Final part | 8:06 a.m. May 1, 2008
You might also find this surprising from the 1796 Treaty with Tripoli article 11:
As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

Again, it is not about religion but actions.
Lost Boys | 8:31 a.m. May 1, 2008
All you have to do is speak to a former member of the FLDS sect and you would realize the CPS findings are consistent. Try finding one of the "Lost Boys" and let them tell you their stories.
There is a reason why these boys are kicked out of the sect, so older men can have sex with minors. Plain and Simple.
Red | 8:38 a.m. May 1, 2008
To Not About Religion (and others who have expressed the same idea) "This is not about religion but actions)":

Yah, a lot of people say this, including various spokescritters for the State. Unfortunately, their compadres' testimony put the lie to this.

A CPS worker testified that the only way it would be safe to return the kids to their moms would be if the moms renounced their religion.

She didn't ask for any change in actions; she admitted there was no evidence of abuse (this was before the State began alleging widespread physical torture and sex abuse of young boys).

The only change she demanded was in religion.

Not actions.
Comments continue below
Good Goal! | 4:38 p.m. May 1, 2008
That is a goal that some of our schools are trying to get down to!
John Lambert | 10:44 p.m. May 1, 2008
I am probably beating a dead horse. However the state has not established any case for child abuse. They may have a case for statutory rape, depending on the nature of the laws. Any sexual conduct with people over the age of 13 is statutory rape, not child abuse. It is a very different crime. Of course, if the state had faced up to that up front they could not have done the mass child grab.
I support statutory rape laws and oppose polygamy. However I would argue that statutory rape laws are meant to address a crime that is not really present in polygamy.
To "Evidence of abuse" | 11:03 a.m. May 2, 2008
School systems do not promote having sex with under age girls and if someone is "found out" to have had this they will be dismissed and tried by a court of law. The FLDS groups, however, have been found out time and again to promote this (even if they don't admit it). This type of behavior is not acceptable in our society and will be "shut down". "Two wrongs don't make a right". Why would you compare the bad behavior of some in general society with the FLDS? It's because you know it's wrong and you know it will not continue to be tolerated or "slipped under the rug".
But RED | 11:07 a.m. May 2, 2008
Do you want to approach the truth regarding the CPS workers statement? I find it doubtful.

"s. Voss said she didn�t think the children should return to the ranch.

�I�m very concerned about the overall mind-set that children are born and grown and that the boys become perpetrators and the girls become victims of sexual abuse,� she said.

It seems that you would find human sacrifice a constitutional right which is fortunately not allowed nor is polygamy due to Reynolds v. U.S.
You likely are not aware that there has been an investigation for 4 years and that inevitable discovery applies well, given the information regarding Ray Jessop and the 16 year old, nope 18 year old, in the Warrant.

�I believe it is not safe for any child to return to the ranch because the adults that I have spoken with who live on the ranch have expressed to me their belief that they aren�t doing anything harmful to their children and that this practice of children being united and having children is part of their overall culture or belief system.�

This appears to still be about action over religion. Some bulbs are more dull than others.

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