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Number of children in Texas custody rises — some young mothers are actually under 18
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Greywolf | 1:07 a.m. April 25, 2008
The most insulting thing I've noticed today while reading all the stories
out today is how hard the Texas authorities and the media have tried to make it
plausible that Rozita Swinton might not have made the call. Think about the odds
involved to say they have reasonable enough doubt to not flat out name her as
the culprit. They do say she had that phone number atleast some time in the
past. Now most of you have a phone book sitting there near your computer. Every
line in that book is an unique number. Now imagine ALL of the phone books Texas
alone. Every line in all the books is a unique number. Now the odds of you
getting Swinton's old phone number is greater then winning the lotto TWICE.
Now the odds of you getting the SAME number of Swinton and pulling the same
prank calls on the same group of people? I don't think you can calculate
those type of odds. Now add in multiple states see what I'm saying? But
Texas and the news media want you to believe it's possible.
... | 1:32 a.m. April 25, 2008
Ervil LaBaron really started a lot of misery when he was a small man trying to
be a big man and when he started this whole mess. Warren Jeffs is a manipulator
with a soft voice who abused his power. My heart aches for these poor women
separated from their young children. None of them have known anything
different. It takes a very strong person to break away from the only ways they
have been indoctrinated into. Those poor little children...two year olds, three
year olds and so forth. Such sorrow. Isn't there a better plan to solve
this problem ??? Why were these kids shipped off to who knows what fate so
quickly? The foster system is no panacea.
Pligkid | 2:34 a.m. April 25, 2008
�DPS officials described the separations as very emotional,
but denied claims that they were cruel in their taking custody of the
children."
Curious, what would they consider cruel?
Just like Waco, throw teargas at the children, and hope their suffering will make the parents conform.
Curious, what would they consider cruel?
Just like Waco, throw teargas at the children, and hope their suffering will make the parents conform.
Comments continue below
Pligkid | 5:08 a.m. April 25, 2008
In the United States 696,130 girls ages 15-19 become pregnant and 145,000 end in
abortion. [UNFPA, State of World Population 2003] [US Census 2005] Studies by
the Population Reference Bureau and the National Center for Health Statistics
found that about two-thirds of births to teenage girls in the United States are
fathered by adult men. That means that approximately 460,000 girls in the
United States age 15-19 become pregnant to adult men and 21% of those end in
abortion. How many are married? How many are planned? None, except the few in
the FLDS.
wrz | 6:39 a.m. April 25, 2008
>>Quick! call CPS! My kids are unhappy because I don't have a
swingset or BB Court<<
But do you have crayons?
But do you have crayons?
pregnancy | 6:42 a.m. April 25, 2008
To the person that cited stats on pregnancy: YOU MISS THE POINT. This is not
an issue of simple pregnancy but pregnancy AFTER a FORCED marriage and ensuing
RAPE. You are comparing apples to duct tape.
married 13 year olds | 6:51 a.m. April 25, 2008
Diane Sawyer interviewed an FLDS man. It was very telling to all of you
nay-sayers. She directly asked him if he had seen any 13 year olds marry. His
response? "I would never marry a 13 year old." Apparently
comprehension skills are not taught, but evasion skills certainly are taught.
The question again was "do you know of any 13 year olds that married?"
Clearly he knows of 13 year old that marry. Now I ask all of you; whom
among you believes that marriage and the given consummation of that marriage is
acceptable under religious rights, when even this FLDS man finds the act
distasteful for himself?
Keep It Real | 8:25 a.m. April 25, 2008
This is just disgusting. How can people live like this? These young girls are
claiming to be older than they really are just to avoid prosecution and to
continue their sexual and spiritual exploitation by these perverted men! How
appalling!
How did the Texas government establish their real ages?
How did the Texas government establish their real ages?
cmr | 10:09 a.m. April 25, 2008
What is being done is not right, but what was being done in their lives is not
right either. Girls were being "given" to "husbands".
America was based on the freedom of choice, even children have the right to
choose. These girls were not given choice. I know that I as a mother if asked
which were my children I would claim them in order to have them with me. Growing
up in Arizona and having to communicate with the community there when I was
working with a company that handled that area's indigent care, it can be a
real eye opener. Because the State of Arizona does not recognize plural
marriages, the second, third, etc wives quality for food stamps, and other state
funded aid as "single" mothers with no, or little income. The State of
Texas is doing the best they can, is it right, probably not but when a decision
has to be made you have to take the roll of the dice that it will end as it
needs to be. That is what they are doing, if they were truly being cruel, they
would not care where the children were placed.
Patagonia | 10:44 a.m. April 25, 2008
I think that their practice of marrying underage girls is an absolute sin. With
that being said, we need to put aside our bad feelings and realize that the ends
do NOT justify the means. Isn't it time that 'we the people' stop
the abuses by our government? What is the proper role of government? Is this it?
Are we all really comfortable with this? Am I the only one that sees some
contrast with the early Latter-Day Saints? It does not matter if what they
believe is true, or not!! That should have no weight in regards to our doing
everything we can to fight for their rights!
Huzzah! | 11:09 a.m. April 25, 2008
As a fundamental principle, children are citizens who are protected in their
inalienable rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. They are
first and foremost citizens of the nation, and only secondarily (or not at all)
the "property" of their parents. Therefore, parents do NOT have an
unencumbered right to do whatever they wish to their children! As a population
of citizens of this nation, children are among the unrepresented, vulnerable
groups who are subject to some of the worst abuse and neglect imaginable. It is
not a moral, humane, nor civil society that allows children to be exploited as a
herd of domesticated breeding-cattle-wives like the FLDS are doing. No person is
the property of another! That is the ethical principle underlying the concept of
individual liberty upon which the U.S. Constitution was based. Only naive,
inhumane, and uneducated people can possibly invoke
"constitutionalist" arguments claiming that the Texas government is
mishandling this situation or abusing their governmental powers. Their
governmental powers are explicitly given them for the sole purpose of protecting
the rights of these vulnerable, minority populations such as exploited children!
They are doing exactly what they should be doing! Huzzah for Texas!
motherof5 | 11:41 a.m. April 25, 2008
Forget if the calls were a hoax or not. What's important is that the
children are being protected and safe now.
hmmmm | 2:19 p.m. April 25, 2008
They can take many to the dentist give full dental xrays and get a good idea the
age by teeth growth
and wisdom teeth also bone growth if need be
at certain ages the teeth roots begin to close
as a child gets to full growth and growth of wisdom
teeth under gum line is critical
and wisdom teeth also bone growth if need be
at certain ages the teeth roots begin to close
as a child gets to full growth and growth of wisdom
teeth under gum line is critical
Anonymous | 2:38 p.m. April 25, 2008
Where are the boys.
The FLDS Church recently excommunicated over 400 teenage boys
Once again some fall pary to the media: You will have to go back more than 20 years to find 400 boys under 20 that have left or been asked to leave the flds church. and most of those will say that they chose to leave.
The FLDS Church recently excommunicated over 400 teenage boys
Once again some fall pary to the media: You will have to go back more than 20 years to find 400 boys under 20 that have left or been asked to leave the flds church. and most of those will say that they chose to leave.
XGI | 2:52 p.m. April 25, 2008
Messing around?:
Messing around is what you the world does and everyone looks the other way. But to marry and try to have a family is bad. Good grif.
Messing around is what you the world does and everyone looks the other way. But to marry and try to have a family is bad. Good grif.
Anonymous | 2:59 p.m. April 25, 2008
{To the person that cited stats on pregnancy: YOU MISS THE POINT. This is not an
issue of simple pregnancy but pregnancy AFTER a FORCED marriage and ensuing
RAPE. You are comparing apples to duct tape.}
Flora and the media have you. this statement is a bald face lie. There is no forced marriages in the flds church. Believe it or not.
Flora and the media have you. this statement is a bald face lie. There is no forced marriages in the flds church. Believe it or not.
XGI | 3:14 p.m. April 25, 2008
Force is what the state and cps people are doing to these people. They have
never been exposed to this kind of FORCE. There are no forced marriages in the
flds church.
wrz | 5:14 p.m. April 25, 2008
>>They are first and foremost citizens of the nation, and only secondarily
(or not at all) the "property" of their parents. >Therefore,
parents do NOT have an unencumbered right to do whatever they wish to their
children!<< - Huzzah
Nor does the state have an unencumbered right to do whatever they wish to the children. CPS seems to think they have.
Nor does the state have an unencumbered right to do whatever they wish to the children. CPS seems to think they have.
Anonymous | 5:48 p.m. April 25, 2008
They say that 25 of the mother's are under 18, but what is their age
exactly, I think the marriage law is 16.
speak for yourself | 8:08 p.m. April 25, 2008
I think that they are doing the right thing. Polygamy is illegal! They found a
bunch of pregnant teens who have been forced to marry. You should be able to
speak for yourself and make your own choices.
Freddie | 8:58 a.m. April 26, 2008
"I think that they are doing the right thing."
They violated many of those folks' Constitutional rights. Article XIV (in part): "No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of the United States; nor shall any state deprive a person of... LIBERTY... without due process of law; nor deny any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
These women and children were deprived of their LIBERTY and without due process of law. Texas Child Protective Services, in this instance, violated the law. And Judge Walthers aided and abetted.
"They found a bunch of pregnant teens who have been forced to marry."
No married teen has indicated they were forced to marry. This is an excuse dreamed up by CPS to commandeer these citizens.
"You should be able to speak for yourself and make your own choices."
You have no proof that they did not speak for themselves. Nor does CPS.
They violated many of those folks' Constitutional rights. Article XIV (in part): "No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of the United States; nor shall any state deprive a person of... LIBERTY... without due process of law; nor deny any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
These women and children were deprived of their LIBERTY and without due process of law. Texas Child Protective Services, in this instance, violated the law. And Judge Walthers aided and abetted.
"They found a bunch of pregnant teens who have been forced to marry."
No married teen has indicated they were forced to marry. This is an excuse dreamed up by CPS to commandeer these citizens.
"You should be able to speak for yourself and make your own choices."
You have no proof that they did not speak for themselves. Nor does CPS.
Freddie | 4:43 p.m. April 26, 2008
"These women and children were deprived of their LIBERTY and without due
process of law. Texas Child Protective Services, in this instance, violated the
law. And Judge Walthers aided and abetted."
More properly stated: "These women and children were deprived of their LIBERTY and without due process of law. Texas Child Protective Services, in this instance, violated the US CONSTITUTION. And Judge Walthers aided and abetted."
The Bill of Rights trumps all, ALL, federal state and local laws... including the laws of Texas under which the CPS operates.
More properly stated: "These women and children were deprived of their LIBERTY and without due process of law. Texas Child Protective Services, in this instance, violated the US CONSTITUTION. And Judge Walthers aided and abetted."
The Bill of Rights trumps all, ALL, federal state and local laws... including the laws of Texas under which the CPS operates.
hey Freddie | 6:39 p.m. April 27, 2008
When a girl is asked how old she is and she responds, "16." Then her
husband says, "no you aren't, you are 18." And she responds,
"oh I am 18." There is a problem.
Their, perhaps your, Prophet Warren Jeffs is already in jail for accessory to rape and incest. Another case involving the same, is about to go forth. I call that a pattern.
Their, perhaps your, Prophet Warren Jeffs is already in jail for accessory to rape and incest. Another case involving the same, is about to go forth. I call that a pattern.
Jayson | 10:15 p.m. April 27, 2008
Freddie,
Where was the Constitution when young girls were being told they had to get married to do their duty and to serve god. What makes this whole situation worse was that religion was used to accomplish the sick and twisted actions of so called spiritual leaders who only had their own interests in mind and who could care less about their flock.
Where was the Constitution when young girls were being told they had to get married to do their duty and to serve god. What makes this whole situation worse was that religion was used to accomplish the sick and twisted actions of so called spiritual leaders who only had their own interests in mind and who could care less about their flock.
Red | 12:24 p.m. April 28, 2008
Headline is probably right, but might not be. The discrepancy could be either:
1) young girls claimed to be older, but have now told the truth, or 2) old girls
were telling the truth, but now claim to be younger.
A State official with "life and death" control over you and your relationship with your child says, "If you tell me you're under 18, you get to go with your child; if you tell me you're 18 or over, I'll take your nursing baby for as long as I please -- possibly forever."
What would a loving 18-year-old mother say? If she lied, I don't think I could find it in my heart to condemn her.
A State official with "life and death" control over you and your relationship with your child says, "If you tell me you're under 18, you get to go with your child; if you tell me you're 18 or over, I'll take your nursing baby for as long as I please -- possibly forever."
What would a loving 18-year-old mother say? If she lied, I don't think I could find it in my heart to condemn her.
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