is in the results. The False Will Fail! The True Will Survive!
In any form of academics: SEEK TRUTH. Do not attack truth in Ignorance. Ignorance is the cause of un-intended consequence.
Try to remember, The one with the most truth wins. The one with the most lies - Dies. "J"

Re John

Oh, yes they do get past it. Lets not get all huffy and puffy here just because a few think they know how everyone else should react and think. Remember, Mormons are not the only human beings born on this earth who claim to have brains. Live and let live.

One man's science...

..is another's religion. How many times have we read "scientific studies" which state coffee is good for you one year and bad for you the next? Or that wine and beer are good for you in one study and bad for you the next?

As an academician, I have seen the "religion of research" where so called intellecuals spend countless hours "praying that the study yeilds results" to keep their grants or position. While a few (very few) yeild anything positive, many sustain themselves at the alter of the test tube.

Frankly, we need more religious thought. Religion is to make bad men good and good men better. As Benjamin Franklin stated: "Man is so evil WITH religion, imagine what we'd be without it".

@Seattle Guy

I've been a Church member my whole life. I don't recall EVER being encouraged to learn about other faiths nor having other churches talk about their faiths. But then, I never attended a Church school (ie BYU). Does this happen at BYU?

BYU Grad

I've been a Mormon my whole life as well and I graduated from BYU, I was taught that the FULL truth can only come from Mormon leaders and that all other faiths are corrupt or deficient in some way. I'm beginning to realize that the same point of view is held by Muslims and many other Christians. I think we as Mormons should back off from such arrogance as I can see that it can only lead to problems.


One man's belief is another man's oppression.


There are college professors out there that have a very definite agenda against religion. I had a professor at a community college in California about 15 years ago. The class was a history class that had some focus on religion. She proudly talked about 2 LDS return missionaries she had failed the previous semester because they would not agree with what she was teaching. She even talked about how knowledgeable they were, but she had failed them specifically because they disagreed with her way of thinking. She then went on to say she looked forward to failing anyone (especially LDS) that would disagree with her in the current class.

Religion and values

Elder Oaks states: "colleges and universities have become value-free places where attitudes toward religion are neutral at best"

Just because people are neutral or indifferent to religion doesn't mean they lack any values at all. I find it arrogant when religious people suggest that religion is required for one to have standards or values.

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