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Texas says 41 FLDS children have broken bones, fractures
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Biblereadingdude | 9:15 a.m. May 1, 2008
Holy cow!!!! that does it...the FLDS are child beaters...I'm just glad I
didn't live in Texas when I grew up. I broke a bone playing football, and
my wife had a doctor break her finger to see if he could have it heal straighter
because it was crooked. Two of my three sons broke bones growing up. If I lived
in Texas they would have to live in foster homes where no one ever breaks bones
or goes to the doctor, foster care is the ideal place to grow up you know. P.S.
from my bible study I do believe Jesus would have been taken away from a 13-16
year old Mary soon after birth, if she were under the watchful care of Texas
officials. To protect him from his 18 to 40 year old "father". Of
course a DNA test would clear up all the paternity issues about the birth.
responding to sosueme | 9:21 a.m. May 1, 2008
"We the people of american will except nothing less."
We Americans will except nothing less than the child abusers of the FLDS to be be punished!
I really believe that those who think what the FLDS has done to their children is ok are child abusers themselves.
We Americans will except nothing less than the child abusers of the FLDS to be be punished!
I really believe that those who think what the FLDS has done to their children is ok are child abusers themselves.
Comments continue below
Less than 10%? | 9:21 a.m. May 1, 2008
In my family, 50% of the children had managed to break bones (I broke my hip -
long story - and my brother broke each arm once). Clearly, we were subject to
the cruelest of abuses... not.
I have strong feelings against the FLDS, but my strong feelings do not overcome their first amendment rights, among others. Saying that 10% of these kids have, at one time, had a fracture - and the media's willingness to go along with it by writing the headlines in such a way as to make a reader believe that 10% of these kids presently have broken bones - is not evidence of physical abuse but of bias. There's plenty of evidence of sexual abuse, folks - let's focus on that, and leave broken bones at a normal level of occurrence out of it.
I have strong feelings against the FLDS, but my strong feelings do not overcome their first amendment rights, among others. Saying that 10% of these kids have, at one time, had a fracture - and the media's willingness to go along with it by writing the headlines in such a way as to make a reader believe that 10% of these kids presently have broken bones - is not evidence of physical abuse but of bias. There's plenty of evidence of sexual abuse, folks - let's focus on that, and leave broken bones at a normal level of occurrence out of it.
BeeCareful | 9:21 a.m. May 1, 2008
You want cases of multiple births to underage girl? Go to any inner-city
neighborhood in Dallas, or Houston and you will find many examples of girls
eighteen and under with two or more children. Why is it that Texas CPS only
seems to be worried about this if the girls wear long dresses and no makeup?
Why the blatant double standard? Could it be they are persecuting a population they knew wouldn't fight back? They know if they went goose-stepping into the gangsta neighborhood, they'd be met with fierce resistance
Why the blatant double standard? Could it be they are persecuting a population they knew wouldn't fight back? They know if they went goose-stepping into the gangsta neighborhood, they'd be met with fierce resistance
wrz | 9:22 a.m. May 1, 2008
>>Why do so many readers feel the need to defend the FLDS?<<
Few if any are defending the LFDS practice of polygamy, which is against the law. What is being protested is the government violating human rights by rounding all the children up, wholesale, and separating them from their mothers, and the violation of Constitutional rights of freedom of worship, etc.
Few if any are defending the LFDS practice of polygamy, which is against the law. What is being protested is the government violating human rights by rounding all the children up, wholesale, and separating them from their mothers, and the violation of Constitutional rights of freedom of worship, etc.
Realistic Dad | 9:25 a.m. May 1, 2008
This is dumb. Among my 4 children there is a history of four broken bones--some
at a very young age.
1. Pushed off a retaining wall by his brother (age 4)
2. Jumped off a bunk bed (age 3)
3. Fell while running (age 6)
4. Landed badly off a snowboard jump (age 15)
While there may be plenty rotten in the state of YFZ, this is a stupid attempt by Texas to justify their draconian intervention. Can you find another group of children with only a 10% broken bone rate during childhood? Sounds to me like an unusual level of safety at the ranch.
1. Pushed off a retaining wall by his brother (age 4)
2. Jumped off a bunk bed (age 3)
3. Fell while running (age 6)
4. Landed badly off a snowboard jump (age 15)
While there may be plenty rotten in the state of YFZ, this is a stupid attempt by Texas to justify their draconian intervention. Can you find another group of children with only a 10% broken bone rate during childhood? Sounds to me like an unusual level of safety at the ranch.
Freddie | 9:29 a.m. May 1, 2008
"The broken bones are irrelevent. Just another piece of the puzzle. The
incest and teen rape is appalling. 3 kids before your 17, do the math."
I did the math. With tree kids at 17 the first would have to be born at about age 10 or 11... A physical impossibility.
I did the math. With tree kids at 17 the first would have to be born at about age 10 or 11... A physical impossibility.
lynn | 9:29 a.m. May 1, 2008
It sickens me thinking of girls/women letting men into their beds based on a
belief that their eternal welfare is at risk if they don't!
Cookie | 9:33 a.m. May 1, 2008
Please check your spelling and typo errors, folks,
so that your postings read intelligently.
Military housing can be hornet nest of busy biddy
women when their(notice correct spelling of 'their'
signifying possession)husbands are out on deployment. My neighbor turned me in to CPS after
she stole from me. One child, a nine-year old, had
a broken arm with a cast/proper medical attention.
There (the usage of t-h-e-r-e points out direction or explanation) were allegations that my husband
was sexually molesting my daughter and that alone
almost cost him his military career.
CPS took our three children to a safe house where
they were interviewed separately (notice correct
spelling). THEY TOLD THE TRUTH, and were returned
home within three days, for the wiser. I'm glad CPS responded. You know, it used to be that whatever was going on in a church, a home, a school, a camp, was NOBODY'S BUSINESS!
Arizona/Utah ignored FLDS for years.
Don't you think that AZ/Utah officials
had some communication with Texas before it all
came down? Like welfare, inbreeding, and 'brittle
bones'?
Welfare is for betterment through education/job
training. Are the FLDS women using welfare to
help their education/job skills to support their
own children?
so that your postings read intelligently.
Military housing can be hornet nest of busy biddy
women when their(notice correct spelling of 'their'
signifying possession)husbands are out on deployment. My neighbor turned me in to CPS after
she stole from me. One child, a nine-year old, had
a broken arm with a cast/proper medical attention.
There (the usage of t-h-e-r-e points out direction or explanation) were allegations that my husband
was sexually molesting my daughter and that alone
almost cost him his military career.
CPS took our three children to a safe house where
they were interviewed separately (notice correct
spelling). THEY TOLD THE TRUTH, and were returned
home within three days, for the wiser. I'm glad CPS responded. You know, it used to be that whatever was going on in a church, a home, a school, a camp, was NOBODY'S BUSINESS!
Arizona/Utah ignored FLDS for years.
Don't you think that AZ/Utah officials
had some communication with Texas before it all
came down? Like welfare, inbreeding, and 'brittle
bones'?
Welfare is for betterment through education/job
training. Are the FLDS women using welfare to
help their education/job skills to support their
own children?
More news... | 9:35 a.m. May 1, 2008
What's this? Two boys who turned 18 do not want to return to YFZ ranch?
Could it be that they have seen that the evil, outside world affords such
freedoms as education and opportunity? And what awaits them at YFZ...control,
manipulation, forced labor, and a culture that is free to excommunicate them as
unwanted competition.
All is not well in "zion".
All is not well in "zion".
Propaganda Wave | 9:35 a.m. May 1, 2008
Looks like the wave of FLDS propagandaists has arrived trying to divert
attention away from the investigation of their sick practice of child bride
slavery.
East Texas | 9:40 a.m. May 1, 2008
There are several young teenaged girls at the church around the corner who are
pregnant (under 16), are they being abused, and why are they not being taken
from thier families by CPS.
Government out to get you? | 9:40 a.m. May 1, 2008
Fundamentalists have a long history of government mistrust...refusing to get
drivers licences, social security cards, paying taxes, etc....using
constitutional rights arguments to defend questionable activities.
The prevalent paranoia I'm reading on these posts is shocking. If you've done nothing wrong you have no reason to worry. That is why no authorities came to your house when 2 out of 3 of your children have broken bones. The evidence of abuse in FLDS community has mounted over years. The FLDS communities in Colorado city have a well documented history of abuse and misuse of public funds... THIS IS ORGANIZED CRIME plain and simple.
The prevalent paranoia I'm reading on these posts is shocking. If you've done nothing wrong you have no reason to worry. That is why no authorities came to your house when 2 out of 3 of your children have broken bones. The evidence of abuse in FLDS community has mounted over years. The FLDS communities in Colorado city have a well documented history of abuse and misuse of public funds... THIS IS ORGANIZED CRIME plain and simple.
homophobic | 9:40 a.m. May 1, 2008
Observer,
You made this statement, "I would much rather they would go after all the homosexual couples who have kids."
Is your opinion of gay men and women with children is that they are child molesters and child rapists? What backward, homophobic place to you live?
At least the FLDS people are religious. I do not doubt they are sincere about that.
Helen | 9:47 a.m. May 1, 2008
---Please check your spelling and typo errors, folks,
so that your postings read intelligently.
Military housing can be hornet nest of busy biddy
women when their(notice correct spelling of 'their'
signifying possession)husbands are out on deployment. My neighbor turned me in to CPS after
she stole from me.---
Please add proper spacing.
so that your postings read intelligently.
Military housing can be hornet nest of busy biddy
women when their(notice correct spelling of 'their'
signifying possession)husbands are out on deployment. My neighbor turned me in to CPS after
she stole from me.---
Please add proper spacing.
chemist :RE: observer | 9:55 a.m. May 1, 2008
The thing that is wrong with polygamy is that it:
1. Is illegal.
2. Leads to the abuse of children and women as practiced by the flds and some other polygymous groups.
The flds lead an illegal life style, marry underage girls, lie and deceive at every opportunity, kick out the older teenage boys to maintain 3+ wives for the leaders, inbreed to the point that they have high rates of birth defects. I see absolutely nothing in the flds religion or pratices that I would want me or my family to emulate. Perhaps Texas and the Federal task force can put an end to this odious group. Don't tell me polygamy is OK if between consenting adults since the Kingstons have also been found guilty of abuse. It is a sick life style and as a midwesterner I don't care that it was practiced in Utah in the 1800s. We are discussing it now and it should be stopped NOW.
1. Is illegal.
2. Leads to the abuse of children and women as practiced by the flds and some other polygymous groups.
The flds lead an illegal life style, marry underage girls, lie and deceive at every opportunity, kick out the older teenage boys to maintain 3+ wives for the leaders, inbreed to the point that they have high rates of birth defects. I see absolutely nothing in the flds religion or pratices that I would want me or my family to emulate. Perhaps Texas and the Federal task force can put an end to this odious group. Don't tell me polygamy is OK if between consenting adults since the Kingstons have also been found guilty of abuse. It is a sick life style and as a midwesterner I don't care that it was practiced in Utah in the 1800s. We are discussing it now and it should be stopped NOW.
INBRED | 9:56 a.m. May 1, 2008
wow , i really marvel at elder scott now and how this was unfoiled. these guys
really do have years of cunning plans of the evil one and from the looks of some
of these blogs, some support that plan!!
boblog | 9:55 a.m. May 1, 2008
Hey, hope the Texas officials are keeping their eyes on the men at the ranch.
They FLDS men are the culprits here, not the women and children. As the
evidence increases, so will the likelihood that the men will flee. Keep up the
watch around the ranch.
Mom in MO | 9:59 a.m. May 1, 2008
You may not like the FLDS church, or their practises. You may think that they
brainwash their followers. You may think that they enslave women and marry off
their daughters too young. But other faiths are similar. Look at Islam.
Arranged marriages for young girls to whomever the parents decide. Teaching
kids to strap bombs to themselves and be a human sacrifice for the chance to
enter heaven and receive 72 virgins. Why hasn't the State gone into the
Muslim mosques and rounded up these children for their own protection? And what
happens to you, my good Christian friends, when the Feds decide your faith is
also a brainwashing technique? Who will stand up for you when all the others
have already been silenced?
To WRZ | 10:04 a.m. May 1, 2008
I sure hope you are joking wrz....
*in my most sarcastic tone*
uhm. yeah that's what will make american strong.. kids sitting in the living room watching television.
*in my most sarcastic tone*
uhm. yeah that's what will make american strong.. kids sitting in the living room watching television.
AGE-JUDGING OR JUDGING AGE | 10:05 a.m. May 1, 2008
Comparing the young ladies of the YFZ ranch to the young "ladies" in
the world is a bit like comparing apples to oranges. If you take a girl and
raise her in a society to learn purity, chastity and to value innocence from a
young age. And dare I say humility, they are going to look a lot younger or
innocent if you will. Especially if they abstain from make-up and todays gowdy
fashions that accentuate eroticism. Take a look at pictures of young women from
the 18th century. Telling isn't it.
Hypnosis | 10:07 a.m. May 1, 2008
I was reading an article of the hypnotic nature of the TV and the use of mind
control by supplying information (propaganda) that gets played into the minds of
Americans over and over until they become more or less conditioned to except and
then regurgitate that information to family and friends as though it were the
gospel truth. After reading these posts and watching the coverage I'm
convinced it is true.
When the authority speaks, we the people believe and then begin to defend the official position in true herd form. Let us never forget the fact that there can be no authoritative legitimacy except it is done as was laid out by the wise founders of this nation. Never forget that the founders were not running away from child molesters or other boogymen when they came here, they were fleeing so called authority that refused to acknowledge their inalienable rights.
There has been much said about breaking the law, but checks and balance and due process are the supreme law of the land and I see an atrocious amount of abuse of those fundamental rights by so called protecters of it.
When the authority speaks, we the people believe and then begin to defend the official position in true herd form. Let us never forget the fact that there can be no authoritative legitimacy except it is done as was laid out by the wise founders of this nation. Never forget that the founders were not running away from child molesters or other boogymen when they came here, they were fleeing so called authority that refused to acknowledge their inalienable rights.
There has been much said about breaking the law, but checks and balance and due process are the supreme law of the land and I see an atrocious amount of abuse of those fundamental rights by so called protecters of it.
realitycheck60 | 10:08 a.m. May 1, 2008
it's quite obvious that all the defenders of FLDS here are in fact from the
FLDS crowd. No one else in their right mind would defend these people. Only
other FLDS (or extreme muslims) would try to justify the abusive confimement of
women and children as the FLDS do. These poor women and children have no choice
at all on their future and are kept confined in a camp with no access to the
outside world. Reminds me of Afganistan. Regardless of physical/sexual abuse
or broken bones, the fact is that these FLDS are violating the civil rights of
these women and children by not allowing them the freedoms we all take for
granted. The ironic part is that they do it in the name of God, but when they
get to heaven they won't be allowed in, because they were unkind to the
weak. Now that's irony, and justice.
Rich | 10:08 a.m. May 1, 2008
Let's stop focusing on broken bones. The real problem is sexual child
abuse, the crime that Warren Jeffs has been convicted of committing.
CanadianGirl | 10:09 a.m. May 1, 2008
Polygamy is still illegal in Canada last I checked, however, it is not grounds
for prosecution or persecution. Like everything else here, it only is subject
to investigation when something is fishy.
People are too quick to condemn the CPS, which is flawed but they have the interests of the young people in their hearts and minds.
I have to wonder what the FLDS "faithful" are hiding. After all, even if they were taught to be fearful of outsiders, the leaders IF (and that's a big one) were smart, they would have encouraged their followers to work with CPS to allow for this to be over quicker, but instead they seem to be blocking any attempt.
A favourite statement in this era is, "what do you have to hide anyway? Why not let the police verify your ID?"
People are too quick to condemn the CPS, which is flawed but they have the interests of the young people in their hearts and minds.
I have to wonder what the FLDS "faithful" are hiding. After all, even if they were taught to be fearful of outsiders, the leaders IF (and that's a big one) were smart, they would have encouraged their followers to work with CPS to allow for this to be over quicker, but instead they seem to be blocking any attempt.
A favourite statement in this era is, "what do you have to hide anyway? Why not let the police verify your ID?"
Hey mypc46 | 10:10 a.m. May 1, 2008
Your daughter did not "almost lose custody" because she looked 14.
She need only produce a license, which she did at the hospital as a manner of
procedure. And while you would like to believe that your presence in the life
of the baby made a difference in custody retention, it did not. You might be
embarrassed that your daughter looks so young and has a child, but there was no
legal threat unless you forgot some portion of the story. Was a comment made?
Perhaps, but that is a far cry from legal threat.
TO: More News | 10:15 a.m. May 1, 2008
Did it every accur to you that maybe the 18 year old boys wanted to help younger
siblings through this hate crime. Family in the FLDS do love one another I
would think.
azmom | 10:26 a.m. May 1, 2008
ok, so broken bones is not an issue, kids have accidents all time. Let's
just say that they fell off a horse or something. The thing that bothers me the
most is the fact that these children are all treated as one family. They call
all the women mother and all the children are siblings. So do the women
"love" all of the children like their own? I love my sister's
children but nothing like the love I feel for the children I gave birth to. I
personally feel that these women do not have a lot of emotion invested in these
children. I'm not sure they care about them except as a leverage into
heaven.
We already know | 10:33 a.m. May 1, 2008
We already know from the Warren Jeffs case, that this is not about young girls
getting pregnant. This is about young girls being forced into Marriage, and
pregnancy at time with a close relative. There is a canyon of difference
between that and the unfortunate pregnancies in the inner cities of America.
sensationalized.... | 10:36 a.m. May 1, 2008
Relax, folks. This information came out in a senate hearing--not a CPS press
release directed at smearing the FLDS. No one is saying that the FLDS abused
the kids. The prior injuries need to be investigated--that's all. CPS has
been asked to keep the senate committee advised of any developments with regard
to the FLDS children. Unfortunately, the press was there, picked it up and
everyone automatically jumps to conclusions.
This is much ado about nothing.
This is much ado about nothing.
to JND | 10:46 a.m. May 1, 2008
Yes there is something that would convince me CPS is right and FLDS is
wrong......PROOF! I see acusations and fuzzy facts. Fuzzy facts? Yes! Why do CPS
give a range of mothers who half are legal and half are not. If they have a case
just say it. I am tired of seeing sensational accusations coming from exFLDS who
are trying to promote some novel they wrote. We even keep getting reminded that
their "prophet" warren jeffs is in prison convicted of accomplice to
rape. Where is the person convicted of the rape? Where is anyone convicted of
any rape or abuse? Where is some PROOF of anything?
G | 10:47 a.m. May 1, 2008
"What's this? Two boys who turned 18 do not want to return to YFZ
ranch?"
How many LDS kids that turn 18 don't want to continue in the church? A lot of RM's fall into that category after the mission. How many Amish kids? Baptist kids? A lot of people from very Christian families become atheists once they come of age.
Of course some aren't going to go back. Name one church that has a 100% member retention rate.
Some people are really grasping at straws.
How many LDS kids that turn 18 don't want to continue in the church? A lot of RM's fall into that category after the mission. How many Amish kids? Baptist kids? A lot of people from very Christian families become atheists once they come of age.
Of course some aren't going to go back. Name one church that has a 100% member retention rate.
Some people are really grasping at straws.
avengeance | 10:52 a.m. May 1, 2008
Young men are trying to stay in the system to protect their younger siblings.
Mothers over 17 are claiming to be minors to protect their babies.
Why?
Here's a little info on Texas foster care system:
Based on Fiscal 2004 data provided by the Health and Human Services Commission, about 100 children received treatment for poisoning from medications; 63 foster children received medical treatment for rape that occurred while in the foster care system; and
---best of all---
142 young girls gave birth while in the state foster care system.
Looks like the Texas Rangers need to raid CPS! Seems like quite a "pervasive pattern" (as CPS put it).
Why?
Here's a little info on Texas foster care system:
Based on Fiscal 2004 data provided by the Health and Human Services Commission, about 100 children received treatment for poisoning from medications; 63 foster children received medical treatment for rape that occurred while in the foster care system; and
---best of all---
142 young girls gave birth while in the state foster care system.
Looks like the Texas Rangers need to raid CPS! Seems like quite a "pervasive pattern" (as CPS put it).
Cookie | 10:53 a.m. May 1, 2008
No broken bones or 'brittle bone disease' in
Northeastern New Mexico, but as of April 22,
three underage girls and one boy were taken
by CPS from a religious encampment. See 'Strong
City', Michael Travesser, and/or KOATTV. Watch
the Seven Messengers video. Does this ring a bell?
Northeastern New Mexico, but as of April 22,
three underage girls and one boy were taken
by CPS from a religious encampment. See 'Strong
City', Michael Travesser, and/or KOATTV. Watch
the Seven Messengers video. Does this ring a bell?
Teen Pregnancy | 11:01 a.m. May 1, 2008
The movie Juno comes to mind and it won�t help the general
population with this problem. I looked up statistics for Texas on teen
pregnancy. It's not relevant but interesting:
How Often Does a Teenager in Texas Get Pregnant?
Every 10 minutes, a teen in Texas gets pregnant.
Every 10 hours, a 14-year-old teen gets pregnant.
Every 3 hours, a 15-year-old teen gets pregnant.
Every 1.5 hours, a 16-year-old teen gets pregnant.
I also found this: "Texas teens lead the nation in having babies. Last month, the nonprofit group Child Trends conferred another No. 1 ranking on Texas. In the latest statistics available, 24 percent of the state's teen births in 2004 were NOT the girl's first delivery.
"That astounded me," said senior vice president for community relations at Planned Parenthood of North Texas. "I mean, what are we doing wrong?"
Well, they will be so busy now solving this problem with the FLDS they won�t find out!! I hope that this isn't just a witch hunt and that somehow that these young mothers of the FLDS can get counseling and be able to raise their own babies. These were nursing mothers. Show me real proof of abuse.
How Often Does a Teenager in Texas Get Pregnant?
Every 10 minutes, a teen in Texas gets pregnant.
Every 10 hours, a 14-year-old teen gets pregnant.
Every 3 hours, a 15-year-old teen gets pregnant.
Every 1.5 hours, a 16-year-old teen gets pregnant.
I also found this: "Texas teens lead the nation in having babies. Last month, the nonprofit group Child Trends conferred another No. 1 ranking on Texas. In the latest statistics available, 24 percent of the state's teen births in 2004 were NOT the girl's first delivery.
"That astounded me," said senior vice president for community relations at Planned Parenthood of North Texas. "I mean, what are we doing wrong?"
Well, they will be so busy now solving this problem with the FLDS they won�t find out!! I hope that this isn't just a witch hunt and that somehow that these young mothers of the FLDS can get counseling and be able to raise their own babies. These were nursing mothers. Show me real proof of abuse.
Freethinker | 11:09 a.m. May 1, 2008
Will one of you good Christians who are ranting against polygamy please explain
to me how one of your Bibical icons, Solomon, the illegitimate son of David and
Bathsheba, was consideered so wise and loved by God? He had one hundred wives
and a thousand concubines, and he still chased after "strange women. Has
God changed his mind about it being OK for a man to have more than one wife?
G | 11:13 a.m. May 1, 2008
"There is a canyon of difference between that and the unfortunate
pregnancies in the inner cities of America. "
There is no difference under the law, and studies have shown that the majority of teenage pregnancies in America are caused by adult men. And, that most of the time it was forced. By the way, relatives are usually involved there too.
There is no difference under the law, and studies have shown that the majority of teenage pregnancies in America are caused by adult men. And, that most of the time it was forced. By the way, relatives are usually involved there too.
wrz | 11:21 a.m. May 1, 2008
<<I sure hope you are joking wrz....
*in my most sarcastic tone*
uhm. yeah that's what will make american strong.. kids sitting in the living room watching television.<<
Not just any TV... Sponge Bob Square Pants and American Idol, I said (in my concerned but conciliatory voice).
*in my most sarcastic tone*
uhm. yeah that's what will make american strong.. kids sitting in the living room watching television.<<
Not just any TV... Sponge Bob Square Pants and American Idol, I said (in my concerned but conciliatory voice).
re: TO: More News | 11:23 a.m. May 1, 2008
>
Didn't occur to me at all. Since the boys turned 18, they cannot remain with younger siblings and other non-FLDS children in a juvenile foster care facility. They will be (or have already been) transferred to a transitional facility with other "adults" of the same age to finish their education.
Didn't occur to me at all. Since the boys turned 18, they cannot remain with younger siblings and other non-FLDS children in a juvenile foster care facility. They will be (or have already been) transferred to a transitional facility with other "adults" of the same age to finish their education.
G | 11:26 a.m. May 1, 2008
"No broken bones or 'brittle bone disease' in
Northeastern New Mexico"
That's because
(1) Smaller sample size.
(2) No hundred-year cycle of inbreeding.
Northeastern New Mexico"
That's because
(1) Smaller sample size.
(2) No hundred-year cycle of inbreeding.
Earl | 11:29 a.m. May 1, 2008
I quote:
"Your daughter did not "almost lose custody" because she looked 14. She need only produce a license, which she did at the hospital as a manner of procedure."
Many of the CPS selected children have already produced Drivers License and birth certificates and Tax returns only to be told "I don't believe you"
If someone does NOT accept your I.D. there isn't any way to prove who you are. It's like a case of I D theft, it's almost impossible to prove it wasn't you. It takes years in some cases to actually prove who you are.
"Your daughter did not "almost lose custody" because she looked 14. She need only produce a license, which she did at the hospital as a manner of procedure."
Many of the CPS selected children have already produced Drivers License and birth certificates and Tax returns only to be told "I don't believe you"
If someone does NOT accept your I.D. there isn't any way to prove who you are. It's like a case of I D theft, it's almost impossible to prove it wasn't you. It takes years in some cases to actually prove who you are.
re: wrz | 11:31 a.m. May 1, 2008
>
"rounding all the children up"...True, it happened.
"wholesale"...Who are we selling them to? And why is it wholesale and not retail?
"separating them from their mothers"...The mothers who are adults failed to protect the children from a systemic practice of sexual abuse which they universally accept as a divine mandate from their leaders. They have repeatedly lied, demonstrating culpability for their actions. They are considered suspects and could be prosecuted under the law.
"violation of Constitutional rights of freedom of worship"...How has freedom of worship been abridged? The FLDS are free to worship as they see fit, but they (along with Mormons, Muslims, Jews, Catholics...etc) are prohibited from including illegal acts as part of that worship. Either you truly do not understand constitutional law or you are FLDS and will say anything to deflect focus from the central issue...underage sexual abuse.
"rounding all the children up"...True, it happened.
"wholesale"...Who are we selling them to? And why is it wholesale and not retail?
"separating them from their mothers"...The mothers who are adults failed to protect the children from a systemic practice of sexual abuse which they universally accept as a divine mandate from their leaders. They have repeatedly lied, demonstrating culpability for their actions. They are considered suspects and could be prosecuted under the law.
"violation of Constitutional rights of freedom of worship"...How has freedom of worship been abridged? The FLDS are free to worship as they see fit, but they (along with Mormons, Muslims, Jews, Catholics...etc) are prohibited from including illegal acts as part of that worship. Either you truly do not understand constitutional law or you are FLDS and will say anything to deflect focus from the central issue...underage sexual abuse.
Helen | 11:34 a.m. May 1, 2008
----it's quite obvious that all the defenders of FLDS here are in fact from
the FLDS crowd. No one else in their right mind would defend these
people.----
Few, if any on this or other threads, are defending polygamy or sexual abuse of children.
What's of concern is the violation of human rights as documented by our Founding Fathers in the Constitution's Bill of Rights. CPS cannot violate one person's rights in order to capture others who are committing crimes. And especially a governmental agency. It smacks of governmental tyranny.
To check your credibility on the issue... suppose The US Attorney General, Alberto Gonzales under the direction of G. W. Bush, were conducting wire-tapping on these people. What would your response be?
Few, if any on this or other threads, are defending polygamy or sexual abuse of children.
What's of concern is the violation of human rights as documented by our Founding Fathers in the Constitution's Bill of Rights. CPS cannot violate one person's rights in order to capture others who are committing crimes. And especially a governmental agency. It smacks of governmental tyranny.
To check your credibility on the issue... suppose The US Attorney General, Alberto Gonzales under the direction of G. W. Bush, were conducting wire-tapping on these people. What would your response be?
Don't Look Here | 11:38 a.m. May 1, 2008
The FLDS here are master minipulators. They won't discuss the real issue,
which is why they feel that there is nothing wrong with raping young girls by
forcing them into arranged marriages with older men.
Instead, they want us to focus on how many girls in the inner city are pregnant, how many other kids were abused somewhere else, how other people from other religions have been persecuted, how wrong it is to separate mothers from their children (ignoring the probability that many of these mothers were complicit in forcing their teenaged daughters to marry an old man).
The FLDS won't/can't defend their "religious" practice of child rape, so they have to deflect attention to other subjects.
Instead, they want us to focus on how many girls in the inner city are pregnant, how many other kids were abused somewhere else, how other people from other religions have been persecuted, how wrong it is to separate mothers from their children (ignoring the probability that many of these mothers were complicit in forcing their teenaged daughters to marry an old man).
The FLDS won't/can't defend their "religious" practice of child rape, so they have to deflect attention to other subjects.
Blame It On Hillary! | 11:39 a.m. May 1, 2008
Blame the whole FLDS thing on Hillary Clinton, she wrote the book "It Takes
A Village" and these people obviously took her Literally!!! Group
Parenting, Group Love, They feed one another, nobody goes hungry, they all share
material for clothing! Why are we bothering them for living Hillary
Clinton's Model Example of What it's all about? I mean Husbands take
more than one wife, that eliminates cheating and affairs! It's all lessons
taken from the Clintons! You can't tell me they shouldn't raid Utah
because more than 1,500 LDS kids have had broken bones over the past year in
this state, Cause for Concern??? I THINK SO!!!!! More than 150 Teenage
Pregnancies in Utah in 2007? I think SO!!! Known Polygamous practices in Utah
somewhere now and in the past? I think so!!!!! Homes with "Walls &
Fences" surrounding them? I think so!!! I think the ATF US Marshalls, and
FBI should all invade Utah for the same reasons they have invaded this
"COMPOUND" and I am sure of all the thousands of children you put into
foster care, some will complain of abuse from parents! Come And Get Us Here In
Utah!!! We Are Guilty Too!
wrz | 11:39 a.m. May 1, 2008
>>The thing that bothers me the most is the fact that these children are
all treated as one family. They call all the women mother and all the children
are siblings.<<
I sorta reminds me of what a typical Indian tribe in the 17th - 18th centuries might have been.
I sorta reminds me of what a typical Indian tribe in the 17th - 18th centuries might have been.
To: Freethinker | 11:40 a.m. May 1, 2008
Show me one instance in the Old Testament where God expressly commanded
polygamy.
The only ones | 11:41 a.m. May 1, 2008
gasping at straws are the FLDS defenders.
Proof of abuse? Some boys have already come forward and said they were molested. Underage girls are pregnant and have children. How much more proof of abuse do you people want?
These kids in this compound are prisoners. Kind of sad when they go to into custody and all they want to do is clean and do yard work. What kind of kid says that?
You keep reading the FLDS propaganda and believe everything they say.The stories are going to keep unraveling. The FLDS compounds need to be shut down, period. They are breaking the law in so many ways.
Proof of abuse? Some boys have already come forward and said they were molested. Underage girls are pregnant and have children. How much more proof of abuse do you people want?
These kids in this compound are prisoners. Kind of sad when they go to into custody and all they want to do is clean and do yard work. What kind of kid says that?
You keep reading the FLDS propaganda and believe everything they say.The stories are going to keep unraveling. The FLDS compounds need to be shut down, period. They are breaking the law in so many ways.
Missing Boys | 11:43 a.m. May 1, 2008
53 girls ages 14-17, but only 17 boys. What happened to all the teenaged boys?
Did they not make the cut when Warren Jeffs was handpicking his most devoted
followers to live at the YFZ Ranch?
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Carey Cockerell of the Texas Department of Family and Protective Services testifies about FLDS children.
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Your wolf-crying, fear-mongering claims are a complete joke. CPS agencies are not going to use this case as a pretext for swooping in to steal kids from innocent parents across the country.